Gruden's QB Camp: Newton

[Bangarang]

Don't know if you guys have seen this but this is Cam speaking with Gruden. Gruden asks Cam to call a play and Cam freezes and goes on to talk about how he's used to the simplicity of Auburn's offense. You see his face when Gruden was calling out that play? This is what worries me about him.

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6375220

[djjimkelly]

this guy is gonna bust bad i pray its not as a buffalo bill

[Novacane]

I hope he had that same deer in the headlight look when Gailey ran similar scenarios by him.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

I was impressed by his interview. Showed passion

[BuffaloBlitz83]

This kids going to be a pro bowler in 3 years

[Novacane]

This kids going to be a pro bowler in 3 years


:roflmao:

[Philagape]

This kids going to be a pro bowler in 3 years

in the UFL

[djjimkelly]

we should set up a poll

who under 30 wants cam and who doesnt

and who over 30 wants him and who doesnt

because i think most under 30 are clueless enough to let espn and other media outlets manipulate them

i call it the iphone ipad generation clueless kids impressed with shiny toys who never use them for anything meaningful

sort of like cam newton shiny and useless

[X-Era]

we should set up a poll

who under 30 wants cam and who doesnt

and who over 30 wants him and who doesnt

because i think most under 30 are clueless enough to let espn and other media outlets manipulate them

i call it the iphone ipad generation clueless kids impressed with shiny toys who never use them for anything meaningful

sort of like cam newton shiny and uselessThat's age discrimination but since I'm 38, I don't mind that much.

[Prov401]

I'm 22, and I don't want him.

[buffalopowereye]

I just turned 32 and I can't agree more with what you said about the "iGeneration." Wow.

As that comment pertains to quarterbacks . . . It took me until I was about 25 to appreciate the true importance of leadership, confidence, psychology, intelligence, will, etc., on the playing field. I'm on the Fitz bandwagon because we finally have a quarterback the team believes in. I cannot fathom drafting a guy like Newton or even Gabbert to replace him.

[YardRat]

http://cutter.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/box-of-rocks.jpghttp://www.solving-math-problems.com/image-files/sym_greater_than_sign-blue.jpghttp://img.fannation.com/upload/truth_rumor/photo_upload/247/950/full/Cam-Newton.jpg

[we are]

we should set up a poll

who under 30 wants cam and who doesnt

and who over 30 wants him and who doesnt

because i think most under 30 are clueless enough to let espn and other media outlets manipulate them

i call it the iphone ipad generation clueless kids impressed with shiny toys who never use them for anything meaningful

sort of like cam newton shiny and useless

pretty immature post from someone who is trying to make themselves look smarter and more distinguished than younger people.

so you think people only want newton because espn talks about him a lot? you don't think it has anything to do with those 50 touchdowns?

[Ingtar33]

There is a lot in Cam's body language when he's talking to Gruden that sets off every alarm bell in my mind. He won't look Gruden in the eye, he covers his mouth and face when talking about things he claims he did or didn't do; he uses a lot of verbal pauses, and says less when he does form a sentence.

I'm seeing a kid who's inherently dishonest with himself; inherently dishonest with others, and who's not particularly smart.

After seeing that, I wouldn't spend a 3rd round pick on him. He's the type of guy who won't react well to coaching, i could see him growing cold and sullen when Gruden was talking, he clearly doesn't like it when people tell him things he needs to hear, or doesn't want to hear. This is a kid who blames others for his own problems. That's not the mental makeup of a champion.

Listen. you don't need to be a good person to succeed in football. You don't need to be honest, you don't need to be particularly smart either. But you need to be able to hear what you don't like and internalize it, and make the changes necessary to get better. I'm not seeing that there; his terrible gun analogy aside (that was something he was coached to say btw in response to that type of question) i don't think he has the temperament to succeed in the NFL. He might have all the physical talent in the world to do so... but not the temperament. Jimmy Clausen had the same issue in his interview last year with Gruden... Clausen's a more honest kid than Newton and i liked his body language more during the interview, but just like Newton he closed down when he heard something he didn't like. Bad sign.

he might prove me wrong... but i doubt it.


btw: Gruden knew Cam was coached into saying the gun analogy, that's why he interrupted him and asked him to repeat it. I was laughing when he did that because it's what i would have done as well. Whats really pathetic about it is, he's been coached the line, but he really sucked at delivering the line. I mean is that the type of results you can expect from coaching the kid? something halfhearted and unconvincing?

[THE END OF ALL DAYS]

who cares its going to be carolinas problem in 2 weeks

[evol4276]

we should set up a poll

who under 30 wants cam and who doesnt

and who over 30 wants him and who doesnt

because i think most under 30 are clueless enough to let espn and other media outlets manipulate them

i call it the iphone ipad generation clueless kids impressed with shiny toys who never use them for anything meaningful

sort of like cam newton shiny and useless lol i'm under 30 and loathe the idea of having newton

[djjimkelly]

That's age discrimination but since I'm 38, I don't mind that much.



i said most :)

[BuffaloBlitz83]

i said most :)

This coming from the genius that wanted to trade for Tim Couch

[BillsWin]

*sigh* Dumb as a post but man he can throw.

[justasportsfan]

There is a lot in Cam's body language when he's talking to Gruden that sets off every alarm bell in my mind. He won't look Gruden in the eye, he covers his mouth and face when talking about things he claims he did or didn't do; he uses a lot of verbal pauses, and says less when he does form a sentence.

I'm seeing a kid who's inherently dishonest with himself; inherently dishonest with others, and who's not particularly smart.

After seeing that, I wouldn't spend a 3rd round pick on him. He's the type of guy who won't react well to coaching, i could see him growing cold and sullen when Gruden was talking, he clearly doesn't like it when people tell him things he needs to hear, or doesn't want to hear. This is a kid who blames others for his own problems. That's not the mental makeup of a champion.

Listen. you don't need to be a good person to succeed in football. You don't need to be honest, you don't need to be particularly smart either. But you need to be able to hear what you don't like and internalize it, and make the changes necessary to get better. I'm not seeing that there; his terrible gun analogy aside (that was something he was coached to say btw in response to that type of question) i don't think he has the temperament to succeed in the NFL. He might have all the physical talent in the world to do so... but not the temperament. Jimmy Clausen had the same issue in his interview last year with Gruden... Clausen's a more honest kid than Newton and i liked his body language more during the interview, but just like Newton he closed down when he heard something he didn't like. Bad sign.

he might prove me wrong... but i doubt it.


btw: Gruden knew Cam was coached into saying the gun analogy, that's why he interrupted him and asked him to repeat it. I was laughing when he did that because it's what i would have done as well. Whats really pathetic about it is, he's been coached the line, but he really sucked at delivering the line. I mean is that the type of results you can expect from coaching the kid? something halfhearted and unconvincing?

cmon. I'm not high on Cam but I would risk a third on him.

[djjimkelly]

This coming from the genius that wanted to trade for Tim Couch



post facts please

id like to see me make any statement like that

only qb ive been mistaken about is losman and honestly jauron ****ed him over. he still has the best record for a season since bledsoe

when on earth did i ever want an injured qb cast off from the browns

[Mike13]

Ouch, he didnt come off well there.

[SeatownBillsFan21]

He looked lost and uncomfortable had no input at all... a gun really a gun come on Cam...PS im 29 and wouldn't touch this kid PASS

[lordofgun]

There is a lot in Cam's body language when he's talking to Gruden that sets off every alarm bell in my mind. He won't look Gruden in the eye, he covers his mouth and face when talking about things he claims he did or didn't do; he uses a lot of verbal pauses, and says less when he does form a sentence.

I'm seeing a kid who's inherently dishonest with himself; inherently dishonest with others, and who's not particularly smart.

After seeing that, I wouldn't spend a 3rd round pick on him. He's the type of guy who won't react well to coaching, i could see him growing cold and sullen when Gruden was talking, he clearly doesn't like it when people tell him things he needs to hear, or doesn't want to hear. This is a kid who blames others for his own problems. That's not the mental makeup of a champion.

Listen. you don't need to be a good person to succeed in football. You don't need to be honest, you don't need to be particularly smart either. But you need to be able to hear what you don't like and internalize it, and make the changes necessary to get better. I'm not seeing that there; his terrible gun analogy aside (that was something he was coached to say btw in response to that type of question) i don't think he has the temperament to succeed in the NFL. He might have all the physical talent in the world to do so... but not the temperament. Jimmy Clausen had the same issue in his interview last year with Gruden... Clausen's a more honest kid than Newton and i liked his body language more during the interview, but just like Newton he closed down when he heard something he didn't like. Bad sign.

he might prove me wrong... but i doubt it.


btw: Gruden knew Cam was coached into saying the gun analogy, that's why he interrupted him and asked him to repeat it. I was laughing when he did that because it's what i would have done as well. Whats really pathetic about it is, he's been coached the line, but he really sucked at delivering the line. I mean is that the type of results you can expect from coaching the kid? something halfhearted and unconvincing?
He sounded like Obama to me.

