Interesting Draft Find

[ServoBillieves]

I usually pick up Pro Football Draft Guide every year. It's moreover a poor decision for someone who loves combine numbers, but does evaluate college talent and who plays well in-game.

I just took a look at their pre-combine draft board and found some interesting.... finds...

300 players were on their draft big board... Here are our picks/FA pick ups as they were ranked.

#11) C.J. Spiller, RB
#60) Alex Carrington, DE
#78) Kyle Calloway (talk about slipping...), OG
#97) Torrell Troup, DT
#148) Joique Bell, RB
#160) Ed Wang, LT
#162) Marcus Easley, WR
#213) Antonio Coleman, DE/LB
#234) Danny Batten, LB
#244) Levi Brown, QB
#246) Naaman Roosevelt, WR
#264) Stephan Virgil, CB

Respectively, they were drafted 9, 72, 216, 41, UDFA, 140, 107, UDFA, 192, 209, UDFA, UDFA.

I plan on posting the write ups for them soon but... well I'm too tired tonight. Overall I couldn't believe Calloway was ranked 78th, Joique Bell went undrafted (Draftboy made a good call on that one), and that according to them, we would've made 11 draft-worthy picks.

Doesn't matter anymore, since they're all on an NFL roster and were at different times, just sayin' how the combine changes things.

[BillsWin]

Somewhere, at this very moment, Draftboy is doing a :jig: because we signed Joique Bell.

Wait for poll...

[DraftBoy]

Somewhere, at this very moment, Draftboy is doing a :jig: because we signed Joique Bell.

Wait for poll...

Done, and done.

[nateodoms'bff]

Whats the deal with Joique Bell? What is so special about him.

Thanks Hargrove for the research. I feel like Nix and Co. did a great job drafting football players who both fit the scheme, and can be coached into it.

[The Spaz]

Whats the deal with Joique Bell? What is so special about him.

Thanks Hargrove for the research. I feel like Nix and Co. did a great job drafting football players who both fit the scheme, and can be coached into it.

Do a search.

[BillsWin]

Done, and done.

:up:

[PECKERWOOD]

:up:

Are you kidding? ***EDITED FOR TOS VIOLATION***

[jamze132]

Bell is going to have a hard time making this roster unless Lynch or Jackson are traded. I think he is a prime candidate for the PS but I am not sure he will last there long as another team with a RB need will snatch him up.

[methos4ever]

I doubt Lynch or Jackson will be on the punt or kick cover units, so that's a spot that Bell can take...

[Buffalogic]

When I watch Bell's tape two things jump out at me.

He's slow.

The competition he played against sucked and it shows on the film.

At least he made plays, but I don't necessarily see in him what Draftboy does.

There's a reason he went undrafted.

[k-oneputt]

How exactly does Bell make this team if Lynch is staying ? They are not keeping four rb's.

[Buddo]

How exactly does Bell make this team if Lynch is staying ? They are not keeping four rb's.

If they are going to be 'run first', they could well keep 4 RBs.

[psubills62]

If they are going to be 'run first', they could well keep 4 RBs.

Especially if they get rid of the FB.

[DraftBoy]

How exactly does Bell make this team if Lynch is staying ? They are not keeping four rb's.

Its not hard to see it happening, especially when you have one player a mistake away from a suspension and almost no need for a FB. Bell is likely a PS guy though for this year.

[ServoBillieves]

Especially if they get rid of the FB.

This surprises me. To my knowledge we only have McIntyre on the roster as FB, but in a run-heavy offense, wouldn't a fullback be a must? Someone needs to pave the way for the back if he's hitting the hole to take out a LB or pesky safety. I thought for sure we'd pick one up in the draft.

[DraftBoy]

This surprises me. To my knowledge we only have McIntyre on the roster as FB, but in a run-heavy offense, wouldn't a fullback be a must? Someone needs to pave the way for the back if he's hitting the hole to take out a LB or pesky safety. I thought for sure we'd pick one up in the draft.

We are running a spread style offense, most dont use fullbacks and with the guys we have they are better off creating for themselves.

[DraftBoy]

When I watch Bell's tape two things jump out at me.

He's slow.

The competition he played against sucked and it shows on the film.

At least he made plays, but I don't necessarily see in him what Draftboy does.

There's a reason he went undrafted.

