Bills hope sticking with Harvard grad is a smart move

[justasportsfan]

And once Gabbert was selected later in the first round, by Jacksonville, the Bills were done shopping for quarterbacks. They stuck with defense in their next two picks, and essentially told Fitzpatrick: "This is your team."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81fb1993/article/bills-hope-sticking-with-harvard-grad-is-a-smart-move?module=HP_cp2

[BuffaloBlitz83]

I wonder if they would go Gabbert over Miller if Dareus went 2

[justasportsfan]

s Fitzpatrick told The Buffalo News, "it was cool"

heres the article

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81fb1993/article/bills-hope-sticking-with-harvard-grad-is-a-smart-move?module=HP_cp2

[Bangarang]

I have this feeling that Fitz is going to be terrible next season.

[justasportsfan]

I have this feeling that Fitz is going to be terrible next season.

I have the opposite feeling if the OL plays better , the run game gets better , Evans/Parrish stay healthy and the D gives him the ball back more often.

[Night Train]

The article makes complete sense in saying a stronger D will only help Fitz from constantly having to play from behind. Then he can play more within himself and let the RB's carry the load. We all know his limitations.

[psubills62]

Parrish was actually showing something in this offense before he got injured. I liked how they used him.

I doubt he can stay healthy the whole season, but if he could, he'd be a good asset. Wouldn't be a bad WR corps, despite having no true stars: Evans, Johnson, Parrish, Nelson, Easley. It's pretty obvious that the offense started going downhill as our WR's became injured, so hopefully they can stay on the field for the full season.

[TigerJ]

I expect modest improvement in Fitzpatrick because I expect modest improvement in the blocking and the running game. I also think the time pof possession is going to shift back toward the Bills a bit because the defense should be somewhat better at stopping the run. I'm not expecting any huge turnarounds in any one area, but cumulatively, I think it will result in a few more wins. Yes, I'm a diehard optimist.

[PromoTheRobot]

I have this feeling that Fitz is going to be terrible next season.
Why? Especially with Parrish and Marcus Easley coming back.

PTR

[Johnny Bugmenot]

I have this feeling that Fitz is going to be terrible next season.
Nah. Fitz is consistently mediocre. Do just enough to keep you competitive and hold you over, but he won't lead you to a Lombardi. But he won't lead you to 0-16, either. He's the perfect guy to lead the team to an 8-8 season. In other words, an ideal backup.

I still don't see why people think Gabbert is going to be this surefire starter.

[Bangarang]

Why? Especially with Parrish and Marcus Easley coming back.

PTR

Because he's just not that good of a QB to begin with.

[tomz]

Folks: He is at that age/point in his career where quarterbacks start to come into their own. He's not that old, right? He has not been a starter for much of that time. Maybe it just is coming together for him after some extended playing time. Granted, he does not seem to have elite physical tools but there seemed to be plenty of zip when it was needed. I have never been a huge fan but let's give the guy a chance. He did look good at times.

[PromoTheRobot]

Because he's just not that good of a QB to begin with.

He's not a QB that people fawn over. He's not a bad QB. In fact I think he's one the best team leaders we've had in some time. I also don't think we've seen Fitz's ceiling yet.

PTR

[NOT THE DUDE...]

Nah. Fitz is consistently mediocre. Do just enough to keep you competitive and hold you over, but he won't lead you to a Lombardi. But he won't lead you to 0-16, either. He's the perfect guy to lead the team to an 8-8 season. In other words, an ideal backup.

I still don't see why people think Gabbert is going to be this surefire starter.

the 91 redskins won a superbowl, 86, 90, 00, 07 giants all won or went to superbowls with solid qbs, non franchise guys. joe theisman was not a franchise qb, 02 bucs, 06 bears went to superbowl with rex grossman. doug williams won a superbowl, tommy maddox took the steelers to the playoffs. the list is very long. jim harbaugh took the colts to the 95 afc championship, hell i dont even consider troy aikman a franchise qb and he won 3....

