View Full Version : Nix and Gailey... I love these guys
X-Era
04-30-2011, 09:48 PM
It's always interesting to see what they will say.
Gailey says, " a) we needed players and 2) the best players on the board..."
Nix says, "He’s not as big as you’ve got him listed. He’s lost down to 378 lbs, so he’s drying up to nothing"
Bangarang
04-30-2011, 09:52 PM
I got a good laugh when Nix said that about Jasper. Also, what TEs were off the board when it was their time to pick? Locker and Green were both available with one of the later picks. Was the just posturing on Chan's part?
wmoz11
04-30-2011, 09:54 PM
I'm with you. Gailey was pretty much our last resort, but I just love how he coaches the guys up. Talk about improvement in one year on offense.
Nix has a great track record and I think, although it was an in-house, unexciting hire at the time, that we should have been happier to get him than we were.
I love that there's a plan (you can tell pretty easily) right now. I haven't felt this comfortable with a group in a LONG time. Surely before I was old enough to form an educated opinion.
The players all love each other and rally around ONE QB? When is the last time we had that? Just a great group of young men and a great group of talented ones, at that. I'm happy to be a Bills fan for the first time in a long time.
The playoffs might not be in our immediate future, but I feel like we're not treading water anymore. We're on our way.
BertSquirtgum
05-01-2011, 10:05 AM
JOKE
you're just mad that our coherent front office didn't waste one of our draft pics on one of the ****ty quarterbacks in this draft.
Buddo
05-01-2011, 10:13 AM
It's always interesting to see what they will say.
Gailey says, " a) we needed players and 2) the best players on the board..."
Nix says, "He’s not as big as you’ve got him listed. He’s lost down to 378 lbs, so he’s drying up to nothing"
The bit that follows is just as funny, as he's asked what they are going to do with him, at which point Nix starts to pass the question to Chan, but says, apart from feed him...;)
They won 4 games in their first year together after taking over from a crappy staff and did worse with just about the same players. They have proved nothing at all thus far, not sure why anyone has anything but skepticism towards them. They hardly played any draft picks last year, how do we know what happens this year? If all these guys play this year, know what that means? Means they sucked ass picking last year then.
YardRat
05-01-2011, 10:35 AM
They are still a work in progress...The honeymoon is officially over and the signs are encouraging for everybody except those who think the game revolves the QB position only but just as we witnessed some offensive progress last season, we need to see the same from all three sides of the ball in '11 and the results have to start manifesting themselves in the W column.
you're just mad that our coherent front office didn't waste one of our draft pics on one of the ****ty quarterbacks in this draft.
coherent huh?
good choice of words.
yes i would have liked a quarterback. your right
i am pretty happy with some of the guys we got.
our d line should be stacked now
but then again we still wont be doing enough to win.
if merriman plays (well), and some other guys pay out the way we want. then our d should be set
but remember that thing that wins games...... POINTS...... how will we get them.
FITZ?
some but probubly not enough.
thats my only point. and im fine with losing every game this year. cuz we HAVE TO GET a franchise face of the franchise qb and untill we do we wont win a superbowl and im willing to be we wont win playoff games.
Dujek
05-01-2011, 05:47 PM
coherent huh?
good choice of words.
yes i would have liked a quarterback. your right
i am pretty happy with some of the guys we got.
our d line should be stacked now
but then again we still wont be doing enough to win.
if merriman plays (well), and some other guys pay out the way we want. then our d should be set
but remember that thing that wins games...... POINTS...... how will we get them.
FITZ?
some but probubly not enough.
thats my only point. and im fine with losing every game this year. cuz we HAVE TO GET a franchise face of the franchise qb and untill we do we wont win a superbowl and im willing to be we wont win playoff games.
Fitz put up enough points to win 10 games with a solid defense last year. Any season where you lose games where the offense puts up 30 points the problems aren't with the guy under center.
Fitz put up enough points to win 10 games with a solid defense last year. Any season where you lose games where the offense puts up 30 points the problems aren't with the guy under center.
so are you trying to say that we dont have a problem with our guy under center.
Fitz put up enough points to win 10 games with a solid defense last year. Any season where you lose games where the offense puts up 30 points the problems aren't with the guy under center.
by the way.....
we lost two games last year with 30 + points.
and lost 7 games with 14 - points...
id say that the stats speak for themself
JCBills
05-01-2011, 08:01 PM
by the way.....
we lost two games last year with 30 + points.
and lost 7 games with 14 - points...
id say that the stats speak for themself
Haha.
The defense allowed 31+ points 9 times, 8 of them being 34+ pts allowed showings. They couldn't stop anyone on the ground, several RBs had career days against that unit.
This was a weak QB class. If certain underclassmen next year declare, and even the top seniors coming out continue to develop, it looks to be a decently strong class. I'm happy they passed on QB this season. Fitz is good enough to win some games with this year and have someone develop under him for a year if they take a QB next season.
TacklingDummy
05-01-2011, 08:51 PM
Gailey says, " a) we needed players and 2) the best players on the board..."
Will you love Gailey after a combined 2 year record of 8-24?
mikemac2001
05-01-2011, 09:26 PM
Will you love Gailey after a combined 2 year record of 8-24?
team has played hard for him we lacked talent
and only a couple games we got are asses beat
i doubt we only win 4 games this year
TacklingDummy
05-01-2011, 09:32 PM
team has played hard for him we lacked talent
and only a couple games we got are asses beat
i doubt we only win 4 games this year
8-24 or 10-22, still will love him?
Beebe's Kid
05-01-2011, 10:36 PM
so are you trying to say that we dont have a problem with our guy under center.
That's exactly what I'd say...and if the draft was any indication, I'd say the guys that get paid to run this football team feel the same way.
Beebe's Kid
05-01-2011, 10:38 PM
8-24 or 10-22, still will love him?I guess that depends on how it looks, but I think you want them to fail more than you want them to succeed.
There is no indication that this team didn't improve, and will not continue to improve. Once the team was acclimated to playing with Fitzy, and began to learn the system, they were a different team...you, however, had the same negative outlook.
If it pisses you off...sure, I'll still love them.
Akhippo
05-01-2011, 11:26 PM
They won 4 games in their first year together after taking over from a crappy staff and did worse with just about the same players. They have proved nothing at all thus far, not sure why anyone has anything but skepticism towards them. They hardly played any draft picks last year, how do we know what happens this year? If all these guys play this year, know what that means? Means they sucked ass picking last year then.
Jauron was making a go cart for the go cart track. Nix took that go cart to the big boy track. Sure hes going to lose ground while trying to rebuild on the fly.
We absolutely have to get a QB next year though. We have hit on just about every position to upgrade. QB of the future is next.
BertSquirtgum
05-01-2011, 11:35 PM
coherent huh?
good choice of words.
yes i would have liked a quarterback. your right
i am pretty happy with some of the guys we got.
our d line should be stacked now
but then again we still wont be doing enough to win.
if merriman plays (well), and some other guys pay out the way we want. then our d should be set
but remember that thing that wins games...... POINTS...... how will we get them.
FITZ?
some but probubly not enough.
thats my only point. and im fine with losing every game this year. cuz we HAVE TO GET a franchise face of the franchise qb and untill we do we wont win a superbowl and im willing to be we wont win playoff games.
you're the worst kind of fan. :puke:
Haha.
The defense allowed 31+ points 9 times, 8 of them being 34+ pts allowed showings. They couldn't stop anyone on the ground, several RBs had career days against that unit.
