Nix comments on Kelsay extension

[ddaryl]

Here comes the 5 pages of whines

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2010/10/07/nix-on-kelsay-extension/



Bills GM Buddy Nix addressed the media on several topics (http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-3/Nix-Turnaround-will-take-time-but-it-will-happen/db9a58d3-e2b1-4710-8376-15206ff290d1) concerning the Bills recent roster moves. One in particular was the extension that was given to veteran OLB Chris Kelsay. Here was Nix’s take as to why they wanted Kelsay as a part of the team’s future going forward.

“The thing you don’t want to do is take your core guys and your leaders out of your system,” said Nix. ”We decided obviously that we’ve got four, five or six guys like that, they maybe are not great players, but good players that set the tone for what you want everybody else to be. Chris Kelsay is a good player. He’s exemplifies what we want players to do and how we want them to be. So that’s the reason he’s here.”

A forgotten part of what it’s going to take to turn around the Bills franchise is eliminating the culture of losing that exists in the locker room. In no way does any player in Buffalo’s locker room want to lose, but when a team loses games as much as Buffalo has it can become a self-fulfilling type thing. Even Nix said though players may not realize it, it can become an accepted thing.
“I don’t care whether you want to admit it or not, but losing gets to be a habit and it gets to be something you accept and we’re not going to do that,” Nix said. ”We’re going to demand that we get the proper attention to (changing that culture). To be honest with you it’s the hardest thing you have to do.”


basically he admits he is not a great player, but his locker room prescence and his willingness to be a team player is what they are rewarding him for...

Obvioulsy, and IMO, they do not have enough players on the roster that don't subscribe to the loser metality and Kelsay although average at best at least doesn't appear to radiate that mentality to others in the locker room.

I'm not enamored with Kelsay, but it's not like we have any chance in becoming a winning franchise for a few more years. By the time we bring in enough new players to circumvent the present loser mentality, Kelsay will be heading out the door anyways.


now lets begin the 5 pages of discontent :fishy:

[The King]

I agree 100% with the part about losing becoming habit.

[DraftBoy]

It was still a horrendous extension, I dont care how he spins it.

[Yasgur's Farm]

I'm OK with the Kelsay extension... I've seen him put some licks on ball carriers this season. I understand they were a bit downfield... But none the less he punishes.

[justasportsfan]

Trent was a team player which is why they voeted him Capt. He kept taking one of the team ....sacks I mean.

[OpIv37]

So, how the hell are we supposed to change the losing culture by re-signing guys like Kelsay who are PART OF IT?

[RockStar36]

I hate the extension, but I can at least buy that reasoning. At least Nix didn't come out and try to sell us on Kelsay actually being good.

[trapezeus]

i just don't get how signing an average player who likes winning to an overextension changes the losing attitude.

cutting average players for better players changes the attitudes.

either way, it's so hard to ***** about what's going on. we've gone from bad to a different kind of bad. it doesn't matter.

[justasportsfan]

they maybe are not great players, but good players that set the tone for what you want everybody else to be.

so you want everyone else to be overpaid mediocre players?

[madness]

Trent was a team player which is why they voeted him Capt. He kept taking one of the team ....sacks I mean.

Best updated nicknames I've seen on the internet describing Trent and Marshawn's exit ---> Capt. Check-out and Trade Mode

[trapezeus]

let me pose my original thought this way. if we were all in a company that i ran, and i said to one coworker, "you are subpar, but i like that you walk in that door every day and try to sell our product. you royally suck at it, and the product is truly awful. I want to offer you a bigger salary."

Does that make you want to work harder or just show up and pretend that you are trying? And if you agree that it just makes you show up but make no difference to bottom line, did i change the culture?

I'd rather have the guys who are decent sellers who can say, "dude, Trap, the product blows. I can sell all day at meetings and seminars, but it sucks. we need new R&D, we need better marketing." I think that makes hte company better faster.

[Jan Reimers]

". . .you don't want to. . . take your core guys and your leaders out of your system."

