Owners Made a Nice Move - Now The Players Can Squirm

[Night Train]

I'm NOT taking sides. Just observing that the Owners were very aware of a financial timeline and for whatever reason, the last 2-3 % of this deal couldn't get done.

So they put on a good performance yesterday and the PR pressure is shifted squarely back on D Smith and his disciples. The longer this takes, the worse the players look to the fans.

I do think the Owners currently have a far better understanding of the term " negotiation " . You can't just take, you have to give and some issues won't get ratified.

It will be interesting how the players respond. If they start crying for sympathy today, they'll be hanging themselves with the public.

I think D Smith and his legal team better get moving and STFU.

[Jan Reimers]

I agree. I can't see what the players have to gain, at this point, by prolonging this thing - except maybe missing some training camp, which is getting more and more like a country club, anyway, under the new CBA.

If they delay the agreement for any serious length of time, the fans - who are now chomping at the bit, given the owners' vote - will really be pissed.

[McBFLO]

How is sneaking things in at the last minute good business? Sleezey move by the owners. I think the Players are right to be cautious in proceeding. And if this whole things blows up at this point, I'd blame it squarely on the Owners for the scam they tries to pull last night. Having said that, if it blows up, what a freakin joke...

[Historian]

They should do what they did in '87.

Bring in replacements until the players cave. (Which takes all of about a month)

[Dujek]

How is sneaking things in at the last minute good business? Sleezey move by the owners. I think the Players are right to be cautious in proceeding. And if this whole things blows up at this point, I'd blame it squarely on the Owners for the scam they tries to pull last night. Having said that, if it blows up, what a freakin joke...

There was nothing "sneaked in" the owners simply added in how they were going to distribute shared revenues, which has NOTHING to do with the players.

Smith and the rest of his lackeys simply want to keep their names in the news as long as possible.

[Jan Reimers]

How is sneaking things in at the last minute good business? Sleezey move by the owners. I think the Players are right to be cautious in proceeding. And if this whole things blows up at this point, I'd blame it squarely on the Owners for the scam they tries to pull last night. Having said that, if it blows up, what a freakin joke...
So, you've swallowed the players' point of view hook, line and sinker?

I'd like to know exactly what the owners "sneaked" in, and how it affects the total package. The players certainly knew all of the major parts of the agreement before last evening. I agree that the players should be cautious, and review anything new that the owners added at the last minute, but to automatically assume that the owners were sleezy is a little over the top.

I think that originally, the players were to vote Wednesday and the owners Thursday. Only the owners lived up to the schedule. I think they were right to at least move this thing along, and force the players to do SOMETHING other than nit pick and procrastinate.

The time for any sort of meaningful preseason, as well as starting the season on time, is getting very short.

[X-Era]

The players are not professional businessmen, they are players. And they acted like it last night.

How do you start trashing a deal when you haven't even seen it yet? They should have just shown patience and kept their mouths shut until they saw all the details. Instead some act like babies and start blowing up there twitter accounts and calling into shows to *****. Maybe act a bit more professional and wait to see the details.

Ego is the other thing at play. They want to be pampered and to have their own timelines and we will vote our way. They are having some problems with ego. They need to realize that the clock is ticking and games and money will be lost and work with the league to come up with a plan on when to vote and what and when the next steps are. Business people do this. They set ego aside and work to get things done.

Everyone knows your important, everyone sees you, and we all know nothing happens until you agree to it. So leave all your emotions at the door and get to work.

[X-Era]

How is sneaking things in at the last minute good business? Sleezey move by the owners. I think the Players are right to be cautious in proceeding. And if this whole things blows up at this point, I'd blame it squarely on the Owners for the scam they tries to pull last night. Having said that, if it blows up, what a freakin joke...Sneaking things in or players that didn't know the details but lashed out anyways?

[X-Era]

I agree. I can't see what the players have to gain, at this point, by prolonging this thing - except maybe missing some training camp, which is getting more and more like a country club, anyway, under the new CBA.

