did the team give up last year or were they just bad?

[trapezeus]

I think we are going to see how much this team just flat out gave up last year vs. being excruciatingly bad last year in the first 3-4 games of the season.

The noise out of camp has a different vibe. You aren't getting the stock answers like the last couple years. "yeah, we're excited, the town needs a winner and we hope to give it to them."

instead we are hearing a lot of "this is so much different. We're excited!" and then you see that gailey is getting the younger players on the field, changing offense and defense to match our strengths, etc.

to me, we'll know if the jauron teams were just coached so pathetically that the players just gave up or if they really are an awful grouping of players. I suspect its a little bit of both. But i think we'll see how much of the "boring" football last year was a result of uninterested players who tuned out their idiot coach. I think they are going to play with more of an edge. They might not win a lot, but they are going to have pride and make the games exciting. Something that's been missing for a solid 4 years. And the bar has been set so low for me, all i want is exciting games again.

[better days]

I think we are going to see how much this team just flat out gave up last year vs. being excruciatingly bad last year in the first 3-4 games of the season.

The noise out of camp has a different vibe. You aren't getting the stock answers like the last couple years. "yeah, we're excited, the town needs a winner and we hope to give it to them."

instead we are hearing a lot of "this is so much different. We're excited!" and then you see that gailey is getting the younger players on the field, changing offense and defense to match our strengths, etc.

to me, we'll know if the jauron teams were just coached so pathetically that the players just gave up or if they really are an awful grouping of players. I suspect its a little bit of both. But i think we'll see how much of the "boring" football last year was a result of uninterested players who tuned out their idiot coach. I think they are going to play with more of an edge. They might not win a lot, but they are going to have pride and make the games exciting. Something that's been missing for a solid 4 years. And the bar has been set so low for me, all i want is exciting games again.

I think many players will play better this year because they are at a new position that better suits their skill set & size.

I also expect to see much better coaching / clock management during the game.

[Night Train]

They were poorly coached until Jauron was fired and played far more focused once Fewell took over.

They weren't very good most times but " giving up " was something I never saw in that team. They played hard but lacked direction from the coaching staff.

[Aero II]

I think injuries had alot to do with the lack of production on the field the last 4 years. It would seem like we would start strong, then the injuries would pile up.

[Mr. Pink]

They're just bad.

[OpIv37]

They were poorly coached until Jauron was fired and played far more focused once Fewell took over.

They weren't very good most times but " giving up " was something I never saw in that team. They played hard but lacked direction from the coaching staff.

Think back to how many times we were close late in the 3rd or early in the 4th, but ended up losing by 3 scores. Or the embarrassing last second choke jobs against Dallas and NE.

This team was either poorly conditioned or simply gave up late in games (or both).

We still lack talent and I still don't see this team going anywhere, but like trap said, I expect this team to have a lot more fight in them, and at least go down kicking and screaming instead of rolling over to die. It still won't be fun, but at least we'll have some pride.

[chernobylwraiths]

We don't have a very good QB and our offense was predictable and inept. So, the defense was ok for a portion of the game but wore down by the 4th quarter after being on the field so much.

[ddaryl]

Jauron was just that bad of coach.... unconditioned team, bad gameday decisions, just piss poor coaching

We won 7 games 3 years in a row and 6 games last year.... AND I put the majority of the blame for not winning more on coaching with the rest of the blame placed on the FO for screwing up hiring the right coach and drafting better.

[justasportsfan]

They're just bad.

thanks to the coaching staff who didn't get them physically prepared .

Another thing to consider, the HEADCOACH who makes the final decision thought that it would be a great idea to run the no huddle with a bunch of rookies at OL, and not having the right talent to run it.

Dick was so smart that he thought the players had what it took to run a system that confused the hell out of it's own players and got laughed at by defenses.

Great idea coach, thats why you're a db coach.

[Night Train]

Think back to how many times we were close late in the 3rd or early in the 4th, but ended up losing by 3 scores. Or the embarrassing last second choke jobs against Dallas and NE.

This team was either poorly conditioned or simply gave up late in games (or both).

