Premptive "don't blame the refs" thread...

[MikeInRoch]

The game's not over yet, but just in case...

The refs are *NOT* the reason the Bills lose if they end up losing. You *cannot* win a game with 12 first downs. Period. So don't start pointing the fingers that way.

[Novacane]

Our defense blows. Offense was out of cync today. Refs effed up but the Bills did this to themselves

[YoungEz]

It was an obvious catch though, we get that and drive is still alive. Cinci wouldn't have gotten ball and scored right than

[Novacane]

458 yards given up to a rookie QB and bad Bengals offense. Nuff said!

[LtFinFan66]

too late...already happening in the game thread

[TacklingDummy]

There's no doubt the Bills D blows.

But so did the Refs blowing the Bills fumble for Touchdown and Johnson's catch calls.

[kingJofNYC]

Dareus paying off dividends.

D is terrible.

[MikeInRoch]

too late...already happening in the game thread

Well, I tried.

[Beebe's Kid]

This is a cute thread, but the obvious catch that was ruled an incompletion was not the Bills fault, was it?

It is very adult to say don't blame the refs, but we looked to be in control until that call ****ed us...so while I appreciate you trying to tell everybody how to handle the loss, I'll have to disagree.

[jmb1099]

Regardless of the thread title, we got hosed by the refs.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

The game's not over yet, but just in case...

The refs are *NOT* the reason the Bills lose if they end up losing. You *cannot* win a game with 12 first downs. Period. So don't start pointing the fingers that way.
Who says the two are mutually exclusive?

[YardRat]

Gotta be good enough to overcome calls like that. Terrible call at a critical point in the game, but it never should've been a factor to begin with.

[ParanoidAndroid]

The game's not over yet, but just in case...

The refs are *NOT* the reason the Bills lose if they end up losing. You *cannot* win a game with 12 first downs. Period. So don't start pointing the fingers that way.

I'll agree with a caveat. That was an important drive, they were moving the ball and that would have been another first down as they were getting their rhythm back.

As much as I hate to blame the refs, that was a game changer.

[imbondz]

I didn't think our D was that bad, just wasn't great. gave up 23 points. Our offense let us down in my opinion.

but a horrible call against us stopped a great drive.

[sam5767]

The game's not over yet, but just in case...

The refs are *NOT* the reason the Bills lose if they end up losing. You *cannot* win a game with 12 first downs. Period. So don't start pointing the fingers that way.

While I won't blame the refs....that 3rd down catch by SJ that was ruled a no catch was huge...we get a 1st down there we might have scored and ending may have been different....however, doesn't excuse the awful play by D

[sba]

You HAVE to run the ball in the NFL. Chan didn't. D was gassed in the second half. Blame him.

[MikeInRoch]

This is a cute thread, but the obvious catch that was ruled an incompletion was not the Bills fault, was it?

It is very adult to say don't blame the refs, but we looked to be in control until that call ****ed us...so while I appreciate you trying to tell everybody how to handle the loss, I'll have to disagree.

"In control"? Really? Did you watch the second half?

[kingJofNYC]

We gave up over 400 yards to the ****ing Bengals, yeah the D is that bad.

[chernobylwraiths]

The refs DID suck though. That was a HUGE call against us. "Oh, don't blame the refs" How about that pass interference call against us early in the game. Tasker said, " well it's because he was in front of the line of scrimmage, if he was behind the line, it is ok" only Jackson WAS behind the line on the screen pass. The Bengals seemed to be jumping on the pile the whole game too. They seemed to be playing dirty.

The only good thing I can see is that maybe people won't be so quick to give "Fitzmagic" 10 mil per year. He was awful today. Our defense was awful today too.

Lastly, the tuck rule is the stupidest rule in the NFL. "Well, he wasn't trying to throw it, be he had it knocked out of his hands. We'll just call it an incomplete pass" Not a sack, not a fumble, stupidity.

[Boomstick]

That "no catch" call killed the team's momentum. Its pretty obvious that this team thrives off of the momentum. Kill the momentum, kill the team. I don't agree with that call but it is what it is

[paladin warrior]

4th down and 1 in the middle in the 5o yard in the 4th qrt. Go FOR it about 6 min left:opiv:

WHy ryan throw the ball with 3 down and 4 yard. Why ryan did not gave to fred. Sheesh that was 3rd time in roll..... Bills was 17-3 half time for cry out loud

[ParanoidAndroid]

Gotta be good enough to overcome calls like that. Terrible call at a critical point in the game, but it never should've been a factor to begin with.

