Every time I start to believe in this team... [Archive] - BillsZone.com

Dr. Lecter

12-05-2009, 09:49 PM

Ebenezer

12-06-2009, 09:20 AM

Another pointless thread...

two words...hot goalie.

DMBcrew36

12-06-2009, 09:59 AM

I dropped $300 on two tickets, 15 row up behind the penalty boxes, right at center ice, to take my Dad for his 60th birthday. It was a decent game but I don't feel like I'm getting my moneys worth when they can't even score a goal. By the time Pominville scored, we had already left and were walking out of the arena.

OpIv37

12-06-2009, 10:27 AM

I was wondering if you were going to start a BS thread like this while I was driving home.

I would say I am shocked, but I am not.

First off, they were coming into this game on a 4 game wining streak. They are not going to win every game this year or play well in every game. You add in the fact that the goalie they were facing was playing very well, and this game is hardly one to panic over or start a *****fest over.

Secondly saying they do not have a true goal scorer is so lacking in fact when they have a guy who has scored 40 two seasons in a row, it is pointless to try and discuss.

Third, you gave up with 7 minutes and they were down by one.

Why you are unable to look at the big picture and see where they are at the quarter point + part of the season, I don't know. But I am not shocked that you were relatively silent during the 4 game win streak.
First, win or lose there is NEVER an excuse to go 58 minutes without a goal.

Second, what Vanek did previously won't help us this year. He and all the other so-called "scorers" blew plenty of chances. You don't see true scorers missing that many in one game.

Finally, the Rangers are not a good team this year. the big picture is that if we can't score at home against mediocre teams, we will collapse just lime last year.

OpIv37

12-06-2009, 10:29 AM

Another pointless thread...

two words...hot goalie.
Not an excuse for a scoreless 58 minutes at home

SabreEleven

12-06-2009, 11:34 AM

Their passing was atrocious and they had no interest in playing hockey for two periods. The pass killed just about every scoring chance they had in the 1st 2 periods. Does this start a long losing streak or do they come back and start another winning streak? Eb, is right though, you can't win them all.

Ebenezer

12-06-2009, 07:40 PM

Not an excuse for a scoreless 58 minutes at home
Yeah, you're right...no goalie in the history of the NHL has ever been so hot they he came in and shut a team out at home...that has never, ever, ever happened.

rbochan

12-06-2009, 09:07 PM

Douchebags 'o Buffalo 1
Rags 2.

'nuff said.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooring.

OpIv37

12-06-2009, 10:16 PM

Yeah, you're right...no goalie in the history of the NHL has ever been so hot they he came in and shut a team out at home...that has never, ever, ever happened.
Miller was hot when we went into Washington but ovechkin still scored because he's an elite scorer. If we had an elite scorer, we would have scored more than one on lundqvist. It's that simple.

RockStar36

12-07-2009, 07:39 AM

I'll take 4 out of 5 all season long.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 07:42 AM

Miller was hot when we went into Washington but ovechkin still scored because he's an elite scorer. If we had an elite scorer, we would have scored more than one on lundqvist. It's that simple.

Ovechkin is the best player in the league.

What a fair comparison.

BlackMetalNinja

12-07-2009, 07:45 AM

Ovechkin is the best player in the league.

What a fair comparison.If ONLY we had that extra $9.5 million/year laying around to pay somebody like that...

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 07:48 AM

Ovechkin is the best player in the league.

What a fair comparison.

Where did this loser mentality come from?

"Lunqvist is a hot goalie so it's ok that he shut us down at home."
"Ovechkin is the best in the league so it's ok if he beats us."

Give me a ****ing break.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 07:49 AM

If ONLY we had that extra $9.5 million/year laying around to pay somebody like that...

if only we had a top line that didn't get outscored by Ovechkin alone.... the goals don't all have to come from one guy, but they DO have to come. And right now, they're not coming.

BlackMetalNinja

12-07-2009, 07:52 AM

if only we had a top line that didn't get outscored by Ovechkin alone.... the goals don't all have to come from one guy, but they DO have to come. And right now, they're not coming.Are you ****ing kidding me???? Here are the last 5 games, which we won 4 of I might add...

