The 2-3 Win Prediction Folks Better Not Be Rooting For Trentative Or Fitz At QB

[Night Train]

If the Bills are supposedly going to suck as bad as many of you are preaching, then they have nothing to lose in starting Brohm or even Brown at QB. That goes for most starting positions where old guard marginal players with zero upside are starting.

Start a youth movement since Gailey gets at least 3-4 years anyhow. He's got nothing to lose and Nix/Wailey need to build this thing right, once and for all.

Agree or Disagree ? Discuss...

[Ingtar33]

If the Bills are supposedly going to suck as bad as many of you are preaching, then they have nothing to lose in starting Brohm or even Brown at QB. That goes for most starting positions where old guard marginal players with zero upside are starting.

Start a youth movement since Gailey gets at least 3-4 years anyhow. He's got nothing to lose and Nix/Wailey need to build this thing right, once and for all.

Agree or Disagree ? Discuss...

Gailey will get canned if the team gets 2 or 3 wins this year... even Fewell could win 2 games with that mess of a squad.

the question you should be asking is... if this team at BEST can only win 7 games should they start Brohm or Brown to see what they have. I'd say yes... however... a 7 win team will be "in the chase" into november, maybe even december so it will never happen.

[wmoz11]

I still believe that Trent can salvage something from his career with a competent offensive head coach/OC. Who knows? Maybe he lights it up for whatever reason; he's got the tools.

[Dr. Lecter]

Gailey will get canned if the team gets 2 or 3 wins this year... even Fewell could win 2 games with that mess of a squad.

the question you should be asking is... if this team at BEST can only win 7 games should they start Brohm or Brown to see what they have. I'd say yes... however... a 7 win team will be "in the chase" into november, maybe even december so it will never happen.

I dunno. I think 2 or 3 wins is realistic.

Take an honest look - there is no NT. One DE in Edwards and he is average. No OLBs. ILB should be OK. Solid DBs.

No OTs. Perhaps the best OL will be out for the start of the season. An average center. One starting WR. Hopefully one starting TE. 2 or 3 starting RBs. And no QB.


Tell why 2 or 3 wins is not what should be expected?

[Nighthawk]

I dunno. I think 2 or 3 wins is realistic.

Take an honest look - there is no NT. One DE in Edwards and he is average. No OLBs. ILB should be OK. Solid DBs.

No OTs. Perhaps the best OL will be out for the start of the season. An average center. One starting WR. Hopefully one starting TE. 2 or 3 starting RBs. And no QB.


Tell why 2 or 3 wins is not what should be expected?

Because Dick Jauron was able to win 7 with this team and he is a worse coach then Gailey. The offense will be better, just because Gailey is running it. The defense could be OK, but we have to see...the switch to a 3-4 is a big one, but the Broncos did it last year with less talent. Granted, they had Nolan running it, so that has to mean something, but do not overlook Gailey's effect on this team and specifically the offense.

[BertSquirtgum]

i'm thinking it's going to be a 6-10 year again. who should i be rooting for?

[NOT THE DUDE...]

Trent will get one more chance......

[Buffalogic]

2-3 wins is not realistic.

The bills have finished with 3 or fewer wins only one time in the last 24 years. Qb'd by Van Pelt and coached by Williams.

So those predicting a 2-3 win season are predicting the second one in a quarter of a century. Great odds. :rolleyes:

[jamze132]

Gailey will get canned if the team gets 2 or 3 wins this year... even Fewell could win 2 games with that mess of a squad.

the question you should be asking is... if this team at BEST can only win 7 games should they start Brohm or Brown to see what they have. I'd say yes... however... a 7 win team will be "in the chase" into november, maybe even december so it will never happen.
Gailey isn't getting canned if we go 1-15 this year. But a poor performance in 2011 will put him in the hot seat. Any by poor performance, I mean under .500. Yeah, I'm not really shooting for the stars just yet.