Sometimes games are close and if a bad call takes away good play on the field, the ability to overcome it is kind of taken away at the same time.

Sure, they should have executed better at other times, but that was a time when they were and it was killed by a poor call.

I'm not going to blame it on the two interference no calls.... the one on Freddie especially, but that side judge had too big of an impact on the outcome of the game.

[T-Long]

If that is called a catch this game turns out differently...period. The Bills were at midfield and driving. Lindell is money and at worst, we get 3.

[Forward_Lateral]

The officiating, along with the Bills, was horrible today.

[zone]

Without a doubt the biggest BS call of the season. I can deal with our entire DL getting tackled on every passing play but how was a incomplete pass even in that equation, because Clements waived his arms around like a f**kn moron.

Fixed.

[ServoBillieves]

How,many holding/clipping calls were missed? This was a piss poor game on both teams and the refs, we just got the brown end of the stick. So begins our downfall.

[cordog]

I believe Cinncy had 0 penalties......how is that even possible? No holdings, no pass interference....nothing. Yes I know that this D was horrible in the 2nd half, but that no catch call changed the game.

[Boomstick]

How,many holding/clipping calls were missed? This was a piss poor game on both teams and the refs, we just got the brown end of the stick. So begins our downfall.

I honestly believe this won't be a "downfall" as you put it. This team will be extremely pissed at themselves, they'll get to work and forget this game happened. This isn't a Jauron coached team

[X-Era]

Our defense blows. Offense was out of cync today. Refs effed up but the Bills did this to themselves
CB is now very high on my draft wish list. Sorry. That's how it is.

[Buddo]

Lots of poor calls (again) in the game, the officiating has been crap generally from what I've seen.

The Bills didn't play great, but they were always in the game until that 'incomplete' call. That killed the drive stone dead, when it should have been another set of downs. Another 1st down or a big play, and we could easily have been in comfortable FG range. It also would have run the clock down quite a bit, and in effect, took any possible control over the game we might have got.

While if we are 'for real', we shouldn't have been in that position, the reality was, that I don't think you can underestimate the importance of that call, in context of the game.

[Meathead]

Gotta be good enough to overcome calls like that. Terrible call at a critical point in the game, but it never should've been a factor to begin with.
no doubt correct. and the bills arent that good, which was obvious well before this game

nevertheless, when you have a high res image in front of you, one that clearly shows what happened, i just dont get how luck should ever come into that equation. its RIGHT THE FK THERE, in 1280+ resolution, super slomo, how the hell do you NOT get it right??

im actually hoping there some obscure part of the rule i dont know about. otherwise, this is a historic non-reversal in terms of level of obvious wrongness

it almost ranks right up there with just give it to them for ridiculousness

[kingJofNYC]

CB is now very high on my draft wish list. Sorry. That's how it is.

Right, we had an all world CB sitting there last year, **** won't happen again.

CB is such a roll of the dice.

I'm watching Peterson eat up Nicks right now.

[ParanoidAndroid]

I believe Cinncy had 0 penalties......how is that even possible? No holdings, no pass interference....nothing. Yes I know that this D was horrible in the 2nd half, but that no catch call changed the game.

3 false start penalties. Zero penalties on the defense.

[X-Era]

Lots of poor calls (again) in the game, the officiating has been crap generally from what I've seen.

The Bills didn't play great, but they were always in the game until that 'incomplete' call. That killed the drive stone dead, when it should have been another set of downs. Another 1st down or a big play, and we could easily have been in comfortable FG range. It also would have run the clock down quite a bit, and in effect, took any possible control over the game we might have got.

While if we are 'for real', we shouldn't have been in that position, the reality was, that I don't think you can underestimate the importance of that call, in context of the game.
Our defense and secondary was horrible today. Horrible. The call is not the only reason we lost. That is an unacceptable call for a NFL caliber ref to make but still.

You cannot beat teams when you give up that much through the air and on the ground.

[DraftBoy]

We gave up a 14 point lead to the Bengals. Period.

That's the story right there. We had an offense that could not put together consistent drives, and a defense that couldn't hold a two TD lead.

Bad calls or good calls, there is absolutely no way we should of given up that lead.

