First year on the D-job for Dave (the stash) Wannstedt might be his last here

[Skooby]

It's tough to get handed a new crew & train them to all be on the same page in the first year is going to be tough. DW was given the keys to a Ferrari without the training to drive it, he's actually blown deals like this before as well. You don't spend the most ever for a defensive superstar when you have nothing else really set in stone, it's a go for broke scenario that's pretty risky.

I'm not trying to be totally negative but if the defense fails & the team crashes, heads are going to roll. The expectations are really too high for a new D-coach & a major change in your defensive system, Dave W. is in way over his head.

[Skooby]

Dave W & Dick Jauron also interviewed for the DC position in Cleveland. If the Browns passed on him, that tells you something.

[kingJofNYC]

Was Wade Phillips in way over his head last year? Gary Kubiak was on the hot seat, they were switching from a 4-3 to a 3-4, new personnel all over the field, none of them had really played in a 3-4 outside of McClain.

Stache is in a similar spot, it may end in disaster, but at the end of the day the players/talent will determine whether or not he's successful. Not much he can do besides coach. I don't think they're going to blow it up if the ship sinks, Ralph doesn't have the stomach for it. You'll see Nix retire in the next year or so, Whaley will step in and it's his show from that point.

[TigerJ]

If I worried about everything that could go wrong in my life, I'd probably feel like committing suicide. Fortunately, I don't.

[YardRat]

Was Wade Phillips in way over his head last year? Gary Kubiak was on the hot seat, they were switching from a 4-3 to a 3-4, new personnel all over the field, none of them had really played in a 3-4 outside of McClain.

Stache is in a similar spot, it may end in disaster, but at the end of the day the players/talent will determine whether or not he's successful. Not much he can do besides coach. I don't think they're going to blow it up if the ship sinks, Ralph doesn't have the stomach for it. You'll see Nix retire in the next year or so, Whaley will step in and it's his show from that point.

Wade Phillips is one of the best, and proven, 34 defensive minds in the game. If we were able to snag someone even remotely close to his level instead of hiring an asshat like Edwards we'd still be playing a 34 with a better defensive performance the last two seasons and Wannstadt would still be filling out applications.

[BillsOverDolphins]

If I worried about everything that could go wrong in my life, I'd probably feel like committing suicide. Fortunately, I don't.

True...you'd have been dead a decade ago if you fretted over Bills problems

[kingJofNYC]

Wade Phillips is one of the best, and proven, 34 defensive minds in the game. If we were able to snag someone even remotely close to his level instead of hiring an asshat like Edwards we'd still be playing a 34 with a better defensive performance the last two seasons and Wannstadt would still be filling out applications.

And yet Wade managed **** all with his defensive talent in Dallas.

Coaching matters, it really does, but never discount talent/personnel. JPP/Osi/Tuck make Fewell look like a genius when they're firing off the ball. When they were injured/hurt Giants D was nothing to write home about, they still finished near the bottom but I'll chalk that up to injuries in the secondary and Osi/Tuck being out for a stretch.

[BillsOverDolphins]

And yet Wade managed **** all with his defensive talent in Dallas.

Coaching matters, it really does, but never discount talent/personnel. JPP/Osi/Tuck make Fewell look like a genius when they're firing off the ball. When they were injured/hurt Giants D was nothing to write home about, they still finished near the bottom but I'll chalk that up to injuries in the secondary and Osi/Tuck being out for a stretch.

Agree 100%. Lemme coach that D-line ffs. When healthy, they are one of the best in NFL history. No doubt about it.

[YardRat]

And yet Wade managed **** all with his defensive talent in Dallas.

Coaching matters, it really does, but never discount talent/personnel. JPP/Osi/Tuck make Fewell look like a genius when they're firing off the ball. When they were injured/hurt Giants D was nothing to write home about, they still finished near the bottom but I'll chalk that up to injuries in the secondary and Osi/Tuck being out for a stretch.

Granted, but Wade didn't exactly have an entire roster of All-Pros and household names in Houston to make a single-season switch, and he lost his (supposed) best player a third into the season.

[Beebe]

Dave W & Dick Jauron also interviewed for the DC position in Cleveland. If the Browns passed on him, that tells you something.

Didn't he passed on them, because they wanted him after he got fired form PITT.

[Oaf]

:ill:

[BillsOverDolphins]

Give me the good players over the good coaches any day of the week. Players win games.

[Skooby]

Give me the good players over the good coaches any day of the week. Players win games.

Well coached good players win championships.

[Meathead]

have you been drinking again mitch?

pornstachio is a great dcoord. we are lucky to have him. aside from another string of injuries the d could not possibly blow up bad enough to get him fired. thats just crazy talk. this is also crazy talk: blaa bloo blee blaabababa mememe bobooo

[EricStratton]

Why are we worrying about firing a DC in August?

[Mike13]

Its not "The Stache" Its "Wanny" or "Wanstache", or "completely incompetent moron".

[Skooby]

Why are we worrying about firing a DC in August?

It's a little deeper than just his job man, it's this whole season & possibly the viability of the franchise in Buffalo. It's harder to move a well supported winner, versus a losing franchise 12 + years removed from the playoffs. You can see we're swinging for the fences on payroll costs & obtaining talent. I'm suggesting that without the proper systems in place, the talent will not be utilized to it's highest & best use.

