BBD Mock 2.3

[DraftBoy]

Bills pick 15th overall...

http://www.buffalobillsdraft.com/2012-nfl-mock-draft/

Last 2 Rounder before we move it to three rounds.

[WeAreArthurMoates]

Absolutely love the first pick, Claiborn at 15 would be fantastic. Irvin makes sense in the second but I'd see Branch or Ingram there cause I think Wannstedt takes over and sticks full time with the 4-3.

[T-Long]

Love the pick if Upshaw is gone....do u think Burfict and/or Brown would be a reach at 15?

[DraftBoy]

Absolutely love the first pick, Claiborn at 15 would be fantastic. Irvin makes sense in the second but I'd see Branch or Ingram there cause I think Wannstedt takes over and sticks full time with the 4-3.

If we go 43 I could see either being the pick though we would also have a surplus at DE as well.

Carrington
Kelsay
Batten
Moats
Merriman

[DraftBoy]

Love the pick if Upshaw is gone....do u think Burfict and/or Brown would be a reach at 15?

Slightly on Burfict and yes on Brown.

I could live with Burfict, Brown still has far too many question marks.

[YardRat]

Batten, Moats and Merriman will never play DE full time in this league.

[bluerosekiller]

Merriman?!!!
I doubt he even makes it into camp next year, much less sees any action on the field.
I mean, seriously, the guy is just one injury after another... Why bother?
Same with Parrish, McGee & Easley. They've either had their day in seasons past or at least had their opportunities to perform in the regular season & were unable to stay healthy enough to do so, so why let ANY of them tie up a roster spot ever again?
The Bills desperately need contributers, not benchwarmers & the walking wounded.

[DraftBoy]

Batten, Moats and Merriman will never play DE full time in this league.

I dont disagree with you but that doesn't mean that they aren't still on the roster next year. At least I think they are, Merriman signed the two year deal.

[DraftBoy]

Merriman?!!!
I doubt he even makes it into camp next year, much less sees any action on the field.
I mean, seriously, the guy is just one injury after another... Why bother?
Same with Parrish, McGee & Easley. They've either had their day in seasons past or at least had their opportunities to perform in the regular season & were unable to stay healthy enough to do so, so why let ANY of them tie up a roster spot ever again?
The Bills desperately need contributers, not benchwarmers & the walking wounded.

I don't disagree with you but these players dont simply go away. If we cut them there are still cap penalties and at this point if we cut the 6 guys (3 you mentioned, and 3 Yardie mentioned) that's a good bit of dead cap weight (assuming some because not sure on exact cap numbers/contract status).

Big part of the reason I dont want to switch to a 43.

[YardRat]

I dont disagree with you but that doesn't mean that they aren't still on the roster next year. At least I think they are, Merriman signed the two year deal.

I was just saying they won't be on the roster as DE's.

I agree, Merriman will be around next season.

Batten is questionable but might keep a spot just because of weak numbers at OLB. I wouldn't be surprised to see Moats gone.

[DraftBoy]

I was just saying they won't be on the roster as DE's.

I agree, Merriman will be around next season.

Batten is questionable but might keep a spot just because of weak numbers at OLB. I wouldn't be surprised to see Moats gone.

Agreed on all account but don't forget Batten did play DE at South Dakota State in a 43 already once. And as somebody pointed out last week, its not a huge size issue for him.

[TigerJ]

Claibourne is a solid pick but i have to admit I like your last mock better.

[YardRat]

Agreed on all account but don't forget Batten did play DE at South Dakota State in a 43 already once. And as somebody pointed out last week, its not a huge size issue for him.

Yes, but 43 DE in the NFL certainly isn't 43 DE at South Dakota State. Just IMO, but if he were to try the end at this level he'd have to pack on at least 15 lbs and I would question whether he could handle it.

[Ginger Vitis]

Can't complain about the Bills getting a CB and a OLB with there 1st 2 picks.. Down the road it wil lbe interesting who you have the Bills picking when there picking in the Top 10 and not at 15

[DesertFox24]

Just because Wanny will be the DC next year does not mean 43. Why do people think they can only run one defense.

I think we stay with the 34 because that is what Nix said he is going to draft for, and what Gailey wants to eventually get to. As he said himself it causes more problems for the offense to gameplan against.