If they delay the agreement for any serious length of time, the fans - who are now chomping at the bit, given the owners' vote - will really be pissed.I think it's logical and probable that some players would like this to kill most of TC and preseason games... I don't think for a second that all of them are aching to get into camp and play preseason games.

[Novacane]

The players are not professional businessmen, they are players. And they acted like it last night.

.


You're being nice. I say most of them are just dumb jocks that don't have a clue to about business. They hired competent people to represent them. Now they should stfu and listen to them.

[mrbojanglezs]

of course the owners are better negotiators the owners are wealthy successful business men, the players tackle people and get concussions for a living.

[X-Era]

You're being nice. I say most of them are just dumb jocks that don't have a clue to about business. They hired competent people to represent them. Now they should stfu and listen to them.It's worse. They wouldn't even STFU until they had the information. It was funny because everytime one of the players called into the NFLN Eisen asked them what part of the deal they didn't like and they had no answers. They never answered it. Because they didn't know the details.

Let's get all the fans to buy the 1900 players rooms at the Sandals hotel. We will make sure there are 1900 copies of the full document and they can be lavishly pampered as they take their sweet time to review it. They can sit poolside and sip mojito's and collectively ***** as much as they want. We can distribute re-certification cards that are disguised as free passes to "happy ending" massages that just need their signatures. They get 2 all inclusive nights... Saturday and Sunday night. And as the checkout they have to return the signed deal.

[CoolBreeze]

This deal was hammered out with De Smith, that's his job. In an interview with Carolina owner Jerry Richardson, he said that, as did John Mara of the Giants. It was Smith's failure to pass it along. It's. no different than UPS dealing with teamster president James Hoffa. No company or football owners in their right mind would ratify a union contract, without the assurance and prior approval of the union president. I believe that would violate labor laws. Player reps may not have seen the ratified contract, however that is not the fault of owners.

[X-Era]

This deal was hammered out with De Smith, that's his job. In an interview with Carolina owner Jerry Richardson, he said that, as did John Mara of the Giants. It was Smith's failure to pass it along. It's. no different than UPS dealing with teamster president James Hoffa. No company or football owners in their right mind would ratify a union contract, without the assurance and prior approval of the union president. I believe that would violate labor laws. Player reps may not have seen the ratified contract, however that is not the fault of owners.Exactly.

[Historian]

What was the resolution about the pre season?

Will they cut the preseason and add two reg season games?

[X-Era]

What was the resolution about the pre season?

Will they cut the preseason and add two reg season games?It was agreed that they would not change to 18 games at this time but would discuss it in future years.

[MikeInRoch]

Someone name for me one thing that was "slipped in at the last minute". And don't say the revenue sharing, because that's a) a separate thing and b) none of the players business.

[Michael82]

Someone name for me one thing that was "slipped in at the last minute". And don't say the revenue sharing, because that's a) a separate thing and b) none of the players business.
Exactly! Nothing was slipped in. The players are just uninformed and the owners are making them look very foolish each time they go crying to the media or on twitter.

[CoolBreeze]

What's even more shameful is the way ESPN and others reported owners approved their own contract without player rep involvement. I think ESPN really showed who's side they are on. So much for objective reporting.

[Mski]

What's even more shameful is the way ESPN and others reported owners approved their own contract without player rep involvement. I think ESPN really showed who's side they are on. So much for objective reporting.thats what happens when most of their on air personalities that cover the NFL are former players

[Historian]

watch it about eight minutes in. This sums up the game pretty succinctly.


<OBJECT style="WIDTH: 640px; HEIGHT: 390px">


<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/tCr1d_h45EQ?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="390"></OBJECT></P>

[X-Era]

TKO:

"...if theres a training camp".

Exactly, the players have no motivation to get to camp or play the preseason.

[Night Train]

I don't believe for a second the owners have tried to sneak anything in.

Roger The God & Mr. D Smith speak many hours a day & Smith knew what the deal was the owners were voting on yesterday. There were NO surprises.

