Time to blow this team up

[YardRat]

13 years in a row no playoffs.
Chan's third year, and little sign of progress. His only redeeming quality supposedly is his ability to build an offense, but it's obvious once opponents get film built up it's easy to defend. Not to mention that his play-calling is frustrating as hell.
Wannstadt blows. We've never had a DC, and won't...Gailey's biggest failure in his tenure in Buffalo is his handling of the coordinator positions.
Nix can stay for the draft, but retire gracefully in favor of Whaley immediately after.
For the love of the football gods, Chris White and Ruvell Martin should never see another game in a Bills uniform.
We need a QB...badly.

I'm more of a realist than a homer, but I really do hold out hope as long as humanly possible, but that time has passed once again.

I want to win, and I want to win now.

[HAMMER]

No need to blow it up, you can't keep starting over. It is time to find a QB though.

[Novacane]

A real coach could turn this around quickly if he got a QB. They have some talent. Just not at the most important pos.

[lightningbolt444]

I dont think we need to blow this team up. We have some very talented players on the roster however they are not put into a position to succeed. Talent cant overcome a lack of gameplan and stupid play calls in the NFL. I think we need to fire chan and dave and get some people in spots that are awful on this fb team. LB,CB,QB and another WR at least

[YardRat]

A QB isn't going to fix the ineptitude of the coaching staff, which is just as big (if not bigger) of a problem.

[BertSquirtgum]

Today was the last day that I cared about this team this season. If anyone on this coaching staff is here next year I will take next season off. Probably watch them on television but won't have any feelings as to what happens.

[kingJofNYC]

Chan should be fired, no question about it. IF they bring him back I won't even follow the team next season.

[Lone Stranger]

If the Bills don't do anything positive in the off-season then there will be a big drop in season ticket sales next year. And I will participate in the drop.

[YardRat]

TJax needs to start getting reps immediately, and playing time.

[cookie G]

If you want a QB....draft one. That simple.

But you can't do that when you're building a sub par defense, or if you can't get past page 2 of the annual Defensive Back swimsuit edition.

It has been 3 drafts.

"show me the baby"

[Mr. Pink]

If the Jags somehow beat us next week, Gailey should be fired Monday morning.

He should have been fired after the Pats game but that's besides the point.

[ServoBillieves]

There is a LOT of talent on this team. There are great finds, stars, solid depth, et cetera, but when they are constantly put in a position to lose from the guys with the head-sets, they look like a disaster.

Now we'll win out, going to 8-7 with a chance at the playoffs and lose to the Jets.

One can only hope it doesn't go that well. Chan needs to go or needs to be dropped to OC. He knows his ****, but he needs someone above him to say "no" when any boneheaded "Drr let's pass on 1st down" bull**** spews from Gailey's mouth.

[YardRat]

Gailey needs to go, period.

[SpikedLemonade]

This team under this regime is going no where.

On a separate note, what is Ralph's health these days?

[Fixxxer]

We need a QB that the team can believe they can win with. I bet the team loves Fitz the guy, but they have zero trust in Fitz the QB.

[DraftBoy]

Been saying it needs to be blown up. Talent for the most part is overrated by the fan base.

[Mr. Pink]

Been saying it needs to be blown up. Talent for the most part is overrated by the fan base.

This team has needed to be blown up since 06.

Unfortunately, for us as fans, it still hasn't been.

[Typ0]

It depends on who the coach is really. We need a QB. Chan would be a winning coach with a QB he certainly would have won today most likely with a blowout IMO. Yeah he puts Fitz on the field but maybe he's the best option. That's pretty sad.

[kingJofNYC]

Been saying it needs to be blown up. Talent for the most part is overrated by the fan base.
Totally agree, we have two players from the 10/11 draft, Spiller/Dareus.

[X-Era]

Personally, I have no interest in a full rebuild. But I do want a legit QB to be found in the off-season. Plus a new DC, ILB, and OLB.

[kingJofNYC]

Need QB, WR, RT, OLB, ILB, SS. Can use depth at DT/DE as well, and TE who can run block and catch.

There's nothing here to really blow up, we need to fill the immense crater that is the Buffalo Bills.

[YardRat]

We have talent, it's just being misused by the coaching staff. A couple of upgrades that others have mentioned, plus fresh blood on the sideline will do wonders for this team.

[SpikedLemonade]

Personally, I have no interest in a full rebuild. But I do want a legit QB to be found in the off-season. Plus a new DC, ILB, and OLB.

Well, you are NOT asking for much.

****! The way you put it, we are almost a contender.

[X-Era]

Well, you are NOT asking for much.

****! The way you put it, we are almost a contender.
Personally I think a legit QB alone would have won us one more game at least. Add in a solid starter at ILB and another at OLB and I can see another game at least.

I think we'd be at 6 or 7 wins right now.

Finding a legit QB is not easy but I do think finding a solid starter potential ILB and even OLB in one offseason is do-able.

The scheme has to be fixed to cover the flat and seems.

[SpikedLemonade]

Personally I think a legit QB alone would have won us one more game at least. Add in a solid starter at ILB and another at OLB and I can see another game at least.

I think we'd be at 6 or 7 wins right now.

Sure.

[DraftBoy]

Personally, I have no interest in a full rebuild. But I do want a legit QB to be found in the off-season. Plus a new DC, ILB, and OLB.

You keep trying these quick fixes, you can keep expecting to get the same results.

[Mr. Pink]

We need in no order of importance besides the top 3...

HC, QB, DC, SS, CB - 3 of them, LB - 3 of them, at least one OT, TE, WR - 2 of them, K - because apparently Lindell can't kick 50 yarders nor kick off.

If that's not a team that needs a full tear down and rebuild I don't know what is.

Who do you say are must keeps on this team right now?

Spiller, Levitre, Wood, Mario, Kyle, Byrd and Sanborn. Am I missing anyone? By my calculations that's 3 of 11 on each side of the ball and a long snapper.

[X-Era]

You keep trying these quick fixes, you can keep expecting to get the same results.I'm just looking at the Pats, Tenn, and even this game as wins with a better QB, solid ILB and OLB.

[kingJofNYC]

Our OL played like trash today, last week as well, but fans overlook that because Spiller can make people miss and Fitz is just so terrible you overlook how bad Hairston and Urbik have been.

[X-Era]

Our OL played like trash today, last week as well, but fans overlook that because Spiller can make people miss and Fitz is just so terrible you overlook how bad Hairston and Urbik have been.Hairston did have a questionable game and the OL was weak today. Personally, I've been pleased with the unit overall. I think we have a decent line overall. I would upgrade Urbik though.

[djjimkelly]

Personally, I have no interest in a full rebuild. But I do want a legit QB to be found in the off-season. Plus a new DC, ILB, and OLB.

add in one more wr i do like donald jones and i dont mind david nelson but we need a real number 2 WR also

[X-Era]

add in one more wr i do like donald jones and i dont mind david nelson but we need a real number 2 WR also
Agreed. I want a bigger guy with speed. But I don't want it wasted with Fitz who can't throw accurately down field. Hunter, Allen, and Woods are guys I like.