[Buddo]

That was quite disturbing as an interview. Did he actually give Gruden a play-call?
Didn't like the hand in front of mouth thing either, but I know next to nothing about body language. Just seemed 'wrong'. Haven't seen any of the other guys interviewed, do that, or anything like it.
Previously, I was of the opinion it could take two years to develop Newton, now I'd say pretty much definitely it will.
Then you have to go through the actual playing learning curve, which would be another 2 years, imho. 1 year of production from the #3 pick, with a huge contract, and wanting another huge contract. Way too risky imho, and not worth it.

I suppose a caveat to all of that, is that as Newton would appear to be a relatively 'blank canvas', if he can learn, then you might get something out of him sooner, but it looks like an awful risk to me.

[Slim]

He sounded like Obama to me.

****ING HILARIOUS.

[Slim]

LOG is kind of like God. Just when you think he's not around anymore, he does something to let you know he's still there.

[Michael82]

Wow! I didn't want the kid before and now I really don't want him. He reminds me of JaMarcus Russell, Jimmy Clausen, and Vince Young mixed together. No thanks! :ill:

[Philagape]

*sigh* Dumb as a post but man he can throw.

And how many times have we seen that?

Not again.

[Spiderweb]

He sounded like Obama to me.

Actually, it was far more Bush like .....

[Oaf]

I think Newton will succeed. I don't think Newton will be a Bill.

I call em' like I see em'.

[Jan Reimers]

Don't NFL personnel people learn from the debacles of JaMarcus Russell and Vince Young?

I guess Newton could be great, but there are plenty of warning signs about his intelligence, maturity and character.

[X-Era]

There is a lot in Cam's body language when he's talking to Gruden that sets off every alarm bell in my mind. He won't look Gruden in the eye, he covers his mouth and face when talking about things he claims he did or didn't do; he uses a lot of verbal pauses, and says less when he does form a sentence.

I'm seeing a kid who's inherently dishonest with himself; inherently dishonest with others, and who's not particularly smart.

After seeing that, I wouldn't spend a 3rd round pick on him. He's the type of guy who won't react well to coaching, i could see him growing cold and sullen when Gruden was talking, he clearly doesn't like it when people tell him things he needs to hear, or doesn't want to hear. This is a kid who blames others for his own problems. That's not the mental makeup of a champion.

Listen. you don't need to be a good person to succeed in football. You don't need to be honest, you don't need to be particularly smart either. But you need to be able to hear what you don't like and internalize it, and make the changes necessary to get better. I'm not seeing that there; his terrible gun analogy aside (that was something he was coached to say btw in response to that type of question) i don't think he has the temperament to succeed in the NFL. He might have all the physical talent in the world to do so... but not the temperament. Jimmy Clausen had the same issue in his interview last year with Gruden... Clausen's a more honest kid than Newton and i liked his body language more during the interview, but just like Newton he closed down when he heard something he didn't like. Bad sign.

he might prove me wrong... but i doubt it.


btw: Gruden knew Cam was coached into saying the gun analogy, that's why he interrupted him and asked him to repeat it. I was laughing when he did that because it's what i would have done as well. Whats really pathetic about it is, he's been coached the line, but he really sucked at delivering the line. I mean is that the type of results you can expect from coaching the kid? something halfhearted and unconvincing?
First off, and not necessarily directed at you Ing, I think we are seeing another example of the same sort of responses. If you were or weren't a fan of a QB at 3, or Newton, your sticking to your stance and this is just another spot to do it.

Not a great interview. I have a different take on it though. I see a kid who is a bit naive and immature. He just doesn't seem to understand yet how he should act. I don't think he's been asked to be a tough-minded and determined leader who has great intensity in everything he does. I think he lacks experience on how to be a professional and how to portray that. He reminds me a bit of a kid with his head in the clouds. It could just be an act. This distant and unfocused way he comes off could be him just putting up a front to all the negative criticism and extending that to all media types. I mean, he certainly doesn't look comfortable or open when he meets with the media. He probably is a bit weary of opening up to them, or being himself due to all the negativity. So it could be a front. He kind of reminds me of guy about to arrive at boot camp. He's got that clueless, immature look about him. I think the important thing is to decide what motivates him. To me he seems to be a good spirited kid who would rather keep his determination to himself. He may not fully know how to be a leader at QB in the NFL yet. But why would that surprise anyone, he hasn't done it yet. I don't see a liar, but I also don't see someone who wants to be open with the media. I don't see a lack of motivation; I don't think he knows how to carry himself or the focus that will be required of him yet. And yes, Peyton Manning is the polar opposite as far as demeanor goes. He's extremely focused and intense. Cam is lighthearted and comes off naive. But, if his drive and determination is there and if he is motivated to succeed, he will. He has the talent. He needs a good coach to teach him how to be a professional, how to act, how to think with intensity, and how to carry himself... Someone like Gailey.

I don't have a problem with a lighthearted guy who lacks maturity as long as he has the motivation to become a focused, intense, quick acting leader on the field. And as I've said over and over, I trust Gailey to teach him what's required as far as his demeanor and his mental approach goes. Gailey is the right guy for this job. "Toughness and discipline". That's the style of Head Coach that Newton needs and that he would get for the Bills. It only doesn't work if the kid just doesn't have the determination to make it work and to learn. I don't think any of us has the information on who Cam really is. That's what's necessary to decide what he will become. So, I think we are then stuck trusting our GM, HC, and Scouts to know what they are doing and see him for who he really is.

To be honest, it won't shock me if they take some other player and admit that they never really wanted him as a Bill. And it won't shock me if they jump to the podium and take him at 3 if he's there. This isn't a talent thing to me. It's about figuring out who the kid really is.

[SabreEleven]

He sounded like Obama to me.

So are we giving Cam Newton the Nobel Peace Prize?

[Novacane]

This isn't a talent thing to me. It's about figuring out who the kid really is.


I think most of us who don't want him would agree with this. He would not be being talked about as a top pick if he was not talented.

[X-Era]

I think most of us who don't want him would agree with this. He would not be being talked about as a top pick if he was not talented.I just can't picture him being a douche who would have a Leaf like implosion. And I also don't see him being Russell and just going through the motions. He may have a tougher time than some as he adapts to learning to be a professional and top notch competitor. But, I think anyone who has handled all the criticism without any melt down should be able to do it.

And as far as a lack of perceived intensity... Off-the-field, guys like Joe Montana, John Elway, and Joe Namath also were a bit more calm and even light-hearted... hell, even Tom Brady comes off like an immature guy with his head in the clouds at times. They certainly aren't like Peyton Manning. Its probably as simple as how much drive a person has to succeed. If they want to be successful, they will be. But it's also one of the most difficult things to predict.

He's the biggest boom or bust in this years draft IMO. I only feel that the teams, not the fans or media, will have the best shot at getting it right.

[DraftBoy]

While I havent seen it yet (its on my DVR) I think comparing Newton to Young and Russell are inaccurate comparisons. Young struggles with a diagnosed mental health condition that Newton has never dealt with and Russell is just plain lazy which is also not an issue Newton has.

While its tough to grade a kid just on an interview, he absolutely had to come off well here and judging by the reactions of those who have seen it both here and at other places he failed to do that.

Ill watch it on Tuesday night and post my thoughts right after it airs.

[Northern Stampede]

He looked absolutely lost and confused without a word to say in response, when Gruden verbalized an NFL play to him and asked for his response... That was scary.... He didn't score any points in my book, thats for sure... REAL bad interview imo...

[alohabillsfan]

Id still take his production, ability and ceiling over Gabbert, but I really would like the Bills to draft defense over either.

[Ingtar33]

While I havent seen it yet (its on my DVR) I think comparing Newton to Young and Russell are inaccurate comparisons. Young struggles with a diagnosed mental health condition that Newton has never dealt with and Russell is just plain lazy which is also not an issue Newton has.

While its tough to grade a kid just on an interview, he absolutely had to come off well here and judging by the reactions of those who have seen it both here and at other places he failed to do that.

Ill watch it on Tuesday night and post my thoughts right after it airs.


