Should Bills Fire Chan Gailey?

[Mike]

Should Bills Fire Chan Gailey?

Does he deserve another year. One thing to point, I feel that outside of QB this team can be decent -at least on offense. I like Chan's offensive capacities and I think the game plans are there and mostly executed by everyone but the QB -WR are getting open, Line is top notch, TE is good, RBs are excellent. Defensively the Bills suck. I say get a QB and another DC.

[Philagape]

He gets the rest of the season to turn it around, but then, time's up.

[Mr. Pink]

If this team is 2-6 which they very well could be before facing the easy part of the schedule, yes he should be fired.

Give him the year and he's gonna go 7-9, it's gonna be spun that he's slowly making progress and sold to the fanbase as such.

[Mahdi]

Bills Offense:

6th Total Yards
11th points per game
4th rushing

Fitz -- Leading league in TDs on pace for 48 TDs.

Chan needs his defensive coordinator to match his production thats all. We don't need to tear this thing apart and rebuild again. If a new owner comes in though, gotta wonder if that is exactly what he does though. New owner wants new GM, new GM wants new HC, new HC wants his own coordinators and QB.

[Mr. Pink]

Bills Offense:

6th Total Yards
11th points per game
4th rushing

Fitz -- Leading league in TDs on pace for 48 TDs.

Chan needs his defensive coordinator to match his production thats all. We don't need to tear this thing apart and rebuild again. If a new owner comes in though, gotta wonder if that is exactly what he does though. New owner wants new GM, new GM wants new HC, new HC wants his own coordinators and QB.

You do realize protecting the football is part of the offense right?

29th in the league in INTs, 24th in the league in Fumbles Lost.

You ain't winning consistently in this league when your offense can't protect the football.

[Mahdi]

You do realize protecting the football is part of the offense right?

29th in the league in INTs, 24th in the league in Fumbles Lost.

You ain't winning consistently in this league when your offense can't protect the football.

Gailey can't really control the turnover aspect. My point is he has coached this team up to become a potent offensive unit when we literally had nothing before he came.

[JoeMama]

No!

I don't want Pornstache to take over.

Just give Gailey the rest of the season to see how things unfold.

We're 0-2 in the division (par for the course), but at least we're all deadlocked at 2-2.

There are another 12 games to decide our fate.

A firing this early would be another odd, Brian Moorman type move.

For better or for worse, Yes We Chan (for now).

[OpIv37]

He gets the rest of the season to turn it around, but then, time's up.

This.

Chan has certainly made mistakes and I have my doubts about him, but we have to see how this season plays out. Firing a coach mid-season is very disruptive and rarely results in any significant turnaround, and Chan simply hasn't been bad enough to warrant that.

[Albany,n.y.]

Chan should not be fired.
The reason is that at this point with ownership literally on a day to day basis, no decent head coach is going to come here. So, what the guys in place are doing is just keeping the team in a holding pattern, trying to improve the personnel for the future while knowing they will not be in the team's long term plans. There's no point screwing up another guy's life by firing Gailey & bringing someone else in and any new system. We're going nowhere until there's a new owner, GM, coach & QB.

[zone]

Absolutely not, the reason why we have been as bad as we have is because there is no continuity. You can not build a franchise when you blow the thing up every 3 years. I honestly feel like we are on the right track this time but its going to take time. I know that Sunday was horrible but let's see how the rest of the season goes. We are a defensive leader away from being able to contend.

[Stewie]

You do realize protecting the football is part of the offense right?

29th in the league in INTs, 24th in the league in Fumbles Lost.

You ain't winning consistently in this league when your offense can't protect the football.

You guys are both right

[jdaltroy5]

If he goes 8-8 and fires Wanny, I'd sign him to a one year deal.

[ThunderGun]

I have my doubts about Chan.....but I don't think that he is the problem. Our defense is a train-wreck, and we only have one starting caliber WR. I feel that he has done a good job making something out of nothing (Fitz, scrub WR's.....yet our offense still appears competent). If Fitz would stop throwing the ball to the other team, and if our defense actually did anything, we could be good.