Wanny was an excellent DC with Dallas and I have no doubts with the proper talent could be an excellent DC with us running a 34.

These guys are pro coaches for a reason, they know defense or offense not just one scheme or another.

[DesertFox24]

That being said I am not an Bruce Irving fan. I would rather have Branch from Clemson. I believe he is fast enough to play, it will take time but I think Irvin is a lot like Maybin light in the pants and has one move.

I could be wrong and would love to hear some opinions on him. I will have to watch WVU this weekend or upcoming weeks. I have watched a lot of other teams that have potential OLBs and my favorite hands down is Upshaw.

I am a South Carolina fan but I am not sure Taylor or Ingram can play in the 34 and probably would be better for the 43.

Branch Clemson I think could do it, he is 6'5 260 can dip the shoulder and turn the corner and has a nice bull rush, also has played in coverage in the flat and does not look lost.

[DraftBoy]

Claibourne is a solid pick but i have to admit I like your last mock better.

You and me both. The purpose of these mocks though (especially this early) is to present new names and scenarios to people who don't follow the draft as closely or as early as I am. Discussion is never a negative imo.

[DraftBoy]

Yes, but 43 DE in the NFL certainly isn't 43 DE at South Dakota State. Just IMO, but if he were to try the end at this level he'd have to pack on at least 15 lbs and I would question whether he could handle it.

Completel agree, just pointing out he has shown to have some success in the skillset that is asked of being a 43 DE.

[DraftBoy]

Just because Wanny will be the DC next year does not mean 43. Why do people think they can only run one defense.

I think we stay with the 34 because that is what Nix said he is going to draft for, and what Gailey wants to eventually get to. As he said himself it causes more problems for the offense to gameplan against.

Wanny was an excellent DC with Dallas and I have no doubts with the proper talent could be an excellent DC with us running a 34.

These guys are pro coaches for a reason, they know defense or offense not just one scheme or another.

He's never run a 34 before and while its possible he could learn it, do you really want that for your DC? Ideally Id want my DC to run the defense he's the most comfortable with.

[DraftBoy]

That being said I am not an Bruce Irving fan. I would rather have Branch from Clemson. I believe he is fast enough to play, it will take time but I think Irvin is a lot like Maybin light in the pants and has one move.

I could be wrong and would love to hear some opinions on him. I will have to watch WVU this weekend or upcoming weeks. I have watched a lot of other teams that have potential OLBs and my favorite hands down is Upshaw.

I am a South Carolina fan but I am not sure Taylor or Ingram can play in the 34 and probably would be better for the 43.

Branch Clemson I think could do it, he is 6'5 260 can dip the shoulder and turn the corner and has a nice bull rush, also has played in coverage in the flat and does not look lost.

The thing with Branch I dont see is the first step. He's not quick enough off the ball to beat the OT from a wide angle. He's an ideal 43 DE I think but standing him up in a 34 may not be his best situation.

With Irvin you have quite possibly the quickest LB in the draft. He runs extremely well and can get around the OT. Now the Maybin comparison is somewhat legit but Irvin has experience standing up, can go inside or outside with speed, but does not have legitimate power moves at this point. He does have an occasional spin move that he'll employ but its still a work in progress.

As for watching Irvin, he and WVU will play USF on Thursday night with the Big East on the line. Also a great chance to see 2013 QB Prospect Geno Smith, and 2013 RB Darrell Scott.

[DesertFox24]

He's never run a 34 before and while its possible he could learn it, do you really want that for your DC? Ideally Id want my DC to run the defense he's the most comfortable with.

I agree but good coaches will run a scheme that best fits the players they have.

We will more than likely be a full on 34 team next year. Plus he has had this year to have on the job training, and has also coached against 34s since he was a head coach in Miami.

I agree no ideal, my ideal DC would be Mike Nolan but we all know Chan will hire Wanny and then bring in a new ILB coach.

I believe we will stay a 34 and it will not be as big of an issue as you guys making it out to be.

Heck Nolan has coached both, Fox both, a lot of good DCs have coached both.

[DesertFox24]

The thing with Branch I dont see is the first step. He's not quick enough off the ball to beat the OT from a wide angle. He's an ideal 43 DE I think but standing him up in a 34 may not be his best situation.

