Was it worth it?

[Mike]

Aren't you guys glad we won a few more meaningless games this year? This was our year to suck for luck, except we were too stupid to do such a obvious thing. Weve sucked for 12 straight years, but the bills can not even get loosing right.

Ask colt fans if they regret this year or the year they drafted Payton. In any case, bills weren't going to win SB this year & they didn't

[Philagape]

Five of their wins came in the first seven weeks ... they should have tanked from the start of the season?
Throwing an entire season, which is what is being discussed here, for any kid who's never played in the NFL is not only stupid, it's disgraceful. Only fans think like this.

[Pinkerton Security]

i know how we ended up...but for the first 6 weeks I was walking on sunshine, especially when we beat NE...our local Bills Backers bar here just north of Albany was nearly as festive of an atmosphere as it was tailgating at the Ralph. "Sure things" are non-existent...Luck is as close as there is to a sure thing but you never know.

[THRILLHO]

No win is meaningless. You cannot teach a team to win by losing.

[mikemac2001]

5-2 those wins meant something

[Mike]

No win is meaningless. You cannot teach a team to win by losing.


Teams that need to learn how to win, are championship caliber. They are like this decades Steelers that needed to learn how to win those few extra games to get SB, or like the Colts who needed to learn how to beat the Pats in order to win their first SB. For example Baltimore has been trying to get over the Steelers hump. They were a pay away from SB appearance! They need to learn how to close, win that play in crunch time.

The Bills don't have the talent to win consistently. They don't have the talent to win a SB. You can not teach them to win a SB.

[Mike]

Five of their wins came in the first seven weeks ... they should have tanked from the start of the season?
No. If you could majically take those wins away right now, would you do it?
Throwing an entire season, which is what is being discussed here, for any kid who's never played in the NFL is not only stupid, it's disgraceful. Only fans think like this.
Not true at all. In fact the opposite could be argued. Fans care more, players quite on plays, on their teams, fight for personal accolades, care too much about their stats, and are all about the Money.
You have to remember that football for the fans is like a religion but for the players and owners it's business

[SquishDaFish]

No way in hell would I give up seeing those wins. NO draft pick is a sure thing. The draft is a crapshoot it doesnt matter where you pick.

[TMu11]

What is loosing?

[DMBcrew36]

Definitely wouldn't give up the win over the Patriots.

[YardRat]

Teams that need to learn how to win, are championship caliber. They are like this decades Steelers that needed to learn how to win those few extra games to get SB, or like the Colts who needed to learn how to beat the Pats in order to win their first SB. For example Baltimore has been trying to get over the Steelers hump. They were a pay away from SB appearance! They need to learn how to close, win that play in crunch time.

The Bills don't have the talent to win consistently. They don't have the talent to win a SB. You can not teach them to win a SB.

Andrew Luck on his own isn't going to change that.

[ddaryl]

the 1st 5 games of the season was the most fun I have had watching football in a long long time.

In hindsight injuries, and lack of depth kept us from winning a few more. Which is what we will be fixing this offseason

[jamze132]

Never tank the season for a player. That's stupid.

[Philagape]

If you could majically take those wins away right now, would you do it?

Let's create a separate forum for magic, with threads like Which Diseases Would You Eradicate First, and How Much Money Would You Make Fall Out of the Sky. Thanks for wasting our time, Gandalf.

[RedEyE]

I don't think the Bills would have had a chance at Luck anyway. No one sucked worse then Indy this year.

[HAMMER]

What is loosing?

It's what happens when you are passing notes to Betty in English class when you should be paying attention to the teacher.

[Oaf]

Stupid Tebow screwed us by laying an egg. I had $20 riding on that game. :mad:

[Philagape]

How did an ad get attached to my post?? #2

[Michael82]

How did an ad get attached to my post?? #2

Because I'm guessing that your donorship expired.... :idunno:

[Johnny Bugmenot]

No win is meaningless. You cannot teach a team to win by losing.
They're professional football players. If they don't know how to win coming out of college, they don't deserve to be paid. Period.

[Buffalo Thriller]

Andrew Luck or #10? I hate losing but Jesus Christ..

[Michael82]

As a season ticket holder that goes to all the home games, it was definitely worth it. I really enjoyed the first couple months of the season and I wouldn't give up the win against the Patriots for anything. It was so fun to be at.

[SABURZFAN]

the ONLY thing saving this thread from going to the the Spam Zone is that Oaf lost $20 for the Tebow crucifixion. :up:

[Mike]

I am the type that is always looking towards the future. The first 2months were a lot of fun and I mean a lot. I felt like most of you, excited, ecstatic, looking forward to each upcoming sunday, it was fabulous. Would I give those 2mo up for a potential Franchise QB that can create the same type of excitement for the next 12-15 years? Its a no-brainer, absolutely!

[feldspar]

Andrew Luck or #10? I hate losing but Jesus Christ..