[JoeMama]

If he goes 8-8 and fires Wanny, I'd sign him to a one year deal.

Wanny has no business in the NFL with the kind of talent to results ratio he's putting out.

[blackonyx89]

I want a Chuck Knox type of coach to replace Chan who can win games. If Chuck was coaching the 90's Bills, I think they might have won a at least 1 SB. The problem is the Bills always hire soft coaches, Chuck wasn't that, he didn't have the talent around him and Ralph was the reason he didn't succeed and remain the problem today Ralph hiring mentally soft coaches. Chuck was a tough minded coach and he was my favorite Bills coach, sorry Marv. Back to main point, CAN CHAN and his staff!

[Bill Cody]

Absolutely not, the reason why we have been as bad as we have is because there is no continuity.

The main reason we've been bad is we've had a bad roster. Amos Alonzo Lombardi Walsh couldn't have won with our group. We've upgraded the talent to mediocre, sort of like Gailey.

[gebobs]

Gailey can't really control the turnover aspect.
Sure he can. He can start by limiting Fitz to 20 passes per game.


My point is he has coached this team up to become a potent offensive unit when we literally had nothing before he came.
Let's be clear. Most of those stats you quoted came against two doormats and during garbage time in Game 1.

[BLeonard]

The problem with this question is: Who are we getting to replace Chan?

If we're going to get someone who is significantly better, then yes, I have no issues firing him yesterday. But, if we're gonna get a coach just because he comes cheap, or because Ralph recognizes his name on a list, what does firing Chan really accomplish?

Look at it this way: I'd about bet at least 95% of Bills fans were thrilled when Dick Jauron got fired. But, I'd also bet that most people were saying to themselves "ANYONE is better than Jauron."

Well, Jauron was 24-33. That's a .421 winning percentage. Gailey is currently 12-24 for a .333 winning percentage. So, did we reallly upgrade our coaching situation when we hired Gailey? I have to say we haven't... So, do we really want to get rid of Gailey under the "ANYONE is better than Gailey" philosophy...?

-Bill

[Pinkerton Security]

We are 2-2...if we were 0-4 then this thread might be reasonable.

[Mr. Pink]

Absolutely not, the reason why we have been as bad as we have is because there is no continuity. You can not build a franchise when you blow the thing up every 3 years. I honestly feel like we are on the right track this time but its going to take time. I know that Sunday was horrible but let's see how the rest of the season goes. We are a defensive leader away from being able to contend.

You don't just have continuity for the sake of continuity. By your logic we gave up on Gregg and Dick too quickly.

Chan Gailey and his staff are an outright disaster and the results on the field show it.

[Pinkerton Security]

You don't just have continuity for the sake of continuity. By your logic we gave up on Gregg and Dick too quickly.

Chan Gailey and his staff are an outright disaster and the results on the field show it.

The staff got out-coached by the Jets, period.

We beat up on KC and Cle.

the staff had a fine gameplan and for more than half the NE game, it worked...when the players turn the ball over 6 times, its gonna be extremely hard for ANY team to beat the Pats.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

I have calmed down from Sunday, and although I still think they gave up I still feel that unless we go on the seven game slide (including last week's soul crusher) I fear that we should let him play until the end of the season. If we can get to 4-4 with this schedule I say give him until the end of the season as the schedule gets easier. A winning record would attract quality free agents. That being said, Dave Wandstache has to go.

[Philagape]

Absolutely not, the reason why we have been as bad as we have is because there is no continuity. You can not build a franchise when you blow the thing up every 3 years. I honestly feel like we are on the right track this time but its going to take time. I know that Sunday was horrible but let's see how the rest of the season goes. We are a defensive leader away from being able to contend.

Nor can you build a franchise by fielding a team that deserves to be blown up every 3 years.
Three years in the standard. In today's NFL, if it takes longer than that, something's wrong. That's three years a team is ripping off fans who are paying the same ticket prices during the rebuilding stage as they do during the good years.
Like I said, he gets the rest of the season, but if it's anything like the first four games, then there's been no progress at all. Beating up weaklings and getting embarrassed by the elite. Same perpetual mediocrity.
All this goes for Buddy Nix, too.

