Ralph's ownership eliminated our ability to win

[Skooby]

The Bills are not going to get better while Ralph is the owner, he didn't hire a good enough crew to manage the team. It's sorta of like going to the old "Your Host" restaurant, you walked in and knew that this isn't the Ritz, especially with those horrible drapes that had 30 years of food stains. This team is run by a 3rd class / underpaid outfit without the ability to form a cognitive plan, nor will they ever attract a real guy like Polian to run the team. Ralph needed to be the bigger man & sure showed Polian who is charge, it got the Colts on a decade long playoff run with a championship. We got a bag of burning dog-s()it left on our door, see Ralph's in charge.

[BillsFever21]

He is incapable of finding and paying for a real front office and coaching staff. It all starts up top and after all these years it's hard to find a respectable person who even wants the job when they have better opportunities.

There's a reason why teams like the Steelers, Packers, Patriots, etc have been good for years even though players come and go. They have good owners who hire good people to run the ship. You can have the best boat in the world but if you don't have a captain that can drive it then you're a sinking ship that will be yelling "mayday" and calling for the coast guard.

[imbondz]

The issue is that there is no accountability in the front office. You think heads rolled yesterday? Did Ralph light into the coaching staff after the game? If I'm paying a player $100 million and he's performing like Mario, I'm getting in his face. Seriously doubt there is any accountability in Buffalo

[BLeonard]

There's only one number that Ralph, or anyone in the Front Office really cares about and it isn't 52-28...

It's 70,684... The paid attendance.

As long as there is an ass every 18 inches (or at least a ticket bought to put an ass every 18 inches) the Front Office is celebrating a victory.

You'll notice that they had absolutely no issue with letting Patriots' Owner Bob Kraft walk right down on our field and accept an award, did they? Try doing that in MetLife Stadium or Philly...

That sort of stuff just goes to show that the only thing that the Front Office cares about is the almighty dollar. They don't care if they get it from Bills fans, Patriots fans, or hell, even from Toronto, where they've gone as far as to sell home games away.

The Front Office is just in it to make as big of a profit as they can. It's really that simple.

-Bill

[bluerosekiller]

Let's be blunt about it. The Bills will not be a winning team until ol' Ralph is six feet under.
Him & the people that he chooses to run this team are just incompetent. They only thing that they're successful at is taking advantage of the fan base.
Which I'm so damned fed up with that I was actually disappointed when we got the news that Wilson's stay in the hospital was just for for some minor thing & that it wasn't life threatening.
Sorry, but until he's gone, it's obvious that this organization won't even reach the level of mediocrity. Much less produce a winner.

[Historian]

Bill hit the nail on the head.

[Turf]

Been saying it for years, as long as Ralph owns this team there is no hope.

[OpIv37]

Depressing as this is, I'm glad people are finally seeing the light on Ralph.

I need to get my life on the Ralph C. Wilson, Jr plan.

I want to do one great thing that requires a $25,000 investment. Then, I want to sit back for the next 50 years and accomplish nothing while people heap kudos on me for simply not undoing the great thing that I did, all while my $25k investment grows to $700 million.

[Skooby]

Depressing as this is, I'm glad people are finally seeing the light on Ralph.

I need to get my life on the Ralph C. Wilson, Jr plan.

I want to do one great thing that requires a $25,000 investment. Then, I want to sit back for the next 50 years and accomplish nothing while people heap kudos on me for simply not undoing the great thing that I did, all while my $25k investment grows to $700 million.

He did work on other things for many decades but obviously this was a good call. One thing most people don't realize is, for every one good thing that works out in a business career you had a dozen failures plus the problems associated with them. I can personallly attest to this and with age, this happens to most people at one time or another.

[gebobs]

We need a new billboard campaign:

SELL THE TEAM ALREADY

[SpikedLemonade]

I have felt this way for over a dozen years.

The only thing that keeps being a Bills fan these days is to see how this all unfolds after Ralph's death.

I might as well be a Bills fan until the very bitter end rather only to a few years before the end.

[PTI]

Real owner would have fired Levy after losing 2nd Super Bowl, after losing 3rd Super Bowl, after losing 4th Super Bowl, after then not making the Super Bowl, these were teams with no discipline run by the players, horrible coaches with a horrible owner when we were most talented.

