What turns a guy into a bust?

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  • ghz in pittsburgh
    Registered User
    • Aug 2004
    • 5861

    What turns a guy into a bust?

    I was just shooting some shots with my buddy working for an agency here. We were talking about busts and that got me thinking?

    How does a guy become a bust? Especially higher draft picks?

    From what I learned, they have most of the physical parts down to a science. A guy in each position needs certain speed, certain strength, certain size, which all teams have measured over and over again, in combines, and more importantly, from hundreds of films analysis.

    Everyone also has to go through interviews, dissect plays, answer football questions so that football intelligence is tested - I heard they have to go through scouts, position coaches, coordinators, head coaches on a typical visits. So a team should have a pretty good idea if the kid can grasp the concept of what the team want to do on the field - I mean concepts, not all the plays.

    The one variable I can see is hard work. I understand when you go up a level, you natural talent alone may not carry you as much as in college because talent differences are much smaller in NFL, you need hard work to keep up or notch ahead. I think teams know that. The Bills, for example, are picking guys with a hard working attitude exclusively. Those who take a gamble on not-so-reputable athletes know that they are taking a gamble; I cannot call those ones busts because of that.

    Then there are peaks and valleys in performance. Some times, guys peak in performance or get favorable match ups, so you look awesome in one year. That's what we call one year wonder. I think Nix said he tried to avoid that, though I think he did exact that in the 4th round. But if you stick with picking guys with 3 or more years of solid performance, you can eliminate this kind of problems as well.

    So finally I come down with a conclusion of money. That's the thing that noone can measure or forecast. Almost all of the kids, for the first time, will have the amount of money they've never seen before. And we all know money can change a person, in a big way. I have heard many stories of business people making money and lose interest - they usually have stock or invest while still collecting a fat check off other people's work. People like Steve Jobs, Bill Gates are minority.

    Maybe NFL should hire people to analyze prospects from the money perspective.
  • DraftBoy
    Administrator
    • Jul 2002
    • 107452

    #2
    Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

    Originally posted by ghz in pittsburgh
    I was just shooting some shots with my buddy working for an agency here. We were talking about busts and that got me thinking?

    How does a guy become a bust? Especially higher draft picks?

    From what I learned, they have most of the physical parts down to a science. A guy in each position needs certain speed, certain strength, certain size, which all teams have measured over and over again, in combines, and more importantly, from hundreds of films analysis.

    Everyone also has to go through interviews, dissect plays, answer football questions so that football intelligence is tested - I heard they have to go through scouts, position coaches, coordinators, head coaches on a typical visits. So a team should have a pretty good idea if the kid can grasp the concept of what the team want to do on the field - I mean concepts, not all the plays.

    The one variable I can see is hard work. I understand when you go up a level, you natural talent alone may not carry you as much as in college because talent differences are much smaller in NFL, you need hard work to keep up or notch ahead. I think teams know that. The Bills, for example, are picking guys with a hard working attitude exclusively. Those who take a gamble on not-so-reputable athletes know that they are taking a gamble; I cannot call those ones busts because of that.

    Then there are peaks and valleys in performance. Some times, guys peak in performance or get favorable match ups, so you look awesome in one year. That's what we call one year wonder. I think Nix said he tried to avoid that, though I think he did exact that in the 4th round. But if you stick with picking guys with 3 or more years of solid performance, you can eliminate this kind of problems as well.

    So finally I come down with a conclusion of money. That's the thing that noone can measure or forecast. Almost all of the kids, for the first time, will have the amount of money they've never seen before. And we all know money can change a person, in a big way. I have heard many stories of business people making money and lose interest - they usually have stock or invest while still collecting a fat check off other people's work. People like Steve Jobs, Bill Gates are minority.

    Maybe NFL should hire people to analyze prospects from the money perspective.
    This has been studies for years, there is no conclusive answer. Too many variables exist.
    COMING SOON...
    Originally posted by Dr.Lecter
    We were both drunk and Hillary did not look that bad at 2 AM, I swear!!!!!!

    Comment

    • trapezeus
      Legendary Zoner
      • Oct 2004
      • 19525

      #3
      Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

      i think one major issue is the increase in talent level.

      some guys got away with using poor technique against lesser talent. and they got away with it. they were labelled "athletes" and people think, "wow, he was so goodwith no discipline, i bet as a fantastic coach, i can fix this and make him better."

      And the issue then becomes, is this a guy who is a student of the game and wants to be technically sound so that he can out play others who are as talented, or is he a guy who was happy for his payday and really just thinks he's better than everyone else because that's the way its been his whole life up to that point.

      Within those two ideas, there are a ton of varying factors that aren't exactly quantifiable. That's why they do the dinners and the wonderlics....just like a job interview. You know that people will say the right thing. but when it comes down to it, will they be the right fit. You don't know until they are on your team.