Reportedly the problem is Smith getting the word out or a complete lack of understanding by the Players on the language of the deal.

I like how the players knew for months how to decertify the union in a minute, then suddenly " need time " to figure out how to recertify. :rofl:

Sounds like some players are loving this time off & want to skip camp and a few pre-season games. Maybe flush their bods of some " Toxins " ?

Quit tweeting clueless opinions and start learning the deal, which seems to be win/win for everyone but the fans.

[Dujek]

Currently amusing myself by calling Trey Wingo out on twitter for his bull**** pro-player bias.

Helping to put the time in while I'm waiting for my bread to bake.

[X-Era]

Basically were down to waiting for the players to take there sweet time to go through a document that the player leadership already has agreed to.

Looks like Monday will be the vote which still meets the Tuesday deadline. No doors will open this weekend IMO.

But the dumbest part is this:

We will open the doors so that you can vote to be a union... we won't vote to walk through those doors until were a union.

[Night Train]

There have been some good fan comments proceeding many of the national articles today. My favorite..

" This labor mess has turned me more towards college football, where the kids are happy to play for what they're paid. "

:rofl:

[X-Era]

Nothings happening until Monday at the earliest... I'm frustrated, I have good beer, and I'm home from a long work week... I think I'm out for a while.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

They should do what they did in '87.

Bring in replacements until the players cave. (Which takes all of about a month) Not really possible in this environment-- remember, the league initiated the lockout. In '87, the players struck-- the NFL just hired replacements to get the game moving again. Plus, the union decertified. So, you can't just lock out a decertified union without locking out everybody. In other words, replacement players would be impossible in this environment.

[Buddo]

I don't blame the players for needing some more time to look over what the Owners have put into the agreement, they would be stupid not to. However, I do blame them for going off at the deep end, without actually knowing what has been inserted, and what it relates to. All that is doing is causing additional confusion everywhere.
There are very good chances, that whatever has been inserted, or added, affects the players side of the deal, in no way whatsoever, particularly as it seems it's related to how the Owners share their own slice of the revenue.

[Dujek]

I don't blame the players for needing some more time to look over what the Owners have put into the agreement, they would be stupid not to. However, I do blame them for going off at the deep end, without actually knowing what has been inserted, and what it relates to. All that is doing is causing additional confusion everywhere.
There are very good chances, that whatever has been inserted, or added, affects the players side of the deal, in no way whatsoever, particularly as it seems it's related to how the Owners share their own slice of the revenue.

All that was inserted was revenue sharing. Nothing to do with the players at all, so they should shut the **** up and get on with it.

[methos4ever]

They actually did insert a little more than revenue sharing...http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/22/the-open-items-before-the-leagues-approval-of-the-labor-deal/


The open items are set forth below.

First, the minimum team expenditure would be only 89 percent of the salary cap. The term would be coupled with a guaranteed league-wide cash spend of 95 percent of the salary cap. If half of the teams spend 100 percent of the cap, half could spend 90 percent of the cap, preserving as a practical matter a 10-percent spread between the highest-spending and lowest-spending teams. If, alternatively, all teams have a minimum cash spend of 95 percent, the total cash spend would be 97.5 percent or more, assuming at least half of the teams spend 100 percent of their allotment, with the other half spending 95 percent.

Second, those offseason workout bonuses (such as the $750,000 due to Jets tackle D’Brickashaw Ferguson) would be paid if the player reports to training camp and performs the services required of him. Thus, under this term, players who report for work (and then work) would earn all offseason workout bonuses, despite the absence of an offseason workout program.

Third, for rookie pay, an escalator would be available to push the fourth-year salary to the lowest level restricted free agency tender, which is $1.2 million in 2011, but which will increase with the salary cap.

Fourth, players would be guaranteed up to $3 million for the second and third year after a catastrophic injury. Balzer reports that, in the deal approved by the league on Thursday, the number had been cut to $1 million in the second year and $500,000 in the third year.

Fifth, the California loophole for workers’ compensation benefits would continue.

