Moats back to ILB

[CAbills]

They are practicing Moats back at ILB. Im finding it real hard to have any faith right now. Oh boy...

[wmoz11]

Well, it makes sense right now since we don't have many options there. Not to mention that Kelsay's salary means he'll be starting at one OLB position and Merriman will surely have the other.

Gotta get Moats on the field.

[Michael82]

Are you serious? He did so good as a pass rushing OLB. Why the **** would they move him back? I hate this team! :mad:

Op is right! :ill: :banghead:

[CAbills]

The one rookie who did something last year and move his position though? When he was clearly not comfortable at ILB during the preseason and games. Maybe he can do it but, the reasoning that one of the few promising young players has to move position because of people like Kelsay.... makes me sad.

[EDS]

Well, it makes sense right now since we don't have many options there. Not to mention that Kelsay's salary means he'll be starting at one OLB position and Merriman will surely have the other.

Gotta get Moats on the field.

Moats best asset is his pass rush abilities which are best utilized at OLB. In addition, who do they have at OLB that they can move Moats inside?

[Dr. Lecter]

Are you serious? He did so good as a pass rushing OLB. Why the **** would they move him back? I hate this team! :mad:

Op is right! :ill: :banghead:
You owe me an apology.

Just sayin'.

[wmoz11]

Moats best asset is his pass rush abilities which are best utilized at OLB. In addition, who do they have at OLB that they can move Moats inside?
I believe I mentioned two names. It's kind of sounds like he's just set there now because 1) Sheppard isn't in camp and 2) We haven't signed an ILB yet. It's like Kaepernick taking 1st team reps in SF. Alex Smith isn't in camp yet.

You guys really are quick to jump to conclusions. Of course, I don't have much faith in the Bills to do the right thing a lot of the time, but at least wait until their full roster is in place before going off the deep end.

[Philagape]

They should just move Kelsay inside.

Or maybe Brad Smith. He can do everything.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

I think this is temporary... jmo, or maybe dave wanstedt sees something in moats... idk.... weird

[EDS]

I believe I mentioned two names. It's kind of sounds like he's just set there now because 1) Sheppard isn't in camp and 2) We haven't signed an ILB yet. It's like Kaepernick taking 1st team reps in SF. Alex Smith isn't in camp yet.

You guys really are quick to jump to conclusions. Of course, I don't have much faith in the Bills to do the right thing a lot of the time, but at least wait until their full roster is in place before going off the deep end.

Aren't Torbor and Davis in camp? Where is Batten playing?

[Thurmal]

Moats can rush the passer.

I'm thinking Dareus and Williams just might open up some holes for him to blitz.

Everyone dogs Kawika Mitchell, but the blitz with him up the middle was money in '08.

[wmoz11]

Aren't Torbor and Davis in camp? Where is Batten playing?

We have two ILB spots. Davis is one and Moats is filling in at the other. It's more likely, as the roster sits now without Sheppard signed, that Moats plays ahead of Torbor than either Merriman or Kelsay.

[EDS]

We have two ILB spots. Davis is one and Moats is filling in at the other. It's more likely, as the roster sits now without Sheppard signed, that Moats plays ahead of Torbor than either Merriman or Kelsay.

A stiff breeze could start ahead of Kelsay and it would be an upgrade. Kelsay's only value is when they run a 4-3 front.

[bills4ver]

OMG if this is true I am really starting to question our coach and staff?

Moats looked great when he kicked outside he should play opposite Merriman

We need to sign an ILB Crowder would be a good 2 down backer for runs

[wmoz11]

A stiff breeze could start ahead of Kelsay and it would be an upgrade. Kelsay's only value is when they run a 4-3 front.

I'm not saying Kelsay is good. But with his contract you can bet your ass he'll be on the field as a starter. Unless he's cut, which would be great by me.

[X-Era]

This is a cover your ass move because you won't make FA moves.

It's not over yet... I :pray:

[YardRat]

:rofl:

First day of TC, and people are jumping off of bridges....Again.

Give it some time, let them get through some shuffling, and see how it plays out.

