While many are whining...

[ublinkwescore]

I really like what our front office has done so far. I really think we can have the makings of a significantly improved Defense with the addition of Marcel Dareus, and the steady improvement year to year of Kyle Williams and Dwan Edwards still being here. If Jasper ends up being a player instead of a project, and Torell Troupe ends up taking the anticipated step forward this year we not only have the makings of a solid D line but one with depth as well. Add in Alex Carrington's hopeful step forward as well, our coaching staff could have some very difficult decisions to make come cut time...

Our Linebackers look to be pretty solid as well with Barnett and Merriman making up the leadership core. Sheppard could be a nice surprise as well. this could be the strongest section of what is figuring to shape up into a pretty solid defense. It will be nice to see us more than capable of running a competent 3-4 d.

Our Secondary is still for the most part in tact. Donte Whitner's likely departure shouldn't be missed too much. we've still got george wilson and bryan scott (i think that's our big safety's name - i've been away for a while). Our secondary will definitely welcome the addition of Aaron Williams.

it's time for the negative nancys to stop their whining. the front office has done a good job both in free agency and the draft. now it's up to the players to get out there and just execute.

[OpIv37]

lmao- we get this post ever year.

"Steady improvement" is supposed to happen every year and it never does.

And the FO did their job in FA by getting one guy to replace a guy we lost? It's a slight upgrade and it helps, but this team still has a myriad of holes that were not addressed.

This is same ****, different day: their sole strategy for improvement is rookies and player development. Look at all the qualifiers in your post... "IF Jasper isn't a project" and "IF Troup takes a step forward" and "Carrington's HOPEFUL step forward" and "Sheppard COULD be a nice surprise"... and you didn't even mention Merriman's health.

Basically, this is the same as every other year: IF a couple dozen things ALL go right, the Bills will have a good season. And some of those things will go right. But the chances of all of those things going right, or even enough of them to have a good season, are slim to none.

[justasportsfan]

lmao- we get this post ever year.

"Steady improvement" is supposed to happen every year and it never does.

And the FO did their job in FA by getting one guy to replace a guy we lost? It's a slight upgrade and it helps, but this team still has a myriad of holes that were not addressed.

This is same ****, different day: their sole strategy for improvement is rookies and player development. Look at all the qualifiers in your post... "IF Jasper isn't a project" and "IF Troup takes a step forward" and "Carrington's HOPEFUL step forward" and "Sheppard COULD be a nice surprise"... and you didn't even mention Merriman's health.

Basically, this is the same as every other year: IF a couple dozen things ALL go right, the Bills will have a good season. And some of those things will go right. But the chances of all of those things going right, or even enough of them to have a good season, are slim to none.

translation :wail:

[trapezeus]

OP, you are getting it all wrong, as per usual. The way you should read it is "IF all these things go right, we have A CHANCE to start to get good."

This allows us to go 4-12 again, but you have a warm and fuzzy feeling that 8-8 is just around the corner for next year.

Ca-peesh?

[DesertFox24]

As a bills fan I am always optimistic our young drafted players take the next step. However, until I see it in the regular season I am not going to get to high or low.

[mysticsoto]

lmao- we get this post ever year.

"Steady improvement" is supposed to happen every year and it never does.

And the FO did their job in FA by getting one guy to replace a guy we lost? It's a slight upgrade and it helps, but this team still has a myriad of holes that were not addressed.

This is same ****, different day: their sole strategy for improvement is rookies and player development. Look at all the qualifiers in your post... "IF Jasper isn't a project" and "IF Troup takes a step forward" and "Carrington's HOPEFUL step forward" and "Sheppard COULD be a nice surprise"... and you didn't even mention Merriman's health.

Basically, this is the same as every other year: IF a couple dozen things ALL go right, the Bills will have a good season. And some of those things will go right. But the chances of all of those things going right, or even enough of them to have a good season, are slim to none.

I'm not going to jump on the "we will be great" bandwagon yet either Op, but Dareus alone being on the team by default makes us better by himself!!!