Sixth, the possibility of an opt out was included as an open item. Balzer reports that the final version included no opt out, making it a firm 10-year deal. (It has been reported that the players want a potential opt out after seven years.)

Seventh, payment of $320 million in lost benefits would be made for the 2010 season. In the summary document, the lump sum expressly is linked to the “lockout insurance” case. Basically, the players are proposing the restoration of those lost benefits as the payment of damages for the league’s failure to max out TV money when persuading the networks to pay rights fees during a lockout.

Eighth, a settlement of the Brady antitrust case would need to be made, separate and apart from the labor deal.

Ninth, a player would be subject to the franchise tag only once in his career.

Tenth, short-term injured reserve would be available, along with a possible game-day roster of 47. The deal approved by the owners reportedly limits the game-day roster to 46.

It's one thing to be shrewd businessmen, it's another to be a bad faith partner in a contract, IMHO.

[X-Era]

They actually did insert a little more than revenue sharing...http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/22/the-open-items-before-the-leagues-approval-of-the-labor-deal/



It's one thing to be shrewd businessmen, it's another to be a bad faith partner in a contract, IMHO.Do you think any of those points were not discussed with De Smith? That's the point.

Put it this way. I think there is what De Smith knew and agreed to and then theres what the rest of the players knew.

They *****ed because they didn't have the details and IMO De Smith did and had already handshake agreed on them.

[X-Era]

"First, the minimum team expenditure would be only 89 percent of the salary cap. The term would be coupled with a guaranteed league-wide cash spend of 95 percent of the salary cap. If half of the teams spend 100 percent of the cap, half could spend 90 percent of the cap, preserving as a practical matter a 10-percent spread between the highest-spending and lowest-spending teams. If, alternatively, all teams have a minimum cash spend of 95 percent, the total cash spend would be 97.5 percent or more, assuming at least half of the teams spend 100 percent of their allotment, with the other half spending 95 percent."

Some thing is wrong here. This can't be the details because it doesn't make sense. How can the league guarantee the players 95% overall without some way of ensuring half the teams pay 100% as an example? What are they going to do, go to the big spending teams and demand they spend 100% so that other teams only spend 89%? Makes no sense.

All teams could pay 89% and then they would not meet the 95% number. You can't guarantee a 95% league wide spend without some further method of getting teams to spend more. Really the only way to ensure a 95% minimum league wide spend is to ensure that all teams spend a minimum of 95% individually.

I think there is a missing piece.

[methos4ever]

Do you think any of those points were not discussed with De Smith? That's the point.

Put it this way. I think there is what De Smith knew and agreed to and then theres what the rest of the players knew.

They *****ed because they didn't have the details and IMO De Smith did and had already handshake agreed on them.
But from what has transpired, though I know it's far easier for some to assume that the "dumb players" are just mad that De didn't explain to them - it's easier for me to assume the items they still had to work on were put in the owners CBA as final and in their favor.

[X-Era]

But from what has transpired, though I know it's far easier to assume that the "dumb players" are just mad that De didn't explain to them - it's easier for me to assume the items they still had to work on were put in the owners CBA as final and in their favor.The problem with that notion is that Goodell would have told the owners they had a "deal" without really having one because De Smith wouldn't have agreed to those extra terms yet.

I think it's less plausible.

And, the data is already out there. You can go back through when comments were made about the owners sneaking stuff in and see that they didn't even have the whole document yet.

[ParanoidAndroid]

I'm not a player or an owner, but as a fan, I'm frustrated. The first thing I want to do is point a finger. Then, I want someone to make a concession so I can be entertained. I might even ***** a little bit in the process. But the truth is, I have no idea why this really hasn't happened yet. I wonder if it is incompetence, greed, laziness, or pride, but I think it is more about stubborn negotiation. They are both waiting it out to get the best deal possible.
We will have football. In the meantime, I'm going to enjoy my summer and the beautiful weather.

[X-Era]

This whole thing right now is about ego.

