Chan Gailey Approval Poll

[northernbillfan]

Now that the season is behind us, it's time to see where Chan Gailey rates among the Zone posters.

Feel free to discuss your answers as well.

[justasportsfan]

unsure. Then again I'd be unsure about anyone in their first year of rebuild. The only thing I like about him is that the players respond very well to him.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

I never approve of 4 wins. Doesn't matter.

[northernbillfan]

I was leaning towards unsure as well. That said, some of the adjustments that he did during a game won me over. It was a breath of fresh air to see someone actually change the game plan and not have our opponents knowing exactly what was going to happen.

[trapezeus]

i would have been really positive if he could have won one of the last two games. but he really got out classed by better talent.

pros - offense was better, comes to terms with bad decisions much quicker, second half of games actually had adjustments, more disciplined OL (less holding and false starts), dealt with OL injuries better (ton of turnover, not a lot of decline in the play), didn't putz around in blowout losses with punting on 4th down. He manned up and went for it.

cons- beat bad teams, couldn't contain the run, struggled with gameplans for better teams, gave up on the run early (but the OL wasn't a run blocking line).

[DraftBoy]

Went with unsure. Not a big fan of his gameday tactics, player usage or play calling at times, but he wasnt afraid to move on from mistakes and give other players a shot at PT.

[The King]

His honesty and ability to admit his mistakes and try to fix them is passable for me in his first season.

[don137]

I went unsure because anyone would look good replacing Jauron and he still has players Jauron brought in and is slowly getting rid of them.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

Jauron I hated but we won more games under him every year

[Dr. Lecter]

The roster was a 2 -win roster and they won 4 games.

Slight thumbs up.

[justasportsfan]

I was leaning towards unsure as well. That said, some of the adjustments that he did during a game won me over. It was a breath of fresh air to see someone actually change the game plan and not have our opponents knowing exactly what was going to happen.
I tried to measure him up vs the pats. He failed miserably.

[psubills62]

I put unsure. There were things I liked and things I didn't. I'd like to see how he does with another draft worth of players.

[Nighthawk]

If Chan believes Fitz is the answer at QB, then he has failed miserably.

[Historian]

Hire a bargain-basement-over-the-hill defensive coordinator: average 7 wins....all dull.

Hire a bargain-basement-over-the-hill offensive coordinator: 4 wins....all fun to watch.

Fire up the Delorean...it's back to the future at 1BD.

[psubills62]

If Chan believes Fitz is the answer at QB, then he has failed miserably.

Whether or not someone is the answer always depends on what the question is.

If the question is: who can stay to warm the seat for a future franchise QB? then Fitz may very well be the answer.

[Ingtar33]

Offense

2010
25th rated offense
-24th passing
-18th rushing
-28th points

2009
30th rated offense
-30th passing
-16th rushing
-28th points

Defense

2010
24th rated defense
-3rd passing
-32nd rushing
-28th points

2009
19th rated defense
-2nd passing
-30th rushing
-16th points


~how was this year an improvement in any way? The offense was basically identical, and the defense took a step back. I'm stunned so many people are HAPPY with this... I'd call it mediocrity... but really, it's not mediocrity... it's putrid. Its not a mistake that we only won 4 games this year.

[Bill Cody]

I expected very little. He did better than I expected.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

Offense

2010
25th rated offense
-24th passing
-18th rushing
-28th points

2009
30th rated offense
-30th passing
-16th rushing
-28th points

Defense

2010
24th rated defense
-3rd passing
-32nd rushing
-28th points

2009
19th rated defense
-2nd passing
-30th rushing
-16th points


~how was this year an improvement in any way? The offense was basically identical, and the defense took a step back. I'm stunned so many people are HAPPY with this... I'd call it mediocrity... but really, it's not mediocrity... it's putrid. Its not a mistake that we only won 4 games this year.

those stats dont totally reflect our personal improvement. what are the bills stats in 09 compared to this year, ie td passed this year compared to last...