This was a weak QB class. If certain underclassmen next year declare, and even the top seniors coming out continue to develop, it looks to be a decently strong class. I'm happy they passed on QB this season. Fitz is good enough to win some games with this year and have someone develop under him for a year if they take a QB next season.
i dont disagree with us "beefing" up our defense at all.
i love the picks we got.
what i am saying is that we have to address our qb issue. we will not and can not win a superbowl with fitz under center.
im only worried that we will win some games this year and be back at the 15-20 range in next years draft, resulting in us not getting a franchise top tier quarterback. and we need one.
That's exactly what I'd say...and if the draft was any indication, I'd say the guys that get paid to run this football team feel the same way.
really?
or did the guys that get paid.... just think that our defensive line was a bigger need than the quality of the quarterbacks in this class.
lets call an apple an apple and say that fitz is not good enough to LEAD this team to a super bowl.... much less win one
you're the worst kind of fan. :puke:
what kind of fan would that be?
the type that is a REAList, and is willing to accept that our team isnt the best out there. and the type that will say what is needed for us to become the best.
also the type of fan that doesnt use an avatar that will land him an interview with chris hansen on TO CATCH A PREDATOR!!!
congrats on being the dirtiest poster on this board! :shoothead:
Bill Cody
05-02-2011, 02:43 PM
Will you love Gailey after a combined 2 year record of 8-24?
I would yes. If 4 wins nets us Andrew Luck.
Fitz put up enough points to win 10 games with a solid defense last year. Any season where you lose games where the offense puts up 30 points the problems aren't with the guy under center.
That is a joke, and you are misinformed. Bills scored over 19 points just 4 times. Bills were 1-3 in games they scored over 19 points. In the 3 games we lost he was outplayed by the other QB. The Patriots game we played come back, we had no chance to win and Brady did not throw 2 picks like Fitz did, against the Jags the Bills were 2 of 11 on 3rd down and Garrard was better than Fitz who was handed great field position early and led the Bills to short FGs with his inaccuracy, and the Ravens game, Flacco was 3 TDs, 0 INTs, and Fitz was 4 Tds and 2 INTs, once again outplayed.
it is not right to just say we would have won more as a blank statement without the facts.
justasportsfan
05-02-2011, 02:59 PM
That is a joke, and you are misinformed. Bills scored over 19 points just 4 times. Bills were 1-3 in games they scored over 19 points. In the 3 games we lost he was outplayed by the other QB. The Patriots game we played come back, we had no chance to win and Brady did not throw 2 picks like Fitz did, against the Jags the Bills were 2 of 11 on 3rd down and Garrard was better than Fitz who was handed great field position early and led the Bills to short FGs with his inaccuracy, and the Ravens game, Flacco was 3 TDs, 0 INTs, and Fitz was 4 Tds and 2 INTs, once again outplayed.
it is not right to just say we would have won more as a blank statement without the facts.
No doubt Fitz was outplayed, no one is saying that he wasn't. No one is saying we don't need a franchise Qb. But anyone who knows football knows that the way Brady toys with our D , we're not going anywhere until we fix the weakest link that Jauron left us with.
No doubt Fitz was outplayed, no one is saying that he wasn't. No one is saying we don't need a franchise Qb. But anyone who knows football knows that the way Brady toys with our D , we're not going anywhere until we fix the weakest link that Jauron left us with.
i would agree with everything you say untill you say that the weakest link is our d.
it may be the broadest.
but we had decent pass d last year (stats wise) maybe cuz our run d sucked so bad but it was decent.
the quickest fix that would have the biggest impact is a franchise qb
mysticsoto
05-02-2011, 03:49 PM
i would agree with everything you say untill you say that the weakest link is our d.
it may be the broadest.
but we had decent pass d last year (stats wise) maybe cuz our run d sucked so bad but it was decent.
the quickest fix that would have the biggest impact is a franchise qb
Yes, but this was a WEAK QB class. Would you have Nix force a valuable pick for a QB that is going to take Levi's place holding a clipboard?
i would agree with everything you say untill you say that the weakest link is our d.
it may be the broadest.
but we had decent pass d last year (stats wise) maybe cuz our run d sucked so bad but it was decent.
the quickest fix that would have the biggest impact is a franchise qb
I agree. Dareus is not a bad consolation prize is how I am looking at it. Hope he really brings it.
justasportsfan
05-02-2011, 03:56 PM
i would agree with everything you say untill you say that the weakest link is our d.
it may be the broadest.
but we had decent pass d last year (stats wise) maybe cuz our run d sucked so bad but it was decent.
the quickest fix that would have the biggest impact is a franchise qb
the reason why our pass D looked good is because teams were running 170 yards per game on us. Look at the run vs. pass ratio vs. our D. It doesn't take a genius to know that you run vs. the run D in the league.
When the run D is giving up franchise records vs. the run it is the weakest link.
There's no quick fix in this league. It rarely happens.
Yes, but this was a WEAK QB class. Would you have Nix force a valuable pick for a QB that is going to take Levi's place holding a clipboard?
hahah. no. your right. im thinking beyond this draft. its over and dont with. but we need to start thinking about it.
like what now?
my belief is we always need to be moving forward.
the reason why our pass D looked good is because teams were running 170 yards per game on us. Look at the run vs. pass ratio vs. our D. It doesn't take a genius to know that you run vs. the run D in the league.
When the run D is giving up franchise records vs. the run it is the weakest link.
There's no quick fix in this league. It rarely happens.
thats really what i just said.
the old saying, dont fix it unless its broken. thats what teams did to our defense. they were running the crap out of us and shouldnt do anything else cuz it was working so well.
and yes there isnt a quick fix. but a francise qb is the closest thing. do i need to post the list of franchise qb's that saved teams?
and yes there are first round qb's that didnt pan out also.
TigerJ
05-02-2011, 07:21 PM
I like Nix and Gailey. They did make some mistakes last season, chief of which was they thought they could rehab Edwards from his deep pass phobia. The other reason they struggled so much was the switch to a 3-4, because they lacked the personnel. I don't know if you call that a mistake or not. They could perhaps have eased the pain by delaying the changeover for a hear while they aculumated more of the needed personnel, but if Gailey is convinced the 3-4 defense is ultimately more disruptive to the offense, delaying would only have amounted to a setback this year. Now, at least, the veterans know basically what to do in a 3-4 defense. They don't have to spend this year learning. The new draftees fill most of the holes, and as they come up to speed, the defense should be better this year for having suffered through the learning of it last season.
Gailey at least knew to cut his losses on Edwards, and he's not afraid to tinker with things be adding Wannstedt to help with the hybrid aspects of thedefense he wants to run. I think he's got a no nonsense football mind and wants to win more than the fans do. For all that I want to see him get more time to turn the ship around.