The players are making a power play. They are playing tough guy by letting the NFL know that they will take as long as they want to agree to this deal. OK. Your tough. Don't mess with you. Your important. But when your menstrual cycle ends will you go ahead and sign the document?

Seriously.

IMO the details won't change, Smith has already agreed to them, the players will have a majority that will vote the deal through. They just want to decide when they will vote and re-certify.

Personally I have a good feeling that it could be today.

[Mr. Pink]

The difference is the players aren't as stupid as the owners were last go round.

Would you agree to something that had 10 new points on it that you hadn't even discussed in the first place regardless of what those points are? I think not.

It's a breach of good faith and at the point we're at now, a breach of good faith is not something that should have occurred.

[X-Era]

The difference is the players aren't as stupid as the owners were last go round.

Would you agree to something that had 10 new points on it that you hadn't even discussed in the first place regardless of what those points are? I think not.

It's a breach of good faith and at the point we're at now, a breach of good faith is not something that should have occurred.So a conference room that seats 1932 people?

[methos4ever]

The problem with that notion is that Goodell would have told the owners they had a "deal" without really having one because De Smith wouldn't have agreed to those extra terms yet.

I think it's less plausible.

And, the data is already out there. You can go back through when comments were made about the owners sneaking stuff in and see that they didn't even have the whole document yet.


Really, the whole time, in the aforementioned articles and comments that followed, the key was that there would be portions of the deal that were in progress and would be settled post-globally. Should some such as Heath Evans have evidence when shouting "we wuz robbed"? Sure.

But I'm sure De is aware of what was changed, as well as what the players feel was a "mission accomplished" photo op PC by the owners without them. I can also imagine that the is exactly what De and Roger Goodell discussed and that he's trying to not overstep his bounds with the execs so he can be re-elected.

My problem with this is that some of those items by your own admission are shaky, but unless Jack Bauer tapped that call no one knows, but yet instantly we know who is at fault.

[better days]

They actually did insert a little more than revenue sharing...http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/22/the-open-items-before-the-leagues-approval-of-the-labor-deal/



It's one thing to be shrewd businessmen, it's another to be a bad faith partner in a contract, IMHO.

On one hand the players say they haven't seen the contract. On the other hand they say things have been inserted into it that they don't know about.

Well, if they haven't seen the contract, how do they know anything was inserted into it?

IMO De Smith told the players to do this after leading Goodell & the owners into thinking they had a deal, the players & Smith are the ones with bad faith.

[X-Era]

On one hand the players say they haven't seen the contract. On the other hand they say things have been inserted into it that they don't know about.

Well, if they haven't seen the contract, how do they know anything was inserted into it?

IMO De Smith told the players to do this after leading Goodell & the owners into thinking they had a deal, the players & Smith are the ones with bad faith.I don't think there is anyone who has done anything wrong. Smith gave a handshake deal, Goodell took the deal to the 32 owners who happened to be all together and they voted it through, and now Smith is in the process of going through the details with his players. Heath Evans and others have already stated that they trust Smith and if he feels this is a good deal, the majority will vote it through.

I think what you saw is some players reacting poorly to the owners calling it a deal. And if you want to lay blame, I would lay blame on the NFL for allowing anyone to comment on a deal before the players have officially agreed to it. That's what provoked the responses from the players. And if you listen to them, they basically admit that the CBA terms are settled.

Which brings me back to my point which is widely reported. They just want to take their time, however long it may be, to vote on this.

It's procedural at this point, but the deal is made... just my opinion.

[methos4ever]

On one hand the players say they haven't seen the contract. On the other hand they say things have been inserted into it that they don't know about.

Well, if they haven't seen the contract, how do they know anything was inserted into it?

IMO De Smith told the players to do this after leading Goodell & the owners into thinking they had a deal, the players & Smith are the ones with bad faith.

I look at this like when you're buying a car. You think you have the price set, and then right before you sign, you see there's something you talked about not buying all of the sudden on the paperwork...

