Franchise Quarterbacks - A History

[YardRat]

Buffalo - Kemp?, Ferguson?, Kelly
Miami - Marino
NY Jets - Namath
New England - Grogan, Bledsoe, Brady

Pittsburgh - Bradshaw, Roethlisberger
Cleveland - Graham, Kosar
Ravens - ??
Cincinnati - Anderson, Esiason

the Colts - Unitas, Manning
Texans - ??
Jacksonville - Brunell
Titans - Pastorini, Moon

KC - Dawson
San Diego - Fouts, Rivers?
Denver - Elway
Oakland - Stabler, Plunkett?

Dallas - Staubach, Aikman, Romo?
Philadelphia - Jaworski, Cunningham, McNabb, Vick?
NY Giants - Tittle, Simms, Manning?
Washington - Baugh, Jurgenson?, Kilmer?

Minnesota - Tarkenton
Chicago - Luckman, McMahon?
Green Bay - Starr, Favre, Rodgers
Detroit - Layne

Atlanta - Bartkowski, Ryan?
New Orleans - Manning, Brees
Carolina - Collins?
Tampa Bay - Williams?

San Francisco - Brodie, Montana, Young
Cardinals - Hart?
Seattle - Zorn, Hasselback?
the Rams - Waterfield, Van Brocklin, Warner?

Did I leave anybody out?

[djjimkelly]

theisman on redskins for sure

[YardRat]

theisman on redskins for sure

Maybe...he had a nice five season run, but it took him three to wrest the position away from an aging vet. Might've done more if not for the injury, though.

[Don't Panic]

McNair for the Titans and Greise for Miami

[Beebe's Kid]

So what qualifies you for this elite club?

I mean other than "not Fitzpatrick," of course.

There are a log of guys on that list that many fans would be crying to replace on a weekly basis...also a lot of guys with good stats and no rings (see Marino, Dan,) and I personally think rings > records.

[better days]

In another year you can add Freeman to the list. This guy is going to be a great QB for the Bucs.

I have heard that he is organizing private workouts for the team in the event a lockout occurs. That is the sign of a true leader & someone that has the desire to be great.

[Ingtar33]

how is fergie on that list... i mean really?

[Prov401]

Mcnair needs to be added for sure.

Are the question marks asking if the player they follow should be considered franchise QB's? If that's the case, Rivers, Warner, and Ryan should have the ?'s removed from their names.

[YardRat]

McNair for the Titans and Greise for Miami

Maybe McNair. Greise? Really?


So what qualifies you for this elite club?

It's a test. Wait for it...


how is fergie on that list... i mean really?

There is a ? next to his name. He had a run of 12 straight seasons as the unquestioned starter of the team, didn't he?

[X-Era]

The last time the Bills did anything to speak of, we had Kelly, a mid 1st round pick...

After that we tried trading for guys, signing guys, resurrecting guys, drafting later round guys, and even screwed up a pick on a 1st round guy.

But we never drafted one mid-1st or higher. And yet that's what it took the last time for us.

[Jeff1220]

I'd add Carson Palmer, Matt Schaub, and Delhomme to the list. Even Jake Plummer to an extent for the Cards. We forget Delhomme because of how suddenly he stunk it up and Plummer for his hasty retirement. All these guys have had a number of years of success in the league, and mostly w/one team.
But, McNair and Theisman are the most blatant omissions to me.

[Jan Reimers]

Maybe McNair. Greise? Really?

Bob Greise had a long and successful run, and should definitely be there.

[k-oneputt]

Bert Jones

[alohabillsfan]

com att pct yds ypa td int sck syl rtg
264 413 63.9 2,843 6.9 18 12 41 216 86.5
255 441 57.8 3,000 6.8 23 15 24 145 81.8

who do you want?

[The Jokeman]

The last time the Bills did anything to speak of, we had Kelly, a mid 1st round pick...

After that we tried trading for guys, signing guys, resurrecting guys, drafting later round guys, and even screwed up a pick on a 1st round guy.