[northernbillfan]

Offense

2010
25th rated offense
-24th passing
-18th rushing
-28th points

2009
30th rated offense
-30th passing
-16th rushing
-28th points

Defense

2010
24th rated defense
-3rd passing
-32nd rushing
-28th points

2009
19th rated defense
-2nd passing
-30th rushing
-16th points


~how was this year an improvement in any way? The offense was basically identical, and the defense took a step back. I'm stunned so many people are HAPPY with this... I'd call it mediocrity... but really, it's not mediocrity... it's putrid. Its not a mistake that we only won 4 games this year.Great post. It puts a new light on this situation.

Are people blinded by the fact that the team "almost" won four more games?

[THATHURMANATOR]

I would dump him in a second if Cowher was interested.....

[northernbillfan]

I would dump him in a second if Cowher was interested.....I think we all would.

[psubills62]

Offense

2010
25th rated offense
-24th passing
-18th rushing
-28th points

2009
30th rated offense
-30th passing
-16th rushing
-28th points

Defense

2010
24th rated defense
-3rd passing
-32nd rushing
-28th points

2009
19th rated defense
-2nd passing
-30th rushing
-16th points


~how was this year an improvement in any way? The offense was basically identical, and the defense took a step back. I'm stunned so many people are HAPPY with this... I'd call it mediocrity... but really, it's not mediocrity... it's putrid. Its not a mistake that we only won 4 games this year.

I don't think anyone's necessarily happy. I'm intrigued, but not happy.

Rankings don't tell the entire story. The Bills averaged 17.7 points per game this year. If you look at games where only Fitz started, that goes up to 19.9 points per game. In 2009 we scored 16.1 points per game. We increased from 4.8 yards per play to 5.1, and from 14.6 first downs per game to 16.4.

That increase in points per game is despite higher penalties and a much lower TO margin (from 82 penalties to 107, from +3 to -17 turnover differential). We also had a much tougher schedule than last year, IIRC.

There are things to like about this season and plenty of things not to like. Those last two I just mentioned (increase in penalties and turnovers) are two things that need to drastically improve. I'm still personally in wait and see mode, though I know you dislike Gailey, Ingtar.

[Dr. Lecter]

Offense

2010
25th rated offense
-24th passing
-18th rushing
-28th points

2009
30th rated offense
-30th passing
-16th rushing
-28th points

Defense

2010
24th rated defense
-3rd passing
-32nd rushing
-28th points

2009
19th rated defense
-2nd passing
-30th rushing
-16th points


~how was this year an improvement in any way? The offense was basically identical, and the defense took a step back. I'm stunned so many people are HAPPY with this... I'd call it mediocrity... but really, it's not mediocrity... it's putrid. Its not a mistake that we only won 4 games this year.

I am not really sure you can say the offense was the same when they let their best receiver go and their #3 WR. It was not the same at all. In fact, it was quite different. Saying it was identical is just flat out wrong.

The defense did take a step back. Of course the defense lost their best pass rusher and underwent a radical change in scheme. Anybody who looked at the team ahead of time had to know that the 3-4 was a bad fit for the talent on the team.

If you add in that they had a much more difficult schedule this year (2nd hardest in the NFL), then one can see why some see improvement.

You coach the game - you know that raw numbers do not always tell the entire story.

Is Gailey a genius? No. Did the team show more this year than they did under Jauron? For sure. The talent level on this team is still in 2 win level.


If you want to criticize for making a long term change on defensive scheme or not brining back TO, that is one thing. But using the numbers to tell half of the story is quite another.

[Ingtar33]

those stats dont totally reflect our personal improvement. what are the bills stats in 09 compared to this year, ie td passed this year compared to last...


that means little... scoring was WAY up across the league this year... probably thanks to the rule changes.

that's why i compared it based on ranking... because normalizing for the league averages would be a pain in the ass... but tell you what... just for you i'll pull out a few unique NORMALIZED metrics i found on football outsider (a great site to find some interesting metrics and measurements)

one of football outsider metrics which i like is called Defense-adjusted Value Over Average (DVOA) - in short it normalizes offensive & Defensive performance over or under the average you could expect to get from playing the defenses/offenses you played that year.

so... a positive value means you did better than average (for offense, it's the reverse for the defense), a negative value means you played worse than average (reverse for defense).

