Von Miller Weighs in at 250lbs [Archive] - BillsZone.com

Ickybaluky

04-12-2011, 10:32 AM

Is he Mike Mamula?

That's the only concern I have with him.

I think that is way off base. He was incredibly productive over his college career, and was so playing multiple positions.

I think Miller is about as certain as anyone in this draft. The kid can come off the edge like a terror, and that will translate to the NFL. He can rush the passer.

The only question with him is if he has the kind of power to bull-rush and anchor against the run. He lacks the power of a guy like DeMarcus Ware.

However, Mamula? No, Mamula was a great athlete but not an instinctive football player. Miller is a football player and a great edge rusher, I just wonder if he can anchor or power a guy.

EDS

04-12-2011, 10:32 AM

I dont think Miller is top 5 talent.

In most drafts I would agree, but this draft seems lack obvious top drawer talent - or at least top drawer talent without a list of questions following them around (i.e., Quinn, Bowers, Fairley, Newton, Gabbert, etc.).

stuckincincy

04-12-2011, 11:09 AM

I think that is way off base. He was incredibly productive over his college career, and was so playing multiple positions.

I think Miller is about as certain as anyone in this draft. The kid can come off the edge like a terror, and that will translate to the NFL. He can rush the passer.

The only question with him is if he has the kind of power to bull-rush and anchor against the run. He lacks the power of a guy like DeMarcus Ware.

However, Mamula? No, Mamula was a great athlete but not an instinctive football player. Miller is a football player and a great edge rusher, I just wonder if he can anchor or power a guy.

Sounds like the 2nd coming of Aaron Maybin...

:band:

Mr. Miyagi

04-12-2011, 11:18 AM

Ingtar33

04-12-2011, 11:27 AM

Sounds like the 2nd coming of Aaron Maybin...

:band:

considering he's quite a bit bigger than maybin, and was productive over multiple seasons? No... this is a bad comparison.

DraftBoy

04-12-2011, 11:39 AM

I think that is way off base. He was incredibly productive over his college career, and was so playing multiple positions.

I think Miller is about as certain as anyone in this draft. The kid can come off the edge like a terror, and that will translate to the NFL. He can rush the passer.

The only question with him is if he has the kind of power to bull-rush and anchor against the run. He lacks the power of a guy like DeMarcus Ware.

However, Mamula? No, Mamula was a great athlete but not an instinctive football player. Miller is a football player and a great edge rusher, I just wonder if he can anchor or power a guy.

He's still more athlete than football player. His instincts Ill give you but his technique is very raw and he will needs lots of hands on coaching since he has never played a true LB spot.

baalworship

04-12-2011, 11:53 AM

better days

04-12-2011, 01:00 PM

stuckincincy

04-12-2011, 01:03 PM

considering he's quite a bit bigger than maybin, and was productive over multiple seasons? No... this is a bad comparison.

If at first you don't succeed, try, try again... ?

Sorry - the words "terrific edge rusher" strikes a note.

And I also expect more of a LB than rushing a passer.

TigerJ

04-12-2011, 01:09 PM

djjimkelly

04-12-2011, 01:17 PM

i wonder if hes taking the same summer juice regiment im doing lol

:bike: :bike: :bike: :bike: :bike:

stuckincincy

04-12-2011, 01:24 PM

Miller is not my first choice at #3 overall, and I'm still concerned that he might be small as a 3-4 rush linebacker, and could get pushed around in the run game by big athletic OTs. However, I don't think he equates to Aaron Maybin. He's not a one trick pony.

I also would be surprised if he was the #3 pick.

If he is small as a 3-4 rush linebacker, and might get pushed around by OTs in the run game, what other tricks does he have?

justasportsfan

04-12-2011, 01:33 PM

I also would be surprised if he was the #3 pick.