We still lack talent and I still don't see this team going anywhere, but like trap said, I expect this team to have a lot more fight in them, and at least go down kicking and screaming instead of rolling over to die. It still won't be fun, but at least we'll have some pride.

The Pats game was 1 dumb play by McKelvin.

The Dallas game was conservative coaching " not to lose " .

There is a clear lack of talent... but effort ? No, I'm not buying that.

They had to overcome their own coaches and lacked any sense of direction in close games.

[trapezeus]

by giving up, i mean accepting status quo, more than just flat out giving up.

i think we've all worked in dysfunctional organzations before. i dont think we gave up working, we gave up trying to change the place or make a difference. That's the difference in "giving up". I think they knew they couldn't change the coaches perception of "not to lose" and keeping young talent on the bench, and not coaching people up. and if you are too frustrated, you don't make any of the changes yourself.

I'm hoping chan has this self defeating attitude checked from his TC.

I read in the buffalonews that yesterday the bills worked goaline situations and that jauron rarely worked goaline packages. What the hell? how could a guy have an NFL level coaching gig and not have audibles in his offense for 3 of 4 years, and then not have goalline packages practiced in training camp. This guy was so devastating to the entire team.

[Mr. Pink]

thanks to the coaching staff who didn't get them physically prepared .

Another thing to consider, the HEADCOACH who makes the final decision thought that it would be a great idea to run the no huddle with a bunch of rookies at OL, and not having the right talent to run it.

Dick was so smart that he thought the players had what it took to run a system that confused the hell out of it's own players and got laughed at by defenses.

Great idea coach, thats why you're a db coach.


He was forced to run that system to give hope and optimism to the fanbase from above.

People here for his tenure complained that the offense was boring and simple. However it's what kept the team in many ballgames.

Once they tried something else, you saw how the talent wasn't there to execute it.

[justasportsfan]

I don't think they flat out gave up. These guys loved Dick and played hard for him. The spirit was willing but the body wasn't . It was also placed in their head to not lose games but not win it either.

[trapezeus]

i'd love an interview with Dick Jauron now. The bills have pretty much blamed him for everything. it'd be interesting to hear his take. but i bet he'd still give too political of answers for anyone to decipher anything useful.

I anxiously wait to see the eagles DB's fall apart this season.

[OpIv37]

i think we've all worked in dysfunctional organzations before. i dont think we gave up working, we gave up trying to change the place or make a difference. That's the difference in "giving up". I think they knew they couldn't change the coaches perception of "not to lose" and keeping young talent on the bench, and not coaching people up. and if you are too frustrated, you don't make any of the changes yourself.



I don't think the distinction is as strong as you're making it.

When I work for an organization that's doing well, and I can see direct positive results from my contributions, then I work harder. When I work for a dysfunctional organization, it's not that I completely vacate my responsibilities, but I know I'm not going to make a difference anyway, so I work just hard enough to not get fired and I try to get the hell out of there as soon as I can so I can go be productive somewhere else.

With Jauron and the ****ed up FO, I wonder how many players knew the team had no hope of winning and thus worked just hard enough to keep their roster spot and not risk injury. I'm hoping the changes were enough to make some of these guys go "hey, maybe we do have a chance and maybe I can help turn this thing around."

[justasportsfan]

He was forced to run that system to give hope and optimism to the fanbase from above.

People here for his tenure complained that the offense was boring and simple. However it's what kept the team in many ballgames.

Once they tried something else, you saw how the talent wasn't there to execute it.

You mean he ran a system to please the fanbase even though he knew it was doomed to fail ? Are you saying that Dick was so stupid that he didn't know that the only way to please the fan base was to win and running a no huddle wouldn't achieve that?

You're not making a good case for Dick.


Wrong. What kept the team in the ball games was the D. That wasn't good enough to overcome Dicks stupidity when it comes to the offense which is PROVEN in his track record as a HC.

[don137]

I think Jauron definitely did not bring out 100% in each player. His coaching not to lose mentality was very evident.