I think 4-12 is realistic and anything less I will be disapointed. But if we just get beat, than I completely understand. But what I can't tolorate is the boneheaded mistakes and piss poor time management we are currently known for.

[Ingtar33]

Gailey isn't getting canned if we go 1-15 this year. But a poor performance in 2011 will put him in the hot seat. Any by poor performance, I mean under .500. Yeah, I'm not really shooting for the stars just yet.

I think 4-12 is realistic and anything less I will be disappointed. But if we just get beat, than I completely understand. But what I can't tolerate is the boneheaded mistakes and piss poor time management we are currently known for.

I disagree. He was not loved when the Bills picked him (for good reason), there is almost no coach in the league with enough clout to survive a 1-15, 2-14 season and few who can survive a 3-13 season. I know Ralph is cheep but if the Bills stumble to a 1-15 season with this roster the coach HAS to go, and no matter how senile Ralph might be, i doubt he'd disagree with me.

4-12 is on the low side of realistic... you probably could have a corpse coach the bills to a 4 win season with this roster and the schedule we have. 7 wins is probably on the high side of realistic... and yeah... i'm sorta expecting a 5 or 6 win season right now.

[OpIv37]

Because Dick Jauron was able to win 7 with this team and he is a worse coach then Gailey. The offense will be better, just because Gailey is running it. The defense could be OK, but we have to see...the switch to a 3-4 is a big one, but the Broncos did it last year with less talent. Granted, they had Nolan running it, so that has to mean something, but do not overlook Gailey's effect on this team and specifically the offense.

Don't forget that this team is actually WORSE than what Jauron had last year. On O, we lost Butler, Reed and TO, and have yet to replace any of them with someone equal or better. On D, we didn't really lose anyone of note, but we are worse simply by virtue of the switch to the 3-4 and the lack of the proper personnel. Brown or Brohm might get us 3 wins, Trent or Fitzy might get us 5.

[Dr. Lecter]

I disagree. He was not loved when the Bills picked him (for good reason), there is almost no coach in the league with enough clout to survive a 1-15, 2-14 season and few who can survive a 3-13 season. I know Ralph is cheep but if the Bills stumble to a 1-15 season with this roster the coach HAS to go, and no matter how senile Ralph might be, i doubt he'd disagree with me.

4-12 is on the low side of realistic... you probably could have a corpse coach the bills to a 4 win season with this roster and the schedule we have. 7 wins is probably on the high side of realistic... and yeah... i'm sorta expecting a 5 or 6 win season right now.

The roster really sucks, especially for a 3-4 defense.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

On the other hand... you could throw Brohm or Brown to the wolves, then have another career destroyed before it even started (e.g. Edwards) due to getting battered by the opposing DEs. It goes both ways. Try to develop them, or save them for when they have a better line to play behind. If they're tanking this season, I'd much rather see the latter.

[OpIv37]

2-3 wins is not realistic.

The bills have finished with 3 or fewer wins only one time in the last 24 years. Qb'd by Van Pelt and coached by Williams.

So those predicting a 2-3 win season are predicting the second one in a quarter of a century. Great odds. :rolleyes:

The odds of having a 2-3 win season have nothing to do with what's happened over the last quarter century. They have to do with who's on the roster now.. And with the current roster and coaches, 3 wins is a lot more realistic than 10.

[Philagape]

Don't forget that this team is actually WORSE than what Jauron had last year. On O, we lost Butler, Reed and TO, and have yet to replace any of them with someone equal or better. On D, we didn't really lose anyone of note, but we are worse simply by virtue of the switch to the 3-4 and the lack of the proper personnel. Brown or Brohm might get us 3 wins, Trent or Fitzy might get us 5.

Butler played only two games last year. Cornell Green is a push at RT, I'd say.

The offense lost TO but gained Spiller's playmaking ability, and it's in much better hands with Gailey than AVP.