With Irvin you have quite possibly the quickest LB in the draft. He runs extremely well and can get around the OT. Now the Maybin comparison is somewhat legit but Irvin has experience standing up, can go inside or outside with speed, but does not have legitimate power moves at this point. He does have an occasional spin move that he'll employ but its still a work in progress.

As for watching Irvin, he and WVU will play USF on Thursday night with the Big East on the line. Also a great chance to see 2013 QB Prospect Geno Smith, and 2013 RB Darrell Scott.

True I like Geno, glad he is a junior I think he has a chance.

I also like Logan Thomas from Va Tech two guys I think the bills will look at in 2013, if they can get the OLB situation fixed and some much needed depth with the 10 picks in 12 and Free Agency.

[DraftBoy]

True I like Geno, glad he is a junior I think he has a chance.

I also like Logan Thomas from Va Tech two guys I think the bills will look at in 2013, if they can get the OLB situation fixed and some much needed depth with the 10 picks in 12 and Free Agency.

Thomas is technically 2014 not 2013.

[DraftBoy]

I agree but good coaches will run a scheme that best fits the players they have.

We will more than likely be a full on 34 team next year. Plus he has had this year to have on the job training, and has also coached against 34s since he was a head coach in Miami.

I agree no ideal, my ideal DC would be Mike Nolan but we all know Chan will hire Wanny and then bring in a new ILB coach.

I believe we will stay a 34 and it will not be as big of an issue as you guys making it out to be.

Heck Nolan has coached both, Fox both, a lot of good DCs have coached both.

You bring up two very good DC's and I dont think anybody is going to argue than Wanny is in either of those classes.

[DesertFox24]

Thomas is technically 2014 not 2013.

True but I think he will come out if he does well, but you are correct he might pull a Peyton, Eli, or Leinart and go back especially now with the wage scale.

[DesertFox24]

You bring up two very good DC's and I dont think anybody is going to argue than Wanny is in either of those classes.

No I will not say Wanny is one of them, but he was considered a stud in the early 90s as well.

My point is these guys are in the pros because they know defense period, and I believe a competent DC should be able to succeed in a 34 or 43.

Yes there are differences, but there are some similarities between the two as well. Also all 34 teams have 43 looks at times as well, so having a guy that has a 43 background might be beneficial.

Yes I am also trying to do a half glass full approach to this, and hopefully as bills fans I am correct but we will not know till this time next year.

[k-oneputt]

If we go 43 I could see either being the pick though we would also have a surplus at DE as well.

Carrington
Kelsay
Batten
Moats
Merriman

That group all sucks, are injured, or should retire.

[k-oneputt]

Finally moved Kalil ahead of Reiff.
Adams isn't going #8, but it is Arizona and they took that stiff Brown from Penn St.
Can't go wrong with Claiborne.
d. jones isn't going rd.1 either.
Burfict would be perfect fit for Steelers. Strong get stronger.
Glad you got Z. Brown down where he belongs. Small.
Don't like Irvin in rd. 2. Should be a 3rd or 4th rd, but the Bills like reaching for overrated players.

[DraftBoy]

That group all sucks, are injured, or should retire.

Well them sucking doesnt change the fact that they are on the roster and if cut still affect our moves because of cap penalties. We aren't a cheap team but we are very conscious of the bottom line. So to just cut them all isn't going to necessairly mean we bring in better or even as competent players.

[DraftBoy]

Finally moved Kalil ahead of Reiff.
Adams isn't going #8, but it is Arizona and they took that stiff Brown from Penn St.
Can't go wrong with Claiborne.
d. jones isn't going rd.1 either.
Burfict would be perfect fit for Steelers. Strong get stronger.
Glad you got Z. Brown down where he belongs. Small.
Don't like Irvin in rd. 2. Should be a 3rd or 4th rd, but the Bills like reaching for overrated players.

-Not in the rankings, only because Minny needs a more athletic OT with Ponder's ability to move the pocket. http://www.buffalobillsdraft.com/2013-rankings-and-scouting-reports/

-He's the top Senior OT by far though I did notice some flaws when he played Michigan:http://www.buffalobillsdraft.com/2011/11/film-room-session-michigan-v-ohio-state/

-Agreed

-Maybe but he's certainly got a shot if he runs well enough

-Agreed

-He could go anywhere from 10 to 2nd Round

-Fair eval but Irvin's speed will have him gone before Round 3. His first step is among the quickest in the country.