If he is small as a 3-4 rush linebacker, and might get pushed around by OTs in the run game, what other tricks does he have?

with his speed he can get up fast and be the 2nd or 3rd tackler just like Whitner.

stuckincincy

04-12-2011, 02:13 PM

with his speed he can get up fast and be the 2nd or 3rd tackler just like Whitner.

Heh.

Whitner and the "famous" hit on Ochocinco (nee Johnson).

Ocho was in his contract snit mode - he already had short-armed several tosses from Palmer. Stretched out low for a pass - Whitner hit 'em a foot above the field - hardly a tackle.

Ocho played possum. Which I knew - he is far and away one of the NFL's toughest players- watched him for years getting blasted and getting back up. Here's one of many:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kztnbhUcJo&feature=fvst

He was shipped to a hospital, but *miraculously* recovered in time to catch the team plane back to Cincy.

NOT THE DUDE...

04-12-2011, 02:54 PM

I don't care as much about lbs they put on before the draft. When I look at size I look at their playing weight.

Von Miller played at 237 lbs.

Aaron Maybin played at 237 lbs.

Robert Quinn played at 265 lbs.

Brian Orakpo played at 255 lb lbs

Demarcus Ware played at 251 lbs

maybin was 225lbs during his last year at penn state. miller was 237 at 6-2 1/2 with a thicker waist and lower body, he also has more mass in his arms, hes not ripped like a wr, he has legit mass in his upper body, plus ive seen him bull rush the heck out of ots. now hes a solid strong 250.

for me its

1 dareus
2 von miller
3 trade down and take jordan or watt

Ickybaluky

04-12-2011, 03:09 PM

If at first you don't succeed, try, try again... ?

Sorry - the words "terrific edge rusher" strikes a note.

And I also expect more of a LB than rushing a passer.

Lawrence Taylor was a terrific edge rusher as well. He played at about 235 in college as well, and didn't go over 250 until later in his career when he got thicker.

I remember some worrying if Taylor would hold up because he played with such reckless disregard for his body. Miller is no LT, but he plays with that kind of speed and motor.

DraftBoy

04-12-2011, 03:24 PM

Lawrence Taylor was a terrific edge rusher as well. He played at about 235 in college as well, and didn't go over 250 until later in his career when he got thicker.

I remember some worrying if Taylor would hold up because he played with such reckless disregard for his body. Miller is no LT, but he plays with that kind of speed and motor.

That's a very good comparison but not sure Taylor would have the same effect today as he did when he played nearly 20 years ago.

stuckincincy

04-12-2011, 03:43 PM

I remember some worrying if Taylor would hold up because he played with such reckless disregard for his body. Miller is no LT, but he plays with that kind of speed and motor.

That's nice to hear - but the Bills' pick is #3 overall. That's a steep price to pay for a LB.

But you never know, of course. It's always a roll of the dice.

tampabay25690

04-12-2011, 04:42 PM

I dont think Miller is top 5 talent.
WOW I think he is the 3rd best player in teh draft..

Ickybaluky

04-12-2011, 05:37 PM

That's nice to hear - but the Bills' pick is #3 overall. That's a steep price to pay for a LB.

But you never know, of course. It's always a roll of the dice.

I think short of Dareus or Peterson, Miller the best/cleanest player. There are guys who may end up being better but have a higher risk factor (like Fairley). Miller has the high ceiling without the low floor of some other prospects. He may not end up being the best guy, but he won't be the worst, IMO.

Ickybaluky

04-12-2011, 05:40 PM

That's a very good comparison but not sure Taylor would have the same effect today as he did when he played nearly 20 years ago.

I think he would be the best pass rusher in the NFL. Taylor maybe a cretin, but he was a force of nature on the football field.

Granted, offenses get rid of the ball quicker so sacks are a little harder to get, but that is offset by them passing more. Either way, Taylor had a knack of coming up with big plays. He elevated his game when the stakes were high, and he scared teams like few players in the history of the game.