I'm not saying it's impossible, just improbable knowing DW's past & his conservative nature. Did you ever hear the statement of playing not to lose?? Why obtain a monster like Mario Williams & spend a fortune with a conservative DC? Square pegs, round holes is what I'm seeing & DW is a well known choker that won't make in-game adjustments.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Why are we worrying about firing a DC in August?

We're Bills fans, some of us start calling for coaches to be fired after the first round of the draft.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Its not "The Stache" Its "Wanny" or "Wanstache", or "completely incompetent moron".

I thought it Was Juan Pornstachio

[Skooby]

We're Bills fans, some of start calling for coaches to be fired after the first round of the draft.

Where exactly did I called for him to be fired ? My whole point is DW's nature doesn't jive with what we have & this is the first year of a whole new system. This is a formula for disappointment on the defensive side of the ball, I'm just pointing out the current situation & it's oddities.

[EricStratton]

So Dave is now the lynchpin for the Bills staying in Buffalo?

[cookie G]

So Dave is now the lynchpin for the Bills staying in Buffalo?

If the Bills leave Buffalo, it will be the final dagger in the heart for the city;
Rochester wouldn't be far behind. With Kodak the way it is..and the efforts to make Rochester a partner city for the Bills...they couldn't survive.
That leaves Syracuse and Utica to fend for upstate. Utica's pretty useless, so there is only Syracuse to defend upstate. I doubt the Orange can do it on their own.

If Wanny fails, all of upstate NY will crumble.

[Dannyboy]

15703

Gloom Despair, Agony On Me. Deep Dark Depression, Excessive Misery.

[BertSquirtgum]

It's tough to get handed a new crew & train them to all be on the same page in the first year is going to be tough. DW was given the keys to a Ferrari without the training to drive it, he's actually blown deals like this before as well. You don't spend the most ever for a defensive superstar when you have nothing else really set in stone, it's a go for broke scenario that's pretty risky.

I'm not trying to be totally negative but if the defense fails & the team crashes, heads are going to roll. The expectations are really too high for a new D-coach & a major change in your defensive system, Dave W. is in way over his head.

No

[BertSquirtgum]

This thread sucks and every one of Mitch's posts in this thread sucks.

[Skooby]

This thread sucks and every one of Mitch's posts in this thread sucks.

Didn't you say Chad Johnson wouldn't get cut ?

[Skooby]

So Dave is now the lynchpin for the Bills staying in Buffalo?

I believe that the defense is the lynchpin for this year's success or failures.

[better days]

I believe that the defense is the lynchpin for this year's success or failures.

Maybe so, and that is a good thing. This Bills defense will be the best the Bills have put on the field since Wade left.

[Skooby]

Maybe so, and that is a good thing. This Bills defense will be the best the Bills have put on the field since Wade left.

Talent wise yes. New coach / system / schemes being good, that's the big question.

[better days]

Talent wise yes. New coach / system / schemes being good, that's the big question.

I have faith in Wanny as a DC. NEVER as a HC, but he is a very good DC. I think you will see a big improvement in the system/ schemes compared to the last few years. And for those worried about Wanny being to conservtive, he has said we will blitz more than people think.

[stuckincincy]

have you been drinking again mitch?

pornstachio is a great dcoord. we are lucky to have him. aside from another string of injuries the d could not possibly blow up bad enough to get him fired. thats just crazy talk. this is also crazy talk: blaa bloo blee blaabababa mememe bobooo

IMO, he did a good job for Pitt in the Big East. His clubs played well, were fun to watch. During his tenure there, the league fielded several good clubs - UConn, WVA, UCin, Rutgers were some.

2005 Pittsburgh 5–6 4–3 T–3rd (overall, conference)
2006 Pittsburgh 6–6 2–5 6th
2007 Pittsburgh 5–7 3–4 T–3rd
2008 Pittsburgh 9–4 5–2 T–2nd L Sun
2009 Pittsburgh 10–3 5–2 T–2nd W Meineke Car Care.
2010 Pittsburgh 7–5 5–2 T–1st W BBVA Compass Bowl

[Night Train]

If the Bills leave Buffalo, it will be the final dagger in the heart for the city;
Rochester wouldn't be far behind. With Kodak the way it is..and the efforts to make Rochester a partner city for the Bills...they couldn't survive.
That leaves Syracuse and Utica to fend for upstate. Utica's pretty useless, so there is only Syracuse to defend upstate. I doubt the Orange can do it on their own.

If Wanny fails, all of upstate NY will crumble.
:rofl:

[justasportsfan]

"This thread stinks"

[BertSquirtgum]

Didn't you say Chad Johnson wouldn't get cut ?

That doesn't change the fact that each of your post are absolutely ******ed.

[Jan Reimers]

I think I'll wait until we play a few games with real bullits before I start speculating on Wanny's possible demise.

[Skooby]

That doesn't change the fact that each of your post are absolutely ******ed.

New coach / new scheme concerns are ******ed ?? That seems a little narrow minded.

[better days]

New coach / new scheme concerns are ******ed ?? That seems a little narrow minded.