I have to agree there. LOTS more wins in the future with Andrew Luck is probably what we'd be looking at. Sorry, but Fitz isn't a franchise QB. I wish he was.

I never want to lose, but I'd give up 5 wins to get Luck...no doubt, especially since the season is over anyway. What if we went 1-8 to START the season instead of ending that way?

Depth, injuries, and blah blah. The opposition caught onto the Bills' scheme and they weren't able to generate tons of turnovers anymore...

[THATHURMANATOR]

Five of their wins came in the first seven weeks ... they should have tanked from the start of the season?
Throwing an entire season, which is what is being discussed here, for any kid who's never played in the NFL is not only stupid, it's disgraceful. Only fans think like this.
Seriously....
This has to be one of the dumbest threads in zone history...........

[feldspar]

-
Seriously....
This has to be one of the dumbest threads in zone history...........

No it isn't. "Would it be better to lose out and get a higher draft pick, and thus (at least hypothetically) a better player?" Every team's fanbase has this discussion when it becomes clear that their team is going to be picking in the top ten, say. It's always a topic when your team is out of contention. I've been having this discussion with various Bills fans for a decade straight at least...in the 70s and 80s a lot too. Guess when we weren't having that conversation so much? That's right, when we had a franchise QB and were WINNING...only time Buffalo really had a franchise QB since the merger was Jim Kelly...

I'm always the guy saying that I never hope the Bills lose...keep in mind that we aren't talking about losing on purpose, which is ridiculous and would never happen. But this year we are talking about the best QB prospect that has come down the pike since Peyton Manning, who, ironically, is likely to lose his job because of.

If it were up to me, knowing what would have otherwise happened had I not waved my magic wand, I would have went 1-15 to get Luck. The way we went 6-10 was more painful than going 2-14, to me at least...I've experienced both.

Of course, since we DID start out 5-2, I never thought this way during the regular season...but if the season "flipped" and we'd started out 1-8 instead of ended that way, I would have been hoping we picked first and got Andrew Luck...which would mean losing our last 7 games. Normally, this wouldn't be the case, like I said, but drafting Luck would be too tempting. We ended up last in our division anyway.

Think about it this way: would you go 1-15 (instead of 6-10) to draft Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Joe Montana? I would. I realize Luck hasn't proven a thing in the NFL, and there are no guarantees he'll even make it, but I'd take that chance in this case. Of course this is all hypothetical, as it would never be up to me to control these things.

I sure am tired of losing.

[Mike]

If it were up to me, knowing what would have otherwise happened had I not waved my magic wand, I would have went 1-15 to get Luck. The way we went 6-10 was more painful than going 2-14, to me at least...I've experienced both.

could not agree more

[Mike]

Think about it this way: would you go 1-15 (instead of 6-10) to draft Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Joe Montana? I would. I realize Luck hasn't proven a thing in the NFL, and there are no guarantees he'll even make it, but I'd take that chance in this case. Of course this is all hypothetical, as it would never be up to me to control these things.

Many on this board would prefer getting that extra win and drafting Ryan Leaf.

[better days]

Many on this board would prefer getting that extra win and drafting Ryan Leaf.

Well, not me! I would prefer getting that extra win & drafting Aaron Rodgers.

[THATHURMANATOR]

-

No it isn't. "Would it be better to lose out and get a higher draft pick, and thus (at least hypothetically) a better player?" Every team's fanbase has this discussion when it becomes clear that their team is going to be picking in the top ten, say. It's always a topic when your team is out of contention. I've been having this discussion with various Bills fans for a decade straight at least...in the 70s and 80s a lot too. Guess when we weren't having that conversation so much? That's right, when we had a franchise QB and were WINNING...only time Buffalo really had a franchise QB since the merger was Jim Kelly...

I'm always the guy saying that I never hope the Bills lose...keep in mind that we aren't talking about losing on purpose, which is ridiculous and would never happen. But this year we are talking about the best QB prospect that has come down the pike since Peyton Manning, who, ironically, is likely to lose his job because of.

If it were up to me, knowing what would have otherwise happened had I not waved my magic wand, I would have went 1-15 to get Luck. The way we went 6-10 was more painful than going 2-14, to me at least...I've experienced both.

Of course, since we DID start out 5-2, I never thought this way during the regular season...but if the season "flipped" and we'd started out 1-8 instead of ended that way, I would have been hoping we picked first and got Andrew Luck...which would mean losing our last 7 games. Normally, this wouldn't be the case, like I said, but drafting Luck would be too tempting. We ended up last in our division anyway.

Think about it this way: would you go 1-15 (instead of 6-10) to draft Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Joe Montana? I would. I realize Luck hasn't proven a thing in the NFL, and there are no guarantees he'll even make it, but I'd take that chance in this case. Of course this is all hypothetical, as it would never be up to me to control these things.

I sure am tired of losing.
YEP IT IS.....