Sabres - 4, Flyers -2
Sabres - 5, Hurricanes -1
Sabres - 3, Leafs - 0
Sabres - 6, Canadians - 2
Sabres - 1, Rangers - 2

We've outscored the opposition 19-7 in that stretch and you're acting like our season's over, we can't score goals, and we can't stop anybody.

You are completely and utterly ****ing impossible.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 07:58 AM

Where did this loser mentality come from?

"Lunqvist is a hot goalie so it's ok that he shut us down at home."
"Ovechkin is the best in the league so it's ok if he beats us."

Give me a ****ing break.

They won 4 out of 5 games and you are *****ing.

It is not a loser mentality. It is realism.

It is not OK, but it is the reality of the NHL. Teams don't win every game. Sometimes they struggle to score.

But, in the big picture, the team is playing pretty well this year. You said nothing after they played more phsyical than the Flyers and won. Or when they beat one of the best teams in the west in Calgary. In those cases, one game means nothing.

But one game when they struggle?

The season is over!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 07:59 AM

Are you ****ing kidding me???? Here are the last 5 games, which we won 4 of I might add...

Sabres - 4, Flyers -2
Sabres - 5, Hurricanes -1
Sabres - 3, Leafs - 0
Sabres - 6, Canadians - 2
Sabres - 1, Rangers - 2

We've outscored the opposition 19-7 in that stretch and you're acting like our season's over, we can't score goals, and we can't stop anybody.

You are completely and utterly ****ing impossible.

Stop with the facts, dammit!!!

They only scored once the other night!!!!

I bet you a dollar they only score 5 goals or less the rest of the season!!

THATHURMANATOR

12-07-2009, 08:09 AM

There are 82 games OP. HOLY ****>

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 09:04 AM

Are you ****ing kidding me???? Here are the last 5 games, which we won 4 of I might add...

Sabres - 4, Flyers -2
Sabres - 5, Hurricanes -1
Sabres - 3, Leafs - 0
Sabres - 6, Canadians - 2
Sabres - 1, Rangers - 2

We've outscored the opposition 19-7 in that stretch and you're acting like our season's over, we can't score goals, and we can't stop anybody.

You are completely and utterly ****ing impossible.
And if we go back over the course of the season, I can show you similar stretches where we averaged less than 2 goals a game. But according to you, that's irrevelvant. Stop and think about that for a second.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 09:07 AM

They won 4 out of 5 games and you are *****ing.

It is not a loser mentality. It is realism.

It is not OK, but it is the reality of the NHL. Teams don't win every game. Sometimes they struggle to score.

But, in the big picture, the team is playing pretty well this year. You said nothing after they played more phsyical than the Flyers and won. Or when they beat one of the best teams in the west in Calgary. In those cases, one game means nothing.

But one game when they struggle?

The season is over!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The big picture is that this inability to score keeps coming back. The big picture is that the backup goaltending sucks and Miller will eventually wear down. The big picture is that this season resembles last year in a lot of key ways, hence the title of this thread

Philagape

12-07-2009, 09:09 AM

The big picture is that the backup goaltending sucks and Miller will eventually wear down.

Even more this season with the Olympics

BlackMetalNinja

12-07-2009, 09:22 AM

And if we go back over the course of the season, I can show you similar stretches where we averaged less than 2 goals a game. But according to you, that's irrevelvant. Stop and think about that for a second.Where in the hell did I say that doesn't matter??? We also happen to give up the 3rd fewest goals in the league... we score more than we give up... we have a record of 16-8-2, we're 1 point back in the division with 3 games in hand... If you want to accuse people of not seeing the whole picture, maybe you better take a closer look yourself.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 09:25 AM

Where in the hell did I say that doesn't matter??? We also happen to give up the 3rd fewest goals in the league... we score more than we give up... we have a record of 16-8-2, we're 1 point back in the division with 3 games in hand... If you want to accuse people of not seeing the whole picture, maybe you better take a closer look yourself.
When miller has 60 starts plus the Olympics, do you honestly believe we'll still be giving up so few goals? That's the whole picture.