If you don't think that carries over, you are nuts. The guy was great, and would still be great.

better days

04-12-2011, 06:00 PM

That's nice to hear - but the Bills' pick is #3 overall. That's a steep price to pay for a LB.

But you never know, of course. It's always a roll of the dice.

Well, if you think the #3 is steep for a LB, it is much steeper for a WR or CB which some on this board have said they want the Bills to draft.

baalworship

04-12-2011, 07:31 PM

The point that that many of us who do not want Von Miller at 3 are making is that using a top 5 pick on a small speed rusher is more risk than is needed to take.

Could he turn into a Clay Matthews type? Sure. But how many teams draft 230 lb pass rushers with a top 5 pick? It is just not done. 3-4 OLB should be looked at later in the draft to maximize value. The best ones tend to be undersized defensive ends and tweeners that 4-3 teams can't use.

It's a higher risk pick because of

1. His size. Again he played at 237 lbs in college

2. His value. 3-4 OLB's don't get drafted this high and the last 2 linebackers drafted top 5 have been underwhelming.

3.Will his pass-rush skills translate to the NFL? In college he just ran around players. What will he do when he is always lined up against a 320 lb tackle with quick feet?

I would feel much better about Von Miller around pick 15 rather than 3. At 3rd overall why can't we get a talented front 7 player with talent AND size?

tampabay25690

04-12-2011, 07:39 PM

I dont care what he weighs.....
Von Miller will be a Pro Bowl LB in the NFL.....

BertSquirtgum

04-12-2011, 09:05 PM

EVERYBODY all together, say NO to Von Miller. That is all.

Mahdi

04-12-2011, 10:35 PM

Don't be mistaken. Von Miller is NOT Aaron Maybin. For one thing Miller wasn't a one year wonder in college. And he's not a one-trick pony in terms of pass rushing moves. Plus he's not 185 lbs dripping wet either.
Show me how he is not a one-trick pony... All he does is run by the OT... I don't think I saw Miller ONCE swim, rip, handfight, or bull rush an OT in college... how is that going to affect him in the NFL when he can't rely solely on his speed?

tampabay25690

04-13-2011, 04:55 AM

Show me how he is not a one-trick pony... All he does is run by the OT... I don't think I saw Miller ONCE swim, rip, handfight, or bull rush an OT in college... how is that going to affect him in the NFL when he can't rely solely on his speed?

Isn't that what L.T. and Derrick Thomas????
I think they had pretty decent careers???
Im still trying to figure out why some don't want Miller.

Night Train

04-13-2011, 06:12 AM

Miller is one heck of an athlete, but the question is does he have pass rush moves and the ability to lock on to an OT and beat him....?
That's the million dollar question because he's not in there to defend the run. If he can't be a terror off the edge, then he's just another guy. That's my concern with him.

Thief

04-13-2011, 06:36 AM

Why is he so shocked he weights 250? Does he not have a scale at home?

DraftBoy

04-13-2011, 07:36 AM

I think he would be the best pass rusher in the NFL. Taylor maybe a cretin, but he was a force of nature on the football field.

Granted, offenses get rid of the ball quicker so sacks are a little harder to get, but that is offset by them passing more. Either way, Taylor had a knack of coming up with big plays. He elevated his game when the stakes were high, and he scared teams like few players in the history of the game.

If you don't think that carries over, you are nuts. The guy was great, and would still be great.

Did I say it wouldn't carry over?

Some perspective however is needed when making the comparison of how dominant LT was 20 years ago to how dominant Miller will be playing almost the same identical game (albeit less sound tackling) with faster, strong, and smarter OT's, more complex blocking packages, and a new age spread em out system that is designed to get rid of the ball faster.

Does that mean LT wouldn't be good or that Miller won't? Of course not, all Im asking for is some perspective. The kid has a lot to prove and what I mean by that is that he has more to prove than almost any other LB ranked in the top 15 or so. His learning curve will be very steep and people over looking that could get burned because of it. His natural athelticism and instincts are not to be overlooked but there is far more to be concerned with then just how much of a physical specimen he is.