The 3-4 is an unknown, but an unknown is better than proven horrendous, as last year's team was against the run. Poz, Maybin and Ellis may actually be better suited for the 3-4 than 4-3. A lot will depend on Troup and Carrington, but again, hard to imagine being worse than last year.

The secondary is the same at worst, probably better with the return of McKelvin.

[OpIv37]

The offense lost TO but gained Spiller's playmaking ability, and it's in much better hands with Gailey than AVP.



Just like TO's production was limited last year by our poor QB's, Spiller's will be limited by our ****ty OL.

[Dr. Lecter]

Butler played only two games last year. Cornell Green is a push at RT, I'd say.

The offense lost TO but gained Spiller's playmaking ability, and it's in much better hands with Gailey than AVP.

The 3-4 is an unknown, but an unknown is better than proven horrendous, as last year's team was against the run. Poz, Maybin and Ellis may actually be better suited for the 3-4 than 4-3. A lot will depend on Troup and Carrington, but again, hard to imagine being worse than last year.

The secondary is the same at worst, probably better with the return of McKelvin.

The offense also lost TOs ability to draw coverage from Evans and Reed's 3rd down ability. Steve Johnson, James Hardy and Roscoe are a big step down from Owens and Reed.

There is no NT on the roster and that is the key in a 3-4. At least Williams and Stoud were adequate to decent at DT.

And the secondary likely will be worse. McGee is better fit for a 4-3. So is Florence. And Byrd. Scott is a decent 3-4 SS. Whitner is still Whitner.

And there are no OLBs on the team

[Philagape]

Just like TO's production was limited last year by our poor QB's, Spiller's will be limited by our ****ty OL.

The line was not bad at run blocking last year. The Bills were 8th in the league in YPC.
Fred Jackson averaged 4.5 a pop with that line, and Spiller's much more talented.

[Philagape]

The offense also lost TOs ability to draw coverage from Evans and Reed's 3rd down ability. Steve Johnson, James Hardy and Roscoe are a big step down from Owens and Reed.

There is no NT on the roster and that is the key in a 3-4. At least Williams and Stoud were adequate to decent at DT.

And the secondary likely will be worse. McGee is better fit for a 4-3. So is Florence. And Byrd. Scott is a decent 3-4 SS. Whitner is still Whitner.

And there are no OLBs on the team

I'm not expecting anything from the passing game as long as the same QBs are there. With that group, doesn't matter much who the receivers are. It's not hard for Evans to match last year's 44 catches and 612 yards under any circumstances. And Spiller is a diverse weapon who can be dangerous as a receiver as well.

There is a NT, he's a rookie, so that's an unknown.

Please elaborate on how the 3-4 makes the secondary worse.

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm not expecting anything from the passing game as long as the same QBs are there. With that group, doesn't matter much who the receivers are. It's not hard for Evans to match last year's 44 catches and 612 yards under any circumstances. And Spiller is a diverse weapon who can be dangerous as a receiver as well.

There is a NT, he's a rookie, so that's an unknown.

Please elaborate on how the 3-4 makes the secondary worse.

A 3-4 defense, generally, uses more man coverage and less Zone.

[OpIv37]

Please elaborate on how the 3-4 makes the secondary worse.

What Lecter said about man coverage.

I think McKelvin may tear **** up in the 3-4 and really do some damage. McGee was never the best man corner and he's getting up there now too. Whitner can't even cover a TE in man and I simply don't know with Byrd.

That being said, DB is still the least of my concerns with the D. The almost total lack of 3-4 NT's, DE's and OLB's is far scarier.

[Dr. Lecter]

What Lecter said about man coverage.

I think McKelvin may tear **** up in the 3-4 and really do some damage. McGee was never the best man corner and he's getting up there now too. Whitner can't even cover a TE in man and I simply don't know with Byrd.

McKelvin should be a stud in this defense.

[Philagape]

A 3-4 defense, generally, uses more man coverage and less Zone.