[THATHURMANATOR]

Many on this board would prefer getting that extra win and drafting Ryan Leaf.
Nope.

[Luisito23]

:negrep:

[JCBills]

So, any team that starts to suck should just tank it for a few seasons and get early picks over and over?

Hell, anyone who isn't a superbowl lock should just call it a season when that becomes apparent, right?

Let's flip the sport to take out any competitive nature, and just mope around for 17 weeks while the best team is determined by preseason matchups.

[feldspar]

YEP IT IS.....

Very compelling argument...

Have you ever sacrificed the present to plan for a better future?

"I wouldn't give up a .375 winning percentage for nothin'," huh? Oh, those precious moments. 2008 was even better...go 5-1 only to go 7-9 overall. Great times. We can go 5-2 and 5-1 only to wind up with losing records. It's a long way down from there. Set us up just to let us down in the biggest way possible.

Do you realize the potential change that could happen to this organization if we picked up Andrew Luck? Answer that, because it's the ONLY question in this thread.

What does 6-10 achieve...I mean REALLY? The answer comes back...NOTHING. It ties us for the 8th worst record in the league...the bottom fourth percentile, where we have been dwelling for the past 12 years.

Perhaps the Bills problem is that they haven't exactly bottomed out; instead, they have been just "mingling" with the worst teams without a chance to grab the best prospects. Besides Mike Williams and stupid picks, the closest we came was last year with Dareus...watch and see how much that will help. I bet it will. Dareus is one thing, but you can't measure how much a top-of-the-line QB will help your team...but you would go another 12 years of mediocrity, say, rather than be in position to grab a likely top QB? Cuz' that's what we are looking at.

It's a quarterback driven league. Going 6-10 saves ZERO face. Everybody KNOWS the Bills are a bad franchise. If Bills fans take some sort of half-assed pride in 6-10, we are more pathetic than I thought. If you think that gains us a measure of respect, think again. Nobody has a longer playoff-less streak than we do. I think we are on the right track, but a franchise QB would give us virtually immediate credibility, and you must know that.

[Philagape]

-keep in mind that we aren't talking about losing on purpose, which is ridiculous and would never happen.

But that is what this whole argument is about, or else it's moot.

[better days]

-

No it isn't. "Would it be better to lose out and get a higher draft pick, and thus (at least hypothetically) a better player?" Every team's fanbase has this discussion when it becomes clear that their team is going to be picking in the top ten, say. It's always a topic when your team is out of contention. I've been having this discussion with various Bills fans for a decade straight at least...in the 70s and 80s a lot too. Guess when we weren't having that conversation so much? That's right, when we had a franchise QB and were WINNING...only time Buffalo really had a franchise QB since the merger was Jim Kelly...

I'm always the guy saying that I never hope the Bills lose...keep in mind that we aren't talking about losing on purpose, which is ridiculous and would never happen. But this year we are talking about the best QB prospect that has come down the pike since Peyton Manning, who, ironically, is likely to lose his job because of.

If it were up to me, knowing what would have otherwise happened had I not waved my magic wand, I would have went 1-15 to get Luck. The way we went 6-10 was more painful than going 2-14, to me at least...I've experienced both.

Of course, since we DID start out 5-2, I never thought this way during the regular season...but if the season "flipped" and we'd started out 1-8 instead of ended that way, I would have been hoping we picked first and got Andrew Luck...which would mean losing our last 7 games. Normally, this wouldn't be the case, like I said, but drafting Luck would be too tempting. We ended up last in our division anyway.

Think about it this way: would you go 1-15 (instead of 6-10) to draft Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Joe Montana? I would. I realize Luck hasn't proven a thing in the NFL, and there are no guarantees he'll even make it, but I'd take that chance in this case. Of course this is all hypothetical, as it would never be up to me to control these things.

I sure am tired of losing.

Well, Joe Montana was the 82 pick & 4th QB taken. Drew Brees was the first pick...........in the 2nd rnd. Aaron Rodgers was the 25th pick in the draft, & Tom Brady was a 6th rnd pick which goes to prove you don't have to go 1-15 to draft a GOOD QB. The ONLY high draft pick you named was Peyton Manning.

[feldspar]

Well, Joe Montana was the 82 pick & 4th QB taken. Drew Brees was the first pick...........in the 2nd rnd. Aaron Rodgers was the 25th pick in the draft, & Tom Brady was a 6th rnd pick which goes to prove you don't have to go 1-15 to draft a GOOD QB. The ONLY high draft pick you named was Peyton Manning.

Thank you for completely missing the point.

[feldspar]

But that is what this whole argument is about, or else it's moot.

No, to me the argument is about what YOU would like to SEE happen as a FAN. Obviously, grown men aren't going to risk their jobs, careers, and reputations by deliberately losing games so the Bills can pick first.

[better days]

Thank you for completely missing the point.

