Spiller Is Exceptional, Unlike Fred Jackson

[Night Train]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MooMhKt-wKw

Saying he's a luxury pick because we already have Jackson is like saying I'm no different than Brad Pitt, since I'm male and have blond hair. :rolleyes:

Jackson is a good back but scares no one. This guy is frightening and may instantly be our best player.

[psubills62]

Jackson is good, but I think too many people see all RB's as being equal. The fact is that there are guys at RB who have significantly more talent than others. I just saw someone compare Jackson/Spiller to Williams/Stewart in Carolina. I like Jackson, but he does not have the talent that Williams and Stewart have.

[justasportsfan]

the guy can catch deep too.

[psubills62]

the guy can catch deep too.

Exactly...he can be used as a receiver. I'd love to see Spiller and Jackson on the field at the same time for numerous plays in each game. Especially 3rd downs.

[Luisito23]

"I don't want a franchise, home-run threat, I rather reach for a tackle just to fill a need"...:rolleyes:

[Lexwhat]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MooMhKt-wKw

Saying he's a luxury pick because we already have Jackson is like saying I'm no different than Brad Pitt, since I'm male and have blond hair. :rolleyes:

Jackson is a good back but scares no one. This guy is frightening and may instantly be our best player.

Are you implying something about Fred Jackson not being Black enough? Black enough like Spiller?


:snicker2:

[mysticsoto]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MooMhKt-wKw

Saying he's a luxury pick because we already have Jackson is like saying I'm no different than Brad Pitt, since I'm male and have blond hair. :rolleyes:

Jackson is a good back but scares no one. This guy is frightening and may instantly be our best player.

I think you are right. Exceptional backs can change a team. Look how much Adrian Petersen improved Minnesota, or Chris Brown with Tennessee? We do have lots of holes, so I understand people complaining, but imagine getting a superb rb that we can have for years and years. I was against this pick before the draft, but the more I think about it, the more I see that he was the BPA and that the Bills did the right thing in getting him.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Let's see him catch that ball when his quarterback's getting sacked every other down.

[Billz_fan]

Well Im still not sold. Yes we have many more needs than a 1st round RB. I wanted either Dan Williams or Bulaga with our 9 pick.

I keep seeing people here saying how we are now going to have a game changing running back for years to come. The average career for an NFL running back is what ? It's like 3 years or less.

So if he falls in line with the numbers we won't even be done rebuilding when he starts declining or lost his knees altogether.

Now everyone has a chance of injury etc at any position, however running backs have the got to have the shortest career numbers no ?

[Oaf]

"I don't want a franchise, home-run threat, I rather reach for a tackle just to fill a need"...:rolleyes:
"I'd rather improve RB by 25% than improve LT by 70-80%"...:rolleyes:

[OpIv37]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MooMhKt-wKw

Saying he's a luxury pick because we already have Jackson is like saying I'm no different than Brad Pitt, since I'm male and have blond hair. :rolleyes:

Jackson is a good back but scares no one. This guy is frightening and may instantly be our best player.

Saying Spiller is a luxury pick has nothing to do with whether or not he's better than Jackson. It has to do with the fact that this team has way bigger needs than RB.

Like I said earlier in another thread: Drafting an RB now is like cleaning up a car wreck by sweeping the glass off the road before trying to get the injured people out of the vehicle.

[psubills62]

Let's see him catch that ball when his quarterback's getting sacked every other down.
I'd rate that 4 Op's :opiv: :opiv: :opiv: :opiv: in terms of exaggeration of how bad this team is.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Well Im still not sold. Yes we have many more needs than a 1st round RB. I wanted either Dan Williams or Bulaga with our 9 pick.

I keep seeing people here saying how we are now going to have a game changing running back for years to come. The average career for an NFL running back is what ? It's like 3 years or less.

So if he falls in line with the numbers we won't even be done rebuilding when he starts declining or lost his knees altogether.

Now everyone has a chance of injury etc at any position, however running backs have the got to have the shortest career numbers no ?
Exactly! Linemen have much longer careers and are worth far more in the long run than a running back. This league chews up and spits out running backs far more quickly than any other position. That's why it's almost NEVER worth a first-round pick on a running back. First-rounders demand long term guaranteed money, something that most aren't worth.

[psubills62]

Well Im still not sold. Yes we have many more needs than a 1st round RB. I wanted either Dan Williams or Bulaga with our 9 pick.

I keep seeing people here saying how we are now going to have a game changing running back for years to come. The average career for an NFL running back is what ? It's like 3 years or less.