In all honesty, if Merriman is anywhere near 100% and can actually stay healthy I'm OK with having somebody like Moats with pass rushing ability on the inside. Hell, he could be money blitzing the run, shooting gaps, etc from the inside and we might actually get to see an ILB that can make a real tackle at or behind the line of scrimmage, something the POS never seemed to understand.

[Mr Bills]

This better mean they are trying to sign Roth or Avril

[Mr. Pink]

This better mean they are trying to sign Roth or Avril


Roth would be a nice under the radar signing.

[OpIv37]

I believe I mentioned two names. It's kind of sounds like he's just set there now because 1) Sheppard isn't in camp and 2) We haven't signed an ILB yet. It's like Kaepernick taking 1st team reps in SF. Alex Smith isn't in camp yet.

You guys really are quick to jump to conclusions. Of course, I don't have much faith in the Bills to do the right thing a lot of the time, but at least wait until their full roster is in place before going off the deep end.

The problem is that this team has a history of drafting guys then changing their positions, or changing a guy's position after one year. It's bad for consistency and it makes it difficult on the player to have to keep re-learning things every year (and let's face it, a lot of these guys aren't geniuses to start with).

Hopefully you're right- maybe Moats was just playing ILB in practice today because some other guys haven't reported yet. But when the team has a record of position-shuffling, you can't blame fans for assuming the worst. The assumption is correct 9 times out of 10 with this team.

[YardRat]

The problem is that this team has a history of drafting guys then changing their positions, or changing a guy's position after one year. It's bad for consistency and it makes it difficult on the player to have to keep re-learning things every year (and let's face it, a lot of these guys aren't geniuses to start with).

Hopefully you're right- maybe Moats was just playing ILB in practice today because some other guys haven't reported yet. But when the team has a record of position-shuffling, you can't blame fans for assuming the worst. The assumption is correct 9 times out of 10 with this team.

Didn't they change Moats' position from inside to outside last season?

So which switch is 'right', and which is 'wrong'? Are both wrong?

[wmoz11]

The problem is that this team has a history of drafting guys then changing their positions, or changing a guy's position after one year. It's bad for consistency and it makes it difficult on the player to have to keep re-learning things every year (and let's face it, a lot of these guys aren't geniuses to start with).

Hopefully you're right- maybe Moats was just playing ILB in practice today because some other guys haven't reported yet. But when the team has a record of position-shuffling, you can't blame fans for assuming the worst. The assumption is correct 9 times out of 10 with this team.

Making assumptions on where someone will play when key members at that position aren't on the roster yet is stupid. Whether it turns out to be right or not is irrelevant right now.

[CAbills]

"Now Moats is back inside and Nix indicated that wouldn’t be changing unless he really struggled."

[OpIv37]

Didn't they change Moats' position from inside to outside last season?

So which switch is 'right', and which is 'wrong'? Are both wrong?

It's wrong to draft a guy who played one position and then immediately move him to another position. I can't remember if it was 2009 or 2010, but there was one year when the Bills literally moved 4 draft picks to new positions immediately.

It's even more wrong to move them back after 1 year. Let the guy develop at a position.

[OpIv37]

Making assumptions on where someone will play when key members at that position aren't on the roster yet is stupid. Whether it turns out to be right or not is irrelevant right now.

It's an assumption based on what the team has done in the past. Until the team proves that they are smart enough not to do this, the assumption is reasonable. Deal with it.

[wmoz11]

It's an assumption based on what the team has done in the past. Until the team proves that they are smart enough not to do this, the assumption is reasonable. Deal with it.

Another stupid assumption since there are entirely different people dealing with personnel than in previous years.

[YardRat]

It's wrong to draft a guy who played one position and then immediately move him to another position.

Would you really want Moats and Batten playing DE at this level?

[Mr. Pink]

Another stupid assumption since there are entirely different people dealing with personnel than in previous years.


But its the same person at the top making the hire. And then the new administration is going out making the same bonehead decisions. Like drafting a flashy RB when we already had 2 more than capable NFL RBs. THEN not even really letting said running back get into any kind of flow in the offense.

