CJ Spiller: 2010 Draft Discussion -- Had to be posted!

[Mahdi]

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php/189402-Mock-Draft-2-0

[THRILLHO]

Lol, trading up for Tebow...

[Mahdi]

Lol, trading up for Tebow...

Hey I thought they would try for it... didnt really like the idea. And actually, a combo of Tebow and Spiller could be lethal.

[YardRat]

I'm still comfortable with my comment in the thread.

[DraftBoy]

I'd say I'd about nailed it. Spiller was a good pick and Tebow would of been a horrible mistake in a trade up.

[HAMMER]

Hey I thought they would try for it... didnt really like the idea. And actually, a combo of Tebow and Spiller could be lethal.
Lethal to our chances of making the playoffs, Tebow is not an NFL caliber QB.

[Ingtar33]

i still stand by my assessment (which was not in that thread)... i said at worse he was a poor man's Reggie Bush, at best he was Tiki Barber.. and that either way he would be over drafted if taken by buffalo.

While Spiller is looking very good, I still think Fred Jackson and Marshawn Lynch are better running backs as of this moment in time. He has to take it to a level beyond what Tiki Barber reached in his career before i believe he was worth the pick in that draft.

[HAMMER]

i still stand by my assessment (which was not in that thread)... i said at worse he was a poor man's Reggie Bush, at best he was Tiki Barber.. and that either way he would be over drafted if taken by buffalo.

While Spiller is looking very good, I still think Fred Jackson and Marshawn Lynch are better running backs as of this moment in time. He has to take it to a level beyond what Tiki Barber reached in his career before i believe he was worth the pick in that draft.

There is simply no way Lynch is a better RB than Spiller.

[BertSquirtgum]

I told you so threads are gayer than 9 men having an orgy.

[HAMMER]

I told you so threads are gayer than 9 men having an orgy.

You spend a lot of time talking about gay men.

[mjt328]

The biggest complaint about drafting CJ Spiller was that Buffalo simply didn't NEED him, with two 1,000-yard backs already on the roster.
Just because he is playing well now - three years later - does not make those people wrong.

Drafting Spiller eventually forced Buffalo to trade Marshawn Lynch for a fourth round pick. In case you missed it, Lynch ran for over 1,200 yards and 12 touchdowns last season. He also ran for over 120 yards and a touchdown yesterday.

[BertSquirtgum]

You spend a lot of time talking about gay men.

You spend a lot of time with gay men.

[Ingtar33]

There is simply no way Lynch is a better RB than Spiller.

no other RB in the league has run for more yards over the last 11 games then Lynch.

He's tearing it up in Seattle right now.

So i stand by my post. It was an unneeded pick for a utility player. Until I see Spiller carry the rock more than 25 times in a game he'll forever be a 3rd down back in my mind. Remember this is a RB who's never carried the ball more than 19 times in a pro game. So perhaps we should back down from the hype for a bit. He's been the best player on the field for this team this year. Lets see how it turns out. Overall it's good for the franchise if he can become a Tiki Barber or better type of back, so I'll root for him, but as it stands right now, the draft pick was a waste.

[Mahdi]

no other RB in the league has run for more yards over the last 11 games then Lynch.

He's tearing it up in Seattle right now.

So i stand by my post. It was an unneeded pick for a utility player. Until I see Spiller carry the rock more than 25 times in a game he'll forever be a 3rd down back in my mind. Remember this is a RB who's never carried the ball more than 19 times in a pro game. So perhaps we should back down from the hype for a bit. He's been the best player on the field for this team this year. Lets see how it turns out. Overall it's good for the franchise if he can become a Tiki Barber or better type of back, so I'll root for him, but as it stands right now, the draft pick was a waste.

He's still a 3rd down back in your mind? Wow... no comment...

And as for the 19 carries per game only.... well its hard for Spiller to get a lot of carries when he is averaging 10 yards per and getting to the endzone too fast.

Oh and Spiller can do 10x more for an offense than Lynch. Its not even close.

[DraftBoy]

He's still a 3rd down back in your mind? Wow... no comment...

And as for the 19 carries per game only.... well its hard for Spiller to get a lot of carries when he is averaging 10 yards per and getting to the endzone too fast.

Oh and Spiller can do 10x more for an offense than Lynch. Its not even close.