Yet it looks like we're about to trade Lee Evans to the Pats.

Go figure.

[Beebe's Kid]

I, with my homer colored glasses, read that he is saying Kelsay isn't a good player, so I'm trying to tell you this wasn't my choice, but I am giving you the reason Ralph said we should keep "that Kelsay boy."

When a team is cleaning house/rebuilding/building, whatever...NOBODY gets an extension. NO job is safe... especially players that really aren't that good.

I maintain that it isn't the end of the world. The only problem is that it would have been the optimal situation if Nix would have said, "With all respect Mr. Wilson, you hired me to build you a winning football team. That's what I am trying to do here, and I don't think giving that Kelsay boy a raise is what we need to do at this time."
...then hope he isn't fired.

Maybe Ralph told him..."Look, I'm the owner...I've been involved, I have royally **** the bed a few times with extensions, free agents...well, all of my player decisions. I hired you because you are a football guy, and I respect that. I am asking that you let me pull rank for one of the nice guys, then I go back to counting my money, and leave you alone. Take care of the Kelsay boy for me, would you, Buddy?"

Or else is was part of the diabolical plan, deigned to alienate the fan base to move the team.

I guess we'll never know...until the book comes out, of course.

[justasportsfan]

Yet it looks like we're about to trade Lee Evans to the Pats.
.

Who cares if Lee is traded as long as we keep Whitner

[Beebe's Kid]

So, how the hell are we supposed to change the losing culture by re-signing guys like Kelsay who are PART OF IT?

What's he supposed to say, Op? "The old man likes this kid, I think he sucks, but he's here...deal with it." That's kind of what I took out of his comments.

[Night Train]

How can we take this rebuilding seriously when Kyle Williams & Kelsay get new extensions ?

[Beebe's Kid]

". . .you don't want to. . . take your core guys and your leaders out of your system."

Yet it looks like we're about to trade Lee Evans to the Pats.

Go figure.

With all due respect to you, Jan, and to Lee Evans, who has been one of my favorite players... I do not get the impression he is much of a leader, or a core guy. He is one with talent....which makes him one with value, but we have to face the music.

Look at his numbers...that's not impossible to replace.

I'd like to see us get Jackson back...is he still out there?

[RockStar36]

let me pose my original thought this way. if we were all in a company that i ran, and i said to one coworker, "you are subpar, but i like that you walk in that door every day and try to sell our product. you royally suck at it, and the product is truly awful. I want to offer you a bigger salary."

Does that make you want to work harder or just show up and pretend that you are trying? And if you agree that it just makes you show up but make no difference to bottom line, did i change the culture?

I'd rather have the guys who are decent sellers who can say, "dude, Trap, the product blows. I can sell all day at meetings and seminars, but it sucks. we need new R&D, we need better marketing." I think that makes hte company better faster.

If there were two employees, one was smarter and better at his job, but also showed up to work late every day and took long lunches; I would fully expect the other employee who shows up and gives a full effort to be rewarded first.

[OpIv37]

What's he supposed to say, Op? "The old man likes this kid, I think he sucks, but he's here...deal with it." That's kind of what I took out of his comments.

He could have said the Kelsay part and left the "losing culture" part alone. It really makes no sense whatsoever to re-sign Kelsay and then talk about changing the culture of this team. Kelsay was with the team for the majority of the Decade of Fail and he's been average at best and a liability at worst. The guy is literally part of the problem that Nix claims he's trying to change.

[malo]

So, how the hell are we supposed to change the losing culture by re-signing guys like Kelsay who are PART OF IT?

exactly!!!!

[OpIv37]

If there were two employees, one was smarter and better at his job, but also showed up to work late every day and took long lunches; I would fully expect the other employee who shows up and gives a full effort to be rewarded first.

I would fully expect neither of them to get rewarded. The better one needs to improve his commitment. The other one needs to improve his skills. Neither should get rewarded until those things happen.