"Generally" is a very big loophole, and says nothing about what this 3-4 will do. The 3-4 is a very flexible defense, with a wide variety of coverage schemes, and Gailey has said his philosophy is to fit schemes to the players rather than vice-versa. Those points are descriptive of George Edwards as well.
I don't think there's any basis for saying the secondary will be worse (or better) based solely on the switch to a 3-4.

[OpIv37]

"Generally" is a very big loophole, and says nothing about what this 3-4 will do. The 3-4 is a very flexible defense, with a wide variety of coverage schemes, and Gailey has said his philosophy is to fit schemes to the players rather than vice-versa. Those points are descriptive of George Edwards as well.
I don't think there's any basis for saying the secondary will be worse (or better) based solely on the switch to a 3-4.

Well, think about it this way: the more zone coverage we use, the more guys like Schobel, Kelsay, Ellis and Maybin will end up in coverage. I don't know about you, but that doesn't exactly give me a warm and fuzzy feeling.

[Philagape]

Well, think about it this way: the more zone coverage we use, the more guys like Schobel, Kelsay, Ellis and Maybin will end up in coverage. I don't know about you, but that doesn't exactly give me a warm and fuzzy feeling.

Warm and fuzzy is way down the road, if ever.

I'm just saying that if the Bills can win 6-7 with Dick, with the QBs they've had, with the run defense they've had, I don't see where the huge dropoff is.

[madness]

A 3-4 defense, generally, uses more man coverage and less Zone.
Sorry, but that's backwards. 4-3's generally tend to use more man coverage as the 3-4 gives you flexibility to rush the passer which usually comes in many forms of zone blitz's.

Older article but it does a good job of explaining LB duties between the two schemes.


In the 4-3 you tend to see more man-to-man defense than zone assignments.
http://kan.scout.com/2/393649.html

[Philagape]

There are different kinds of 3-4 defenses, and within each of those there can be hybrids and adjustments and myriad assignments. Nothing is set in stone.

Here are some extensive pages on the 3-4:
http://www.fannation.com/blogs/post/265696
http://football.calsci.com/DefensiveLine3.html
http://www.milehighreport.com/2008/5/7/481970/mhr-university-modern-3-4

George Edwards says:


“Defensively, we will start from a 3-4 alignment,” said Edwards. “But we will do what we feel is best for our players. We are not going to give anything away about exactly what we will do, but personnel will dictate what you can and what you can’t do. As far as the initial alignment, the 3-4 is what we will start off with and we will adjust from there.”

The Bills have used a Cover 2 zone for the past four years, which was born in Pittsburgh's 3-4, just to show how much overlap there can be.

[methos4ever]

And don't forget that there are man-like coverages (cover 3/4) that can give a zone look but still maintain "I got this guy" for the defender.

[ddaryl]

You do not want to rush Brown out there

and unless Brohm can win the job in camp I don't care what our record could or would be... If you can't win the camp competition you are not the starter.

If Brohm or Brown can't beat out Trent then trent is the starter. My hope is Chan can get Trent back on track, because I place a lot of the blam on Trents regression on the last regime and the mess it was.

I could care less about Fitz and pretty positive he can't win the competition

This is the end of this discussion.

[Jan Reimers]

I don't see anyway that our roster is worse than last year. We've added a playmaker who (for now at least) gives us a three headed monster at running back. We thus seem to have a plan on offense to run the ball extensively, which will at least minimize our problems at QB. Spiller, Jackson and Nelson should be good dump-off receivers, which should take advantage of the meager skills that our QBs possess.

On D, at least we drafted specifically - and added a couple of FAs - to meet the needs of the 3-4. Edwards and Davis give us a pair of 3-4 vets, Troup, Carrington Moats and Batten seem to fit the new scheme, and guys like Maybin and Poz (and perhaps Stroud and Johnson) might actually be better in the 3-4.

I'd rather go into the season with a new defensive scheme and guys who HAVE a CHANCE to fit it, than with the old 4-3 and guys we KNOW couldn't stop the run.

