Fitz isn't the answer, but ...

[Philagape]

That should have no bearing whatsoever on who they pick at No. 3.

Who they draft should be based on how they evaluate the prospects on their own merits. That's it.
And you can take any historical positional trends and shove them into your hole where they belong.

You can't go into a pick thinking it MUST be a certain position. That's what resulted in Whitner, McCargo and other busts. They should pick whoever's at the top of their value chart, based only on the pros and cons of each player.

Nobody's disputing that Fitz isn't a franchise QB, but if one isn't available at third overall -- meaning, there isn't one worth that pick, in their judgment -- then they have to find another solution if they want one.

I'm not saying here that there's no QB worth no. 3, although I'm doubtful. That's another issue. If they truly feel there's a QB good enough to warrant the pick, then they should pull the trigger for that reason alone.
But "Fitz isn't the answer" is not an argument to draft a QB at third overall no matter what.

[Beebe's Kid]

That should have no bearing whatsoever on who they pick at No. 3.

Who they draft should be based on how they evaluate the prospects on their own merits. That's it.
And you can take any historical positional trends and shove them into your hole where they belong.

You can't go into a pick thinking it MUST be a certain position. That's what resulted in Whitner, McCargo and other busts. They should pick whoever's at the top of their value chart, based only on the pros and cons of each player.

Nobody's disputing that Fitz isn't a franchise QB, but if one isn't available at third overall -- meaning, there isn't one worth that pick, in their judgment -- then they have to find another solution if they want one.

I'm not saying here that there's no QB worth no. 3, although I'm doubtful. That's another issue. If they truly feel there's a QB good enough to warrant the pick, then they should pull the trigger for that reason alone.
But "Fitz isn't the answer" is not an argument to draft a QB at third overall no matter what.

I'll dispute that.

I know that we are supposed to "know" Fitz isn't a real QB, and is nothing more than a backup, and that very well may end up being the case. I will not say that I "know" that, or accept it as fact, simply because it is popular sentiment that is passed off and common knowledge.

I am just curious...how long do we have to wait for a "Franchise" QB to be good? Do we have to give them 3-4 years? We sure had to give Kelly that long, and most of the others that are christened with the elusive "Franchise" title, didn't see success for a few seasons either.

Fitz has improved, and shown that he has the ability to play the position. I know that the Harvard thing is overplayed, but I don't think that people give enough credit to how smart this dude is. He also is athletic, and toward the end of this year was making throws that you don't see many other guys in the NFL making.

It appears that, either way, sink or swim, Fitz will get one more season at the helm... I have a feeling that the sentiment changes towards him after this year. Not with the Kiper-ites, but with a large constituency of Bills fans that watch games.

There are a lot of fans that will never be able to be swayed, but there were a lot of fans that thought Reich should have been the starter, there were fans that were screaming for Collins, there are fans that still think RJ of Flutie was a good move, fans that complained about Fletcher tackling everybody downfield, Kenneth Davis over Thurman... and on and on. Fans will make 9000 predictions, and then tell everybody about the two they hit on, so forgive me if what the fans say doesn't mean a hell of a lot to me.

Fitz will make believers out of many this year...regardless of who gets drafted at #3

[X-Era]

That should have no bearing whatsoever on who they pick at No. 3.

Who they draft should be based on how they evaluate the prospects on their own merits. That's it.
And you can take any historical positional trends and shove them into your hole where they belong.

You can't go into a pick thinking it MUST be a certain position. That's what resulted in Whitner, McCargo and other busts. They should pick whoever's at the top of their value chart, based only on the pros and cons of each player.

Nobody's disputing that Fitz isn't a franchise QB, but if one isn't available at third overall -- meaning, there isn't one worth that pick, in their judgment -- then they have to find another solution if they want one.

I'm not saying here that there's no QB worth no. 3, although I'm doubtful. That's another issue. If they truly feel there's a QB good enough to warrant the pick, then they should pull the trigger for that reason alone.
But "Fitz isn't the answer" is not an argument to draft a QB at third overall no matter what.:clap:

Totally agree with this post. Well done.

[Night Train]

Agreed.

And I DON'T think there's a QB worth the #3 pick.. but it's just my opinion.

[X-Era]

I'll dispute that.