And if I were in charge of a football team, I'd cut both those *******s.

[madness]

I would fully expect neither of them to get rewarded. The better one needs to improve his commitment. The other one needs to improve his skills. Neither should get rewarded until those things happen.

And if I were in charge of a football team, I'd cut both those *******s.

If everybody took that route, my company would go from 100 employees to 10 and half the NFL would be jobless.

[Stewie]

it's not kelsays fault he's a "high motor" de... he plays hard, his teammates make him a captain over more highly visible idiots.. and one day maybe he'll be able to cover someone coming out of the backfield.

[ddaryl]

Like I suggested in 3 years when this team MIGHT actually be turned around Kelsay will be gone and the new Attitide players will take over.

I'm not excited about his extension, but it's not like we're going to be able to sign 8-10 draft picks and 8- 10 scrub to mediocre FA's that will bring the right attitude to start next season.

His production is average at best, but if he is a leader in the mental department of helping others get up to speed, then I think there is a lot ot be said for that. But even Kelsay can't make up for th elack of talent of himself or others, he obvioulsy has a locker room prescence the Bills can't aford ot cut loose until they find a core of guys to with sed attiude ot move this franchise forward.

[malo]

If there were two employees, one was smarter and better at his job, but also showed up to work late every day and took long lunches; I would fully expect the other employee who shows up and gives a full effort to be rewarded first.

except these are friggin professional athletes making millions of dollars. you can't really compare your everyday office worker.

[madness]

it's not kelsays fault he's a "high motor" de... he plays hard, his teammates make him a captain over more highly visible idiots.. and one day maybe he'll be able to cover someone coming out of the backfield.

Stop lying. It's funny though how people would rather complain about him missing tackles in the backfield instead of complaining about how he's the only one actually in the backfield.

[Jan Reimers]

With all due respect to you, Jan, and to Lee Evans, who has been one of my favorite players... I do not get the impression he is much of a leader, or a core guy. He is one with talent....which makes him one with value, but we have to face the music.

Look at his numbers...that's not impossible to replace.

I'd like to see us get Jackson back...is he still out there?
I agree that he may not be a leader. But if our best receiver (and arguably our best player), a 7(?) year veteran, and a guy who has been a complete professional and never really caused any trouble, is not a core guy, I don't know who is (besides Kelsay).

And I know he has talent and can fetch us a relatively high pick. I just can't see us improving the Pats by sending him there. At least trade him out of the division, if he fails the core guy test.

[Dr. Lecter]

Who cares if Lee is traded as long as we keep Whitner


And bring back JP!!!!!

[HHURRICANE]

So we are extending Kelsay because he's been around since the winning years?

This is exactly why this team sucks. Extending the wrong players.

[malo]

The willingness to accept mediocrity (and below) here is amazing. I see the losing culture Nix is talking about has infected some of the fans.

[ddaryl]

So we are extending Kelsay because he's been around since the winning years?

This is exactly why this team sucks. Extending the wrong players.

Kelsay was never here during the winning years... We haven't had winning year since 2004 and before that it was an 8-8 season in 2002 and 2000.

So kelsay was here for a winning year in 2004

[ddaryl]

The willingness to accept mediocrity (and below) here is amazing. I see the losing culture Nix is talking about has infected some of the fans.

Not really

I'm glad they're gutting the hell out of this team, and I have already accepted losing for th enext 2-3 years... There is no recipe that could possibly fix this mess in a season or even 2... We're looking at a 40 player swap out

[billz83]

wow this guy nix is like bill o reilly with that BS spin job! i dont care how u break it down Kelsay SUCKS..and NO player that sucks should be given an extension..Nix just saying hes a good player tells me he cant evaluate talent..if he thinks Kelsay is a good player then holy **** we have set the BAR EXTREMELY LOW!!

[HHURRICANE]

Kelsay was never here during the winning years... We haven't had winning year since 2004 and before that it was an 8-8 season in 2002 and 2000.