Well, if the new DC was a guy like the Bills previous DC that had no experience, no track record, then those concerns would be valid. Wanny on the other hand has plenty of experience, a GOOD track record as a DC & Chan has worked with him before, knows him well & hired him. That is good enough for me, I have no concerns about the DC or his system.

Chan has said of Wanny " He does not work for me, he works WITH me."

[justasportsfan]

Mitch wants George Edwards back.

[Skooby]

Mitch wants George Edwards back.


Well, if the new DC was a guy like the Bills previous DC that had no experience, no track record, then those concerns would be valid. Wanny on the other hand has plenty of experience, a GOOD track record as a DC & Chan has worked with him before, knows him well & hired him. That is good enough for me, I have no concerns about the DC or his system.

Chan has said of Wanny " He does not work for me, he works WITH me."


Implementing new defensive systems normally take a few years, I hope you're all right & my concern is unfounded.

[better days]

Implementing new defensive systems normally take a few years, I hope you're all right & my concern is unfounded.

Well, the Texans switched from a 4-3 to a 3-4 last year with little problem. The Bills have been running some form of 4-3 for a while now & have GOOD personal to run the 4-3. I think your concern is unfounded.

[Meathead]

yeah im like not at all worried about this defense under pornstachio. they should be able to make the top half of the league in their sleep. the higher they go after that the more pressure they take off the offense and the greater the chance they can eek out enough wins to make the playoffs. wont be easy by any stretch but wannys performance as dc is one of the least of my worries

[justasportsfan]

Implementing new defensive systems normally take a few years, I hope you're all right & my concern is unfounded.

I agree it could take a few years , if you don't have the talent.

[Meathead]

plus the bodies on this team really always more suited to a four man front. and in reality theyve been playing primarily four fronts since the middle of last season. even when they had kelsay listed as a lb he never left the los and really was in fact a de

so yeah pornstachio and his specific system is 'new' but really they are far from starting from scratch

[BillsOwnAll]

why does this thread exist? Its the 2nd preseason game and we have arguably the best defense (on paper) the bills had in a long long time...

[coastal]

The system or Wanny being new isn't the problem.

Actually... His system is easy by all accounts... Simple assignments and then go and get after it and let the players talents shine.

The rub for me is still the players... Specifically the linebackers.

To date... The most positive reports are about McKillop and Moats.

Unless they're both diamonds in the rough, thats not a good sign.

[Skooby]

Anybody else seeing what I'm saying ?

[kingJofNYC]

Yeah, I'm seeing some terrible linebacker play and questionable coverage in the secondary. Same issues as last year but now with a different coach. So is it the coach or the talent? Stache can't cover or tackle.

[IAG]

Dave was an incredible selection as DC. Owns Tom Brady btw. Stay patient.

[justasportsfan]

Anybody else seeing what I'm saying ?

NO!

[Skooby]

Yeah, I'm seeing some terrible linebacker play and questionable coverage in the secondary. Same issues as last year but now with a different coach. So is it the coach or the talent? Stache can't cover or tackle.

It's coaching, we have talent they just don't know where to go.

[better days]

It's coaching, we have talent they just don't know where to go.

Ridiculous. Do you expect the Coaches to go out on the field & take them by the hand to the spot they are supposed to be in? This is PRESEASON. When the REAL Season starts this team will look much better.

[Skooby]

Ridiculous. Do you expect the Coaches to go out on the field & take them by the hand to the spot they are supposed to be in? This is PRESEASON. When the REAL Season starts this team will look much better.

You're right because we couldn't look much worse.

[kingJofNYC]

Our linebackers are dog ****, how is that not a talent issue? A rookie cornerback and second year guy who missed a lot of games last year are starting on the outside, their going to have good and bad games as they develop. It's always the coaching with Bills fans, never the talent.

[Skooby]

Our linebackers are dog ****, how is that not a talent issue? A rookie cornerback and second year guy who missed a lot of games last year are starting on the outside, their going to have good and bad games as they develop. It's always the coaching with Bills fans, never the talent.

The talent's not picking itself to play in certain schemes.

[kingJofNYC]

The talent's not picking itself to play in certain schemes.
By picking do you mean, drafting? If so, how is that Wannstedt's fault? This thread is about Wannstedt is it not? He has no say over personnel selection, does what he can with what he has.

If you weren't, well it's a 4-3, we have the DL to run a 4-3. What talent is my response, we have **** at LB and young corners that will get beat early in their careers. Either deal with it or keep complaining about it on the internet, because you're under this false delusion that Wannestedt can make untalented players talented.

Our linebackers suck, doesn't matter if it's 3-4 4-3, whatever the ****, you can't scheme around ****. It's still ****.

[Skooby]

By picking do you mean, drafting? If so, how is that Wannstedt's fault? This thread is about Wannstedt is it not? He has no say over personnel selection, does what he can with what he has.

If you weren't, well it's a 4-3, we have the DL to run a 4-3. What talent is my response, we have **** at LB and young corners that will get beat early in their careers. Either deal with it or keep complaining about it on the internet, because you're under this false delusion that Wannestedt can make untalented players talented.

Our linebackers suck, doesn't matter if it's 3-4 4-3, whatever the ****, you can't scheme around ****. It's still ****.

On field personnel & the positions they play in are determined by the coaches, that's my point.