[Ingtar33]

I'm not expecting anything from the passing game as long as the same QBs are there. With that group, doesn't matter much who the receivers are. It's not hard for Evans to match last year's 44 catches and 612 yards under any circumstances. And Spiller is a diverse weapon who can be dangerous as a receiver as well.

There is a NT, he's a rookie, so that's an unknown.

Please elaborate on how the 3-4 makes the secondary worse.


A 3-4 defense, generally, uses more man coverage and less Zone.

pretty much this is exactly right. the Tampa 2 usually depends on short quick CBs who can close fast, and who are comfortable in zone.

the 3-4 requires bigger more physical CBs who can play bump and run and play more man coverage. CBs who dominate in the T2 can be mediocre in a 34 man defense... just as CBs who dominate in the 34 can struggle in the T2.

It's not a huge difference... but it can make an elite CB look average pretty quickly, (just as the reverse is possible)

[OpIv37]

I don't see anyway that our roster is worse than last year. We've added a playmaker who (for now at least) gives us a three headed monster at running back. We thus seem to have a plan on offense to run the ball extensively, which will at least minimize our problems at QB. Spiller, Jackson and Nelson should be good dump-off receivers, which should take advantage of the meager skills that our QBs possess.

On D, at least we drafted specifically - and added a couple of FAs - to meet the needs of the 3-4. Edwards and Davis give us a pair of 3-4 vets, Troup, Carrington Moats and Batten seem to fit the new scheme, and guys like Maybin and Poz (and perhaps Stroud and Johnson) might actually be better in the 3-4.

I'd rather go into the season with a new defensive scheme and guys who HAVE a CHANCE to fit it, than with the old 4-3 and guys we KNOW couldn't stop the run.

I agree with the last statement- the 3-4 is a change that had to be made. The problem is that we are still heavy on 4-3 guys and light on 3-4 guys. Our only true NT at the moment is a rookie, and the NT is the lynchpin of the 3-4. Edwards and Davis are good 3-4 guys, but they're also a little long in the tooth. Good additions, but not huge playmakers.

If they do this right, we could be better on D in a year or two. But for the moment, I think we're worse on D.

On O, we lost Reed, TO and Butler, and added Green and Spiller. I fail to see how that makes us better, or even equal, especially since RB was the least of our problems on O last year.

[Buffalogic]

The odds of having a 2-3 win season have nothing to do with what's happened over the last quarter century. They have to do with who's on the roster now.. And with the current roster and coaches, 3 wins is a lot more realistic than 10.Who said anything about 10?

And how can anyone say our roster going into this season is 3-4 wins worse than what they have been the last four seasons? They have had a terrible run d and a laughable offense and they still manage to win 6-7 games every year.

3 wins ain't happening.

[trapezeus]

the team some how got worse from 2009 to 2010 rosters. they changed defense and the players who were salvagable last year may not be so this year.

The offenses biggest weaknesses in the line and the QB remain unchanged.

Therefore, i think it is possible for them to fall below last year's output.

the difference is that they are building around this new philosphy. And i like 2009 and 2010 drafts on paper. Let's see how it comes together.

I think trent has upside in him if coached well, but i don't think he can stay healthy. but he's here and if he wins the battle, try the season with him. He's the best and earned if. if brohm wins the battle, then he earns it and should start. I want the best guy starting because if they can stun us and really play at an elevated level, we may not need to waste a first round pick on a QB which would be nice. and the other pieces like WR, LB, OT, DE and depth can start be added. And that's when the team will really be able to succeed.

i don't think we are aiming for a 2-4 win season. i just don't think one guy can switch the whole thing around.

[Bill Cody]

There is no NT on the roster and that is the key in a 3-4.

Pretty sure we didn't draft Troup to play linebacker.

[wmoz11]

And don't forget that there are man-like coverages (cover 3/4) that can give a zone look but still maintain "I got this guy" for the defender.