[alohabillsfan]

I am hoping for Easly, I think he will not only help the passing game I also believe with his size he can be a formidable blocker in the running game and screens/bubble screens.

We have lacked strong blocking WR's for sometime.

[Bangarang]

He's not a QB that people fawn over. He's not a bad QB. In fact I think he's one the best team leaders we've had in some time. I also don't think we've seen Fitz's ceiling yet.

PTR

He's a great leader but I still think he's average at best as a starting QB. I also think last season was Fitz's ceiling.

[mayotm]

He's a great leader but I still think he's average at best as a starting QB. I also think last season was Fitz's ceiling.Why? He played significantly better in 2010 than he did in 2009. He's relativley young. Why can't he continue to improve?

[CleveSteve]

The part the OP quoted was the most interesting tidbit, but to me this is the most important.

The thinking is valid. Fitzpatrick was a 3,000-yard, 23-touchdown passer last season. If Dareus and third-round linebacker Kelvin Sheppard (http://www.nfl.com/draft/2011/profiles/kelvin-sheppard?id=2495229) are able to help significantly improve an atrocious run defense, Fitzpatrick can be good enough to make the Bills more competitive than they were in the 4-12 debacle of 2010.

And if Fitz stinks this year, it will most likely be b/c the OL is still broken.

[ddaryl]

For me I saw 1 thing in Fitz that I latch onto.... He reads the D quickly and makes decisions quickly....

his accuracy and arm strength is average at best... but the ability to read a D and make a decision quickly is what separates the QB failures from those who stick around for awhile.

All the QB's that make the NFL have talent, but many just cannot dissect what they see in front of them and then make a decision quick enough. Bills fans should know this all to well after Rob Johnson, Trent Edwards and JP Losman...

So when I show faith in Fitz it's because of this one trait that I feel is the true indicator/determinator of whether a QB can have some success in this league.

Not saying we shouldn't continue our search for a QB that has better arm strength and accuracy then Fitz but even that new QB will have to prove capable in the cognitive portion of the position.... and because of this one trait Fitz gives us a little wiggle room to wait for the right QB option to present itself

[cgbm]

I have the opposite feeling if the OL plays better , the run game gets better , Evans/Parrish stay healthy and the D gives him the ball back more often.

hahahhahah

so if everyone else performs well then fitz will have good numbers?

DUH

[cgbm]

the 91 redskins won a superbowl, 86, 90, 00, 07 giants all won or went to superbowls with solid qbs, non franchise guys. joe theisman was not a franchise qb, 02 bucs, 06 bears went to superbowl with rex grossman. doug williams won a superbowl, tommy maddox took the steelers to the playoffs. the list is very long. jim harbaugh took the colts to the 95 afc championship, hell i dont even consider troy aikman a franchise qb and he won 3....

really?

joe theisman isnt franchise?

jim harbaugh isnt frachise?

and to put the icing on the cake.... troy aikman isnt franchise?

who is?

.......GOD..... thats it!!!!!

[cgbm]

For me I saw 1 thing in Fitz that I latch onto.... He reads the D quickly and makes decisions quickly....

his accuracy and arm strength is average at best... but the ability to read a D and make a decision quickly is what separates the QB failures from those who stick around for awhile.

All the QB's that make the NFL have talent, but many just cannot dissect what they see in front of them and then make a decision quick enough. Bills fans should know this all to well after Rob Johnson, Trent Edwards and JP Losman...

So when I show faith in Fitz it's because of this one trait that I feel is the true indicator/determinator of whether a QB can have some success in this league.

Not saying we shouldn't continue our search for a QB that has better arm strength and accuracy then Fitz but even that new QB will have to prove capable in the cognitive portion of the position.... and because of this one trait Fitz gives us a little wiggle room to wait for the right QB option to present itself

i can hear that

kinda makes sense. really what needs to happen is us watch fitz this year and see how he performs. because in reality last year was kinda like a rookie season. at least as a starter. so give him this year to see if he can improve and prove to us that he is our guy. and the wiggle room is kinda right. hes not going to win a superbowl or even a playoff game (maybe) but he is good enough to hold us off for a year.

i just hate... letting us lose.