So kelsay was here for a winning year in 2004


Sarcasm high!!!

[malo]

Kelsay couldn't make most CFL rosters, and he's a leader on this team?

[Michael82]

I, with my homer colored glasses, read that he is saying Kelsay isn't a good player, so I'm trying to tell you this wasn't my choice, but I am giving you the reason Ralph said we should keep "that Kelsay boy."

When a team is cleaning house/rebuilding/building, whatever...NOBODY gets an extension. NO job is safe... especially players that really aren't that good.

I maintain that it isn't the end of the world. The only problem is that it would have been the optimal situation if Nix would have said, "With all respect Mr. Wilson, you hired me to build you a winning football team. That's what I am trying to do here, and I don't think giving that Kelsay boy a raise is what we need to do at this time."
...then hope he isn't fired.

Maybe Ralph told him..."Look, I'm the owner...I've been involved, I have royally **** the bed a few times with extensions, free agents...well, all of my player decisions. I hired you because you are a football guy, and I respect that. I am asking that you let me pull rank for one of the nice guys, then I go back to counting my money, and leave you alone. Take care of the Kelsay boy for me, would you, Buddy?"
That's exactly what I got out of it. I don't think that Buddy wanted to sign him to an extension, but Ralph convinced him. Now Buddy is basically saying that he was kept for his leadership in the locker room to appease the fans. It makes sense. A lot of people have talked about Chris Kelsay being a big voice in the locker room and a true leader. He may suck, but he works his ass off and is a vocal leader. For a young team that is rebuilding, we do need a couple guys like him.

[RockStar36]

Just to clarify so my comments aren't mistaken -

I think this is the worst extension in the history of the Bills and I'm 100% against it.

[BertSquirtgum]

this dude sucks. what a waste of money ralph.

[Bangarang]

What I got from Nix there was that the extension was out of his hands and he's just trying to sound supportive of the team.

[ddaryl]

That's exactly what I got out of it. I don't think that Buddy wanted to sign him to an extension, but Ralph convinced him. Now Buddy is basically saying that he was kept for his leadership in the locker room to appease the fans. It makes sense. A lot of people have talked about Chris Kelsay being a big voice in the locker room and a true leader. He may suck, but he works his ass off and is a vocal leader. For a young team that is rebuilding, we do need a couple guys like him.

Ralph is barely cognitive these days. I guarentee Ralph had nothing to do with this, but I do enjoy the conspiracy theory.

[ddaryl]

Sarcasm high!!!

missed the sarcasm, basically because with your posting style one can not differietiate sarcasm or seriousness. :spade:

[Typ0]

it would be nice if they would wake up and get some above average players to be their core guys instead of settling for below average guys who have good attitudes. They just aren't going to build a contender with this attitude. But yes, they will continue to field a football team that offers the excitement of fighting to win a game against outmatched opponents. I would be surprised if we win 2 games next season.

[Jan Reimers]

it would be nice if they would wake up and get some above average players to be their core guys instead of settling for below average guys who have good attitudes.
Actually, we have at least one above average player with a good attitude, Lee Evans.

Rumor has it that we are sending him to the Pats.

[justasportsfan]

I think they paid Kelsay based on what they HOPE he can be and not based on what he is. Kinda like a very expensive rookie.

[Beebe's Kid]

I agree that he may not be a leader. But if our best receiver (and arguably our best player), a 7(?) year veteran, and a guy who has been a complete professional and never really caused any trouble, is not a core guy, I don't know who is (besides Kelsay).

And I know he has talent and can fetch us a relatively high pick. I just can't see us improving the Pats by sending him there. At least trade him out of the division, if he fails the core guy test.

Evans to New England would be the worst possible scenario, at least for me, because he's dead to me at that point. I would think the goal would be to get him out of the division, if not the conference, but who has the most picks to spare? Who has the biggest need?

It sucks, and it sucks bad, but keeping him here doesn't help us.