[OpIv37]

Another stupid assumption since there are entirely different people dealing with personnel than in previous years.

Oh really? You mean it wasn't Buddy Nix who drafted Moats at ILB and immediately moved him to OLB?

Could've fooled me.

[X-Era]

One possible silver lining would be if the Bills added a significant OLB with the move of Moats to ILB. The Babin interest surprised some of us. Matt Roth is still out there... Banta-Cain, and Cliff Avril

[OpIv37]

Would you really want Moats and Batten playing DE at this level?

I'm ok with Moats at OLB. They probably shouldn't have moved him in the first place, but that's no reason to turn 1 mistake into 2

[wmoz11]

Oh really? You mean it wasn't Buddy Nix who drafted Moats at ILB and immediately moved him to OLB?

Could've fooled me.

You said "previous years." Show me empirical evidence over the years of Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey switching players' positions for the Buffalo Bills. Oh, right - they've only been here a year.

Starting a guy at ILB and then realizing we need help at OLB and moving him there (and getting production from him) should be lauded.

You adapt to changing times. Kind of like your arguments, albeit much less fluidly.

[wmoz11]

I'm ok with Moats at OLB. They probably shouldn't have moved him in the first place, but that's no reason to turn 1 mistake into 2

So you're complaining about switching Moats from ILB to OLB and then OLB to ILB. Got it. Makes sense.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

I wonder if this is to give maybin one last shot at winning that backup spot behind merriman... idk, seems like maybe they want another olb pass rusher... idk...

[NOT THE DUDE...]

wonder if they go after banta cain or maybe they feel really good about coleman...

[kingJofNYC]

In a way they're ****ing with his development, but he'll have more coverage responsibilities as a Mike, an area he struggles with, so that practice will come in handy.

No way he stays at ILB.

[wmoz11]

In a way they're ****ing with his development, but he'll have more coverage responsibilities as a Mike, an area he struggles with, so that practice will come in handy.

No way he stays at ILB.

I agree that I don't think he stays at ILB. Even if the does, though, maybe we can finally get some pressure up the middle.

[wmoz11]

BTW, he's the actual Nix quote. Seems like some of you have, predictably, jumped the gun.

“We’ll give him some work in there and see how he’s doing,” Nix said. ”If we were to move him, it’d probably be to move him permanently to the outside.”

[X-Era]

BTW, he's the actual Nix quote. Seems like some of you have, predictable, jumped the gun.

“We’ll give him some work in there and see how he’s doing,” Nix said. ”If we were to move him, it’d probably be to move him permanently to the outside.” Agreed.

I will say this though. Losing Poz and replacing him with a starter from another position is not getting better overall. That's a shift of resources.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

Yeah, wait a sec guys, this is just temporary.... i knew it. they are probably just giving him looks there for blitz packages. its nothing serious. hes staying outside

[Philagape]

You said "previous years." Show me empirical evidence over the years of Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey switching players' positions for the Buffalo Bills. Oh, right - they've only been here a year.

All the 4-3 guys they inherited who had to switch to a 3-4 (Poz, Kelsay, Kyle Williams ...)

[The Jokeman]

One possible silver lining would be if the Bills added a significant OLB with the move of Moats to ILB. The Babin interest surprised some of us. Matt Roth is still out there... Banta-Cain, and Cliff Avril
Two ILBs came available, because they were cut, that might be worth looking at our Channing Crowder, has a relationship with George Edwards from their time in Miami and Gerald Hayes who's played in a 3-4 with the Cardinals. I can't say they're better then what we have now but do have more experience which might be beneficial.

[better days]

Well, the Bills are thin at LB. I expect that position to be a high priority in next years draft.

[The Jokeman]

Well, the Bills are thin at LB. I expect that position to be a high priority in next years draft.
We 've used four draft picks on LB the last two years and still thin. Two projects, one potential starter in Shepperd but some feel he might not be and one depth guy. What's that tell you? Hopefully someone steps up from those drafts otherswise we're not going to improve.