I don't think I missed your point. You said if the Bills started out the season with a bad record (like the Broncos did) you would rather see them continue to lose to draft a GOOD QB, rather than win (like the Broncos did).

My point is GOOD QBs are just as often had after the top picks in the draft. I will NEVER be happy to lose.

[alohabillsfan]

wow more than 1 ****** on this board... interesting

[Philagape]

No, to me the argument is about what YOU would like to SEE happen as a FAN. Obviously, grown men aren't going to risk their jobs, careers, and reputations by deliberately losing games so the Bills can pick first.

I'd like to see Fitzpatrick never throw another interception. I'd like to see Kelsay turn into Jason Pierre Paul. I'd like to be able to eat anything I want and not gain weight.
What's the point of this other than message board masturbation?

[Bill Cody]

I'd like to see Fitzpatrick never throw another interception.

He won't as soon as we get a new QB.

[feldspar]

I'd like to see Fitzpatrick never throw another interception. I'd like to see Kelsay turn into Jason Pierre Paul. I'd like to be able to eat anything I want and not gain weight.
What's the point of this other than message board masturbation?

If you can't understand or do not want to play along with the premise, then don't participate. There is no point to any of this football banter, in case you didn't notice. It never accomplishes anything, fella. I do it because I enjoy it, just like when I masturbate.

[feldspar]

I don't think I missed your point. You said if the Bills started out the season with a bad record (like the Broncos did) you would rather see them continue to lose to draft a GOOD QB, rather than win (like the Broncos did).

My point is GOOD QBs are just as often had after the top picks in the draft. I will NEVER be happy to lose.

Actually, you just proved again that you missed my point, which is a very simple one. THIS YEAR, I would rather have gone 1-15 than 6-10 because we would have been able to draft Andrew Luck. THAT is what I said. The Broncos made the playoffs...it has nothing to do with them or anything else.

Now we are left spinning our wheels with Fitzy.

I'm never happy with losing, either...and that's something that has defined this team for 12 years. I feel Andrew Luck would play a HUGE part of pulling the Bills out of the quagmire for the next decade or so. Oh well, though...at least we can go bragging that the Bills won 6 games and 7 other teams did worse.

Sometimes you have to totally bottom out to affect long-lasting positive change, son.

[feldspar]

wow more than 1 ****** on this board... interesting

Who is a ******, someone that wants to win meaningless games, or someone that wants to plan on winning meaningful games consistently?

[Mike]

THIS YEAR, I would rather have gone 1-15 than 6-10 because we would have been able to draft Andrew Luck.

This is EXACTLY what intended to know from begging the question.(btw I started the thread)

This year would you prefer to have gone 1-15 with Luck or 6-10 picking 10th overall?

[Mike]

BTW: 3Things

1. I bet there are broncos fans out there that would tease their very I interesting season for a chance to draft Luck. I would not be surprised if Elway was one of those fans.

2. When Manning was put on IR, I wondered if they would tank the season. After all, without Manning they had virtually no chance of a SB.

3. I have read GMs coments about rebuilding. I. Their eyes, being in that mediocre range that prevent you from getting the top picks is the worst place to be. Many GMs have stated that it's better to be picking 1st or 2nd than 10th, or 15th. A team may need to completely bottom out so it can reload properly. In the end, the difference between great teams & everone else is QB & you can draft the best prospects with the top pics.

[feldspar]

This is EXACTLY what intended to know from begging the question.(btw I started the thread)

This year would you prefer to have gone 1-15 with Luck or 6-10 picking 10th overall?

Not hard to understand the premise, bro...not hard at all.

All these guys are talking about "other things" for some reason, side-skirting the main question and point for some unknown reason. I'd feel less like I'm talking to a wall if the "opposition" would at least demonstrate that they understand the premise they so vehemently deny.

Nobody likes to lose, unless you have money on the other team. It's not about that either, as much as they like to try to force that in there....like we WANT to lose because we wanted to pick first this year. Those 5 losses would be an enormous INVESTMENT is what would amount to...again, we aren't talking about deliberately losing.

Losing more would be what is best for our ball-club IMO if it would mean drafting Luck. The Bills weren't "ready to win" anyway, according to our leader.

[better days]

Actually, you just proved again that you missed my point, which is a very simple one. THIS YEAR, I would rather have gone 1-15 than 6-10 because we would have been able to draft Andrew Luck. THAT is what I said. The Broncos made the playoffs...it has nothing to do with them or anything else.

Now we are left spinning our wheels with Fitzy.

I'm never happy with losing, either...and that's something that has defined this team for 12 years. I feel Andrew Luck would play a HUGE part of pulling the Bills out of the quagmire for the next decade or so. Oh well, though...at least we can go bragging that the Bills won 6 games and 7 other teams did worse.

Sometimes you have to totally bottom out to affect long-lasting positive change, son.

NO, you have NO POINT. The past year is over. The Bills can not lose more games or draft luck. You are implying if the Bills start out slow in the future that you would like to see them lose enough games to draft a GOOD QB.