In short this is a great way to normalize your team's performance over a number of years for factors such as playing a slate of poor defensive teams or weak offensive teams... and it spits out a number for your team's overall DVOA, or NFL rating of your team's general strength.

2010 -

Buffalo's overall DVOA - (-19.4%) which is good for 28th;
-Offense DVOA - 26th
-Defense DVOA - 28th
-Special Teams DVOA - 17th

2009 -

Buffalo's overall DVOA - (-9.3%) which was good for 24th
-Offensive DVOA - 29th
-Defensive DVOA - 8th
-Special Teams DVOA - 12th


take it for what it is... but the numbers, i don't think lie... now you can take their metric with a grain of salt but it seems to me last year their metric seemed to think our defense played a lot more and better offenses then it did this year... and it did noticeably better then this year.

Yet again, i raise the question, why didn't we just keep Fewell and hire Gailey on as OC? I don't think we improved much at all really... outside of a marginal improvement on offense, everywhere else you look this team got much worse.



-as a side-note... our Strength of Schedule last season was pretty much the same as this season. Last season our SOS was .570; this year it's .578

[EDS]

that means little... scoring was WAY up across the league this year... probably thanks to the rule changes.

that's why i compared it based on ranking... because normalizing for the league averages would be a pain in the ass... but tell you what... just for you i'll pull out a few unique NORMALIZED metrics i found on football outsider (a great site to find some interesting metrics and measurements)

one of football outsider metrics which i like is called Defense-adjusted Value Over Average (DVOA) - in short it normalizes offensive & Defensive performance over or under the average you could expect to get from playing the defenses/offenses you played that year.

so... a positive value means you did better than average (for offense, it's the reverse for the defense), a negative value means you played worse than average (reverse for defense).

In short this is a great way to normalize your team's performance over a number of years for factors such as playing a slate of poor defensive teams or weak offensive teams... and it spits out a number for your team's overall DVOA, or NFL rating of your team's general strength.

2010 -

Buffalo's overall DVOA - (-19.4%) which is good for 28th;
-Offense DVOA - 26th
-Defense DVOA - 28th
-Special Teams DVOA - 17th

2009 -

Buffalo's overall DVOA - (-9.3%) which was good for 24th
-Offensive DVOA - 29th
-Defensive DVOA - 8th
-Special Teams DVOA - 12th


take it for what it is... but the numbers, i don't think lie... now you can take their metric with a grain of salt but it seems to me last year their metric seemed to think our defense played a lot more and better offenses then it did this year... and it did noticeably better then this year.

Yet again, i raise the question, why didn't we just keep Fewell and hire Gailey on as OC? I don't think we improved much at all really... outside of a marginal improvement on offense, everywhere else you look this team got much worse.



-as a side-note... our Strength of Schedule last season was pretty much the same as this season. Last season our SOS was .570; this year it's .578

But Chan Gailey has been so successful at his last few jobs . . .

[psubills62]

-as a side-note... our Strength of Schedule last season was pretty much the same as this season. Last season our SOS was .570; this year it's .578

Where are you getting those numbers? I just calculated our SOS from last year and I got 0.516, with 0.578 this year.

The defenses we faced this year were significantly tougher than last year.

Average Opponent Defense ranking:
2009: 16.2
2010: 11.1

On average, the defenses we faced this year ranked 11th overall (in points allowed). We played every single one of the top 4 teams once, and the 6th, 8th and 14th teams were in our division. Only two of the teams we faced were not in the top 20 (Cincinnati at 24th and Jacksonville at 27th). That's a brutal schedule for any offense.

[Night Train]

Can't judge him after 1 year with a roster that currently is in the bottom 5 in actual talent. Vince Lombardi in his prime couldn't win 5 games with this lot.

Now he gets to clean house and get his players. Hopefully, they can add some more talent in FA and especially the draft. Get young and send many of these pretending vets packing.

[Mr. Pink]

Same ole, same ole.

Garbage in, garbage out.

The only positive this season was the passing game because we went from a guy who was afraid to throw the ball to a guy who just didn't care.