[Philagape]

As for Moats, this is his history:

DE in college, translates to 3-4 OLB
Switched him to ILB as a rookie. Struggled.
Switched him to OLB later in rookie year. Did well.
Now back to ILB.

Basically a schizophrenic development.

[The Jokeman]

As for Moats, this is his history:

DE in college, translates to 3-4 OLB
Switched him to ILB as a rookie. Struggled.
Switched him to OLB later in rookie year. Did well.
Now back to ILB.

Basically a schizophrenic development.
Or insert square peg in round hole.

[Philagape]

Bottom line is, he's an outside rusher, and now they're stunting his development ... again.
Not to mention the young actual ILBs who could use the reps

[better days]

We 've used four draft picks on LB the last two years and still thin. Two projects, one potential starter in Shepperd but some feel he might not be and one depth guy. What's that tell you? Hopefully someone steps up from those drafts otherswise we're not going to improve.

It tells me the Bills had MANY holes to fill the last two years & LB was not a deep position in the last draft.

[Nighthawk]

This is what happens when you have an idiot for an owner who doesn't care about winning.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Moats seemed to be progressing at OLB. I dont like this move to ILB at all. Rather have Sheppard/Torbor/Davis inside if we can't get a free agent.

[DraftBoy]

The player to move to ILB is Batten not Moats. If this move is permanent it shows a severe issue with our coaching staff.

[DraftBoy]

I will add, I have no issue playing Moats inside some because of the 34 defense we have to find ways to become more unpredictable and having Moats being able to pass rush from different slots/positions is one of those ways.


However outside of that sole line of logic this move is stupid.

[Philagape]

I will add, I have no issue playing Moats inside some because of the 34 defense we have to find ways to become more unpredictable and having Moats being able to pass rush from different slots/positions is one of those ways.


However outside of that sole line of logic this move is stupid.

Their comments indicated this is a permanent move unless he tanks.

[justasportsfan]

Moats is inside until Shep signs. I don't mind a nasty mean ILB since Poz wasn't. We'll see how it plays out.

[ServoBillieves]

In other news, we're moving Roscoe to long snapper...

[acehole]

Pass rushing from inside spot is not a bad idea...given a few things.

1. The d line can occupy a lot of blockers.

2. Merriman > moats at the olb position both against the run and as pass rusher.

3. Moats can hold up against the run.


Throw in a few safety blitzes and opposing qb's could be pretty destabilized.



Moats best asset is his pass rush abilities which are best utilizede at OLB. In addition, who do they have at OLB that they can move Moats inside?

[mikemac2001]

U guys are so ****ing dumb

really we havent signed our Rookie ILB and moats is filling the spot and see how he does until he signs

STFU

[BertSquirtgum]

Are you serious? He did so good as a pass rushing OLB. Why the **** would they move him back? I hate this team! :mad:

Op is right! :ill: :banghead:
So they can blitz him up the middle. every time poz did he was stopped by a running back because he sucked so bad. so many people are freaking out about the dumbest ****. calm the **** down. wait a week and then see how the free agency thing turns out. for christ's sake. after the week is up, if you don't see some sort of significant signings. then we can all start pissing on the Bills' front office.

[Philagape]

U guys are so ****ing dumb

really we havent signed our Rookie ILB and moats is filling the spot and see how he does until he signs

STFU

It has nothing to do with Sheppard.
And even if it were, why not use someone whose development you won't interrupt at a spot where he was doing well?
Right now on the second unit it's Moats on the inside and Batten outside. Why, when Moats was making an impact on the outside?

[acehole]

What is so wrong about learning two positions?



It has nothing to do with Sheppard.
And even if it were, why not use someone whose development you won't interrupt at a spot where he was doing well?
Right now on the second unit it's Moats on the inside and Batten outside. Why, when Moats was making an impact on the outside?

[THATHURMANATOR]

I will add, I have no issue playing Moats inside some because of the 34 defense we have to find ways to become more unpredictable and having Moats being able to pass rush from different slots/positions is one of those ways.