Cover 3 and quarters (cover 4) are the furthest thing from "man-like coverages" that you can get.

Cover 3 means that, in general, both corners each have the deepest man in their third of the field and the FS has the deepest man in the middle third of the field.

Cover 4 is just about the same thing, except there are two high safeties so the field is broken up into 4 quarters.

In Cover 3:

If the TE runs a deep corner route out of a regular pro-formation and the outside WR on that side runs a hitch (a very common, basic football route) then the corner on that side has to choose between the TE and the WR. The basic read for the QB is the corner; does he jump up on the hitch or drop deep (like he should) for the corner route?

If the corner gets deep to defend the TE, the linebacker's responsibility is to get underneath the hitch route and therefore, the CB's "man" pre-snap is no longer his man.

If the corner jumps the hitch, the QB is instructed to throw the corner route to the TE, which would fall in the deep third of the corner and be a tough reach for the high safety to get out over top of.

Your "man" in the the zone does not depend on alignment, but on where the routes of the receivers take them.

[Yasgur's Farm]

2-3 wins is not realistic.

The bills have finished with 3 or fewer wins only one time in the last 24 years. Qb'd by Van Pelt and coached by Williams.

So those predicting a 2-3 win season are predicting the second one in a quarter of a century. Great odds. :rolleyes:
1968 - 1 - 12 & 1
1970 - 3 - 10 & 1
1971 - 1 - 13
1976 - 2 - 12
1977 - 3 - 11
1885 - 2 - 14
1886 - 2 - 14
2001 - 3 - 13

[Philagape]

1885 - 2 - 14
1886 - 2 - 14

That was before there was a forward pass ... which might have been a good thing for those Bills.

[Mr. Pink]

I don't get the infatuation some posters have for Brohm.

It's not like he's shown more or anything different than what we've seen out of the other chumps.

None of these QBs are good enough to win ballgames consistently.

[Yasgur's Farm]

That was before there was a forward pass ... which might have been a good thing for those Bills.In '85 Bruce Matheson and Vince Farragamo combined for 3,712 yards, 9 TD's, 31 interceptions... WOW!
In '86 Jim Kelly came to town and threw for 3,593 yards, 22 TD's and 17 INT's... A down year for him but when you compare to the previous year...

[Night Train]

Nice of many of you to wander off the subject. Look at this shiny mirror in my hand !

Edwards is one hit away from calling me Mommy. Fitz throws 15 ducks a a game. I think they will hang themselves, sooner better than later. Move on.

No QB should be rushed into anything but every QB has a first game. Look it up, it's true and they are never fully ready. Brohm and Brown should be the 1st 2 choices and if they fail, then next years #1 pick will probably be a QB and he'll have a full year to ready himself with the expected lockout.

But I'm not thinking about next year. Let's get Brohm and Brown ready now. Run the damn ball. Get Spiller the ball anyway possible via run, pass, or KO returns. Hit TE Nelson on the seam route. Find Evans deep. Throw the ball up in the red zone and let Hardy outjump the CB for the ball.

The key this coming season will be how the front 7 of the 3-4 D plays anyhow, which is why the Bills added Edwards,Davis,Troup,Carrington,Moats,Batten,Coleman to the lineup.

Get rid of Edwards & Fitz. Turn the page. Play the kids and never look back.

[Philagape]

The key this coming season will be how the front 7 of the 3-4 D plays anyhow, which is why the Bills added Edwards,Davis,Troup,Carrington,Moats,Batten,Coleman to the lineup.

See, we didn't wander off; we skipped right to the key.

[Dr. Lecter]

Pretty sure we didn't draft Troup to play linebacker.

I'm pretty sure he has never played that position in the NFL

[better days]

I don't get the infatuation some posters have for Brohm.

It's not like he's shown more or anything different than what we've seen out of the other chumps.

None of these QBs are good enough to win ballgames consistently.