I'll give you the short of it. The kid was asked point blank by Gruden 2 questions in the whole interview.

1) The Verbiage in the NFL is complicated... give me an example of a complicated playcall at auburn. Call me a play.
greeted by - dead silence... then nervous laugh... then ummm... then... ummm... then more silence... then Cam finally saying... "uuuhhhh.. you really put me on the spot." This whole time he wasn't even facing John... he turned his whole head away from him and was staring at the ceiling, or a tv or something off screen.

Gruden tries to help him out after letting him flauder for 15 seconds by saying something to the effect of "you didn't really have that type of system did you? you're going to have problems with the verbiage in the nfl... (he then spews out a playcall as an example, cam's eyes glaze over, and he lowers his head and sorta moves his pen on his notepad, but it couldn't possibly be to write anything gruden is saying... a word or two at most and he closes down while gruden tries to bail him out of the non-answer...

2) Gruden asks him about all the doubters and naysayers and nasty rumors. Cam covers his mouth and looks away, then covers his face while replying about how he doesn't let it bother him, and it's just ammo for a gun

(a coached phrase, that's pretty much one of a number of popular phrases which are supposed to denote an A type personality in an interview; it would have been the same as saying something like "it's like chum to a shark" or "meat for a wolf" or something along those lines... the key is to this "psychological" answer is to compare yourself to a powerful image or predator... fuel for an f15 would have been the same; the problem is, Type A personalities will look you in the face, in the eye when saying it, and won't stumble over the phrase... it also was so apropos to use for that question it was a COACHED answer. But he stumbles the answer, staggers about fumbles it badly, and never even is able to deliver the line clearly, even when gruden gave him a second chance)

So he's asked 2 real questions in the whole interview, the first one he isn't even able to string a coherent sentence together to answer, and the second he covers his face and spits out a badly rehearsed and unconvincing line to a question i guarantee he's had to field with every team that's interviewed him.

OK, set that stuff aside.


Lets say you don't buy the body language or coached answer for meaning anything. That's fair. Lets give him the benefit of the doubt and say he's nervous or distrustful and intimidated by Gruden, the Great Pumpkin and Mel Kiper's hair.

No answer to "give me an example of a playcall at auburn; call me a play"?

Seriously? I wouldn't accept that type of no answer out of a RB let alone a QB.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I love Gruden. He's so no-nonsense and I love how he doesn't walk on eggshells around these QBs. I've seen his QB camp with Dalton and Mallet so far, but haven't seen the Newton one yet.

Sounds like it only confirms what I feel about Newton all along.

[Mr. Miyagi]

No answer to "give me an example of a playcall at auburn; call me a play"?

Seriously? I wouldn't accept that type of no answer out of a RB let alone a QB.
Both Andy Dalton and even the supposedly borderline ******ed Ryan Mallet gave playcalls off the cuff in their interviews that I saw.

Newton is garbage.

[Lexwhat]

Here's the one with Blaine Gabbert... opinions?

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6381541

[DraftBoy]

I'll give you the short of it. The kid was asked point blank by Gruden 2 questions in the whole interview.

1) The Verbiage in the NFL is complicated... give me an example of a complicated playcall at auburn. Call me a play.
greeted by - dead silence... then nervous laugh... then ummm... then... ummm... then more silence... then Cam finally saying... "uuuhhhh.. you really put me on the spot." This whole time he wasn't even facing John... he turned his whole head away from him and was staring at the ceiling, or a tv or something off screen.

Gruden tries to help him out after letting him flauder for 15 seconds by saying something to the effect of "you didn't really have that type of system did you? you're going to have problems with the verbiage in the nfl... (he then spews out a playcall as an example, cam's eyes glaze over, and he lowers his head and sorta moves his pen on his notepad, but it couldn't possibly be to write anything gruden is saying... a word or two at most and he closes down while gruden tries to bail him out of the non-answer...

2) Gruden asks him about all the doubters and naysayers and nasty rumors. Cam covers his mouth and looks away, then covers his face while replying about how he doesn't let it bother him, and it's just ammo for a gun

(a coached phrase, that's pretty much one of a number of popular phrases which are supposed to denote an A type personality in an interview; it would have been the same as saying something like "it's like chum to a shark" or "meat for a wolf" or something along those lines... the key is to this "psychological" answer is to compare yourself to a powerful image or predator... fuel for an f15 would have been the same; the problem is, Type A personalities will look you in the face, in the eye when saying it, and won't stumble over the phrase... it also was so apropos to use for that question it was a COACHED answer. But he stumbles the answer, staggers about fumbles it badly, and never even is able to deliver the line clearly, even when gruden gave him a second chance)

So he's asked 2 real questions in the whole interview, the first one he isn't even able to string a coherent sentence together to answer, and the second he covers his face and spits out a badly rehearsed and unconvincing line to a question i guarantee he's had to field with every team that's interviewed him.

OK, set that stuff aside.


Lets say you don't buy the body language or coached answer for meaning anything. That's fair. Lets give him the benefit of the doubt and say he's nervous or distrustful and intimidated by Gruden, the Great Pumpkin and Mel Kiper's hair.

No answer to "give me an example of a playcall at auburn; call me a play"?

Seriously? I wouldn't accept that type of no answer out of a RB let alone a QB.

I believe you and let me state this, I have lots of questions about Cam's ability to translate. Im dont buy into the off the field stuff that many have because Ive done my own research and have found out most of it is not in fact true, or at least not entirely true. But his ability to transition from the simplified Guz Malzahn offense (that only truly used 30-40% of the playbook) to a complete NFL offense is a massive question mark for me.

[X-Era]

Here's the one with Blaine Gabbert... opinions?

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6381541I can give you a preview of what people will think... No minds will change.

[ChristopherWalken]

There is a lot in Cam's body language when he's talking to Gruden that sets off every alarm bell in my mind. He won't look Gruden in the eye, he covers his mouth and face when talking about things he claims he did or didn't do; he uses a lot of verbal pauses, and says less when he does form a sentence.

I'm seeing a kid who's inherently dishonest with himself; inherently dishonest with others, and who's not particularly smart.

After seeing that, I wouldn't spend a 3rd round pick on him. He's the type of guy who won't react well to coaching, i could see him growing cold and sullen when Gruden was talking, he clearly doesn't like it when people tell him things he needs to hear, or doesn't want to hear. This is a kid who blames others for his own problems. That's not the mental makeup of a champion.

Listen. you don't need to be a good person to succeed in football. You don't need to be honest, you don't need to be particularly smart either. But you need to be able to hear what you don't like and internalize it, and make the changes necessary to get better. I'm not seeing that there; his terrible gun analogy aside (that was something he was coached to say btw in response to that type of question) i don't think he has the temperament to succeed in the NFL. He might have all the physical talent in the world to do so... but not the temperament. Jimmy Clausen had the same issue in his interview last year with Gruden... Clausen's a more honest kid than Newton and i liked his body language more during the interview, but just like Newton he closed down when he heard something he didn't like. Bad sign.

he might prove me wrong... but i doubt it.


btw: Gruden knew Cam was coached into saying the gun analogy, that's why he interrupted him and asked him to repeat it. I was laughing when he did that because it's what i would have done as well. Whats really pathetic about it is, he's been coached the line, but he really sucked at delivering the line. I mean is that the type of results you can expect from coaching the kid? something halfhearted and unconvincing?

Great post.

So is the hype being generated from the media, or is this kid being pumped up by certain NFL teams around the league to inflate interest and lower other prospects on the Big Boards?

Also, why does he keep agreeing to these "promos" if all it does is expose his weaknesses? Seems like if he really had something to hide he would be more protective of the bluff.

[Bill Cody]

Both Andy Dalton and even the supposedly borderline ******ed Ryan Mallet gave playcalls off the cuff in their interviews that I saw.

Newton is garbage.

I'd love to hook Gailey up to a lie detector right now and ask him about Newton. He had the kid in for an all day grilling. Now that would mean something to me. The fact that Newton played in a "one read and run if it isn't there offense" for 1 season should not be a news flash to anyone. Why that translates to "he's garbage" fro not knowing any complicated plays is baffling to me, why should he know any? Maybe he is immature, dumb, dishonest I don't know. But I'd like to know what Chan/Buddy really think I really would. These arm chair shrinks/scouts on this board make me laugh.

[baalworship]

I think a lot of what I am hearing is pop psychology. He was watching film so he wasn't going to be staring at Gruden every second as they spoke. The fact is that Newton is smarter than Marino was when he came out.