So if he falls in line with the numbers we won't even be done rebuilding when he starts declining or lost his knees altogether.

Now everyone has a chance of injury etc at any position, however running backs have the got to have the shortest career numbers no ?

3 years? I thought good RB's were done when they're 30. That would be a lot more than 3 years. Having Jackson around should also save him a lot of wear and tear.

I was one of the people who really wanted Bulaga at #9. But a lot of people just don't seem to want to admit that this draft is fairly deep at OT. Considering only 4 OT's went off the board in the 1st, we're in quite good shape to get one in the 2nd round also.

[Billz_fan]

3 years? I thought good RB's were done when they're 30. That would be a lot more than 3 years. Having Jackson around should also save him a lot of wear and tear.

I was one of the people who really wanted Bulaga at #9. But a lot of people just don't seem to want to admit that this draft is fairly deep at OT. Considering only 4 OT's went off the board in the 1st, we're in quite good shape to get one in the 2nd round also.


I saw the number of 2.6 years for an average NFL running back alot when looking around. I found this little article interesting. 3 out of every 5 RB's are out of the league in 4 years and thats from the NFLPA. That folks is why you don't take RB's in the 1st round of the draft. Just think how much money this pick is going to command for such a short term return.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/specialreports/specialnfl/s_291034.html


The average career of an NFL back is 2.6 years and falling, according to the National Football League Players' Association. Players, coaches and historians interviewed by the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review blamed the mayfly careers of rushers on the brutally high number of carries they get in an age of free agency.

Throughout the 1960s and 1970s, teams rarely asked their backs to touch the ball more than 230 times in a season.

Historically, every time a player gets more than that many touches in a season, his production declines the following year by 50 fewer carries and 1.2 fewer games. Nearly three out of every five of these backs are out of the league within four years.

[Prov401]

The dude is approximately the same height and weight as Chris Johnson. He's elusive, fast, and has great hands. Hell, he even ran the same 40 as CJ. Anybody upset at this pick needs to take their tampons out and realize that we have the top playmaker in this year's draft hands down. We have 6 more rounds to go. Some of you sound like the draft is over because the first round is done with. This draft is crazy deep, and were going to shore up our lines withing the next few rounds I'm sure.

[psubills62]

I saw the number of 2.6 years for an average NFL running back alot when looking around. I found this little article interesting. 3 out of every 5 RB's are out of the league in 4 years and thats from the NFLPA. That folks is why you don't take RB's in the 1st round of the draft. Just think how much money this pick is going to command for such a short term return.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/specialreports/specialnfl/s_291034.html

3 out of every 5 RB's are out of the league in 4 years? I would bet that that's mostly due to lack of talent and a plentiful supply of guys who are decent at RB. Guys like Samkon Gado who have a decent half-year, then bounce around the league for the next couple of years. Spiller has talent that far surpasses any average RB.

I'd like to see the numbers for 1st-round RB's. I'd bet they are significantly higher (probably around 5-6 years). To claim that Spiller will be out of the league in 3 years is silly. The only thing that would prevent him from playing longer than 5 years is injuries, which is the case with every position.

[psubills62]

The dude is approximately the same height and weight as Chris Johnson. He's elusive, fast, and has great hands. Hell, he even ran the same 40 as CJ. Anybody upset at this pick needs to take their tampons out and realize that we have the top playmaker in this year's draft hands down. We have 6 more rounds to go. Some of you sound like the draft is over because the first round is done with. This draft is crazy deep, and were going to shore up our lines withing the next few rounds I'm sure.

I'll defend Spiller as Buffalo's pick, but I don't think that's true. Spiller ran a 4.37 and Chris Johnson ran a 4.24.

[Billz_fan]

Well then it's settled, Lets fit him for his hall of fame jacket and be done with :laughter:

[TacklingDummy]

Saying Spiller is a luxury pick has nothing to do with whether or not he's better than Jackson. It has to do with the fact that this team has way bigger needs than RB.


The Bills should have reached for Tebow at 9.

[Buffalogic]

There's no such thing as a luxury pick in the top10. You are just a fool if you say that and that's pretty much the reason the bills are void of exceptional talent. You take BPA in the top10. Period.

[OpIv37]

The Bills should have reached for Tebow at 9.

Never said that- in fact, I've been trashing Tebow as much as anyone around here. You're the one who thinks that QB is the team's only problem, not me.