[kingJofNYC]

On field personnel & the positions they play in are determined by the coaches, that's my point.
But what if that personnel isn't good, or learning/developing their skills while on the job because they're rookies/2nd year guys. That's my point.

[Beebe]

I hope we play better I really want this team to start winning already,I don't want to wait anymore.Not another year of losing we waited long enough.

[better days]

The talent's not picking itself to play in certain schemes.

This is the PRESEASON. It is the time to experiment & evaluate. You try different guys at different positions to see how they do in PRESEASON. By the time the REAL season starts the Coaches will know who plays best where, end of story.

[Captain gameboy]

Football aside, is there anyone else who gets really tired reading mustache nonsense?

There is a physiological reason why the man wears a mustache. It is classless and grossly tired, to keep bringing it up.
Get over it and let him do his job without wasting time talking about it, especially from someone as self claimed as being as open minded as Meathead.

[Skooby]

Ironically, my exact concerns about our starting defense surfaced last night:


Even more troubling was how Buffalo looked on defense. Minnesota’s first unit played only three possessions and drove into at least field-goal range each time. Minnesota had five gains of at least 16 yards before the backups entered in the second quarter.

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/article1009717.ece

[better days]

Ironically, my exact concerns about our starting defense surfaced last night:



http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/article1009717.ece

The Sky is falling.

[Skooby]

The Sky is falling.

You're reading about my concerns in the Buffalo News paper about what happened, so I'd say there's something to be concerned with here. It is the Pre-season, so there's time to make some changes.

[better days]

You're reading about my concerns in the Buffalo News paper about what happened, so I'd say there's something to be concerned with here. It is the Pre-season, so there's time to make some changes.

It is the preseason so there is NOTHING to be concerned about at this point. So far, unlike many teams, the Bills have not had any injuries. But you go ahead & keep telling everyone the Sky is falling, nobody is listenting.

[pmoon6]

Well, the system or scheme will only go as far as the players take it. Bill Belichick is one of the greatest defensive minds in NFL history. How has his defense fared the last couple of years? Dom Capers is a pretty good defensive coach, but the Packers, along with the Patriots gave up more yards than the Bills last year. The legendary Dick Lebeau did not do well outside of Pittsburgh. Why? In Pittsburgh he has had the talent to run his system effectively.

You also have to factor in that in today's NFL the rules overwhelmingly favor the offense. Then, you have the unwritten rule of letting the O-Lineman hold to protect the QB.

[YardRat]

Well, the system or scheme will only go as far as the players take it. Bill Belichick is one of the greatest defensive minds in NFL history. How has his defense fared the last couple of years? Dom Capers is a pretty good defensive coach, but the Packers, along with the Patriots gave up more yards than the Bills last year. The legendary Dick Lebeau did not do well outside of Pittsburgh. Why? In Pittsburgh he has had the talent to run his system effectively.

That works in reverse, also. A piss-poor coordinator can make top-notch talent look very bad.

[better days]

That works in reverse, also. A piss-poor coordinator can make top-notch talent look very bad.

Agreed. Good thing Wanny is a GOOD DC & anyone that knows football should know that.

[Skooby]

Agreed. Good thing Wanny is a GOOD DC & anyone that knows football should know that.

That's our biggest difference, i think he's a non-aggressive quitter that will not press to maximize our talent.

[YardRat]

Agreed. Good thing Wanny is a GOOD DC & anyone that knows football should know that.

We're going to find out...I hope you are right. I'm still a little bit concerned about a guy that's been an actual defensive coordinator exactly one season out of the last nineteen, at any level, let alone the NFL.

[better days]

We're going to find out...I hope you are right. I'm still a little bit concerned about a guy that's been an actual defensive coordinator exactly one season out of the last nineteen, at any level, let alone the NFL.

Well, we will find out against the Jets, not before, if Wanny still knows how to be a DC. I doubt he has gotten senile myself, I think all the doubters will see what a good defense looks like in Buffalo for the first time in years.

[justasportsfan]

We're going to find out...I hope you are right. I'm still a little bit concerned about a guy that's been an actual defensive coordinator exactly one season out of the last nineteen, at any level, let alone the NFL.

twice. dallas where they won a sb and miami before Jimmy Johnson stepped down as HC

[YardRat]

twice. dallas where they won a sb and miami before Jimmy Johnson stepped down as HC

He was DC in Dallas through '92. The '93 to '11 seasons = 19. His one season was in Miami, in '99. If I would have said 20 years instead of nineteen, however, you would be correct.

[pmoon6]

That works in reverse, also. A piss-poor coordinator can make top-notch talent look very bad.Well then, how does a run of the mill fan really know anything? Are they in the team meetings trying to teach the 46 or the Tampa 2? Are they able to see the progression of a player, when he should be ****canned or when he should be kept?

Fans go on results. When they can't see success on the field, they complain. Why? Because they don't get their warm fuzzy on Sunday if their team loses.

This guy or that guy fcked up and the fan didn't get what he paid for. Boo ****ing hoo.

Losers and winners are judged by people that never had the balls to put on a jockstrap.

I weep for them, they don't even have a remote notion what it takes to get to that level.

[YardRat]

Well then, how does a run of the mill fan really know anything? Are they in the team meetings trying to teach the 46 or the Tampa 2? Are they able to see the progression of a player, when he should be ****canned or when he should be kept?