However outside of that sole line of logic this move is stupid.
Only thing I could see is if they want to give him one more shot inside after a full year of learning the defense. He certainly has talent. If he shows he can handle it great if not they better move him back.

[DraftBoy]

Only thing I could see is if they want to give him one more shot inside after a full year of learning the defense. He certainly has talent. If he shows he can handle it great if not they better move him back.

He showed last year he can't, he showed in college he wasn't good in traffic. The move makes little sense.

[acehole]

I dont know that doing something you are not familiar with or good at is stunting growth. I would think it would have the opposite effect. Learning both positions makes one versatile ..better at maneuvering threw traffic and also can work on shedding blocks and becoming stouter at run stuffing. Certainly not the sole duties of an outside linebacker...but all of the greats can also do the former pretty well. I would say they should even play some of the ilb outside to work on their weaknesses. Interchangeable back 4 is a big advantage to our team as well as creating confusion on the offensive side of the ball. I doubt in the end he plays there.....but how many timed lets say do the te's work with the oline...and then with th WR? Pass catching TE's have to learn to block same as blocking TE's have to work to catch the ball... I would not state that doing so stunts growth of either. I would relax on the point we are damaging a player or somehow illogical for doing so. People need to breath....




Bottom line is, he's an outside rusher, and now they're stunting his development ... again.
Not to mention the young actual ILBs who could use the reps

[OpIv37]

So you're complaining about switching Moats from ILB to OLB and then OLB to ILB. Got it. Makes sense.

If you don't see a problem with constantly moving a player around and not giving them the opportunity to develop at a position, I don't know what to tell you.

I'm not buying your "give the FO the benefit of the doubt for no reason other than the fact that I can't mentally handle the reality that they are incompetent" mentality.

[OpIv37]

I dont know that doing something you are not familiar with or good at is stunting growth. I would think it would have the opposite effect. Learning both positions makes one versatile ..better at maneuvering threw traffic and also can work on shedding blocks and becoming stouter at run stuffing. Certainly not the sole duties of an outside linebacker...but all of the greats can also do the former pretty well. I would say they should even play some of the ilb outside to work on their weaknesses. Interchangeable back 4 is a big advantage to our team as well as creating confusion on the offensive side of the ball. I doubt in the end he plays there.....but how many timed lets say do the te's work with the oline...and then with th WR? Pass catching TE's have to learn to block same as blocking TE's have to work to catch the ball... I would not state that doing so stunts growth of either. I would relax on the point we are damaging a player or somehow illogical for doing so. People need to breath....

when the team's whole strategy for improvement involves rookies and players already on the team developing, it's too risky to keep moving guys around.

[TigerJ]

This flipping back and forth can't be good for Moats' development.

[BillsFever21]

Are you serious? He did so good as a pass rushing OLB. Why the **** would they move him back? I hate this team! :mad:

Op is right! :ill: :banghead:

You're finally starting to realize this after a decade? lol

[ParanoidAndroid]

So, he's likely staying outside.
Moats has some ability and I'm sure, since he had relatively little time at ILB last year and that being his first experience there and on top of that, he was an NFL rookie.... no one was surprised that he struggled. I don't see why he could not learn the position and become an asset there.

[YardRat]

Shane Conlan was completely lost as an OLB for the first half-season after we drafted him. He didn't 'catch on' until we traded for Bennett and moved him back to the inside.

[acehole]

Shane Conlan was completely lost as an OLB for the first half-season after we drafted him. He didn't 'catch on' until we traded for Bennett and moved him back to the inside.

Conclusion?

The experience helped him?

Can't be possible!

Bills suck!

:hitself: :hitself: :hitself:

[JCBills]

The one rookie who did something last year and move his position though? When he was clearly not comfortable at ILB during the preseason and games. Maybe he can do it but, the reasoning that one of the few promising young players has to move position because of people like Kelsay.... makes me sad.

Not sure what Kelsay has to do with a lack of ILBs on the team, but alright.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

With barnett on board, im pretty sure moats will move back outside. probably today. thats my guess