[mysticsoto]

Never said that- in fact, I've been trashing Tebow as much as anyone around here. You're the one who thinks that QB is the team's only problem, not me.

Just curious Op, who would you have picked at #9 considering where we were?

[OpIv37]

There's no such thing as a luxury pick in the top10. You are just a fool if you say that and that's pretty much the reason the bills are void of exceptional talent. You take BPA in the top10. Period.

That's fine if you do something else to address the holes. But the Bills didn't. So, we had gaping holes at QB, T, NT, and WR, and now with all the best FA's signed and the first round of the draft over with, we STILL have gaping holes at QB, T, NT, and WR.

You can't do NOTHING in FA, then go BPA in the draft, and expect to win.

[Ed]

The average career length is only a few years for the entire NFL, not just RB's. Over 200 new players join the league every year, which means a lot of guys that have only been in the league a couple years and haven't emerged get cut.

[mysticsoto]

That's fine if you do something else to address the holes. But the Bills didn't. So, we had gaping holes at QB, T, NT, and WR, and now with all the best FA's signed and the first round of the draft over with, we STILL have gaping holes at QB, T, NT, and WR.

You can't do NOTHING in FA, then go BPA in the draft, and expect to win.

???

Only one round has gone by...

[OpIv37]

Just curious Op, who would you have picked at #9 considering where we were?

Probably Davis.

Or trade down- if SD was willing to trade up for that other RB, they probably would have traded up for Spiller.

But these holes have to get addressed somehow. The FO ignored them in FA and ignored them in the first round of the draft, where the best players are. We're supposed to be rebuilding, but how are we supposed to rebuild by NOT addressing holes?

[Bling]

???

Only one round has gone by...

Good point but a first round pick is way more important than every other pick. It sets the tone. We'll see how the Bills finish out.

[OpIv37]

???

Only one round has gone by...

Oh, right, so we're going to address glaring needs with late round draft picks. Really? I think I've seen this episode before, and I know how it ends.

[mysticsoto]

Oh, right, so we're going to address glaring needs with late round draft picks. Really? I think I've seen this episode before, and I know how it ends.

So you can only address holes in the 1st round and everything else is crap?

[PECKERWOOD]

Spiller better be a perennial 1,200 yard rusher for the pick to be worth it, he better not be a just over 1,000 yard guy like Lynch has been or it was a waste of a pick. I'm excited that people are comparing him to Chris Johnson, but how can I believe that? You'd be lucky to see a Chris Johnson caliber of player once every decade, let alone in every draft.

[OpIv37]

So you can only address holes in the 1st round and everything else is crap?

Or FA/trade, but we didn't do that either.

when you have as many glaring holes as the Bills do, you can't expect a bunch of late round rookies to come in and elevate the team.

Look, the team's a cluster****. We're not going to address all the holes in one off-season. But the major holes are QB, NT, LT, WR, and pass rush depending on if Schobel retires and/or how Schobel and Maybin do in the 3-4. All I was hoping for was some progress in a couple of those areas. Let me repeat: all the best FA's are gone and the first round of the draft is over. Those are the best opportunities to get something done, and we have improved in NONE of those areas.

So, let me repeat: how are we going to get better by not addressing holes, or at least putting them off until the end of the draft? It makes no sense whatsoever.

[TacklingDummy]

Never said that- in fact, I've been trashing Tebow as much as anyone around here. You're the one who thinks that QB is the team's only problem, not me.
I never said that. Stop putting words in my mouth.
QB is the main problem. Why not reach and try and fill a need like you suggest?

[OpIv37]

I never said that. Stop putting words in my mouth.
QB is the main problem. Why not reach and try and fill a need like you suggest?

1. I don't think Davis is a reach
2. There's a difference between a 3-4 pick reach and a 20 pick reach.

[mysticsoto]

Good point but a first round pick is way more important than every other pick. It sets the tone. We'll see how the Bills finish out.

I think you're right and I think it did set the tone. The new Bills FO is going to go after playmakers that can change the dynamics of a game. They realize that we are not a 1 or 2 player needed to fix us - type of team. As such, they can't fix the team in 1 year. So what they can and will do, is take advantage of an EXCEPTIONAL player that has fallen to them.