Fans go on results. When they can't see success on the field, they complain. Why? Because they don't get their warm fuzzy on Sunday if their team loses.

This guy or that guy fcked up and the fan didn't get what he paid for. Boo ****ing hoo.

Losers and winners are judged by people that never had the balls to put on a jockstrap.

I weep for them, they don't even have a remote notion what it takes to get to that level.

So you don't agree that a poor coach can make talent look bad?

[pmoon6]

So you don't agree that a poor coach can make talent look bad?Isn't that obvious? Who decides who is a poor coach or a good coach is?

Fans?

How can anybody sit on the sideline and make any kind of rational judgment?

You don't get to the NFL level if you suck as a player or a coach. Unfortunately, you have opinion websites that judge both.

[BertSquirtgum]

I'm more worried about the offense than the defense.

[YardRat]

Isn't that obvious? Who decides who is a poor coach or a good coach is?

Fans?

How can anybody sit on the sideline and make any kind of rational judgment?

You don't get to the NFL level if you suck as a player or a coach. Unfortunately, you have opinion websites that judge both.

Oh, absolutely we can judge and critique, any coach and any player.

Sometimes we're full of ****...some times were exactly right.

Do fans somehow have to be qualified to make observations?

Are you serious? First, most fans perceptions of players/coaches are relative to their peers, we do have some measuring stick and benchmarks to go by. Second, you absolutely can get to the NFL as a ****ty coach and pretty sure I don't have to start listing names for too long before we'll agree.

Are you related to Wannstadt or something?

[YardRat]

BTW...


How can anybody sit on the sideline and make any kind of rational judgment?

..if that's your mindset, you might as well stay on sidelines for any conversation regarding any subject on any message board, unless you are somehow directly qualified to make any kind of observation or judgement.

You're not a professional football player or coach? Then shut the hell up about the Buffalo Bills. Not a politician or a preacher? Shut the hell up about politics or religion.

[BertSquirtgum]

Tom Skerritt

[Skooby]

It's tough to get handed a new crew & train them to all be on the same page in the first year is going to be tough. DW was given the keys to a Ferrari without the training to drive it, he's actually blown deals like this before as well. You don't spend the most ever for a defensive superstar when you have nothing else really set in stone, it's a go for broke scenario that's pretty risky.

I'm not trying to be totally negative but if the defense fails & the team crashes, heads are going to roll. The expectations are really too high for a new D-coach & a major change in your defensive system, Dave W. is in way over his head.

Buried.

[Skooby]

Well, we will find out against the Jets, not before, if Wanny still knows how to be a DC. I doubt he has gotten senile myself, I think all the doubters will see what a good defense looks like in Buffalo for the first time in years.



It is the preseason so there is NOTHING to be concerned about at this point. So far, unlike many teams, the Bills have not had any injuries. But you go ahead & keep telling everyone the Sky is falling, nobody is listenting.

Hear anything ?

[Skooby]

It's a little deeper than just his job man, it's this whole season & possibly the viability of the franchise in Buffalo. It's harder to move a well supported winner, versus a losing franchise 12 + years removed from the playoffs. You can see we're swinging for the fences on payroll costs & obtaining talent. I'm suggesting that without the proper systems in place, the talent will not be utilized to it's highest & best use.

I'm not saying it's impossible, just improbable knowing DW's past & his conservative nature. Did you ever hear the statement of playing not to lose?? Why obtain a monster like Mario Williams & spend a fortune with a conservative DC? Square pegs, round holes is what I'm seeing & DW is a well known choker that won't make in-game adjustments.

Worst F-in fears of mine we're pegged, Mario was like tits on a boar hog yesterday.

[Skooby]

No

Take a side son, fish flop around less in a hot frying pan.

[BillsFever21]

We're Bills fans, some of us start calling for coaches to be fired after the first round of the draft.

Can you name many(if any) good coaches that we have had in the past decade though? Ones that were at least successful with us? I didn't think so.

[gebobs]

Can you name many(if any) good coaches that we have had in the past decade though? Ones that were at least successful with us? I didn't think so.

Rusty Jones? ;-)

[BertSquirtgum]

Take a side son, fish flop around less in a hot frying pan.

What is that supposed to mean oh great one?

[Skooby]

What is that supposed to mean oh great one?

You take radical leaps on issues, like off the cliff on either side. I warned that a new coach with a new system would take some time to implement a positive change. History has told us that Dave W. is conservative by nature, so handing him the keys to a Prius or a Ferrari to drive will equal the same results on a racetrack.

I'm now wondering how Nix puts the word down the line that the elderly owner in the hospital didn't just drop a fortune to see what might be his last team teetering on collapse. The blame for the past 13 losses out of 14 games is difficult to place on the players with the new additions & returning healthy players.

Just for the record, I also met Dave W. several times on different business ventures (he had a home here in Naples). I can assure you that his business prowess is about as sharp as a bag of wet mice. I'm not a believer in his ability to translate anything cognitively brilliant on the field anytime soon.