However, I cannot blame everything on him. This team also lacks/lacked veteran leaders. I remember back in the days of Kelly, Thurman and Talley. If the Bills were behind in the fourth quarter they walk the sidelines getting into the face of their teammates getting them motivated and getting them ready to seize the opporotunity so when the final buzzer sounded they were walking off that field with a win and not a loss. Who on this team demonstrated this leadership? No one. Back in those days you had to answer to your teammates. Under the Jauron era it was business as usual the next day.

[better days]

You mean he ran a system to please the fanbase even though he knew it was doomed to fail ? Are you saying that Dick was so stupid that he didn't know that the only way to please the fan base was to win and running a no huddle wouldn't achieve that?

You're not making a good case for Dick.


Wrong. What kept the team in the ball games was the D. That wasn't good enough to overcome Dicks stupidity when it comes to the offense which is PROVEN in his track record as a HC.

Just what I was going to say. The defense & special teams kept the team in games not the pop gun offense.

[justasportsfan]

Just what I was going to say. The defense & special teams kept the team in games not the pop gun offense.


Dick has a horrible track record when it comes to his offense as a HC. Even when we were 5-1, I started a thread worrying that the O could be a problem down the road and it did become a problem. Going into a game with a philosophy that doesn't need to score as long as we keep the other team from scoring can only take you so far. THe D will eventually break down during crunch time. Under DIck, the busiest guys were Moorman and Lindell. We were either punting or kicking FG's.

[Mr. Pink]

You mean he ran a system to please the fanbase even though he knew it was doomed to fail ? Are you saying that Dick was so stupid that he didn't know that the only way to please the fan base was to win and running a no huddle wouldn't achieve that?

You're not making a good case for Dick.


Wrong. What kept the team in the ball games was the D. That wasn't good enough to overcome Dicks stupidity when it comes to the offense which is PROVEN in his track record as a HC.


He was pressured by an owner who only cares about the bottom line to generate interest in the fanbase to buy tickets and merchandise. Period. TO wasn't signed to win ball games, he was signed for the business aspect of generating revenue.

I won't get into this any further than that as you have your opinion and I have mine...after a year or two, one of us will be right and the other will be wrong.

[djjimkelly]

i dont think they gave up last year.

i think they are actually pretty bad. however i do believe there is a lot more individual talent on this roster then alot of people believe.

will that translate this year im not sure. when u dont have QB or a truly premier pass rusher its hard to tell.

[Yasgur's Farm]

This season we're gonna have a lot less players named Mary or Nancy.

[Homegrown]

Yes, the team gave up, b/c they were just bad :clown:

[HHURRICANE]

This is going to sound like a broken record but the season was over when they traded Peters, cut Dockery, and catapulted Walker.

We went from being above average in pass protection to worst in the league.

I actually think it's miraculous that we won 6 games and almost won that NE game. However that NE game probably killed this team and I think they gave up after that.

The o-line is still terrible so all of the optimism in the world can't fix that. Cornell Green is already getting man-handled and Meredith has been terrible at LT. This si exactly why an injured Bell is better which is not saying much.

[justasportsfan]

He was pressured by an owner who only cares about the bottom line to generate interest in the fanbase to buy tickets and merchandise. Period. .

I won't get into this any further than that as you have your opinion and I have mine...after a year or two, one of us will be right and the other will be wrong.


And you know for a fact that the no huddle was meant to sell tickets and not win games?

Dick may be stupid but he knows that the way to sell tickets is to win. PERIOD.

Running the no huddle was his call as a HC. Hiistory PROVES he's stupid offensively.

My opinion is based on FACTS!

[Mr. Pink]

And you know for a fact that the no huddle was meant to sell tickets and not win games?

Dick may be stupid but he knows that the way to sell tickets is to win. PERIOD.

Running the no huddle was his call as a HC. Hiistory PROVES he's stupid offensively.

My opinion is based on FACTS!


The way to sell tickets in WNY has nothing to do with winning games.

Any fan of this team has seen enough evidence of this in the past decade.

Come on now.

[justasportsfan]

The way to sell tickets in WNY has nothing to do with winning games.

Any fan of this team has seen enough evidence of this in the past decade.

Come on now.


I guess we shall see soon enough how good or bad Dick is. This years O should finish higher than the average 28th rank under Dick. Thats even without a TO opposite Lee.