But we never drafted one mid-1st or higher. And yet that's what it took the last time for us.
The Bills took Tony Hunter before Kelly that should tell you how much they knew when they were drafting him. Not to mention he could have just as easily turned out to be Tony Eason or Ken O'Brien. What helped the Bills best with respect to Kelly was he was able to develop in the USFL while the Bills sucked it up and were able to knab Bruce Smith with the top pick in 1985.

It's kind of sad really but the only QB the Bills can ever claim to developing on their own was Joe Ferguson.

[PTI]

Bob Griese is in the freaking Hall of Fame.

If Ferguson counts then guys like Chris Chandler and Neil Lomax count then too.

Ken O'Brien counts for the Jets. Dave Kreig counts for the Seahawks. Former Bills player Daryle Lamonica counts for Oakland. Jim Everett for the Rams.

[better days]

Maybe McNair. Greise? Really?



It's a test. Wait for it...



There is a ? next to his name. He had a run of 12 straight seasons as the unquestioned starter of the team, didn't he?

Played for 14 years, is an NFL HOF player, 3 appearances in the Super Bowl with 2 wins. Greise.........REALLY.

[Dozerdog]

Buffalo - Kemp?, Ferguson?, Kelly
Miami - Marino- Griese
NY Jets - Namath
New England - Grogan, Bledsoe, Brady

Pittsburgh - Bradshaw, Roethlisberger
Cleveland - Graham, Kosar
Ravens - ??
Cincinnati - Anderson, Esiason

the Colts - Unitas, Manning Bert Jones
Texans - ??
Jacksonville - Brunell
Titans - Pastorini, Moon, McNair George Blanda

KC - Dawson
San Diego - Fouts, Rivers?
Denver - Elway
Oakland - Stabler, Plunkett?

Dallas - Staubach, Aikman, Romo?
Philadelphia - Jaworski, Cunningham, McNabb, Vick?
NY Giants - Tittle, Simms, Manning?
Washington - Baugh, Jurgenson?, Kilmer? Theisman

Minnesota - Tarkenton
Chicago - Luckman, McMahon?
Green Bay - Starr, Favre, Rodgers
Detroit - Layne

Atlanta - Bartkowski, Ryan?
New Orleans - Manning, Brees. Bobby Hebert
Carolina - Collins?
Tampa Bay - Williams?

San Francisco - Brodie, Montana, Young
Cardinals - Hart? Niel Lomax. Curt Warner
Seattle - Zorn, Hasselback? Kreig
the Rams - Waterfield, Van Brocklin, Warner?

Did I leave anybody out?

[ServoBillieves]

Romo? Seriously? No.

[PTI]

Daunte Culpepper had several really good seasons for the Vikings and may not qualify, but he was taken to be the franchise guy and would have played longer had he not got hurt. The season before he got hurt he had over 4700 yards passing and 39 TD passes.

[Extremebillsfan247]

Bob Greise had a long and successful run, and should definitely be there.lol I think the OP may have had Bob Greise confused with Brian Greise. I could be wrong though...

[tomz]

Buffalo - Kemp?, Ferguson?, Kelly
Miami - Marino
NY Jets - Namath
New England - Grogan, Bledsoe, Brady

Pittsburgh - Bradshaw, Roethlisberger
Cleveland - Graham, Kosar Frank Ryan
Ravens - ??
Cincinnati - Anderson, Esiason

the Colts - Unitas, Manning (not Jeff George? :) )
Texans - ??
Jacksonville - Brunell
Titans - Pastorini, Moon

KC - Dawson
San Diego - Fouts, Rivers? John Hadl
Denver - Elway
Oakland - Stabler, Plunkett? Lamonica

Dallas - Staubach, Aikman, Romo? Meredith
Philadelphia - Jaworski, Cunningham, McNabb, Vick?
NY Giants - Tittle, Simms, Manning?
Washington - Baugh, Jurgenson?, Kilmer?