I will tell you about my infatuation with Brohm. At 24 years old he is much younger than Edwards or Fitz. He was a MUCH better QB in college than Trent or Ryan, throwing for over 4000 yds & 30 TDs in 2007.


Brohm at age 24 stll has potential. We already know EVERYTHING we need to know about Trent & Ryan, they have both proven they have no potential to be a franchise QB.

[nateodoms'bff]

A 3-4 defense, generally, uses more man coverage and less Zone.

Except if you're the new england patriots or the miami dolphins, or the san diego chargers. the idea that anyone scheme determines what type of pass protection is used is an amateurs opinion. This coaching staff has clearly indicated that they will use schemes that fit the players.

The bills have corners that can play both man and zone. And the reason that tghey don't put up flashy numbers is because they are disciplined. They seldom jump their routes, and they all tackle well. They rarely sell out for the big hit, yet still play physical.

This defenses strong suit is its secondary and ability to defend the pass. Its time people recognize that.

[Mr. Pink]

I will tell you about my infatuation with Brohm. At 24 years old he is much younger than Edwards or Fitz. He was a MUCH better QB in college than Trent or Ryan, throwing for over 4000 yds & 30 TDs in 2007.


Brohm at age 24 stll has potential. We already know EVERYTHING we need to know about Trent & Ryan, they have both proven they have no potential to be a franchise QB.


Technically you can say the same about Brohm.

We already know EVERYTHING we need to know about him.

He was beaten out by a 7th round pick, put on the practice squad, came here without much of a try by GB to keep him, hasn't looked great from what I heard in practices, looked just as bad as our other stellar QBs in game action.

If I want to go with the youth movement, if Brown shows any acumen for the NFL game at all...put Edwards out there for 10 games, that's all it should take for us to be out of playoff contention this year, then throw Brown in to get him experience and seasoning.

[Dr. Lecter]

Except if you're the new england patriots or the miami dolphins, or the san diego chargers. the idea that anyone scheme determines what type of pass protection is used is an amateurs opinion. This coaching staff has clearly indicated that they will use schemes that fit the players.

The bills have corners that can play both man and zone. And the reason that tghey don't put up flashy numbers is because they are disciplined. They seldom jump their routes, and they all tackle well. They rarely sell out for the big hit, yet still play physical.

This defenses strong suit is its secondary and ability to defend the pass. Its time people recognize that.

Which is why I said generally. And that is more than an amateur's opinion.

A 3-4 is more likely to use man than Tampa 2, which is almost exclusively zone.

[DraftBoy]

Lots of you guys seem to be counting on many rookies to contribute. That's never a good recipe for success.

[better days]

Technically you can say the same about Brohm.

We already know EVERYTHING we need to know about him.

He was beaten out by a 7th round pick, put on the practice squad, came here without much of a try by GB to keep him, hasn't looked great from what I heard in practices, looked just as bad as our other stellar QBs in game action.

If I want to go with the youth movement, if Brown shows any acumen for the NFL game at all...put Edwards out there for 10 games, that's all it should take for us to be out of playoff contention this year, then throw Brown in to get him experience and seasoning.

EVERYTHING I read about the situation with GreenBay said GB WANTED to keep Brohm but he CHOSE to sign with Buffalo.

I agree Brohm looked as bad as Trent & Fitz in the game he started. The difference is they were both Bills since training camp & Brohm had only about 2 weeks before starting that game.

I agree that if Trent beats Brohm out for the starting job, the Bills will be out of contention after about 10 games. That is if Trent lasts 10 games before he is injured.

[jamze132]

Gailey isn't getting canned if we go 1-15 this year. But a poor performance in 2011 will put him in the hot seat. Any by poor performance, I mean under .500. Yeah, I'm not really shooting for the stars just yet.

I think 4-12 is realistic and anything less I will be disapointed. But if we just get beat, than I completely understand. But what I can't tolorate is the boneheaded mistakes and piss poor time management we are currently known for.
I would bet all my ZBs that if the Bills win less than 2 games, Ralph will not fire Gailey. Year 1 is an assessment year, he gets a free pass.