It's nice when a quarterback is also smart but much more important is pocket presence, accuracy, and work ethic.

All of those areas I like Newton.

The one issue I had was he seemed a little bit too worried about criticism. He better learn it's going to get a lot worse than a few draft guys writing mean things on a website. It can be an entire city down on you if you come out of the gate slow.

He's young and this is not necessarily a fatal flaw but something he needs to work on.

[Bill Cody]

I think a lot of what I am hearing is pop psychology. He was watching film so he wasn't going to be staring at Gruden every second as they spoke. The fact is that Newton is smarter than Marino was when he came out.

It's nice when a quarterback is also smart but much more important is pocket presence, accuracy, and work ethic.

All of those areas I like Newton.

The one issue I had was he seemed a little bit too worried about criticism. He better learn it's going to get a lot worse than a few draft guys writing mean things on a website. It can be an entire city down on you if you come out of the gate slow.

He's young and this is not necessarily a fatal flaw but something he needs to work on.

I think it's very important for Newton to not have to play right away. Sit at least a full season, maybe 2. As Bill Parcells used to say "he doesn't even know what he doesn't know" at this point. It will take a lot of time and effort by coaches and the player for him to have a chance to succeed. But if he has the brains and the work ethic he will, the sky is really the limit in that case.

[X-Era]

Here's the one with Blaine Gabbert... opinions?

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6381541Mind if I fork it out?

[cookie G]

Here's the one with Blaine Gabbert... opinions?

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6381541

Gabbert doesn't fail due to a white board session.

He fails for other reasons.

[Novacane]

He could not/would not give a simple play call from Auburn. WTF...he's either dumb
or an *******. This is probably what he wanted to say but knew how dumb he'd sound.


Gruden...Cam, give me an example of a play call at Auburn


Cam........... Uh Uh Uh.......Uh, everyone go deep and I'll run if you're not open. :rolleyes:



If you're a Cam fan and that interview does not concern you you're crazy.
He's going to be a huge bust. I'd bet real money on it. Stay away Buffalo! Please!!!!!!

[YardRat]

lol..."36". What a maroon.

[Mr. Miyagi]

lol..."36". What a maroon.
36 what? I guess I'll have to watch the show first?

[YardRat]

36 what? I guess I'll have to watch the show first?

I watched it yesterday, but in response to play calling Newton answered "They'd hold up a '36' on the sideline, and that was the play" or something to that effect.

[Extremebillsfan247]

This kids going to be a pro bowler in 3 years
It really depends on the team he goes to. He will definitely be drafted in the top 5 this year. He is going to need a HC with patience, and more importantly an OC that can take a complicated offense and simplify the terminology for him until he becomes more fluent with how things are done at the pro level. His talent is definitely superb though. If he goes to a team that gives him those 2 things, I think he will be a pro bowler. In fact, he could turn out to be one of the better QBs of the next decade. That would make a lot of Bills fans angry especially if we had a chance at drafting him and picked someone else because of how simple his offense was at Auburn. This wouldn't be the first year the Bills may possibly have a chance at drafting a great player and passed on him. It seems to happen to this team virtually every year. lol

[Extremebillsfan247]

I watched it yesterday, but in response to play calling Newton answered "They'd hold up a '36' on the sideline, and that was the play" or something to that effect.
Basically everyone on the offense gets the play from the sidelines so they never really have to get into a huddle. It's pretty common at the college level these days.

[trapezeus]

This kids going to be a pro bowler in 3 years

as in a guy who bowls professionally? I'll buy that.

[methos4ever]

Basically everyone on the offense gets the play from the sidelines so they never really have to get into a huddle. It's pretty common at the college level these days.


While that is true, most players in those sorts of offenses can at least say "36 in this offense is this concept, a midline with a pre-snap motion into the backfield by the slot and bubble to the field option on x sound" and go through what that would look like on the board, showing Gruden what he's supposed to do.

Part of this is also the magic of editing - and don't discount that as a factor in this video clip as well.

[trapezeus]

I haven't seen the gruden series, but i've heard good things about it last year.

is this a typical question that he asks recruits? If so, warren Moon's advice and prep for his client sucks.

The fact that X-era, the real defender to INGTar's point, concedes that the guy needs more time is a worry to me. The bills need impact players early. With as many glaring holes on the defense and very shallow depth on the OL, we can't wait for guy who doesn't even know what the calls are when he knows that question is coming.

I really hope billsnation is more than 50% anti- Cam because i would hate for ralph to draft him solely as a marketing gimmick and then get rewarded with people buying his jersey en masse.

[methos4ever]

I haven't seen the gruden series, but i've heard good things about it last year.

is this a typical question that he asks recruits? If so, warren Moon's advice and prep for his client sucks.

The fact that X-era, the real defender to INGTar's point, concedes that the guy needs more time is a worry to me. The bills need impact players early. With as many glaring holes on the defense and very shallow depth on the OL, we can't wait for guy who doesn't even know what the calls are when he knows that question is coming.

I really hope billsnation is more than 50% anti- Cam because i would hate for ralph to draft him solely as a marketing gimmick and then get rewarded with people buying his jersey en masse.
Yeah Trapezeus, he usually has a player put up his favorite play or a play they've discussed (positive or negative) on the board. On the clip, since they didn't get to it, I only hope he had the chance to do so as well..

[Philagape]

as in a guy who bowls professionally? I'll buy that.

He'd have the fastest walk-up in the history of the PBA, but he's take off and run if he doesn't like his first look at the pins.

[BertSquirtgum]

It really depends on the team he goes to. He will definitely be drafted in the top 5 this year. He is going to need a HC with patience, and more importantly an OC that can take a complicated offense and simplify the terminology for him until he becomes more fluent with how things are done at the pro level. His talent is definitely superb though. If he goes to a team that gives him those 2 things, I think he will be a pro bowler. In fact, he could turn out to be one of the better QBs of the next decade. That would make a lot of Bills fans angry especially if we had a chance at drafting him and picked someone else because of how simple his offense was at Auburn. This wouldn't be the first year the Bills may possibly have a chance at drafting a great player and passed on him. It seems to happen to this team virtually every year. lol

you're fooling yourself there.

[X-Era]

I haven't seen the gruden series, but i've heard good things about it last year.

is this a typical question that he asks recruits? If so, warren Moon's advice and prep for his client sucks.

The fact that X-era, the real defender to INGTar's point, concedes that the guy needs more time is a worry to me. The bills need impact players early. With as many glaring holes on the defense and very shallow depth on the OL, we can't wait for guy who doesn't even know what the calls are when he knows that question is coming.

I really hope billsnation is more than 50% anti- Cam because i would hate for ralph to draft him solely as a marketing gimmick and then get rewarded with people buying his jersey en masse.I don't think it's a worry to a team that can develop him. The Bills are in better shape than others that need a QB. They can give him time to learn. Overall, it's just another situation where it's levels of gray, not black and white. Newton may develop just fine and be ready in a year. Or, he may never develop. But really that applies to every QB prospect. I will say that Newton does not appear as strong on the mental side as some.

[Northern Stampede]

After watching the Gruden interview with Mallet, I am completely convinced, that although Newton may be a physical specimen, he has a LONG way to go mentally to prepare and play at the NFL level, based on that video. I mean I coach QB's at the 15 - 17 age level here in Ontario, and I think some of our verbiage would confound Newton, after watching that video. Mallet looked much more confident in breaking down his reads on the whiteboard and translating what he was attempting to achieve with the play that he was explaining. Newton didn't come anywhere near close to how I would think an NCAA QB should think and prepare... Based on that interview. He didn't show me ANYTHING.... Like I said, physically he has the tools, but I question whether mentally he is ready for the bigs yet. If he does end up developing into an NFL QB, I think it is going to take some time... Upwards of two seasons or more, just learning the pro systems...

[Extremebillsfan247]

you're fooling yourself there.
Am I? How many good players has this team passed on just in the last 5 drafts let alone the last 10?

[mrbojanglezs]

we should set up a poll

who under 30 wants cam and who doesnt

and who over 30 wants him and who doesnt

because i think most under 30 are clueless enough to let espn and other media outlets manipulate them

i call it the iphone ipad generation clueless kids impressed with shiny toys who never use them for anything meaningful

sort of like cam newton shiny and useless

what are you trying to prove here that old people are risk averse or that young people are dumb and immature.

Pretty stupid comment

[Mike13]

Mallet impressed the most out of all the QB's on the whiteboard so far.