BertSquirtgum
05-02-2011, 07:38 PM
what kind of fan would that be?
the type that is a REAList, and is willing to accept that our team isnt the best out there. and the type that will say what is needed for us to become the best.
also the type of fan that doesnt use an avatar that will land him an interview with chris hansen on TO CATCH A PREDATOR!!!
congrats on being the dirtiest poster on this board! :shoothead:
do you seriously believe that the Bills front office doesn't know that they need a franchise qb? i watched an interview with buddy last night. he stated that they didn't draft a qb because they want a guy that will be here for the next 10 years and that there was nobody to draft that was worth the time or money.
do you seriously believe that the Bills front office doesn't know that they need a franchise qb? i watched an interview with buddy last night. he stated that they didn't draft a qb because they want a guy that will be here for the next 10 years and that there was nobody to draft that was worth the time or money.
ok well it sounds like he is on the same page as me.
i would have loved to have taken a qb in this draft because i belive there is a franchise guy in this class.
if the bills dont belive the same (at least with cam gone at 3) then i am willing to accept that. i just want to make sure we do fix our qb PROBLEM at some point soon (within a year or so)
TigerJ
05-02-2011, 08:12 PM
ok well it sounds like he is on the same page as me.
i would have loved to have taken a qb in this draft because i belive there is a franchise guy in this class.
if the bills dont belive the same (at least with cam gone at 3) then i am willing to accept that. i just want to make sure we do fix our qb PROBLEM at some point soon (within a year or so)
I was hoping the Bills would take a QB too, though not in the first as some hoped. I knew, as everyone else did that they liked Ponder, but was hoping then #34 rolled around they liked Dalton or Kaepernick as well. Obviously they didn't. Except for finding a franchise QB, they did a good job of filling needs without reaching except for tight end. I thought it was an excellent draft overall, and I can't fault them for a difference of opinion.
I was hoping the Bills would take a QB too, though not in the first as some hoped. I knew, as everyone else did that they liked Ponder, but was hoping then #34 rolled around they liked Dalton or Kaepernick as well. Obviously they didn't. Except for finding a franchise QB, they did a good job of filling needs without reaching except for tight end. I thought it was an excellent draft overall, and I can't fault them for a difference of opinion.
i agree with you man.
and this draft is growing on me more and more
X-Era
05-02-2011, 08:37 PM
The search goes on until Fitz and/or this team proves they are all set.
The search goes on until Fitz and/or this team proves they are all set.
from you that is a rediculous statement...
you know that fitz isnt and never will be all set.
why would you even say that?
X-Era
05-02-2011, 08:59 PM
from you that is a rediculous statement...
you know that fitz isnt and never will be all set.
why would you even say that?Pessimistically optimistic?
Pessimistically optimistic?
rediculously crazy?
X-Era
05-02-2011, 09:00 PM
rediculously crazy?Same thing... also known as Bills fan
Same thing... also known as Bills fan
yea but even YOU dont belive fitz will ever be our franchise qb. or a playoff qb
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 10:43 AM
yea but even YOU dont belive fitz will ever be our franchise qb. or a playoff qb
Fitz had better numbers than Sanchez . You can't tell me Fitz can't be a playoff qb .
Fitz had better numbers than Sanchez . You can't tell me Fitz can't be a playoff qb .
yes i can.
he is not good enough to lead a team to the big game much less win it.
can he get to the playoffs.... maybe...
and thats only if this draft really helps our d out like we think it will.
can he win a playoff game..... no...
i dont think he has the talent, leadership, or the talent to win a playoff game. hahah
he makes horrible decisions and messes up too much. i would say that if our man why so serious didnt come out of nowhere and tear it up, then fitz wouldnt have nearly the numbers he had. and fact is his numbers werent that good.
and yea mark sanchez is terrible too. but he also has a number 1-3 defense every year. and superbowl mvp players helping him out.
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 10:51 AM
and yea mark sanchez is terrible too. but he also has a number 1-3 defense every year. and superbowl mvp players helping him out.
thats exactly my point. Bring in a great defense and anyone can be a playoff qb.
i dont think he has the talent, leadership, or the talent to win a playoff game. hahah
yet Mark Sanchez did win a few playoff games. So again, the FACTS don't support your opinion.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 10:52 AM
yes i can.
he is not good enough to lead a team to the big game much less win it.
can he get to the playoffs.... maybe...
and thats only if this draft really helps our d out like we think it will.
can he win a playoff game..... no...
i dont think he has the talent, leadership, or the talent to win a playoff game. hahah
he makes horrible decisions and messes up too much. i would say that if our man why so serious didnt come out of nowhere and tear it up, then fitz wouldnt have nearly the numbers he had. and fact is his numbers werent that good.
and yea mark sanchez is terrible too. but he also has a number 1-3 defense every year. and superbowl mvp players helping him out.
If Mark Sanchez can win a playoff game, Fitz can too. If Trent Dilfer can get a ring, Fitz can win a playoff game. Nobody's saying he's a HOF QB, but he's a guy that can do a decent job if you put talent around him, and that's what we need to do when there's no great QB's available.
You're giving Stevie Johnson credit for Fitz's numbers? Seriously? Johnson was better than expected, but he's not nearly that good.
Maybe if Fitz didn't have to throw to UDFA's and 7th rounders, he'd be looking a little better. Considering how bad our receiving corps became due to injuries towards the end of the year, I'm a little shocked he put up as good numbers as he did.
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 10:55 AM
If Mark Sanchez can win a playoff game, Fitz can too. .
He blasts Sanchez who had worse nos than Fitz yet won a few playoff games and then says Fitz cant win playoff games? Not making sense.
Fitz had better nos. without a D like the jets to get him the ball back.
If Mark Sanchez can win a playoff game, Fitz can too. If Trent Dilfer can get a ring, Fitz can win a playoff game. Nobody's saying he's a HOF QB, but he's a guy that can do a decent job if you put talent around him, and that's what we need to do when there's no great QB's available.
You're giving Stevie Johnson credit for Fitz's numbers? Seriously? Johnson was better than expected, but he's not nearly that good.
Maybe if Fitz didn't have to throw to UDFA's and 7th rounders, he'd be looking a little better. Considering how bad our receiving corps became due to injuries towards the end of the year, I'm a little shocked he put up as good numbers as he did.
ok so your examples of teams that win with less than good qbs are the jets last year and the ravens with dilfer.
lets get some more facts to support this theory that you can win with a great d and no qb. it does exist but again i will say that your defense is going to have to be a top 2 defense. both of those teams were number 1-6 in defense
so id say that to win playoff games with fitz we will have to have a top 5 defense.
fact again - we dont have one. and im sorry but this draft will not make one.
and to go even further. we are not 1-2 years away from having that defense. we were somewhere arround 28th in the league in total d.
so with a qb that is below average and a defense that is 28th. that will not win playoff games.
heres the options to win though.
a top 10 qb or a top 10 d will set you up for some playoff wins
(most of the top 10 d's have top 10 qbs but ill give that to you)
so to get to a top 10 d we will need more than this draft class. we are going to have to have more than one d line player that is nasty. and we will absolutely need to beef up our secondary more. they werent even tested last year because nobody had to throw the ball. but when they were tested, they werent so hott. i know we are getting rid of whitner, thats a pluss i think but we will need more. and our lb's will need some help too. if merriman pays out and plays like a pro bowler again then we should be in good shape but fact is our d needs alot more to get to a top 10 d and be in the shape of pitt, nyj, green bay, chicago, atlanta, baltimore, and lets not mention that we will have to bump one of them. who will that be?
OR - we can pick up a franchise qb. in either the draft. or in FA. i know that at 3, the bills didnt think there was a franchise qb there. thats fine but the fact is we need one.
possibility remains that we can become a playoff winning team with fitz. that would be with a top 10 d.
so the truth in all this is that if we want to be a playoff winning team we will need a top 10 d or a top 10 qb. and fact is that it is much easier to get the top 10 qb then the other. so we should focus alot of our time and effort in getting that guy. and lets not get into the fact that with the top 10 d, it is hard to keep it at that.
how many times did dilfer repeat?
He blasts Sanchez who had worse nos than Fitz yet won a few playoff games and then says Fitz cant win playoff games? Not making sense.
Fitz had better nos. without a D like the jets to get him the ball back.
i agree that mark is a worse player. but u also have to think about the fact that he is one of the best in the league when the game is on the line. thats why he wins. becuause he makes game winners. and gets it done within two minutes.