[kishoph]

I'm still optimistic for this defense, they struggled against the Jets, but a lot of that was due to poor play by the DB's and that could of been caused by a number of things that can be corrected. Also how mentally draining and frustrating must it be to go out there do you job and have the offense dig a hole that puts you down in the first couple of minutes, it has to affect the way you play. Overall the run defense played a pretty solid game holding the Jets to just over 3 yds. per carry. This is a whole new defense, new coach, new system and many new players. With the right adjustments and some playing time together, hopefully things will gel sooner than later. I'm not ready to call for Wannstedt's head after 1 game. One thing I think might be missing from this defense, is a leader, someone to fire them up, give them some identity, intangibles like Ray Lewis brings to the Ravens or Darryl Talley brought to the Bills. Could Nick Barnett be this guy ? Someone needs to step up and take this role, maybe Mario Williams. :laughing:

[BertSquirtgum]

You take radical leaps on issues, like off the cliff on either side. I warned that a new coach with a new system would take some time to implement a positive change. History has told us that Dave W. is conservative by nature, so handing him the keys to a Prius or a Ferrari to drive will equal the same results on a racetrack.

I'm now wondering how Nix puts the word down the line that the elderly owner in the hospital didn't just drop a fortune to see what might be his last team teetering on collapse. The blame for the past 13 losses out of 14 games is difficult to place on the players with the new additions & returning healthy players.

Just for the record, I also met Dave W. several times on different business ventures (he had a home here in Naples). I can assure you that his business prowess is about as sharp as a bag of wet mice. I'm not a believer in his ability to translate anything cognitively brilliant on the field anytime soon.

So you single me out because I said no. What an idiot post.

[BertSquirtgum]

It wasn't the defenses fault that the life was sucked out of them after their bum quarterback **** the bed. Wannstadt made no adjustments which is completely his fault but he's not out there playing the game. The guys on the field looked completely deflated and looked like they were playing at 50%.

[Skooby]

It wasn't the defenses fault that the life was sucked out of them after their bum quarterback **** the bed. Wannstadt made no adjustments which is completely his fault but he's not out there playing the game. The guys on the field looked completely deflated and looked like they were playing at 50%.

How many 3 & outs did we have ?

[Skooby]

Not that many huh?

[BertSquirtgum]

Sorry, I don't live on here all day. I don't know, nor do I care how many 3 and out we had.

[kishoph]

It wasn't the defenses fault that the life was sucked out of them after their bum quarterback **** the bed. Wannstadt made no adjustments which is completely his fault but he's not out there playing the game. The guys on the field looked completely deflated and looked like they were playing at 50%.


I couldn't agree more that this had a major impact on how the defense performed. After coming up with a turnover on the 1st series, Fintz then turned the ball right back over to the Jets after only 4 plays, leaving the Jets with good field position. Then after seemingly stopping the Jets on 3rd down, A. Williams is called for a questionable PI, Jets go on to score, then 7 plays later Fintz again turns it over, giving the ball to the Jets at mid-field. Rookie Gilmore gets beat, with no help from Byrd, Jets go up 14-0. Offense gets the ball back, does nothing and 5 plays later ST's give up a 68 yd. punt return, 21-0. How could this defense not be totally deflated at this point, especially after such high expectations. This game is played with such emotion and momentum swings can easily decide games. Fans also use emotion to grade their team, so in a way I can understand why so many people now think the season is lost, but the Bills are not going to give up 24 points a week on turnovers (at least I hope not) and the defense will rebound and use the talent it has. Every season has unexpected wins and losses, the Bills will still make the playoffs this season.

Unless Fintz continues to **** the bed.

[Skooby]

You take radical leaps on issues, like off the cliff on either side. I warned that a new coach with a new system would take some time to implement a positive change. History has told us that Dave W. is conservative by nature, so handing him the keys to a Prius or a Ferrari to drive will equal the same results on a racetrack.

I'm now wondering how Nix puts the word down the line that the elderly owner in the hospital didn't just drop a fortune to see what might be his last team teetering on collapse. The blame for the past 13 losses out of 14 games is difficult to place on the players with the new additions & returning healthy players.

Just for the record, I also met Dave W. several times on different business ventures (he had a home here in Naples). I can assure you that his business prowess is about as sharp as a bag of wet mice. I'm not a believer in his ability to translate anything cognitively brilliant on the field anytime soon.

Did this show up today or what?

[BertSquirtgum]

If wannstadt isn't here next year it will be because Buddy nix turned the reigns over to whaley and then whaley cleans house.

[Skooby]

If wannstadt isn't here next year it will be because Buddy nix turned the reigns over to whaley and then whaley cleans house.

A bag a ******ism doesn't need to burn that obvious if you allow the opponents to differ to their usual gifts like we did today. A different exposure would be to press on some blitz package that combines our LB's for common sense if we press the opposing QB, it's a huge variance.

[BertSquirtgum]

Chan Gailey is too busy worrying about the offense to put any pressure on his defensive coach. Another failure of the idiot Gailey. Not getting himself a coordinator by year two like he said he was going to. Head coaches are supposed to manage games.

[Mouldsie]

I agree with the OP.

These players are not well coached on defense. We never blitzed, never change up coverages, and got gashed in the run game by playing nickel all game long (with Scott at LB).

I think we could also use some swagger and attitude from the players that is not currently there. A leader like Ray Lewis would do wonders, as would coaching from a guy like Lebeau/Tomlin/Ryan/Harbaugh.

Mike Nolan was available and we inexplicably passed on him.

