A top defense vs A first rd QB

[mikemac2001]

Playoff teams

defense ranked by points because thats all that matters


Steelers 1
packers 2
Ravens 3
bears 4
falcons 5
Jets 6
saints 7
New England 8
Chiefs 11
eagles 21
Colts 23
seahawks 25


RD 1
Steelers = bye
Ravens (3) > Chiefs (11)
Jets (6) > Colts (23)
New England = Bye

Bears = Bye
Falcons = bye
Packers (2) > Eagles (21)
Seahawks (25) > Saints (7)

RD 2
Jets (6) > NE (8)
Steelers (1) > Ravens (3)
Packers (2) > Falcons (5)
Bears (4) > Seahawks (25)

RD 3
Steelers (1) > Jets (6)
Packers (2) > Bears (4)

RD 4
Packers (2) > Steelers (1)

As you can see the better D won all but 2 times

seahawks upset the saints (at home and saints D sucked that day)
and the number 2 d beat the number 1 D in the superbowl.

But every other game the D came out on top

Now lets take a different look at this


Playoff teams
With QB's by Round


Steelers RD 1 QB
packers RD 1 QB
Ravens RD 1 QB
bears RD 1 QB
falcons RD 1 QB
Jets RD 1 QB
saints RD 2 (32 pick)
New England RD 6
Chiefs Really this guy sucks
eagles RD 1
Colts RD 1
seahawks I honestly don't know i don't think its rd one (but bradford was rd 1)


So the best teams in the league or divisions all had top defense but they also had for the most part round one qb's. also half of the picks werent even the first QB to be selected. i am all for going defense and not a huge fan of gabbert or newton but we need to improve both if they believe fitz can hold the team and they have a homerun on D i say go for D and see what fitz can do atleast we know we can score points the issue was our D not being able to stop anything.

but if they draft QB how can we get upset both need improvements and the trends have shown you need both,

i don't usually research stuff but i was kinda curious what was more of an impact and to be honest most of the teams had a first RD QB and a solid Defense but i think our biggest weakness was on the D.

either way we need to get players who can play and make an impact.

[BertSquirtgum]

fitz is the next johnny unitas. the bills need to go defense the first 4 rounds of the draft.

[Prov401]

Defense wins titles. I'm not too crazy about any of the QB's in this draft. Fitz had a good year last year, and I believe will be better next year. I'm not saying he's our franchise savior, but he's got heart, brains, and toughness. We haven't seen that in a long time. Our defense is further behind than our QB play. We need to draft a player that is going to start from day one, and be a pro bowler throughout his career. A top 3 pick should net us that if we play it right. If we go QB, we're going to watch another first round pick not make an impact his rookie season for about the tenth year straight. Dareus, Peterson, or Bowers, I'm begging ya Nix.

[Extremebillsfan247]

What that says is that it really doesn't matter what comes first, you need both to get to the top in the NFL. Teams with exposed defenses(Colts, Patriots, Chiefs, Saints) usually don't go very far in the post season even with elite QBs like Manning, or Brady etc. Teams with great defenses, but exposed offenses(Ravens) will get to the post season a lot but will fail to beat the teams that are more balanced. Balance is what any team striving to be a top team needs. Without it you may get to a post season, but it will rarely if ever lead to a Super Bowl ring in the end. JMO

[FlyingDutchman]

To me its an easy decision. Last year there were 9 games where 30 points or more were scored on us...9...thats a joke...dead last against the rush....DEAD LAST...to me its obvious what the number one glaring hole is, and this is a perfect draft to address it with the prospects available

Im not the biggest Fitz fan in the world but last year he proved to me that he is capable. Hes not taking us to the Super Bowl but hes serviceable for now. There is serious questions about each QB prospect coming out in the draft, yet the defensive line prospects seem strong. We have a glaring hole (DL) and promising prospects available versus somewhat of a problem (QB) with questionable prospects....I agree Fitz will not get us far, but neither will a defense that cant stop the ball and get off the field...Its a no brainer we address the Defensive front 7 with the 3rd pick imo

[Joe Fo Sho]

The thing is, no one really knows who in this draft is going to excel in the NFL.

Let's say Peyton Manning, Julius Peppers, and Ray Lewis are in this draft. I would draft Manning, followed by Lewis then Peppers. But if only one of them are in this years draft, you have to take that player. I'm not qualified enough to say any of these rookies are going to be great, I just hope we draft the player that is going to have the most impact on this team.

[Night Train]

The key, when was the QB brought in ?

When the D sucked and the overall team was bad... or after the D was built up, in order to give him a chance to stay in games ?