BlackMetalNinja

12-07-2009, 09:38 AM

When miller has 60 starts plus the Olympics, do you honestly believe we'll still be giving up so few goals? That's the whole picture.And how many times have I posted in this forum that my hugest concern this year is Miller's durability, particularly with the Olympics????? My point is that even when we have a great stretch where we win 4 games, and then have a minor setback in one... you have to jump all over that setback and act as if it's the norm, when it clearly isn't. Compared to the rest of the league right now, this team is good, plain and simple. I'm sorry if that hurts you to hear, and you can twist it anywhich way you please, but right now it's the truth and every statistic and standing backs it up.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 09:45 AM

And how many times have I posted in this forum that my hugest concern this year is Miller's durability, particularly with the Olympics????? My point is that even when we have a great stretch where we win 4 games, and then have a minor setback in one... you have to jump all over that setback and act as if it's the norm, when it clearly isn't. Compared to the rest of the league right now, this team is good, plain and simple. I'm sorry if that hurts you to hear, and you can twist it anywhich way you please, but right now it's the truth and every statistic and standing backs it up.
And it was the truth around this time last year too, before the team went on a holiday vacation and never returned. Sorry if it hurts you to hear, but being good in nov and dec doesn't mean dick.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 09:45 AM

The big picture is that this inability to score keeps coming back. The big picture is that the backup goaltending sucks and Miller will eventually wear down. The big picture is that this season resembles last year in a lot of key ways, hence the title of this thread

That is entirely different than what you said.

And there are also key differences from last year's team, including the addition of guys like Montadour and Grier, who provide more leadership and toughness than Max and Spacek. Not to mention to contributions of young guys like Myers and Kennedy. But I guess the differences can be ignored, eh?

But I do agree that we need guy that is better as a back-up than Lalime. He can't start every 8th game. He is not effective as a spot starter.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 09:53 AM

And it was the truth around this time last year too, before the team went on a holiday vacation and never returned.

The team had already trailed way off last year at this point.

Last year after 26 games they were 12-11-3, for 27 points.

This year they are 16-8-2, for 34 points.

So they are 7 points ahead of last year's team. Even if they run equal to what they did last year, they are looking at finishing about 5th or 6th in the East.

So, it is not the same at all.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 10:18 AM

The team had already trailed way off last year at this point.

Last year after 26 games they were 12-11-3, for 27 points.

This year they are 16-8-2, for 34 points.

So they are 7 points ahead of last year's team. Even if they run equal to what they did last year, they are looking at finishing about 5th or 6th in the East.

So, it is not the same at all.
The team was also scoring more last year. Miller is the only star who shows up every night. Guys like Grier and Gaustad play hard every night, but they just don't have the raw talent to provide the points this team needs.

It's embarrassing and alarming that the D is adding points and we still can't score consistently.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 10:25 AM

The team was also scoring more last year. Miller is the only star who shows up every night. Guys like Grier and Gaustad play hard every night, but they just don't have the raw talent to provide the points this team needs.

It's embarrassing and alarming that the D is adding points and we still can't score consistently.

What is more important - scoring more goals or winning more games?

Fact is, this team (SO FAR), is much better than last years team. They have 26% more points than last year. They are on pace for 107 points. Last year they were on pace for 84 points.

And yes, they do have the talent. Roy, Pominville, Vanek, Connolly and Stafford have all shown they can score. They are not doing so this season so far, but they do have the ability.

Point is, this year the team has been much better to date than last years team. Any objective evidence proves that. And they are, at this time, playing like a solid playoff team. And in the playoffs, generally goaltending and defense is crucial as is a good PK (the Sabres are 2nd int he NHL in that department).

So not all is lost.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 10:33 AM

What is more important - scoring more goals or winning more games?

Fact is, this team (SO FAR), is much better than last years team. They have 26% more points than last year. They are on pace for 107 points. Last year they were on pace for 84 points.