Everywhere else the team was worse this year than last year.

Talent wise? We weren't much different outside of losing Schoebel, then again I don't think he would have done much in an inept defense lead by an inept coordinator.

[Cleve]

Based on the results of this poll, the Bills had best be 8-8 or better next season, or there will be a lot of Zoners will egg on their collective faces.

While it appeared the Bills might be improving, the last two games of the season against teams with good records showed zero forward progress.

[TacklingDummy]

The last time the Bills were this bad was 2001.

[ParanoidAndroid]

I tried to measure him up vs the pats. He failed miserably.

Hmmm.... I'm not sure he failed as much as the team failed to not turn the ball over.

Anyway, I edged toward an approval simply because he is finding guys who can actually make plays on offense. They were actually half way decent on third down this year.
My hesitancy is based on the defense. He had better do a lot of work to get run stuffers in Buffalo this offseason or we will be looking at another 4-12 record. I don't remember the run defense looking any worse.

[better days]

Based on the results of this poll, the Bills had best be 8-8 or better next season, or there will be a lot of Zoners will egg on their collective faces.

While it appeared the Bills might be improving, the last two games of the season against teams with good records showed zero forward progress.

I had no problem with this losing season but I expect 8-8 at least next year. Raheem got the Bucs to 10 wins this year & it should have been 11. The NFL admitted they blew the Lions game & the Bucs should have won it. That would have put them in the playoffs after going 3-13 last year.

[better days]

I think we all would.

I think we all would love to see Cowher as HC with Chan as his OC, too bad that will never happen.

[justasportsfan]

Hmmm.... I'm not sure he failed as much as the team failed to not turn the ball over.

.

and part of that should fall on the coaches no?

As much as I HATE to say this, BB always gets his players to perform whether they are rookies or washed up vets. They always find a way to get it done. Whether it's an undrafted rookie like Woodhead . Who here thinks that Woodhead is more talented than Spiller. If Spiller was with the Pats I doubt he gets the fumblelitis.

Part of being a good HC is getting your players to perform .

This team isn't going anywhere until we learn to beat the pats. They should be the measuring stick of this organization. They are not only the best team in the AFCE but the entire league year in and year out. They always stockpile draft picks and win with what they have.

[Mr. Pink]

and part of that should fall on the coaches no?

As much as I HATE to say this, BB always gets his players to perform whether they are rookies or washed up vets. They always find a way to get it done. Whether it's an undrafted rookie like Woodhead . Who here thinks that Woodhead is more talented than Spiller. If Spiller was with the Pats I doubt he gets the fumblelitis.

Part of being a good HC is getting your players to perform .


Talent wise obviously Spiller is better than Woodhead.

Woodhead just understands the speed and style of the NFL game.

Instead of running east west and dancing, he just runs to the hole.

[Cleve]

I had no problem with this losing season but I expect 8-8 at least next year. Raheem got the Bucs to 10 wins this year & it should have been 11. The NFL admitted they blew the Lions game & the Bucs should have won it. That would have put them in the playoffs after going 3-13 last year.
One thing Zoners are forgetting - the Dolphins went from 1-15 in 2007 to 11-5 in 2008 and won the AFC East.

Two years later - their head coach is fired after a 7-9 season.

We saw ZERO improvement from this team in 2010 with a full season of the Gailey/Nix regime. The team went BACKWARDS - the defense, which kept us in many games last season, was a shadow of its former self, and the Gailey coaching was utterly unable to prepare the team to defend against the run. And we saw some blatant coaching stupidity - like playing Trent Edwards - a guy clearly not capable of being a starting QB in the NFL. And there was also the lucrative and unwarranted contract extension for Chris Kelsay.

The Bills Front office had BEST fire Gailey and Nix if the team has a losing record again in 2011.

[justasportsfan]

Talent wise obviously Spiller is better than Woodhead.

Woodhead just understands the speed and style of the NFL game.

Instead of running east west and dancing, he just runs to the hole.

I agree. BUt a great HC is able to teach these rookies to understand what it takes to make the transition . This is what BB has done with nobodies like Woodhead , Brady ,Cassel and Green Ellis.