[Turf]

Marv was a failed coach when hired. He was in the CFL then failed miserably in Kansas City. He did the Bills preseason games (ie Tasker) for 3 years before he was hired.
Ever since then, Ralph thinks he going to strike gold again. What he never has realized was his gold was Bill Polian, and Marv was Ralphs friend who was incredibly lucky to have such talent.
In all those Super Bowl years, all Ralph had to do was allow one more DE FA signing to complement Bruce, and that would have put us over the top for sure Super Bowl wins. In my opinion, that was Ralph's cheapest, and dumbest move,was not getting one more player to put us over the top.

[gebobs]

You'll notice that they had absolutely no issue with letting Patriots' Owner Bob Kraft walk right down on our field and accept an award

I know. What in THE HELL was that all about!

[gebobs]

Marv was a failed coach when hired. He was in the CFL then failed miserably in Kansas City. He did the Bills preseason games (ie Tasker) for 3 years before he was hired.
Ever since then, Ralph thinks he going to strike gold again. What he never has realized was his gold was Bill Polian, and Marv was Ralphs friend who was incredibly lucky to have such talent.

Absolutely spot on. If there is a theme in his hiring of coaches and executives, it's that he goes for the lousy retreads and hopes to catch lightning in a bottle again and find a diamond in the rough.

Mixed metaphors aside, the only time he hasn't done this was with Chuck Knox. Knox bought us back from the brink of irrelevancy and made us contenders again. Rightfully, he asks for a raise and Ralph, true to form, tells him to take a hike. After one of Knox's assistants laughed Ralph's face after he was offered the top job, he goes and gives it to Kay Stephenson, a guy who had only been a quarterbacks coach in the NFL for one season. And a damned lousy one at that.

[SABURZFAN]

The Old Fart only hires "Yes" men. anybody who rocks the boat are gone immediately. see Lou Saban, Bill Polian, and Cookie Gilchrist.

[ServoBillieves]

Yes, Marv Levy was a terrible coach...

[gebobs]

Yes, Marv Levy was a terrible coach...
I liked Levy. Smart guy. Good leader. As far as Bills coaches go, he was the best. But aside from Chuck Knox, there isn't much in the way of competition.

Unfortunately, he was absolutely schooled in every one of the Super Bowls by Parcells, Gibbs, and Johnson. Obviously, the starkest example of this was Super Bowl XXV. On paper, the Bills win that game hands down as they had superior talent at just about every position. The difference was the Tuna.

[SABURZFAN]

Yes, Marv Levy was a terrible GM...



fixed

[OpIv37]

Yes, Marv Levy was a terrible coach...

Being the best Bills coach?

That's like being the smartest kid on the short bus.
That's like being the fastest sprinter in fat camp.
That's like being the hottest chick in the nursing home.
That's like being the highest paid employee at McDonalds

Get the point or need I continue?

Seriously, though, I like Marv but a) when it comes to being the best Bills coach, there isn't a whole lot of competition and b) it's using the exception to prove the rule. In 52 years, Ralph has managed to find one good coach (maybe 2- I've heard Chuck Knox was good but I'm too young to remember). Since Marv retired, we had one average coach in Wade Phillips, 3 disasters in Williams, Mularkey and Jauron, and the jury's still out on Gailey but it's not looking good. And that's to say nothing of the 25 years or so before Marv.

If this team is ever going to win, we have to do better than 1 good coach every 25 years or so.

[Skooby]

LOL, those MCd's managers in North Dakota make $50,000 a year.


Being the best Bills coach?

That's like being the smartest kid on the short bus.
That's like being the fastest sprinter in fat camp.
That's like being the hottest chick in the nursing home.
That's like being the highest paid employee at McDonalds

Get the point or need I continue?

Seriously, though, I like Marv but a) when it comes to being the best Bills coach, there isn't a whole lot of competition and b) it's using the exception to prove the rule. In 52 years, Ralph has managed to find one good coach (maybe 2- I've heard Chuck Knox was good but I'm too young to remember). Since Marv retired, we had one average coach in Wade Phillips, 3 disasters in Williams, Mularkey and Jauron, and the jury's still out on Gailey but it's not looking good. And that's to say nothing of the 25 years or so before Marv.

If this team is ever going to win, we have to do better than 1 good coach every 25 years or so.

[ThunderGun]

You just figured this out? Welcome to 10 years ago.

[Historian]

Seriously, though, I like Marv but a) when it comes to being the best Bills coach, there isn't a whole lot of competition and b) it's using the exception to prove the rule. In 52 years, Ralph has managed to find one good coach (maybe 2- I've heard Chuck Knox was good but I'm too young to remember). Since Marv retired, we had one average coach in Wade Phillips, 3 disasters in Williams, Mularkey and Jauron, and the jury's still out on Gailey but it's not looking good. And that's to say nothing of the 25 years or so before Marv.