[Mahdi]

Sure he can. He can start by limiting Fitz to 20 passes per game.


Let's be clear. Most of those stats you quoted came against two doormats and during garbage time in Game 1.

Which is not realistic when you go up against defenses that are stout against the run and not as good against the pass. Pats and Niners are two teams that are very big up front so you have no choice but to throw.

[zone]

You don't just have continuity for the sake of continuity. By your logic we gave up on Gregg and Dick too quickly.

Chan Gailey and his staff are an outright disaster and the results on the field show it.

Gregg possibly Dick not a chance. This staff is far from "an outright disaster".

[IlluminatusUIUC]

The main reason we've been bad is we've had a bad roster. Amos Alonzo Lombardi Walsh couldn't have won with our group. We've upgraded the talent to mediocre, sort of like Gailey.

I think your point and zone's are intertwined more than you think. We've switched defenses from Phillips' 3-4 to Williams' 46 to Mularkey's 4-3 to Jauron's Cover 2 to Edwards' 3-4 hybrid and now Wannestadt's 4-3. Throughout that, we've been constantly smashing square pegs into round holes and making our players learn new positions.

Carrington: 4-3 end in college. We have him bulk up to play 3-4 end and then play him, inexplicably at 3-4 OLB.
Moats: 4-3 end in college. We had him play 3-4 OLB, now he plays 4-3 OLB.
Scott: Safety in college and in the pros, now he's a 4-3 OLB
Troup: 4-3 DT in college, bulked up to play 3-4 Nose Tackle, now he's back to 4-3 DT.

On and on like this.

I also disagree that no coach could have won with our players. San Francisco and New Orleans show how big a head coach is. San Francisco went from perennial doormat to the NFC title game with a coaching change. New Orleans went from a 13-3 division winner to a doormat because of the coach suspensions.

[zone]

Sure he can. He can start by limiting Fitz to 20 passes per game.


Let's be clear. Most of those stats you quoted came against two doormats and during garbage time in Game 1.

KC defense is hardly a doormat.

[zone]

Nor can you build a franchise by fielding a team that deserves to be blown up every 3 years.
Three years in the standard. In today's NFL, if it takes longer than that, something's wrong. That's three years a team is ripping off fans who are paying the same ticket prices during the rebuilding stage as they do during the good years.
Like I said, he gets the rest of the season, but if it's anything like the first four games, then there's been no progress at all. Beating up weaklings and getting embarrassed by the elite. Same perpetual mediocrity.
All this goes for Buddy Nix, too.

This team has never actually been blown up every 3 years though. The staff changed but the garbage core of players stayed the same. This time we are building a team the proper way through the trenches and upgrading the skill positions slowly but surely. The Jets are not elite and we got embarrassed for one quarter against NE but I get your point. The season is not over yet but if history repeats we could be in for a long one.

[justasportsfan]

Bills Offense:

6th Total Yards
11th points per game
4th rushing

Fitz -- Leading league in TDs on pace for 48 TDs.

Chan needs his defensive coordinator to match his production thats all. We don't need to tear this thing apart and rebuild again. If a new owner comes in though, gotta wonder if that is exactly what he does though. New owner wants new GM, new GM wants new HC, new HC wants his own coordinators and QB.


It's all about the wins.

[zone]

It's all about the wins.

And we are 2-2 just like the "elite" teams; Pats, Giants, Packers, Cowboys, Broncos, Steelers

[jdaltroy5]

Wanny has no business in the NFL with the kind of talent to results ratio he's putting out.
I said this exact same thing over at the range about 6 months ago. I was e-shunned.

Sure, he had very high ranked defenses but let's look at the facts shall we?

He was the Dallas Cowboys DC from 1989-1992

Below are the rankings for YPG and PPG

1988 - 20th, 25th
1989 - 20th, 24th
1990 - 10th, 15th
1991 - 17th, 17th
1992 - 1st, 5th
1993 - 10th, 2nd
1994 - 1st, 3rd

I showed the year before he was there and the two years after to show where they were and where he took them. They were mostly mediocre until his last year in 1992 when they started playing really well. They played really well for years after Wanny was gone too. They were regularly ranked in the top ten in either yards or points allowed (or both) just about every year until the late 90's. I think the best thing that ever happened was trading Herschel Walker. They loaded up on talent after that.