Which games did you watch? Im generally curious.

[ServoBillieves]

Here's the write up on Calloway and Wang...

Kyle Calloway:
Upside: A big, strong right tackle, Calloway is an aggresive mauler in the running game. But despite his size, he shows the ability to get out and pull.
Downside: He has trouble with smaller, athletic pass rushers, as he tends to play too high when forced to move his feet a lot
Bottom Line: With his size/athleticism combo and mean streak, Calloway could be a quality starter on the right side or the interior

Ed Wang:
Upside: An aggresive tackle with decent feet for his size, Wang can maul as a run blocker and could hold his own on the right side.
Downside: He won't play the left side, and he gets flagged for a lot of penalties. He needs to learn how to use his hands better in pass protection.
Bottom Line: Wang should be a nice addition to a run based offense, though it will be as either a right tackle or a guard.

Emphasis being? In a run based offense, these guys can excel. Calloway sounds like a Brad Butler clone.

[DraftBoy]

Here's the write up on Calloway and Wang...

Kyle Calloway:
Upside: A big, strong right tackle, Calloway is an aggresive mauler in the running game. But despite his size, he shows the ability to get out and pull.
Downside: He has trouble with smaller, athletic pass rushers, as he tends to play too high when forced to move his feet a lot
Bottom Line: With his size/athleticism combo and mean streak, Calloway could be a quality starter on the right side or the interior

Ed Wang:
Upside: An aggresive tackle with decent feet for his size, Wang can maul as a run blocker and could hold his own on the right side.
Downside: He won't play the left side, and he gets flagged for a lot of penalties. He needs to learn how to use his hands better in pass protection.
Bottom Line: Wang should be a nice addition to a run based offense, though it will be as either a right tackle or a guard.

Emphasis being? In a run based offense, these guys can excel. Calloway sounds like a Brad Butler clone.

How about concern that neither should play LT? Many zoners thought Wang would be a LT prospect.

[The Spaz]

How about concern that neither should play LT? Many zoners thought Wang would be a LT prospect.

The PC for Wang by the Bills scouts when he was drafted said he was a LT prospect.

[OpIv37]

How about concern that neither should play LT? Many zoners thought Wang would be a LT prospect.

We don't need a LT. Buddy Nix thinks Bell is a sufficient starter.

[mayotm]

How about concern that neither should play LT? Many zoners thought Wang would be a LT prospect.The Bills have stated that they see Wang as a LT.

[DraftBoy]

The Bills have stated that they see Wang as a LT.

I don't have the most trust in the Bills scouts. It's a concer when they see him a LT but others see him as a RT. Not saying either is right but that has to at least catch your eye.

[TigerJ]

Wang would have had about the third best 40 time among tackles at the combine, had he been a combine invitee. The Bills think he has quick feet, which is a pretty important quality for assessing whether a tackle can handle the speed rushers that come from the left side. I think the main negative on Wang at this point is he's pretty raw. Because of that he probably won't be ready to play on the left this fall, and it's a little tough to know how high is ceiling is. There may be other factors that prevent him from ever being a successful starting left tackle.

[ServoBillieves]

My biggest concern is the knock on him for taking penalties. I think Demetrius Bell has the potential to be talented, but he can't seem to keep his damn hand in the dirt and loves to hold on... Why replace a drive killer with another drive killer?

[Buffalogic]

Which games did you watch? Im generally curious.I watched most of his senior season. He had a great year for Wayne state he really did. I forget what game it was but I remember he had 300+ yards and nobody could stop him.

But the tape doesn't lie. He's slow and the players he played against were not good. A lot of his big plays are a result of poor, poor defensive positioning or horrible tackling. He has no explosion at the NFL level and he's not going to be able to get away from defenders like he did at Wayne state.

Just what my scouting eye sees.

[DraftBoy]

I watched most of his senior season. He had a great year for Wayne state he really did. I forget what game it was but I remember he had 300+ yards and nobody could stop him.

But the tape doesn't lie. He's slow and the players he played against were not good. A lot of his big plays are a result of poor, poor defensive positioning or horrible tackling. He has no explosion at the NFL level and he's not going to be able to get away from defenders like he did at Wayne state.

Just what my scouting eye sees.