I can't give Gailey an approval because he wasn't even close to beating the Patriots at their best. BB will step on Gaileys throat whenever he can .

[BillsFever21]

I'd give him a C overall for the first year and it would be even lower if we didn't show some improvement after the first 6 games. No matter which way you look at it we were the 3rd worst team in the league this year and 3 of our wins came against other teams drafting in the Top 7 or so.

[Cleve]

I'd give him a C overall for the first year and it would be even lower if we didn't show some improvement after the first 6 games. No matter which way you look at it we were the 3rd worst team in the league this year and 3 of our wins came against other teams drafting in the Top 7 or so.

Actually, ESPN has the Bills ranked thus for 2010

25th in offense


24th in defense.


Contrast that with 2009

Offense - 30th

Defense 19th

We gained 5 places in offense, but lost 5 places in Defense so it's kind of a wash.


Of course, Jauron only coached part of the season last year. The last full year of Jauron was 2008 - and the rankings were...

Buffalo - 25th offense

Defense - 14th



So as much as Jauron was reviled, and rightfully so, his last full year of coaching had a superior product on the field to what we're seeing now. The offense was about the same but the defense was far better.


So the only thing I've seen thus far from Gailey/Nix is an overall worse team on the field and zero forward progress in 'rebuilding'. I see no reason for optimism at this juncture for 2011.

With the right people, the Dolphins made a huge improvement in one season. Trouble is - our front office SUCKS and can't attract or hire the right people.

[better days]

One thing Zoners are forgetting - the Dolphins went from 1-15 in 2007 to 11-5 in 2008 and won the AFC East.

Two years later - their head coach is fired after a 7-9 season.

We saw ZERO improvement from this team in 2010 with a full season of the Gailey/Nix regime. The team went BACKWARDS - the defense, which kept us in many games last season, was a shadow of its former self, and the Gailey coaching was utterly unable to prepare the team to defend against the run. And we saw some blatant coaching stupidity - like playing Trent Edwards - a guy clearly not capable of being a starting QB in the NFL. And there was also the lucrative and unwarranted contract extension for Chris Kelsay.

The Bills Front office had BEST fire Gailey and Nix if the team has a losing record again in 2011.

The Fins really blew it drafting Long instead of Ryan. That really goes to show a QB is much more important than any other player on the team.

The Bucs got their QB in the 09 draft. Freeman will prove to be a franchise QB for the Bucs. I expect them to compete for the title for years to come.

The Bills need to get a QB in this draft if they are going to have a long term improvement. I have been saying take BPA in the 1st but if they trade up for Luck or draft a QB at 3 I will trust their judgement, they just better be right.

[Mr. Pink]

I agree. BUt a great HC is able to teach these rookies to understand what it takes to make the transition . This is what BB has done with nobodies like Woodhead , Brady ,Cassel and Green Ellis.

I can't give Gailey an approval because he wasn't even close to beating the Patriots at their best. BB will step on Gaileys throat whenever he can .


I agree with this to an extent. The RB himself also has to understand it.

McGahee didn't, Lynch didn't and now Spiller doesn't.

[Dying_-2-_Live]

Im leaning towards his approval...but he did have me questioning him occasionally during games.

[Billz_fan]

At this point in his tenure I voted yes. There has been some good things, Fitz, Stevie, Roscoe was doing well before injury. Nothing earth shattering but I have approved of some of his decisions and it's possible he is getting the ship lined up square for the future. I think he has some ability as far as getting production out of players we thought were maxed out already.

Now, I think next season will be very telling as far as Chan's future goes. If we finish next season in the same ballpark record wise I will turn on him quickly as it will mean he would be heading into year 3 with 8-10 wins and that won't be good. As for right now Im behind them going into the draft. Hope they have a good draft :up:

[Nighthawk]

Whether or not someone is the answer always depends on what the question is.

If the question is: who can stay to warm the seat for a future franchise QB? then Fitz may very well be the answer.

And this I agree with. However, if they go and give him a 3-4 year contract extension for some real money, then it will mean that mediocrity still reigns at One Bills Drive.