[DraftBoy]

I'm just looking at the Pats, Tenn, and even this game as wins with a better QB, solid ILB and OLB.

You've now gone from 1 position of need to 3.

[X-Era]

You've now gone from 1 position of need to 3.
No. I've been consistent in what I think the needs are. QB, ILB, OLB are needs. WR, SS, OG are lesser needs IMO.

QB is a huge task to fill. No idea how we will do that. I'm coming around to the thought of the top QB dropping to our pick and us going that route.

[k-oneputt]

My is Justin Rogers still on the field ? That guy sucks too.

[YardRat]

We need in no order of importance besides the top 3...

HC, QB, DC, SS, CB - 3 of them, LB - 3 of them, at least one OT, TE, WR - 2 of them, K - because apparently Lindell can't kick 50 yarders nor kick off.

If that's not a team that needs a full tear down and rebuild I don't know what is.

Who do you say are must keeps on this team right now?

Spiller, Levitre, Wood, Mario, Kyle, Byrd and Sanborn. Am I missing anyone? By my calculations that's 3 of 11 on each side of the ball and a long snapper.

Those two (and McKelvin, at least) will probably bolt for greener pastures, and at this point I can't blame them.

[DraftBoy]

No. I've been consistent in what I think the needs are. QB, ILB, OLB are needs. WR, SS, OG are lesser needs IMO.

QB is a huge task to fill. No idea how we will do that. I'm coming around to the thought of the top QB dropping to our pick and us going that route.

And what about the issues with a general lack of depth, the issues with our other starting CB, the developing issue at RT and that doesn't begin to talk about the potential changes that will be needed with a new scheme being brought in by a new coaching staff.

[Mr. Pink]

Those two (and McKelvin, at least) will probably bolt for greener pastures, and at this point I can't blame them.

McKelvin can go. Returners are a dime a dozen in this league and McKelvin is garbage as a CB.

The 7 guys I listed are the only guys who I think we MUST keep around for the next 3-5 years or so and build around. Stevie is iffy but he's really a possession type receiver who works underneath...those guys aren't that hard to really replace but there's no need to let him go anywhere because he's the only real WR this team has. Donald Jones or David Nelson are fine too but lower on the depth chart at the position.

Everyone else on this team, IMO, are interchangeable parts where we can go get a middle tier FA who can do the same thing and then there are positions we need OBVIOUS upgrades. And that's not just at QB.

We could likely survive Levitre going elsewhere to be honest but losing Byrd would be a travesty. Seeing good interior lineman are easier to find than ball hawking playmakers at FS. However, with a team full of holes, creating even more isn't a model for winning football.

[YardRat]

And what about the issues with a general lack of depth, the issues with our other starting CB, the developing issue at RT and that doesn't begin to talk about the potential changes that will be needed with a new scheme being brought in by a new coaching staff.

That's why you interview candidates, and hire somebody that will tweak the intricacies without screwing the basics.

[DraftBoy]

That's why you interview candidates, and hire somebody that will tweak the intricacies without screwing the basics.

Because those basics are working so well for us now?

[X-Era]

And what about the issues with a general lack of depth, the issues with our other starting CB, the developing issue at RT and that doesn't begin to talk about the potential changes that will be needed with a new scheme being brought in by a new coaching staff.I wasn't proposing a new staff. A new DC, yes. But, I think Gailey should find a guy who will still run a 4-3 so we don't need to change out all those players to fit the new scheme.

Lack of depth is always an issue, I agree. I want that to come from the draft and free agency as always. I'm not as worried about RT personally, Hairston has played well often enough for me although his recent streak of questionable play is worrying. As far as the other starting CB spot, it's got to be solidified I agree. Could it be through resigning McLovin? Could it still be Aaron Williams? Could it be a free agent? Maybe. I personally would rather see our 1st rounder spent elsewhere but I could see an argument for CB.

[coastal]

To rub salt... Whither just returned an INT for a TD.

[DraftBoy]

I wasn't proposing a new staff. A new DC, yes. But, I think Gailey should find a guy who will still run a 4-3 so we don't need to change out all those players to fit the new scheme.

Lack of depth is always an issue, I agree. I want that to come from the draft and free agency as always. I'm not as worried about RT personally, Hairston has played well often enough for me although his recent streak of questionable play is worrying. As far as the other starting CB spot, it's got to be solidified I agree. Could it be through resigning McLovin? Could it still be Aaron Williams? Could it be a free agent? Maybe. I personally would rather see our 1st rounder spent elsewhere but I could see an argument for CB.

Again we are sticking with this because its been working so well for us?

And even a new DC is still going to want his guys to come in.

[Mr. Pink]

To rub salt... Whither just returned an INT for a TD.

On a tipped ball which was an absolutely horrible throw by Brees.

Put George Wilson there and he'd do the same thing.

[coastal]

On a tipped ball which was an absolutely horrible throw by Brees.

Put George Wilson there and he'd do the same thing.
Them why doesn't he...

[kingJofNYC]

You want to keep Gailey around x-era?

Does the talent even matter with him at the helm? Guy is awful, no amount of talent can cover up his sshortfalls. He had Calvin Johnson and Demaryius Thomas but started Nesbitt, nuff said.

[Mr. Pink]

Them why doesn't he...

Whitner career 8 INTs and 2 TDs now

Wilson career 12 INTs and 1 TD.

Guess he does.

[YardRat]

Because those basics are working so well for us now?

Piss-poor coaching will do that.

[Mr. Pink]

Again we are sticking with this because its been working so well for us?

And even a new DC is still going to want his guys to come in.

Maybe we can lure Dick Jauron back to just DC when Cleveland cleans house in a couple months.

Then we won't need a bunch of new guys LMAO

[coastal]

Whitner career 8 INTs and 2 TDs now

Wilson career 12 INTs and 1 TD.

Guess he does.u missed the point entirely **** for brains.

[Mr. Pink]

u missed the point entirely **** for brains.

You had no point.

Whitner was a first round bust/bum.

[DraftBoy]

Piss-poor coaching will do that.

So will piss-poor execution, do you think we're executing the fundamentals well right now?

That's not say the coaching isn't bad, because its absolutely pathetic.

[kingJofNYC]

Whitner was also responsible for giving up the two tds the saints notched.

[Mr. Pink]

Whitner was also responsible for giving up the two tds the saints notched.

And on this last play where Whitner was jogging half speed to lend help to the corner on a deep ball to Lance Moore.

But ya know that dude is great!

[JoeMama]

Fire Chan Gailey, cut Ryan Fitzpatrick, draft a franchise QB, and keep the rest of the team together.

In Buddy Nix's first year, he said there wasn't a huge gap between your best team and your worst team in terms of talent.

And I believe he's right, to an extent.

I don't know if Matt Barkley or Gino Smith fit the bill, but it's obvious that Ryan Fitzpatrick is not a starting NFL quarterback. He's pathetic.

I seriously think Rob Johnson was better.