And yes, they do have the talent. Roy, Pominville, Vanek, Connolly and Stafford have all shown they can score. They are not doing so this season so far, but they do have the ability.

Point is, this year the team has been much better to date than last years team. Any objective evidence proves that. And they are, at this time, playing like a solid playoff team. And in the playoffs, generally goaltending and defense is crucial as is a good PK (the Sabres are 2nd int he NHL in that department).

So not all is lost.
the piece that you are missing is that we're fast approaching the point where we will need to score to win. All of those guys can score- none of them have proven they can score consistently. Even Vanek tends to have dry spells.

DMBcrew36

12-07-2009, 10:53 AM

The team is human - they will play some good games, and they will play some duds. All I care about is how they are playing in the Spring.

hydro

12-07-2009, 11:08 AM

the piece that you are missing is that we're fast approaching the point where we will need to score to win. All of those guys can score- none of them have proven they can score consistently. Even Vanek tends to have dry spells.
Isn't Vanek basically in a dry spell now? Maybe when the goaltending slips a little bit he may get hot. It isn't as if we haven't seen that before.

RockStar36

12-07-2009, 11:20 AM

This entire thread is unreal.

Ebenezer

12-07-2009, 04:57 PM

This entire thread is unreal.
this entire thread is totally typical.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 06:22 PM

this entire thread is totally typical.

and totally true.

You guys can ignore the scoring problem all you want, and think Miller can keep up at this pace all season all you want, but you're just setting yourselves up for disappointment.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 06:28 PM

and totally true.

You guys can ignore the scoring problem all you want, and think Miller can keep up at this pace all season all you want, but you're just setting yourselves up for disappointment.

So the positive (Miller's play) is going to stop and the negative (goals scoring) will continue?

Correct?

BTW, you completely ignored the 17 goals in 4 games. They had picked up on the goal scoring recently and had ONE bad game.

And as usual, you use the exception to prove the rule.

And you never did respond to the fact that they are 26% ahead of where they were last year.

Is that meaningless?

Philagape

12-07-2009, 06:33 PM

So the positive (Miller's play) is going to stop and the negative (goals scoring) will continue?

Positives stopping and negatives continuing is all that's ever happened in Buffalo in my lifetime.
So why is such a thought so controversial?

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 06:44 PM

So the positive (Miller's play) is going to stop and the negative (goals scoring) will continue?

Correct?

BTW, you completely ignored the 17 goals in 4 games. They had picked up on the goal scoring recently and had ONE bad game.

And as usual, you use the exception to prove the rule.

And you never did respond to the fact that they are 26% ahead of where they were last year.

Is that meaningless?

It's not rocket science- MILLER WILL WEAR OUT. It has nothing to do with negatives and positives. It has to do with the reality of only having one viable option at goalie. He broke down last year and he'll break down this year too. He can't do it himself.

1 period down against NJ- 5 shots, zero goals. In the last 4 periods at home, the Sabres have been outscored 4-1. 1 goal every 4 periods will NOT cut it.

We're ahead of last year? It doesn't matter if we keep playing like this. And Miller has the Olympics this year, which he didn't have last year.

12-07-2009, 06:50 PM

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 06:52 PM

OP, we're a more defensive minded team this year. We don't have to score a bunch of goals to win because we can play steady defense, get the early lead and hold onto it. It has worked for New Jersey, they've won a cup and that's all that matters.

that works if we score a couple. ONE at home won't cut it and is inexcusable.

Also, it's gonna burn us later in the year when Miller is tired. That's all I'm trying to say. Seems pretty basic- I don't know why it's started so much controversy.

Philagape

12-07-2009, 06:58 PM

OP, we're a more defensive minded team this year. We don't have to score a bunch of goals to win because we can play steady defense, get the early lead and hold onto it. It has worked for New Jersey, they've won a cup and that's all that matters.

Well, they have Brodeur ... not that it matters .... tiny difference ..... hardly worth mentioning ......

