Is Stevie Johnson going to blame God for that performance?

[bf1]

Besides 3 linebackers at least, we need a few quality wrs to be any good. Stevie is an average #2 at best.

[Don't Panic]

Stevie got screwed today... he definitely needs another threat opposite him, though. Not many receivers could be very dangerous with Martin and Dickerson as the other options.

[Mike13]

Stevie got screwed today... he definitely needs another threat opposite him, though. Not many receivers could be very dangerous with Martin and Dickerson as the other options.

By fumbling? By not securing the ball on a TD catch?

[Novacane]

Besides 3 linebackers at least, we need a few quality wrs to be any good. Stevie is an average #2 at best.



That's a ridicules statement.

[Mahdi]

wow what a reactionary thread this is... Stevie is a #1 being thrown to by a backup QB. He didnt have a good game today, big deal.

[TacklingDummy]

Besides 3 linebackers at least, we need a few quality wrs to be any good. Stevie is an average #2 at best.

The fumble and then the ball he didn't catch that hit him in the chest made me laugh out loud.

[Don't Panic]

By fumbling? By not securing the ball on a TD catch?

The incomplete in the end zone should have been a TD. He made a football move and then took two steps before slamming the ball on the paint.

[Vampire Baby]

The incomplete in the end zone should have been a TD. He made a football move and then took two steps before slamming the ball on the paint.

It breaks my heart that he didn't secure the football..... LOL

[JoeMama]

If God was truly merciful, he wouldn't allow Bills fans to procreate.

I often imagine how much more fulfilling my life would be if I wasn't conceived and reared by a family of Bills fans.

This organization is rock bottom in the NFL. A total dumpster fire if ever there was one.

[kishoph]

Besides 3 linebackers at least, we need a few quality wrs to be any good. Stevie is an average #2 at best.



Stevie is 65 yds. short of his 3rd 1,000 yd. season in a row, you call that an average #2 WR. I'm sure there's a lot of #2 WR's out there having 1,000 yd. seasons, let alone 3 in a row.

Is it because of the drops that you think Stevie is no better than an average #2 ? FYI going into yesterday's game, Calvin Johnson had 10 drops, that was double Stevie's 5, is Calvin Johnson an average #2 at best also ?

What makes me "laugh out loud" is the number of Trolls on this board that actually think that anyone, other than another Troll would agree with them.

[Jeff1220]

Stevie is a decent #1. Get a comparable WR on the other side and , more importantly, a QB with some accuracy, and this O could do some great things.

[Don't Panic]

Stevie is 65 yds. short of his 3rd 1,000 yd. season in a row, you call that an average #2 WR. I'm sure there's a lot of #2 WR's out there having 1,000 yd. seasons, let alone 3 in a row.

Is it because of the drops that you think Stevie is no better than an average #2 ? FYI going into yesterday's game, Calvin Johnson had 10 drops, that was double Stevie's 5, is Calvin Johnson an average #2 at best also ?

What makes me "laugh out loud" is the number of Trolls on this board that actually think that anyone, other than another Troll would agree with them.

They just need a target for their frustration... don't bother confusing them with facts. This is what 13 years of sub-mediocrity have done to this fan base - turned an already negative leaning crowd into a full-blown depression ward.

[OpIv37]

wow what a reactionary thread this is... Stevie is a #1 being thrown to by a backup QB. He didnt have a good game today, big deal.

yeah, because this is the first time Stevie's had a bad game, right? It's the first time that Stevie's made mental mistakes on the field, right? It's the first time that the guy's done something stupid and immature that has hurt his team, right?

Some of you are doing the same thing with Stevie that was done with Donte Whitner: he screws up week in and week out, but every week it's an "isolated incident" that's really someone else's fault. Please.

Enough of Stevie. I know, Fitz sucks and that has held Stevie back. But Fitz didn't drop two balls that hit him in the hands. Fitz didn't fumble after the catch. Fitz didn't take a penalty for throwing the ball down the field after the play. Yeah, he didn't have a good game today. Exactly how many good games has he had this year? By my count, it's about 3 out of 15.

[Mahdi]

yeah, because this is the first time Stevie's had a bad game, right? It's the first time that Stevie's made mental mistakes on the field, right? It's the first time that the guy's done something stupid and immature that has hurt his team, right?

Some of you are doing the same thing with Stevie that was done with Donte Whitner: he screws up week in and week out, but every week it's an "isolated incident" that's really someone else's fault. Please.

Enough of Stevie. I know, Fitz sucks and that has held Stevie back. But Fitz didn't drop two balls that hit him in the hands. Fitz didn't fumble after the catch. Fitz didn't take a penalty for throwing the ball down the field after the play. Yeah, he didn't have a good game today. Exactly how many good games has he had this year? By my count, it's about 3 out of 15.

However you are taking all this from within the context of one game. Stevie rarely fumbles, and if you check the drops for WRs you will probably find that Stevie is no more prone to drops than some of the top WRs in the NFL.