[Mouldsie]

On top of poor scheme and attitude, we do not do a good job rotating our DL IMO

[Skooby]

I agree with the OP.

These players are not well coached on defense. We never blitzed, never change up coverages, and got gashed in the run game by playing nickel all game long (with Scott at LB).

I think we could also use some swagger and attitude from the players that is not currently there. A leader like Ray Lewis would do wonders, as would coaching from a guy like Lebeau/Tomlin/Ryan/Harbaugh.

Mike Nolan was available and we inexplicably passed on him.

Dead on here, what a joke again this past week. Dave W. is in way over his head.

[Skooby]

Much hate for Wanny on other boards as well, 50 points + average given up against divisional opponents is brutal.

[kishoph]

I wanted aj green at #3.


Why, so Fitz can underthrow him ?


As for Dareus, I lost a brother just over a year ago and there are still times when he comes to mind and it overwhelms me, that 's just one thing, you need teammates around you that are going to tie up blockers occasionally, Dareus receives a lot of double teams along with K. Williams. Then you also have the fact that he's in a new scheme with a new coordinator (who isn't doing a good job). An occasional blitz my help tie up a blocker. There's also the rotation, against the Pats, Dareus was in for only 64% of the snaps and it was even less the week before against the Browns. I know that he needs a breather now and then, but he does not need to miss 1 out of 3 plays. With Spencer Johnson out this week hopefully both Dareus and K. Williams will get more snaps. There are so many variables that can play into a players performance, they can't always be judged by black and white stats.

[kishoph]

Dead on here, what a joke again this past week. Dave W. is in way over his head.

I don't know what he's thinking during the games, or if he's thinking at all. He said he laid awake all Sunday night wondering if he should of adjusted and changed the defense, this is something he should of thought about during the game, not 12 hours later, at home in bed. The worse decision in the Pats game was to stay in the nickle, Moats was in for 9 plays, Sheppard in for 10, that's out of 77 plays. Your team is getting gashed in the run game and you have your LB's on the sideline for practically the whole game. Putting and keeping Rogers on Welker, was Wanny hoping that eventually the odds would catch up and Rogers would make a play. Putting Scott on Gronkowski, that matchup has failed miserably in the past, did he think it would suddenly be any different. The NFL game has passed Wannstedt by, unfortunately Gailey does not hold his coaches or his players accountable, so it looks like we're stuck with Wannstedt for a while.

[BertSquirtgum]

Why, so Fitz can underthrow him ?


As for Dareus, I lost a brother just over a year ago and there are still times when he comes to mind and it overwhelms me, that 's just one thing, you need teammates around you that are going to tie up blockers occasionally, Dareus receives a lot of double teams along with K. Williams. Then you also have the fact that he's in a new scheme with a new coordinator (who isn't doing a good job). An occasional blitz my help tie up a blocker. There's also the rotation, against the Pats, Dareus was in for only 64% of the snaps and it was even less the week before against the Browns. I know that he needs a breather now and then, but he does not need to miss 1 out of 3 plays. With Spencer Johnson out this week hopefully both Dareus and K. Williams will get more snaps. There are so many variables that can play into a players performance, they can't always be judged by black and white stats.

No, the Bills could have had the aj green dalton duo. Another **** up by the front office in my opinion. I was still happy with dareus though.

[Skooby]

If he makes it out of this week, it looks criminal. New DC / New scheme / new players is hard to put together.

[Mr. Pink]

Can we hire George Edwards back?

[Skooby]

Can we hire George Edwards back?

We need another guy that's 2 generations behind the current play, just for old time sakes.

[Skooby]

Is this Dave's last year here ?

[BertSquirtgum]

Is this Dave's last year here ?

Probably not.

[Skooby]

Probably not.

Well that's sad then, I expect a upheaveal soon.

[Skooby]

You've been sacked! - First NFL coach to be fired


Rex Ryan (Jets) +700
Joe Philbin (Dolphins) +1200
Chan Gailey (Bills) -140
Pat Shurmur (Browns) +200
Mike Mularkey (Jaguars) +1400
Mike Munchak (Titans) +1200
Romeo Crennel (Chiefs) +750
Dennis Allen (Raiders) +2500
Jason Garrett (Cowboys) +750
Andy Reid (Eagles) +3000
Jim Schwartz (Lions) +750
Greg Schiano (Buccaneers) +2000
Ron Rivera (Panthers) +1200

[JoeMama]

If our front four can't get to Kevin Kolb (who's been sacked 17 times in the past two weeks), there's no hope for this defense.

[Skooby]

If our front four can't get to Kevin Kolb (who's been sacked 17 times in the past two weeks), there's no hope for this defense.

I agree, it makes sense that we are going to get to him though.

[BertSquirtgum]

You've been sacked! - First NFL coach to be fired


Rex Ryan (Jets) +700
Joe Philbin (Dolphins) +1200
Chan Gailey (Bills) -140
Pat Shurmur (Browns) +200
Mike Mularkey (Jaguars) +1400
Mike Munchak (Titans) +1200
Romeo Crennel (Chiefs) +750
Dennis Allen (Raiders) +2500
Jason Garrett (Cowboys) +750
Andy Reid (Eagles) +3000
Jim Schwartz (Lions) +750
Greg Schiano (Buccaneers) +2000
Ron Rivera (Panthers) +1200

What the **** is that?