Our biggest hole right now is at RT and isn't anything new we didn't have last year. Even if we don't make the playoffs, I think we'll come close. That's a positive in that we will win more games although unfortunately, we will still have problems beating the Pats and Jets. It's a negative in that we will be out of the running for Luck. Still we will be in the running for a 2nd or 3rd best QB.

[mayotm]

lmao- we get this post ever year.

"Steady improvement" is supposed to happen every year and it never does.

And the FO did their job in FA by getting one guy to replace a guy we lost? It's a slight upgrade and it helps, but this team still has a myriad of holes that were not addressed.

This is same ****, different day: their sole strategy for improvement is rookies and player development. Look at all the qualifiers in your post... "IF Jasper isn't a project" and "IF Troup takes a step forward" and "Carrington's HOPEFUL step forward" and "Sheppard COULD be a nice surprise"... and you didn't even mention Merriman's health.

Basically, this is the same as every other year: IF a couple dozen things ALL go right, the Bills will have a good season. And some of those things will go right. But the chances of all of those things going right, or even enough of them to have a good season, are slim to none.You're complaining about seeing the same post every year? We essentially get the same posts from you hourly.

[psubills62]

Thing is...EVERY team has to depend on young guys. Look at the Chargers - they're starting two very young guys at ILB. Green Bay won a Super Bowl with two rookie undrafted free agents fighting over the starting OLB spot across from Clay Matthews. Jets are hoping to replace Woody with a disappointment.

I think it's reasonable to expect young guys to get better. The problem is that the Bills are depending on too many young guys. With time, the good young players will become good veterans and we'll fill in the (hopefully) fewer remaining holes with more draftees or free agents.

Every team has their IF...THEN players. We just have more because we're building a team with an enormous youth movement, and we had almost no good players to start with.

There are certainly some things I'm not really liking about our FO, but in general I think they're building a team the right way. First, they've really focused on the defense. Second, they've made the DL a big priority. Third, they've made it clear that they want to upgrade positions when they can, but not overpay FA's. Fourth, they've also made it clear they aren't happy with our current situation at RT. Fifth, they want to build a core through the draft.

Do I agree with all their decisions? No. Do I agree with them not doing much to truly improve the OL? No. Do I agree with some of the extensions they've handed out, like Kelsay? Certainly not. Do I think they're improving the talent on the team? It's a little slower than I would have liked, but yes, I think they are.

[BidsJr]

Looks like OP lives in the DC area. Maybe a transistion to being a Redskins fan would be good for him. At least in the offseason he would be excited about all the big splashes being made.

[OpIv37]

You're complaining about seeing the same post every year? We essentially get the same posts from you hourly.

because people constantly say the same nonsense like the initial post in this thread.

I love it how people complain that my posts are repetitive but never complain about the dozens of "Dareus is great and will make our whole D better" or "Carrington is improving and will be good" or "I can't wait to see what Marcus Easley can do" or "we'll get better by player improvement" posts.

[psubills62]

because people constantly say the same nonsense like the initial post in this thread.

I love it how people complain that my posts are repetitive but never complain about the dozens of "Dareus is great and will make our whole D better" or "Carrington is improving and will be good" or "I can't wait to see what Marcus Easley can do" or "we'll get better by player improvement" posts.
I really don't think the uber-positive posts are nearly as abundant as you make them out to be. I consistently see pessimistic posts, whether logical or illogical, significantly more than their counterparts. And to be honest, I often dismiss certain posters (MDP, for one), some of whom do post those uber-positive statements.

[OpIv37]

I think it's reasonable to expect young guys to get better. The problem is that the Bills are depending on too many young guys. With time, the good young players will become good veterans and we'll fill in the (hopefully) fewer remaining holes with more draftees or free agents.



I agree with this- my problem is that the Bills insist on doing everything through the draft, so by the time the good young players become good vets, new holes open up and we need to depend on more young guys, and hence the revolving door rebuilding cycle continues.