If this team is ever going to win, we have to do better than 1 good coach every 25 years or so.

Knox was a great regular season coach, who's ground-oriented gameplans won a lot of regular season games, but could never get over the hump in the playoffs because they were too conservative. He had very loyal coordinators, which is why he was successful in LA, Buf and Sea. He was an old AFL guy, who came up under Weeb, and won a coaching ring in SB III.

Levy's achilles was that he never had any top flight coordinators after Ted left. Great organizer, great at massaging all those collassal egos, but not so hot at gameday adjustments. (See SB XXVIII)

[blackonyx89]

Ralph has played WNY for over 50+ years and some people have figured out that all he wants to do is make money and not win a Super Bowl. He hires corporate puppets and soft players consistently and what do you get? An inferior product on the field and fans will pay an arm and a leg to be miserable and watch sub-par football, year in and year out! Bills fans deserve better!
:teary:

[Mr. Pink]

Knox was a great regular season coach, who's ground-oriented gameplans won a lot of regular season games, but could never get over the hump in the playoffs because they were too conservative. He had very loyal coordinators, which is why he was successful in LA, Buf and Sea. He was an old AFL guy, who came up under Weeb, and won a coaching ring in SB III.


So basically he was Marty Schoettenheimer before Marty Ball came into existence!

[imbondz]

There's only one number that Ralph, or anyone in the Front Office really cares about and it isn't 52-28...

It's 70,684... The paid attendance.

As long as there is an ass every 18 inches (or at least a ticket bought to put an ass every 18 inches) the Front Office is celebrating a victory.

You'll notice that they had absolutely no issue with letting Patriots' Owner Bob Kraft walk right down on our field and accept an award, did they? Try doing that in MetLife Stadium or Philly...

That sort of stuff just goes to show that the only thing that the Front Office cares about is the almighty dollar. They don't care if they get it from Bills fans, Patriots fans, or hell, even from Toronto, where they've gone as far as to sell home games away.

The Front Office is just in it to make as big of a profit as they can. It's really that simple.

-Bill

But this argument doesn't' make sense, because winning teams, bring in way more money than perennial losing teams. You think NE or Buffalo has brought in more revenue over the past 10 years from ticket sales?

Better the team, more the profit.

[Bill Cody]

There is no reason for Ralph to be holding onto the team now other than simple greed and vanity. It's certainly not in the best interest of the team, it's fans or the city of Buffalo. If the "highest bidder" when Ralph finally kicks is from out of town someone will need to explain to me how Ralph is any better than Art Modell.

[BLeonard]

But this argument doesn't' make sense, because winning teams, bring in way more money than perennial losing teams. You think NE or Buffalo has brought in more revenue over the past 10 years from ticket sales?

Better the team, more the profit.

The bolded is not true at all... And, I can prove it isn't true.

http://www.wgrz.com/news/article/134157/37/Forbes-Bills-Among-NFLs-Most-Profitable-Teams



According to a Forbes Magazine analysis, the Bills are among the league's 10 most profitable teams. The data is part of the magazine's annual valuations of all NFL Franchises. Forbes ranks the Bills ninth, with an annual operating income of $40.9 million (that's after they pay the players). And it's more than the Philadelphia Eagles, Pittsburgh Steelers, and New York Jets each make. It's also more than triple what the Miami Dolphins or Super Bowl Champion Green Bay Packers take away.


Here's the Forbes report: http://www.forbes.com/lists/2011/30/nfl-valuations-11_land.html

For profits, click "Operating Income."

Here's the top 10:

1. Dallas
2. Washington
3. Arizona
4. Tampa Bay
5. Cincinnati
6. Chicago
7. New England
8. Houston
9. Buffalo
10. NY Giants

Certainly you're not gonna tell me that these teams are the top ten teams in the NFL, when it comes to on-field performance, right...?

-Bill

[SpikedLemonade]

The bolded is not true at all... And, I can prove it isn't true.

http://www.wgrz.com/news/article/134157/37/Forbes-Bills-Among-NFLs-Most-Profitable-Teams



Here's the Forbes report: http://www.forbes.com/lists/2011/30/nfl-valuations-11_land.html

For profits, click "Operating Income."

Here's the top 10:

1. Dallas
2. Washington
3. Arizona
4. Tampa Bay
5. Cincinnati
6. Chicago
7. New England
8. Houston
9. Buffalo
10. NY Giants

Certainly you're not gonna tell me that these teams are the top ten teams in the NFL, when it comes to on-field performance, right...?