[Mouldsie]

Let's add poor tackling and a lack of swarming to the ball to my criticisms

[Skooby]

What the **** is that?

Vegas odds on who's getting S-canned first, notice that our coach is worse than even money?? That should tell you something is happening, he's miles ahead to get fired past everyone on the list. Rex is second on that list, just to be clear.

If we get blown out again this weekend, it looks like he'll be taking his own plane home.

[Skooby]

Dave W. is in so far over his head, he drowned today. What a sad day when get raped again at home by a low-rate team.

[Skooby]

It's tough to get handed a new crew & train them to all be on the same page in the first year is going to be tough. DW was given the keys to a Ferrari without the training to drive it, he's actually blown deals like this before as well. You don't spend the most ever for a defensive superstar when you have nothing else really set in stone, it's a go for broke scenario that's pretty risky.

I'm not trying to be totally negative but if the defense fails & the team crashes, heads are going to roll. The expectations are really too high for a new D-coach & a major change in your defensive system, Dave W. is in way over his head.

Did the heads roll?

[Skooby]

It's a little deeper than just his job man, it's this whole season & possibly the viability of the franchise in Buffalo. It's harder to move a well supported winner, versus a losing franchise 12 + years removed from the playoffs. You can see we're swinging for the fences on payroll costs & obtaining talent. I'm suggesting that without the proper systems in place, the talent will not be utilized to it's highest & best use.

I'm not saying it's impossible, just improbable knowing DW's past & his conservative nature. Did you ever hear the statement of playing not to lose?? Why obtain a monster like Mario Williams & spend a fortune with a conservative DC? Square pegs, round holes is what I'm seeing & DW is a well known choker that won't make in-game adjustments.

Can anyone disagree with this ?

[Skooby]

No


Yes.


That doesn't change the fact that each of your post are absolutely ******ed.

Still feel the same ??

[Skooby]

The system or Wanny being new isn't the problem.

Actually... His system is easy by all accounts... Simple assignments and then go and get after it and let the players talents shine.

The rub for me is still the players... Specifically the linebackers.

To date... The most positive reports are about McKillop and Moats.

Unless they're both diamonds in the rough, thats not a good sign.

Smartest guy thus far on here.

[swiper]

Smartest guy thus far on here.

No. Not exactly. Several notable players took steps backwards in their games when Wannstedt was the d-coordinator. Specifically Barnett and Sheppard and the rest of the LBs. They are not all that bad. It WAS wannstedt. Saying he wasn't the problem is purely incorrect.

[Night Train]

" EVERYBODY ! LOOK AT ME !!! "

[Skooby]

Probably not.

Funny to look back and see all these calls.

[Skooby]

" EVERYBODY ! LOOK AT ME !!! "

No this is more of the I met Dave W and he was dumb as a stump thread. This guy had been passed along by his friendships & not his mind, ignorant people don't succeed in the NFL.

[Skooby]

What the **** is that?

Reality.

[BillsFever21]

Great thread to bring back to the table from last year. Many of the same Kool-Aid drinkers thought Wanny was a great coach and would make our defense much better. It only ended up being the worse defense in the history of the Bills though.

Perfect example of the same people every year thinking everyone who comes to Buffalo are better then they really are and that we're on the rise. Then when them people fail they will make excuses for a while and when they finally get fired then afterwards they blame it on the horrible people that we just fired which they originally praised the entire year before. Oh the mind of the Kool-Aid drinker.

[Mr. Pink]

I like the Vegas odds on Andy Reid being out in Philly.

Coulda made a mint betting on that one.

[BertSquirtgum]

Yes.



Still feel the same ??

Such a loser. I'm pretty sure that I make it well known that I think many of your posts are ******ed.

[BertSquirtgum]

I feel bad for you Skoob. The need to bring something up from a year ago so someone tells you were right. With the hopes of making your life in the trailer bog a little better for a day. So sad.

FWIW, I was saying Wannstadt would still be here because I didn't think the Bills would have the balls to fire Gailey and Gailey wouldn't have the balls to fire his long time friend. I never thought the stache was a good coach.

[Skooby]

Such a loser.

LOL, hey when you're right / you're right.


I feel bad for you Skoob. The need to bring something up from a year ago so someone tells you were right. With the hopes of making your life in the trailer bog a little better for a day. So sad.


FWIW, I was saying Wannstadt would still be here because I didn't think the Bills would have the balls to fire Gailey and Gailey wouldn't have the balls to fire his long time friend. I never thought the stache was a good coach.

No.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Why are we worrying about firing a DC in August?

I wish we had fired him and his moustache in August

[Skooby]

I wish we had fired him and his moustache in August

LOL.

[Skooby]

How brutal Dave was is trending on other boards, LOL.

[ThunderGun]

So you figured you'd bring back one of your old, crappy threads?

[Skooby]

So you figured you'd bring back one of your old, crappy threads?

Accurate thread is more like it.

[BertSquirtgum]

So you figured you'd bring back one of your old, crappy threads?

I don't think Skoobs was breast fed. He's always crying for attention.

[Skooby]

I don't think Skoobs was breast fed. He's always crying for attention.

Sure thing.