View Full Version : JJ Whatt, JPP, Orakpo, Smith, Quinn, Irvin, etc...
We definatly have had the chance to draft Top DE/OLB
JJ Whatt 9,
Clay Mathews: 8
R. Quinn: 6
B. Irvin: 5
C. Jones: 5
A. Smith: 4.5
Others: JPP, Orakpo, Ware, etc...
Some of these players came out in the same year, obviously the Bills could have only drafted one of them at a time however this goes to show that we have had multiple opportunities to draft the right D-Line players and improve the pass rush via draft.
mikemac2001
10-14-2012, 10:06 PM
team game
BillsOwnAll
10-14-2012, 10:29 PM
easy to pick 3 years later....
easy to pick 3 years later....
What is that suppose to mean?
Joe Fo Sho
10-14-2012, 10:42 PM
Also, we could've had Brandon Graham, Derrick Morgan, Larry English, Derrick Harvey, oh and AARON MAYBIN. These threads are pointless, as the argument goes both ways.
Bangarang
10-14-2012, 10:55 PM
We also let Tom Brady slip away.
Skooby
10-14-2012, 11:20 PM
Hindsight is 20/20.
All I am saying is that the opportunity is there and that what *really* separates us from the best teams is our *FO/Coach/GM* the vary people most of you defend as being expert professionals until 3 years later when its so obvious it hurts....
... go look at my post when Dick was hired: clearly thought it was move in the wrong direction and most of you defended the move
... same goes for Chan. I also predicted that we would be a worst team under Chan than DJ.... so far I am correct...
... same goes for many of their bone headed draft picks, Heck there are people on this board that would have a better draft than the Bills
*All of this being said, if we have the right FO/HC/GM in here this team can improve quite quickly...
Hindsight is 20/20.
Do you know what 20/20 vision means? It means that the subject sees same line of letters at 20ft as the normal person sees at 20ft.
20/20 is vary average and you are right, we have been no better than average. The bills are that 6-9 win team. Average indeed. If we want to win, the Bills need to be better than average, better than 20/20.
Luisito23
10-14-2012, 11:34 PM
We get it, you're always right, and can predict the future...If I was the owner I would hire you as the GM on Monday (and fire you on Tuesday)
We get it, you're always right, and can predict the future...If I was the owner I would hire you as the GM on Monday (and fire you on Tuesday)
I dont get it at all... This is not a bashing or an I told you so thread, or anything of the sort.
Its just that I find it interesting that so many good DE/OLB have come out in the past 2-3 years and that there is opportunity to draft them. I think that the NFL is obviously 60/40 passing league which is having a trickle down effect to DE/OLB sack numbers, pressures, etc... If you look INTS are up this year.
Also, I am saying that there is good talent for the Bills to chose from and an opportunity to really improve which starts at the top.
* Lastly, I feel that no matter what I say, unless its fanatical optimism, it is bound to get criticized no matter how obvious it is.
I am sure you have heard of the 80/20 rule (top 20% have effect 80%: in sales, life, etc... and in some areas its 95/5 or even 99/1 rule). Unless your in the top 5-20% there is little difference between the bottom 80%-95%. The differences lie in the depth of perception not on expertise. So an average fan with a great depth of talent perception can identify talent much better than an average scout in the same way that a great novice trader can pick stocks better than the experts! (BTW Wall St is very much into track records and if your a stock genius that lacks the Harvard MBA you can still get a job making 7 figures.)
What the Bills need is that person who is in the top 5-20%. When that person comes, its becomes pretty apparent. The team will all of the sudden draft one superstar after another and become a contender. It will have that feeling like the 1998 Colts, or the 2001 Pats, etc...
Until then they will remain average to good at best.
BADTHINGSMAN
10-15-2012, 12:22 AM
We also let Tom Brady slip away.
So did 31 other teams, and multiple times. I do wonder if he would be the same Brady if he had gone to the Browns, Bengals or even the Bills.
So did 31 other teams, and multiple times. I do wonder if he would be the same Brady if he had gone to the Browns, Bengals or even the Bills.
There are two ways to answer it:
1) Yes he would have been great regardless of outside circumstances: this supports idea of how great Pats were for drafting him
2) No he is a byproduct of system/coaching: this supports idea of how great Pats are at developing players
The truth lies somewhere in the middle. In any case, both Brady and the Pats had a lot to do with his personal success and the team success.
* Regarding Brady on draft day, he was originally projected as a 3rd round pick but fell. Had he played his entire senior college season at Michigan he could have gone much higher than his 3rd round grade...
better days
10-15-2012, 01:21 AM
There are two ways to answer it:
1) Yes he would have been great regardless of outside circumstances: this supports idea of how great Pats were for drafting him
2) No he is a byproduct of system/coaching: this supports idea of how great Pats are at developing players
The truth lies somewhere in the middle. In any case, both Brady and the Pats had a lot to do with his personal success and the team success.
* Regarding Brady on draft day, he was originally projected as a 3rd round pick but fell. Had he played his entire senior college season at Michigan he could have gone much higher than his 3rd round grade...
Or it could be 3) Right player, right system, right time. If Bledsoe did not get injured, Brady might have never seen the field for the Pats* until Bledsoe won them a Super Bowl, then he would have likely been traded like Cassell.