[Extremebillsfan247]

Bills pick 15th overall...

http://www.buffalobillsdraft.com/2012-nfl-mock-draft/

Last 2 Rounder before we move it to three rounds. Before I view it, are you following the format of best player you think will be available, or who you think the Bills need at that pick? It will help to know when I view it, and return to comment.

Edit: Went and looked anyway. Liked the first pick. Why not grab Hightower to pair up with Sheppard on the inside? You can still grab Irvin in the 2nd to pad the outside, or if CB is really of need the Bills could always roll with Judie at 47. Either way, not too bad so far. JMO

[DraftBoy]

Before I view it, are you following the format of best player you think will be available, or who you think the Bills need at that pick? It will help to know when I view it, and return to comment.

Edit: Went and looked anyway. Liked the first pick. Why not grab Hightower to pair up with Sheppard on the inside? You can still grab Irvin in the 2nd to pad the outside, or if CB is really of need the Bills could always roll with Judie at 47. Either way, not too bad so far. JMO

To answer your top question both. I dont subscribe to either theory of BPA or Need fully. I do mocks based on a hybrid of both.

We could grab Hightower but with a good ILB in Shepp why grab another? We could grab another ILB later like Audie Cole, James-Michael Johnson, or Korey Williams.

Thanks.

[Ed]

I love the Claiborne pick. He's becoming one of my favorite college players.

I noticed you list Upshaw as an ILB. I thought he was an OLB.

[DraftBoy]

I love the Claiborne pick. He's becoming one of my favorite college players.

I noticed you list Upshaw as an ILB. I thought he was an OLB.

I project him to ILB actually. I think his height limitations could dictate he move inside and take on a Lawrence Timmons type role.

Im one of the first people to consider him that way so Im either visionary or an idiot. Id bet on option 2.

[k-oneputt]

There are two things the Bills have to get away from when drafting/evaluating players:
1. The over drafting of the small school "diamond in the rough players".
2. Drafting players and changing their positions when they get here.

Wood, Moats, Batten, Carrington, Troup, brown, Spiller

The good news is the last draft they got away from both of these points.
Time will tell.

[DraftBoy]

There are two things the Bills have to get away from when drafting/evaluating players:
1. The over drafting of the small school "diamond in the rough players".
2. Drafting players and changing their positions when they get here.

Wood, Moats, Batten, Carrington, Troup, brown, Spiller

The good news is the last draft they got away from both of these points.
Time will tell.

They did?

1. Rogers, Jasper
2. Shepp and White from 43 MLB to 34 ILB, Jasper from DT to OG

[k-oneputt]

They did?

1. Rogers, Jasper
2. Shepp and White from 43 MLB to 34 ILB, Jasper from DT to OG

rogers and jasper were not 2nd and 3rd rd. picks, you know the guys you count on to contribute.

Shep and White were both inside backers. run stuffers.

you can add McKelvin and Maybin to the list also.

[DraftBoy]

rogers and jasper were not 2nd and 3rd rd. picks, you know the guys you count on to contribute.

Shep and White were both inside backers. run stuffers.

you can add McKelvin and Maybin to the list also.

Come on now, you know that MLB does not automatically equal ILB. (Ex. Poz)

[better days]

I hope the draft does not play out like this. I would rather an OLB or DE that can rush the passer or a GOOD QB in the 1st rnd than a CB no matter how good myself.

[YardRat]

If Wannstadt gets promoted and still tries to run a 34, saddle up for another season of defensive suckitude. The guy wasn't that great running a 43, and I'm pretty sure he's just as clueless as Edwards with a 34.

[DesertFox24]

If Wannstadt gets promoted and still tries to run a 34, saddle up for another season of defensive suckitude. The guy wasn't that great running a 43, and I'm pretty sure he's just as clueless as Edwards with a 34.

Miami always had a good defense and Dallas did as well, and so did Chicago.

The guy knows defense.

That being said him running a 34 will be different, but he will have had a year on the job training so hopefully that coupled with our young players getting better and some more players we will be competent once again.

[Ed]

If we did switch to a 4-3 could Barnett play OLB?

[DraftBoy]

If we did switch to a 4-3 could Barnett play OLB?
Don't think so.