I know that we are supposed to "know" Fitz isn't a real QB, and is nothing more than a backup, and that very well may end up being the case. I will not say that I "know" that, or accept it as fact, simply because it is popular sentiment that is passed off and common knowledge.

I am just curious...how long do we have to wait for a "Franchise" QB to be good? Do we have to give them 3-4 years? We sure had to give Kelly that long, and most of the others that are christened with the elusive "Franchise" title, didn't see success for a few seasons either.

Fitz has improved, and shown that he has the ability to play the position. I know that the Harvard thing is overplayed, but I don't think that people give enough credit to how smart this dude is. He also is athletic, and toward the end of this year was making throws that you don't see many other guys in the NFL making.

It appears that, either way, sink or swim, Fitz will get one more season at the helm... I have a feeling that the sentiment changes towards him after this year. Not with the Kiper-ites, but with a large constituency of Bills fans that watch games.

There are a lot of fans that will never be able to be swayed, but there were a lot of fans that thought Reich should have been the starter, there were fans that were screaming for Collins, there are fans that still think RJ of Flutie was a good move, fans that complained about Fletcher tackling everybody downfield, Kenneth Davis over Thurman... and on and on. Fans will make 9000 predictions, and then tell everybody about the two they hit on, so forgive me if what the fans say doesn't mean a hell of a lot to me.

Fitz will make believers out of many this year...regardless of who gets drafted at #3

We have seen QB's do well early like Sanchez and Roeth, but I'm thinking we wouldn't start ours until mid-season at the earliest.

I don't want to have to throw a rookie into starting right away. That's one reason I'd rather get the QB this year. Fitz is a UFA next year and could demand starting QB money. Unless he lights it up next year, I don't think we should pay it. I think he should get backup money. He may not take that, leaves, and leaves us drafting and starting a QB right away.

As for Fitz's ability to be all we need, I'm worried that teams will catch up with our offense and be able to shut us down much more. Fitz does a nice job of moving the ball around and that will help him be productive so maybe he keeps his production where it's at.

[Extremebillsfan247]

What if they took a gamble and went with Ponder at 3? how jaw dropping would that be? They were debating heavily last year on whether they were going to take Tebow in the first before finally deciding on rolling out with Spiller.

[Philagape]

What if they took a gamble and went with Ponder at 3? how jaw dropping would that be? They were debating heavily last year on whether they were going to take Tebow in the first before finally deciding on rolling out with Spiller.

That's not a gamble, that's getting falling-down drunk and putting your life savings for one spin on the roulette table.
And then peeing on it and getting thrown in jail.

[Commissioner]

The Bills should take whoever is going to help the franchise be successful the most....

That doesn't mean this year... it could mean 2 years from now.

With that being said... the biggest impact on franchise comes from the QB position. I don't care if Gabbert has some flaws.... the question is ... do the Bills think he can eventually be a franchise QB that can go to a super bowl? If the answers yes... then they should take Gabbert at #3... no matter how much of a reach it may appear to be this year. 3 years from now if we are going to the playoffs ... who will care?

[TigerJ]

Don't reach to take a QB? Yeah that's what I thought you said. I agree.

[Philagape]

The Bills should take whoever is going to help the franchise be successful the most....

That doesn't mean this year... it could mean 2 years from now.

With that being said... the biggest impact on franchise comes from the QB position. I don't care if Gabbert has some flaws.... the question is ... do the Bills think he can eventually be a franchise QB that can go to a super bowl? If the answers yes... then they should take Gabbert at #3... no matter how much of a reach it may appear to be this year. 3 years from now if we are going to the playoffs ... who will care?

If they think he's going to be that good, absolutely.

[Extremebillsfan247]

That's not a gamble, that's getting falling-down drunk and putting your life savings for one spin on the roulette table.
And then peeing on it and getting thrown in jail.Oh I agree, but its odd to me that they even considered drafting Tebow last year for whom in some crowds would have drawn the same kind of opinions. JMO

[Nighthawk]

I'll dispute that.

I know that we are supposed to "know" Fitz isn't a real QB, and is nothing more than a backup, and that very well may end up being the case. I will not say that I "know" that, or accept it as fact, simply because it is popular sentiment that is passed off and common knowledge.

I am just curious...how long do we have to wait for a "Franchise" QB to be good? Do we have to give them 3-4 years? We sure had to give Kelly that long, and most of the others that are christened with the elusive "Franchise" title, didn't see success for a few seasons either.