I pointed out to you using the QBs you named yourself that you don't have to lose to draft a GOOD QB. And by the way nobody knows yet if Luck will be good or average or worse yet.

[feldspar]

NO, you have NO POINT. The past year is over. The Bills can not lose more games or draft luck. You are implying if the Bills start out slow in the future that you would like to see them lose enough games to draft a GOOD QB.

I pointed out to you using the QBs you named yourself that you don't have to lose to draft a GOOD QB. And by the way nobody knows yet if Luck will be good or average or worse yet.

Friggin' hell...haven't you ever contemplated a hypothetical situation before....I "implied" nothing. In this hypothetical situation...see, here...again, it's a hypothetical situation...I would rather have gone 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. See how easy that is? There are no side issues. I could care less if Tom Brady was drafted in the sixth round because it's irrelevant to the hypothetical.

I made a simple statement, and the point is self-evident in that statement. I would rather have gone 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. Should I repeat it again? I said originally that I realize Luck hasn't proven anything in the NFL...I don't care. I still take the same attitude.

[better days]

Friggin' hell...haven't you ever contemplated a hypothetical situation before....I "implied" nothing. In this hypothetical situation...see, here...again, it's a hypothetical situation...I would rather have gone 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. See how easy that is? There are no side issues. I could care less if Tom Brady was drafted in the sixth round because it's irrelevant to the hypothetical.

I made a simple statement, and the point is self-evident in that statement. I would rather have gone 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. Should I repeat it again? I said originally that I realize Luck hasn't proven anything in the NFL...I don't care. I still take the same attitude.

Well, why did you bring up the names of Rodgers, Manning, Brees, Montana & Brady if you were ONLY talking about Luck?

The reason is you were talking about drafting a GOOD QB in general, NOT Luck specifically. I proved to you a team does not have to lose to draft a good QB using the names YOU provided.

And again nobody knows how good Luck will be. So if you were to give up wins to draft Luck, you could be out of luck when he proves to be a bust.

[Philagape]

If you can't understand or do not want to play along with the premise, then don't participate. There is no point to any of this football banter, in case you didn't notice. It never accomplishes anything, fella. I do it because I enjoy it, just like when I masturbate.

Most of the other banter is about things that don't violate the laws of space and time.

[feldspar]

Most of the other banter is about things that don't violate the laws of space and time.

If you are opposed to "message board masturbation," stop and think. That's what you are doing right now, and you are jerking me off in the process, too.

[feldspar]

Well, why did you bring up the names of Rodgers, Manning, Brees, Montana & Brady if you were ONLY talking about Luck?

The reason is you were talking about drafting a GOOD QB in general, NOT Luck specifically. I proved to you a team does not have to lose to draft a good QB using the names YOU provided.

And again nobody knows how good Luck will be. So if you were to give up wins to draft Luck, you could be out of luck when he proves to be a bust.

LOL, give it up already. Now you are going to come back and tell me what I meant, as if I don't know? I was never talking about some generic "good QB." I was talking about Luck all along...Luck SPECIFICALLY, since my whole message was what? That's right, I would rather go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10.

Why the *** is that such a hard concept for some of you people to wrap your heads around and accept? It's not complicated. Do you guys have zero imagination, or what?

Again, I would take the chance on Luck if I could if it meant surrendering 5 glorious wins in a 6 win season. And don't try to prove me wrong, because I'm not. I'm not right or wrong...it's the way I feel about it.

[better days]

LOL, give it up already. Now you are going to come back and tell me what I meant, as if I don't know? I was never talking about some generic "good QB." I was talking about Luck all along...Luck SPECIFICALLY, since my whole message was what? That's right, I would rather go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10.

Why the *** is that such a hard concept for some of you people to wrap your heads around and accept? It's not complicated. Do you guys have zero imagination, or what?

Again, I would take the chance on Luck if I could if it meant surrendering 5 glorious wins in a 6 win season. And don't try to prove me wrong, because I'm not. I'm not right or wrong...it's the way I feel about it.

You are the person that should give it up. You were NOT talking about Luck alone or you would not have named all those other QBs.

I PROVED you WRONG so just man up & admit it. A team does not have to bottom out to draft a good QB.

[feldspar]

You are the person that should give it up. You were NOT talking about Luck alone or you would not have named all those other QBs.

I PROVED you WRONG so just man up & admit it. A team does not have to bottom out to draft a good QB.

Holy crap.

I named those other QBs to illustrate what I think about Luck as a prospect. I really can't believe that I have to explain this to you or you could skew it so badly.

All I said was what? That's right, I would rather go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. How in the world could I ever be wrong about that?

