Dems seek to allow fan ownership of sports teams

[BLeonard]

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/house/191609-dems-seek-to-allow-fan-ownership-of-sports-teams



Two House Democrats on Thursday afternoon will introduce legislation that would ban professional sports leagues from putting up obstacles to fan ownership of teams.

One of the bill's co-sponsors, Rep. Earl Blumenauer (D-Ore.), indicated on the House floor Thursday morning that the bill is a reaction to this week's news that the Los Angeles Dodgers will be put up for sale by owner Frank McCourt.


I haven't commented much on this subject because, as we all know, it's currently against NFL bylaws. But, now that this is out there, this is my take:

Apparently, the Green Bay Packers' model for "fan ownership" works. I don't know all of the intricate details of how it all works, but I know that the team, in spite of being in a very small market, is profitable, not to mention successful.

I do know that, when the Packers need funds, they offer up public stock. I'm pretty sure I read that they'll actually be doing this again in the not-too-distant future. Last I recall, the stock was sold at $200 a share.

So, I ask this: With the Bills currently seeking around $100 million for upgrades to RWS, how many fans would get in on buying stock at $200 a pop, in exchange for being able to call themselves "part owner" of the Bills? My guess? You would get an OVERWHELMING amount of people willing to fork the cash over.

Doing the quick math: $100,000,000 (upgrades cost)/$200 (cost of share) = 500,000. So, in short, under this plan, if 500,000 people bought one share each, the Bills would then have their stadium funding, without using state, city, or county tax money to do it.

No worries of moving, on top of not using taxes on stadiums (meaning they can be used elsewhere)... It basically allows those who choose to financially support the team to do so, while not spending monies of those who don't want their tax money going towards sports teams. Explain to me why this is a bad idea again?

-Bill

[ddaryl]

this would be great...... I would love to be a part owner in the Buffalo Bills.

And if this is supposed to be a free market capitalist society then who is the NFL or anyone to tell anyone else who can or can't buy a business.

You have to believe there is some constitutional right for a group of citizens to be able to pool their money together and buy a football franchise.


Fan ownership would pretty much put all profits back into the business and not into owners pockets...

you;'re math is fuzzy as we would need $800 million for the Bills and another $100K for upgrades... future improvements would have to be figured in...


A new stadium and team ownership would probably cost $1.75 billion.... total. That would mean 1 million investors at $1750 a piece. I'm in

[PromoTheRobot]

Fan ownership is one thing. Who actually runs the team is the other. Can you imagine the chaos if we all owned the Bills? Turn over half the roster every week. Coaches fired every week. All our draft picks for the next ten seasons traded away within weeks. It would be a glorious landfill fire in no time.

PTR

[BLeonard]

you;'re math is fuzzy as we would need $800 million for the Bills and another $100K for upgrades... future improvements would have to be figured in...


A new stadium and team ownership would probably cost $1.75 billion.... total. That would mean 1 million investors at $1750 a piece. I'm in

I'm not taking about "buying the team," per se... I'll slow down a bit:

Currently, when the Packers need funding for a stadium project, they sell sheares of stock at $200 a pop. I just read about a month ago that they are looking to do this in the near future and the price would remain at $200 a share. That's whre that comes from.

Now, the Bills have recently said that they are wanting money to upgrade RWS and are tying the improvents to signing a new lease. They are estimating that the cost of the upgrades they seek will be around the $100 million mark: http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/article601613.ece



Until then, the Bills and Erie County can't broker a lease extension because they won't know how much money they'll ask from the state. The price tag will be in the tens of millions and likely well past $100 million.

"Cost is an unknown and could be in a wide range," Erie County Executive Chris Collins said. "I'm expecting New York State to pay for these improvements. But you can't sit down and have meaningful negotiations until this study is complete."


Now, if the Bills were publicy owned, like the Packers... Instead of trying to use taxpayer's money to fund the upgrades, they could simply sell stock, as the Packers do. At $200 a share, they would need to sell 500,000 shares in order to get $100 million. Yes, the article does say the price tag will be "likely well past $100 million," but my guess would be, if they offered stock to the Bills they would have no problem whatsoever in selling as much stock as they needed in order to fully finance the upgrade project.

Under this scenario, those who want to spend the money on the upgrades can, while those who don't won't see their tax dollars going towards the project.

Here's another quote from the article:


There are some critical appraisals that have suggested that it would have been cheaper for New York to simply buy the New York Yankees outright for the value of the team than submit to the outrageous demands from Steinbrenner to keep them there.


How I read that: The State of New York spent more in tax money to fund the new Yankee Stadium than they would have spent if they would have just bought the team outright. That's a little nuts.

Hopefully, I explained the numbers a bit better... I'm not even talking about "buying the team" or a new stadium... Just talking about the upgrades that the Bills are seeking on RWS. They sell stock at $200 a pop and I about guarantee they have no problem getting the money they need.

-Bill

[BLeonard]

Fan ownership is one thing. Who actually runs the team is the other. Can you imagine the chaos if we all owned the Bills? Turn over half the roster every week. Coaches fired every week. All our draft picks for the next ten seasons traded away within weeks. It would be a glorious landfill fire in no time.

PTR

I'm pretty sure you're kidding... But, just for more info... Here's how the Packers function: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Bay_Packers_Board_of_Directors

Interesting that Bryce Paup is on the Board...

