Anybody remember 2008?

[Cleve]

Sports writers were calling the Bills "the real deal" 4 weeks into the season then.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/64905-bills-look-for-first-5-0-start-since-glory-days-of-1991

And we all remember how the rest of that season went. :(

I'm cautiously optimistic about this year, but the specter of 2008 kind of haunts me.

Anyone have ideas or thoughts on why we may do better this year than 2008? JAURON being long gone, along with Deadwards and Loseman are the big differences for me, and keeps me hopeful 2011 won't degenerate into a repeat of 2008. Anything else?

[better days]

Sports writers were calling the Bills "the real deal" 4 weeks into the season then.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/64905-bills-look-for-first-5-0-start-since-glory-days-of-1991

And we all remember how the rest of that season went. :(

I'm cautiously optimistic about this year, but the specter of 2008 kind of haunts me.

Anyone have ideas or thoughts on why we may do better this year than 2008? JAURON being long gone, along with Deadwards and Loseman are the big differences for me, and keeps me hopeful 2011 won't degenerate into a repeat of 2008. Anything else?

No More Jauron with his play not to lose mentality is all I need to get over that. This is a much different Bills team with a different mentality. I think that is what makes this year different than 2008.

[BAM]

Let's just hope Ryan Fitzpatrick doesn't take a shot to the head and suffer a concussion.

[trapezeus]

"We were prepared for that play call"

that quote is said the most by the bills in the last 5 games. Chan has them in a position to win. Regardless of who is there, they seem to be a team that knows the importance of practice and study.

The other teams beat up on bad teams and they hung on to survive after fast starts.

These teams have played better for the most part in the second half vs the first half. which mean the coach is doing his thing.

This game is huge vs the giants. if they can get to 5-1 with a bye, i think that will really help them come out of the gates for teh next 3 games that are pretty much the tell of the tape on if they are going to go to the playoffs and if so, what kind of team they'll be.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Wins losses aside, this team is playing with heart, and a take no prisioner mentality. We know how to blow out a team, we know how to come back from way behind and not lie down, and we have shown we know how to hold off a comeback.

Jauron's team was all about holding your breath and hoping to squeeze out a win by a field goal.

[Joe Fo Sho]

This team would destroy the 2008 Buffalo Bills.

[better days]

"We were prepared for that play call"

that quote is said the most by the bills in the last 5 games. Chan has them in a position to win. Regardless of who is there, they seem to be a team that knows the importance of practice and study.

The other teams beat up on bad teams and they hung on to survive after fast starts.

These teams have played better for the most part in the second half vs the first half. which mean the coach is doing his thing.

This game is huge vs the giants. if they can get to 5-1 with a bye, i think that will really help them come out of the gates for teh next 3 games that are pretty much the tell of the tape on if they are going to go to the playoffs and if so, what kind of team they'll be.

Much of the talk in the Philly media after the last game was how the Bills were prepared to take advantage of the Eagles weaknesses.

[OpIv37]

To me, the 2008 Bills had a ton of flaws and managed to squeak by some bad teams. The start of that season just had this aura of waiting for when the other shoe was going to drop.

The 2011 Bills definitely have flaws, but it seems like they are compensating for them and working to overcome them. It's an aura of winning.

As a longtime Bills fan, I'm very jaded and it wouldn't surprise me to see this team collapse. It's happened before:
2002- started 5-3, finished 8-8 and out of the playoffs
2003- started 2-0, finished 5-11
2004- great late season run only to choke against Pitt's back-ups and end up one game out of the playoffs.
2008- Started 5-1, finished 6-10

So, nothing would surprise me at this point. But, it does seem like things are different and going in the right direction for once.

[Dujek]

The simple fact is that the Bills have beaten two teams already (Raiders, Patriots) who are legitimate playoff contenders, and another team that was meant to be one of the best teams in the league before the season started.

The only better than **** team that the Bills beat at the start of 2008 was the Chargers.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Sports writers were calling the Bills "the real deal" 4 weeks into the season then.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/64905-bills-look-for-first-5-0-start-since-glory-days-of-1991

And we all remember how the rest of that season went. :(

I'm cautiously optimistic about this year, but the specter of 2008 kind of haunts me.

Anyone have ideas or thoughts on why we may do better this year than 2008? JAURON being long gone, along with Deadwards and Loseman are the big differences for me, and keeps me hopeful 2011 won't degenerate into a repeat of 2008. Anything else?
Quality of opponents.

Who did they beat in 08 to start 4-0 and 5-1? Seattle, Jacksonville, the Raiders, the Rams and San Diego, with a loss to Arizona. They started their season with a West Coast junket, filled with the worst teams in the NFL at the time. Then, of course, Trent had that concussion and he's never been the same. They hit a stretch of division opponents and it was all downhill from there.