Brady and Bledsoe are worlds apart.... But I see what you are saying... how do you know if Dan Marino was a good QB and not a byproduct of the right system, time, player etc... what about jerry rice, and all the other great players? How do you know if anyone is good?
kishoph
10-15-2012, 03:28 AM
Brady and Bledsoe are worlds apart.... But I see what you are saying... how do you know if Dan Marino was a good QB and not a byproduct of the right system, time, player etc... what about jerry rice, and all the other great players? How do you know if anyone is good?
Did you see Marino play ? I'm not try to be stupid and I know what you're trying to get at, but using Marino is probably one of the worst examples you could of chose. Marino's success was because of his talent, if anything, the system he played in deprived him of being a Super Bowl winning QB, that and the Buffalo Bills being so awesome at the time.
Did you see Marino play ? I'm not try to be stupid and I know what you're trying to get at, but using Marino is probably one of the worst examples you could of chose. Marino's success was because of his talent, if anything, the system he played in deprived him of being a Super Bowl winning QB, that and the Buffalo Bills being so awesome at the time.
I used Marino on purpose...
But how can you separate the system from the player? You make this argument vs Brady but Brady is a HOF one of the best QBs of all time and someone who accomplished feats that Marino could not. He is a Winner! So if you can argue that Brady is byproduct of system then why not Marino? Why Not Montana or Rice or Sanders or any other great player?
What Proof DO You Have that these players were by products of a system?
SquishDaFish
10-15-2012, 06:35 PM
Wow pat yourself on the back much.
Hey guys look at me :wave:
Jesus man what a pointless thread
coastal
10-15-2012, 06:35 PM
It's smarter to spend a $100 million on a guy who can pad his stats against ****ty fourth round rookie OTs.
SquishDaFish
10-15-2012, 06:40 PM
It's smarter to spend a $100 million on a guy who can pad his stats against ****ty fourth round rookie OTs.
Get over yourself man ****! We get you dont like the signing now STFU about it. Its not your money. If we didnt spend the money and had a ton of cap space ****ing people would complain. **** when we spend the money some people still arent ****ing happy. We HAD to OPERPAY to get a real DE! And Yes he will prove he is a damn good DE. Give the ****ing guy at least a half of season. Hes on a NEW team NEW system going back to his real original position with NEW TEAMMATES that have to GEL together.
Go play NFL and change teams and see how well you would do your armchair ****ing QB
kingJofNYC
10-15-2012, 07:01 PM
I wonder if Robert Quinn would've made your list last season? Definitely not. IF the junior pass rushers declare early, this class will be one of the best when it comes to pass rushers. Love Werner and Carradine.
Lets discuss the future and not the past, that just opens old wounds.
coastal
10-15-2012, 07:13 PM
Get over yourself man ****! We get you dont like the signing now STFU about it. Its not your money. If we didnt spend the money and had a ton of cap space ****ing people would complain. **** when we spend the money some people still arent ****ing happy. We HAD to OPERPAY to get a real DE! And Yes he will prove he is a damn good DE. Give the ****ing guy at least a half of season. Hes on a NEW team NEW system going back to his real original position with NEW TEAMMATES that have to GEL together.
Go play NFL and change teams and see how well you would do your armchair ****ing QB
15936
SquishDaFish
10-15-2012, 07:40 PM
15936
You have a multitude of problems. I think your problems even have issues
BillsOwnAll
10-15-2012, 08:16 PM
this threads gone downhill lol
Wow pat yourself on the back much.
Hey guys look at me :wave:
Jesus man what a pointless thread
Dude, every thread is pointless. This is entertainment.... I hope you get that by now. No matter who you think you are, your not solving any problems or producing something of value by being on here. Most likely, your waisting your time and in the process complaining about something you have no control over like the guy in a cubical yelling at his PC.
Welcome to first world problems.... my AC blows to cold, my BMW only gets 18mpg, my 4500sqft house isnt big enough, the Bills have not made the playoffs in 12 years....
its all the same BS...
1st world problems
I wonder if Robert Quinn would've made your list last season? Definitely not. IF the junior pass rushers declare early, this class will be one of the best when it comes to pass rushers. Love Werner and Carradine.
Lets discuss the future and not the past, that just opens old wounds.
What NFL players would u compare the, to?
SquishDaFish
10-16-2012, 03:04 AM
Dude, every thread is pointless. This is entertainment.... I hope you get that by now. No matter who you think you are, your not solving any problems or producing something of value by being on here. Most likely, your waisting your time and in the process complaining about something you have no control over like the guy in a cubical yelling at his PC.
Welcome to first world problems.... my AC blows to cold, my BMW only gets 18mpg, my 4500sqft house isnt big enough, the Bills have not made the playoffs in 12 years....
its all the same BS...
1st world problems
:roflmao:
kingJofNYC
10-16-2012, 01:03 PM
What NFL players would u compare the, to?
Werner's going to go really high, I'm not sure I like making comparisons to NFL players. He has a great first step, gets off the ball quick, good hand usage and power, can change direction well, never stops.
Carradine doesn't have a great first step but is long and really uses his hands well, very physical and violent is the way I would describe him, really gets after it.
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