[psubills62]

I agree with this- my problem is that the Bills insist on doing everything through the draft, so by the time the good young players become good vets, new holes open up and we need to depend on more young guys, and hence the revolving door rebuilding cycle continues.
Well, the hope is that a good number of those young players turn into good ones that we re-sign to new contracts. We also need to be able to get talent everywhere, even among undrafted rookies.

To me, Green Bay is the ideal way to go about building through the draft. The vast majority of their roster was drafted by them. I think the only significant players who weren't are Charles Woodson and Ryan Grant, but I may be missing a couple others. They've done a superb job of adding talent through the draft and re-signing it when the time comes. They got to the point where they could plan for the future during the draft, replacing Cullen Jenkins and Johnny Jolly with young DE's who have already spent a year in the system. Green Bay has spent a ton of time and money re-signing their own guys to keep the team intact as well, meanwhile drafting good players to replace them.

I think it's very possible, especially since we're slightly active in free agency - GB regularly signs no one in FA.

The keys are 1) getting draftees who are talented but don't bust, 2) having good offensive and defensive systems, and 3) having coaches who implement these systems well and can develop talent.

I believe our previous regime was horrible at 1 and 3, and not very good at 2. Our current regime still has a lot of uncertainty, but I think they're OK at 1, decent at 2 (offensively, jury's still out defensively), and not enough data to know about 3.

I think it will be tough, but I definitely think we can build this team through the draft. Like I said, every team is replacing guys every year. It may vary as to how significant the holes are, but if a team has done its job, then after building a good core, then they should have talent in the wings waiting to replace those significant losses.

[djjimkelly]

and while people cursing about sheppard and some of the other second year guys we have to hit on a couple of them at some point

and these guys actually look like they might

everyone in the know knew maybin wasnt gonna hit people knew whitner would never live up to the 8th pick

these young guys actually have a chance to be something for the first time in a while

buddy is doing real good!

[Mr. Pink]

and while people cursing about sheppard and some of the other second year guys we have to hit on a couple of them at some point

and these guys actually look like they might

everyone in the know knew maybin wasnt gonna hit people knew whitner would never live up to the 8th pick

these young guys actually have a chance to be something for the first time in a while

buddy is doing real good!


He really nailed last years draft class, didn't he?

/sarcasm

[BillsWin]

The key is our first and second year players. If they get on the field and contribute and improve then we take a giant leap forward. If they drop like flies in training camp, or don't live up to expectations we run around in circles again.

[trapezeus]

building through draft is the best way to do it. unfortunately we've had the clown posse making all the decisions for 8 years. and those mistakes last. and we are all optimists at heart. we've all said, "give it time." and we've done this for 3 systems worth of players and the improvements have been marginal.

I am with people that this draft does come off as the most focused and biggest impact. even bills hateres at the draft for ESPN were like, "value pick...need addressed." It was the first time in a long time that the bills FO wasn't trying to be smarter than everyone else. the picked the best players for positions of need. One could argue that it was made easier since every defensive position was a position of need.

I do think if the youngsters ready to go and the stachstedt defense is on point, the bills are pretty much a 6-10 to 8-8 team. The bills won 4 games last year and were in 2 or 3 others. in all 14 of 16 games, the bills defense was a joke.

The bills offense will need more help on the running side. that's in chan's hands. he abandoned it a lot. and often times it was becuase we were already down due to defensive woes.

But in the end, i think if you are gambling man, you have to assume a limited TC, not OTAs, a new rookie/2yr pro based defense is going to take time through the early part of the season to "get it." That doesn't bode well for a team playing teams like the patriots, the jets, the NFC east where the teams have already kind of estabilished their philospohy.

[psubills62]

building through draft is the best way to do it. unfortunately we've had the clown posse making all the decisions for 8 years. and those mistakes last. and we are all optimists at heart. we've all said, "give it time." and we've done this for 3 systems worth of players and the improvements have been marginal.

I am with people that this draft does come off as the most focused and biggest impact. even bills hateres at the draft for ESPN were like, "value pick...need addressed." It was the first time in a long time that the bills FO wasn't trying to be smarter than everyone else. the picked the best players for positions of need. One could argue that it was made easier since every defensive position was a position of need.