And for the record Von Miller is a very intelligent kid, having spoken to him once and heard him speak a couple more times I have no doubts about his intelligence level.

Mahdi

04-13-2011, 08:32 AM

Isn't that what L.T. and Derrick Thomas????
I think they had pretty decent careers???
Im still trying to figure out why some don't want Miller.
Look at first glance I was all over taking Miller at 3. DB pointed out his deficiencies and I went back and watched all his highlights and found that this kid never has to deal with an OT.

He either blows right by the OT before he can get his hands up or he gets pushed around the pocket.

He never does anything different or tries to counter his speed rush with something else. That is the similarity I see with him and Maybin. They both don't display other solutions or ways of beating an OT.

If you think Miller can just come in and run past OT in the NFL you are not being realistic. He will have to learn to use his hands, bull rush, spin, swim and rip. etc. If he can do that the kid will be the next Derrick Thomas. If he can't he will be sitting next to Maybin trying to figure out the NFL.

For me its just not a chance I'm willing to take. Especially when you can actually get a really good 3-4 OLB prospect at the top of the second who are more polished.

tampabay25690

04-13-2011, 09:11 AM

Why is he so shocked he weights 250? Does he not have a scale at home?

He was probably being sarcastic since most fans are dramatic about him being under weight......
Im telling you guys thsi guy is going to light it up in the NFL, I have that feeling about him....
I wouldnt be surprised if Denver takes him......

tampabay25690

04-13-2011, 09:18 AM

Look at first glance I was all over taking Miller at 3. DB pointed out his deficiencies and I went back and watched all his highlights and found that this kid never has to deal with an OT.

He either blows right by the OT before he can get his hands up or he gets pushed around the pocket.

He never does anything different or tries to counter his speed rush with something else. That is the similarity I see with him and Maybin. They both don't display other solutions or ways of beating an OT.

If you think Miller can just come in and run past OT in the NFL you are not being realistic. He will have to learn to use his hands, bull rush, spin, swim and rip. etc. If he can do that the kid will be the next Derrick Thomas. If he can't he will be sitting next to Maybin trying to figure out the NFL.

For me its just not a chance I'm willing to take. Especially when you can actually get a really good 3-4 OLB prospect at the top of the second who are more polished.

You can find something wrong with every pick in the draft.....
Problem is BUFFALO has not been able to get to the QB and Von Miller can do that.......You can point out all the negative you want but to me he has a huge upside to him.....I guess we will see.....
There are so many players I really like in the draft and 98% are on the Defensive side.......If you told me that the Bills drafted 8 players on the defsnive side of the ball I would be thrilled........

elltrain22

04-13-2011, 09:23 AM

Personally, I would be very happy w/ Von Miller. I love it that he was very productive in college, and especially against top competition. If he pans out to be a good player, that makes our defense so much better. An OLB who can rush the passer, and can also reek havoc against the run, OMG, that would make our dee so much better.

stuckincincy

04-13-2011, 10:08 AM

Well, if you think the #3 is steep for a LB, it is much steeper for a WR or CB which some on this board have said they want the Bills to draft.

Indeed it is.

I can sort of understand grabbing a CB that high - sort of. I'd have to have a real big need, though. I read somewhere that's a very rare thing - a DB that high.

For me, a top 5 pick is most always a qb, an ol , or a dl.

I'd have to be a team dripping with talent before I'd think about a wr.

I'm not a real big fan of the BPA school of thought. If my foundation is cracked, and my roof is leaking, I'm not going to spend my money on spiffy new windows.