[X-Era]

Defense wins titles. I'm not too crazy about any of the QB's in this draft. Fitz had a good year last year, and I believe will be better next year. I'm not saying he's our franchise savior, but he's got heart, brains, and toughness. We haven't seen that in a long time. Our defense is further behind than our QB play. We need to draft a player that is going to start from day one, and be a pro bowler throughout his career. A top 3 pick should net us that if we play it right. If we go QB, we're going to watch another first round pick not make an impact his rookie season for about the tenth year straight. Dareus, Peterson, or Bowers, I'm begging ya Nix.Except for this year?

[THE END OF ALL DAYS]

which came first.... chicken or the egg

which do we need first d or qb

same questions

[X-Era]

which came first.... chicken or the egg

which do we need first d or qb

same questionsWhy don't we just get both? One 1st round pick won't put the defense in the top 5. If the Bills think they are drafting a franchise QB at 3, get him. And then make a heavy investment on the defense from FA and the rest of the draft.

[jamze132]

I'm still not completely sold on Gabbert or Newton. But I am sold on Bowers, Fairely, and Miller. It's a tough call and I don't envy Nix and Co. for having a huge decision. Nix and Gailey know they have to absolutely nail this draft considering the high pick we have.

I think I am leaning on taking the BPA on defense in RD1 and then maybe taking a stab at Stazni in the 2nd if someone late in the first doesn't take him. If Carolina passes on a QB in RD 1, they might be thinking Stazni in RD 2 as well.

[BuffaloBlakely14]

Why don't we just get both? One 1st round pick won't put the defense in the top 5. If the Bills think they are drafting a franchise QB at 3, get him. And then make a heavy investment on the defense from FA and the rest of the draft.

I'm not 100% sold on any of the first round QB's this year, but this is one of the smartest quotes out there.

I love how people think that 1 first round pick will make the entire D. I am a very big proponent of Peterson or Miller at #3 but that is because I think that they are actually difference makers. I also would not be upset with Dareus. But if the Bills think that Gabbert or Newton has what it takes for the next decade, then there is no choice in my opinion.

[alohabillsfan]

I would be happy with the Bills selecting defense with their first 4 picks. something like...

DE
ILB
CB
NT
SS/ILB

[mikemac2001]

I'm not 100% sold on any of the first round QB's this year, but this is one of the smartest quotes out there.

I love how people think that 1 first round pick will make the entire D. I am a very big proponent of Peterson or Miller at #3 but that is because I think that they are actually difference makers. I also would not be upset with Dareus. But if the Bills think that Gabbert or Newton has what it takes for the next decade, then there is no choice in my opinion.


And this is the big question

If they are sold on a qb and draft them then you gotta look at it as a positive

I don't like newton or gabbert but I also see why they might like them

But I believe the safer pick at 3 is defense

I think with a solid d we can still compete

We shouda coulda beat steelers bears ravens and chiefs all top 11 d's

Draft the player with the higher % to be a star right away with the 3rd pick

[alohabillsfan]

Come on people, dont you want to build a defense that can do to Tom Brady what the Giants did to him in the superbowl! Screw offense!

[mikemac2001]

Come on people, dont you want to build a defense that can do to Tom Brady what the Giants did to him in the superbowl! Screw offense!


Great d plus first rd qb

But yes I'd rather see a d beat up Brady before anything

[The Jokeman]

which came first.... chicken or the egg

which do we need first d or qb

same questions
Stop stealing my lines (http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=200568). lol :cgal:

[FlyingDutchman]

Why don't we just get both? One 1st round pick won't put the defense in the top 5. If the Bills think they are drafting a franchise QB at 3, get him. And then make a heavy investment on the defense from FA and the rest of the draft.

well thats just the thing...there is a very small percentage of people who truly believe there is a franchise QB available....so why not go a much safer choice when we have a pick that we cant miss on? Werent you dying for Claussen last year?...not trying to pick on you or anything but where would we be now had we done that?

[The Jokeman]

well thats just the thing...there is a very small percentage of people who truly believe there is a franchise QB available....so why not go a much safer choice when we have a pick that we cant miss on? Werent you dying for Claussen last year?...not trying to pick on you or anything but where would we be now had we done that?
We'd probably be picking ahead of Carolina and Denver.

[Prov401]

Except for this year?

lol, yea because Greenbay didn't have the number 2 ranked defense in the NFL.

[PTI]

All I know is you better score some points, doesn't matter how good your defense is. The 4 division final games in the playoffs, the scores were:

31-24 Steelers over Ravens
35-24 Bears over Seahawks
48-21 Packers over Falcons
28-21 Jets over Patriots

Super Bowl was 31-25

All these good teams can score on each other regardless of the defense. Bills need a better QB, it helps in so many ways. We have to go QB in round 1 and hope that the guys we drafted last year can play and the guys in rounds 2-7 can help.