Minnesota - Tarkenton
Chicago - Luckman, McMahon?
Green Bay - Starr, Favre, Rodgers
Detroit - Layne

Atlanta - Bartkowski, Ryan?
New Orleans - Manning, Brees
Carolina - Collins?
Tampa Bay - Williams?

San Francisco - Brodie, Montana, Young
Cardinals - Hart?
Seattle - Zorn, Hasselback?
the Rams - Waterfield, Van Brocklin, Warner? Roman Gabriel, Ferragamo

Did I leave anybody out?

Beyond Dozerdg....

Lots of debatable choices actually on the list.

[YardRat]

The last time the Bills did anything to speak of, we had Kelly, a mid 1st round pick...

After that we tried trading for guys, signing guys, resurrecting guys, drafting later round guys, and even screwed up a pick on a 1st round guy.

But we never drafted one mid-1st or higher. And yet that's what it took the last time for us.

And they thought they needed one so badly that they still picked a TE two spots ahead of him.

[Jan Reimers]

Romo? Seriously? No.
At this point, Danny White would rank ahead of Tony Romo among Cowboy QBs.

[Bill Cody]

Alex Van Pelt is a glaring omission

[better days]

At this point, Danny White would rank ahead of Tony Romo among Cowboy QBs.

I think when Romo retires, Danny White will rank ahead of him.

[trapezeus]

what defines franchise? because i would think winning a superbowl automatically counts. i would take a mediocre QB and great defense like Dilfer and the ravens for a year, just to enjoy a superbowl. Kelly never won, but we know he was franchise for going so frequently.

i think dilfer has to go on. He's the same as eli manning. he only won one and did that on a fluky play. before and since that game, he's been an average qb.

I'll take average qb on a well rounded team than a peyton manning or brady and substandard team.

[Bill Cody]

what defines franchise? because i would think winning a superbowl automatically counts. i would take a mediocre QB and great defense like Dilfer and the ravens for a year, just to enjoy a superbowl. Kelly never won, but we know he was franchise for going so frequently.

i think dilfer has to go on. He's the same as eli manning. he only won one and did that on a fluky play. before and since that game, he's been an average qb.

I'll take average qb on a well rounded team than a peyton manning or brady and substandard team.

Please. By that standard Mark Rypien is a franchise QB and we all know he isn't.

[YardRat]

what defines franchise? because i would think winning a superbowl automatically counts. i would take a mediocre QB and great defense like Dilfer and the ravens for a year, just to enjoy a superbowl. Kelly never won, but we know he was franchise for going so frequently.

i think dilfer has to go on. He's the same as eli manning. he only won one and did that on a fluky play. before and since that game, he's been an average qb.

I'll take average qb on a well rounded team than a peyton manning or brady and substandard team.

I don't think too many people equate 'mediocre' with 'franchise', but I like your supporting comments.

[YardRat]

See, this is where it gets interesting...When guys like Hadl, Lamonica, and Ferragamo start leaking into the equation. Hell, even Griese or possibly Starr are questionable IMO. The guys were well known at one time, and had some limited success, but 'franchise'? Really? So the definition of a franchise QB becomes a guy who has multiple 1000-yard rushers and a killer D?

[ServoBillieves]

It's simple as to what a "franchise quarterback" is. It's the guy you know can run the offense for more than 16 games and does it well for an extended period of time.

He's the guy you don't need to worry about in free agency and the draft, and you can build around.

We could build around Kelly, even Kemp. I could say you could build around every QB mentioned so far. If they can take you to the promised land (the playoffs, for Bills fans) frequently, then they are "franchise" QB's.

... But ROMO?! No... Just no...

I don't see a "franchise" quarterback in the near future. Unless Newton becomes the next Fran Tarkenton who won't choke in the big game, or VY becomes the champ he was in college, or Mallett learns how to play at the big boy level, or... well damn.

Can we please get incredibly lucky and have a 2000 Ravens SB win, riding on 2 running backs, a steady QB and a tolerable D?!

I'm 23 and already getting frustrated... ****ing CBA...