[YardRat]

So will piss-poor execution, do you think we're executing the fundamentals well right now?

That's not say the coaching isn't bad, because its absolutely pathetic.

No, and that once again comes down to coaching.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

its called hire john gruden and give up the farm for matt barkley...

[YardRat]

Fire Chan Gailey, cut Ryan Fitzpatrick, draft a franchise QB, and keep the rest of the team together.

In Buddy Nix's first year, he said there wasn't a huge gap between your best team and your worst team in terms of talent.

And I believe he's right, to an extent.


Bingo :clap:

[Mr. Pink]

Fire Chan Gailey, cut Ryan Fitzpatrick, draft a franchise QB, and keep the rest of the team together.

In Buddy Nix's first year, he said there wasn't a huge gap between your best team and your worst team in terms of talent.

And I believe he's right, to an extent.

I don't know if Matt Barkley or Gino Smith fit the bill, but it's obvious that Ryan Fitzpatrick is not a starting NFL quarterback. He's pathetic.

I seriously think Rob Johnson was better.

We are miles away from teams like the Texans, Patriots, Bears, Saints and Niners.

Yes, on any given Sunday you could win, true. However we'd lose to any of those teams 95 times out of 100 the way we all stand right now.

There's a huge talent gap between us and them as well as just as huge of a coaching gap.

[DraftBoy]

No, and that once again comes down to coaching.

So failure of players to do what they've been taught to do their entire lives like blocking, tackling, and covering is also on the coaches? We are talking about breakdowns at the most fundamental levels.

[ICRockets]

There is a scenario where we end up with the perfect offseason. Say we hire Chip Kelly as head coach, Rex Ryan as DC, draft Manti Te'o in the first round, and draft someone like Landry Jones or Tyler Wilson in the 2nd round, we're ready to make a run in 2014 with a GREAT team.

[JoeMama]

We are miles away from teams like the Texans, Patriots, Bears, Saints and Niners.

Yes, on any given Sunday you could win, true. However we'd lose to any of those teams 95 times out of 100 the way we all stand right now.

There's a huge talent gap between us and them as well as just as huge of a coaching gap.

I completely disagree.

I bet if Wade Phillips was our DC, our defense would be a hell of a lot better.

There IS talent on this team.

We should be better.

[Mr. Pink]

I completely disagree.

I bet if Wade Phillips was our DC, our defense would be a hell of a lot better.

There IS talent on this team.

We should be better.

With better coaching, we would be better...but what is that better exactly?

Defensively, we've actually played fairly well the past 2 weeks. Offensively we've crapped the bed.

Overall though regardless of coach we have no LBs, uninspired DL play and a weak secondary outside of Byrd. So are we talking 30th defense to 25th with a better coach and scheme?

I do think with better offensive coaching and play calling, regardless of the fact that our QB is complete garbage, we're a 6-5 football team instead of 4-7. And with the way our schedule has played out and how the AFC has shaken out this year besides the top, we'd have an outside shot at being the 6th seed to get blown out by the 3rd seed in all likelihood.

I guess basically what I'm saying is instead of being a bottom dweller team we'd be somewhere in the middle of the pack which is still a talent gap between us and the teams I aforementioned.

[kingJofNYC]

Chip Kelly can have any job he wants, Buffalo is probably dead last on his list. Couldn't even get Shanahan, think about that.

[Mr. Pink]

Chip Kelly can have any job he wants, Buffalo is probably dead last on his list. Couldn't even get Shanahan, think about that.

I want Trestman! I know we had some interest in him last go round and it didn't work out but I can still dream.

[JoeMama]

With better coaching, we would be better...but what is that better exactly?

Defensively, we've actually played fairly well the past 2 weeks. Offensively we've crapped the bed.

Overall though regardless of coach we have no LBs, uninspired DL play and a weak secondary outside of Byrd. So are we talking 30th defense to 25th with a better coach and scheme?

I do think with better offensive coaching and play calling, regardless of the fact that our QB is complete garbage, we're a 6-5 football team instead of 4-7. And with the way our schedule has played out and how the AFC has shaken out this year besides the top, we'd have an outside shot at being the 6th seed to get blown out by the 3rd seed in all likelihood.

I guess basically what I'm saying is instead of being a bottom dweller team we'd be somewhere in the middle of the pack which is still a talent gap between us and the teams I aforementioned.

Look what Mike Smith did in Atlanta, John Harbaugh did in Baltimore, Jim Harbaugh did in San Francisco, etc etc. IN THEIR FIRST YEARS.

Sometimes all it takes is a little coaching and you can transform a team with "no talent" into a winner.

Chan Gailey is historically bad. I would say easily worse than Dick Jauron.

Keep in mind, this is year three of Gailey's tenure. It's supposed to be his winning year. Instead we're as bad as when we started.

All because of one awful coach.

[Mr. Pink]

Look what Mike Smith did in Atlanta, John Harbaugh did in Baltimore, Jim Harbaugh did in San Francisco, etc etc.

Sometimes all it takes is a little coaching and you can transform a team with "no talent" into a winner.

Chan Gailey is historically bad. I would say easily worse than Dick Jauron.

I think Atlanta and San Fran are more talented than us and were more talented than us before they got their two new coaches. Matt Ryan and Patrick Willis respectively.

I do agree on your last statement. I actually think we're a 6-5 team right now if Jauron was still the HC based on how he handled the offense with Losman here, he'd do the same thing now with Fitz and hide him as much as possible and ride our strong rushing attack.

Which shouldn't be that hard to figure out for any legitimate HC. Since it's glaringly obvious the strength of this offense/team is the rushing attack.

[casdhf]

We need heart and leadership. No one looks like they give a **** out there.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

The situation is irreparable at this point. Send the team to LA and let them fix this mess.

[BertSquirtgum]

Personally, I have no interest in a full rebuild. But I do want a legit QB to be found in the off-season. Plus a new DC, ILB, and OLB.

You forgot new head coach.

[BuffaloWingEater]

I completely disagree.

I bet if Wade Phillips was our DC, our defense would be a hell of a lot better.

There IS talent on this team.

We should be better.

how about perry fewell

[BertSquirtgum]

The situation is irreparable at this point. Send the team to LA and let them fix this mess.

Run into a highway.

[OpIv37]

No need to blow it up, you can't keep starting over. It is time to find a QB though.

No one wants to start over, but we have to. Here's the problem: when you build everything wrong from the beginning, it will always be wrong. You could give this FO and coaching staff 50 years and they will never win. They are simply incompetent.

And yes, we definitely need a QB. But unfortunately, this team's problems go far beyond QB. We've been loading up on D in the draft and spent $100 million on the best defensive FA available, but the D still sucks. We gave up ST touchdowns in consecutive weeks.

This team is a disaster on an almost incomprehensible level. A better QB would definitely help, but even with a real QB, the team won't win with the D and ST sucking.

[BertSquirtgum]

Quit whining. You are a pussy.

XOXO,

BBK

I will still be at every remaining game this year while you are home typing up short stories.