Not true and this is why Spiller may continue to only get a few carries (5-7) when Jackson is back. He's not a good blocker, never had been and never will. You can't call Max Protect with him which limits the offense and also is a tell. Lynch is a good blocker, and a great power runner. People want to overlook his ability because of his off the field issues but ask any Seahawks fan and they'll tell you they fleeced us in that deal and its hard to argue otherwise.

[Mahdi]

Not true and this is why Spiller may continue to only get a few carries (5-7) when Jackson is back. He's not a good blocker, never had been and never will. You can't call Max Protect with him which limits the offense and also is a tell. Lynch is a good blocker, and a great power runner. People want to overlook his ability because of his off the field issues but ask any Seahawks fan and they'll tell you they fleeced us in that deal and its hard to argue otherwise.

CJ never will be a good blocker? That's a very strange statement.

1. I would like to know how you came to the conclusion that he will NEVER be a good blocker.

2. Spiller will not go back to 5-7 carries when Jackson is back because that would be ******ed.

3. Even if Spiller is not a great blocker and even if he never is, he will still provide more for an offense than lynch. Screens, pitch plays, receiving out of the backfield and flanking out as a WR, Spiller is better in all those categories.

Honestly, I'm not even sure how I'm having to have this discussion with you. A 10 year old NFL fan knows Spiller is more valuable to an offense than Lynch. I think you just like to agree with Ingtar.

[Stewie]

I'd say I'd about nailed it. Spiller was a good pick and Tebow would of been a horrible mistake in a trade up.

Nailed it? An NFL team traded up for Tebow 8 spots higher than where you thought it'd be a terrible idea. The jury is still out on his career. How can you say you nailed it? Nailed what?

[Mahdi]

Nailed it? An NFL team traded up for Tebow 8 spots higher than where you thought it'd be a terrible idea. The jury is still out on his career. How can you say you nailed it? Nailed what?

IT.

[THRILLHO]

The biggest complaint about drafting CJ Spiller was that Buffalo simply didn't NEED him, with two 1,000-yard backs already on the roster.
Just because he is playing well now - three years later - does not make those people wrong.

Drafting Spiller eventually forced Buffalo to trade Marshawn Lynch for a fourth round pick. In case you missed it, Lynch ran for over 1,200 yards and 12 touchdowns last season. He also ran for over 120 yards and a touchdown yesterday.

Thank you. Exactly how I felt when we drafted Spiller, and still today. Imagine who else we could have used that first round selection on. Jason Pierre Paul, Maurkice Pouncey. But we had to use it on a RB when we already had two good RBs, forcing us to trade Lynch for what felt like nothing.

[Skooby]

Anybody hating on getting the Gale Sayers' looking clone now is insane, he's turning out to be our most potent player thus far.

[better days]

There is simply no way Lynch is a better RB than Spiller.

Lynch may not be better than Spiller, but he would be a better fit with Fred because of his style of play. The Bills have no power back to pick up that tough yard or punch it into the endzone now. Lynch could do that for a team.

And as others have said another GOOD player could have been drafted instead of Spiller. Well, at least Hairston is something I suppose for Lynch.

[Mahdi]

Thank you. Exactly how I felt when we drafted Spiller, and still today. Imagine who else we could have used that first round selection on. Jason Pierre Paul, Maurkice Pouncey. But we had to use it on a RB when we already had two good RBs, forcing us to trade Lynch for what felt like nothing.

JPP is pretty much the only guy and he looked pretty raw coming out. Incredible athlete but very questionable pick. Pouncey didn't provide anything different than what we already had at Center with Eric Wood.

[Mahdi]

Lynch may not be better than Spiller, but he would be a better fit with Fred because of his style of play. The Bills have no power back to pick up that tough yard or punch it into the endzone now. Lynch could do that for a team.

And as others have said another GOOD player could have been drafted instead of Spiller. Well, at least Hairston is something I suppose for Lynch.

Jackson is plenty capable of punching it in. Choice is also pretty solid from short yardage and I think he will do well for us with Jackson out. Also have Jonny White who was drafted as a power back.

[Historian]

Washington -- Jimmy Clausen -- QB -- Notre Dame

:rofl:

[FootballCEO]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy_Z2O16xGY

Listen to my statements at 1:45-2:02

[DraftBoy]

CJ never will be a good blocker? That's a very strange statement.