This one is hard, because, while I've liked other players that have been shown the door, Evans has been a favorite for a long time. We'll miss him, and hate sending him to NE, but he may do us more good there than here.

Nothings in stone yet anyway, right? Maybe this is much ado about nothing....I hope so.

I completely understand you think he is a core guy, and I might just be selling myself of the idea, and when I said he wasn't a core guy, I mean that we are not going to miss the production because there isn't any. Is that his fault? I don't blame him.

Evans is a tough pill to swallow, but I think we're going to have to, and at the end of it all...we may be further ahead.

[malo]

I think they paid Kelsay based on what they HOPE he can be and not based on what he is. Kinda like a very expensive rookie.

Reading the Nix article, I don't think it was anything else but utter desperation. Basically the team had no leader whatsoever, so he was the best leader they could come up with.

[trapezeus]

maybe the bills need to hit a certain pay level for the end of hte year, and they know they are tossing crap, so it was easier to extend one guy who would take a low guarantee and cutable in a year, than it is to keep a handful of crap.

somehow that is now my best case scenario on why they made this move.

[RoscoeMagic]

Buddy Nix = hypocrite

"“If a guy is not producing we’re not going to keep doing the same thing and keep losing with the same people doing the same thing,” Nix said. “We’re not going to do that. After a point it doesn’t change. To be honest with you, nobody is safe, you’ve got to produce. If it gets to the point where we need to make other changes, it won’t matter who it is. If it will help us, we’ll do it.”"

Hey Buddy, Kelsay sucks, he hasn't performed, he's part of the problem, he's been one of the many reasons for the losing culture, his job is entirely too safe. He cut Trent for this reasoning above, how do we extend Kelsay?

[Mr. Pink]

So Kelsay is a core guy now?

Holy S*** is this team in more trouble than what anyone thinks.

[Ingtar33]

So Kelsay is a core guy now?

Holy S*** is this team in more trouble than what anyone thinks.


yes... but the people on this message board seem to think this is a good thing... because it means crashing and burning and looking like a poorly run franchise is all an ILLUSION because "Nix" claims he has a super secret "plan"

Sort of like Nixon's "secret" plan to get out of Vietnam I’m sure...

[Ed]

I guess my biggest issue with the extension is the timing. Why extend Kelsay now instead of waiting until the end of the season? What if he blow out a knee next week or tears an Achilles? It's not like we would have had any competition for his services after the season. So why reward him now when we're off to such a crappy start and he's not producing? This now guarantees that he'll be on the team next year, which blows, and if he's still on the team in two years it means we probably still suck, which blows even more.

[Typ0]

yeah, one guy. No wonder we suck.


Actually, we have at least one above average player with a good attitude, Lee Evans.

Rumor has it that we are sending him to the Pats.

[topher180]

If you try to justify this move, at all, you are too clueless to even bother with.

[better days]

maybe the bills need to hit a certain pay level for the end of hte year, and they know they are tossing crap, so it was easier to extend one guy who would take a low guarantee and cutable in a year, than it is to keep a handful of crap.

somehow that is now my best case scenario on why they made this move.

Since there is no cap this year there also is no floor. They did not need to spend any money.

[madness]

So Kelsay is a core guy now?

Holy S*** is this team in more trouble than what anyone thinks.

No he's still not. He's only getting paid until they find a suitable replacement. His base salary for next year is $2 million but supposedly his extension is so backloaded, it's almost certain he's gone before he makes any serious money.

[Philagape]

DISCLAIMER: The following comments are speculation as to Ralph/Buddy's thinking and NOT my own .............

I think, in their mind, they were hamstrung by Kelsay's previous deal. They wanted him back, and knew he wasn't worth this, but to offer him a huge pay cut would have been insulting. So it was either give him a large contract or let him go, and they chose the former.

(me talking now) But letting him go would have likely meant getting him back anyway, since no other team would have been this stupid, and he would have come crawling back for $1-2 million.

Colossal fail. Buddy may be a successful scout, but he's a rookie at personnel management and it shows.