Offensive players not a need?

[cpearl]

How can anyone who knows anything about the NFL think that an offensive superstar (like Spiller, best RB and overall offensive player in the draft ) wasn't a "need" for us?

What was our offensive rank last year? 30? Have we even been better than 25th in 4 or 5 years?

We can't score. He can. Therefore, he is a need. Especially over the 3rd best OT in the draft or a ****ty QB.

Enough already.

[mikemac2001]

How can anyone who knows anything about the NFL think that an offensive superstar (like Spiller, best RB and overall offensive player in the draft ) wasn't a "need" for us?

What was our offensive rank last year? 30? Have we even been better than 25th in 4 or 5 years?

We can't score. He can. Therefore, he is a need. Especially over the 3rd best OT in the draft or a ****ty QB.

Enough already.


Most of that get that....i wouldn't spaz about it we had a good draft

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Wasn't the Bills' problem that they stall in the red zone? If so, given the fact that the main selling point was that Spiller scores from outside the red zone... he doesn't help this team at all.

[OpIv37]

How can anyone who knows anything about the NFL think that an offensive superstar (like Spiller, best RB and overall offensive player in the draft ) wasn't a "need" for us?

What was our offensive rank last year? 30? Have we even been better than 25th in 4 or 5 years?

We can't score. He can. Therefore, he is a need. Especially over the 3rd best OT in the draft or a ****ty QB.

Enough already.

Demetrius Bell is our starting LT.
Trent Edwards is our starting QB.
Lee Evans is our best WR, and it goes downhill fast from there.
At the time of the Spiller pick, we had literally zero NT's on the roster. Zero.

At the time of the Spiller pick, we had 2 legitimate NFL RB's on the roster. The reason we are 30 in O has nothing to do with RB. It has to do with OL, QB, and WR- three needs that were not addressed.

If you want to say no LT's were worth the pick, fine. If you want to say that going Best Player Available is a better strategy, fine. But with all the holes on this team, saying RB was a need is just plain asinine.

[cpearl]

Lelgitimate RBs don't win games. Great ones do.

[OpIv37]

Lelgitimate RBs don't win games. Great ones do.

No RB can win games without an LT, a QB or a defense that can stop the other team. CJ Spiller alone does not make this offense legit- he simply makes it slightly less bad.

[Philagape]

Wasn't the Bills' problem that they stall in the red zone? If so, given the fact that the main selling point was that Spiller scores from outside the red zone... he doesn't help this team at all.

Um, if Spiller scores outside the red zone, then the Bills no longer have to try from inside the red zone on that drive :brilliant:

[Philagape]

At the time of the Spiller pick, we had 2 legitimate NFL RB's on the roster.

Ah, but are they CONTRIBUTORS? :D

[mysticsoto]

No RB can win games without an LT, a QB or a defense that can stop the other team. CJ Spiller alone does not make this offense legit- he simply makes it slightly less bad.

Gailey has made every team's offense he's joined better. That sounds like a pretty good track record...

[Griff]

No RB can win games without an LT, a QB or a defense that can stop the other team. CJ Spiller alone does not make this offense legit- he simply makes it slightly less bad.

you really believe 1 draft would've made us super awesome? If we drafted say Bulaga at 9th, Clausen at 41 we would literally be waiting years for them to become starters. We drafted a starting home run hitting RB, and a starting NT.

[ddaryl]

Gailey has made every team's offense he's joined better. That sounds like a pretty good track record...


That's the difference between last years O and this one. :tobykeith

My money says Gailey gets more mileage out of the same band of misfits and it will all fall on his ability to be as a OC / HC...

Something Phillips, Williams, Jauron were not. As for Mularkey... well he shouldn't even have been a HC for us. :eb:

[OpIv37]

you really believe 1 draft would've made us super awesome? If we drafted say Bulaga at 9th, Clausen at 41 we would literally be waiting years for them to become starters. We drafted a starting home run hitting RB, and a starting NT.

no but I was hoping this draft would do a better job at filling holes.

You're making the argument that the Bills should go BPA with the draft (although I beg to differ that they always took BPA, but that's a different issue). Going BPA is fine if they address needs via FA. But they didn't address needs via FA or the draft. So, we have the same glaring holes now that we had at the start of the off season: QB, LT, WR, NT (even if you like Troup, one NT doesn't get us through the season).

