Maybin vs other D-ends rookie production

[The Juice Is Loose]

Ok, FlyingDoutchman, please don't yell at me for starting another thread.

The other Maybin threads are getting congested, so I just want to post some REALITY for all of you guys as to just how bad Maybin is doing.

I raised the question "How many d-ends did NOTHING their rookie year and went on to have good careers"

People threw these names at me, citing that they didn't have good rookie years. Now, these are guys who I wouldn't even necessarily expect Maybin to be better than.

I'm posting this because people have cited that these guys took as long as Maybin to produce, which is not the case. Here are the facts:

Mario Williams - 1st overall, 35 tackles, 4.5 sacks
Dwight Freeney - 11th overall pick, 40 tackles, 13 sacks
Gaines Adams - 5th overall pick, 38 tackles, 6 sacks
Chris Long - 2nd overall pick, 32 tackles, 4 sacks

I would also like to add that NONE of these players held out for a better contract. And, another fun fact is that Freeney has been billed as a "small" "speed" defensive end, in a 4-3, and he weighs 268lbs. That is up to 30lbs more than Maybin.

Now, just to be thorough, I am going to compare him to some other defensive ends from this draft, players that we could have drafted, but didn't.

Tyson Jackson - 13 tackles, 0 sacks (he plays DE in a 3-4, not a sack position)(still almost double the tackles)
Brian Orakpo - 29 tackles, 7 sacks
Everette Brown - 12 tackles, 1.5 sacks (not great but still way more than Maybin)

And lastly, I'm going to compare him to some of our horrible d-ends over the past 10 years.

Erik Flowers - 2 sacks rookie year
Chris Kelsay - 12 tackles, 0 sacks
Ryan Denney - 6 tackles, 0 sacks.

So, now can we stop throwing names like Mario Williams and Dwight Freeney at me as comparison? I think this shows that if your ever going to do anything, you'll find your way on the field and do SOMETHING your rookie year.

We basically have spent 25 million on a skinnier Ryan Denney with a mohawk.

Who held out for more $.

History shows, if anybody expects anything better than Denney (unless we switch to 3-4) your going to be sorely dissapointed.

As we all already are.

[madness]

:banghead:

[Dicknoze69]

Small sample size is small.

[The Juice Is Loose]

BTW, I wouldn't hold Maybins or Whitners draft positions against them if they hadn't held out.

If they just signed, I'd blame the Bills.

But when a rookie, whose never played a down comes here and holds out for weeks, or a month or whatever, that is a sign of arrogance to me

"They need to take care of their family"

Right, and the original 20 million offer wasn't enough.

If you talk the talk you better walk the walk. And Maybin and Whitner are prime examples of guys who got a sense of entitlement because of their draft position.

They always displayed arrogance and a sense of greatness about themselves, which makes me resent them.

All they have to do to get me to like them is produce. I don't care if you get tasered if you win us games. I don't care if you hold out, if you win us games.

These 2 guys are poster children for what's wrong with this team right now.

[Pinkerton Security]

i can see what you're getting at, and yes he obviously has disappointed, but he also rarely plays. i want to see more and more of him, let him play a couple series in a row to get into the flow of the game.

[The Juice Is Loose]

i can see what you're getting at, and yes he obviously has disappointed, but he also rarely plays. i want to see more and more of him, let him play a couple series in a row to get into the flow of the game.

i can agree with that. no reason to not play him now.

but even still, if you deserve to be on the field who in their right mind would stop you?

[BillsWin]

I can admit that his rookie season has been a disappointment and his hold out sucked. Especially for Bills fans that had just went through the Peters hold out.

In my opinion this is the wrong defensive scheme for Maybin. He should be a rush linebacker in a 3-4.

Still, I think he is young and has the frame to add more muscle. He is very quick, but needs to work on his counter move.

I think it is too early to call him a bust as we all knew coming out that if the Bills would pick him it would be a project to get him ready THIS season.

If he goes all next year without production I am right on board with you Juice.

[psubills62]

:deadhorse:

Really? You needed a third thread?

[HHURRICANE]

We basically have spent 25 million on a skinnier Ryan Denney with a mohawk.


Even if you're not a fan of the Juice that comment is f..ing hilarious!!

[TacklingDummy]

Maybin was the wrong pick. I'd almost rather have anyone else that was selected in the 1st round after him. Definitely the ones in bold.

12 DEN Moreno, Knowshon, RB, Georgia
13 WAS Orakpo, Brian, DE, Texas
14 NO Jenkins, Malcolm, CB, Ohio State
15 HOU Cushing, Brian, OLB, Southern Cal
16 SD English, Larry, DE, Northern Illinois
17 TB Freeman, Josh, QB, Kansas State
18 DEN Ayers, Robert, LB, Tennessee
19 PHI Maclin, Jeremy, WR, Missouri
20 DET Pettigrew, Brandon, TE, Oklahoma State
21 CLE Mack, Alex, C, California
22 MIN Harvin, Percy, WR, Florida
23 BAL Oher, Michael, OT, Mississippi
24 ATL Jerry, Peria, DT, Mississippi
25 MIA Davis, Vontae, CB, Illinois
26 GB Matthews, Clay, OLB, Southern Cal
27 IND Brown, Donald, RB, Connecticut
28 BUF Wood, Eric, C, Louisville
29 NYG Nicks, Hakeem, WR, North Carolina
30 TEN Britt, Kenny, WR, Rutgers
31 ARI Wells, Chris, RB, Ohio State
32 PIT Hood, Evander, DT, Missouri

[Prov401]

No doubt he has disappointed.