Fitz has improved, and shown that he has the ability to play the position. I know that the Harvard thing is overplayed, but I don't think that people give enough credit to how smart this dude is. He also is athletic, and toward the end of this year was making throws that you don't see many other guys in the NFL making.

It appears that, either way, sink or swim, Fitz will get one more season at the helm... I have a feeling that the sentiment changes towards him after this year. Not with the Kiper-ites, but with a large constituency of Bills fans that watch games.

There are a lot of fans that will never be able to be swayed, but there were a lot of fans that thought Reich should have been the starter, there were fans that were screaming for Collins, there are fans that still think RJ of Flutie was a good move, fans that complained about Fletcher tackling everybody downfield, Kenneth Davis over Thurman... and on and on. Fans will make 9000 predictions, and then tell everybody about the two they hit on, so forgive me if what the fans say doesn't mean a hell of a lot to me.

Fitz will make believers out of many this year...regardless of who gets drafted at #3

Umm, Fitz has had 7 years in the NFL to prove he is better then a backup and he hasn't done it. You are grasping at straws...he isn't a rookie who is going to grow into something special. Hell, he isn't even a 2nd year player learning the position, he's a freakin' veteran and you should start realizing that! Damn...some people are so thick!

[PTI]

Umm, Fitz has had 7 years in the NFL to prove he is better then a backup and he hasn't done it. You are grasping at straws...he isn't a rookie who is going to grow into something special. Hell, he isn't even a 2nd year player learning the position, he's a freakin' veteran and you should start realizing that! Damn...some people are so thick!

I know, how do people not realize this? Mostly they ignore it. This was his 3rd year in a row of extended play, and the majority of the year starter too. He has the 20th most starts of any QB who has played in the NFL in the last 3 years.

[justasportsfan]

I know, how do people not realize this? Mostly they ignore it. This was his 3rd year in a row of extended play, and the majority of the year starter too. He has the 20th most starts of any QB who has played in the NFL in the last 3 years.
using the last 3 years to grade Fitz is not fair. No one could have succeeded.

[PTI]

using the last 3 years to grade Fitz is not fair. No one could have succeeded.

The year after Fitz left Cincinnati they were 10-6. If the Colts had Fitz and not Manning they would have been lucky to win 5 games. If the Bills had Manning instead of Fitz and everyone else the Bills would have had 8-10 wins this year and last year.

[justasportsfan]

The year after Fitz left Cincinnati they were 10-6. If the Colts had Fitz and not Manning they would have been lucky to win 5 games. If the Bills had Manning instead of Fitz and everyone else the Bills would have had 8-10 wins this year and last year.

8-10 wins? Manning would be on IR .

[PTI]

8-10 wins? Manning would be on IR .

I didn't know Fitz was on IR.

[justasportsfan]

I didn't know Fitz was on IR.
Fitz was more mobile. If you look at Dicks offensive history, didn't matter who was the qb. His offense sucked. Dick wouldnt want Peyton to begin with anyways, Dick wants a qb who plays not to lose and if he isn't, he mkes him do so.

[PTI]

Fitz was more mobile. If you look at Dicks offensive history, didn't matter who was the qb. His offense sucked. Dick wouldnt want Peyton to begin with anyways, Dick wants a qb who plays not to lose and if he isn't, he mkes him do so.

Dude, crazy talk. Manning gets rid of the ball and moves around just fine. Sacked 16 times this year and 10 last year and has one of the lowest percentage of sacks taken ever for how often he throws the ball and their OL is not very good and he had tons of injuries all around him too. and Bills were a way better rushing team too. I don't get how you think you can make any same argument for what you are trying to say.

[Bill Cody]

here are the correct questions the Bills need to ask and answer for our first pick:

1) Is there a franchise QB in this draft? That's the first question, not "is there a QB worth the #3 pick".

2) If ther answer to # 1 is "yes we think _______is going to be a star even if it takes him a few years to get there then the second question is "where do we rate that player on our board". Being true to your board is the entire reason for having a draft board. If say we rate Newton a franchise QB but we have him ranked as the 10th best player in the draft we do not take him at 3 we trade down or failing that we take the best rated player on our board.