[better days]

-

No it isn't. "Would it be better to lose out and get a higher draft pick, and thus (at least hypothetically) a better player?" Every team's fanbase has this discussion when it becomes clear that their team is going to be picking in the top ten, say. It's always a topic when your team is out of contention. I've been having this discussion with various Bills fans for a decade straight at least...in the 70s and 80s a lot too. Guess when we weren't having that conversation so much? That's right, when we had a franchise QB and were WINNING...only time Buffalo really had a franchise QB since the merger was Jim Kelly...

I'm always the guy saying that I never hope the Bills lose...keep in mind that we aren't talking about losing on purpose, which is ridiculous and would never happen. But this year we are talking about the best QB prospect that has come down the pike since Peyton Manning, who, ironically, is likely to lose his job because of.

If it were up to me, knowing what would have otherwise happened had I not waved my magic wand, I would have went 1-15 to get Luck. The way we went 6-10 was more painful than going 2-14, to me at least...I've experienced both.

Of course, since we DID start out 5-2, I never thought this way during the regular season...but if the season "flipped" and we'd started out 1-8 instead of ended that way, I would have been hoping we picked first and got Andrew Luck...which would mean losing our last 7 games. Normally, this wouldn't be the case, like I said, but drafting Luck would be too tempting. We ended up last in our division anyway.

Think about it this way: would you go 1-15 (instead of 6-10) to draft Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, or Joe Montana? I would. I realize Luck hasn't proven a thing in the NFL, and there are no guarantees he'll even make it, but I'd take that chance in this case. Of course this is all hypothetical, as it would never be up to me to control these things.

I sure am tired of losing.

Here is the post. It does not compare Luck to those GREAT QBs. It is asking would anyone be willing to go 1-15 to draft one of THEM. You admitted in that post that you don't even know if Luck will make it.

[feldspar]

Here is the post. It does not compare Luck to those GREAT QBs. It is asking would anyone be willing to go 1-15 to draft one of THEM. You admitted in that post that you don't even know if Luck will make it.

Wow.

Seems like you've got some serious comprehension disability here. Ever hear of a metaphor? The comparison was clearly implied. I don't know how else you would look at it. What did you THINK I meant again? Whatever the case may be, I'm telling you now what I meant. I was comparing grabbing Luck to grabbing one of those guys. If you don't believe me, I would be rendered speechless.

I admitted that I don't even know if Luck will even make it...so what? What does THAT prove? I'd still go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. So would TONS of other people from various fanbases. Ask Browns fans if they'd give up a couple of few wins to land Luck, for example. Luck is the highest rated prospect to come out in well over a decade...lots of "experts" say since John Elway...and no, I'm not talking about drafting John Elway or whatever else you might take away from my mentioning his name.

[better days]

Wow.

Seems like you've got some serious comprehension disability here. Ever hear of a metaphor? The comparison was clearly implied. I don't know how else you would look at it. What did you THINK I meant again? Whatever the case may be, I'm telling you now what I meant. I was comparing grabbing Luck to grabbing one of those guys. If you don't believe me, I would be rendered speechless.

I admitted that I don't even know if Luck will even make it...so what? What does THAT prove? I'd still go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10. So would TONS of other people from various fanbases. Ask Browns fans if they'd give up a couple of few wins to land Luck, for example. Luck is the highest rated prospect to come out in well over a decade...lots of "experts" say since John Elway...and no, I'm not talking about drafting John Elway or whatever else you might take away from my mentioning his name.

I think you meant you would be happy to go 1-15 to draft a GOOD QB which all of the QBs you named were.

Many fans might want Luck TODAY. Let's wait a couple years & see how many want him.
Even if he has a great career in Indy in a DOME, I'm not convinced he would be as good in Buffalo playing at the Ralph with his arm.

[feldspar]

I think you meant you would be happy to go 1-15 to draft a GOOD QB which all of the QBs you named were.

Many fans might want Luck TODAY. Let's wait a couple years & see how many want him.
Even if he has a great career in Indy in a DOME, I'm not convinced he would be as good in Buffalo playing at the Ralph with his arm.

Seriously, dude. I have no reason to lie, and I certainly know what I meant. You really don't believe me? That's crazy. The context is apparent.

So, you WOULDN'T go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck rather than go 6-10. I get it. I, on the other hand, WOULD. Do you have any idea the excitement that would be buzzing around the fanbase if we knew Luck was ours to be had?

[SABURZFAN]

wow more than 1 ****** on this board... interesting


i can name quite a few on this board.

[better days]

Seriously, dude. I have no reason to lie, and I certainly know what I meant. You really don't believe me? That's crazy. The context is apparent.

So, you WOULDN'T go 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck rather than go 6-10. I get it. I, on the other hand, WOULD. Do you have any idea the excitement that would be buzzing around the fanbase if we knew Luck was ours to be had?

Well, the thing is you can't turn back the clock as much as I would like to do so at times. So if your point is not to bottom out & draft a GOOD QB, what is your point? The Colts are the team with the 1st pick & you can't change that.