[methos4ever]

Full Newton ep is on in full on ESPNU right now. That clip really went a little bit longer, and they trimmed a little out of it. Not much, just a little flubbing by Cam. Though Cam did do a good job of explaining Malzahn expects perfect execution on their quick snap plays....

I did like how he was confident mentioning it takes a different type of cat to get the ball, have the opponent know you're getting the ball in short yardage at QB and still score.

He also does chalk talk and does a great job (IMO) of breaking down his favorite play vs 1-high, as well as an unbalanced line red zone play Auburn used.

The show finished up with the on field throws, but to me something that was interesting was that he admitted that he did attempt to score in the National Championship when they had called for a kneel down as rumored. I didn't like the fact that even now he defended the decision with "as a student and a fan of the game, being that close I had to try."

[Thief]

There is a lot in Cam's body language when he's talking to Gruden that sets off every alarm bell in my mind. He won't look Gruden in the eye, he covers his mouth and face when talking about things he claims he did or didn't do; he uses a lot of verbal pauses, and says less when he does form a sentence.

I'm seeing a kid who's inherently dishonest with himself; inherently dishonest with others, and who's not particularly smart.

After seeing that, I wouldn't spend a 3rd round pick on him. He's the type of guy who won't react well to coaching, i could see him growing cold and sullen when Gruden was talking, he clearly doesn't like it when people tell him things he needs to hear, or doesn't want to hear. This is a kid who blames others for his own problems. That's not the mental makeup of a champion.

Listen. you don't need to be a good person to succeed in football. You don't need to be honest, you don't need to be particularly smart either. But you need to be able to hear what you don't like and internalize it, and make the changes necessary to get better. I'm not seeing that there; his terrible gun analogy aside (that was something he was coached to say btw in response to that type of question) i don't think he has the temperament to succeed in the NFL. He might have all the physical talent in the world to do so... but not the temperament. Jimmy Clausen had the same issue in his interview last year with Gruden... Clausen's a more honest kid than Newton and i liked his body language more during the interview, but just like Newton he closed down when he heard something he didn't like. Bad sign.

he might prove me wrong... but i doubt it.


btw: Gruden knew Cam was coached into saying the gun analogy, that's why he interrupted him and asked him to repeat it. I was laughing when he did that because it's what i would have done as well. Whats really pathetic about it is, he's been coached the line, but he really sucked at delivering the line. I mean is that the type of results you can expect from coaching the kid? something halfhearted and unconvincing?IMO, there is merit to what you are saying. However, was it a lesson or an interview? Were we expecting him to whip out with a notepad and pen? Start learning right there? Focus on his negatives? Or, keep it moving and stay positive?

Also, I don't think he changed his analogy. I think he just reworded it. I guess I just think you're overanalying it. No offense. I guess this is the time of year for it.

[Ingtar33]

IMO, there is merit to what you are saying. However, was it a lesson or an interview? Were we expecting him to whip out with a notepad and pen? Start learning right there? Focus on his negatives? Or, keep it moving and stay positive?

Also, I don't think he changed his analogy. I think he just reworded it. I guess I just think you're overanalying it. No offense. I guess this is the time of year for it.


I don't think he needs a pen and paper for an interview with John Gruden unless he plans to address what gruden is talking about and sound intelligent doing so (jake locker used the paper to do just this).

it's being recorded and that's largely just marketing gimmicks/pr by his agent; unless the kid is going to actually use it.

That said; look at the Andy Dalton interview. The kid was eating up everything gruden had to say. he has a passion for football, a drive to know more; he might never have the physical acumen to succeed in the nfl... but i loved the kid's attitude, and would love to have him in the locker room.


Sidenote: The BG interview was underwhelming. Not really any red flags but, while i don't really know what's going on in his head, he doesn't seem to have passion for the game.

[better days]

I don't think it's a worry to a team that can develop him. The Bills are in better shape than others that need a QB. They can give him time to learn. Overall, it's just another situation where it's levels of gray, not black and white. Newton may develop just fine and be ready in a year. Or, he may never develop. But really that applies to every QB prospect. I will say that Newton does not appear as strong on the mental side as some.

I have said it a long time ago. Newton is either LAZY or STUPID. To get caught cheating 3 times while at Florida, a person has to be one or the other.......or both.

We all know about the easy class load football players at a football powerhouse like Florida can take as well as the dedicated tutors that are assigned to them. To not only cheat, but to get caught doing so 3 times is IMO inexcusable. Too lazy to do the work & too stupid to cheat without getting caught. I hope to God Newton is not drafted by the Bills.

[djjimkelly]

I watched it yesterday, but in response to play calling Newton answered "They'd hold up a '36' on the sideline, and that was the play" or something to that effect.


anyone who isnt concerned by this just doesnt get it

great athlete but this guy will never be a real nfl qb

[jamze132]

That's age discrimination but since I'm 38, I don't mind that much.
You also have a love affair with Tom Brady as you seem to immortalize him when he is at his gayest.

[X-Era]

You also have a love affair with Tom Brady as you seem to immortalize him when he is at his gayest.Now your just goading me into an implosion... everyone knows how much I despise that dude. :D:

[jamze132]

Now your just goading me into an implosion... everyone knows how much I love that dude. :D:

I know... I know.

[trapezeus]

I don't think it's a worry to a team that can develop him. The Bills are in better shape than others that need a QB. They can give him time to learn. Overall, it's just another situation where it's levels of gray, not black and white. Newton may develop just fine and be ready in a year. Or, he may never develop. But really that applies to every QB prospect. I will say that Newton does not appear as strong on the mental side as some.

i get what you are saying, but the team was 4-12 with 11 years of missing the playoffs. They have neither the time nor ability to coach up a player not ready to contribute.

[BertSquirtgum]

tom brady is my hero. i wish i could cry like him.

[ChristopherWalken]

I thought it would be interesting to see how Gruden grilled some of the QB class last year and how well they responded.

McCoy: This cracked me up! http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=5086484

Bradford: I think he did very well but take notice of some of Sam's body language. http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=5074305

Tebow: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=5080617

You know, if we were to judge everything based solely on one interview, Tebow looks the best of the 3 above. I'd also say that McCoy seems to have a whiny sense to him. He seems easliy rattled as Gruden is firing questions to him. But he also shakes it quickly and laughs it off.

I don't think any of us could have predicted the season Bradford produced based on this interview.

[Mr. Miyagi]

These Gruden episodes are great. You get a good look at a player with a real coach who doesn't sugarcoat much. After watching the Mallet episode I definitely dislike him a bit less, and came away a lot more impressed with Dalton and Locker. So it goes to show that my mind can be changed and that I'm not stubborn at my position on a player.

But the Cam Newton episode did nothing but further convince me that he has nothing upstairs. He is freaky atheletic, no doubt about that, but he came across super shallow and empty in the head. He can't answer simple and direct questions with straight answers. He can't articulate his thoughts even when he tries, and it always comes up jumbled and incomprehensible. When he does try to string sentences together, they are full of filler phrases and cliches, and cannot focus on a single message without going all over the place and end up making no sense at all. He tries to get by with his charm far too much, and jokes around too much when he needs to be giving serious answers to legitimate questions.

If I met a person that behaves like this in my life, my impression would be that he is shallow, stupid, unreliable, immature, and untrustworthy. I would not want to be associated with this person whatsoever.

And that's what I got out of the Newton QB camp show.

[TigerJ]

Newton is not my choice and I'm almost double 30. I am not an expert in body language and would not try and second guess what Ingtar observed about the interview. The thing that concerns me is how much of a learning curve he's got to deal with. Teaching him the mental aspect of the game would be like having to teach TigerJ the mental aspect of playing QB in the NFL. I guarantee I'm smarter than Newton, but I wouldn't want to project when I'd be mentally ready to step on the field assuming I had the physical abilities.

[Bangarang]

http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2011/04/cam_newton_flunks_camp_gruden.php

Hilarious article on Newton's segment with Gruden. I laughed pretty good at some of this stuff.

[trapezeus]

do you think the underarmor people are getting nervous yet? if he doesn't go #1, that shouldn't hurt their sales too much. but if he goes to a team where he will start this year, i'm guessing a marketing rep might go down.

[Mr. Miyagi]

http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2011/04/cam_newton_flunks_camp_gruden.php

Hilarious article on Newton's segment with Gruden. I laughed pretty good at some of this stuff.
:rofl: As if I said it myself!!! Excellent!!

[tatersalad]

http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2011/04/cam_newton_flunks_camp_gruden.php

Hilarious article on Newton's segment with Gruden. I laughed pretty good at some of this stuff.



great read

[Philagape]

What's the issue here??? All the Bills have to do is run Play 36 every time. Winning.