In the 1991 draft alone, they took 2 first round DTs, a second round LB, and a third round LB. In 1992, they took 3 DBs in the first 3 rounds (including Darren Woodson).

He was mostly mediocre in Dallas and he cashed in on his one good year and took the head coaching gig at Chicago before the 1993 season until he was fired at the end of the 1998 season.

Now let's take a look at what he did there.

1992 - 17th, 22nd
1993 - 4th, 3rd
1994 - 13th, 10th
1995 - 19th, 22nd
1996 - 12th, 12th
1997 - 12th, 29th
1998 - 14th, 23rd
1999 - 29th, 20th

Had one really good year after he took over and then some slightly above average, mixed in with some mediocre years after that. Not that bad, but not that impressive.

Now onto the most important part -his Miami years. This is where he gets all the praise for having those great defenses.

He took over as DC in 1999 before he was promoted to HC in 2000 where he stayed until he quit midway through a 1-8 season.

1998 - 3rd, 1st
1999 - 5th, 19th
2000 - 6th, 3rd
2001 - 5th, 11th
2002 - 3rd, 4th
2003 - 10th, 3rd
2004 - 8th, 20th
2005 - 18th, 15th

The team he took over already had a great defense. Why? Because Jimmy Johnson ACTUALLY was a good defensive coach and could spot talent. Yes, the same Jimmy Johnson that was HC of Dallas when Wanny was there and stockpiled that team with great players on both sides of the ball.

You always hear about how great of a DC he was with Miami, and if you only look at the stats, you'd be right. However, what most people don't realize is that they already HAD Tim Bowens, Jason Taylor, Zach Thomas, Sam Madison, and Brock Marion on the team. That's 5 multiple Pro Bowl and All-Pro players out of 11 already at his disposal. Not to mention out of the guys who WEREN'T pro bowlers, he also had 3 first rounders, a second rounder, and a third rounder playing.

That team was already stacked before he got there and when he left, he left the coffers bare.

I was on board with him just based on his stats, but then I talked to Miami and Pitt fans and they laughed.

They said he had played a vanilla defense, with no blitzes or wrinkles and just let his guys go out and play. That works when you have a stacked defense. That doesn't work when you're the Buffalo Bills.

[Historian]

No!

He gets another two full seasons after this one.

By then, a real coach might be bored with working in a tv studio.

[Ed]

Let's see how the season plays out, but I'm reluctant to say he should be fired just because I don't have any faith that we would replace him with anyone better. The thing I like about Chan is he really seems to get a lot out of the talent he has on offense. I mean most of our WR's are 7th round/undrafted guys. Scott Chandler had like one catch for his career before coming here. Guys like Urbik and Pears were pulled off the scrap heap and turned into pretty good starters. Fred Jackson turned into a stud and while Fitz has his faults and takes a lot of heat around here I think he's become a lot better QB than anyone could have really expected.

Unfortunately our 2010 draft and free agents really stunted the teams ability to make more progress than it has and it's hard to put that on Gailey.

[BertSquirtgum]

He should have been fired at the end of last season.

[Historian]

Perhaps the players can self-coach...

[kingJofNYC]

It's too early to be throwing out statistical rankings. 4 game sample size, plus the garbage time stats this offense puts up skews things. Bottom line, the offense may be slightly better, but we're the worst defensive unit in football 3 years running. After spending a dozen selections or so on defensive players and changing coordinators we've seen no change. Team is still soft.

Gailey may be a good OC but the HC experiment is drawing to a close with each coming week. Doesn't mean he's going to get fired though.

[Mr. Pink]

The staff got out-coached by the Jets, period.

We beat up on KC and Cle.

the staff had a fine gameplan and for more than half the NE game, it worked...when the players turn the ball over 6 times, its gonna be extremely hard for ANY team to beat the Pats.