I do think if the youngsters ready to go and the stachstedt defense is on point, the bills are pretty much a 6-10 to 8-8 team. The bills won 4 games last year and were in 2 or 3 others. in all 14 of 16 games, the bills defense was a joke.

The bills offense will need more help on the running side. that's in chan's hands. he abandoned it a lot. and often times it was becuase we were already down due to defensive woes.

But in the end, i think if you are gambling man, you have to assume a limited TC, not OTAs, a new rookie/2yr pro based defense is going to take time through the early part of the season to "get it." That doesn't bode well for a team playing teams like the patriots, the jets, the NFC east where the teams have already kind of estabilished their philospohy.
Agreed. Going through the draft is the best way to do it, IMO, especially if you want to build a good team that will last. GB started, I believe, in 2003, and are now in the best position to become a dynasty. It takes times - just wish Buffalo hadn't wasted the last 10-11 years like they did.

[justasportsfan]

I agree with this- my problem is that the Bills insist on doing everything through the draft, so by the time the good young players become good vets, new holes open up and we need to depend on more young guys, and hence the revolving door rebuilding cycle continues.

we've gone through this already. Insisting via FA does not work either. The Raiders and redskins did it and failed and we did it with Bledsoe ,Spikes and co. and failed

[Mr. Pink]

we've gone through this already. Insisting via FA does not work either. The Raiders and redskins did it and failed and we did it with Bledsoe ,Spikes and co. and failed


We didn't fail completely. Donahoe decided to not build upon 2004 and insisted on having Losman play in 05. If he would have left Bledsoe in there and infused some more talent, 05 would have been a completely different story.

[OpIv37]

Looks like OP lives in the DC area. Maybe a transistion to being a Redskins fan would be good for him. At least in the offseason he would be excited about all the big splashes being made.

Yeah, clearly Buffalo's way of doing things is far superior. That's why our record is always so much better than the Redskins'.... oh, wait.

[Billz_fan]

Im sticking to what I said form day 1 of the Gaily hire. He has 3 years just like everyone else. I have not whined one bit about the lack of movement or anything else for that matter.

His first season = 4 wins


By the end of next season the team needs to be significantly better in the WIN dept. that's all that matters. Not feeling better about the team or upgrading or heading in the right direction yada yada yada. Wins are all that matters.

I never wanted the guy here. To bad no one else would take the job. The only way he changes my mind is Win. He has 2 more seasons in my book or I will want him gone if the team does not improve significantly in the win dept. If he wins games I say Im wrong and happily at that.

[trapezeus]

Donahoe's mistake wasn't forcing losman onto his coach, but picking a coach who wasn't really allowed to make decisions himself.

donahoe did build a great defense. and on paper, if he tried to give the line some stability. he failed and he didn't learn. instead, replacing one puppet coach with another and still meddling with a week offense.

He was light years ahead of the MArv/Dick show which really tainted my view on the bills. prior to that move, i was an optimist willing to give the bills the benefit of the doubt. Those 4 years were like going to war. i didn't come back as the same fan i was going in. and i fear i may never go back to my pre Jauron days.

[justasportsfan]

We didn't fail completely. Donahoe decided to not build upon 2004 and insisted on having Losman play in 05. If he would have left Bledsoe in there and infused some more talent, 05 would have been a completely different story.
I agree but Drew (an FA) could only take us so far which is why they decided to go with JP. This in turn pissed of the other FA's who were getting up there in age which is why you build your core via the draft that way they grow together.

[ublinkwescore]

This statement was made in defense of the coaching staff and the front office op. They have done an admirable job in filling holes both through the draft and free agency. Every teams needs a lot of hypotheticals to go their way to get to the playoffs. No teams are locks to get in. Some are more likely than others. All i am saying is that the front office in my opinion has gotten us enough players to compete for at least a wildcard spot. Get off your soapbox already.