[PTI]

Folks: He is at that age/point in his career where quarterbacks start to come into their own. He's not that old, right? He has not been a starter for much of that time. Maybe it just is coming together for him after some extended playing time. Granted, he does not seem to have elite physical tools but there seemed to be plenty of zip when it was needed. I have never been a huge fan but let's give the guy a chance. He did look good at times.
He has the 19th or 20th most starts of all QBs in the NFL over the last 3 seasons. He has 33 starts in the last 3 seasons and played in 36 total games. Fitz has had consistent stretches of at least a whole half a season 3 years in a row and has not played well.

[trapezeus]

So 59% of QBs had more starting time over the last 3 years than fitz...sounds like he probably is trailing then. 19/32

anyways, i agree with ddaryl. he reads things well and will be a very important piece in helping a rookie learn. I think you re-up him and you make it clear that he has a place in the organization in coaching capacities when his skills diminish. he's a pretty cerebral guy. if he wants to be in football, that's a good in for him to breakinto coaching and what not.

he also doesn't seem to be a "me first" guy. he'll understand that he can't be the #1 the entire time and will probably go to the bench quietly.

Why get rid of that?

[justasportsfan]

hahahhahah

so if everyone else performs well then fitz will have good numbers?

DUH


DUH. Exactly. I was obviously stating the obvious that applies to EVERY qb.

[PromoTheRobot]

He's a great leader but I still think he's average at best as a starting QB. I also think last season was Fitz's ceiling.

Okay, let's go with that. If Fitz has the same season in 2011 over 16 games that's 3,400 yds and 26 TDs. I'll take that "average" any day.

PTR

[PTI]

Okay, let's go with that. If Fitz has the same season in 2011 over 16 games that's 3,400 yds and 26 TDs. I'll take that "average" any day.

PTR

You forgot to average out the number of INTs and fumbles, and the number of wins and number of times the Bills actually scored 20 points. Bills scored over 19 points just 4 total times last year.

[PromoTheRobot]

He has the 19th or 20th most starts of all QBs in the NFL over the last 3 seasons. He has 33 starts in the last 3 seasons and played in 36 total games. Fitz has had consistent stretches of at least a whole half a season 3 years in a row and has not played well.
2010 was his only season as the designated starter, not a mop up guy. This is hardly a fair or realistic measure.

PTR

[PTI]

2010 was his only season as the designated starter, not a mop up guy. This is hardly a fair or realistic measure.

PTR

He was designated starter in 2008 after Palmer went out. 12 straight games. 2008 he started 8 of the last 9 and the last 6 in a row. not sure how was not designated starter in those years too.

[PromoTheRobot]

You forgot to average out the number of INTs and fumbles, and the number of wins and number of times the Bills actually scored 20 points. Bills scored over 19 points just 4 total times last year.

Ryan Fitzpatrick stats based on 2010 over 16 games:
(fractions rounded off)

YDS: 3,429
TDs: 26
INTs: 17
Fumbles lost: 6
Rush YDS: 307

Yep PTI, what a disaster! :doh: Meanwhile if we drafted Gabbert and he had that year he's be hailed a future HOFer!

PTR

[PTI]

Ryan Fitzpatrick stats based on 2010 over 16 games:
(fractions rounded off)

YDS: 3,429
TDs: 26
INTs: 17
Fumbles lost: 6
Rush YDS: 307

Yep PTI, what a disaster! :doh: Meanwhile if we drafted Gabbert and he had that year he's be hailed a future HOFer!

PTR

Maybe Shaun Hill should start for Lions instead of Stafford?

11 games, 10 starts (3-7)
YDS: 2686
TDs: 16
INTs: 12
Fumbles lost: 1
Rush YDS: 123

Pretty much the same as Fitz. Love basing it on numbers.

Jason Campbell (12 starts, Raiders were 7-5)

YDS: 2387
TDs: 13
INTs: 8
Fumbles lost: 1
Rush YDS: 222

Fitz is just about no different than these guys. Bills just never ran the ball inside the 10 yard line.