[Meathead]

While if we are 'for real', we shouldn't have been in that position
yeah i cant even agree with that

- these bills are NOT 'real' in terms of being that overwhelming team that is almost assured at making the playoffs over the course of season, like the kelly-lead bills

- but even those great kelly teams played crap games for three and a half quarters sometimes. what made them great is that they almost always found ways to pull those games out

- if that call is overturned AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN, theres an excellent chance the bills kick a fg and win the game - which would have been one of several stepping stones to establish they ARE approaching those kelly teams

but all of that dont mean **** now cuz somehow those crystal clear images the ref saw under the hood didnt add up to a catch. i think im in a coma maybe

[Mad Max]

CB is now very high on my draft wish list. Sorry. That's how it is.

Outside rush LB/ QB (depending on how Fitzy finishes the season) are mine.

[don137]

The Bills did not play great on either side of the ball but the refs were horrendous on numerous occasions. It's almost like the NFL does not want Buffalo to succeed. It was BS that Johnson's third down catch was not a completion. If the ref made the correct call the Bills get a first down in Cincinnati territory and only have to go 15 yards to get in FG range. Field goal is made the game is over. I saw multiple times Dareus was held and no call.
The tuck is rule is a complete farce but that unfortunately was a tuck so I will not
complain about it.
Question because I truly do not know the rule. Are you allowed to block in the back while the punt is in the air. If yes, then it was a smart play by the Bengals player the Bills could not down the ball inside the 5. If you cannot block in back while ball in air how could the ref not call it at end of game. That play was huge. Bengals get ball at 20 and not the 2 yard line. Big difference in play calling.

[kingJofNYC]

George Edwards needs to go.

[chernobylwraiths]

I also want to know about another play early in the game, if it was supposed to be a penalty or not.

Cincy back gains a bit on the play, and Wilson grabs him and straightens him up. A Bengal comes in and grabs Wilson from behind, literally grabbing him by the shoulder pads and lifts him up so that his player gets another 5 yards. Is that legal?

[TacklingDummy]

Bad calls or good calls, there is absolutely no way we should of given up that lead.
And they wouldn't have if not for those huge 2 bad calls.

[DraftBoy]

And they wouldn't have if not for those huge 2 bad calls.

Says who? You're making a bold assumption that is supported by almost no fact considering how bad the offense was today.

[TacklingDummy]

Says who? You're making a bold assumption that is supported by almost no fact considering how bad the offense was today.

Not sure how you can assume they would give up the lead with another Touchdown on the board and if Johnsons catch was ruled a catch.

[Mad Max]

Fuel to the fire:

Tony Dungy watching the play called it a catch.

Gailey thinks it was a catch...but we gotta be better than that.

[DraftBoy]

Not sure how you can assume they would give up the lead with another Touchdown on the board and if Johnsons catch was ruled a catch.

Did you see the defense in the 2nd half? It wasnt like they were going to stop anybody.

[mysticsoto]

Says who? You're making a bold assumption that is supported by almost no fact considering how bad the offense was today.

At the very least, the bad call that led to the non-catch by Stevie would have allowed 4 more downs and more run off of the clock. We lost by 3 pts with only seconds left. On close games like this bad ref calls can (and do IMO) make a difference.

Yes, our D should have played better in the 2nd half. Yes, we should have scored more than 3 pts. But an emphatic...NO, we shouldn't be getting good plays rejected that can continue drives and momentum.

And what's with the constant holding on our DLine that apparently NEVER gets called. Dareus was held several times, Kyle was held...I mean, it's getting ridiculous!!!

[psubills62]

Right, we had an all world CB sitting there last year, **** won't happen again.

CB is such a roll of the dice.

I'm watching Peterson eat up Nicks right now.
Didn't Nicks get something like 162 yards yesterday?

[DraftBoy]

At the very least, the bad call that led to the non-catch by Stevie would have allowed 4 more downs and more run off of the clock. We lost by 3 pts with only seconds left. On close games like this bad ref calls can (and do IMO) make a difference.

Yes, our D should have played better in the 2nd half. Yes, we should have scored more than 3 pts. But an emphatic...NO, we shouldn't be getting good plays rejected that can continue drives and momentum.

And what's with the constant holding on our DLine that apparently NEVER gets called. Dareus was held several times, Kyle was held...I mean, it's getting ridiculous!!!