And as for the delay of game penalty, if I was a competitive person and playing for the Bills I would be getting penalties on every series. Stevie is highly competitive and is fed up with losing and is QB. I would love to see what Stevie would do with Tom Brady.

[OpIv37]

However you are taking all this from within the context of one game. Stevie rarely fumbles, and if you check the drops for WRs you will probably find that Stevie is no more prone to drops than some of the top WRs in the NFL.

And as for the delay of game penalty, if I was a competitive person and playing for the Bills I would be getting penalties on every series. Stevie is highly competitive and is fed up with losing and is QB. I would love to see what Stevie would do with Tom Brady.
Oh, I'm sure Stevie would do just fine on a winning team with Brady throwing him the ball- until the team was having an off day and they needed him to come through to win. Then he'd have two drops and a 15 yard personal foul.

[djjimkelly]

threads like this make me wish i could be bedside and mock some people how they bang. cursing stevie for one drop is like me cursing you for finishing in 2 minutes leaving your girl asking wheres the rest.

**** happens !!!!

our qb throws the ball behind people 90% of the time. get a qb then curse stevie

[OpIv37]

threads like this make me wish i could be bedside and mock some people how they bang. cursing stevie for one drop is like me cursing you for finishing in 2 minutes leaving your girl asking wheres the rest.

**** happens !!!!

our qb throws the ball behind people 90% of the time. get a qb then curse stevie

Ok, here's the problem: first our QB DIDN'T throw behind Stevie this time, and Stevie rewarded him with two drops and a fumble. And a stupid penalty. Stevie and his defenders can't sit there whining that Stevie doesn't get opportunities, then say "well it was just one time" when he actually is given an opportunity and screws it up.

Second, it's NOT just one time. Stevie frequently makes these kinds of mistakes. Remember the two potential game-winning TD drops? Remember the stupid celebration penalties that got him benched last season? And for that matter, outside of 3 games or so, where has Stevie been all year? Moulds and Evans had **** QB's too but they still managed to do better than Stevie.

The reality is that we are living in the age of the salary cap. That means that every player signed to a big contract comes at the opportunity cost of signing big-name FA's or retaining other talent on the team. If you give a player a big salary, he has to play up to that number. Otherwise, the team is going to struggle. Stevie is certainly not the only one on this team not playing up to his salary, but he is absolutely part of the problem.

I'm getting really tired of his act. He definitely has some talent, but it's not elite #1 talent and he doesn't have the mentality to be a true #1. This team will never win if he is the #1 WR.

[ParanoidAndroid]

The penalty was inexcusable, but drops happen to WR's. Stevie is a quality WR and an emotional player which is what we complained this team lacks. He's a go-to receiver, but he's not one of those guys who can overpower a DB like a Brandon Marshall, Dez Bryant or Calvin Johnson. Depending on your definition of a #1 receiver, you will label Stevie. It doesn't change the fact that he has the ability to make an offense better, especially given that he is the only receiver the Bills have worthy of an NFL start. This team sorely lacks weapons in the passing/receiving game, so if we do get a new QB, they had better give him someone else besides Stevie to throw to.

[OpIv37]

The penalty was inexcusable, but drops happen to WR's. Stevie is a quality WR and an emotional player which is what we complained this team lacks. He's a go-to receiver, but he's not one of those guys who can overpower a DB like a Brandon Marshall, Dez Bryant or Calvin Johnson. Depending on your definition of a #1 receiver, you will label Stevie. It doesn't change the fact that he has the ability to make an offense better, especially given that he is the only receiver the Bills have worthy of an NFL start. This team sorely lacks weapons in the passing/receiving game, so if we do get a new QB, they had better give him someone else besides Stevie to throw to.

How does he make the offense better exactly? Fitz screws him with bad throws- the one time Fitz is actually on and making good passes, he has two drops and a fumble. People complain and say that he doesn't get opportunities, then when he gets opportunities he screws them up, then people write it off as "drops happen." So, he's either not getting opportunities or dropping the ball. How do people not see that?

And when people complain that the team doesn't have emotion, we're talking about heart and the will to win. We're not talking about having hissy fits on the field that hurt the team. He could break down crying about how stressed out he is like a menstruating college chick after two vodka shots, and that would technically be showing emotion too, but you know damn well that's not what we're talking about either.

[Ginger Vitis]

How does he make the offense better exactly?

In regards to this season if he had missed a significant amount of time the offense would have been worse off. So the offense while still mediocre is better off when Stevie plays as opposed to if he doesnt

[CoolBreeze]

Besides 3 linebackers at least, we need a few quality wrs to be any good. Stevie is an average #2 at best.


I'm sure i'm not the only one here who feels Johnson deserves a little more respect than being called an average #2 receiver. The guy has had one bad, bad game and all of a sudden we just turn on him? Need I remind you over the last 3 years he has 3000+ receiving yards. Saying he may be a #2 in our future is one thing, but then saying he's not even a solid/good #2 but average. You might as well drive to his house and smack him in the face. He's had 3-4 games in the 3 years that he's upset me. Opposed to the 25+ games he's been very solid, including getting the best of Revis on more than one occasion. Yesterday would have been much worse if the playoffs were on the line, but they weren't. He's one of the few bright spots on this team, and even though he had a rough game, I think we should cut him a little slack on yesterday, and thank him for being the best he could be. He can't put up the numbers he should with a mediocre QB, and no other receiving threats on the team.