I think that some of the exec committee reacted because they were aware of what was tentative and what was agreed to. For instance, don't you think we would have heard a leak at least at some point on the concession of no judicial oversight? Or the issue of Goodell still having complete power over discipline still?

I'm just saying the same owners that bilk us for 10 games when they play 8, charge 8 bucks for a 2 dollar beer wouldn't try and slip a quick one by?

The biggest mistake they made to me was the press conference. If they hadn't done that and said they'll hold on celebrations until the PA agree, I would have not a question about it.

I get the players aren't all informed. But, hey, maybe I'm the dork and this whole thing is just bunk by the players. I just don't see the vitriol. They'll get it done.

[Mr. Pink]

So a conference room that seats 1932 people?


Sure!

And lock the doors and make them all sit there until they can hammer something out.

The way it went now, I would have been pissed if I was a player or player rep the way things went down.

[X-Era]

Sure!

And lock the doors and make them all sit there until they can hammer something out.

The way it went now, I would have been pissed if I was a player or player rep the way things went down.Everyone has a voice and it will be heard through their vote. But why have player rep's or De Smith at all then?

They are *****ing about their own structure. They chose to have it this way and one of the downsides is that it may take time to get the details of a possible deal.

[Mr. Pink]

Everyone has a voice and it will be heard through their vote. But why have player rep's or De Smith at all then?

They are *****ing about their own structure. They chose to have it this way and one of the downsides is that it may take time to get the details of a possible deal.


The owners could have saved themselves a huge amount of publicity and hassle if they didn't announce that they voted and agreed upon something. If they didn't announce it, no one would know and we'd be sitting here all wondering when the sides would come to an agreement.

Basically the owners tried a bs tactic to get the power of the media and the people behind them to press the players into signing something or become vilified.

Would you agree with that?

[X-Era]

The owners could have saved themselves a huge amount of publicity and hassle if they didn't announce that they voted and agreed upon something. If they didn't announce it, no one would know and we'd be sitting here all wondering when the sides would come to an agreement.

Basically the owners tried a bs tactic to get the power of the media and the people behind them to press the players into signing something or become vilified.

Would you agree with that?No.

I don't think they intentionally tried to pull a fast one. I do think, however, they were stupid and should have waited and held a joint conference with the players to announce a deal.

But, in this day and age it was going to leak that they voted yes to a deal.

[paranoid]

They actually did insert a little more than revenue sharing...http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...he-labor-deal/ (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/22/the-open-items-before-the-leagues-approval-of-the-labor-deal/)


Where is the bad faith? Some of those look like concessions to the players (i.e. the "California loophole.")

Is there evidence that those were "snuck in" as little landmines, or are they just open issues to be finalized?

[Jan Reimers]

If these open items are deemed contentious enough for the players to continue their posturing and procrastinating, then let them sit out a season and bring in replacements.

Whatever sympathy I had for the players is now long gone.

[ParanoidAndroid]

If it wasn't for my love for Buffalo, NY, I would be absolutely done with major professional sports.

[better days]

The owners could have saved themselves a huge amount of publicity and hassle if they didn't announce that they voted and agreed upon something. If they didn't announce it, no one would know and we'd be sitting here all wondering when the sides would come to an agreement.

Basically the owners tried a bs tactic to get the power of the media and the people behind them to press the players into signing something or become vilified.

Would you agree with that?

Well, I don't know what others heard, but when they held the press conference, I heard the owners say it was subject to approval by the players.

I think the only bs is Smith & the players dragging their feet to recertify.

[Mr. Pink]

If these open items are deemed contentious enough for the players to continue their posturing and procrastinating, then let them sit out a season and bring in replacements.

Whatever sympathy I had for the players is now long gone.


The owners have already gone on record and said they will never bring in scabs again as they feel it tarnishes the brand more than what is going on now.

I actually tend to agree with that. If I wanted to watch 2nd rate football, I'd turn on the UFL and watch JP Losman as league MVP.

[Luisito23]

Why anyone would want to see replacements is beyond me...I rather they'll be no football, then watch scrubs every Sunday.