FITZ DOESNT. HE BUSTS
Fitz had better numbers than Sanchez . You can't tell me Fitz can't be a playoff qb .
In 2010 alone, Sanchez had 4 4th quarter comebacks and 6 GW drives and he has 5 and 7 respectively.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=SancMa00
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=FitzRy00
In more starts, Fitz has 3 4th quarter comebacks and 4 game winning drives. JP Losman and Trent Edwards are more clutch and have more late game drives for wins in less starts then Fitz has had.
Fitz is not a leader, he is not clutch, and is not close to being a playoff QB. 4th quarter shows Fitz to be well below average.
He blasts Sanchez who had worse nos than Fitz yet won a few playoff games and then says Fitz cant win playoff games? Not making sense.
Fitz had better nos. without a D like the jets to get him the ball back.
Sanchez led that team to late scores for wins all season last year.
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 11:27 AM
i agree that mark is a worse player. but u also have to think about the fact that he is one of the best in the league when the game is on the line. thats why he wins. becuause he makes game winners. and gets it done within two minutes.
FITZ DOESNT. HE BUSTS
so now you're changing your tune. MSanchez wins because he has a better D than Fitz. He has a D that can dominate and give him the ball back or at least keep the game close enough to win it in the end.Fitz doesn't. Thats a FACT!
so now you're changing your tune. MSanchez wins because he has a better D than Fitz. He has a D that can dominate and give him the ball back or at least keep the game close enough to win it in the end.Fitz doesn't. Thats a FACT!
that is the only example you can run with is what im saying. u have the jets, and the ravens, thats it. yes the jets have a d that causes mark to look better.
yes fitz may have better stats then mark. but mark is a clutch player. and a damn good clutch player. put their 4th quarter stats side by side and then tell me who has better stats?
that is the defanition of FACT!!!!!
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 11:38 AM
that is the only example you can run with is what im saying. u have the jets, and the ravens, thats it. yes the jets have a d that causes mark to look better.
yes fitz may have better stats then mark. but mark is a clutch player. and a damn good clutch player. put their 4th quarter stats side by side and then tell me who has better stats?
that is the defanition of FACT!!!!!
I thought you said Sanchez blows. Then you said Sanchez is a worse player than Fitz. Now he's not only clutch but a damn good clutch player. If so, how is Sanchez worse than Fitz like you said earlier? Make up your mind.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 12:03 PM
ok so your examples of teams that win with less than good qbs are the jets last year and the ravens with dilfer.
lets get some more facts to support this theory that you can win with a great d and no qb. it does exist but again i will say that your defense is going to have to be a top 2 defense. both of those teams were number 1-6 in defense
so id say that to win playoff games with fitz we will have to have a top 5 defense.
fact again - we dont have one. and im sorry but this draft will not make one.
and to go even further. we are not 1-2 years away from having that defense. we were somewhere arround 28th in the league in total d.
so with a qb that is below average and a defense that is 28th. that will not win playoff games.
heres the options to win though.
a top 10 qb or a top 10 d will set you up for some playoff wins
(most of the top 10 d's have top 10 qbs but ill give that to you)
so to get to a top 10 d we will need more than this draft class. we are going to have to have more than one d line player that is nasty. and we will absolutely need to beef up our secondary more. they werent even tested last year because nobody had to throw the ball. but when they were tested, they werent so hott. i know we are getting rid of whitner, thats a pluss i think but we will need more. and our lb's will need some help too. if merriman pays out and plays like a pro bowler again then we should be in good shape but fact is our d needs alot more to get to a top 10 d and be in the shape of pitt, nyj, green bay, chicago, atlanta, baltimore, and lets not mention that we will have to bump one of them. who will that be?
OR - we can pick up a franchise qb. in either the draft. or in FA. i know that at 3, the bills didnt think there was a franchise qb there. thats fine but the fact is we need one.
possibility remains that we can become a playoff winning team with fitz. that would be with a top 10 d.
so the truth in all this is that if we want to be a playoff winning team we will need a top 10 d or a top 10 qb. and fact is that it is much easier to get the top 10 qb then the other. so we should focus alot of our time and effort in getting that guy. and lets not get into the fact that with the top 10 d, it is hard to keep it at that.
how many times did dilfer repeat? You sure spend a lot of words arguing a point that I have no problem with.
Does it take a great defense? Sure. But that's what it takes to get into the playoffs in general - a really good defense.
You seem to be changing your tune pretty quickly. First you say we will not win playoff games with Fitz, but then you change it to say we won't win with Fitz AND a bottom-level defense. I can agree with that. We also wouldn't win a playoff game with Peyton Manning and the 28th-ranked defense.
You don't seem to get the fact that there are no franchise QB's available. None. Where did you see any? You and PTI keep talking about needing to get a QB...fine, give us your solution. Tell us what you'd do to improve this team at QB. Where's the top 10 QB you keep discussing?
If you really thought about it...you'd realize that 12 teams make the playoffs every year, and it's guaranteed that at least 4 of those teams won't win a playoff game. So theoretically, the 12th-best QB would be sufficient to make the playoffs. And 10th best in what? Going by QB rating, well 3 of the top 10 in that didn't make the playoffs. TD's? Yet again, 3 of the top 10 didn't make the playoffs. Yards per attempt? 5 of the top 11 (three were tied for 9th) didn't make the playoffs.
There seems to be this magical top-10 QB you keep referring to. Where is he? Who is he? And no, it really shouldn't be that hard to develop a decent defense. Look at Baltimore and Pittsburgh again for examples. They plug and play pretty much anyone (Evander Hood for Aaron Smith last year in the playoffs for example) and experience no drop-off. Why is that? Coaching. They develop players and always manage to get the right players - it's not a coincidence, it's good talent evaluation and coaching. Developing the defense is not impossible, and it's exactly what they're working on. Fine, they were 28th in the league last year. Maybe wait and see what happens this year before jumping all over them for not taking Trent Edwards 2.0.
I thought you said Sanchez blows. Then you said Sanchez is a worse player than Fitz. Now he's not only clutch but a damn good clutch player. If so, how is Sanchez worse than Fitz like you said earlier? Make up your mind.
sanchez is a terrible qb 80 percent of the game. he is my least favorite player in the nfl. i hate the hype and i hate who he is. but the truth is that he is one of the best when the game is on the line. he is terrible 80 percent of the game but when it is on the line he performs. i hate it and him but its the truth.
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 12:08 PM
sanchez is a terrible qb 80 percent of the game. he is my least favorite player in the nfl. i hate the hype and i hate who he is. but the truth is that he is one of the best when the game is on the line. he is terrible 80 percent of the game but when it is on the line he performs. i hate it and him but its the truth.
lol. He's terrible 80% of the game yet he wins playoff games and yet if Fitz had the same supporting cast that Sanchez has he can't win.
I am not arguing whether Sanchez is good or bad, but merely pointing out that you're making thigs up as you go along to argue your point.
Lets say I will agree to disagree with your not making any sense.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 12:11 PM
Sanchez led that team to late scores for wins all season last year.