[Night Train]

David Shaw of Stanford looks like he's done even a better job at Stanford than Harbaugh. His D looks good. O playcalling is excellent. Resembles an NFL team. Tough and physical. Smart. Being black may help the players respond to him. Luck loved the guy.
Father was a long time NFL asst. coach. He's had a couple stnts as an asst. in the NFL, so he knows what is expected. If Nix retires and Whaley takes over, I could see the attraction and it's justified. Far better option than the gadget driven unknown in Chip Kelly. Call Shaw and let him bring his staff.

[Historian]

If we follow Houston's model, we should be in the playoffs by 2018!

[TacklingDummy]

It starts and ends with the Quarterback, period

[DraftBoy]

David Shaw of Stanford looks like he's done even a better job at Stanford than Harbaugh. His D looks good. O playcalling is excellent. Resembles an NFL team. Tough and physical. Smart. Being black may help the players respond to him. Luck loved the guy.
Father was a long time NFL asst. coach. He's had a couple stnts as an asst. in the NFL, so he knows what is expected. If Nix retires and Whaley takes over, I could see the attraction and it's justified. Far better option than the gadget driven unknown in Chip Kelly. Call Shaw and let him bring his staff.

He may never leave Stanford. That's his dream job.

[El Guapo]

If the Bills don't do anything positive in the off-season then there will be a big drop in season ticket sales next year. And I will participate in the drop.Me too. Tired of this broken record.

[Mahdi]

Blown up? Why? So we can get rid of the talent we have and start over again? That makes no sense.

We have a good OL and a DL that is coming to together. We have a #1 WR, a TE and 2 top RBs. We have a #1CB, and a solid FS.

Serious help needed --> LB corps (at least 2 new LBs), SS (we need a SS with more instinct and range), slot CB (we don't have anyone that can cover a slot receiver), #2WR (we need a big WR opposite Stevie), QB (we need a QB with a better arm)

Basically, the things we have been asking for for the last 10 years we finally have, we've been preaching that the team need to be built from the Lines out.

Now we actually have done that and ppl want to blow it up? How about we put more talent behind those lines and continue building instead?

[djjimkelly]

we need a qb period of course we need a few other pieces but this team is ready to compete with a proper qb i have no doubt about that

[Mahdi]

we need a qb period of course we need a few other pieces but this team is ready to compete with a proper qb i have no doubt about that

Yeah I think a better QB would hide a lot of our weaknesses. No team has PBers at every position or even good players at every position, but a QB and a MLB/QB/Big hitter on defense would make us very competitive.

[k-oneputt]

Just once this season I would like to see Spiller with 25 carries and see what happens. Let's run the offensive gameplan around him instead of Fitz.

[Historian]

In all seriousness, I think the O line is performing well.

I think the D line has the talent, but has underachieved for several reasons, the least of which is coaching.

I believe if your lines are intact, you aren't too far off. By that I mean, and entire franchise blow up is not in order here. (again)

The Bills problem, is that the most glaring need is at QB, and the difference makers don't just grow on trees.

[OpIv37]

It starts and ends with the Quarterback, period

The quarterback didn't give up a S/T touchdown. The quarterback didn't punt inside the 35. The quarterback didn't allow 50% conversion rate on 3rd downs, including a 3rd and 11 and 3rd and 17. The quarterback didn't allow a 6 minute drive. The quarterback didn't limit CJ Spiller to 15 touches.

No doubt the QB sucks and needs to be replaced, but the problems with this team go far beyond QB.

[SpikedLemonade]

No doubt the QB sucks and needs to be replaced, but the problems with this team go far beyond QB.

Far far far beyond.

[better days]

Our OL played like trash today, last week as well, but fans overlook that because Spiller can make people miss and Fitz is just so terrible you overlook how bad Hairston and Urbik have been.

You want to see a terrible OL, watch Chicago. Yet with Cutler, the Bears have a chance to go to the Super Bowl even with a terrible OL. A GOOD QB will fix much of the Bills problems IMO.

[mjt328]

Our biggest issue is QB.
But this coach clearly isn't the answer either, so it's time to replace both.

I'll admit, there are times I've thought Chan was doing a good job on the offensive side of the ball.
He clearly does an excellent job at designing plays, disguising run vs. pass and generally keeping the defense off balance.
I think he also does a good job at protecting the quarterback, and getting the most out of marginal offensive players.

However, his gameday playcalling is terrible.
Instead of relying on his best players (Spiller), he's always looking to exploit matchups. It doesn't matter how well our run game is going, or how poorly Fitz is throwing.
A defense doesn't need to stop our running game. All they need to do is stack the box, and Chan will throw 40 times a game. Even if Spiller is averaging 10 yards a carry.

Chan also deserves blame for the failed Fitz experiment.
After his first season on the job, he should have DEMANDED that Buddy draft a prospect for him to develop. Instead, he puffed up his chest and concluded that he could win with Fitzpatrick.
Meanwhile, the Bills passed on Andy Dalton and Colin Kaepernick in 2011, and Russell Wilson in 2012.
(Don't be surprised if Ryan Mallett and/or Brock Osweiler develop into decent starters when they get a chance as well).

Not to mention that Chan has ZERO control over the defense - and picked a complete moron to run the other side of the ball.

[gebobs]

The quarterback didn't give up a S/T touchdown. The quarterback didn't punt inside the 35. The quarterback didn't allow 50% conversion rate on 3rd downs, including a 3rd and 11 and 3rd and 17. The quarterback didn't allow a 6 minute drive. The quarterback didn't limit CJ Spiller to 15 touches.
Would you like me to mention all the dumbass things Fitz did do yesterday and over the course of the last full season? Look at Andrew Luck and tell me the Bills wouldn't be vying for the division lead if we had him instead of Tred redux?

[TigerJ]

I have mixed feelings on Gailey. He does some good things, and I'm not certain that his offenses are that easy for opposing DCs to figure out if you have the QB who can operate the offense effectively. After all Spiller is having a top 3 all time season as far as yards per carry is concerned this season. Still, if Wilson cans him after the season, I could certainly understand it. I think the talent level has been increasing under the Nix regime, and I don't know that we've reached the ceiling. If we find a decent QB and upgrade the linebackingmaybe that will be enough to win us more games. I know we're all tired of waiting, but I'm also wary blowing up the team every three years. Teams that have a history of that never seem to get better. Oakland is another case in point.

[gebobs]

I have mixed feelings on Gailey.He does some good things, and I'm not certain that his offenses are that easy for opposing DCs to figure out if you have the QB who can operate the offense effectively. After all Spiller is having a top 3 all time season as far as yards per carry is concerned this season.
That's all I need to see to know Gailey is a bum. Spiller is doing as you say. And still has only had one game...ONE GAME...with 20+ touches. And that barely: 25 v. Miami.


I know we're all tired of waiting, but I'm also wary blowing up the team every three years. Teams that have a history of that never seem to get better. Oakland is another case in point.Gawd...isn't it pathetic? Even comparing us to the hapless Raiders and the Bills still pale in comparison. The Raiders have made the playoffs 3 times since the last Bills team in '99. And they even have had two 0.500 teams in the past two seasons, something the Bills haven't matched in the previous seven seasons and aren't likely to this year either.