[Philagape]

here are the correct questions the Bills need to ask and answer for our first pick:

1) Is there a franchise QB in this draft? That's the first question, not "is there a QB worth the #3 pick".


It's basically the same question. If a "franchise" QB is one who can lead them to legit contention -- meaning they're contenders largely because of him -- that's worth the third overall pick.

[Bill Cody]

It's basically the same question. If a "franchise" QB is one who can lead them to legit contention -- meaning they're contenders largely because of him -- that's worth the third overall pick.

No it isn't and no that's not correct IMO. By this logic NE should have drafted Brady 3rd overall even though they had him rated 190th. This is why the Patriots end up with twice as many picks as everyone else. They don't marry players they rate them objectively and they stick to those ratings. The Bills on the other hand reach more than a queer in the YMCA shower room.

[Philagape]

No it isn't and no that's not correct IMO. By this logic NE should have drafted Brady 3rd overall even though they had him rated 190th. This is why the Patriots end up with twice as many picks as everyone else. They don't marry players they rate them objectively and they stick to those ratings. The Bills on the other hand reach more than a queer in the YMCA shower room.

Who knew Brady was a franchise QB back then?? You think the Pats thought they were getting one?

[ddaryl]

We have seen QB's do well early like Sanchez and Roeth, but I'm thinking we wouldn't start ours until mid-season at the earliest.



the key to those QB's fast starts were solid teams around them. Solid OL, and really solid D's,

I would think in our situation we wouldn't start a rookie at all in 2011 unless injury forced our hand.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gabbert is the only real candidate at #3. He has the starts in college, the completion % and holds a pretty decent above average GPA.

However I believe, at this time, Gabbert can be had a few slots down from #3, so can we pick up our QB and still have that extra pick.

[mayotm]

The Bills on the other hand reach more than a queer in the YMCA shower room.Says the 12 year old.

[Bill Cody]

Says the 12 year old.

ok poor joke sorry if you were offended. Unless that was you in the shower room.:whistling

[Commissioner]

here are the correct questions the Bills need to ask and answer for our first pick:

1) Is there a franchise QB in this draft? That's the first question, not "is there a QB worth the #3 pick".

2) If ther answer to # 1 is "yes we think _______is going to be a star even if it takes him a few years to get there then the second question is "where do we rate that player on our board". Being true to your board is the entire reason for having a draft board. If say we rate Newton a franchise QB but we have him ranked as the 10th best player in the draft we do not take him at 3 we trade down or failing that we take the best rated player on our board.

I disagree with this... if you are picking 3... but you're 10th ranked player is what you think is a franchise QB... then it's OK to take him at #3. That is not a big reach in my opinion because it's only 7 spots and you are drafting what you think its going to be your franchise QB. you don't trade down and risk losing him to someone else.

[Ickybaluky]

Who knew Brady was a franchise QB back then?? You think the Pats thought they were getting one?

I don't think they think that way.

Scott Pioli told the story behind Brady thusly:

The Pats didn't have QB as a high priority, but there were two in there they liked after day 1: Tom Brady and Tim Rattay. Evalutions were split on them, so they sent Dick Rehbein, the QB coach (who died during training camp in 2001 from a heart condition), out to work Brady out about 3 weeks before the draft. He came back from the workout raving about Brady, as as a result they placed him higher on their chart. Pioli said they had him rated as a 3rd round prospect.

By the time the Pats got down to the 6th round, their board had been depleted and Brady was rated much higher than any other players. Though QB wasn't a big priority for them (remember, Bledsoe had just signed for over $100M a year before), they decided he was clearly better enough that they would ignore other needs and take him.

That shows you how much luck plays a role in these things.

[cgbm]

:clap:

Totally agree with this post. Well done.

well your wrong x_winningteam. we have to have a qb. whitner shows that drafting high a d player will not make your team good quick. it may help a little but we have to have a qb

[Extremebillsfan247]

well your wrong x_winningteam. we have to have a qb. whitner shows that drafting high a d player will not make your team good quick. it may help a little but we have to have a qb
When you draft a QB at number 3 overall, your telling everyone on the planet that this QB is good enough to start for you on day one. What QB in this draft is ready for that responsibility? Rushing to get a QB just to draft a QB would be an even dumber idea than bringing Jauron back to coach the Bills. lol JMO