[better days]

See, this is where it gets interesting...When guys like Hadl, Lamonica, and Ferragamo start leaking into the equation. Hell, even Griese or possibly Starr are questionable IMO. The guys were well known at one time, and had some limited success, but 'franchise'? Really? So the definition of a franchise QB becomes a guy who has multiple 1000-yard rushers and a killer D?

If you are talking limited success you are not talking about Bob Griese or Bart Starr. Both of them are HOF QB's. How can a guy be in the HOF & not be considered a franchise QB? That is just CRAZY!!!!!!!

I think Hadl & Lamonica can also be considered franchise QB's both were STARS in the AFL.

[YardRat]

If you are talking limited success you are not talking about Bob Griese or Bart Starr. Both of them are HOF QB's. How can a guy be in the HOF & not be considered a franchise QB? That is just CRAZY!!!!!!!

I think Hadl & Lamonica can also be considered franchise QB's both were STARS in the AFL.

Griese was a very minor part of the Dolphins success. Ask Earl Morrall.

[better days]

[quote=YardRat]Griese was a very minor part of the Dolphins success. Ask Earl Morrall.[/qu

Griese is a HALL OF FAME QB. That is all you should need to know when asking if he is a franchise QB. It is IDIOTIC to think a guy can be in the HOF & not be considered a franchise QB.

It is obvious you are young & never saw these guys play. If Griese played a minor part in the Dolphins success, he never would have been elected to the HALL OF FAME. The entire point of the Hall of fame is to let future fans know who the NFL's GREAT players were. The Hall OF Fame is not the Hall Of the Very Good or Average.

[YardRat]

[quote=YardRat]Griese was a very minor part of the Dolphins success. Ask Earl Morrall.[/qu

Griese is a HALL OF FAME QB. That is all you should need to know when asking if he is a franchise QB. It is IDIOTIC to think a guy can be in the HOF & not be considered a franchise QB.

It is obvious you are young & never saw these guys play. If Griese played a minor part in the Dolphins success, he never would have been elected to the HALL OF FAME. The entire point of the Hall of fame is to let future fans know who the NFL's GREAT players were. The Hall OF Fame is not the Hall Of the Very Good or Average.

lol...Seriously?

Griese is in the HOF based on two SB wins, and three consecutive conference titles. Team accomplishments. He rode the strongest running game in the league at the time to any success.

[better days]

[quote=better days]

lol...Seriously?

Griese is in the HOF based on two SB wins, and three consecutive conference titles. Team accomplishments. He rode the strongest running game in the league at the time to any success.

You name me ONE Super Bowl winning QB that did not have a good team around him. As I said they do not admit anybody but the games greats into the Hall Of Fame.

Now I have to go take a shower, I feel dirty arguing for a Fins player.

[stuckincincy]

I'd add DET's Greg Landry, who played 10 years for them. And the STL Card's Jim Hart, with his 17 years there.

Different era, I know...

[YardRat]

[quote=YardRat]

You name me ONE Super Bowl winning QB that did not have a good team around him. As I said they do not admit anybody but the games greats into the Hall Of Fame.

Now I have to go take a shower, I feel dirty arguing for a Fins player.

I don't know if I can. That's kind of the point. What's more important for ultimate success...A franchise QB, or the team that surrounds him?

Hell, Earl Morrall had more impact on the Dolfags undefeated season than Griese did.

[YardRat]

I'd add DET's Greg Landry, who played 10 years for them. And the STL Card's Jim Hart, with his 17 years there.

Different era, I know...

Landry's a good one...I completely forgot about him. Although he's more in the 'Fergy' category of franchise guys than the Kelly's/Marino's/Elway's.

[PTI]

I will say the HOF does get it wrong sometimes. Marv Levy is the most undeserving person ever in the HOF.

[Dr. Lecter]

Bob Griese is in the freaking Hall of Fame.

If Ferguson counts then guys like Chris Chandler and Neil Lomax count then too.

Ken O'Brien counts for the Jets. Dave Kreig counts for the Seahawks. Former Bills player Daryle Lamonica counts for Oakland. Jim Everett for the Rams.