However, can you blame the guy for holding out? Who cares about arrogance and whatnot. If me being arrogant and snobby is going to get my employer to throw another 2 million a year on my salary, then I'll be the most arrogant person I could possibly be. We're not talking about chump change here. Maybin didn't hold out for 20 thousand dollars. He held out for millions.

Yea, bring up the point about him not being there. Him not gelling with his teamates. Him being a disappointment. Comparing him to more 'NFL ready' DE's that have come out of college the past few years. Whatever. The point is, we all knew he was going to be a project. He was billed as having enormous potential, and that's what he is still billed as. What do you expect Maybin to do with minimal playing time? Calling him a bust now is just way too premature. And I'm assuming this is what the thread is about. Because if it isn't about that, and instead it's about Maybin being a disappointment, then this thread is useless. Stevie Wonder could see that Maybin has been a disappointment.

[The Juice Is Loose]

No doubt he has disappointed.

However, can you blame the guy for holding out? Who cares about arrogance and whatnot. If me being arrogant and snobby is going to get my employer to throw another 2 million a year on my salary, then I'll be the most arrogant person I could possibly be. We're not talking about chump change here. Maybin didn't hold out for 20 thousand dollars. He held out for millions.

Yea, bring up the point about him not being there. Him not gelling with his teamates. Him being a disappointment. Comparing him to more 'NFL ready' DE's that have come out of college the past few years. Whatever. The point is, we all knew he was going to be a project. He was billed as having enormous potential, and that's what he is still billed as. What do you expect Maybin to do with minimal playing time? Calling him a bust now is just way too premature. And I'm assuming this is what the thread is about. Because if it isn't about that, and instead it's about Maybin being a disappointment, then this thread is useless. Stevie Wonder could see that Maybin has been a disappointment.

I think the feeling that I have is that for the Bills to make that pick, they had to have hoped he'd be on the field, NOW.

Ok?

You don't go draft a guy in the first round, 11th overall, and not expect him to make an impact in his first year. If not Sept/Oct, then in Nov/Dec.

We knew he was a project, but for him to not be on the field, to me, means that he is falling short of what even the Bills expected of him.

[The Juice Is Loose]

also, if other rookies are doing more as rookies, they'll do more as 2nd year players and 3rd year players.

if maybin triples his production, he'll have 21 tackles and 0 sacks.

that ain't cuttin it for a high pick.

[The Juice Is Loose]

THE RACE IS ON:

2009 TACKLES
JOHN MCCARGO : 6
AARON MAYBIN : 7

WHO WILL WIN IT?!?

[Beastie Bills]

THE RACE IS ON:

2009 TACKLES
JOHN MCCARGO : 6
AARON MAYBIN : 7

WHO WILL WIN IT?!?

hahahahahaha.

Too funny man.

[The Juice Is Loose]

hahahahahaha.

Too funny man.

everybody hates mccargo, he can't pass a physical, he can't stay healthy, barely sees the field.

1 tackle difference from maybin.

[Raptor]

osi umenyiora and justin tuck. Both considered massive bust in there first year by there fan bases

Sorry, all players dont development at the same speed especially with the limited amount of playing time Maybin has seen. The fact that R.Denney, a player I might add who will not even be here next year, gets more snaps then him is an utter joke

[Raptor]

also, if other rookies are doing more as rookies, they'll do more as 2nd year players and 3rd year players.

if maybin triples his production, he'll have 21 tackles and 0 sacks.

that ain't cuttin it for a high pick.


Tell that to Mark Anderson and D.Harvey...Might want to dig a little deeper into your research

[Block "O"]

Brian Cushing and James Laurinaitis are also better than Aaron Curry. If you're going by this season.

[Bravo82]

Brian Cushing and James Laurinaitis are also better than Aaron Curry. If you're going by this season.

****ing idiot :down:

[Block "O"]

****ing idiot :down:

infraction on the way

[Dicknoze69]

also, if other rookies are doing more as rookies, they'll do more as 2nd year players and 3rd year players.



This might be the worst use of logic and rational thinking that I've ever seen on this board.

[billistic]

Maybin has had a really great year for a rookie, holdout defensive end. I don't see how Aaron could have possibly done any better, or showed more of his inherent talent. He clearly exceeded my wildest expectations. His fantastic promise is obvious. Guaranteed, this kid has All Pro written all over him.

[Ingtar33]

Mario Williams - 1st overall, 35 tackles, 4.5 sacks
Dwight Freeney - 11th overall pick, 40 tackles, 13 sacks
Gaines Adams - 5th overall pick, 38 tackles, 6 sacks
Chris Long - 2nd overall pick, 32 tackles, 4 sacks



Tyson Jackson - 13 tackles, 0 sacks (he plays DE in a 3-4, not a sack position)(still almost double the tackles)
Brian Orakpo - 29 tackles, 7 sacks
Everette Brown - 12 tackles, 1.5 sacks (not great but still way more than Maybin)




the bolded players play linebacker not defensive end.

and Tyson Jackson was drafted 5th overall. we couldn't have drafted him.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

Hey buddy. Sometimes it takes time. Don;t jump the gun. I'll name you 3 Hall of fame type guys at DE spot. And how they did there rookie years. The great

Michael Strahan- 1 sack
John Randle- 1 sack
Richard Dent- 3 sacks

Should these tems have called these guys busts after yr 1?

You can add Chris Doleman .5 sack then 3 sacks in yr 2. Before closing with 150

[jamze132]

The Bills haven't been in the position to draft a project in the 1st round in years. There is absolutely no justifiable reason for drafting this guy when we did.

Maybe he will turn out to be a decent player in a couple of years in a different defensive scheme, but he will never produce **** in a 4-3 or Crap2 as a DE pure.

What ****ing moron thought it was a good idea to draft this guy considering what scheme we play? Well, hopefully those idiots will be gone after this season. One of them already is.