[feldspar]

Well, the thing is you can't turn back the clock as much as I would like to do so at times. So if your point is not to bottom out & draft a GOOD QB, what is your point? The Colts are the team with the 1st pick & you can't change that.

What do you think my point is?

That's right, I'd rather have gone 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10 and be Luckless. I believe I told you this at least 5 times.

Why this is so hard for you to grasp is beyond me. I see that you actually voted in the poll...did you even understand the question? It's a hypothetical question... Haven't you ever sat down with a friend and asked questions like "If you could have either Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald, which one would you pick?" Obviously, you cannot pick one or the other (or either of them), but it's still a legitimate question from an entertainment standpoint.

IT...IS...NOT...HARD...TO...UNDERSTAND.

[better days]

What do you think my point is?

That's right, I'd rather have gone 1-15 and draft Andrew Luck than go 6-10 and be Luckless. I believe I told you this at least 5 times.

Why this is so hard for you to grasp is beyond me. I see that you actually voted in the poll...did you even understand the question? It's a hypothetical question... Haven't you ever sat down with a friend and asked questions like "If you could have either Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald, which one would you pick?" Obviously, you cannot pick one or the other (or either of them), but it's still a legitimate question from an entertainment standpoint.

IT...IS...NOT...HARD...TO...UNDERSTAND.

Well, you are BOTH Luckless & POINTLESS.

[feldspar]

Well, you are BOTH Luckless & POINTLESS.

You've got a problem dude.

Can you tell me what my point is? Or do I have to tell you AGAIN? It's an opinion...I value having Andrew Luck on my team more than I value 5 wins in a 6-win season. That's what it boils down to.

Are you so boring and unimaginative? Or are you just incredibly dense?

Let me ask you a question: did you ever read the Lord of the Rings Trilogy or see the movies?

[better days]

You've got a problem dude.

Can you tell me what my point is? Or do I have to tell you AGAIN? It's an opinion...I value having Andrew Luck on my team more than I value 5 wins in a 6-win season. That's what it boils down to.

Are you so boring and unimaginative? Or are you just incredibly dense?

Let me ask you a question: did you ever read the Lord of the Rings Trilogy or see the movies?

I already told you, you have no Luck & no point. Pine away all you want to be 1-15 & draft Luck, not happening.

[Mike]

Here is the same question in reverse:

You would prefer to have won an extra 5 games last year 2010-11 season and draft in the middle of the pack and miss out on Darius?

[Mike]

so far, for most it was not worth it

[feldspar]

I already told you, you have no Luck & no point. Pine away all you want to be 1-15 & draft Luck, not happening.

My point revolves around how valuable I think Luck would be to this franchise. Whether or not it's "happening" is completely beside the point. If you can't see that, you are truly an idiot.

40% of the people in this poll agree with me, and this is but a tiny sample of the fanbase.

[better days]

My point revolves around how valuable I think Luck would be to this franchise. Whether or not it's "happening" is completely beside the point. If you can't see that, you are truly an idiot.

40% of the people in this poll agree with me, and this is but a tiny sample of the fanbase.

In other words, a minority of people agree with you. As I said before, if the Bills could have somehow drafted Luck, I doubt he would have as good a career in Buffalo as he may in Indy because I don't think he has the arm strength to play at the Ralph.

[feldspar]

In other words, a minority of people agree with you. As I said before, if the Bills could have somehow drafted Luck, I doubt he would have as good a career in Buffalo as he may in Indy because I don't think he has the arm strength to play at the Ralph.

LOL, you are still banging your head against the wall. You pretend to refuse to waste your time contemplating such notions that the thread suggests since they are not "founded in reality"...even for a split second you won't entertain the notion, let alone validate it (even though you actually voted in the poll)...yet you pursue those that do entertain the notion contrarily to the ends of the Earth. How special.

Also, we are talking about what, 52 people now? How many Bills fans are there? The sample is way too small...ever take a statistics course? 40% is big enough (out of a 52 people sample) to suggest the possibility that the majority of Bills fans may feel the same way I do. Hell, I got eleven friends I know of that do...I'll sign them up on this site, and, before you know it, the "MAJORITY" of Bills fans will agree with me. How would that be?

[better days]

LOL, you are still banging your head against the wall. You pretend to refuse to waste your time contemplating such notions that the thread suggests since they are not "founded in reality"...even for a split second you won't entertain the notion, let alone validate it (even though you actually voted in the poll)...yet you pursue those that do entertain the notion contrarily to the ends of the Earth. How special.

Also, we are talking about what, 52 people now? How many Bills fans are there? The sample is way too small...ever take a statistics course? 40% is big enough (out of a 52 people sample) to suggest the possibility that the majority of Bills fans may feel the same way I do. Hell, I got eleven friends I know of that do...I'll sign them up on this site, and, before you know it, the "MAJORITY" of Bills fans will agree with me. How would that be?

Well, prove it get your 11 friends to sign up & vote.

[feldspar]

Well, prove it get your 11 friends to sign up & vote.