[Jeff1220]

Our biggest issue is QB.
But this coach clearly isn't the answer either, so it's time to replace both.

I'll admit, there are times I've thought Chan was doing a good job on the offensive side of the ball.
He clearly does an excellent job at designing plays, disguising run vs. pass and generally keeping the defense off balance.
I think he also does a good job at protecting the quarterback, and getting the most out of marginal offensive players.

However, his gameday playcalling is terrible.
Instead of relying on his best players (Spiller), he's always looking to exploit matchups. It doesn't matter how well our run game is going, or how poorly Fitz is throwing.
A defense doesn't need to stop our running game. All they need to do is stack the box, and Chan will throw 40 times a game. Even if Spiller is averaging 10 yards a carry.

Chan also deserves blame for the failed Fitz experiment.
After his first season on the job, he should have DEMANDED that Buddy draft a prospect for him to develop. Instead, he puffed up his chest and concluded that he could win with Fitzpatrick.
Meanwhile, the Bills passed on Andy Dalton and Colin Kaepernick in 2011, and Russell Wilson in 2012.
(Don't be surprised if Ryan Mallett and/or Brock Osweiler develop into decent starters when they get a chance as well).

Not to mention that Chan has ZERO control over the defense - and picked a complete moron to run the other side of the ball.

This. Pretty much my thoughts exactly. QB and Coaching are the biggest needs. Chan designs good plays, but sucks at play calling. HC should have some input on D so that when the unit is playing historically bad, he can talk to his DC w/authority.

[DraftBoy]

If you replace this coaching staff you better be ready for some big roster moves. A new coach is going to want to instill his guys with his system.

[X-Era]

If you replace this coaching staff you better be ready for some big roster moves. A new coach is going to want to instill his guys with his system.
Yes. And it can take years to get the right players for the schemes. That's another reason I'd rather stick with Chan. I do want Wanny gone though. But I'd like to keep the 4-3.

[DraftBoy]

Yes. And it can take years to get the right players for the schemes. That's another reason I'd rather stick with Chan. I do want Wanny gone though. But I'd like to keep the 4-3.

Why?

[BertSquirtgum]

If you replace this coaching staff you better be ready for some big roster moves. A new coach is going to want to instill his guys with his system.

I have no problem with that.

[Mr. Pink]

If you replace this coaching staff you better be ready for some big roster moves. A new coach is going to want to instill his guys with his system.

This team requires big roster moves. And a lot of moves will be lateral moves replacing a marginal guy with another marginal guy.

It's not like the new guy would get rid of say Spiller for someone like Peyton Hillis.

Stars are stars regardless of coach and guys you build the franchise around.

[X-Era]

Why?
Why what? We both watched this team spend several picks and several years trying to get the players for a 3-4. Remember the discussion about finding the guys with the right size, skills, speed, etc... to properly run the 3-4? And they never really did. Now, we have the players to run a 4-3 on the DL and in the secondary. We need a ILB and OLB. Hell, I think a productive, solid, ILB alone would make a big impact. The scheme has to be changed to cover the seems and the flat. I agree that we ought to be looking for an ILB/OLB that can cover the quicker TE's in this league. If we find the scheme and players to stop the Pats offense, we will have built a team that can beat many teams. Focus on what it will take to stop the Pats offense. Welker and Gronk in the flats and seems. I don't think that has to be a major shift in defensive scheme with all new players.

And that's just on defense.

On offense, we adequate talent on the OL, RB, WR, and TE. Can we always add to the mix and push starters? Yes and we always should look to do that. But, our offense has been successful and IMO is successful enough to win games. We need a QB who can continue to run our spread but who has better accuracy and can throw a more accurate long ball. I also would like to add more intangibles as well. A guy like Geno Smith seems more and more appealing. I don't want to throw away something that's successful enough to win games. A new offensive playbook alone could take a year to learn and master.

Were close enough that status quo as far as HC and schemes (4-3) should stay. It's a shorter road to success to stick with much of what we have. Get the few pieces you need (QB, ILB, OLB) add to the depth with vets and young guys who will hopefully push to start and finish the current model.

Just my two cents guys. I understand many totally disagree and want to start over and I respect that opinion. I just disagree.

[The Jokeman]

I have no problem with that.

So you want to have to rebuild the D for a third time in 5 years? Toss in find a new offense. Say what you want but Gailey has done the most to bring out the most of the players he does have on O.

[The Jokeman]

Why what? We both watched this team spend several picks and several years trying to get the players for a 3-4. Remember the discussion about finding the guys with the right size, skills, speed, etc... to properly run the 3-4? And they never really did. Now, we have the players to run a 4-3 on the DL and in the secondary. We need a ILB and OLB. Hell, I think a productive, solid, ILB alone would make a big impact. The scheme has to be changed to cover the seems and the flat. I agree that we ought to be looking for an ILB/OLB that can cover the quicker TE's in this league. If we find the scheme and players to stop the Pats offense, we will have built a team that can beat many teams. Focus on what it will take to stop the Pats offense. Welker and Gronk in the flats and seems. I don't think that has to be a major shift in defensive scheme with all new players.

And that's just on defense.

On offense, we adequate talent on the OL, RB, WR, and TE. Can we always add to the mix and push starters? Yes and we always should look to do that. But, our offense has been successful and IMO is successful enough to win games. We need a QB who can continue to run our spread but who has better accuracy and can throw a more accurate long ball. I also would like to add more intangibles as well. A guy like Geno Smith seems more and more appealing. I don't want to throw away something that's successful enough to win games. A new offensive playbook alone could take a year to learn and master.

Were close enough that status quo as far as HC and schemes (4-3) should stay. It's a shorter road to success to stick with much of what we have. Get the few pieces you need (QB, ILB, OLB) add to the depth with vets and young guys who will hopefully push to start and finish the current model.

Just my two cents guys. I understand many totally disagree and want to start over and I respect that opinion. I just disagree.

On offense I would argue we have talent at RB, interior offensive line and at one WR spot. Everyone else is a question mark or debatable starter. I was calling him last offseason but one guy who might be available this offseason is Jermichael Finley. I would love for us to land him as he would immediately give us a weapon in the passing game outside of Stevie. Yes he's had bouts of inconsistency but really think would give us someone that could be a legitimate threat outside of Stevie. As to me Scott Chandler is nothing more then a depth TE/Red Zone specialist.

[Mr. Pink]

So you want to have to rebuild the D for a third time in 5 years? Toss in find a new offense. Say what you want but Gailey has done the most to bring out the most of the players he does have on O.

The D outside of the line which is underachieving and Byrd is garbage. Complete and total garbage. In case ya forgot we give up 30 points a game, it's not working nor is it good enough.

And Gailey, offensively, doesn't even use his best player and playmaker anywhere near enough so I question his abilities there.