Vince Young 8 starts (4-4)

YDS: 1255
TDs: 10
INTs: 3
Fumbles lost: 4
Rush YDS: 80

None of these guys numbers over 16 games were any better than each others. I am suck of stat whores tugging on Fitz's junk.

[PromoTheRobot]

Maybe Shaun Hill should start for Lions instead of Stafford?

11 games, 10 starts (3-7)
YDS: 2686
TDs: 16
INTs: 12
Fumbles lost: 1
Rush YDS: 123

Pretty much the same as Fitz. Love basing it on numbers.

Jason Campbell (12 starts, Raiders were 7-5)

YDS: 2387
TDs: 13
INTs: 8
Fumbles lost: 1
Rush YDS: 222

Fitz is just about no different than these guys. Bills just never ran the ball inside the 10 yard line.

Vince Young 8 starts (4-4)

YDS: 1255
TDs: 10
INTs: 3
Fumbles lost: 4
Rush YDS: 80

None of these guys numbers over 16 games were any better than each others. I am suck of stat whores tugging on Fitz's junk.

What's more tiring are people like you who think winning and losing is entirely a function of QB play. Did the Bills porous D contribute to any losses? How about Steve Johnson dropping a perfect TD pass in OT?

All I'm pointing out is stat-wise Fitz is adequate to start 2011, hoping our defense will improve significantly. I'm sure Nix would like to ad a franchise QB but you can't run out to Wal-Mart and get one.

As I've said many times before, every draft is full of "franchise QBs". Not saying they are, just that people think they are. I'm sure QB will be a priority in the 2012 draft.

PTR

[PTI]

The defense was very bad in many games. Fitz was very bad in many games. Bad combination.

The D contributed in many games, as did bad QB play. What is funny, in the games the Bills scored points, Fitz was outplayed in those games by the other QB. Fitz's turnovers and inaccuracy are just as much a reason as any. In the Patriots 38-30, JAgs 36-26, and Ravens 37-34, Fitz was outplayed by the opposing QB for you stat whores.

[justasportsfan]

The defense was very bad in many games. Fitz was very bad in many games. Bad combination.

The D contributed in many games, as did bad QB play. What is funny, in the games the Bills scored points, Fitz was outplayed in those games by the other QB. Fitz's turnovers and inaccuracy are just as much a reason as any. In the Patriots 38-30, JAgs 36-26, and Ravens 37-34, Fitz was outplayed by the opposing QB for you stat whores.


Lol. Sanchez was outplayed be a lot of qb's but they still won the games because of the D and running game.

[trapezeus]

You forgot to average out the number of INTs and fumbles, and the number of wins and number of times the Bills actually scored 20 points. Bills scored over 19 points just 4 total times last year.

You are like a quantitative trader. you have all the stats and assume the numbers alone tell a story. meanwhile, there is a story that also exists aside from the numbers.

Again, fitz ain't a legend, but when you have a bad first drive and the defense lets points up and you are essentially playing the pass the entire time, you aren't going to put up gaudy numbers.
i think there is a balance to be struck. Currently the balance is that the offense is the better side of the ball.

with this draft, we may see that balance shift. At that point, the offense will need some help.

what i don't like doing is ripping apart a capable player that we know and have a good working relationship to bring in an average/capable guy from another team who doesn't know our system and who has had problems elsewhere.

i like this team's process to the rebuild. patience is the key. and i think the defense is going to be more influential by simply making other teams have to throw the ball more.

In both jet games, the jets ran the most vanilla offense both times and ran all over us to 30+ points. no offense can keep up with that about of TOP and scoring.

[PTI]

Lol. Sanchez was outplayed be a lot of qb's but they still won the games because of the D and running game.

What you said makes no sense. Why are you commenting about nothing I spoke of in my post above? There was no Sanchez talk. If you want to, I will respond and say how in the world could Sanchez get outplayed and the Jets win because of the defense? If the Jets defense won the games there is no way the opposing QBs could have done well, thus no way Sanchez was outplayed then. Most of the time when a team loses though, it is because the QB plays bad. In Jets 10 wins Sanchez went for 16 TDs and 6 INTs, and in the 5 losses he had 1 TD and 7 INT (he sat one game). Fitz had 8 TDs in games won and 3 INTs, and in 9 losses he had 15 TDs and 12 INTs (and 4 lost fumbles too).