I just dont see it, he's literally never been caught from behind and the assertation you're making is that every player he played against last year is also slow. When I know for a fact that some of the guys he beat to the corner in the games have 4.4 speed. Not to mention the game against U of Indy where he chased down DB JT Owens over 100 yards to catch him from behind and save the two point conversion from going for a safety.

He's not a burner at all but he's also not as slow as you're making him out to be either, the tape shows that as well.

[Buffalogic]

I just dont see it, he's literally never been caught from behind and the assertation you're making is that every player he played against last year is also slow. When I know for a fact that some of the guys he beat to the corner in the games have 4.4 speed. Not to mention the game against U of Indy where he chased down DB JT Owens over 100 yards to catch him from behind and save the two point conversion from going for a safety.

He's not a burner at all but he's also not as slow as you're making him out to be either, the tape shows that as well.It doesn't matter how fast the defense is if they aren't sound tacklers. In the film I see he looks better than he is due to bad competition. Poor angles on pursuit, bad arm tackles, diving at his feet. The players he played against might be fast, but they can't play.

He's slow man. He's NFL molasses. He has good instincts but that speed isn't gonna get it done in the NFL. Especially when every defender is faster than he is and actually knows how to tackle.

[DraftBoy]

It doesn't matter how fast the defense is if they aren't sound tacklers. In the film I see he looks better than he is due to bad competition. Poor angles on pursuit, bad arm tackles, diving at his feet. The players he played against might be fast, but they can't play.

He's slow man. He's NFL molasses. He has good instincts but that speed isn't gonna get it done in the NFL. Especially when every defender is faster than he is and actually knows how to tackle.

Again I think you're down playing of the players he played against is quite off. These aren't JV kids he's playing against. But that's alright, it happens.

I simply disagree, you don't gain the amount of yards he had being "slow as molasses", it just doesnt happen. He's a quicker version of Xavier Omon with more hip movement and better vision.

Speed kills, but its not the only thing that matters either. I think he'll prove you wrong in that regard. If he doesn't no harm no foul.

[Buffalogic]

Again I think you're down playing of the players he played against is quite off. These aren't JV kids he's playing against. But that's alright, it happens.

I simply disagree, you don't gain the amount of yards he had being "slow as molasses", it just doesnt happen. He's a quicker version of Xavier Omon with more hip movement and better vision.

Speed kills, but its not the only thing that matters either. I think he'll prove you wrong in that regard. If he doesn't no harm no foul.Yeah it's a win/win for you regardless. If he doesn't pan out he's just an undrafted player that sucks. If he does you look like an accurate prognosticator.

And dude you keep defending the competition against WAYNE STATE. Come on. Even if you didn't know what school he was from or what conference he played in, the film clearly shows the weak competition. You are fooling yourself by trying to act like they are adequate defenders when they clearly aren't. You say I'm 'quite off' by downplaying his competition. I don't have to downplay them, the tape does it for me. And if your strongest argument is that the players he played against aren't scrubs, then that's damning in itself, because it's Wayne state.

I think you just have a lil mancrush on your hands. Thinking with your heart instead of your head. You obviously love the guy, but like I said, he was undrafted for a reason. I can see that, can't you?

[BertSquirtgum]

i want OP to start at left tackle

[k-oneputt]

There is a reason he went to Wayne St. instead of a Big-10 school.

IDK, maybe it was his lack of speed that is being talked about.

In the vast majority of cases with kids being recruited there is a reason they can't play at the D-1 level, and it usually has to do with the lack of physical abilities.

[DraftBoy]

There is a reason he went to Wayne St. instead of a Big-10 school.

IDK, maybe it was his lack of speed that is being talked about.

In the vast majority of cases with kids being recruited there is a reason they can't play at the D-1 level, and it usually has to do with the lack of physical abilities.

But you're wrong, he was recruited to play at both Michigan and Michigan State. Received full ride offers from both and turned them down.

[Night Train]

The one that surprises me is Coleman of Auburn .

6-1 and average athlete but when you make plays at such a high rate, you would think someone would have selected him in Rounds 5-7.

Fim doesn't lie. He's always around the ball making plays.

[k-oneputt]

But you're wrong, he was recruited to play at both Michigan and Michigan State. Received full ride offers from both and turned them down.

Why's that ????

4th or 5th rb recruit ???

IDK, asking. Why would he go to Wayne St. over Michigan ?