-Bill

Yet that bastard Ralph has cried "poor small market team" for decades holding a gun to the county for stadium subsidies.

When Ralph dies and it becomes clear that he had no succession plan whatsoever to assist in the team staying in Buffalo, there will be a line up to take turns pissing on his grave.

[Jeff1220]

One of the Bills' biggest problems right now is Smithers (aka Russ Brandon). I believe that, even more than Ralph, this is the guy in control now and in the recent years of crap football. He has no football background and is wired completely around $$$$$$$$$. The problem is he's good at what he does.

[BillsFever21]

Yet that bastard Ralph has cried "poor small market team" for decades holding a gun to the county for stadium subsidies.

When Ralph dies and it becomes clear that he had no succession plan whatsoever to assist in the team staying in Buffalo, there will be a line up to take turns pissing on his grave.

Since the majority of the money is shared except for luxury box seats this isn't surprising at all. We spent some money this year but we're usually sitting 20-30 million under the cap every year. Add that in with the unwillingness to pay for a good front office and coaching staff and choose the cheapest route instead then it's not surprising we're in the Top 10.

[BLeonard]

One of the Bills' biggest problems right now is Smithers (aka Russ Brandon). I believe that, even more than Ralph, this is the guy in control now and in the recent years of crap football. He has no football background and is wired completely around $$$$$$$$$. The problem is he's good at what he does.

I'd argue that, while Russ Brandon is a problem, an even bigger problem is Jeff Littman, the team treasurer. He's been with the Bills much longer than Brandon and is probably at least half of the reason that Bill Polian left OBD.

I say "half" because there are two stories that I have heard surrounding Polian's departure:

1: Polian and Littman got into an argument about player salaries. Ralph sided with Littman.
2: Polian said something bad about Ralph's daughter (who was a Bills' scout). Ralph sided with his daughter.

Either way, I have to say that Ralph sided with the wrong person.

-Bill

[SABURZFAN]

Yet that bastard Ralph has cried "poor small market team" for decades holding a gun to the county for stadium subsidies.

When Ralph dies and it becomes clear that he had no succession plan whatsoever to assist in the team staying in Buffalo, there will be a line up to take turns pissing on his grave.


great post. let's not forget his "tin cup" comment either. the NFL let him strike the Toronto deal just to shut him the **** up.


i'll be standing in that line.

[Extremebillsfan247]

We need a new billboard campaign:

SELL THE TEAM ALREADY lol Those things don't work. You just get laughed at for wasting the money, and becoming a media punch line. NFL Owners consider themselves elite among business owners. Rightfully so, with there being only 32 franchise owners in the world. If you want Ralph Wilson's attention, get enough people to stop going to home games. Oh, and good luck with that approach. That won't work either. Just saying.

[Thurmal]

There's only one number that Ralph, or anyone in the Front Office really cares about and it isn't 52-28...
You'll notice that they had absolutely no issue with letting Patriots' Owner Bob Kraft walk right down on our field and accept an award, did they? Try doing that in MetLife Stadium or Philly...


How about when they let two Pats fans who won a contest work on the chain gang during a Sunday Night game in Buffalo in 2007? Does anyone else remember this?

[BLeonard]

How about when they let two Pats fans who won a contest work on the chain gang during a Sunday Night game in Buffalo in 2007? Does anyone else remember this?

I don't remember it, but it certainly doesn't surprise me...

I have no doubts whatsoever that, if the Bills Front Office can find a way to make a few extra bucks at the expense of the team (and even at the expense of possibly winning games) they'll do so. The Toronto Series is a perfect example.

Ironic that, in the AFL days, Ralph was willing to loan both the Raiders and Patriots money so that they woudn't fold, but now, he doesn't seem to want to invest in his own franchise.

-Bill

[OpIv37]

But this argument doesn't' make sense, because winning teams, bring in way more money than perennial losing teams. You think NE or Buffalo has brought in more revenue over the past 10 years from ticket sales?

Better the team, more the profit.
Profit is revenue minus expenses.

You're only looking at the revenue side. You need to consider the expense side.

Which team do you think spent more on coaches, players, FO personnel, etc? I'll give you a hint: it's not the team owned by the cheap old man.

[ThunderGun]

Profit is revenue minus expenses. You're only looking at the revenue side. You need to consider the expense side. Which team do you think spent more on coaches, players, FO personnel, etc? I'll give you a hint: it's not the team owned by the cheap old man. Kinda sad that you had to explain that. It's basic economics.