But, it's not like, if Gailey has a bad gameplan, we'd fire him and stick OpIv37 in there to coach the Dallas game... :laughing:

-Bill

[ddaryl]

well when it comes to using taxes for stadium upgrades I think it's a good investment of tax $$$.. Taxes collected from Bills fans/and the Bills themselves more then pay for these upgrades, and keeps local businesses viable

[BLeonard]

well when it comes to using taxes for stadium upgrades I think it's a good investment of tax $$$.. Taxes collected from Bills fans/and the Bills themselves more then pay for these upgrades, and keeps local businesses viable

I'm not saying I disagree with you... In fact, I agree with everything you said.

The problem is, not everyone feels that way. I don't necessarily like the fact that 52% of my tax dollars fund the military, in effect supporting all these overseas wars that I certainly don't agree with... But, that's an entirely different discussion for a different forum.

The point is, if they had a Packers-type plan in place, they wouldn't need tax money. The people that want to help buy the stock, the ones that don't decline the stock and the team gets the needed funds. Everyone wins.

If funds were gathered this way, nobody could ***** about "using my tax money to fund a stadium I'll never use." How many times have you heard or read that argument?

-Bill

[SABuffalo786]

Fan ownership is one thing. Who actually runs the team is the other. Can you imagine the chaos if we all owned the Bills? Turn over half the roster every week. Coaches fired every week. All our draft picks for the next ten seasons traded away within weeks. It would be a glorious landfill fire in no time.

PTR


I know you're joking but the way Barcelona does it is their members (shareholders) vote for a team President who will then appoint people in the football dept., etc...

[YardRat]

I'm not taking about "buying the team," per se...

Actually, yes, you are...


Now, if the Bills were publicy owned, like the Packers... Instead of trying to use taxpayer's money to fund the upgrades, they could simply sell stock, as the Packers do.

Can't be publicly owned without the purchase, can't sell stock without ownership.

[YardRat]

FWIW...I'm all for public ownership of professional sports teams and funding stadium upgrades through the sale of stock.

[BLeonard]

Actually, yes, you are...



Can't be publicly owned without the purchase, can't sell stock without ownership.

I wasn't talking about buying the team with the 500,000 shared that would be needed to raise the $100 million is what I was meaning. I was simply saying, if the Bills were in the situation the packers are currently in (Owned by the public) instead of asking the state of New York for money, they could simply sell stock to raise the funds.

How many shares of stock it would take for the fans to buy the team is an entirely different story... i get that, at $200 a share, it would take more than the 500,000 I mentioned.

But, if 500,000 shared would be $100,000,000... That means, to raise 1 billion (estimate on the cost of the team) you'd need to sell 5 million shares of stock at $200 a piece. Currently, the Packers have 4,750,937 shares out and, as I said before, will be releasing more in the near future.

Getting 5 million shares of stock sold on the first day might be asking a bit, but, offering say, a million shares at first (with Ralph still owning 80% of the team (and yes, I realize Ralph refuses to sell a portion, but play along here)) and gradually increasing it over time until the team was completely owned by the public? That's not nearly as big of a hill to climb.

Honestly, I don't think the bill stands much of a chance of passing, but sports teams owned by the public could gain some ground in the future, especially if the government starts threatening the anti-trust exemptions enjoyed by the sports leagues.

-Bill

[Stewie]

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/house/191609-dems-seek-to-allow-fan-ownership-of-sports-teams



I haven't commented much on this subject because, as we all know, it's currently against NFL bylaws. But, now that this is out there, this is my take:

Apparently, the Green Bay Packers' model for "fan ownership" works. I don't know all of the intricate details of how it all works, but I know that the team, in spite of being in a very small market, is profitable, not to mention successful.

I do know that, when the Packers need funds, they offer up public stock. I'm pretty sure I read that they'll actually be doing this again in the not-too-distant future. Last I recall, the stock was sold at $200 a share.

So, I ask this: With the Bills currently seeking around $100 million for upgrades to RWS, how many fans would get in on buying stock at $200 a pop, in exchange for being able to call themselves "part owner" of the Bills? My guess? You would get an OVERWHELMING amount of people willing to fork the cash over.

Doing the quick math: $100,000,000 (upgrades cost)/$200 (cost of share) = 500,000. So, in short, under this plan, if 500,000 people bought one share each, the Bills would then have their stadium funding, without using state, city, or county tax money to do it.

No worries of moving, on top of not using taxes on stadiums (meaning they can be used elsewhere)... It basically allows those who choose to financially support the team to do so, while not spending monies of those who don't want their tax money going towards sports teams. Explain to me why this is a bad idea again?

-Bill

It's a "bad idea" because it's not in the best financial interest of the 31 billionaires who currently own the teams.

[better days]

Fan ownership is one thing. Who actually runs the team is the other. Can you imagine the chaos if we all owned the Bills? Turn over half the roster every week. Coaches fired every week. All our draft picks for the next ten seasons traded away within weeks. It would be a glorious landfill fire in no time.

PTR

Yeah they have all kinds of chaos in Green Bay. Who wants that.

[clumping platelets]

Packers model would work great here!

[Beebe's Kid]

How many shares do you think Kelly would buy?

[Romes]

I'd buy shares for sure. Would be a great way for all us out of town Buffalo fans to contribute. Since for some of us attending games is impossible.