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 07:00 PM

that works if we score a couple. ONE at home won't cut it and is inexcusable.

Also, it's gonna burn us later in the year when Miller is tired. That's all I'm trying to say. Seems pretty basic- I don't know why it's started so much controversy.

Because you are acting like it happens every game, when it was a one game occurrence and you said nothing about the 4 game winning streak.

You thrive on negativity and *****ing and loathe anything positive.

Nobody has disagreed that one goal a game is enough. Nobody.

But that happens to other teams too. And the scoring has increased for this team.

And you refuse to acknowledge those facts.

3-0 now. PP goal.

After 18 straight kills.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 07:17 PM

Because you are acting like it happens every game, when it was a one game occurrence and you said nothing about the 4 game winning streak.

You thrive on negativity and *****ing and loathe anything positive.

Nobody has disagreed that one goal a game is enough. Nobody.

But that happens to other teams too. And the scoring has increased for this team.

And you refuse to acknowledge those facts.

3-0 now. PP goal.

After 18 straight kills.

It's NOT a one game occurrence. It's happening AGAIN tonight. This was the trend at the start of the season, and it keeps coming back. The team will go through a 17 goals in 4 games stretch, then right back to this ****ing bull****.

You're viewing it as an isolated incident, but it's not. It's been the trend this year.

and now you're trying to make it about me instead of the fact that the team is playing like ****. Weak.

DMBcrew36

12-07-2009, 07:22 PM

This game is about as bad as it can get. Not only are the Sabres being dominated, but I have to listen to these Versus ******s.

If Brodeur gets that shutout record against us, I'm going to be pissed. I hate that **** and I honestly believe he's overrated - having benefited from playing behind the Devils system and great Devils teams all these years.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 08:19 PM

It's NOT a one game occurrence. It's happening AGAIN tonight. This was the trend at the start of the season, and it keeps coming back. The team will go through a 17 goals in 4 games stretch, then right back to this ****ing bull****.

You're viewing it as an isolated incident, but it's not. It's been the trend this year.

and now you're trying to make it about me instead of the fact that the team is playing like ****. Weak.

And the end of the day they are still one of the top teams in the East. Whether you want to admit it or not.

I know you are smart enough to see that. They are still winning games.

Not the way you want them too apparently, but they are still winning the majority of their games.

They are not playing like ****. You can say that until you are blue in the face. But being 4-2 in their last 6 is not playing like ****.

It is only about you because you are so damn stubborn and refuse to admit that you are panicking over a team that has a pretty decent record. Or instead of saying it is something that needs to improve you make the Sabres sound like they are playing like the Hurricanes or Leafs.

This is why I avoid this forum.

The discussions are more reasonable in the Spin Zone than they are here.

Not one person has said that the Sabres don't need to play better at times.

What I don't get is why it is so difficult to acknowledge that they have done anything well this year. Once can be critical and still admit that they have done somethign well this year and are not the worst team in the entire NHL, like you are acting.

But I guess we are all idiots and are too stupid to know what we are watching.

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 08:23 PM

And the end of the day they are still one of the top teams in the East. Whether you want to admit it or not.

I know you are smart enough to see that. They are still winning games.

Not the way you want them too apparently, but they are still winning the majority of their games.

They are not playing like ****. You can say that until you are blue in the face. But being 4-2 in their last 6 is not playing like ****.

It is only about you because you are so damn stubborn and refuse to admit that you are panicking over a team that has a pretty decent record. Or instead of saying it is something that needs to improve you make the Sabres sound like they are playing like the Hurricanes or Leafs.

This is why I avoid this forum.

The discussions are more reasonable in the Spin Zone than they are here.

Not one person has said that the Sabres don't need to play better at times.

What I don't get is why it is so difficult to acknowledge that they have done anything well this year. Once can be critical and still admit that they have done somethign well this year and are not the worst team in the entire NHL, like you are acting.

But I guess we are all idiots and are too stupid to know what we are watching.