Mahdi

04-13-2011, 12:18 PM

You can find something wrong with every pick in the draft.....
Problem is BUFFALO has not been able to get to the QB and Von Miller can do that.......You can point out all the negative you want but to me he has a huge upside to him.....I guess we will see.....
There are so many players I really like in the draft and 98% are on the Defensive side.......If you told me that the Bills drafted 8 players on the defsnive side of the ball I would be thrilled........
Something wrong is one thing... a player drafted to be a pass rusher who lacks pass rush moves and ability to engage an OT is a massive deficiency. Especially at 3.

Ickybaluky

04-13-2011, 02:10 PM

Something wrong is one thing... a player drafted to be a pass rusher who lacks pass rush moves and ability to engage an OT is a massive deficiency. Especially at 3.

I think the one that that is certain is the kid can rush the passer. First of all, he isn't just fast, he plays as fast as anyone. He didn't just get all those sacks by running by guys, he is a smart football player how knows how to defeat a blocker. He does have explosive speed to get around the outside, but he has displayed a great swim move and can spin off blocks well. He does a great job of twisting his body and maintaining balance, and is stronger than you think.

He is the prototype for the 3-4 rush OLB. He will play at 245# in the NFL and will almost certainly put up big sack numbers. He does have to become a better all-around players, as he gets too fast at times and needs to stay home better. He probably should get stronger in his legs.

He also has good character, is smart and is a leader. Few guys come out with less risk. His floor is being a solid player who excels at rushing the QB, his ceiling is being an elite defender.

tampabay25690

04-13-2011, 02:21 PM

Something wrong is one thing... a player drafted to be a pass rusher who lacks pass rush moves and ability to engage an OT is a massive deficiency. Especially at 3.

I guess thats why we all have our own opinion.........:beers:
I don't see it at all.....
I guess the experts maybe wrong as well...

Extremebillsfan247

04-14-2011, 05:19 PM

The Bills are going to draft him because the majority here don't like him. lol I can't wait for that.

stuckincincy

04-15-2011, 08:40 AM

The Bills are going to draft him because the majority here don't like him. lol I can't wait for that.

WMG...Losman...McCargo...Maybin. Tradition is important.

:surf:

baalworship

04-15-2011, 10:54 AM

WMG...Losman...McCargo...Maybin. Tradition is important.

:surf:

You forgot Whitner.

:hand:

BuffaloBlitz83

04-15-2011, 12:45 PM

I'd draft Newton, Dareous, Miller, Peterson, Fairly in that order.

Mahdi

04-15-2011, 01:22 PM

I'd draft Newton, Dareous, Miller, Peterson, Fairly in that order.
Switch Peterson with Miller.

stuckincincy

04-15-2011, 02:17 PM

You forgot Whitner.

:hand:

I gave him a pass - he remains a starter.

:bike:

cookie G

04-15-2011, 04:08 PM

I think the one that that is certain is the kid can rush the passer. First of all, he isn't just fast, he plays as fast as anyone. He didn't just get all those sacks by running by guys, he is a smart football player how knows how to defeat a blocker. He does have explosive speed to get around the outside, but he has displayed a great swim move and can spin off blocks well. He does a great job of twisting his body and maintaining balance, and is stronger than you think.

He is the prototype for the 3-4 rush OLB. He will play at 245# in the NFL and will almost certainly put up big sack numbers. He does have to become a better all-around players, as he gets too fast at times and needs to stay home better. He probably should get stronger in his legs.

He also has good character, is smart and is a leader. Few guys come out with less risk. His floor is being a solid player who excels at rushing the QB, his ceiling is being an elite defender.

I think he's a prototype OLB in the NFL, not necessarily a 3-4 rush OLB.

acehole

04-17-2011, 08:04 PM

Don't be mistaken. Von Miller is NOT Aaron Maybin. For one thing Miller wasn't a one year wonder in college. And he's not a one-trick pony in terms of pass rushing moves. Plus he's not 185 lbs dripping wet either.

Would Von MILLER make Mabin a better player? Where does maybin play if at all?

Both would be interesting to see on the field at once.