[X-Era]

So you want to have to rebuild the D for a third time in 5 years? Toss in find a new offense. Say what you want but Gailey has done the most to bring out the most of the players he does have on O.Cast off Scott Chandler, undrafted David Nelson, 7th rounder Stevie... all have found success under Gailey. The OL is another area. Hell even a sub-par QB like Fitz has had success. Spiller boasts over 6 yards a carry due in part to the offensive scheme that utilizes his talent. Gailey isn't perfect and is too loyal and hard headed over keeping his current starters... Freddie should have been benched by game 6, Fitz should have been canned, replaced, or challenged with a legit possible starter in the past off-season after such a poor second half of last season. But, the scheme itself is decent and in many cases he gets more out of his guys than most could.

[BertSquirtgum]

The D outside of the line which is underachieving and Byrd is garbage. Complete and total garbage. In case ya forgot we give up 30 points a game, it's not working nor is it good enough.

And Gailey, offensively, doesn't even use his best player and playmaker anywhere near enough so I question his abilities there.

Byrd is garbage. Are you serious?

[The Jokeman]

The D outside of the line which is underachieving and Byrd is garbage. Complete and total garbage. In case ya forgot we give up 30 points a game, it's not working nor is it good enough.

And Gailey, offensively, doesn't even use his best player and playmaker anywhere near enough so I question his abilities there.

I think Mario's wrist and adjusting to Wanny's scheme lead to a lot of our earlier struggles. That said I don't debate we need help at two LB spots (see Barnett and Shepperd) and not a big fan of George Wilson and any CB not named Gilmore this year. Yet I think if we could find a QB who can sustain drives or get us TDs inside the redzone the D won't be so pressured to always perform. I know I'm a Gailey opologist but to me the talent he has is subpar when look at our QB, TE, WRs outside of Stevie, no real FB etc. and still manages to keep us in most games outside of the season opener and the NE and 49ers blowouts. I just hate the idea that a new guy means things are going to get better if anything I could see them going worse.

[BertSquirtgum]

So you want to have to rebuild the D for a third time in 5 years? Toss in find a new offense. Say what you want but Gailey has done the most to bring out the most of the players he does have on O.

Whatever the new coach not named Gailey wants to do, I am fine with.

[Mr. Pink]

Byrd is garbage. Are you serious?

Reading comprehension. The defense outside of the line and Byrd is garbage.

[The Jokeman]

Byrd is garbage. Are you serious?

I think he was trying to say everyone, outside of Byrd and the D-line, is garbage.

[BertSquirtgum]

Reading comprehension. The defense outside of the line and Byrd is garbage.

Commas are useful.

[The Jokeman]

Whatever the new coach not named Gailey wants to do, I am fine with.

So you'd be okay if we hired Josh McDaniels and traded our top pick to the Jets for Tim Tebow?

[ICRockets]

Cast off Scott Chandler, undrafted David Nelson, 7th rounder Stevie... all have found success under Gailey. The OL is another area. Hell even a sub-par QB like Fitz has had success. Spiller boasts over 6 yards a carry due in part to the offensive scheme that utilizes his talent. Gailey isn't perfect and is too loyal and hard headed over keeping his current starters... Freddie should have been benched by game 6, Fitz should have been canned, replaced, or challenged with a legit possible starter in the past off-season after such a poor second half of last season. But, the scheme itself is decent and in many cases he gets more out of his guys than most could.

So, Tom Brady has Bill Belichick to thank for literally all of his success? Joe Montana is only in the Hall of Fame because of Bill Walsh? Late round draft picks performing well is a testament to the PLAYER, not the coach. The TEAM performing well is a testament to the coach. Our team is not performing well.

[better days]

So, Tom Brady has Bill Belichick to thank for literally all of his success? Joe Montana is only in the Hall of Fame because of Bill Walsh? Late round draft picks performing well is a testament to the PLAYER, not the coach. The TEAM performing well is a testament to the coach. Our team is not performing well.

Both Brady & Montana benefited being drafted by those teams. If Montana for example was drafted by the Raiders, he would have looked & played terrible in that system which featured long downfield passing.

[Mahdi]

On offense I would argue we have talent at RB, interior offensive line and at one WR spot. Everyone else is a question mark or debatable starter. I was calling him last offseason but one guy who might be available this offseason is Jermichael Finley. I would love for us to land him as he would immediately give us a weapon in the passing game outside of Stevie. Yes he's had bouts of inconsistency but really think would give us someone that could be a legitimate threat outside of Stevie. As to me Scott Chandler is nothing more then a depth TE/Red Zone specialist.

Interior OL? How about Cordy Glenn? Probably on of the top young OTs in NFL right now. Hairston is also developing into a solid starter. I don't consider some struggles against one of the best pass rushing tandems in the NFL a regression or sign of inadequacy.

[DraftBoy]

Why what? We both watched this team spend several picks and several years trying to get the players for a 3-4. Remember the discussion about finding the guys with the right size, skills, speed, etc... to properly run the 3-4? And they never really did. Now, we have the players to run a 4-3 on the DL and in the secondary. We need a ILB and OLB. Hell, I think a productive, solid, ILB alone would make a big impact. The scheme has to be changed to cover the seems and the flat. I agree that we ought to be looking for an ILB/OLB that can cover the quicker TE's in this league. If we find the scheme and players to stop the Pats offense, we will have built a team that can beat many teams. Focus on what it will take to stop the Pats offense. Welker and Gronk in the flats and seems. I don't think that has to be a major shift in defensive scheme with all new players.

And that's just on defense.

On offense, we adequate talent on the OL, RB, WR, and TE. Can we always add to the mix and push starters? Yes and we always should look to do that. But, our offense has been successful and IMO is successful enough to win games. We need a QB who can continue to run our spread but who has better accuracy and can throw a more accurate long ball. I also would like to add more intangibles as well. A guy like Geno Smith seems more and more appealing. I don't want to throw away something that's successful enough to win games. A new offensive playbook alone could take a year to learn and master.

Were close enough that status quo as far as HC and schemes (4-3) should stay. It's a shorter road to success to stick with much of what we have. Get the few pieces you need (QB, ILB, OLB) add to the depth with vets and young guys who will hopefully push to start and finish the current model.

Just my two cents guys. I understand many totally disagree and want to start over and I respect that opinion. I just disagree.

No we watch this team be stupid and pick players who were ill suited for the 34 (Troup) or pick players that seemed like logical fit at one position get moved to another for no reason (Moats to ILB, Batten to OLB). This team never really understood how to evaluate talent for the defense they were running so in the end they quit trying and went back to the 43 despite having a team that was full of pieces that kind of fit the 34 but kind of fit the 43. Perfect example is the DT situation. You have a phenomenal 43 DT in Kyle Williams, and you have an out of place DT in Marcel Dareus.

We needed LB's in the 34 and not surprisingly we still need LB's in the 43. We needed CB help in the 34 and not suprisingly we still need CB help in the 43. Same with SAF. The only thing that you could argue has improved with our scheme change is our pass rush and even that's marginal. Little to nothing has changed, in fact if you ask me watching we've gotten worse since our ill timed scheme change, not better nor even close to better. This defense is average at best and barely watchable at worst.