Fitz was good for 2 turnovers a game in the losses and a bad QB rating. Sanchez had 1/2 turnovers in their losses and bad QB rating. When you play better and don't turn the ball over you win more, common sense.

[justasportsfan]

What you said makes no sense. Why are you commenting about nothing I spoke of in my post above? There was no Sanchez talk. If you want to, I will respond and say how in the world could Sanchez get outplayed and the Jets win because of the defense? If the Jets defense won the games there is no way the opposing QBs could have done well, thus no way Sanchez was outplayed then. Most of the time when a team loses though, it is because the QB plays bad. In Jets 10 wins Sanchez went for 16 TDs and 6 INTs, and in the 5 losses he had 1 TD and 7 INT (he sat one game). Fitz had 8 TDs in games won and 3 INTs, and in 9 losses he had 15 TDs and 12 INTs (and 4 lost fumbles too).

Fitz was good for 2 turnovers a game in the losses and a bad QB rating. Sanchez had 1/2 turnovers in their losses and bad QB rating. When you play better and don't turn the ball over you win more, common sense.


because you insist Sanchez was a leader who lead his team and Fitz was someone who was the cause of our failures when in fact Sanchez wasn't the biggest factor in their wins and our D was the biggest factor in our loses.

Yes, no one is arguing Fitz had his problems, but the D was a bigger problem.

[PTI]

You are like a quantitative trader. you have all the stats and assume the numbers alone tell a story. meanwhile, there is a story that also exists aside from the numbers.

Again, fitz ain't a legend, but when you have a bad first drive and the defense lets points up and you are essentially playing the pass the entire time, you aren't going to put up gaudy numbers.
i think there is a balance to be struck. Currently the balance is that the offense is the better side of the ball.

with this draft, we may see that balance shift. At that point, the offense will need some help.

what i don't like doing is ripping apart a capable player that we know and have a good working relationship to bring in an average/capable guy from another team who doesn't know our system and who has had problems elsewhere.

i like this team's process to the rebuild. patience is the key. and i think the defense is going to be more influential by simply making other teams have to throw the ball more.

In both jet games, the jets ran the most vanilla offense both times and ran all over us to 30+ points. no offense can keep up with that about of TOP and scoring.
You start out every response to get people on your side by trying to make me look bad with words. It is a really backwards way of making a point. Attack someone's character first and then progress. It is the most cowardly way to talk to anyone.

Bills defense was decent in the first half, it is undeniable, especially the first quarter even the Jets scored on the first drive. Right after that the Bills fumbled the kickoff and the defense held. Bills went 3 and out on their first 3 drives, so I don't want to hear that crap. In between there in the first quarter the defense held 2 straight 3 and outs. We then held the Jets to a FG, it was 10-0 and then the Bills had their 4th straight 3 and out, right after the Bills Defense made them kick a FG after a long drive. Defense was forced right back on the field. We then let up a long TD pass and it was 17-0. Bills offense had 4 straight 3 and outs and special teams turnover. Most defenses would falter in the 2nd half after that. Bills did get a late TD after that in the first half.

Totally bad example man. You really better think before you type.

It was only 17-7 at the half. Route was on after the Bills opened the 2nd half WITH ANOTHER 3 AND OUT!!! First 6 drives, they had 5 total 3 and outs. CORRECTION, 2nd half we had 1 first down on the opening drive and then punted, and Jackson had 1 run for 12 yards on a first down and then 3 and out in the first half. Bills offense was dreadful in the first half. 3 of the drives 3 and out with 1 drive getting a first down on first down and then punting after 3 more plays.

[trapezeus]

i'm not knocking you. quantitative trading isn't an evil. all i'm saying is that the numbers can say one thing, but the actual games watched show you details that the numbers are missing.

