things are really hopping in here

[Typ0]

ouch!

[SabreEleven]

This is surprising?

[TheGhostofJimKelly]

Brilliant!!

[OpIv37]

Well we can still talk about Derek Roy and Tim Connolly. Roy is just as productive as he would be if there was a season, and Connolly is playing in the same number of games that he would be if there was a season.

[Soviet_Canuckastani]

Connolly sucks.

[Typ0]

I am just surprised there is not even any talk about the status of the league or the season. There is just nothing. Remember the last time there was a lockout? Our team was lights out after that and still couldn't win it all.

[OpIv37]

I just don't think there's much to discuss. Everyone sees it as a lost cause. And let's face it- the Sabres are looking pretty mediocre if there is a season.

[Typ0]

Do you think there will be a season? Next season? An NHL at all?

[OpIv37]

Do you think there will be a season? Next season? An NHL at all?

neither side seems to feel any urgency to get a deal done. Players are signing overseas. It seems like they are just accepting another lost season.

I don't think they go two. If it goes over a year with no resolution, then the league is basically done. They'll never get people to care again after two or more seasons off.

I read some speculation that they might feel pressure to get a deal done before the Winter Classic so they don't have the embarrassment of canceling such a high-profile event, but it may just be wishful thinking.

[Night Train]

I got tickets to the Rochester Amerks game vs. Hamilton on Tuesday 10-23. They moved it to the First Niagara Center - Downtown Buffalo.

[DraftBoy]

neither side seems to feel any urgency to get a deal done. Players are signing overseas. It seems like they are just accepting another lost season.

I don't think they go two. If it goes over a year with no resolution, then the league is basically done. They'll never get people to care again after two or more seasons off.

I read some speculation that they might feel pressure to get a deal done before the Winter Classic so they don't have the embarrassment of canceling such a high-profile event, but it may just be wishful thinking.

As an avid NBA fan, starting a season in shortened form with little time for a team to gel or practice together often leads to pretty sloppy play throughout.

[jamze132]

As an avid NBA fan, starting a season in shortened form with little time for a team to gel or practice together often leads to pretty sloppy play throughout.

Even if we had an entire offseason to prepare, we would still look sloppy until the last quarter of the season when it's too late to make a push.

[Night Train]

I'm hoping they start showing Amerks games here on TV in the Buffalo area.

[mightysimi]

So at the risk of highjacking the thread, who is right? Who needs to cave more?

[Typ0]

highjacking the thread. Thanks simi I really needed that tonight! LMAO. This is a one thread forum!

[SabreEleven]

I'm not going to post the link to Hockey Buzz but I can tell you they said a positive thing about the lockout ending which means we miss two seasons of NHL hockey now. Thanks, Hockey Buzz.

[OpIv37]

So at the risk of highjacking the thread, who is right? Who needs to cave more?

IMO it's the players. They are taking a huge chunk of the revenue to the point where it's putting the viability of a lot of teams in jeopardy. Pegula is an uber-fan with boatloads of money, so losing a few mil for the shot at a championship isn't a big deal to him, but he's the exception to the rule. The players have to understand that if they keep demanding a bigger and bigger chunk of the revenue, it hurts teams financially and will eventually lead to contraction. Sometimes less really is more.

Also I put a lot of blame on Bettman. If it wasn't for his ill-advised expansion, we may not be in this mess. In addition, unlike MLB or the NFL, the NHL doesn't have the TV contracts to support the salaries these guys are getting, and that's mostly Bettman's fault as well. If he could have made the league more popular, there would be more money and, again, we might not be in this mess.

Paul Tagliabue turned the NFL into the most dominant sports franchise in the world. Bud Selig, who's borderline incompetent himself, brought MLB back from the dead after the strike in the 90's. What's Bettman's excuse?

[DraftBoy]

IMO it's the players. They are taking a huge chunk of the revenue to the point where it's putting the viability of a lot of teams in jeopardy. Pegula is an uber-fan with boatloads of money, so losing a few mil for the shot at a championship isn't a big deal to him, but he's the exception to the rule. The players have to understand that if they keep demanding a bigger and bigger chunk of the revenue, it hurts teams financially and will eventually lead to contraction. Sometimes less really is more.

Also I put a lot of blame on Bettman. If it wasn't for his ill-advised expansion, we may not be in this mess. In addition, unlike MLB or the NFL, the NHL doesn't have the TV contracts to support the salaries these guys are getting, and that's mostly Bettman's fault as well. If he could have made the league more popular, there would be more money and, again, we might not be in this mess.

Paul Tagliabue turned the NFL into the most dominant sports franchise in the world. Bud Selig, who's borderline incompetent himself, brought MLB back from the dead after the strike in the 90's. What's Bettman's excuse?

The blame is squarely on the owners. They learned nothing from the last working stoppage and continued to hand out massive contracts that threatened the long term viability of the league.

[OpIv37]

The blame is squarely on the owners. They learned nothing from the last working stoppage and continued to hand out massive contracts that threatened the long term viability of the league.

and the players get no blame for insisting that they stick to revenue policies that hurt the long-term viability of the league?

This is an Olsen problem. People act in their own self-interest. Owners are put in a tough spot. They have to keep their team exciting to keep fans interested. So, if an owner has to give a player a huge contract to do that, he will. At the moment, he's not thinking about the long-term viability of the league. He's only thinking about whether or not his team can afford the contract, in terms of real money and the cap. And this encourages other owners to do the same. It's a weird situation where the owners act as a collective when bargaining with the union over labor policies, but act as individuals when it comes time to actually sign players. The only way to fix that is to create a labor agreement where owner's can't go that high and players don't expect it.

[Skooby]

Greed is the destroyer of all things.

[DraftBoy]

and the players get no blame for insisting that they stick to revenue policies that hurt the long-term viability of the league?

This is an Olsen problem. People act in their own self-interest. Owners are put in a tough spot. They have to keep their team exciting to keep fans interested. So, if an owner has to give a player a huge contract to do that, he will. At the moment, he's not thinking about the long-term viability of the league. He's only thinking about whether or not his team can afford the contract, in terms of real money and the cap. And this encourages other owners to do the same. It's a weird situation where the owners act as a collective when bargaining with the union over labor policies, but act as individuals when it comes time to actually sign players. The only way to fix that is to create a labor agreement where owner's can't go that high and players don't expect it.

No the players share in some blame, but they gave away a number of things to end the last work stoppage. It was the owners who gave in and gave back to them, and now are locking them out because they can't control their own wallet.