The offense is best termed with your own words "adequately talented" not average, not good, not great, but just adequate by NFL standards. Its honestly sad that we have sunken to this low with our own standards as a fan base.

You dump this entire staff and administration, and you move forward with a new direction (43 or 34) on defense and offense. Dump the cute screen game crap and commit to running the frigging football. Get some talent in here beyond just the first team and some skill positions. Actually work to build a roster instead of just working based on who can throw a blind dart at our draft board. From top to bottom this org has failed for years now, its time to once again scrub it clean and start over. There is not much worth salvaging at this point especially if this team is serious about sticking around and getting a new stadium.

[X-Era]

So, Tom Brady has Bill Belichick to thank for literally all of his success? Joe Montana is only in the Hall of Fame because of Bill Walsh? Late round draft picks performing well is a testament to the PLAYER, not the coach. The TEAM performing well is a testament to the coach. Our team is not performing well.If you can't see that the most out of players is in part due to the head coach I guess we'll just have to disagree.

[X-Era]

No we watch this team be stupid and pick players who were ill suited for the 34 (Troup) or pick players that seemed like logical fit at one position get moved to another for no reason (Moats to ILB, Batten to OLB). This team never really understood how to evaluate talent for the defense they were running so in the end they quit trying and went back to the 43 despite having a team that was full of pieces that kind of fit the 34 but kind of fit the 43. Perfect example is the DT situation. You have a phenomenal 43 DT in Kyle Williams, and you have an out of place DT in Marcel Dareus.

We needed LB's in the 34 and not surprisingly we still need LB's in the 43. We needed CB help in the 34 and not suprisingly we still need CB help in the 43. Same with SAF. The only thing that you could argue has improved with our scheme change is our pass rush and even that's marginal. Little to nothing has changed, in fact if you ask me watching we've gotten worse since our ill timed scheme change, not better nor even close to better. This defense is average at best and barely watchable at worst.

The offense is best termed with your own words "adequately talented" not average, not good, not great, but just adequate by NFL standards. Its honestly sad that we have sunken to this low with our own standards as a fan base.

You dump this entire staff and administration, and you move forward with a new direction (43 or 34) on defense and offense. Dump the cute screen game crap and commit to running the frigging football. Get some talent in here beyond just the first team and some skill positions. Actually work to build a roster instead of just working based on who can throw a blind dart at our draft board. From top to bottom this org has failed for years now, its time to once again scrub it clean and start over. There is not much worth salvaging at this point especially if this team is serious about sticking around and getting a new stadium.Even if our roster doesn't fit for either the 4-3 or the 3-4, it still will set us back to scrap the entire staff. The scheme changes alone may take a year or more to master. That's a year I'd rather not waste. And I only see a few significant changes to ILB and OLB as being necessary to have adequate talent on the defense to be a playoff caliber defense. And on O I only see QB as preventing us from having a playoff caliber defense.

Now, I do agree with adding better depth and you and I have agreed on that for years. But, I don't think our current roster is as far away as you do talent wise overall.

[DraftBoy]

Even if our roster doesn't fit for either the 4-3 or the 3-4, it still will set us back to scrap the entire staff. The scheme changes alone may take a year or more to master. That's a year I'd rather not waste. And I only see a few significant changes to ILB and OLB as being necessary to have adequate talent on the defense to be a playoff caliber defense. And on O I only see QB as preventing us from having a playoff caliber defense.

Now, I do agree with adding better depth and you and I have agreed on that for years. But, I don't think our current roster is as far away as you do talent wise overall.

Can't really set a team back that has yet to take many (if any) steps forward.

[X-Era]

Can't really set a team back that has yet to take many (if any) steps forward.
No steps forward? Really?

From 1999 to 2010 the Bills put up more than 20 points on the Patriots once... 9/14/2009. Yet since Gailey has been here they have done it 5 out of 6 times.

http://www.footballdb.com/teamvsteam.html?tm=19&opp=4

Beating the Pats on a consistent basis is the name of the game in the AFC East and because the Pats are so good, if we can beat them we basically are a playoff team.

The defense is the issue. In that same time span, the defense allowed over 20 points 14 out of 20 times. And since Gailey they have allowed over 20 points every time (all 6 contests).

The offense has made a big step forward under Gailey. Get rid of Gailey and we may go back to another decade of crappy offense as well. Yet, change the DC and a few solid pieces at LB and we may become a playoff caliber team.

In my opinion it's an easier route.

[Mr. Pink]

No steps forward? Really?

From 1999 to 2010 the Bills put up more than 20 points on the Patriots once... 9/14/2009. Yet since Gailey has been here they have done it 5 out of 6 times.

http://www.footballdb.com/teamvsteam.html?tm=19&opp=4

Beating the Pats on a consistent basis is the name of the game in the AFC East and because the Pats are so good, if we can beat them we basically are a playoff team.

The defense is the issue. In that same time span, the defense allowed over 20 points 14 out of 20 times. And since Gailey they have allowed over 20 points every time (all 6 contests).

The offense has made a big step forward under Gailey. Get rid of Gailey and we may go back to another decade of crappy offense as well. Yet, change the DC and a few solid pieces at LB and we may become a playoff caliber team.

In my opinion it's an easier route.

Yet we were 7-9 under Jauron back 5 years ago and now, where are we? Maybe we'll get back to 7-9 with this weak schedule and maybe we won't. Being able to score on the Patriots shouldn't be your own barometer on if we're progressing as a team. Couple that with the fact the Pats D is worse now than it was back 5+ years ago too. So even in your example are we progressing or are the Pats just regressing?

Either way, we still lose consistently to them.

[X-Era]

Yet we were 7-9 under Jauron back 5 years ago and now, where are we? Maybe we'll get back to 7-9 with this weak schedule and maybe we won't. Being able to score on the Patriots shouldn't be your own barometer on if we're progressing as a team. Couple that with the fact the Pats D is worse now than it was back 5+ years ago too. So even in your example are we progressing or are the Pats just regressing?

Either way, we still lose consistently to them.
Please re-read. I never said it's the only way to tell if were getting better. But it is a factor. This offense is better under Gailey IMO. The second you can him you may revert to a much less productive offense.

Change for the sake of change is not always better. It could go either way. It could end up being better or worse.

Let's remember that the same factors preventing us from landing a top tier HC still exist. And if the likes of Cowher, Gruden, etc... wouldn't come here before why will they now? Who is this sure fire Harbaugh type that's eager to come to Buffalo and in one year make us a playoff team? That guy doesn't exist. I think were looking at the same type of HC sprospects that we always have. Retreads, never has been coordinators, or lesser college HC's.

Losing Gailey puts us in the same market for the same sort of HC again. And the biggest argument for doing so seems to be that we just want Gailey fired. Not that we have a clear plan to land a guy with a clear vision or bonafide pedigree to upgrade the position. I know I will see the responses that bash Gailey saying anyone would be better. But, that's not rational thinking. Out of the type of HC candidates that we are likely to be able to hire, some may be better than Gailey but it won't be a sure thing or clear cut.