[stuckincincy]

Newton is not my choice and I'm almost double 30. I am not an expert in body language and would not try and second guess what Ingtar observed about the interview. The thing that concerns me is how much of a learning curve he's got to deal with. Teaching him the mental aspect of the game would be like having to teach TigerJ the mental aspect of playing QB in the NFL. I guarantee I'm smarter than Newton, but I wouldn't want to project when I'd be mentally ready to step on the field assuming I had the physical abilities.

I've been touting TCU's Dalton. I'm certainly no scout, but what I've seen of him, made me think that he's a perceptive college qb that sees the field.

[Mr. Miyagi]

What's the issue here??? All the Bills have to do is run Play 36 every time. Winning.
:chuckle:

[Philagape]

This had more plays than Cam Newton's offense:

http://s5.thisnext.com/media/largest_dimension/70695F6C.jpg

[Philagape]

Here's a preview of Cam Newton 2011 NCAA Football:

http://www.techliberation.com/wp-content/uploads/media/images/Atari%20Football.jpg

[Extremebillsfan247]

This had more plays than Cam Newton's offense:

http://s5.thisnext.com/media/largest_dimension/70695F6C.jpg
Didn't Alabama lose to Auburn in 2010? lol Newton threw for what? like 200 something yards and 3 tds, plus 1 on the ground? Not bad for a QB with limited experience, with a limited playbook, lousy receivers, all with Dareus and Alabama having a 24-7 lead at the half huh? I wonder what that says for Dareus? He and Alabama's defense threw everything they had at Newton, and he still found a way to bring his team back and win it. Maybe Newton just isn't a smooth talker. But I think Dareus would be the first to tell you that Newton can play some QB. He witnessed it first hand. Just saying, I wouldn't put too much stock in that Gruden interview.

[psubills62]

I didn't watch the Newton segment, so I appreciated some of the comments and summaries.

I have to say, I did watch a short clip of Gruden's talk with Mallett. Just watching it made me uncomfortable...but then again, I'm an engineer and not used to doing my job in front of thousands/millions of people. One thing I noticed with Mallett was that he said "Yes sir" a lot, and more in an irritated way than respectful manner. Mallett just looked pissed and was trying his best not to show it.

Nothing that's been said about Newton (especially by Ingtar) has surprised me. Most of this stuff were negatives about him long before Gruden's interview with him. Thankfully he'll be going #1 overall and we won't have a chance to see what happens with him in Buffalo.

[Philagape]

Didn't Alabama lose to Auburn in 2010? lol Newton threw for what? like 200 something yards and 3 tds, plus 1 on the ground? Not bad for a QB with limited experience, with a limited playbook, lousy receivers, all with Dareus and Alabama having a 24-7 lead at the half huh? I wonder what that says for Dareus? He and Alabama's defense threw everything they had at Newton, and he still found a way to bring his team back and win it. Maybe Newton just isn't a smooth talker. But I think Dareus would be the first to tell you that Newton can play some QB. He witnessed it first hand. Just saying, I wouldn't put too much stock in that Gruden interview.

The Gruden interview just confirms what many suspected anyway. That Newton is a sandlot player. He may be the greatest sandlot player of all time, which works in college but means jack $#!+ in the NFL.
(and what that says about Dareus is that there are 10 other players on the defense. What a great point you made!)

[BertSquirtgum]

I didn't watch the Newton segment, so I appreciated some of the comments and summaries.

I have to say, I did watch a short clip of Gruden's talk with Mallett. Just watching it made me uncomfortable...but then again, I'm an engineer and not used to doing my job in front of thousands/millions of people. One thing I noticed with Mallett was that he said "Yes sir" a lot, and more in an irritated way than respectful manner. Mallett just looked pissed and was trying his best not to show it.

Nothing that's been said about Newton (especially by Ingtar) has surprised me. Most of this stuff were negatives about him long before Gruden's interview with him. Thankfully he'll be going #1 overall and we won't have a chance to see what happens with him in Buffalo.
i watched it and i don't think he was pissed at all. to me he sounded just like all the other rebel southern boys, quick short answers.

[Extremebillsfan247]

The Gruden interview just confirms what many suspected anyway. That Newton is a sandlot player. He may be the greatest sandlot player of all time, which works in college but means jack $#!+ in the NFL.
(and what that says about Dareus is that there are 10 other players on the defense. What a great point you made!)
It was good enough to beat Dareus, take Auburn to an undefeated season, (something Dareus couldn't do for Alabama) , win SEC player of the year, Heisman trophy over second place runner up Andrew Luck by over 1200 votes, and a National championship for starters. 2854 yards passing, 66.1 completion percentage, 30 tds, 1473 yards rushing, 20 tds on the ground, 42 yards receiving and a td catch, only 7 ints., no fumbles while rushing, and a QB rating of 182.05. That's some year for a sandlot QB.

[Philagape]

After all the college stars who flamed out in the NFL, why do people talk about college accomplishments as if they're relevant?

[Philagape]

The fact that Newton did what he did while getting play "36" from the sideline illustrates the chasm between college and the NFL, and why you can take all those numbers, throw them on the floor and pee on them. They mean absolutely nothing. The NFL is practically a whole 'nother sport.

[Extremebillsfan247]

After all the college stars who flamed out in the NFL, why do people talk about college accomplishments as if they're relevant?
They are relevant when it comes to drafting.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Here's a preview of Cam Newton 2011 NCAA Football:

http://www.techliberation.com/wp-content/uploads/media/images/Atari%20Football.jpg
Is that Play 36 or the 1-High?

[methos4ever]

To be fair to Newton though, while he himself did not help himself explaining the intricate nature of the "simple" offense Malzahn runs, I think this article might help explain it. I like Smart Football because the author typically is not very biased towards a player and rather discusses scheme:

http://smartfootball.com/quarterbacking/did-cam-newton-play-in-a-one-read-passing-offense-at-auburn


Thus in this case, it might not actually be inaccurate to say that Newton had only a “single read,” but it’s also a bit misleading. Indeed, many NFL quarterbacks only have a “single read” if this is the definition, though they might have some other read or key telling them which single read to focus on. But, while I think this “single read” was sometimes the case, I think more likely Gus used the progression read, giving Cam the typical suite of “reads”: one, two, three, throw-it-away/run.

Chris Petersen of Boise State once set forth his view of a quarterback’s development as follows:

1. Strict progression. Tell him to read first receiver, second receiver, and then third receiver — and then run like hell if they aren’t open. In Petersen’s view, if they don’t know anything else they can know, by rote memory, who they are supposed to throw to. This doesn’t require them to have any advance knowledge of the defense and it is where every quarterback begins.
2. Progression with coverage keys. The same progression concept as above except that the progression and sequence of receivers is determined by what the defense is doing. How many safeties are there? What kind of leverage are you getting from the cornerbacks? Is it a blitz? Is it man or zone? Once you’ve determined that, it’s one-two-three.
3. Coverage reads. This is the advanced NFL stuff: Tom Brady sees the defense doing X, so he looks one way and then rifles it back to the receiver he always knew he was going to because he understood the coverage, he understood the technique the defense was playing, and he understood the theory of the play he was running. There are few, if any, college quarterbacks who ever do this kind of thing.

I think Petersen explained it well. Good college quarterbacks should be at level two: They should be able to come to the sideline after a mistake and explain why they threw it to a guy, and what they saw. They should be able to draw the pass play on the whiteboard but also describe the coverages and tell you why a play should get open, and they should be able to enjoy some freedom to determine their progression.This is also how Gus teaches it.

[Figster]

Championship caliber NFL HC/ Jon Gruden seemed in awe of Cam Newton's athletic abilities and I'm becoming more and more convinced Newton detractors see what they want to see.

Even Bo Knows...

[Lexwhat]

Mind if I fork it out?

No problem.

[Philagape]

Championship caliber NFL HC/ Jon Gruden seemed in awe of Cam Newton's athletic abilities and I'm becoming more and more convinced Newton detractors see what they want to see.

Even Bo Knows...

Do you really think athletic ability is all it takes to be an NFL QB?

If so, that's astounding. I cannot believe someone who follows football, and especially the Bills, could possibly think that.

[Figster]

Do you really think athletic ability is all it takes to be an NFL QB?

If so, that's astounding. I cannot believe someone who follows football, and especially the Bills, could possibly think that.