[Jan Reimers]

On O, we lost Reed, TO and Butler, and added Green and Spiller. I fail to see how that makes us better, or even equal, especially since RB was the least of our problems on O last year.
I think we have a PLAN on OFFENSE, which will feature the run and the short passing game. We will not ask our QBs or O-line to do things they can't do with our present personnel.

I feel that this coaching staff will get more, both offensively and defensively,from the talent we have than Jauron ever did.

[BoyILuvLoznStupidly]

I disagree. He was not loved when the Bills picked him (for good reason), there is almost no coach in the league with enough clout to survive a 1-15, 2-14 season and few who can survive a 3-13 season. I know Ralph is cheep but if the Bills stumble to a 1-15 season with this roster the coach HAS to go, and no matter how senile Ralph might be, i doubt he'd disagree with me.

4-12 is on the low side of realistic... you probably could have a corpse coach the bills to a 4 win season with this roster and the schedule we have. 7 wins is probably on the high side of realistic... and yeah... i'm sorta expecting a 5 or 6 win season right now.


No way, total disagree and here's why

1. Most coaches get a free pass the first year, they have to have a year to evaluate the roster. You can only evaluate so much off of film.

2. Gregg Williams finished 3-13 in his first season...... and there are many more I could list.

3. Ralph would never pay three head coaches at one time.



I understand this has been a disappointing off season for most fans, especially with all the moves divisional teams have done. But we are in no position to make moves like others have, and like others have said if Jauron can win 7 games.........you no the rest

[BoyILuvLoznStupidly]

one other thing, you ever wonder how our defense would play with a lead?

[DraftBoy]

No way, total disagree and here's why

1. Most coaches get a free pass the first year, they have to have a year to evaluate the roster. You can only evaluate so much off of film.

2. Gregg Williams finished 3-13 in his first season...... and there are many more I could list.

3. Ralph would never pay three head coaches at one time.



I understand this has been a disappointing off season for most fans, especially with all the moves divisional teams have done. But we are in no position to make moves like others have, and like others have said if Jauron can win 7 games.........you no the rest

Cam Cameron

[Bill Cody]

I'm pretty sure he has never played that position in the NFL

Ah, now I understand. So Spiller is not a RB on this roster?

[Johnny Bugmenot]

We will not ask our QBs or O-line to do things they can't do with our present personnel. You mean, stuff like scoring touchdowns and winning games?

[Jan Reimers]

You mean, stuff like scoring touchdowns and winning games?
No, like not throwing the ball deep very often, or 30+ times a game, or asking the O-line to hold off the pass rush 4-5 seconds. We'll run it early and often, and dump it off to our RBs, TEs and slot guys.

In other words, we will coach to whatever strengths we have, and not try to force square pegs into round holes ala Jauron.

[Spiderweb]

The roster really sucks, especially for a 3-4 defense.


Actually of the Defensive side, I feel much better of late with the switch than before FA and the Draft. We drafted two big mean (Troup & Carrington) who both are physically bigger than we had before. Both play strong so further building their strength should not be a problem. Both are also intelligent, and if Edwards (FA) stays healthy, he'll be a solid addition. Stroud should rebound a bit and Williams is still here. Lastly, our PS NT Harvey will certainly get an opportunity this year. Mitchell return at LB, along with Davis (FA-LB) should help the LB-s tremendously. I don't count on Kelsay even being kept, nor do I have much hope that even if Schobel returns, that he'll be as effective at LB as he was at DE.

Actually as bad as our run D was last year, the switch should be welcomed. We can't get any worse.

To me, the biggest question is still our anemic offense. Fitz was able to make some plays downfield when Edwards couldn't make any, but we are in serious need of a QB and WR's that make other teams respect the pass. I don't believe that QB is on our roster.