So you want Ferguson off and Everett on?

Based on what?

[Dr. Lecter]

I will say the HOF does get it wrong sometimes. Marv Levy is the most undeserving person ever in the HOF.
lol.

OK.

[better days]

[quote=better days]

I don't know if I can. That's kind of the point. What's more important for ultimate success...A franchise QB, or the team that surrounds him?

Hell, Earl Morrall had more impact on the Dolfags undefeated season than Griese did.

Morrall also took over for Unitas & led the Colts to a 13-1 record & Super Bowl 3 where they lost to the Jets. Griese & Unitas are both in the HOF while Morrall is not, that should tell you something. The HOF is for GREAT players not the very good. And even a very good player can be considered a franchise QB so to say Griese is a questionable franchise QB is just stupid.

[k-oneputt]

I will say the HOF does get it wrong sometimes. Marv Levy is the most undeserving person ever in the HOF.

Talk about being in the right place at the right time. If we did truly have a HOF coach during that Bills team they would have won two SB's min.

Marv and his staff hurt the team during the Sb's, they surely didn't help them. Out coached in all four games.

[PTI]

So you want Ferguson off and Everett on?

Based on what?

All guys listed there had more success with wins and losses than Joe Ferguson did. I didn't say to take Ferguson, off, I said if you put him on then you need to put these other guys on too. Sorry you don't understand well.

[PTI]

lol.

OK.

Glorified Rah-Rah cheerleader, no Bills player took him seriously, the players ran that team, he had very little control of the actions of the players and never even seemed to care. He was old when he coached them then, completely out of touch. Worst head coach ever to be in a Super Bowl.

[Dr. Lecter]

Glorified Rah-Rah cheerleader, no Bills player took him seriously, the players ran that team, he had very little control of the actions of the players and never even seemed to care. He was old when he coached them then, completely out of touch. Worst head coach ever to be in a Super Bowl.
Barry Switzer.

End of story.

[Mr. Pink]

Barry Switzer.

End of story.


I see your Barry Switzer and raise you a Bill Callahan.

[Nighthawk]

Buffalo - Kemp?, Ferguson?, Kelly
Miami - Marino
NY Jets - Namath
New England - Grogan, Bledsoe, Brady

Pittsburgh - Bradshaw, Roethlisberger
Cleveland - Graham, Kosar
Ravens - ??
Cincinnati - Anderson, Esiason

the Colts - Unitas, Manning
Texans - ??
Jacksonville - Brunell
Titans - Pastorini, Moon

KC - Dawson
San Diego - Fouts, Rivers?
Denver - Elway
Oakland - Stabler, Plunkett?

Dallas - Staubach, Aikman, Romo?
Philadelphia - Jaworski, Cunningham, McNabb, Vick?
NY Giants - Tittle, Simms, Manning?
Washington - Baugh, Jurgenson?, Kilmer?

Minnesota - Tarkenton
Chicago - Luckman, McMahon?
Green Bay - Starr, Favre, Rodgers
Detroit - Layne

Atlanta - Bartkowski, Ryan?
New Orleans - Manning, Brees
Carolina - Collins?
Tampa Bay - Williams?

San Francisco - Brodie, Montana, Young
Cardinals - Hart?
Seattle - Zorn, Hasselback?
the Rams - Waterfield, Van Brocklin, Warner?

Did I leave anybody out?

Honestly, what is your point? Are you saying that you stop trying to acquire a franchise QB because it is hard to do? Stupid, just stupid mentality.

[YardRat]

Honestly, what is your point? Are you saying that you stop trying to acquire a franchise QB because it is hard to do? Stupid, just stupid mentality.

You never stop trying to acquire one...but you have to use common sense and sound judgment in the attempt. Pick #3 of the first round this year is no place to gamble on something that historically is difficult to obtain.

If Newton or Gabbert drop to us in the second? Fine...Go for it. Any earlier for us, though, and we're trying desperately to buck the trend and in all likelihood will fail.