Gailey is the type of HC this team can hire, we really can't get the top tier guys. And so if you shop in the same market, why do you expect a drastically better outcome?

Again, just change the pieces that need changing. Fire Wanny and hire a DC that can design a legit playoff caliber 4-3 scheme. One capable of covering the flats and seems. Replace a few key cogs like ILB and OLB with productive solid or better starters. And go hard after a long term upgrade to Fitz. A guy who can throw an accurate long ball. A guy with better intangibles and playmaking at key times. A guy that has much better accuracy overall.

I honestly think the talent level is a lot closer than many are giving it credit for. I think we can be a playoff team quicker if we keep Gailey and make a few key changes.

[Mr. Pink]

Please re-read. I never said it's the only way to tell if were getting better. But it is a factor. This offense is better under Gailey IMO. The second you can him you may revert to a much less productive offense.

Change for the sake of change is not always better. It could go either way. It could end up being better or worse.

Let's remember that the same factors preventing us from landing a top tier HC still exist. And if the likes of Cowher, Gruden, etc... wouldn't come here before why will they now? Who is this sure fire Harbaugh type that's eager to come to Buffalo and in one year make us a playoff team? That guy doesn't exist. I think were looking at the same type of HC sprospects that we always have. Retreads, never has been coordinators, or lesser college HC's.

Losing Gailey puts us in the same market for the same sort of HC again. And the biggest argument for doing so seems to be that we just want Gailey fired. Not that we have a clear plan to land a guy with a clear vision or bonafide pedigree to upgrade the position. I know I will see the responses that bash Gailey saying anyone would be better. But, that's not rational thinking. Out of the type of HC candidates that we are likely to be able to hire, some may be better than Gailey but it won't be a sure thing or clear cut.

Gailey is the type of HC this team can hire, we really can't get the top tier guys. And so if you shop in the same market, why do you expect a drastically better outcome?

Again, just change the pieces that need changing. Fire Wanny and hire a DC that can design a legit playoff caliber 4-3 scheme. One capable of covering the flats and seems. Replace a few key cogs like ILB and OLB with productive solid or better starters. And go hard after a long term upgrade to Fitz. A guy who can throw an accurate long ball. A guy with better intangibles and playmaking at key times. A guy that has much better accuracy overall.

I honestly think the talent level is a lot closer than many are giving it credit for. I think we can be a playoff team quicker if we keep Gailey and make a few key changes.

So basically your opinion is Gailey is the best we can possibly ever aspire to acquire so instead of going a different route we should just stay the course. Awesome. Because that's working so well. We're progressing so much under this guy.

Gailey and this staff have ZERO chance at ever making the playoffs. ZERO chance of even ever competing for the playoffs.

This is year 3 in this pathetic process and we've had absolutely NO progression on either side of the ball. This is year 3 with the easiest schedule you could pretty much possibly hope for and we're still no closer to being a playoff team now than we were 10 years ago under Gregg Williams actually we were closer under Gregg. We've actually regressed this year from last year. We scored more PPG and allowed less PPG and had a better turnover ratio.

I'd rather have a defensive minded coach who would make sure we didn't have to hope our offense scored 30+ week in and week out to win football games.

And Mr Offensive Genius has our offense at 17th in scoring and 17th in yards.

For more context...we are scoring 1.1 PPG more now than we were in Jauron's last full season here, 2008. Yet we're giving up 8.6 PPG more. So where we really closer to a playoff team? Now or back in 08? We're a FULL TD worse per game now.

Even more context...we are scoring 6.9 PPG more now than we were in Gregg's last season here, 2003. Yet we're giving up 11.6 PPG more. Net difference of 4.7 PPG better in 2003 than today.

Both Dick and Gregg were run out of town for being failures, yet, we were clearly better during their tenures here than we are today. Yet some people still think Gailey is the answer? Baffling.

Record under Gregg - 17-31
Record under Jauron - 24-33
Record under Gailey - 14-29

[DraftBoy]

No steps forward? Really?

From 1999 to 2010 the Bills put up more than 20 points on the Patriots once... 9/14/2009. Yet since Gailey has been here they have done it 5 out of 6 times.

http://www.footballdb.com/teamvsteam.html?tm=19&opp=4

Beating the Pats on a consistent basis is the name of the game in the AFC East and because the Pats are so good, if we can beat them we basically are a playoff team.

The defense is the issue. In that same time span, the defense allowed over 20 points 14 out of 20 times. And since Gailey they have allowed over 20 points every time (all 6 contests).

The offense has made a big step forward under Gailey. Get rid of Gailey and we may go back to another decade of crappy offense as well. Yet, change the DC and a few solid pieces at LB and we may become a playoff caliber team.

In my opinion it's an easier route.
Im sorry but I will never agree to points based on points scored v a single team. You don't win a Super Bowl by scoring the most points.

[X-Era]

Im sorry but I will never agree to points based on points scored v a single team. You don't win a Super Bowl by scoring the most points.

Ummm...

Lol. I know what you meant.

My point is that beating the Pats consistently is a microcosm of being a playoff caliber team. If our team was good enough to split each year with them we will also be good enough to get to the playoffs and obviously would be in contentio for winning the division.

[gebobs]

Ummm...

Lol. I know what you meant.
Heh...I saw that too. I was going to post something snide, but your response is better.


My point is that beating the Pats consistently is a microcosm of being a playoff caliber team. If our team was good enough to split each year with them we will also be good enough to get to the playoffs and obviously would be in contention for winning the division.
Unfortunately, Chan is 1-5 against them. If it's progress, it ain't much progress. More than likely, it was just an anomaly, just like '03 was. Like '03, it was a perfect storm of our quarterback playing well and Brady having a rare off day against us (he's 20-2 v. Buffalo).

The Bills weren't likely to repeat that again this year and it's not likely to happen next year or any year as long as Brady is on the Pats and the Bills don't have anyone even remotely comparable.

[DraftBoy]

Ummm...

Lol. I know what you meant.

My point is that beating the Pats consistently is a microcosm of being a playoff caliber team. If our team was good enough to split each year with them we will also be good enough to get to the playoffs and obviously would be in contentio for winning the division.

But they aren't.

[justasportsfan]

My point is that beating the Pats consistently is a microcosm of being a playoff caliber team. If our team was good enough to split each year with them we will also be good enough to get to the playoffs and obviously would be in contentio for winning the division.

Splitting with the pats every year means nothing when you lose to teams you SHOULD beat like the titans and colts. A team like that may or may not make playoffs but I doubt it will ever be a SB team.

[Mr. Pink]

Ummm...

Lol. I know what you meant.

My point is that beating the Pats consistently is a microcosm of being a playoff caliber team. If our team was good enough to split each year with them we will also be good enough to get to the playoffs and obviously would be in contentio for winning the division.

Really, we split with them last year and what did that get us? 6-10.