Defensive Roll Call: Who stays and who goes

[Don't Panic]

With a new scheme, we need to determine who should stay and who should go from our current roster. This will help make our needs more apparent. Luckily, I've been kicking this can for a month, so if you need some feedback from the BZ Nation, look here:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=185021

and here:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=186935

My take:

STAYS
Maybin (OLB)
Poz (OLB/ILB... still not sure that he can play OLB in a 3-4)
Mitchell (OLB/ILB... I could see him playing either)
Schoebel (OLB... if he wants to come back)
Stroud (DL... I would think DE, but he was quoted as saying he'd try NT)
Williams (DE)
Johnson (DE)
Harvey (NT... riding your advice on this one, Madhi)

GOES
Kelsay
Denney
Ellison
Harris (where would he play?)
Only question here is can we get a late round pick for Kelsay or Denney

ON THE FENCE
McCargo - can he play in a 3-4? Is he worth trying for a year to see where he may fit? I bet Sanders has already answered this question for himslef and Gailey
Ellis - is he worth trying to transition to OLB, even if only for depth?

[Night Train]

I pretty much agree with you, Carpetbagger.

I think Stroud and Spencer Johnson would be our DE's, with a NT to be determined. Williams could play NT in a pinch but be a solid backup along the line. We need a space eater there.

Needs are NT and OLB. Secondary is overloaded already.

[Night Train]

One more thing . I think Schobel and Kelsay will be on the trading block for draft picks. Too small.

[Don't Panic]

One more thing . I think Schobel and Kelsay will be on the trading block for draft picks. Too small.

If Schobel doesn't retire...

I mention Kelsay and Denney as trade bait... could we get even a 5th or a 6th for them though? I don't know... I guess they have value in a 4-3, which a lot of teams are still running. We may be left with the option of simply releasing them.

[Demon]

Schobel will retire. Look what happened to Kampman in Green Bay after the switched from a 4-3 to a 3-4. Schobel knows better.

[zone]

Harris isn't going anywhere.

[DesertFox24]

Harris and Palmer are tall enough and have a good enough frame to get bigger to move to ILB.

Mitchell and Poz are ILBs all the way.

Dont be surprised if Kelsay adds weight and becomes the RE for us

[BillsOwnAll]

I cant see us cutting harris after one year. He didnt even disappoint.

[PECKERWOOD]

Are you kidding? Keep Poz inside, put Mitchell inside, Maybin obviously goes on the outside and Schobel goes on the outside.

STAYS: Poz, Mitchell, Schobel, Maybin, Stroud, Williams, Ellis & Johnson. (Secondary stays the same.)

GOES: Kelsay, Denney, Harris, Ellison, McCargo, Palmer, Draft & Stamer.

[BillsFanCupp38]

Kelsay/Denny gone... I think Schobel could be a dominate outside linebacker

[kernowboy]

I think if we have 6 DL guys on the roster for a 3-4, then half of them will be rookies. Stroud may stay as well as Johnson, but I think they might trade Williams to a 4-3 team. I think they'll look to add picks rather than try to transition players as that is always risky.

It wouldn't surprise me if they look to the Carolinas for their guys in the middle of the draft.

Cam Thomas (6ft3, 330lbs) of North Carolina, Jay Ross (6ft3, 314lbs) and Linval Joseph (6ft6, 322lbs) of East Carolina have decent size for Nose Tackles.

At DE, the Wilsons - EJ (6ft3, 289lbs) of North Carolina and CJ (6ft4, 284lbs) of East Carolina have a nice size and speed.

All should be around between 3-5 and I can see the Bills looking to stockpile picks here.

[PECKERWOOD]

Cam Thomas is a good football player.

[BoyILuvLoznStupidly]

Are you kidding? Keep Poz inside, put Mitchell inside, Maybin obviously goes on the outside and Schobel goes on the outside.

STAYS: Poz, Mitchell, Schobel, Maybin, Stroud, Williams, Ellis & Johnson. (Secondary stays the same.)

GOES: Kelsay, Denney, Harris, Ellison, McCargo, Palmer, Draft & Stamer.