At some point they have to man up and address these needs. But they'd rather make excuses and tell us it takes "years" to build a team.

[billz83]

truthfully i could care less what this team does anymore...as long as wilson is the owner i dont see this team winning a super bowl! Wilson has done everything in his power to destroy this team..how about we ignore the OLINE again! This FO and organization just doesnt GET IT..they dont understand a winning team HAS TO HAVE a good OLINE and a GOOD DLINE..ignoring the OLINE for over a decade is guaranteed failure! if spiller turns out to be as good as jackson and lynch but NOT BETTER THEN them then this was a COMPLETE worthless pick..i think he will be good im more pissed that this organization just WONT FIX the OLINE and think they have a chance at winning! itz just crazy! they wont even SIGN free agents that are better then who we have on the OLINE because wilson is just TOOO CHEAP!

[OpIv37]

Gailey has made every team's offense he's joined better. That sounds like a pretty good track record...

So, how is he going to make our O better with an RT who's not as good as Butler and one extra RB? Band aid on cancer.

[madness]

http://tallshortgirl.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/sea_monkeys2.jpg

Coming soon... The NFL franchise edition! Just put your franchise in water and watch it groooooooow!!!

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Um, if Spiller scores outside the red zone, then the Bills no longer have to try from inside the red zone on that drive :brilliant:
You cannot seriously bank your entire offense on that theory. Big plays only happen once in a great while, I don't care who is at running back. Besides, if an offense is built on too many boom-or-bust big plays, that means the offense is on the field for a shorter period of time, which in turn wears out the defense and yet again they end up getting blown up late in games. The solution to the Bills' offensive woes, if it is going to be any running back, will be the one that can grind through opposing defenders when it matters most-- a heavy hitter, fullback type. C.J. Spiller is not that man.

[feldspar]

No RB can win games without an LT, a QB or a defense that can stop the other team. CJ Spiller alone does not make this offense legit- he simply makes it slightly less bad.

I didn't realize that running backs always run towards the left.

Anyway, I read somewhere that 21 of his 50 college TDs were plays of 50 yards or greater...something like that. That, my friend, is what you call a baller. I'm sure the front office is well aware of the team's needs. It'll take time to get to where we want to be.

[feldspar]

http://tallshortgirl.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/sea_monkeys2.jpg

Coming soon... The NFL franchise edition! Just put your franchise in water and watch it groooooooow!!!

LOL.

I remember those things. I actually got some when I was a kid. They were supposed to build their own miniature underwater cities and crap like that.

[Philagape]

You cannot seriously bank your entire offense on that theory. Big plays only happen once in a great while, I don't care who is at running back. Besides, if an offense is built on too many boom-or-bust big plays, that means the offense is on the field for a shorter period of time, which in turn wears out the defense and yet again they end up getting blown up late in games. The solution to the Bills' offensive woes, if it is going to be any running back, will be the one that can grind through opposing defenders when it matters most-- a heavy hitter, fullback type. C.J. Spiller is not that man.

Ah, big plays are bad. Got it.

You don't want the D to wear down late? Then it's time the Bills actually built leads that force the other team to pass late in games. No one player in the draft could have furthered that goal more than Spiller.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

You totally missed my point, didn't you? Big plays DON'T WORK the vast majority of the time. You make the foolish assumption that a big play is going to succeed all of the time, or even the majority of the time. It doesn't. Well, it does sometimes-- when it's not intercepted, and when it's not disrupted behind the line of scrimmage, which is what happens more often than not with "big plays." They fail. If big plays worked, we'd see more fourth-down and two-point conversions, and we wouldn't even have a need for kickers and punters, except for kickoffs (which would only need the onside kick). Big plays are also known as high risk plays because they fail more often than not.

[acehole]

No RB can win games without an LT, a QB or a defense that can stop the other team. CJ Spiller alone does not make this offense legit- he simply makes it slightly less bad.