Wow, it's obviously not worth arguing with you if you're glorifying Mark Sanchez. He wouldn't even have been in those positions without that defense. Wake me up next time he throws the ball farther than 10 yards in the air.
better days
05-03-2011, 12:27 PM
ok so your examples of teams that win with less than good qbs are the jets last year and the ravens with dilfer.
lets get some more facts to support this theory that you can win with a great d and no qb. it does exist but again i will say that your defense is going to have to be a top 2 defense. both of those teams were number 1-6 in defense
so id say that to win playoff games with fitz we will have to have a top 5 defense.
fact again - we dont have one. and im sorry but this draft will not make one.
and to go even further. we are not 1-2 years away from having that defense. we were somewhere arround 28th in the league in total d.
so with a qb that is below average and a defense that is 28th. that will not win playoff games.
heres the options to win though.
a top 10 qb or a top 10 d will set you up for some playoff wins
(most of the top 10 d's have top 10 qbs but ill give that to you)
so to get to a top 10 d we will need more than this draft class. we are going to have to have more than one d line player that is nasty. and we will absolutely need to beef up our secondary more. they werent even tested last year because nobody had to throw the ball. but when they were tested, they werent so hott. i know we are getting rid of whitner, thats a pluss i think but we will need more. and our lb's will need some help too. if merriman pays out and plays like a pro bowler again then we should be in good shape but fact is our d needs alot more to get to a top 10 d and be in the shape of pitt, nyj, green bay, chicago, atlanta, baltimore, and lets not mention that we will have to bump one of them. who will that be?
OR - we can pick up a franchise qb. in either the draft. or in FA. i know that at 3, the bills didnt think there was a franchise qb there. thats fine but the fact is we need one.
possibility remains that we can become a playoff winning team with fitz. that would be with a top 10 d.
so the truth in all this is that if we want to be a playoff winning team we will need a top 10 d or a top 10 qb. and fact is that it is much easier to get the top 10 qb then the other. so we should focus alot of our time and effort in getting that guy. and lets not get into the fact that with the top 10 d, it is hard to keep it at that.
how many times did dilfer repeat?
I will give you another example. The Tampa Bay Bucs won Super Bowl XXVII with Brad Johnson who did nothing before that year & nothing ever after that year.
I think it is as easy if not easier to put together a top ten defense as it is to find a top 10 QB. The truth is a team needs both a good defense & a QB that is playing good to win the Super Bowl.
You sure spend a lot of words arguing a point that I have no problem with.
Does it take a great defense? Sure. But that's what it takes to get into the playoffs in general - a really good defense.
You seem to be changing your tune pretty quickly. First you say we will not win playoff games with Fitz, but then you change it to say we won't win with Fitz AND a bottom-level defense. I can agree with that. We also wouldn't win a playoff game with Peyton Manning and the 28th-ranked defense.
You don't seem to get the fact that there are no franchise QB's available. None. Where did you see any? You and PTI keep talking about needing to get a QB...fine, give us your solution. Tell us what you'd do to improve this team at QB. Where's the top 10 QB you keep discussing?
If you really thought about it...you'd realize that 12 teams make the playoffs every year, and it's guaranteed that at least 4 of those teams won't win a playoff game. So theoretically, the 12th-best QB would be sufficient to make the playoffs. And 10th best in what? Going by QB rating, well 3 of the top 10 in that didn't make the playoffs. TD's? Yet again, 3 of the top 10 didn't make the playoffs. Yards per attempt? 5 of the top 11 (three were tied for 9th) didn't make the playoffs.
There seems to be this magical top-10 QB you keep referring to. Where is he? Who is he? And no, it really shouldn't be that hard to develop a decent defense. Look at Baltimore and Pittsburgh again for examples. They plug and play pretty much anyone (Evander Hood for Aaron Smith last year in the playoffs for example) and experience no drop-off. Why is that? Coaching. They develop players and always manage to get the right players - it's not a coincidence, it's good talent evaluation and coaching. Developing the defense is not impossible, and it's exactly what they're working on. Fine, they were 28th in the league last year. Maybe wait and see what happens this year before jumping all over them for not taking Trent Edwards 2.0.
im saying we wont win with fitz. and i stick to that. i didnt state it before but it may have something to do with the fact that i dont think its feasable for us to have a "really good d" in the timeframe that i want us in the playoffs.
the peyton manning thing is a good point but arguable.
how can you say there are no franchise qb's available in this draft. i want to hear a draft year where there are no franchise qb's i did a quick look but went back from now to 06 and every year had a franchise qb, exept 07. some are to young to totally judge but there are franchise qb's in almost every draft. and the "year of the quarterback" is almost sure to have a franchise guy. its a fact of figuring out who it is.
and your proving me wrong stats prove that 70 percent of the top 10 qbs in every stat make the playoffs. id say that is not proving me wrong rather proving my point. if you are a top ten qb in a stat then more often then not you are going to the playoffs.
then you say that top defenses "plug and play". really that isnt true. top defenses dont plug and play their best players. your example is a guy who played a total of 6 games last year with 15 tackles. A NO NAME. and yes you can sub your worst player for anyone and not be worse. give me something better than aaron smith and ZIGGY hood. they both did nothing last year. look at the stats before you use them as an example. show me where troy polamolu got replaced. or where ray lewis got replaced. or where clay mathews got replaced. or someone of that caliber. then you can tell me where our player of that caliber is. the only one u can say is poz. who may only have that many tackles because everyone ran 1000 times a game on us and made it 6 yds every time.
heres the fact - a team with a good defense and a good qb can make the playoffs and win games. cincy, dallas, etc. i just dont see us having a good to really good defense as easy as your making it. i feel like we are alot of work away from it. my point is if we get a really good qb, its a one move fix and will put us relevent easier. that man may not exist for us right now. and im not upset about our draft. we addressed alot of huge issues we have. im happy with it. but i really want a great qb. we need a face of the francise and right now it is stevie. we can do better than that. i love him through and through but i feel like to have a great team you need to have a great qb.
I will give you another example. The Tampa Bay Bucs won Super Bowl XXVII with Brad Johnson who did nothing before that year & nothing ever after that year.
I think it is as easy if not easier to put together a top ten defense as it is to find a top 10 QB. The truth is a team needs both a good defense & a QB that is playing good to win the Super Bowl.
true. i agree with that exept. a top ten defese needs alot of positions to be flawless to great. where a top ten qb needs one. how can we get more than 3-5 great to flawless players on d when right now (pre draft) we had none. its tough. the best d's have a ton of awesome players.
i would love to have a nasty d and no qb but that is really really tough to get. and as soon as you get it, it is gone because all those guys that did great that year want to be paid and you can afford to pay top tier money to all those people. thats why they never repeat.
ravens have been fighting back since their last SB. and now they have a potential franchise qb. oh yea and now there back in the playoffs.... funny...
bucs have been fighting back since their last SB. and now they have a great qb. and there too back in the playoffs..... funny....
lol. He's terrible 80% of the game yet he wins playoff games and yet if Fitz had the same supporting cast that Sanchez has he can't win.
I am not arguing whether Sanchez is good or bad, but merely pointing out that you're making thigs up as you go along to argue your point.
Lets say I will agree to disagree with your not making any sense.
ok. i wish i could break this down for you to understand.
what am i making up. this is an argument on a message forum. this is a discussion not THE WORD.
Wow, it's obviously not worth arguing with you if you're glorifying Mark Sanchez. He wouldn't even have been in those positions without that defense. Wake me up next time he throws the ball farther than 10 yards in the air.
There is not one person of any significance in football who would take Fitz over Sanchez. By the way, Sanchez had 6.6 yards per attempt, Fitz was 6.8. He turned the ball over a lot less than Fitz did. Fitz, 20 in 13 games, Sanchez, 14 in 16, and he was clutch. I don't get how anyone could not say he is a better player then Fitz is. Makes no sense. Playoffs in his first two seasons. I hate the Jets and Sanchez too.