1. I would like to know how you came to the conclusion that he will NEVER be a good blocker.

2. Spiller will not go back to 5-7 carries when Jackson is back because that would be ******ed.

3. Even if Spiller is not a great blocker and even if he never is, he will still provide more for an offense than lynch. Screens, pitch plays, receiving out of the backfield and flanking out as a WR, Spiller is better in all those categories.

Honestly, I'm not even sure how I'm having to have this discussion with you. A 10 year old NFL fan knows Spiller is more valuable to an offense than Lynch. I think you just like to agree with Ingtar.

1. Well he was not a good blocker in HS, College, or thus far in the NFL, so if 10 years doesn't show you that he's not a good blocker I dont know what in the world anybody would see to ensure that he would suddenly become one.

2. We shall see, one thing you should already know about Gailey though is how loyal he is, and that is a fault. He always goes back to players who have done well for him and it would not shock me if Jackson takes at least half of Spiller's carries away when he returns. To this point Gailey has yet to show an ability to properly manage our rushing attack when both backs are healthy. Could that change? Yes but nothing in his past indicates it.

3. He's not, and I never said he wasn't. However let's not act as if Lynch is inept at that either, he was a 45+ pass catcher for the Bills in 2008 and has caught 20+ balls each year in Seattle. Spiller is yet to catch over 40 passes in a season (39 his rookie year) which could be partially a product of our spread system.

Well if I ever had to use a 10 year old NFL fan as the backup for my opinion I'd know that my opinion probably wasn't that good. I never said Spiller was less valuable to an offense and I never actually agreed with Ingtar. Even he'd tell you we disagree heavily on Spiller.

What I said was that its foolish to sit here and act like Spiller is all everything and Lynch is dirt simply because we choose to like one over another. I thought Lynch was done when he left Buffalo. I was wrong about that, what's he's done over the past two seasons is among the best in the NFL and the only people who don't know that are the ones who either don't pay attention or have a reason to not acknowledge that.

[DraftBoy]

Nailed it? An NFL team traded up for Tebow 8 spots higher than where you thought it'd be a terrible idea. The jury is still out on his career. How can you say you nailed it? Nailed what?

How many teams has Tebow been on now? Is he currently a starter or a backup? What upside has he shown? We can argue Tebow if you like but your argument will be based on maybe's and could be's while Ill continually point to being cast away by the team that drafted him and his inability to be anything more than a ST and Wildcat QB currently. If it turns around and he become a double digit winner Ill happily admit I was wrong as Ive done before. This isn't a game of "got ya".

[Mahdi]

1. Well he was not a good blocker in HS, College, or thus far in the NFL, so if 10 years doesn't show you that he's not a good blocker I dont know what in the world anybody would see to ensure that he would suddenly become one.

2. We shall see, one thing you should already know about Gailey though is how loyal he is, and that is a fault. He always goes back to players who have done well for him and it would not shock me if Jackson takes at least half of Spiller's carries away when he returns. To this point Gailey has yet to show an ability to properly manage our rushing attack when both backs are healthy. Could that change? Yes but nothing in his past indicates it.

3. He's not, and I never said he wasn't. However let's not act as if Lynch is inept at that either, he was a 45+ pass catcher for the Bills in 2008 and has caught 20+ balls each year in Seattle. Spiller is yet to catch over 40 passes in a season (39 his rookie year) which could be partially a product of our spread system.

Well if I ever had to use a 10 year old NFL fan as the backup for my opinion I'd know that my opinion probably wasn't that good. I never said Spiller was less valuable to an offense and I never actually agreed with Ingtar. Even he'd tell you we disagree heavily on Spiller.

What I said was that its foolish to sit here and act like Spiller is all everything and Lynch is dirt simply because we choose to like one over another. I thought Lynch was done when he left Buffalo. I was wrong about that, what's he's done over the past two seasons is among the best in the NFL and the only people who don't know that are the ones who either don't pay attention or have a reason to not acknowledge that.

Lynch is a better receiver than some on this board gave him credit for. However, compared to Spiller its not even close. Spiller is just quicker and can actually run routes. Lynch doesn't have the flexibility or agility to do what Spiller can in space.

Also, Spiller is a threat to break a 20+ yard run every time he gets it. Lynch is more of a grinder. Any coach would rather have the guy that can make the big plays.

Just because Spiller wasn't a good blocker in college doesn't mean he won't become one here. He will excel at it with time. You mention 39 receptions for Spiller in his rookie year and that was when he barely played. Spiller has the potential to be the next LT. I doubt anyone is saying that about Lynch.