      Comment

      • ddaryl
        Everything I post is sexual inuendo
        • Jan 2005
        • 10714

        #4
        Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

        desire, drive, self motivation. As you mentioned money. For some once they get paid they have no carrot left to chase

        Some players just do not have enough of it at the upper levels.


        Coaching. Get drafted by a horrible team who misuses the player, which sets that palyer back and makes him unattractive to other teams moving forward...


        Draft position. Get drafted in the 1st rd when you're a 2nd rd talent and you have to work around the expectations attached to you.
        Last edited by ddaryl; 04-26-2010, 02:31 PM.

        Comment

        • Forward_Lateral
          Registered User
          • Mar 2004
          • 29895

          #5
          Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

          It's simple. If the player turns out to suck, he's a bust.

          Comment

          • trapezeus
            Legendary Zoner
            • Oct 2004
            • 19525

            #6
            Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

            also the wildcard is injuries. A guy breaks something, rehabs it, feels the pressure to contribute, reinjures himself, someone else outplays him...he keeps trying, but never fully heals and before you knkow it 3 years have passed and everyone is like, "this guy was a dud."

            Doesn't mean he didn't want to do well, he just caught the worst breaks possible.

            Comment

            • BlackMetalNinja
              I'm not Jewish, I'm just in it for the hats.
              • May 2005
              • 31525

              #7
              Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

              You mean besides playing for Buffalo?

              Comment

              • ddaryl
                Everything I post is sexual inuendo
                • Jan 2005
                • 10714

                #8
                Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                Originally posted by Forward_Lateral
                It's simple. If the player turns out to suck, he's a bust.

                what he said...the simple version:brilliant:

                Comment

                • G Wolly
                  Registered User
                  • Mar 2004
                  • 9387

                  #9
                  Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                  Originally posted by BlackMetalNinja
                  You mean besides playing for Buffalo?
                  Beat me to it.


                  Comment

                  • jamze132
                    Don’t hate…
                    • Jun 2003
                    • 29312

                    #10
                    Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                    Lets pose this question to Whitner.

                    Ok, I'm sorry. It wasn't Whitner's fault he was drafted #8 overall...

                    Comment

                    • PECKERWOOD
                      Defies all logic
                      • Oct 2006
                      • 13170

                      #11
                      Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                      Originally posted by DraftBoy
                      This has been studies for years, there is no conclusive answer. Too many variables exist.
                      Well, if an elite talent who relied solely on his natural ability and not his work ethic to get by on the lower levels will receive a rude awakening if they try doing the same thing in the NFL against PROFESSIONALS with natural ability and heart. This is why you don't take guys with character concerns in the 1st round, for example, a guy like Dez Bryant would be completely off my board in the 1st if I was a GM. (Not saying that Dez Bryant will bust, but his character concerns makes him a bit more prone to busting than other prospects, although I suppose that these same standards apply to Jimmy Clausen, which is probably why he wasn't drafted in the 1st.)
                      Last edited by PECKERWOOD; 04-27-2010, 04:56 AM.

                      Comment

                      • elltrain22
                        Registered User
                        • Sep 2003
                        • 4281

                        #12
                        Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                        Originally posted by ddaryl
                        desire, drive, self motivation. As you mentioned money. For some once they get paid they have no carrot left to chase

                        Some players just do not have enough of it at the upper levels.


                        Coaching. Get drafted by a horrible team who misuses the player, which sets that palyer back and makes him unattractive to other teams moving forward...


                        Draft position. Get drafted in the 1st rd when you're a 2nd rd talent and you have to work around the expectations attached to you.
                        Bingo!! IMO, it's all about how some respond to themselves, once they have a large bank roll. Some guys, or usually the ones that are busts, stop working hard b/c they have a large security blanket. For example, I'm sure there has been a time or two this offseason where Jemarcus Russell has thought about working out, but since he's got madd G's, he says "awwww screw it, I got madd dough, gimmie a donut!"
                        If you walk with Jesus today, you don't have anything to worry about tomorrow...

                        Comment

                        • billz83
                          Registered User
                          • Mar 2010
                          • 445

                          #13
                          Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                          Originally posted by Forward_Lateral
                          It's simple. If the player turns out to suck, he's a bust.
                          I know right haahaha itz not rocket science!! Mccargo= BUST
                          JP Lostman=BUST

                          Comment

                          • better days
                            Registered User
                            • Jan 2010
                            • 22028

                            #14
                            Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                            I don't think it is money so much as passion. If a player has a passion for the game, & loves to play, he will strive to become the best he can be. A person without that passion will soon become distracted with all the things his NEW money can get him & will let his game slide. The wild card is injuries.

                            Comment

                            • mikemac2001
                              is the creepy cross dresser staring at you in the corner
                              • Mar 2003
                              • 4574

                              #15
                              Re: What turns a guy into a bust?

                              Greg Williams/Mike Mularkey/Dick Jauron

                              MUCK
                              FIAMI

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