So then we will have 2 outside LB's that have never played the position. I can see this being a disaster. I can't wait to see there coverage skills.

[bigbub2352]

realisitcly kyle williams and spencer johnson on dline
poz and mitchell at inside
palmer and harris for depth
maybin on outside
keep entire secondary
and schobel to OLB if he doesnt retire
other than that go shopping

Stroud doesnt have anything left in the tank

[PECKERWOOD]

So then we will have 2 outside LB's that have never played the position. I can see this being a disaster. I can't wait to see there coverage skills.

Maybin is very fast, he should excel more in the 3-4 than the 4-3, that's for sure. Even Schobel has some wheels, these guys should be able to make the transition.

[BoyILuvLoznStupidly]

Maybin is very fast, he should excel more in the 3-4 than the 4-3, that's for sure. Even Schobel has some wheels, these guys should be able to make the transition.

I hope you're right. I just don't think we have the roster to make that transition this year. If it blows up this coming season it will be as stupid as trying to run the no huddle last year.

[Ed]

I'm not a huge Denney fan, but I think he could still have a role in a 3-4 at DE. I wouldn't want him starting, but as a rotational guy I would keep him.

I'm pretty sure when we drafted him, Pittsburgh wanted him too, but we grabbed him right before their pick. So if Pitt thought he could fit in a 3-4, I don't see why we have to get rid of him.

I also think to be safe, we need to start getting used to life without Schobel and assume that he retires. His heart doesn't seem to be in it anymore.

[Night Train]

I know everyone has completely forgotten about the guy ..but if Maybin makes sense at OLB, DE Chris Ellis wouldn't be a bad experiment there to salvage his career. 260lbs. and can rush the passer, much like Maybin.

[BillsOwnAll]

If it blows up this coming season it will be as stupid as trying to run the no huddle last year.


Can you call that a no huddle? It confused the offense more then the defense. Plus the defense still had time to huddle up...not like it was necessary.

[psubills62]

With a new scheme, we need to determine who should stay and who should go from our current roster. This will help make our needs more apparent. Luckily, I've been kicking this can for a month, so if you need some feedback from the BZ Nation, look here:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=185021

and here:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=186935

My take:

STAYS
Maybin (OLB)
Poz (OLB/ILB... still not sure that he can play OLB in a 3-4)
Mitchell (OLB/ILB... I could see him playing either)
Schoebel (OLB... if he wants to come back)
Stroud (DL... I would think DE, but he was quoted as saying he'd try NT)
Williams (DE)
Johnson (DE)
Harvey (NT... riding your advice on this one, Madhi)

GOES
Kelsay
Denney
Ellison
Harris (where would he play?)
Only question here is can we get a late round pick for Kelsay or Denney

ON THE FENCE
McCargo - can he play in a 3-4? Is he worth trying for a year to see where he may fit? I bet Sanders has already answered this question for himslef and Gailey
Ellis - is he worth trying to transition to OLB, even if only for depth?

Poz and Mitchell are definitely ILB's. We could really use a stud ILB, though. Switching to the 3-4 makes that first pick all the more difficult.

For those wanting to trade Denney, I'm pretty sure he's a UFA this year. So if we're going to trade anyone, it would just be Kelsay.

I'm hoping that Harris can bulk up and play ILB, but I'm not expecting anything. The kid seemed to have a tough enough time transitioning from safety to light LB in our crappy Tampa 2. Is he really going to be able to transition yet again to ILB? Chris Draft might be worth keeping for depth at ILB, but guys like Marcus Buggs, Keith Ellison, etc. need to go.

I'm sure the coaches have discussed McCargo, and I doubt we'll see him back. Ellis is worth a shot in the 3-4 as a young OLB, as is Maybin.

If we're just going with guys currently on the roster, it would probably look like this:

Spencer Johnson (DE), Lonnie Harvey (NT), Marcus Stroud (DE)
Maybin (OLB), Mitchell (ILB), Poz (ILB), Schobel/Ellis (OLB)

Now whether that's a GOOD front 7 is extremely debateable. We also have very little depth. As others have mentioned, Stroud seems to be declining, but he's actually pretty ideal size for a 5-tech. Kyle Williams just doesn't have the height or arm length to be a good DE in the 3-4. Hopefully we can get a decent draft pick for him.