We won't have to do that, as I would only need 10 friends at this point, since another completely insane person has crossed over to my side in the poll.

I have ten friends that agree with me...You? I'm not talking about "virtual" friends, either.

[better days]

We won't have to do that, as I would only need 10 friends at this point, since another completely insane person has crossed over to my side in the poll.

I have ten friends that agree with me...You? I'm not talking about "virtual" friends, either.

Well, get your friends to join & vote for LOSING. PROVE IT. I think with a larger sampling size, the vote would swing much more in the other direction. Like I said, Luck does not have the arm to play in Buffalo. I just heard him today described as having good short to intermediate range with his arm. Have you ever been to the Ralph?

[Mike]

In another vote, here on Billszone, 100% of polled zooners voted that they would not trade Dareus for 5 extra wins in the 2010-11 season thus missing out on a chance to draft MD.

Does that mean that MD is more valuable to you than a potential Franchise QB???
Why do so many of you prefer meaningless wins instead of a chance at becoming a contender?

[stuckincincy]

Well, get your friends to join & vote for LOSING. PROVE IT. I think with a larger sampling size, the vote would swing much more in the other direction. Like I said, Luck does not have the arm to play in Buffalo. I just heard him today described as having good short to intermediate range with his arm. Have you ever been to the Ralph?

The only "arm" you need to play in Buffalo when the winds are high and swiring is a quick, short one.

When the weather is bad, other attributes of a team rise. That includes the opponent.

The occasional harsh winds of RWS hasn't caused other clubs over the years to tank to any particular degree.

This stuff about buying a QB who can deal with "swirling winds" for a couple of games - maybe - has to stop. Nobody can predict swirling wind - by definition. The National Weather Service sure can't - and they admit such.

[better days]

The only "arm" you need to play in Buffalo when the winds are high and swiring is a quick, short one.

When the weather is bad, other attributes of a team rise. That includes the opponent.

The occasional harsh winds of RWS hasn't caused other clubs over the years to tank to any particular degree.

This stuff about buying a QB who can deal with "swirling winds" for a couple of games - maybe - has to stop. Nobody can predict swirling wind - by definition. The National Weather Service sure can't - and they admit such.

The winds at the Ralph swirl much of the time & can occur at any time. The fact they can't be predicted is the entire point. A STRONG arm capable of throwing a tight spiral is what is required to throw in Buffalo & the East in general.

[better days]

In another vote, here on Billszone, 100% of polled zooners voted that they would not trade Dareus for 5 extra wins in the 2010-11 season thus missing out on a chance to draft MD.

Does that mean that MD is more valuable to you than a potential Franchise QB???
Why do so many of you prefer meaningless wins instead of a chance at becoming a contender?

Well, you could include me in the 100% that would rather have Dareus. It does not mean Dareus is more valuable than a Franchise QB.

The key word is POTENTIAL. I would not trade Dareus for Andrew Luck myself because I think Dareus is sure thing to be probowl player & maybe even a HOF player. I am not convinced Luck will become an ELITE QB, especially if he played in Buffalo.

[Mike]

Well, you could include me in the 100% that would rather have Dareus. It does not mean Dareus is more valuable than a Franchise QB.

The key word is POTENTIAL. I would not trade Dareus for Andrew Luck myself because I think Dareus is sure thing to be probowl player & maybe even a HOF player. I am not convinced Luck will become an ELITE QB, especially if he played in Buffalo.

I understand what you are saying and I am not so sure I would make that same trade myself. Its the inconsistency that I am alluding to. Why are 5 meaningless win in this year more important than 5 meaningless wins last year? If its all about wining, than yes you should always get the extra wins even if it means that you miss out on Payton.

I am on the opinion that wins only matter when you win in the playoffs and more importantly the SB. Winning championships defines teams, not going 6-10 oppose to 4-12. In those cases, it more beneficial to give yourself the chance to get the top talent by bottoming out.

[better days]

I understand what you are saying and I am not so sure I would make that same trade myself. Its the inconsistency that I am alluding to. Why are 5 meaningless win in this year more important than 5 meaningless wins last year? If its all about wining, than yes you should always get the extra wins even if it means that you miss out on Payton.

I am on the opinion that wins only matter when you win in the playoffs and more importantly the SB. Winning championships defines teams, not going 6-10 oppose to 4-12. In those cases, it more beneficial to give yourself the chance to get the top talent by bottoming out.

I always want to see the Bills win but if they start out the year losing as they did the year of the Dareus draft, the losses don't sting as much because of the knowledge a better draft pick is in the future.

This past year with the win streak against good teams early, it looked like the Bills were ahead of schedule on the rebuilding process. After the injury bug hit, the losses were much harder for me to take than the losses the year before because I could see this team is CLOSE to winning.

Picking at #10 with only 6 wins really SUCKS. If the Bills had only lost one more game, they would be picking much higher.