[Jan Reimers]

I didn't suggest replacements because I wanted to see them play, but to punish the spoiled rotten NFL players for their stupidity.

[cookie G]

The owners have already gone on record and said they will never bring in scabs again as they feel it tarnishes the brand more than what is going on now.

I actually tend to agree with that. If I wanted to watch 2nd rate football, I'd turn on the UFL and watch JP Losman as league MVP.

People can always switch to watching college football on Saturdays, and find something else to do on Sundays. College football (non Notre Dame Football Network football games), gets about 30% to 40% of NFL games.

It wouldn't be hard for people to switch allegiance to a favorite college team, or favorite conference. Can college football become a more popular game than the NFL? Maybe. The NCAA college basketball finals blows away the NBA finals in terms of TV ratings.

Would it matter if it actually surpasses it? Frankly, I think the continued screwing around in this debacle, especially if there is a work stoppage, could alienate the fringe fan base. Most of the hardcore base will continue to watch, but the casual viewers are the ones that might not come back.

The fringe fan base this the NFL's profit margin. The mom's who buy their kids' jerseys, the corporate execs. who buy tickets because the NFL is a hot ticket item, etc.

If the NFL loses its "hot item" status due to some really stupid in fighting...well...bummer.

[Luisito23]

Football will always be the hot item.

[better days]

Football will always be the hot item.

That is probably what baseball people thought about baseball when they cancelled the World Series. They were WRONG.

[mikemac2001]

i am already leaning towards hockey

this **** is annoying the f out of me

[Mr. Pink]

That is probably what baseball people thought about baseball when they cancelled the World Series. They were WRONG.


Football was already the hot ticket when that happened. And baseball has regained most of what it lost since their strike.

[cookie G]

Football will always be the hot item.

Yes it is...and there is certainly no other professional football league that will draw people away.

The NCAA might, however.

-After the 1998 NBA lockout, TV ratings for the NBA finals dropped by more than 1/3. They've never regained those ratings.

-In the early 1990's Indy car racing was on par with Nascar in terms of attendance and corporate sponsorship. Then there was the feud between the drivers and the owner of the Indy Car League. Open wheel racing never recovered, and the advertising dollars, as well as most racing fans, went over to Nascar.

The NFL is definitely king, but the king's marketing structure is now based on a pretty wide base of support. It won't take a complete disintegration of that support base to do damage to their bottom line, only an alienation of some of that support.

A 10 year old kid can just as easily become a University of Florida fan as he can become a Tampa Bay fan, or an Ohio State fan as opposed to a Cleveland Brown's fan.

[better days]

Football was already the hot ticket when that happened. And baseball has regained most of what it lost since their strike.

Football was gaining in popularity but Baseball was still #1 before that happened. Baseball has recovered to a great extent but it took them a long time to get to where they are today & included a year where Baseball looked the other way so records could be broken by players cheating with the use of steroids & corked bats.

[Ingtar33]

the NFL never loses. That's all this shows in the end. The players will vote to ratify on monday, and that will be the end of that.

[Spiderweb]

I don't believe for a second the owners have tried to sneak anything in.

Roger The God & Mr. D Smith speak many hours a day & Smith knew what the deal was the owners were voting on yesterday. There were NO surprises.

Reportedly the problem is Smith getting the word out or a complete lack of understanding by the Players on the language of the deal.

I like how the players knew for months how to decertify the union in a minute, then suddenly " need time " to figure out how to recertify. :rofl:

Sounds like some players are loving this time off & want to skip camp and a few pre-season games. Maybe flush their bods of some " Toxins " ?

Quit tweeting clueless opinions and start learning the deal, which seems to be win/win for everyone but the fans.

Since their is no agreement until both side agree, it's foolish to think that either side wouldn't give a thing or two one last shot to better their position. Also, since no one on this board has been privy to the negotiations and the written documentation along the way, a rousing, "sit down and shut-up" would be the sensible call to follow. Negotiations are like a chess match, each move means something, although the desired result might not be readily apparent.