I will give you another example. The Tampa Bay Bucs won Super Bowl XXVII with Brad Johnson who did nothing before that year & nothing ever after that year.
I think it is as easy if not easier to put together a top ten defense as it is to find a top 10 QB. The truth is a team needs both a good defense & a QB that is playing good to win the Super Bowl.
Brad Johnson was replaced the season after. Know why? Tampa knew he wasn't good enough to get them there again. Same with the Ravens. Dilfer won a Super Bowl and was shown the door. They signed Elvis Grbac to big money to replace him. When people bring these guys up it only reinforces that you need a a quality franchise QB to consistently win, it is proven by the teams that won that almost immediately replaced the guy that got them there.
better days
05-03-2011, 12:54 PM
true. i agree with that exept. a top ten defese needs alot of positions to be flawless to great. where a top ten qb needs one. how can we get more than 3-5 great to flawless players on d when right now (pre draft) we had none. its tough. the best d's have a ton of awesome players.
i would love to have a nasty d and no qb but that is really really tough to get. and as soon as you get it, it is gone because all those guys that did great that year want to be paid and you can afford to pay top tier money to all those people. thats why they never repeat.
ravens have been fighting back since their last SB. and now they have a potential franchise qb. oh yea and now there back in the playoffs.... funny...
bucs have been fighting back since their last SB. and now they have a great qb. and there too back in the playoffs..... funny....
Well, aside from getting a QB, both the Ravens & Bucs have added some good young players to their defense. The Bucs had gotten old on defense & had to let go such great players as Sapp & Brooks because time caught up with them. The Bucs now have a young team with guys that while not as good as Sapp & Brooks in their prime are better than they were of late.
Well, aside from getting a QB, both the Ravens & Bucs have added some good young players to their defense. The Bucs had gotten old on defense & had to let go such great players as Sapp & Brooks because time caught up with them. The Bucs now have a young team with guys that while not as good as Sapp & Brooks in their prime are better than they were of late.
so your saying that the best defenses of all time had old hugely talented vets?
where are ours.
Well, aside from getting a QB, both the Ravens & Bucs have added some good young players to their defense. The Bucs had gotten old on defense & had to let go such great players as Sapp & Brooks because time caught up with them. The Bucs now have a young team with guys that while not as good as Sapp & Brooks in their prime are better than they were of late.
and i love how you say aside from getting qb's. that is the main big move they made that immediately started them winning. if not. prove it.
and why dont you name these good young guys that are making them go to the playoffs.... you cant... the QB made the difference.
your all arguing one position vs. an entire side of play.
that in itself should show you all how important that one position is.
better days
05-03-2011, 01:08 PM
Brad Johnson was replaced the season after. Know why? Tampa knew he wasn't good enough to get them there again. Same with the Ravens. Dilfer won a Super Bowl and was shown the door. They signed Elvis Grbac to big money to replace him. When people bring these guys up it only reinforces that you need a a quality franchise QB to consistently win, it is proven by the teams that won that almost immediately replaced the guy that got them there.
Well, what did either team do after letting those QB's go? Had they kept Dilfer in Baltimore they would have been better off until they actually found somebody better.
The point is a team can win it all with an average QB, a fact that can't be argued.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:10 PM
im saying we wont win with fitz. and i stick to that. i didnt state it before but it may have something to do with the fact that i dont think its feasable for us to have a "really good d" in the timeframe that i want us in the playoffs.
the peyton manning thing is a good point but arguable.
how can you say there are no franchise qb's available in this draft. i want to hear a draft year where there are no franchise qb's i did a quick look but went back from now to 06 and every year had a franchise qb, exept 07. some are to young to totally judge but there are franchise qb's in almost every draft. and the "year of the quarterback" is almost sure to have a franchise guy. its a fact of figuring out who it is.
and your proving me wrong stats prove that 70 percent of the top 10 qbs in every stat make the playoffs. id say that is not proving me wrong rather proving my point. if you are a top ten qb in a stat then more often then not you are going to the playoffs.
then you say that top defenses "plug and play". really that isnt true. top defenses dont plug and play their best players. your example is a guy who played a total of 6 games last year with 15 tackles. A NO NAME. and yes you can sub your worst player for anyone and not be worse. give me something better than aaron smith and ZIGGY hood. they both did nothing last year. look at the stats before you use them as an example. show me where troy polamolu got replaced. or where ray lewis got replaced. or where clay mathews got replaced. or someone of that caliber. then you can tell me where our player of that caliber is. the only one u can say is poz. who may only have that many tackles because everyone ran 1000 times a game on us and made it 6 yds every time.
heres the fact - a team with a good defense and a good qb can make the playoffs and win games. cincy, dallas, etc. i just dont see us having a good to really good defense as easy as your making it. i feel like we are alot of work away from it. my point is if we get a really good qb, its a one move fix and will put us relevent easier. that man may not exist for us right now. and im not upset about our draft. we addressed alot of huge issues we have. im happy with it. but i really want a great qb. we need a face of the francise and right now it is stevie. we can do better than that. i love him through and through but i feel like to have a great team you need to have a great qb.
Haha, "year of the quarterback"? Bullcrap. That's ESPN's horrid attempt at driving up viewers by naming it something it is NOT. And that phrase started surfacing before Luck decided to stay in school.
You actually believe 70 percent proves your point? Far from it. Great, so a majority of the top 10 QB's make the playoffs. So what? If there was as good of a correlation as you seem to believe, then that should be a 100% correlation. And if you didn't notice (which I'm sure you didn't), the top 10 defenses have an equal or better correlation year after year for teams that make the playoffs. And 7 of the top 10 QB's making the playoffs also means nearly half of the QB's who made the playoffs were NOT in the top 10.
You still haven't answered any of my questions: top 10 QB in what category? And what would your solution be? Gabbert? Ponder? Locker? McNabb? Which QB are you espousing as the solution to all our problems? What franchise QB are you saying we should get?
I seem to have a much different definition of franchise QB than you do. Going back to '06, 2006, 2007, and 2009 (so far) had zero franchise guys. Good QB's were even difficult to come by.
Wow, what exactly is your problem? You present zero statistics of your own to prove any points (and don't answer my questions), yet expect me to show you timetables of exactly when player X left and player Y came in, what happened before and what happened after? That's a load of bull. First of all, you'll just find a reason to explain away any statistics I'd present. Second of all, you're asking for statistics that are impossible to gain any insight into.
Just because you haven't heard of Evander Hood doesn't make him a no-name. There's a reason the Steelers draft DL every year, yet you never hear of them. They do the dirty work, they are the backbone of that defense. Do you ever hear the names Brett Keisel, or Aaron Smith? They're some of the best DE's in football, and keep undrafted free agents like James Harrison clean to get sacks.
Fitz is just fine and much better than what we've had in the past. We'll need to improve on him at some point, but desperation does not automatically mean opportunity. He's good enough for now, period.
Well, what did either team do after letting those QB's go? Had they kept Dilfer in Baltimore they would have been better off until they actually found somebody better.
The point is a team can win it all with an average QB, a fact that can't be argued.
what they did after letting them go is LOSE. proving once again the importance of a qb.
what is your point.
yes a team can win with an average qb but they cant repeat. that average qb played his career season and that is how they got there.
Well, what did either team do after letting those QB's go? Had they kept Dilfer in Baltimore they would have been better off until they actually found somebody better.
The point is a team can win it all with an average QB, a fact that can't be argued.