Of course- throw the last two in with the previous 4. One goal in two home games is PLAYING LIKE ****, period. Ignore the fact that this scoring issue is a trend that has been coming and going all season. What they've done well doesn't matter because they can't do it consistently, and what they've done well is the piece that's most likely to fall apart as the season winds on.

Go ahead, bury your head in the sand. Come February and March, you will see. In fact, you saw it last year so I don't even know why we have to argue about this.

Dr. Lecter

12-07-2009, 08:27 PM

Of course- throw the last two in with the previous 4. One goal in two home games is PLAYING LIKE ****, period. Ignore the fact that this scoring issue is a trend that has been coming and going all season. What they've done well doesn't matter because they can't do it consistently, and what they've done well is the piece that's most likely to fall apart as the season winds on.

Go ahead, bury your head in the sand. Come February and March, you will see. In fact, you saw it last year so I don't even know why we have to argue about this.

Actually they played well late in the season last year, it was too late.

yes the last two games were bad. I only bring up the last 4 because I am not sure you know they occurred.

And yes, they are inconsistent in scoring. No doubt. But they are getting good defense and great goaltending.

What I find funny is that you told me earlier that what Vanek has done in the past does not matter. Yet the negative from the past does matter.

Which way is it? Is the past significant or not?

And the team is not the same as last year's BTW.

hydro

12-07-2009, 08:30 PM

OpIv37

12-07-2009, 08:31 PM

What Vanek has done in the past doesn't matter because he's not doing it now. The problems of the past matter because they're STILL problems.

What were the two biggest problems the Sabres had last year? Inconsistent top scorers and no backup goaltending.

What are the two biggest problems the Sabres still have? Inconsistent top scorers and no backup goaltending.

What makes you think Miller can continue to play at this level late in the season? What makes you think Vanek, Roy, and Pominville will suddenly start scoring? What makes you think Lalime and/or Enroth can come in and suddenly do something they've never proven they can do?

Those things are what has to happen for this team to make any sort of playoff run, or maybe even to make the playoffs at all. And those things are still HUGE holes that are already manifesting themselves in early December. Go ahead and put your head in the sand if you want, but this team's flaws are being exposed in a major way.

DMBcrew36

12-08-2009, 08:28 AM

Overrated? :rofl:

I have never heard something so insane in my life.

It's funny that when Brodeur was out all season, last season, his backup had just as much success as him. Do you know who that backup was? Kevin Weekes. *****ty a** Kevin Weekes. And yet there was zero drop-off when Brodeur went out. It was Weekes final year in the NHL before retiring, and he recorded his personal best GAA.

Throw Lalime behind the Devils and he's a stud. Lalime would've had that shutout last night, and thats a fact.

The only thing I give Brodeur credit for is his longevity. Throw him behind another team all these years and he's just average or slightly above.

You can disagree with me all you want but it's as clear as day.

hydro

12-08-2009, 08:34 AM

It's funny that when Brodeur was out all season, last season, his backup had just as much success as him. Do you know who that backup was? Kevin Weekes. *****ty a** Kevin Weekes. And yet there was zero drop-off when Brodeur went out. It was Weekes final year in the NHL before retiring, and he recorded his personal best GAA.

Throw Lalime behind the Devils and he's a stud. Lalime would've had that shutout last night, and thats a fact.

The only thing I give Brodeur credit for is his longevity. Throw him behind another team all these years and he's just average or slightly above.

You can disagree with me all you want but it's as clear as day.

Well actually it was Clemmensen that was doing most of the Goaltending. He did have a good record.

DMBcrew36

12-08-2009, 08:42 AM

Well actually it was Clemmensen that was doing most of the Goaltending. He did have a good record.

Clemmensen, too. 25-13-2.

Again, I give Brodeur a lot of credit for his longevity all these years, but when it comes to shutouts and winning games, I don't think it has ever really mattered who is in net for the Devils. They consistently have played the best defensive system in hockey.

Miller, on the other hand, will have to continue playing out of his mind, like the best goaltender in the world, if the Sabres are going to have anything near a 25-13-2 record after 40 games.