[DraftBoy]

Lynch is a better receiver than some on this board gave him credit for. However, compared to Spiller its not even close. Spiller is just quicker and can actually run routes. Lynch doesn't have the flexibility or agility to do what Spiller can in space.

Flexibility and agility do not make one a better receiver. Simply being fast means little, ask Roscoe.


Also, Spiller is a threat to break a 20+ yard run every time he gets it. Lynch is more of a grinder. Any coach would rather have the guy that can make the big plays.
Agreed but coaches also want players who can grind down defenses too.


Just because Spiller wasn't a good blocker in college doesn't mean he won't become one here. He will excel at it with time. You mention 39 receptions for Spiller in his rookie year and that was when he barely played. Spiller has the potential to be the next LT. I doubt anyone is saying that about Lynch.

That makes little sense in terms of his blocking. Please don't compare Spiller to a HOF RB. He's at least has to start and produce over a full season first.

[Mahdi]

Flexibility and agility do not make one a better receiver. Simply being fast means little, ask Roscoe.

Yes they do make one a better receiver. Getting in and out of cuts, setting up a DB or LB requires those things. Regardless, Spiller can run routes like a WR, Lynch cannot. Spiller is more dangerous receiving out of the backfield than Lynch. Spiller is better on draws and screens. On top of all that he can run inside just as well.

Also, I said Spiller has the POTENTIAL to be the next Tomlinson... Lynch is good but his talent is limited.

There is no arguing these points but I'm sure you'll come up with something...

[justasportsfan]

Thank you. Exactly how I felt when we drafted Spiller, and still today. Imagine who else we could have used that first round selection on. Jason Pierre Paul, Maurkice Pouncey. But we had to use it on a RB when we already had two good RBs, forcing us to trade Lynch for what felt like nothing.

Even though they were cool ,I doubt Lynch could co-exhist with Freddie. Lynch was also a risk since he was suspended for 4 games. Not a high character guy that Nix was looking for.

[DraftBoy]

Yes they do make one a better receiver. Getting in and out of cuts, setting up a DB or LB requires those things. Regardless, Spiller can run routes like a WR, Lynch cannot. Spiller is more dangerous receiving out of the backfield than Lynch. Spiller is better on draws and screens. On top of all that he can run inside just as well.

Also, I said Spiller has the POTENTIAL to be the next Tomlinson... Lynch is good but his talent is limited.

There is no arguing these points but I'm sure you'll come up with something...

No they don't and its a ridiculous statement to make.

[better days]

Jackson is plenty capable of punching it in. Choice is also pretty solid from short yardage and I think he will do well for us with Jackson out. Also have Jonny White who was drafted as a power back.

Choice looked good against the Chiefs in garbage time when their defense was tired out & gave up. Neither Jackson, Choice or White have the size & power of Lynch to power the Ball in. Yes Fred can hit the hole & pick up yds & score down in the red zone, the point is he is not a power back & neither is Choice.

[justasportsfan]

Drafting Spiller eventually forced Buffalo to trade Marshawn Lynch for a fourth round pick. In case you missed it, Lynch ran for over 1,200 yards and 12 touchdowns last season. He also ran for over 120 yards and a touchdown yesterday.

If Freddie didn't get injured he would have had way better nos. than Lynch and Lynch played in a weaker division.
Spiller had a better day last sunday and isn't in danger of being suspended for an entire season.

[better days]

If Freddie didn't get injured he would have had way better nos. than Lynch and Lynch played in a weaker division.
Spiller had a better day last sunday and isn't in danger of being suspended for an entire season.

Both very true statements. I am much more happy now with the drafting of Spiller & trade of Lynch than I was at the time.

[Mouldsie]

Marshawn Lynch has no talent


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynn7VGY2Asc

[better days]

Marshawn Lynch has no talent


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynn7VGY2Asc

I don't think anyone is quetioning Lynch's talent. His problems are off the field. And he is in danger of jeopardizing his career.

[Mouldsie]

Lynch is good but his talent is limited.

There is no arguing these points but I'm sure you'll come up with something...

[notacon]

I was not here when Spiller was picked.

My opinion of him has not changed. Back then I thought he was a huge waste of such a high pick in the first round, and I still think he was a huge waste of such a high first round pick.