They did mention that they feel Demetrious Bell can handle LT duties - which leads me to believe they will likely grab a NT next or maybe even OLB. Some of you may not like Bell, but you forget that last year he got better with every game until he got hurt and started playing hurt until he officially had to be taken out completely. Can he really handle it? Well, I don't know, but I do know that our Oline looked decent (better than I thought it would look) at the start of the year before all the injuries crippled it. I don't feel Kyle Williams is even close to be able to handle NT duties, so I hope this is their next pick. I like Linval Joseph, but won't be upset if we get Cody. If Sergio Kindle is still there, however, I may prefer him though...some people have him ranked as the highest OLB of the draft, and it's amazing he's still there.

[TacklingDummy]

But these holes have to get addressed somehow.
These holes you are suggestion are they all filled with one 1st round pick or do other round picks matter?

What's wrong with taking Saffold in the 2nd? Wouldn't that fill your need?

[OpIv37]

I think you're right and I think it did set the tone. The new Bills FO is going to go after playmakers that can change the dynamics of a game. They realize that we are not a 1 or 2 player needed to fix us - type of team. As such, they can't fix the team in 1 year. So what they can and will do, is take advantage of an EXCEPTIONAL player that has fallen to them.

They did mention that they feel Demetrious Bell can handle LT duties - which leads me to believe they will likely grab a NT next or maybe even OLB. Some of you may not like Bell, but you forget that last year he got better with every game until he got hurt and started playing hurt until he officially had to be taken out completely. Can he really handle it? Well, I don't know, but I do know that our Oline looked decent (better than I thought it would look) at the start of the year before all the injuries crippled it. I don't feel Kyle Williams is even close to be able to handle NT duties, so I hope this is their next pick. I like Linval Joseph, but won't be upset if we get Cody. If Sergio Kindle is still there, however, I may prefer him though...some people have him ranked as the highest OLB of the draft, and it's amazing he's still there.

I like Kindle too, but he dropped due to knee problems.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Sergio-Kindle-falls-due-to-medical-concerns.html

[mysticsoto]

1. I don't think Davis is a reach
2. There's a difference between a 3-4 pick reach and a 20 pick reach.

And therein lies the issue Op. YOU don't think Davis was a reach at 9. For all you know, the Bills may have had him ranked as a late 1st rounder.

The other thing you fail to realize is that you are clearly of the philosophy that you should draft on a "need" basis. This FO clearly is drafting (or for now, atleast it seems) with a BPA philosophy. Or they may have a hybrid where BPA for 1st (maybe 2nd also) followed by Needs. I don't know this FO's style enough to gauge, but so far, that's how it seems.

[OpIv37]

And therein lies the issue Op. YOU don't think Davis was a reach at 9. For all you know, the Bills may have had him ranked as a late 1st rounder.

The other thing you fail to realize is that you are clearly of the philosophy that you should draft on a "need" basis. This FO clearly is drafting (or for now, atleast it seems) with a BPA philosophy. Or they may have a hybrid where BPA for 1st (maybe 2nd also) followed by Needs. I don't know this FO's style enough to gauge, but so far, that's how it seems.

So how/when are they going to fill needs? They just keep passing on chance after chance to fill needs.

This team will not improve until they start filling needs, and they seem content to wait to do it. Again, I've seen what happens when teams try to fill holes with low round draft picks and 3rd tier FA's. We've all seen it.

As far as where the Bills had him ranked, well, I've seen some of the Bills' drafts in the past, so where the Bills have guys ranked doesn't have much credibility with me.

[mysticsoto]

So how/when are they going to fill needs? They just keep passing on chance after chance to fill needs.

This team will not improve until they start filling needs, and they seem content to wait to do it. Again, I've seen what happens when teams try to fill holes with low round draft picks and 3rd tier FA's. We've all seen it.

As far as where the Bills had him ranked, well, I've seen some of the Bills' drafts in the past, so where the Bills have guys ranked doesn't have much credibility with me.

If we go LT/NT/OLB or QB with the 2nd and 3rd rds we fill 2 needs. And 2nd and 3rd rds are not low round draft picks...

[OpIv37]

If we go LT/NT/OLB or QB with the 2nd and 3rd rds we fill 2 needs. And 2nd and 3rd rds are not low round draft picks...

I'm not convinced- I think the holes we have require more attention than that, but this FO doesn't seem to care.

[ddaryl]

the guy can catch deep too.

so can Jackson,wo I felt wasn't used out of the backfield enough.

Himand Spiller will make a great Tandem IMO

[Prov401]

I'll defend Spiller as Buffalo's pick, but I don't think that's true. Spiller ran a 4.37 and Chris Johnson ran a 4.24.

Buddy Nix said when the Bills worked out Spiller, his 40 was a "fuz faster" than CJ's.