[kernowboy]

I think we could get a 4th for Williams - a 4th for Lynch, a 3rd for Whitner.

If we were to draft CJ Wilson (6ft4, 284lbs), EJ Wilson (6ft3, 289lbs) and Linval Joseph (6ft6, 322lbs) we'd have decent potential on the DL

[YardRat]

IMO Schobel will retire. Kelsay and Denney will move on, and get SB rings with their new teams.

[Don't Panic]

Poz and Mitchell are definitely ILB's. We could really use a stud ILB, though. Switching to the 3-4 makes that first pick all the more difficult.

For those wanting to trade Denney, I'm pretty sure he's a UFA this year. So if we're going to trade anyone, it would just be Kelsay.

I'm hoping that Harris can bulk up and play ILB, but I'm not expecting anything. The kid seemed to have a tough enough time transitioning from safety to light LB in our crappy Tampa 2. Is he really going to be able to transition yet again to ILB? Chris Draft might be worth keeping for depth at ILB, but guys like Marcus Buggs, Keith Ellison, etc. need to go.

I'm sure the coaches have discussed McCargo, and I doubt we'll see him back. Ellis is worth a shot in the 3-4 as a young OLB, as is Maybin.

If we're just going with guys currently on the roster, it would probably look like this:

Spencer Johnson (DE), Lonnie Harvey (NT), Marcus Stroud (DE)
Maybin (OLB), Mitchell (ILB), Poz (ILB), Schobel/Ellis (OLB)

Now whether that's a GOOD front 7 is extremely debateable. We also have very little depth. As others have mentioned, Stroud seems to be declining, but he's actually pretty ideal size for a 5-tech. Kyle Williams just doesn't have the height or arm length to be a good DE in the 3-4. Hopefully we can get a decent draft pick for him.

That front 7 would be greatly aided by a FA OLB addition. True, depth would still be an issue, but assuming Harvey can play right away (big if), we would be adequate in our starting spots.

Interesting to see how many feel that a lot of the current personnel may be around next year. I guess that was what Nix was referring to at his initial PC.

[kernowboy]

That front 7 would be greatly aided by a FA OLB addition. True, depth would still be an issue, but assuming Harvey can play right away (big if), we would be adequate in our starting spots.

Interesting to see how many feel that a lot of the current personnel may be around next year. I guess that was what Nix was referring to at his initial PC.

I can see a draftee like Cam Thomas, Torrell Tropp, Linval Joseph or even Jay Ross, starting ahead of Harvey

[eee1776]

Spenser Johnson Marcus stroud Kyle willams
Aaron schobel Poz Mitchell Maybin

Kelsay is the odd man out because of his salary.

[psubills62]

That front 7 would be greatly aided by a FA OLB addition. True, depth would still be an issue, but assuming Harvey can play right away (big if), we would be adequate in our starting spots.

Interesting to see how many feel that a lot of the current personnel may be around next year. I guess that was what Nix was referring to at his initial PC.

It does seem like there will be an unnatural number of OLB's available this year, including guys like Adalius Thomas, Joey Porter, Jason Taylor, etc. We may be able to pick one up there, but I wouldn't count on it.

At this point, I'm not counting on FA for anything but depth. With a limited pool and this being the Bills (i.e. not going to outbid anyone), it's unlikely that we find a good starter in FA.

[jamze132]

Mitchell sucks. We need to draft McClain.

[psubills62]

That front 7 would be greatly aided by a FA OLB addition. True, depth would still be an issue, but assuming Harvey can play right away (big if), we would be adequate in our starting spots.

Interesting to see how many feel that a lot of the current personnel may be around next year. I guess that was what Nix was referring to at his initial PC.

I think the problem is that we don't really have much choice. Especially now with the tiny free agent pool, how much turnover can we actually have? It would be nice to phase a lot of these untalented guys out of the lineup, no matter what system we're in. But we only have so many draft picks. Can't replace everyone in one offseason.

If it was a matter of choice, a lot of the current players, I'm sure, would be gone.