Elvis Grbac was regarded as a good signing. Hw was coming off of a 4169 yard season with 28 TDs. He did not play well for them and was not a fan favorite and was cut the season after for salary purposes. He ended up being very unpopular, but at the time he was most certainly considered an upgrade over Dilfer. Ravens had no offense at all after that for years. Bucs turned to Brian Griese thinking he was better and an upgrade over Brad Johnson, and we all know he wasn't that good either.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:14 PM
There is not one person of any significance in football who would take Fitz over Sanchez. By the way, Sanchez had 6.6 yards per attempt, Fitz was 6.8. He turned the ball over a lot less than Fitz did. Fitz, 20 in 13 games, Sanchez, 14 in 16, and he was clutch. I don't get how anyone could not say he is a better player then Fitz is. Makes no sense. Playoffs in his first two seasons. I hate the Jets and Sanchez too.
I love it when people pick and choose various numbers to try and prove a point. Sanchez was "clutch," that's pretty much your entire argument. That's nice, I guess it's difficult to be clutch when you have one of the best OL's in the league blocking for you and a Super Bowl MVP catching passes.
BTW, people that actually watch the games tallied dropped INT's this past year and said that Sanchez had the most by far, out of all the QB's. His "fewer turnovers" wasn't really that great and it was a fluke at that.
Sanchez is nowhere near a franchise QB.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:14 PM
your all arguing one position vs. an entire side of play.
that in itself should show you all how important that one position is.
When did people say it's not important?
When did people say it's not important?
you do by saying fitz is a good qb or our future
I love it when people pick and choose various numbers to try and prove a point. Sanchez was "clutch," that's pretty much your entire argument. That's nice, I guess it's difficult to be clutch when you have one of the best OL's in the league blocking for you and a Super Bowl MVP catching passes.
BTW, people that actually watch the games tallied dropped INT's this past year and said that Sanchez had the most by far, out of all the QB's. His "fewer turnovers" wasn't really that great and it was a fluke at that.
Sanchez is nowhere near a franchise QB.
Awesome argument, Sanchez is even worse the numbers show because the opposition did not intercept his passes when they had the chance to. That sounds pretty 3rd grade to me.
You do realize Fitz's biggest game came when the Bengals did not play their starting CB, both starting safeties, and the nickel corner in the 2nd half, right? It was 31-7 at the half, the starting safety had 2 INTs in the first half. That abomination would not have happened when 4 of the top 5 secondary players went out at halftime.
Sanchez is not elite, but playoffs in the first two seasons is pretty good.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:22 PM
you do by saying fitz is a good qb or our future
Reading comprehension is your friend.
I've said Fitz is good enough for now, while we're rebuilding. I've never said he's our future.
And no, saying Fitz is good enough for now is not the same as saying QB is not important.
Reading comprehension is your friend.
I've said Fitz is good enough for now, while we're rebuilding. I've never said he's our future.
And no, saying Fitz is good enough for now is not the same as saying QB is not important.
You fall behind further if you are not trying to get better. Fitz will never get better. That means we fall further behind.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:28 PM
Awesome argument, Sanchez is even worse the numbers show because the opposition did not intercept his passes when they had the chance to. That sounds pretty 3rd grade to me.
You do realize Fitz's biggest game came when the Bengals did not play their starting CB, both starting safeties, and the nickel corner in the 2nd half, right? It was 31-7 at the half, the starting safety had 2 INTs in the first half. That abomination would not have happened when 4 of the top 5 secondary players went out at halftime.
Sanchez is not elite, but playoffs in the first two seasons is pretty good.
3rd grade? Feel free to tell me exactly how that argument qualifies as "3rd grade." If I called you a ninny, maybe that would be third grade. But referring to people who, as I mentioned before, actually watched the games...he statistically had more dropped INT's by far than anyone else.
Sanchez would never be in the positions he was in if not for 1) his receivers, 2) his OL, 3) his DEFENSE. Heck, Sanchez had one of THE WORST games you could ever have as a QB the first week of the year. Yet they were still in it up until the end, thanks to THE DEFENSE. Funny how you don't mention that game, where he was awful, wasn't clutch, didn't come back, and couldn't throw the ball farther than 2 yards downfield.
Playoffs in his first two years is pretty good? That team was built for a championship. Two championships. Peyton Manning could have won a championship on that team if he threw with his left hand. The Jets in 2009 and 2010 were built so well that Ralph Wilson could have played QB and gotten to the playoffs. That is not an accomplishment. They barely made the playoffs in those years and it's pathetic that they didn't do better.
justasportsfan
05-03-2011, 01:28 PM
I love it when people pick and choose various numbers to try and prove a point. Sanchez was "clutch," that's pretty much your entire argument. That's nice, I guess it's difficult to be clutch when you have one of the best OL's in the league blocking for you and a Super Bowl MVP catching passes.
BTW, people that actually watch the games tallied dropped INT's this past year and said that Sanchez had the most by far, out of all the QB's. His "fewer turnovers" wasn't really that great and it was a fluke at that.
Sanchez is nowhere near a franchise QB.
Sanchez sucks 80% of the time , worse than Fitz ,Fitz had better nos. with a worse supporting cast but he can't win a playoff game.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:29 PM
You fall behind further if you are not trying to get better. Fitz will never get better. That means we fall further behind.
I guess QB is THE ONLY position we can get better at?
I guess QB is THE ONLY position we can get better at?
Jets and Pat are on top of the division, have established starters for the next 3 years at least, and they drafted QBs. Pretty smart, they know you need a QB to win and win big. Bills and Phins will struggle (although I think Miami will make a run at Kevin Kolb).
Reading comprehension is your friend.
I've said Fitz is good enough for now, while we're rebuilding. I've never said he's our future.
And no, saying Fitz is good enough for now is not the same as saying QB is not important.
ok were rebuilding?
have we been "rebuilding" for the past 11 years. i love the "rebuilding" argument. that is what people say when they have no argument and their team sux.
in the game of football where every season counts and a year is a long ass time, there is no such thing as good enough for now. why would you settle for less than average. when you say fitz is good enough for now your saying qb isnt important.
try your own comprehinsion!!!!
3rd grade? Feel free to tell me exactly how that argument qualifies as "3rd grade." If I called you a ninny, maybe that would be third grade. But referring to people who, as I mentioned before, actually watched the games...he statistically had more dropped INT's by far than anyone else.
Sanchez would never be in the positions he was in if not for 1) his receivers, 2) his OL, 3) his DEFENSE. Heck, Sanchez had one of THE WORST games you could ever have as a QB the first week of the year. Yet they were still in it up until the end, thanks to THE DEFENSE. Funny how you don't mention that game, where he was awful, wasn't clutch, didn't come back, and couldn't throw the ball farther than 2 yards downfield.
Playoffs in his first two years is pretty good? That team was built for a championship. Two championships. Peyton Manning could have won a championship on that team if he threw with his left hand. The Jets in 2009 and 2010 were built so well that Ralph Wilson could have played QB and gotten to the playoffs. That is not an accomplishment. They barely made the playoffs in those years and it's pathetic that they didn't do better.
i love your arguments. you get so intense.
your point is true. marks sanchez is terrible and only wins because of his supporting cast. but this isnt about one guy and deff not about mark sanchez.
it is possible to win playoff games and a superbowl with a crap qb. but you HAVE TO HAVE a top tier d at minimum. and a great o line and sick recievers help.
fact is WE DONT HAVE THAT.
so we should get a great qb to start winning games now and forever with a great qb. instead of hoping that our d will become top tier someday as long as we keep picking up un proven suposidly good players year after year after year.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:51 PM
ok were rebuilding?
have we been "rebuilding" for the past 11 years. i love the "rebuilding" argument. that is what people say when they have no argument and their team sux.
in the game of football where every season counts and a year is a long ass time, there is no such thing as good enough for now. why would you settle for less than average. when you say fitz is good enough for now your saying qb isnt important.
try your own comprehinsion!!!!