You definitely have more numbers sorted out than I do. And i think some of the stuff you've said actually makes sense. Like the discounting of the bengals comeback. i get that and think you proved your point.

What i don't think makes sense is putting that all on fitz. the coaches,like you said, have stayed away from the run. Some of that is because they are pretty far behind early and the run is yielding less than 3 yards a run in the early stages of games. so to stay in it, they asked fitz to throw it. And like we all agree, his arm isn't money. He is going to turn it over.

I think the offense was actually bareable for the first time in years. i won't say that it's perfect, but i don't think replacing average pieces for unknown average pieces is the way to do it. When we know the defense had poor pieces. The linemen were terrible. Stroud showed his age. The steelers game we could have won had he not trailed roesthlisberger for the entire 18 yards on 3rd and 17.

Bills defense also had very few turnovers. i don't have the numbers, but when they went on the field, they stayed on the field. i remember tracking their 3rd conversions allowed. it was unbelievable.

So again, to be clear, i wasn't calling you a name. I'm just saying your approach is very numbers based and dismisses alot of the qualitative stuff that we all know we saw.

and in the end the numbers will always stick. the quanalitative stuff becomes hazy as we get further away from those games.

[PTI]

GO BILLS!!!! I firmly believe the quickest way for the Bills to be a good team is for QB to be settled. If Fitz lights it up and the Bills win some games then we will all be happier.

[PromoTheRobot]

The fact is Fitz is the starting QB for 2011 so deal with it. End of argument.

PTR

[justasportsfan]

GO BILLS!!!! I firmly believe the quickest way for the Bills to be a good team is for QB to be settled. If Fitz lights it up and the Bills win some games then we will all be happier.


I do too. The last time we went to a sb was with a franchise qb. However, if there isn't a clear cut franchise to be had, I don't mind building a great D.

Brees couldn't win one until Greg Williams was brought in to fix the D.
Aaron Rogers won one with the best D.
Manning won one when their D was no.1 in the playoffs.
Pitts always had a great D.

[trapezeus]

one kind of sad thought is that our debates over the last 10 years have gone from legit arguments about high talent to this.

johnson or flutie
Bledsoe or Losman
losman or holcomb
losman or edwards
edwards or fitz
Fitz or just about anyone who can throw the ball 20 yards.

It's a little sickening, no?

[PTI]

one kind of sad thought is that our debates over the last 10 years have gone from legit arguments about high talent to this.

johnson or flutie
Bledsoe or Losman
losman or holcomb
losman or edwards
edwards or fitz
Fitz or just about anyone who can throw the ball 20 yards.

It's a little sickening, no?
Any Mularkey and Jauron discussions as a HC made me vomit more than once too.

RB just is a list of names to forget, Henry to Willis to Lynch, sure hope the guys we got can get it done.

[Demon]

And once Gabbert was selected later in the first round, by Jacksonville, the Bills were done shopping for quarterbacks. They stuck with defense in their next two picks, and essentially told Fitzpatrick: "This is your team."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81fb1993/article/bills-hope-sticking-with-harvard-grad-is-a-smart-move?module=HP_cp2

Not sure if that is true.


"I know the Buffalo Bills (http://content.usatoday.com/topics/topic/Organizations/Sports+Leagues/NFL/Buffalo+Bills) were definitely going to trade up into the first round to get Ponder," Miller said.

Link- http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2011-05-03-jake-locker-sw_N.htm?csp=34sports&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+UsatodaycomNfl-TopStories+%28Sports+-+NFL+-+Top+Stor

[Thief]

really?

joe theisman isnt franchise?

jim harbaugh isnt frachise?

and to put the icing on the cake.... troy aikman isnt franchise?

who is?

.......GOD..... thats it!!!!!I must say, I think Harbaugh would have been booed out of the Rich if he played for the Bills.

[djjimkelly]

I have this feeling that Fitz is going to be terrible next season.


either good or very bad suits me fine.

good means he gets a real look and maybe we have one less real need

very bad is great also considering luck and barkley are in play next year