Who did they beat in 11? Kansas City (bad team), Oakland (which is much improved, probably middle-of-the-pack fringe playoff contender in that division), New England (biggie), and Philadelphia (overrated). This year's interconference division is the NFC East, and while it's overrated, it's still better than anything the West Coast conjures up.

Defeating New England, as I said, was the biggie: it's the Pats' only loss this year so far. That, I believe, is the key difference between this year and years past. Only time will tell if it will hold up. So let's just hope Fitzpatrick stays healthy.

[better days]

Quality of opponents.

Who did they beat in 08 to start 4-0 and 5-1? Seattle, Jacksonville, the Raiders, the Rams and San Diego, with a loss to Arizona. They started their season with a West Coast junket, filled with the worst teams in the NFL at the time. Then, of course, Trent had that concussion and he's never been the same. They hit a stretch of division opponents and it was all downhill from there.

Who did they beat in 11? Kansas City (bad team), Oakland (which is much improved, probably middle-of-the-pack fringe playoff contender in that division), New England (biggie), and Philadelphia (overrated). This year's interconference division is the NFC East, and while it's overrated, it's still better than anything the West Coast conjures up.

Defeating New England, as I said, was the biggie: it's the Pats' only loss this year so far. That, I believe, is the key difference between this year and years past. Only time will tell if it will hold up. So let's just hope Fitzpatrick stays healthy.

Well, the Eagles may be overrated, but does anyone think the 2008 Bills would have beaten that team after losing to the Bengals the week before?

[imbondz]

Well, the Eagles may be overrated, but does anyone think the 2008 Bills would have beaten that team after losing to the Bengals the week before?

yes cuz we lost to the Cardinals then beat the Chargers back then.

[Stewie]

Sports writers were calling the Bills "the real deal" 4 weeks into the season then.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/64905-bills-look-for-first-5-0-start-since-glory-days-of-1991

And we all remember how the rest of that season went. :(

I'm cautiously optimistic about this year, but the specter of 2008 kind of haunts me.

Anyone have ideas or thoughts on why we may do better this year than 2008? JAURON being long gone, along with Deadwards and Loseman are the big differences for me, and keeps me hopeful 2011 won't degenerate into a repeat of 2008. Anything else?

Completely different team, different scheme, players, they've beaten better teams.

I don't expect us to win 13 games, but I do think we'll win 10. And I hope it's good enough to get in the playoffs.

[Oaf]

yes cuz we lost to the Cardinals then beat the Chargers back then.
Haha

[trapezeus]

bills beat a charger team that was starting the season slow and there was the power outage on the field. it was kind of just a zany game. essentially jauron's brilliant audible-less offense was finally matched by the chargers because they couldn't get their booth to call in plays. I think if they played that game without the power outage, they would have crushed the bills. they ran down the field without issue, and the bills responded in kind. which at the time was totally uncharacteristic.

I think this eagles game was a little bit more challenging. but like i said elsewhere, the bills are beating teams by being ahead of them in their game plan. if someone just comes out and does something the bills aren't prepared for, maybe they'll beat them because i don't think the bills have the overall talent to handle that defensively. Offensively, i think the bills just keep finding the matchups they want and its credited to wood for getting the protections called and fitz for seeing the right matchups.

[Night Train]

2008 had a terrible head coach

[Mudflap1]

It's fair to bring it up, but different coach, different players. This team seems to be showing more things than the past Bills teams that lead me to think they are better than they've been in years. Not saying they'll make the playoffs this year, but they are improving.

- big comebacks against good teams. Bad Bills teams would fold in the same circumstances.
- beat New England, which have been taboo games for eight years.
- are making plays on both sides of the ball. It's not just lucky or the other team choking. The Bills are forcing turnovers, making big offensive plays when it counts.
- good offensive playcalling. That has been missing for years.
- doing what works for this team, and what works for the league. Smart QB, spread offense, slant routes, bunch formations, good running. That's what works nowadays.
- former Bills teams would have blown the game against Cincy then gotten trounced by the Eagles. The Eagles were very, very desperate for a win, and super talented. A lot of teams would have lost that game. The Bills showed character by jumping ahead and staying ahead. Arguably as important of a win as New England.

However, let's see what happens in the rest of the division games. That will probably separate this team from being average to a playoff team. They are two games ahead of the Jets. If they beat the Jets twice and beat Miami, they will stay well ahead of the Jets. If the Jets beat the Bills and the Bills can't take care of business with Miami, then the Jets will be right there.