Nice.
No, it's not just an argument people use when they "have no argument and their team sux." It's absolutely true. What else do you call it? They're building a team by increasing the talent. Did they stink the last 11 years? Of course, no denying that. And yes, they were rebuilding but they went about it completely wrong, that's why they need to keep doing it.
There certainly is good enough for now when you can see things long-term. Every good team can see things in the long-term rather than the right now.
And who should they have replaced Fitz with?
If you're going to ***** about something, at least have a solution.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 01:54 PM
Jets and Pat are on top of the division, have established starters for the next 3 years at least, and they drafted QBs. Pretty smart, they know you need a QB to win and win big. Bills and Phins will struggle (although I think Miami will make a run at Kevin Kolb).
What's your point? Pats drafted a QB...along with about 9 other positions. Jets drafted one in the 7th round - boy, way to place a HUGE importance on it. Jets also have a great defense...yet spent their first two picks on defense. Hm, why do you think that was? Strange.
PSU, there are solutions offered. I think Bills should drafted Gabbert, and if not that, they had a chance at Dalton, Kaep, and Mallet. They did none of those things. I think they should try and trade for Kolb. too. There. You may not like those things but Fitz has proved he clearly isn't good enough to win. Two seasons in a row he was behind Trent Edwards on the depth chart. If that isn't an indictment of how mediocre he is I am not sure what is. Bills are his 3rd team. He was dumped by the lowly Rams and Bengals.
What's your point? Pats drafted a QB...along with about 9 other positions. Jets drafted one in the 7th round - boy, way to place a HUGE importance on it. Jets also have a great defense...yet spent their first two picks on defense. Hm, why do you think that was? Strange.
Pats defense stinks and they took a QB quite early. They let up more yards per game then the Bills did.
Nice.
No, it's not just an argument people use when they "have no argument and their team sux." It's absolutely true. What else do you call it? They're building a team by increasing the talent. Did they stink the last 11 years? Of course, no denying that. And yes, they were rebuilding but they went about it completely wrong, that's why they need to keep doing it.
There certainly is good enough for now when you can see things long-term. Every good team can see things in the long-term rather than the right now.
And who should they have replaced Fitz with?
If you're going to ***** about something, at least have a solution.
replace fitz with you. that would be an upgrade. at least you have heart.
in just tired of people saying we are rebuilding. especially when we have been "rebuilding" for over a decade.
your right about us having a different approach but i dont think we need be looking to fitz as our long term solution
and every good tream is considered good because they are winning. and what are we looking at for long term?
my solution is to start looking heavily to a franchise future qb.
maybe they are doing this already. they have stated that qb is one of their needs. hell they had cam at the top of their board apparently. im not arguing against what we have done. im just saying that we need to find one. and its frustrating to know that we have to go through this season with fitz under center.
replace fitz with you. that would be an upgrade. at least you have heart.
in just tired of people saying we are rebuilding. especially when we have been "rebuilding" for over a decade.
your right about us having a different approach but i dont think we need be looking to fitz as our long term solution
and every good tream is considered good because they are winning. and what are we looking at for long term?
my solution is to start looking heavily to a franchise future qb.
maybe they are doing this already. they have stated that qb is one of their needs. hell they had cam at the top of their board apparently. im not arguing against what we have done. im just saying that we need to find one. and its frustrating to know that we have to go through this season with fitz under center.
Exactly, I watch with my hands over my eyes and peek through sometimes.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 02:06 PM
PSU, there are solutions offered. I think Bills should drafted Gabbert, and if not that, they had a chance at Dalton, Kaep, and Mallet. They did none of those things. I think they should try and trade for Kolb. too. There. You may not like those things but Fitz has proved he clearly isn't good enough to win. Two seasons in a row he was behind Trent Edwards on the depth chart. If that isn't an indictment of how mediocre he is I am not sure what is. Bills are his 3rd team. He was dumped by the lowly Rams and Bengals.
I don't think I'd trust Jauron's judgment on players in any way, shape or form.
I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on both Fitz and the QB's that were drafted. I don't think any of those guys would be anything more than a very, very minor improvement on Fitz. You obviously think higher of them.
Exactly, I watch with my hands over my eyes and peek through sometimes.
hahah me too. i want to have the feeling of confidence when our o steps on the field. i feel like were always playing d when on o. like our goal isnt to score but to not mess up. i want to feel like. what big play are they about to drop on this poor defense right now.
heres the other thing.
can psu say that after this draft our d is good enough for us to now be able to fully focus on getting a qb. or do we still need more work at d.
psubills62
05-03-2011, 02:11 PM
your right about us having a different approach but i dont think we need be looking to fitz as our long term solution
I don't think they are. They've said many times that if they see a franchise QB in the draft, they'll take him. They obviously didn't see one that they liked. Could they be wrong? It's possible, but would you rather they try to improve the defense or whiff on yet another QB they aren't sure about?
and every good tream is considered good because they are winning. and what are we looking at for long term?
my solution is to start looking heavily to a franchise future qb.
maybe they are doing this already. they have stated that qb is one of their needs. hell they had cam at the top of their board apparently. im not arguing against what we have done. im just saying that we need to find one. and its frustrating to know that we have to go through this season with fitz under center.
So you're not arguing against what we've done...you're just arguing against what we haven't done? Again, if they don't see a franchise QB, they aren't going to draft one. If they can improve the teams in other ways, why not do that?
psubills62
05-03-2011, 02:15 PM
hahah me too. i want to have the feeling of confidence when our o steps on the field. i feel like were always playing d when on o. like our goal isnt to score but to not mess up. i want to feel like. what big play are they about to drop on this poor defense right now.
heres the other thing.
can psu say that after this draft our d is good enough for us to now be able to fully focus on getting a qb. or do we still need more work at d.
It's hard to say without seeing it on the field.
Like I've said in other threads, 3-4 DL usually take at least 1 year to develop, but they often do well in their sophomore years in the pros.
If they've happened to hit on a good number of the picks, I'd say we could use 2-3 more starters (OLB, DE, CB) and some more depth.
Don't take my arguments the wrong way - I have NO problem drafting a franchise QB if he's on the board. I know that I didn't see one this year, and obviously the Bills didn't see one on the board either. Next year? Who knows. If we're drafting and there's a QB that's very good on the board, I'd have no problem taking him. But there's no way I want Buffalo to reach for a mediocre QB when we could be improving our horrid defense.
It's hard to say without seeing it on the field.
Like I've said in other threads, 3-4 DL usually take at least 1 year to develop, but they often do well in their sophomore years in the pros.
If they've happened to hit on a good number of the picks, I'd say we could use 2-3 more starters (OLB, DE, CB) and some more depth.
Don't take my arguments the wrong way - I have NO problem drafting a franchise QB if he's on the board. I know that I didn't see one this year, and obviously the Bills didn't see one on the board either. Next year? Who knows. If we're drafting and there's a QB that's very good on the board, I'd have no problem taking him. But there's no way I want Buffalo to reach for a mediocre QB when we could be improving our horrid defense.
well then i would say that we agree here.
i would love for us to have a good d.
but i want someone to cheer for not just our team.
im just a sad bills fan on a low DECADE
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