[Mr. Pink]

This statement was made in defense of the coaching staff and the front office op. They have done an admirable job in filling holes both through the draft and free agency. Every teams needs a lot of hypotheticals to go their way to get to the playoffs. No teams are locks to get in. Some are more likely than others. All i am saying is that the front office in my opinion has gotten us enough players to compete for at least a wildcard spot. Get off your soapbox already.


No teams are locks?

I can give you 5 in the AFC right now.

NE, NYJ, PIT, IND, BAL and then whoever wins the AFC W.

You think we're gonna compete with NE/NYJ or PIT/BAL on a full season basis?

In the NFC you got ATL, NO, PHI, GB.

I've just given you 75% of the playoff teams come January. Care to argue that?

[X-Era]

I really like what our front office has done so far. I really think we can have the makings of a significantly improved Defense with the addition of Marcel Dareus, and the steady improvement year to year of Kyle Williams and Dwan Edwards still being here. If Jasper ends up being a player instead of a project, and Torell Troupe ends up taking the anticipated step forward this year we not only have the makings of a solid D line but one with depth as well. Add in Alex Carrington's hopeful step forward as well, our coaching staff could have some very difficult decisions to make come cut time...

Our Linebackers look to be pretty solid as well with Barnett and Merriman making up the leadership core. Sheppard could be a nice surprise as well. this could be the strongest section of what is figuring to shape up into a pretty solid defense. It will be nice to see us more than capable of running a competent 3-4 d.

Our Secondary is still for the most part in tact. Donte Whitner's likely departure shouldn't be missed too much. we've still got george wilson and bryan scott (i think that's our big safety's name - i've been away for a while). Our secondary will definitely welcome the addition of Aaron Williams.

it's time for the negative nancys to stop their whining. the front office has done a good job both in free agency and the draft. now it's up to the players to get out there and just execute.I think they are better right now. Most of it is from the draft but Merriman back and Barnett... If those two guys stay healthy we are better than last year.

But there is no way to ignore a 4 and 12 team and the inadequate overall talent. This team is now starting a whole new right side of their o-line. And these guys aren't proven by any means. They are long shots to be solid IMO. Can it happen, sure. But right now there is a long way to go. That is scary to me still.

And even with Barnett, I still would like at least one pass rushing OLB.

I'd also like an upgrade at TE, But Gailey doesn't really use the TE so fine.

So, yes, I agree better. But, there is more to do and we are way to raw on the right side of the o-line for my taste. They have the money, they have the need, and the cost is now better. I look forward to a few more moves.

[Mr. Pink]

I agree but Drew (an FA) could only take us so far which is why they decided to go with JP. This in turn pissed of the other FA's who were getting up there in age which is why you build your core via the draft that way they grow together.


Drew helped take the Pats to 2 Superbowls. Can't say he wouldn't have been able to do it here if he was surrounded by more talent, mostly an O-Line that would give him time to throw.

Like I said though instead of taking a team on the verge of making the playoffs the whole thing was torn down and a guy who had no business being an NFL QB was thrust in.

That was TDs biggest mistake here, the handling of Bledsoe.

[Philagape]

The whining will stop when the winning begins.

[YardRat]

I agree with this- my problem is that the Bills insist on doing everything through the draft, so by the time the good young players become good vets, new holes open up and we need to depend on more young guys, and hence the revolving door rebuilding cycle continues.

Not true.

They pretty much ****ed up free agency just as much as the draft over the first decade of this century.

[YardRat]

No teams are locks?

I can give you 5 in the AFC right now.

NE, NYJ, PIT, IND, BAL and then whoever wins the AFC W.

You think we're gonna compete with NE/NYJ or PIT/BAL on a full season basis?

In the NFC you got ATL, NO, PHI, GB.

I've just given you 75% of the playoff teams come January. Care to argue that?

I could see any of NYJ, PITT, BALT, ATL, NO, PHI missing the playoffs this season.

[k-oneputt]

I could see any of NYJ, PITT, BALT, ATL, NO, PHI missing the playoffs this season.

I wouldn't bet on it.

I can see Houston beating Indy though for that division.