Its not ridiculous and for every bad call we feel like we aren't getting the opponent's fans are *****ing about the same thing. Bad calls happen on both sides and was the Stevie call absolute garbage? yes but its NEVER should of come down to that like it did.

Im sorry blaming the officiails is excuse making plain and simple. As fans hold the team accountable for blowing a lead. Let the league hold officials accountable for bad calls.

[psubills62]

Its not ridiculous and for every bad call we feel like we aren't getting the opponent's fans are *****ing about the same thing. Bad calls happen on both sides and was the Stevie call absolute garbage? yes but its NEVER should of come down to that like it did.

Im sorry blaming the officiails is excuse making plain and simple. As fans hold the team accountable for blowing a lead. Let the league hold officials accountable for bad calls.
I think that as fans we have a right to hold both the team and the refs accountable. As fans, we pay to go see these teams play and we pay to see the refs make the CORRECT calls. Why are the refs absolved of blame from the standpoint of the fans when they have a job to do and they didn't do it?

The fact is, our defense didn't execute all game, and especially when it needed to and our offense didn't really execute all game.

However, on that one play, our offense did execute just fine. I can't blame the team for that drive. If that drive ends up going down for a FG, leaving too little time on the clock for Cincinnati, then our team executed all they needed to do to get the win. We'll never know if they could have done that.

The refs are a part of the game and deserve to be criticized when they get things blatantly wrong. Just my opinion.

[DraftBoy]

I think that as fans we have a right to hold both the team and the refs accountable. As fans, we pay to go see these teams play and we pay to see the refs make the CORRECT calls. Why are the refs absolved of blame from the standpoint of the fans when they have a job to do and they didn't do it?

The fact is, our defense didn't execute all game, and especially when it needed to and our offense didn't really execute all game.

However, on that one play, our offense did execute just fine. I can't blame the team for that drive. If that drive ends up going down for a FG, leaving too little time on the clock for Cincinnati, then our team executed all they needed to do to get the win. We'll never know if they could have done that.

The refs are a part of the game and deserve to be criticized when they get things blatantly wrong. Just my opinion.

Disagree, you pay to see a game. Calls are judgement based, and errors are made.

If you can't win despite bad calls, you're not a good team. Good teams overcome bad calls, bad teams don't. We'll see what we are over the next few weeks.

[mysticsoto]

Its not ridiculous and for every bad call we feel like we aren't getting the opponent's fans are *****ing about the same thing. Bad calls happen on both sides and was the Stevie call absolute garbage? yes but its NEVER should of come down to that like it did.

Im sorry blaming the officiails is excuse making plain and simple. As fans hold the team accountable for blowing a lead. Let the league hold officials accountable for bad calls.
Except that in a a close game that was decided by 3 pts and in the end w/only a few seconds left, that one bad call (actually the SEVERAL bad calls/reffing in this game) did turn out to be the difference.

Yes, I already said it shouldn't have came down to that. But it did and often good teams occasionally get a game where they play poorly and eek out with a win at the end. We would likely have done that if the Refs hadn't made the calls they did.

If the refs had called a phantom penalty on the Drayton Florence interception/score vs the Pats, we'd likely have lost that game too.

It's equally stupid to say that refs don't or can't affect the outcome of a game!!!

[DraftBoy]

Except that in a a close game that was decided by 3 pts and in the end w/only a few seconds left, that one bad call (actually the SEVERAL bad calls/reffing in this game) did turn out to be the difference.

Yes, I already said it shouldn't have came down to that. But it did and often good teams occasionally get a game where they play poorly and eek out with a win at the end. We would likely have done that if the Refs hadn't made the calls they did.

If the refs had called a phantom penalty on the Drayton Florence interception/score, we'd likely have lost that game too.

It's equally stupid to say that refs don't or can't affect the outcome of a game!!!

The bolded is all that matters in the end. You let a call affect the outcome, you deserve to lose the game.

Never ever should come to that. No excuses for it.

[mysticsoto]

The bolded is all that matters in the end. You let a call affect the outcome, you deserve to lose the game.

Never ever should come to that. No excuses for it.

That's a poor excuse. There are close games all the time. Replay was invented to minimize bad calls on the field. It was implemented. Time is stopped just to check on certain plays. The Replay was botched. There were plenty of angles that showed Stevie's hand under the ball the whole time! To say there wasn't enough to overturn the call is bull****!