Look op it is well documented I am a build from the lines out guy. I believe we got two players to build an offense (Spiller) and a deffense (Troup) around. Zone blocking doesnt require such a stud at LT as they (O linemen) are not blocking on islands anymore. It does require practice and training to get down....so even if we picked one number one over all he would have needed the same amount of training as wang. Bottom line niether player (Number 1 or number 5 pick) would have put us over the top on a superbowl run this year. Spiller is a player singlehandedly that can improve the offense and have a much greater impact then any LT this year. It is also possible that Bell graded out comparably so they passed. I use there rational as to why they didnt pick a qb. They didnt want to waste a pick on a guy that graded out close to brom or edwards that high. While we are on qb....they may want to give edwards or Brom one year as the new system may be condusive to these young guys. Also next years QB crop is said to be loaded so we can grab one then if these guys dont step up. Gives us a year to assess bells injury and Wangs progress and at the very least either or both then can be quality depth to a high picked or Fa LT. I had both of these guys pegged in my mock. Troupe will be the heart of that 3-4 for years and I love the 5 technique tackle we picked also... We have also picked up a boatload of pass rushing inside and outside LB's both in the draft and as Fa's.Our seconday is solid and we seem to be on the lookout for tall fast possession guy for the Wr. I love the start to the Gaily era....so far. I am reading alot of our guys were considered sleepers and I am stoked even down to Levi Brown...who is as physically gifted as any qb in draft. I like the fast he trustes his WR to make plays and have a very low int to td ratio. With the addition of tall fast Wr combo he might be perfect for what we are doing. Which is not that complicated. Hand off down one and two....quick slant or find spiller on down 3. I think this was the best draft for what the bills want to do in a very long time possibly last 9 years... We shall see.

[tomz]

People who are trashing the draft that we had seem to act as if there will be nobody even manning the position at, for example, left tackle. They keep referring to 'holes.' Somehow, in spite of a ridiculous spate of injuries to the O-line, we did manage to run the ball decently. The passing woes on offense were not ONLY the fault of the line (yes, there were plenty of breakdowns) but derived from poor play calling and from poor quarterbacking.

Play calling: we were treated to highly predictable play calling, zero use of formation or motion to gain advantage. These factors, in turn, allowed defenses to tee off on us. (Again, this is in addition to things like poor blitz pick-up, the latter of which is a strong function of continuity on the line, not only the skills of individual players.) Also, how often was the tight end used on seam routes? How often did we see crossing routes?

Poor quarterbacking: needless to say, the inability of either Edwards or Fitz and our receiving corps to offer a credible, consistent threat to throw downfield made the lives of opposing defensive coordinators easy.

These three factors (offensive line talent, but at least as importantly, lack of continuity), play calling and quarterbacking created a vicious cycle.

Bell had many penalties but was not the turnstile that people make him out to be. Our O-lien, especially the interior, definitely was half decent in run blocking.

Adding Spiller made a major improvement in several aspects, giving us a versatile back with true vertical pass-catching abilities as well as a major threat for the return game. We also added a big receiver. Many draftnik boards, interestingly, had both Calloway and Wang just off the top tier (interestingly, with Calloway rated slightly higher than Wang in most I saw). Regardless of what round they were selected in, after the 1st round these two were pretty much as good as anyone available.

So we did address the need for an elite playmaker on O and added some promising picks. Again, critical people seem to think that putting (for the sake of argument) Wang out there is tantamount to not even having someone at the position. Hardly the case.

The draft is a bout gauging where they thought the value lay and how long it would last at certain positions. It was clear from the lightning fast delivery of the card to podium that Nix et al. had decided on their picks well in advance. I believe these guys have a clear-eyed view of what they have and what they needed and they constructed their draft based on that.

[Throne Logic]

Wasn't the Bills' problem that they stall in the red zone?

No.

Consistent Red Zone failure would be a major upgrade. It would imply they made it into the Red Zone on occasion.

Most of the time it was difficult to tell if the offense even took the field. I swear, the Bills get the ball going into commercial break and they're lined up in punt formation by the time we get back to the game...

[Throne Logic]

I believe these guys have a clear-eyed view of what they have and what they needed and they constructed their draft based on that.

It seems like they have broken the various pieces of this team into a giant jigsaw puzzle and spread it out on the table. There are a number of pieces they will need to find or replace and they've given themselves two years to complete the picture. Aside from Nose Tackle, the order of acquisition doesn't seem to be important.