[ddaryl]

you need both to win a championship, although there are exceptions.

but establishing a solid D helps teams with average QB's win sooner, and allows young groomable QB's to make some mistakes forgivable which helps development.... IMO

[X-Era]

well thats just the thing...there is a very small percentage of people who truly believe there is a franchise QB available....so why not go a much safer choice when we have a pick that we cant miss on? Werent you dying for Claussen last year?...not trying to pick on you or anything but where would we be now had we done that?Who exactly are you referring to? If anything, there is a very small percentage of the mainstream draft-nicks who don't think one or both will go in the top ten. Most do. I have no problem with anyone not liking the pick, or wanting to go in a different direction, but the popular opinion on a message board does not dictate what the teams or moreover what the Bills will do.

As far as the safer pick, there are no safe picks.

I stand by the same statement I ahve made all along. If the Bills think a QB in this draft can be their future and is worth the #3 pick, I think they will make that pick and I have no problem with it. Potentially, we can draft a DL in round 2 that would be a 1st rounder in many drafts. And since no ILB, or S is worth a 1st rounder, we can address that later as well.

The draft is deep enough to yield us several solid prospects at several positions even if we get a QB in round 1.

[YardRat]

Who exactly are you referring to? If anything, there is a very small percentage of the mainstream draft-nicks who don't think one or both will go in the top ten. Most do. I have no problem with anyone not liking the pick, or wanting to go in a different direction, but the popular opinion on a message board does not dictate what the teams or moreover what the Bills will do.

As far as the safer pick, there are no safe picks.

I stand by the same statement I ahve made all along. If the Bills think a QB in this draft can be their future and is worth the #3 pick, I think they will make that pick and I have no problem with it. Potentially, we can draft a DL in round 2 that would be a 1st rounder in many drafts. And since no ILB, or S is worth a 1st rounder, we can address that later as well.

The draft is deep enough to yield us several solid prospects at several positions even if we get a QB in round 1.

Thinking they'll go in the top ten is completely different than thinking they can be a franchise QB. Hell, even I think Newton is going to go high, but that doesn't change my opinion on how he'll fare in the big league. Somebody will be dumb enough to take the risk on him. Maybe Gabbert, also.

[mikemac2001]

All I know is you better score some points, doesn't matter how good your defense is. The 4 division final games in the playoffs, the scores were:

31-24 Steelers over Ravens
35-24 Bears over Seahawks
48-21 Packers over Falcons
28-21 Jets over Patriots

Super Bowl was 31-25

All these good teams can score on each other regardless of the defense. Bills need a better QB, it helps in so many ways. We have to go QB in round 1 and hope that the guys we drafted last year can play and the guys in rounds 2-7 can help.


don't really want to look up stats but i know

steelers and ravens both got D pts (or setup them for easy pts multiple times)
Packers scored on D before half (and blew game open then didn't need to worry about D as much)


i tried to lookup pts off turnovers but couldnt find them because they matter as well but you can't look at a score and see what the D did to help

Turnovers and field position.

but i do agree you have to be able to score

but we were able to score on the teams we played last year with poor TIME of possession and not getting turnovers or field position


i posted this because i felt the whole Idea was interesting

it takes a top QB and a top D

[X-Era]

Thinking they'll go in the top ten is completely different than thinking they can be a franchise QB. Hell, even I think Newton is going to go high, but that doesn't change my opinion on how he'll fare in the big league. Somebody will be dumb enough to take the risk on him. Maybe Gabbert, also.You could be right, no one knows.

[PTI]

don't really want to look up stats but i know

steelers and ravens both got D pts (or setup them for easy pts multiple times)
Packers scored on D before half (and blew game open then didn't need to worry about D as much)


i tried to lookup pts off turnovers but couldnt find them because they matter as well but you can't look at a score and see what the D did to help

Turnovers and field position.

but i do agree you have to be able to score

but we were able to score on the teams we played last year with poor TIME of possession and not getting turnovers or field position


i posted this because i felt the whole Idea was interesting

it takes a top QB and a top D
I do agree totally with you it takes both, but I disagree that you think the Bills scored points last year. There were 4 games they scored points out of 16. In the last 9 games Fitz started the Bills scored over 19 points once. Gailey proved nothing, regardless if Fitz got 3,000 garbage yards and 23 TDs. The Bills regressed on offense as the season progressed. Everyone has injuries. If people want to bring up WR injuries then the 49 versus Cincy doesn't count then considering their 2 Safeties and starting CB and nickel corner did not play the almost all the 2nd half and that is only when the Bills scored.