I don't know any analyst that watched it and didn't call it a catch.

[psubills62]

Disagree, you pay to see a game. Calls are judgement based, and errors are made.

If you can't win despite bad calls, you're not a good team. Good teams overcome bad calls, bad teams don't. We'll see what we are over the next few weeks.
And the refs are a part of that game. If we can't criticize the refs, I don't think you can make a legitimate argument to criticize the coaches or players then either. Calls are judgment based, but it's their job to get it right. You'd criticize Ryan Fitzpatrick for making a bad read (also a judgment call that can be right or wrong), but not the refs for making a bad call? They have a job to do and didn't do it. They are fair game all the way.

Nobody said the team played well. That was an awful game and the team had a million chances to play better. I simply can't blame them for not getting a first down on that drive, because in my mind they got it. The offense executed when they needed to. They just didn't get a chance to complete that execution thanks to the refs.

Again - why is it so impossible to put blame at the feet of the refs AND the team?

[DraftBoy]

That's a poor excuse. There are close games all the time. Replay was invented to minimize bad calls on the field. It was implemented. Time is stopped just to check on certain plays. The Replay was botched. There were plenty of angles that showed Stevie's hand under the ball the whole time! To say there wasn't enough to overturn the call is bull****!

I don't know any analyst that watched it and didn't call it a catch.

None of that changes the fact that this game NEVER should of come down to that call. Nobody even disagrees with that point, which makes all of this just one big "its not fair" ***** session.

[DraftBoy]

And the refs are a part of that game. If we can't criticize the refs, I don't think you can make a legitimate argument to criticize the coaches or players then either. Calls are judgment based, but it's their job to get it right. You'd criticize Ryan Fitzpatrick for making a bad read (also a judgment call that can be right or wrong), but not the refs for making a bad call? They have a job to do and didn't do it. They are fair game all the way.

Nobody said the team played well. That was an awful game and the team had a million chances to play better. I simply can't blame them for not getting a first down on that drive, because in my mind they got it. The offense executed when they needed to. They just didn't get a chance to complete that execution thanks to the refs.

Again - why is it so impossible to put blame at the feet of the refs AND the team?

To answer the question for the 50th time because there is no reason the game should of come to that. If you don't disagree with that point then there is no reason to blame the refs.

Yes they sucked and yes they should be held accountable but we as fans can do NOTHING about that. The team however we can do something about, at least in terms of through local media channels.

[psubills62]

To answer the question for the 50th time because there is no reason the game should of come to that. If you don't disagree with that point then there is no reason to blame the refs.

Yes they sucked and yes they should be held accountable but we as fans can do NOTHING about that. The team however we can do something about, at least in terms of through local media channels.
You can say all you want that the game shouldn't have come to that...but it did and games usually do. The refs are paid to get things right, period, just like players are paid to play well. Neither one happened and both ways deserve criticism.

Haha local media channels? Yes, I have access to all those local Buffalo media channels. Bull crap. As a whole, maybe the fan base can "do something about" the team, but realistically, no we can't. We also can't do anything about the refs.

But why exactly do we need to be able to "do something about [X]" in order to criticize it? There are plenty of things I can't do anything about that are perfectly legitimate for me to criticize. I also can't do anything about Ryan Fitzpatrick making bad reads or staring down receivers...I'm still perfectly willing to criticize him about that.

[mysticsoto]

None of that changes the fact that this game NEVER should of come down to that call. Nobody even disagrees with that point, which makes all of this just one big "its not fair" ***** session.

So screw it...the refs can alter the outcome of a close game b'cse teams shouldn't allow the other team to be close?

Ridiculous! There are close games all the time in the NFL by every team. Refs need to make correct calls period! Otherwise, what's the point of having them???

And for the record, the call was initially a catch. It was the back judge that came and changed it...the same one that wasn't making other calls for the Bills. Stevie himself makes a point of it:


Stevie, just describe in your mind the reversal of that call on the field that it was a non-catch. How did that reverse the momentum for you guys?
“It was clearly a catch. I don’t know what the refs were looking at. They went in and reviewed it and still said it wasn’t a catch. I caught the ball, secured the ball, (and) my knee was down. The (Bengals defender) grabbed my arm — my knee was down — the ball was still in the same spot, got up, the ball was still in the same spot and I handed the ball to the referee. How is that not a catch? It changed a lot. We still had another opportunity out there, but that call definitely changed the game. “It was a catch and they overturned it and said it wasn’t a catch, and then we had to punt the ball.”
Did they call it a catch at first?
“Yeah, it was a catch, and the back judge — who missed about three or four pass interference and holding calls — said it wasn’t a catch, and that’s what it was.”