I'm basing my opinion off of his entire body of work he's been here. Defensively we're a joke and have been since he arrived. George Edwards Dave Wannacrap, who cares, what's the difference? He runs a college based offense at the NFL level that hasn't exactly been great the entire time he was here, we have games here and there were we look good and the games where we look pathetic there or stretches of games. Hell, Losman had a few good games too, Edwards as well, they were garbage as well.


Gregg possibly Dick not a chance. This staff is far from "an outright disaster".

Really the only thing that matters in the NFL is W/L. Gailey has been a severe downgrade on that department from Dick Jauron even. Spin it anyway you like but Chan and his staff turned us from a middle of the pack team into a bottom feeder who can't even compete in the division let alone the rest of the NFL. It is what it is. It's time for him to pack his bags and go back to where he belongs the college ranks. The rest of his pathetic staff can go back on the unemployment line.

[Historian]

At least we used to beat the fish under Dick.

That being said, Wilson should give Chan a ten-year contract extension, then trade Wood and Levitre to the Lions for a fifth and a sixth in 2014!

[starrymessenger]

Gailey can't really control the turnover aspect. My point is he has coached this team up to become a potent offensive unit when we literally had nothing before he came.
Imagine how good his O would be if he had a decent starting QB. I would not fire him. I would demote him to OC.

[BuffaloWingEater]

it seems chan's offense is very good, but the fitz can't make the throws. so no.

[jdaltroy5]

Imagine how good his O would be if he had a decent starting QB. I would not fire him. I would demote him to OC.
I would absolutely agree, but I don't think that would go over well.

When was the last time a full time head coach took a demotion to a coordinator position on the same team?

I can't remember it ever happening.

[starrymessenger]

I would absolutely agree, but I don't think that would go over well.

When was the last time a full time head coach took a demotion to a coordinator position on the same team?

I can't remember it ever happening.
Agree it's not happening. He should have been offered OC in the beginning with Perry sticking as DC or HC (though the latter was also not in the cards for whatever reason).

[IlluminatusUIUC]

I would absolutely agree, but I don't think that would go over well.

When was the last time a full time head coach took a demotion to a coordinator position on the same team?

I can't remember it ever happening.

It would have to be a nominal thing, the same way Dave Wannestadt was the "Assistant" DC or whatever he was behind the utterly lame duck George Edwards.

[Night Train]

If he wins 7 or less, he fires himself.

[Historian]

I would absolutely agree, but I don't think that would go over well.

When was the last time a full time head coach took a demotion to a coordinator position on the same team?

I can't remember it ever happening.

Gunther Cunningham

[BertSquirtgum]

http://www.dallascowboygirl.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/chan-gailey-cowboys.jpg

[BertSquirtgum]

Russ needs to beg Bill Cowher into coming back and after he decides to coach the Bills, he can ask his old friend if he will except a demotion to be his offensive coordinator. Then, the chin can clean house on the defensive side.

[BillsFever21]

If he bombs out the rest of the season then there isn't any reason to keep him around any longer. That is three years to show improvement with the team and that wouldn't be the case even with an upgraded roster.

All you have to do is look at the Saints as an example to see what a difference a good coach makes. They went from 10-13 win team every year along with winning a SB to being 0-4 this season after Sean Payton was suspended. If he was still there does anyone believe that would be the case?

[Extremebillsfan247]

The question is should the Bills fire Gailey, my answer is no, or at least not yet. They should let the season play out first, then make a decision on how to move forward. This is the proper course of action in my opinion.

[TigerJ]

That's a decision I'm not thinking about until a lot closer to the end of the year. It's possible I will reach that conclusion at some point before the end of January, but not yet. It's also possible I'll conclude he deserves to be retained for another year.

[TedMock]

We'll see how he responds to Wanny's lack of creativity. I know what he said in public, but if all of a sudden there are blitzes being called, etc, then we know he dealt with it in private.

Offensively, he's actually making good calls. Fitz's inability to execute is a huge problem, obviously. If Gailey struggles anywhere it's more in the motivational realm than in the playcalling.