[YardRat]

Unsure...First season is the honeymoon, second is for starting to realize positive or negative results.

Pros-Pretty decisive with personnel, breathed some life into the offense, put some young guys on the field, appeared to be able to make adjustments.

Cons-Very disappointed in his choices for coordinators, fubared to a certain point the QB competition.

Tearing down and analyzing for a season is tough to pass judgement on...we'll see where we are at this point next season.

[psubills62]

And this I agree with. However, if they go and give him a 3-4 year contract extension for some real money, then it will mean that mediocrity still reigns at One Bills Drive.

Agreed. That's why I don't think they'll do that. I see Buffalo taking a QB in the middle rounds (2-4) this year. I think they're going to work on building a solid overall team and draft QB's to try and develop a franchise one. When they get the chance to draft a top QB, they'll take him.

That's what I'm expecting, anyway, they could always fool me.

[FlyingDutchman]

with the crap he was given to work with, he has my approval so far. i was gonna give him a free pass for this year anyways but i was impressed by the way he squeezed out the production he was able to given the lack of talent he had. the bills could have been near .500 had a few things gone their way and i didnt expect them to win more than 3 games. these guys seem to fight for him too, they never gave up on the season

[imbondz]

we've been rebuilding for 10 years now. anything short of the playoffs is failure to me.

the past 10 years says our organization doesn't know how to rebuild.

[ChristopherWalken]

I thought about this all last night. I think he's done well his first year.

He was given time to pre-analyze talent. I think starting the season he had some rose colored glasses on, and perhaps it took him some time to remember the difference between college and pro level talent.

However, once he was able to see certain players in action, he cleaned up several problem positions created by his predecessor.

Doing this, he then plugged in key personel that at the very least generated a winning attitude. Then had ample time to plug in younger players allowing perhaps a few "sleepers" to come forward and take full advantage of an opportunity. Evaluating depth is as necessary as evaluating your starting lineup.

With all he has seen, I think he now realizes (more so) how many holes are actually on this team.

He now gets an opportunity to fortify the rebuilding process. It all spells progress...and ultimately this is what we are all going to judge him on in the end.

Can he turn this pile of players into a team of winners?

2011 will be very telling.

I've decided to give him a chance to fill the gaps and engineer a team worth watching. I think he has shown me enough that he deserves at least that.

[shelby]

The Bucs went from 3-13 to 10-6 in a single season, with young players.

That's what i'm looking for.

[ParanoidAndroid]

and part of that should fall on the coaches no?

As much as I HATE to say this, BB always gets his players to perform whether they are rookies or washed up vets. They always find a way to get it done. Whether it's an undrafted rookie like Woodhead . Who here thinks that Woodhead is more talented than Spiller. If Spiller was with the Pats I doubt he gets the fumblelitis.

Part of being a good HC is getting your players to perform .

This team isn't going anywhere until we learn to beat the pats. They should be the measuring stick of this organization. They are not only the best team in the AFCE but the entire league year in and year out. They always stockpile draft picks and win with what they have.

I wonder if they have some sort of mental block when it comes to the Patriots. I think Gailey had them playing hard this year. You can't scoff at the fact that they took Baltimore and Pittsburgh to overtime. Gailey should get as much credit for that as he might get for his players turning the ball over 7 times in one game.

[better days]

The Bucs went from 3-13 to 10-6 in a single season, with young players.

That's what i'm looking for.

I agree. The only caveat is Tampa was able to draft a Franchise QB the year before, so if the Bills draft a QB & start him there will be growing pains like the Bucs had last year.

[justasportsfan]

I wonder if they have some sort of mental block when it comes to the Patriots. I think Gailey had them playing hard this year. You can't scoff at the fact that they took Baltimore and Pittsburgh to overtime. Gailey should get as much credit for that as he might get for his players turning the ball over 7 times in one game.

I do not discount that. thing is, Pitts and Ravens don't know us as well as the pats do. We need to win within our division first if we are to get anywhere. If we can beat teams that know us well (Pats most especially), we probably could have beaten teams like the ravens and steelers.