[DraftBoy]

So screw it...the refs can alter the outcome of a close game b'cse teams shouldn't allow the other team to be close?

Ridiculous! There are close games all the time in the NFL by every team. Refs need to make correct calls period! Otherwise, what's the point of having them???

And for the record, the call was initially a catch. It was the back judge that came and changed it...the same one that wasn't making other calls for the Bills. Stevie himself makes a point of it:

Again unless you can suddenly argue why the game should of come down to that call, I really dont care about any of the rest of it.

When you as a team decide to leave the game into the hands of officials, you are asking to lose. Refs make wrong calls every game. It happens in every sport.

***** if you want, but you're doing so for no reason.

[chernobylwraiths]

The Bills defense lost the game. But the refs need to be called out on bad officiating.

[Dr. Lecter]

The non fumble call was correct.

Dumb rule, but correct call

[chernobylwraiths]

incredibly dumb rule, but yes correct

[mysticsoto]

Again unless you can suddenly argue why the game should of come down to that call, I really dont care about any of the rest of it.

When you as a team decide to leave the game into the hands of officials, you are asking to lose. Refs make wrong calls every game. It happens in every sport.

***** if you want, but you're doing so for no reason.

Except it's not just a simple "the ref s make a wrong call" situation. The initial call was right from the ref closest to the play, changed into a wrong call by a back judge that was 20+ yrds away AND not calling anything on the Bengals and then replay showed enough to make a right call and it was not corrected. That's the big deal!

Oh, and by the way, I read something that this was the same ref crew that botched the Calvin Johnson catch last year (that was all over the news).

[mysticsoto]

The non fumble call was correct.

Dumb rule, but correct call

That rule needs to go. Essentially, it says that if a QB has pressure behind him, pretend to throw the ball but don't. It's a get out of jail free card. You wont' get a fumble if you lose it and it'll just be ruled an incomplete.

[DraftBoy]

Except it's not just a simple "the ref s make a wrong call" situation. The initial call was right from the ref closest to the play, changed into a wrong call by a back judge that was 20+ yrds away AND not calling anything on the Bengals and then replay showed enough to make a right call and it was not corrected. That's the big deal!

Oh, and by the way, I read something that this was the same ref crew that botched the Calvin Johnson catch last year (that was all over the news).

You spinning your wheels. Again unless you can somehow make the argument that the game SHOULD of come down to that call, I really dont care.

Ive made my point, cames shouldn't come down to those calls. Either dispute it or move on.

Ive already said I agree the call was blown, but I refuse to let the Bills or any team off with that.

[mysticsoto]

You spinning your wheels. Again unless you can somehow make the argument that the game SHOULD of come down to that call, I really dont care.

Ive made my point, cames shouldn't come down to those calls. Either dispute it or move on.

Ive already said I agree the call was blown, but I refuse to let the Bills or any team off with that.


Like some have been saying here, I see no reason why blame can't be placed on both. Bills had a bad day, but the Refs shouldn't be making such blatant bad calls either. And in fact, though I acknowledge that the Bills had a bad day, in truth, I tip my hats off the the Bengals. They played outstanding, defense was superb and Rey Maulaga was all over the place stifling our run game.

The bills couldn't get any offense going but other than a few errant throws by Fitz, I attribute that more to outstanding Bengals defense than to Bills incompetence.

If there are any Bengals fans here - you guys played a fantastic game!!!

Still doesn't let the refs off the hook for bad calls - especially when you support them with Replay!

[The Popcorn]

The game's not over yet, but just in case...

The refs are *NOT* the reason the Bills lose if they end up losing. You *cannot* win a game with 12 first downs. Period. So don't start pointing the fingers that way.


I agree with you but the challenge on the Stevie Johnson's catch was a TOTAL failure by the NFL replay booth. That ball did not move in his hands before he hit the ground. I thought the ground couldn't cause a fumble.

[Cntrygal]

If calls are not going to be corrected by instant replay, quit wasting everyone's time and pretending that instant replay matters.

Just go back to "Old School" already.................