[JohnnyGold]

this question has been asked multiple times, on multiple boards, by multiple people.

and i can sum it up quite simply.

we're not 4-1 right now.

we're 8-5.

and the 3 games before that, we lost by 3 points EACH, meaning we could be 11-5 in our last 16 (but really we're 8-8.)

meaning, this isn't just happening, THIS season, this goes back to last year.

THIS team, with THIS coach, and THIS quarterback, is winning, and winning consistently, and has been winning for 2 years now.

will we continue winning? yes.

will we make the playoffs? yes.

are we going to lose... 1... 2... 5? more games? absolutely.

but stop worrying and enjoy the ride.

because after we lose in the wildcard, or divisional round this year, we'll be primed to be serious contenders next year. for a super bowl, mind you.

[Skooby]

I remember 2004 more, When we lost to 3rd stringers.

[YardRat]

To me, the 2008 Bills had a ton of flaws and managed to squeak by some bad teams. The start of that season just had this aura of waiting for when the other shoe was going to drop.

The 2011 Bills definitely have flaws, but it seems like they are compensating for them and working to overcome them. It's an aura of winning.

As a longtime Bills fan, I'm very jaded and it wouldn't surprise me to see this team collapse. It's happened before:
2002- started 5-3, finished 8-8 and out of the playoffs
2003- started 2-0, finished 5-11
2004- great late season run only to choke against Pitt's back-ups and end up one game out of the playoffs.
2008- Started 5-1, finished 6-10

So, nothing would surprise me at this point. But, it does seem like things are different and going in the right direction for once.

2003 was 6-10, 2008 was 7-9.

[JoeSelkirk]

Football Outsiders - Week 5 - 2008 - Buffalo Bills record - 4-1
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/dvoa-ratings/2008/week-5-dvoa-ratings

Ranking #17

Football Outsiders - Week 5 - 2011 - Buffalo Bills record - 4-1
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/dvoa-ratings/2011/week-5-dvoa-ratings

Ranking #1

[thenry20]

Sports writers were calling the Bills "the real deal" 4 weeks into the season then.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/64905-bills-look-for-first-5-0-start-since-glory-days-of-1991

And we all remember how the rest of that season went. :(

I'm cautiously optimistic about this year, but the specter of 2008 kind of haunts me.

Anyone have ideas or thoughts on why we may do better this year than 2008? JAURON being long gone, along with Deadwards and Loseman are the big differences for me, and keeps me hopeful 2011 won't degenerate into a repeat of 2008. Anything else?

This crept into my mind right after the Bengals loss. The only diff is that I think our O is for real this time around.

The pass defense is horrible except when we get TO's.

[Cleve]

Well, I feel more optimistic after reading all these responses. Thanks!

[RoscoeMagic]

yes cuz we lost to the Cardinals then beat the Chargers back then.

Cardinals went to the SB that year. Cincy won't even make the playoffs this season.

Andy Dalton or Kurt Warner :scratch:

[Cleve]

Thought I would bump this topic for relevancy. I started this topic a month ago - and I'm getting worried again.

[Cleve]

And bumped again - because of two more back to back losses. Bills have only won ONE game since I started this topic over a month ago.

[G Wolly]

Bills have only won ONE game since I started this topic over a month ago.

It's all your fault.

[Cleve]

Ok, I'm bumping this again. Bills have lost SEVEN of their last 8 games. Does anyone think this isn't 2008 all over again?

[imbondz]

if only we were as good as the 2008 team

[Mr. Pink]

if only we were as good as the 2008 team


If only Dick was still coach.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Ok, I'm bumping this again. Bills have lost SEVEN of their last 8 games. Does anyone think this isn't 2008 all over again?
It's not.

There was much weaker competition in 2008's streak. Furthermore, the decline was precipitated in part because of the loss of Trent Edwards to a concussion and the decision to play JP Losman at QB. You try winning with JP at the helm. Unless you're in the UFL, you won't get anywhere.

In 2011, this team was legitimately good for the first several weeks. Then they started dumping the entire defense on IR. When you have not one, but two of your key defensive players pulled off the roster midseason, what do you expect? Mismanagement of the roster was the cause of this team's collapse.

Case in point: They couldn't defeat New England in 2008. They did in 2011. I'd like to see the 2008 Bills try and beat the 2011 Patriots. They couldn't.

2008 was a mirage. 2011 was a collapse.

[Cleve]

Bumping again for relevancy - was this team ever really good? Several of those wins were against terrible teams like the Eagles.

[EDS]

It's not.

There was much weaker competition in 2008's streak. Furthermore, the decline was precipitated in part because of the loss of Trent Edwards to a concussion and the decision to play JP Losman at QB. You try winning with JP at the helm. Unless you're in the UFL, you won't get anywhere.

In 2011, this team was legitimately good for the first several weeks. Then they started dumping the entire defense on IR. When you have not one, but two of your key defensive players pulled off the roster midseason, what do you expect? Mismanagement of the roster was the cause of this team's collapse.