Its astounding to me that you could draw your own conclusions about what I'm thinking based on one post, seriously?

lol

[Philagape]

Its astounding to me that you could draw your own conclusions about what I'm thinking based on one post, seriously?

lol

One post???

You're practically Cam Newton's agent. If one printed out your pro-Cam posts, it would outweigh his playbook many times over.

[Figster]

One post???

You're practically Cam Newton's agent. If one printed out your pro-Cam posts, it would outweigh his playbook many times over.


Did I ever say/post that Cam Newtons intelligence is of zero consequence?

I don't believe I did so whats your point?

[Philagape]

Did I ever say/post that Cam Newtons intelligence is of zero consequence?

I don't believe I did so whats your point?

Because that's the only way one can be so in love with him.

As an NFL prospect, one cannot tout his intelligence as a plus. It must be discounted to believe in him.

[Bill Cody]

The fact that Newton did what he did while getting play "36" from the sideline illustrates the chasm between college and the NFL, and why you can take all those numbers, throw them on the floor and pee on them. They mean absolutely nothing. The NFL is practically a whole 'nother sport.

Ok. So how are we supposed to judge these guys? Have 'em all interview with Gruden and call it a day? Don't our eyeballs tell us anything? Granted college football is far from NFL quality but they are playing football, right? Or is the combine more important than production in college? Not sure many scouts would agree to pee on all those college numbers, that's like saying "who gives a **** what you got in Algebra 1 this is Algebra 2".

[Bill Cody]

Because that's the only way one can be so in love with him.

As an NFL prospect, one cannot tout his intelligence as a plus. It must be discounted to believe in him.

The only thing I know for sure about Newton is he's a project. I'd be the first to agree he's years away from excelling at the NFL level. But give me your evidence that he's NOT intelligent? He did ok on the Wonderlic. Is he inexperienced? yes. Given time can he learn an NFL offense? I don't know but there's a good chance yes, I'd like to ask Chan Gailey that question. But you don't know either. And if he can, he has a chance to be an elite player. How do I know? My eyeballs told me.

[Philagape]

Ok. So how are we supposed to judge these guys? Have 'em all interview with Gruden and call it a day? Don't our eyeballs tell us anything? Granted college football is far from NFL quality but they are playing football, right? Or is the combine more important than production in college? Not sure many scouts would agree to pee on all those college numbers, that's like saying "who gives a **** what you got in Algebra 1 this is Algebra 2".

The NFL is more like calculus.
Like I said earlier, the Gruden thing was just confirmation of sentiments that were already out there, which come from several factors, including the eyeball test. No new ground was broken here.

[Philagape]

The only thing I know for sure about Newton is he's a project. I'd be the first to agree he's years away from excelling at the NFL level. But give me your evidence that he's NOT intelligent? He did ok on the Wonderlic. Is he inexperienced? yes. Given time can he learn an NFL offense? I don't know but there's a good chance yes, I'd like to ask Chan Gailey that question. But you don't know either. And if he can, he has a chance to be an elite player. How do I know? My eyeballs told me.

If he's to be a candidate for third overall, the burden of proof must be on him to show some signs that he is intelligent (and I mean field intelligence, not anything that can be measured on paper sitting at a desk). It's the most important aspect of the position, so we cannot just hope he someday gets it. There must be evidence of football IQ, or no deal.

[Bill Cody]

If he's to be a candidate for third overall, the burden of proof must be on him to show some signs that he is intelligent (and I mean field intelligence, not anything that can be measured on paper sitting at a desk). It's the most important aspect of the position, so we cannot just hope he someday gets it. There must be evidence of football IQ, or no deal.

Fact: He's not just a candidate for 3rd he's a candidate for 1st overall and if he isn't taken in the first 3 he'd go 4th or 5th or 8th or 10th or 12th all based on his incredible potential. I'm not sure what you're looking for- show he's learned what he doesn't know yet? The Bills spent a full day with the guy trying to figure out if he's Donovan Mcnabb or Vince Young. I for one am comfortable Gailey and Nix have reached a proper conclusion on this. Or are you under the impression Nix and Gailey are going to get snowed by a guy you apparently think is stupid? Just asking.

[Philagape]

Fact: He's not just a candidate for 3rd he's a candidate for 1st overall and if he isn't taken in the first 3 he'd go 4th or 5th or 8th or 10th or 12th all based on his incredible potential. I'm not sure what you're looking for- show he's learned what he doesn't know yet? The Bills spent a full day with the guy trying to figure out if he's Donovan Mcnabb or Vince Young. I for one am comfortable Gailey and Nix have reached a proper conclusion on this. Or are you under the impression Nix and Gailey are going to get snowed by a guy you apparently think is stupid? Just asking.

There's a large trash heap of QBs who were drafted high, including first overall, because they were great athletes but busted because they weren't right in the head. NFL teams have gotten snowed many times.

[justasportsfan]

Championship caliber NFL HC/ Jon Gruden seemed in awe of Cam Newton's athletic abilities and I'm becoming more and more convinced Newton detractors see what they want to see.


and the Newton fans do the same. Everyone is in awe with his athletic abilities even his detractors, but I doubt Gruden thinks he's the sharpest knife

[Bill Cody]

The NFL is more like calculus.
Like I said earlier, the Gruden thing was just confirmation of sentiments that were already out there, which come from several factors, including the eyeball test. No new ground was broken here.

I don't disagree. But is it Newton's fault he was in his 1st year as a div 1 player and therefore had to have a simple offense? Or do you think Peyton Manning was calling audibles at the LOS his first year at Tennessee? How would Tom Brady have done in an interview with Gruden with 1 year's college expereince under his belt? If you need Newton to play right away I agree he would be a disaster. But you can't crucify him for being inexperienced think about it.

[Philagape]

I don't disagree. But is it Newton's fault he was in his 1st year as a div 1 player and therefore had to have a simple offense? Or do you think Peyton Manning was calling audibles at the LOS his first year at Tennessee? How would Tom Brady have done in an interview with Gruden with 1 year's college expereince under his belt? If you need Newton to play right away I agree he would be a disaster. But you can't crucify him for being inexperienced think about it.

Nor will I use the team's highest draft pick since Bruce Smith on him. They have got to get this one right.

[Bill Cody]

There's a large trash heap of QBs who were drafted high, including first overall, because they were great athletes but busted because they weren't right in the head. NFL teams have gotten snowed many times.

And those teams lose. On the other hand the Eagles pick of McNabb at 3 was roundly booed by the fans. The Eagles did thier homework, got it right and won more games in the decade that followed than any team in the NFL other than NE. I have to trust the Bills brass to get it right. Or turn in my fan card because if not we're screwed.

[Bill Cody]

Nor will I use the team's highest draft pick since Bruce Smith on him. They have got to get this one right.

If we pick him it's because he's the right choice. If he's there and we pass it's because he's the wrong choice. I realy believe this because I see the due dilligence we've done. I don't accept every decision the Bills make at face value but sometimes like in this case you need to have a little faith. At least I do.

[Figster]

and the Newton fans do the same. Everyone is in awe with his athletic abilities even his detractors, but I doubt Gruden thinks he's the sharpest knife
How an athlete thinks/reacts under pressure says a lot more about a QB then any wonderlic score or chalkboard demonstration ever will in my opinion. The better the athlete (wheels/agility/arm strength) the easier evasive maneuvers become while still looking down field to find an open receiver.

I'll take Jim Kelly and his low wondelic score any day of the week over Ryan Fitzpatrick and his ability to ace it.

[better days]

I don't disagree. But is it Newton's fault he was in his 1st year as a div 1 player and therefore had to have a simple offense? Or do you think Peyton Manning was calling audibles at the LOS his first year at Tennessee? How would Tom Brady have done in an interview with Gruden with 1 year's college expereince under his belt? If you need Newton to play right away I agree he would be a disaster. But you can't crucify him for being inexperienced think about it.

As a matter of fact, it is Newtons fault he was in his 1st year as a div 1 player and therefore had to have a simple offense.

Had he not been caught cheating 3 times while at Florida as well as buying a computer he knew was stolen, he would have never have had to leave Florida.

[Bill Cody]

As a matter of fact, it is Newtons fault he was in his 1st year as a div 1 player and therefore had to have a simple offense.

Had he not been caught cheating 3 times while at Florida as well as buying a computer he knew was stolen, he would have never have had to leave Florida.

I have a feeling if he was a still a gator you'd be singing a different tune.

[Figster]

I have a feeling if he was a still a gator you'd be singing a different tune.
better days, being the honest fellow that he is, has actually admitted his opinion of Cam is a bit tainted. (Gator fan)

[better days]

I have a feeling if he was a still a gator you'd be singing a different tune.