[DraftBoy]

Yeah it's a win/win for you regardless. If he doesn't pan out he's just an undrafted player that sucks. If he does you look like an accurate prognosticator.

And dude you keep defending the competition against WAYNE STATE. Come on. Even if you didn't know what school he was from or what conference he played in, the film clearly shows the weak competition. You are fooling yourself by trying to act like they are adequate defenders when they clearly aren't. You say I'm 'quite off' by downplaying his competition. I don't have to downplay them, the tape does it for me. And if your strongest argument is that the players he played against aren't scrubs, then that's damning in itself, because it's Wayne state.

I think you just have a lil mancrush on your hands. Thinking with your heart instead of your head. You obviously love the guy, but like I said, he was undrafted for a reason. I can see that, can't you?

No its not, I dont consider it a win just because he was PS squad fodder. Plus Im not keeping a running tally either.

We disagree you see things on tape, I dont see and I see things you don't. Call it a man crush if you wish, but then also says guys like Pat Kirwan have the same man crush. Ill take people in the business of scouting and coaching who agree with me in how I see Bell. Like you said the tape doesn't lie and many people see him differently than you do.

You continue to challenge his speed, but can't provide an instance where he was caught from behind despite playing against faster timed players instead blaming poor angles and such. He ran the ball 544 times in his career, can you point out one time on tape that he was caught from behind for a tackle? Also to further my point, if he is as slow as molasses like you said why did he have the second best 3-cone drill time behind only Jahvid Best, the 4th best 20 Yd Shuttle time (Tate, McCluster, and Hardesty), and the best 60 yd shuttle time at the combine?

He ran a 4.6, and 4.7 40 yd dash in his two pro days and combine, but is that really all your basing your issue with speed on? You provided no instances in any tape that shows he is as slow as you believe he is. I have provided instances where he chased a guy down over 100 yards to save a safety, and can even provide practice reports from the Senior Bowl week where he impressed people with his big play ability and quickness. Im still interested to know in what games that you saw on what plays, he looked as slow as you believe he is.

[DraftBoy]

Why's that ????

4th or 5th rb recruit ???

IDK, asking. Why would he go to Wayne St. over Michigan ?

They asked him to move to S, he was a little thin coming out of HS and both schools like his overall athleticism and thought they could groom him to be a S. He preferred to remain at RB and turned down the DI offers.

Michigan State told him they'd give him a shot at RB but they preferred him at S, Michigan only wanted him as a S. He wanted to prove them wrong and he did.

[k-oneputt]

Yes, very familiar recruiting type story.

Maybe the kid will prove everyone wrong and stick in the NFL. Time will tell.

[Buffalogic]

He has no explosion in the open field that's what I'm basing it on. He has one gear pretty much from what i see.

I didn't see the 2 point conversion play you talk about so I have no way to know how slow the other guy is who he caught. I mean he had to be pretty slow right? Linebacker or something?

You and Pat Kirwan may agree that's cool. But all 32 NFL teams agreed with me and didn't find him draft-worthy.

You're a knowledgeable guy, so am I. It's ok for us to disagree. I hope he does well. :up:

[DraftBoy]

He has no explosion in the open field that's what I'm basing it on. He has one gear pretty much from what i see.

I didn't see the 2 point conversion play you talk about so I have no way to know how slow the other guy is who he caught. I mean he had to be pretty slow right? Linebacker or something?

You and Pat Kirwan may agree that's cool. But all 32 NFL teams agreed with me and didn't find him draft-worthy.

You're a knowledgeable guy, so am I. It's ok for us to disagree. I hope he does well. :up:


Your first line doesnt fit at all, he has explosion its not elite but to say he has none, is false.

It was a S, google the game v. Indy U in 2009, the highlight of it are on Youtube.

I do love the bolded part of your statement, you're better than that and you know the counter far before I even have to mention it.

[Buffalogic]

Me and every nfl GM and scouting department > you and pat kirwan.

He has Wayne state explosion. Not NFL explosion. You just talk him up so well!

[DraftBoy]

Me and every nfl GM and scouting department > you and pat kirwan.

I do love arguments using absolutes!

Oh well maybe one day...

[BertSquirtgum]

you guys are being fart sniffers

[ServoBillieves]

Was hoping for a better end to this thread :-/... Though a stand-up comic I enjoy the fart reference but cmon others....