Case in point: They couldn't defeat New England in 2008. They did in 2011. I'd like to see the 2008 Bills try and beat the 2011 Patriots. They couldn't.

2008 was a mirage. 2011 was a collapse.

Which two guys on the defense are you talking about? Williams, sure. But who else? Please don't tell me Merriman, a guy who had never played a down for the Bills prior to this season and has not been a good NFL player for over 4 years.

[EDS]

Bumping again for relevancy - was this team ever really good? Several of those wins were against terrible teams like the Eagles.

You nailed it early. Smoke and mirrors can only get you so far.

[DynaPaul]

We ran out of magic tricks.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Which two guys on the defense are you talking about? Williams, sure. But who else? Please don't tell me Merriman, a guy who had never played a down for the Bills prior to this season and has not been a good NFL player for over 4 years.
You tell me: without blockers keying on Merriman, what has this defense done? Diddly squat.

[EDS]

You tell me: without blockers keying on Merriman, what has this defense done? Diddly squat.

The defense was terrible to start the season, nothing has changed accept the offense slowing down.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

The defense was terrible to start the season, nothing has changed accept the offense slowing down.
Interceptions are down, sacks are down, yards given up rushing is up. If you seriously think nothing's changed, what else can I say?

[Mr. Pink]

Interceptions are down, sacks are down, yards given up rushing is up. If you seriously think nothing's changed, what else can I say?


The only defensive stat that matters is points allowed.

We still gave up points at the beginning of the year too. We just were able to score.

[EDS]

Interceptions are down, sacks are down, yards given up rushing is up. If you seriously think nothing's changed, what else can I say?


All those things are down because the team can't get a lead (due to poor offense) so opposition is not forced to take risk (i.e., pass) to catch up. Look at what Miami did to the Bills - got an early lead and then milked it via the run game.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

All those things are down because the team can't get a lead (due to poor offense) so opposition is not forced to take risk (i.e., pass) to catch up. Look at what Miami did to the Bills - got an early lead and then milked it via the run game.
That strategy didn't seem to work for the Raiders or Patriots earlier this year, both of which racked up 18 point leads against Buffalo, only to see them collapse.

[BertSquirtgum]

the Bills suck.

[Cleve]

If the Bills don't win both of their final games, one difference between this season and 2008 - the 2011 Bills' record will be even worse than the 2008 record of 7-9.

[OpIv37]

To me, the 2008 Bills had a ton of flaws and managed to squeak by some bad teams. The start of that season just had this aura of waiting for when the other shoe was going to drop.

The 2011 Bills definitely have flaws, but it seems like they are compensating for them and working to overcome them. It's an aura of winning.

As a longtime Bills fan, I'm very jaded and it wouldn't surprise me to see this team collapse. It's happened before:
2002- started 5-3, finished 8-8 and out of the playoffs
2003- started 2-0, finished 5-11
2004- great late season run only to choke against Pitt's back-ups and end up one game out of the playoffs.
2008- Started 5-1, finished 6-10

So, nothing would surprise me at this point. But, it does seem like things are different and going in the right direction for once.


Oops. Looks like I was a little off on this one.

It figures- the one time I say something positive and it turns out to be one of the few times that I'm wrong.

[Cleve]

And I learned that I was right to be pessimistic back in October, and fear the worst about this team.

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

as i turn 30 today, i think back and realize that the last bills playoff game I witnessed was when I was 18, and the last home playoff game was right after i turned 15.

in short, f**k you, Bills.

[Oaf]

as i turn 30 today, i think back and realize that the last bills playoff game I witnessed was when I was 18, and the last home playoff game was right after i turned 15.

in short, f**k you, Bills.
When was the last time you witnessed them win one? :eek:

In mine, never. (at least at a cognizant age.)

[Jan Reimers]

I've seen every season, good and bad, since the beginning in 1960. The last 12 years, with no playoffs and no end to this misery in sight, and with this team so devoid of talent for the future, represent the lowest and worst time in Bills' history.

There is really no hope right now.

[Cleve]

Well, the BIG difference between 2008 and 2011....

The 2008 Bills were apparently a BETTER team than the 2011 Bills - 7-9 vs 6-10

The failure is even more epic this year than in 2008.

BTW, Dick Jauron's winning percentage for his first two years is HIGHER than Chan Gailey. Not sure why people like Gailey so much. A GOOD coach and GOOD GM can turn things around a heckuva lot faster than this. Sean Payton came into New Orleans in 2006 - inherited a 3-13 team, and took them to 10-6 in his FIRST season. And look at them now - 5 years later one of THE most revered and respected franchises in the NFL.