Of course I would be singing a different tune if Newton were still a Gator. If Newton never left Florida it would mean there would be much less concern about his character than there is.

The fact Newton was forced to withdraw from Florida due to the problems he had there should be the major concern everyone should have about him.

[justasportsfan]

How an athlete thinks/reacts under pressure says a lot more about a QB then any wonderlic score or chalkboard demonstration ever will in my opinion. The better the athlete (wheels/agility/arm strength) the easier evasive maneuvers become while still looking down field to find an open receiver.

I'll take Jim Kelly and his low wondelic score any day of the week over Ryan Fitzpatrick and his ability to ace it.


I wasn't talking wonderlic. Just look at the video. "you put me on the spot "? What are you talking about, Cam? the qb is always on the spot. He fumbled.

You can't tell me that Gruden thinks Cam is a smarter compared to the qb's he interviewed. Anyone can see he was lost under pressure . I'm not as harsh as the Cam detractors here but lets call a spade a spade, He looked stupid in that interview.

If you think he looked smart in that interview then you too are seeing what you want to see.

[Philagape]

Of course I would be singing a different tune if Newton were still a Gator. If Newton never left Florida it would mean there would be much less concern about his character than there is.

As well as him having more DI experience and more of a chance to show he's more than just an athlete.

[Figster]

I wasn't talking wonderlic. Just look at the video. "you put me on the spot "? What are you talking about, Cam? the qb is always on the spot. He fumbled.

You can't tell me that Gruden thinks Cam is a smarter compared to the qb's he interviewed. Anyone can see he was lost under pressure . I'm not as harsh as the Cam detractors here but lets call a spade a spade, He looked stupid in that interview.

If you think he looked smart in that interview then you too are seeing what you want to see.

Not sure I've seen the interview in question to be honest,

We have a slightly different definition of under pressure, I meant on the football field during a live game with the defense crashing in around you.

I'm willing to bet Gruden has the same impression our own HC Chan Gailey has about Cam Newton when it comes to his football mentality,

He gets it...

[justasportsfan]

Not sure I've seen the interview in question to be honest,

We have a slightly different definition of under pressure, I meant on the football field during a live game with the defense crashing in around you.

I'm willing to bet Gruden has the same impression our own HC Chan Gailey has about Cam Newton when it comes to his football mentality,

He gets it...

it's the video in the first post of this thread.

[Bill Cody]

Of course I would be singing a different tune if Newton were still a Gator. If Newton never left Florida it would mean there would be much less concern about his character than there is.

The fact Newton was forced to withdraw from Florida due to the problems he had there should be the major concern everyone should have about him.

Ok fair enough. But let's just say he only cheated twice, stole the laptop or whatever but was allowed to stay at FL. I just think some of your negative feelings for the guy are based on the fact that he left your team and went on to win a national championship at a rival school.

I know this is hard but try to be honest- if Cam had just completed the year he just had as a gator and not a tiger would you be as down on him as you are?

[better days]

Ok fair enough. But let's just say he only cheated twice, stole the laptop or whatever but was allowed to stay at FL. I just think some of your negative feelings for the guy are based on the fact that he left your team and went on to win a national championship at a rival school.

I know this is hard but try to be honest- if Cam had just completed the year he just had as a gator and not a tiger would you be as down on him as you are?

To be honest, I would still have concerns about him as a QB for the Bills but would be very happy he led the Gators to another National Championship, so no I would not be as down on him as I am. That would presume he did not have as much baggage as he really does however.

[psubills62]

I wasn't talking wonderlic. Just look at the video. "you put me on the spot "? What are you talking about, Cam? the qb is always on the spot. He fumbled.

You can't tell me that Gruden thinks Cam is a smarter compared to the qb's he interviewed. Anyone can see he was lost under pressure . I'm not as harsh as the Cam detractors here but lets call a spade a spade, He looked stupid in that interview.

If you think he looked smart in that interview then you too are seeing what you want to see.
I'll tell you what...when I have gone on interviews (and this was as a college student getting an internship), I prepared for questions. I can't believe that Newton wasn't prepared in any way to discuss a play at Auburn. Spent a year in the system, been coached up to answer questions in a certain way, yet couldn't tell Gruden a dang thing about any one single play? Tells you exactly how many reads he made during the season.

[djjimkelly]

What's the issue here??? All the Bills have to do is run Play 36 every time. Winning.


LMAO

[justasportsfan]

I'll tell you what...when I have gone on interviews (and this was as a college student getting an internship), I prepared for questions. I can't believe that Newton wasn't prepared in any way to discuss a play at Auburn. Spent a year in the system, been coached up to answer questions in a certain way, yet couldn't tell Gruden a dang thing about any one single play? Tells you exactly how many reads he made during the season.

He couldn't even bring up an Auburn playcall when asked. His answer "you put me on the spot". He said it was simple yet he had no reply.

[TigerJ]

I've been touting TCU's Dalton. I'm certainly no scout, but what I've seen of him, made me think that he's a perceptive college qb that sees the field.I haven't been in the Dalton camp to this point, but what I'm hearing suggests he might have more upside than people were earlier giving him credit for.

[Extremebillsfan247]

This is just one of those QBs that even if he did have a break out hall of fame NFL career, people would still hate him. But, in my opinion, at the end of the day none of this hoopla matters. All anyone here should be concerned about is how he performs once the helmet and pads go on. Some players are just better leaders on the field than they are off it. I'm reserving all opinion on Newton until the day when what he does on and off the field at the pro level actually matters.

[Mr. Miyagi]

He couldn't even bring up an Auburn playcall when asked. His answer "you put me on the spot". He said it was simple yet he had no reply.
He did. It's 36.

:snicker:

[TedMock]

Local ESPN affiliate had an interesting tidbit on the Cam Newton opinions this past Friday. A poll went out to every scout who covered Newton, asking their long term projection. 24 scouts responded. 2 said he's a perennial pro-bowler. 9 said he'll end up a long-term starter, but never be a real difference maker. 9 said he'll stick around long-term, but as a backup. 4 said he'll be a complete bust. Nobody can quite figure this guy out right now.

Oh yeah - Happy Easter to all!

[Philagape]

Local ESPN affiliate had an interesting tidbit on the Cam Newton opinions this past Friday. A poll went out to every scout who covered Newton, asking their long term projection. 24 scouts responded. 2 said he's a perennial pro-bowler. 9 said he'll end up a long-term starter, but never be a real difference maker. 9 said he'll stick around long-term, but as a backup. 4 said he'll be a complete bust. Nobody can quite figure this guy out right now.

Oh yeah - Happy Easter to all!

So 2 out of 24 said he's worth a top-10 pick.

Happy Resurrection Day to you too!

[methos4ever]

Newton, regardless of the town he's in is going to be a lightning rod. I cannot remember who (I believe it was Rich Eisen on the Dan Patrick show?), but someone said that whomever drafts Cam will be essentially drafting a reality tv show for his duration on the team..


Happy Resurrection Sunday as well!

[acehole]

I can see why some on this board think he is a genius.




Don't know if you guys have seen this but this is Cam speaking with Gruden. Gruden asks Cam to call a play and Cam freezes and goes on to talk about how he's used to the simplicity of Auburn's offense. You see his face when Gruden was calling out that play? This is what worries me about him.

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=6375220

[BillsFanCupp38]

I watched a lot of that series and I found Jake Locker to be the most impressive... He's gonna be a steal Im sure.

[tomz]

I just watched Newton and Mallett back to back. Mallett looked like he had absolute command of a very complex play. Pretty clear that Newton doesn't know what he is getting into.

[acehole]

I see us trading down and grabbing him....



I watched a lot of that series and I found Jake Locker to be the most impressive... He's gonna be a steal Im sure.

[methos4ever]

Here's a page out of his playbook. Say what you will about Cam, but it's not like it was a super simple offense...http://smartfootball.com/uncategorized/a-page-from-gus-malzahns-passing-playbook-literally

You'll notice the near mythic play 36 as well...

http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/gus-passgame.gif

[Figster]

Here's a page out of his playbook. Say what you will about Cam, but it's not like it was a super simple offense...http://smartfootball.com/uncategorized/a-page-from-gus-malzahns-passing-playbook-literally

You'll notice the near mythic play 36 as well...

http://smartfootball.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/gus-passgame.gif


Auburn put a premium on getting the play off fast/ good execution.

Simple/short terminology was by design and you can't fault Cam Newton for the lack of sophistication in the Tiger Offense.