[ParanoidAndroid]

So, he's either not getting opportunities or dropping the ball. How do people not see that?



How do people not see that? We don't have your selective memory. I see just fine, thanks. He makes more plays than he misses, by far, and the fact that he is near 1000yds again is further proof. I see him miss plays, and I see him open and not getting the ball, but it's not the only thing I see and I know damn well it's not the only thing you see either. It's where your focus is. You make it sound like he does nothing. The Bills passing game would be zero without him.
Finding a way to trash our good players, too..... awesome. Insufferable.

...3....2....1 ..... "Again making it about me." -OpIv

It's not you, it's your argument, and it's just plain cukoo. :crazy:

[CoolBreeze]

Ok, here's the problem: first our QB DIDN'T throw behind Stevie this time, and Stevie rewarded him with two drops and a fumble. And a stupid penalty. Stevie and his defenders can't sit there whining that Stevie doesn't get opportunities, then say "well it was just one time" when he actually is given an opportunity and screws it up.

Second, it's NOT just one time. Stevie frequently makes these kinds of mistakes. Remember the two potential game-winning TD drops? Remember the stupid celebration penalties that got him benched last season? And for that matter, outside of 3 games or so, where has Stevie been all year? Moulds and Evans had **** QB's too but they still managed to do better than Stevie.

The reality is that we are living in the age of the salary cap. That means that every player signed to a big contract comes at the opportunity cost of signing big-name FA's or retaining other talent on the team. If you give a player a big salary, he has to play up to that number. Otherwise, the team is going to struggle. Stevie is certainly not the only one on this team not playing up to his salary, but he is absolutely part of the problem.

I'm getting really tired of his act. He definitely has some talent, but it's not elite #1 talent and he doesn't have the mentality to be a true #1. This team will never win if he is the #1 WR.

This team will never win with your negative vibes. By the way I love how you bring up games from the last 2 years as well as this year. Stevie has had 4-6 games with late penalties including this last week. I agree with you he does drop his share of balls. And your right he's dropped two game winners (against the steelers in OT, and the Jets last year) If those are the games you're referring too. However, that Jets game was the same one he hurt us with the late penalty. My overall problem with your statement is your basing Stevie's whole career performance on these 6-7 games. You can't do that, that doesn't make sense. Moulds was way better than Johnson in my opinion, i agree. But Evans has never had 2, 1000 yard seasons in a row ever. in fact Evans has never had 2 seasons in a row over 850 yards. In fact Evans only made it above 60 catches twice. My point is don't drag Evans into a discussion about Johnson. Because Johnson is way better than Mr. Fly Route, who also had his fair share of drops. Secondly you asked where he's been this past season. The simple answer is usually jogging back to the huddle after our terrible QB throws it behind, or over the head of him. Yesterday, I assure you sir was an awkward day where you saw Johnson under perform, and Fitz actually hit Stevie on route. Stevie is solid usually and would have had a much better year with a better QB.

[Albany,n.y.]

WGR is dissing Stevie for stiffing them & not doing his show or calling in to tell them he wasn't doing it.

[OpIv37]

How do people not see that? We don't have your selective memory. I see just fine, thanks. He makes more plays than he misses, by far, and the fact that he is near 1000yds again is further proof. I see him miss plays, and I see him open and not getting the ball, but it's not the only thing I see and I know damn well it's not the only thing you see either. It's where your focus is. You make it sound like he does nothing. The Bills passing game would be zero without him.
Finding a way to trash our good players, too..... awesome. Insufferable.

...3....2....1 ..... "Again making it about me." -OpIv

It's not you, it's your argument, and it's just plain cukoo. :crazy:
It's not cuckoo at all. Stevie repeatedly hurts this team with his nonsense. And a 1000 yard season is 62.5 yards a game. Lookout Jerry Rice!

Did you not see my post about the cap, or did you just selectively ignore it? This team will never win unless guys like Stevie play up to their contracts and he never will.

It cracks me up that that the team sucks and yet some of you insist in defending the people who are holding them back. Is it Stevie's fault entirely? Of course not. But he's part of the problem. Depending on guys like him is why this team can't win.

[Ginger Vitis]

It cracks me up that that the team sucks and yet some of you insist in defending the people who are holding them back.

Since you think Stevie is holding them back you must want the Bills FO to cut him?

[OpIv37]

This team will never win with your negative vibes. By the way I love how you bring up games from the last 2 years as well as this year. Stevie has had 4-6 games with late penalties including this last week. I agree with you he does drop his share of balls. And your right he's dropped two game winners (against the steelers in OT, and the Jets last year) If those are the games you're referring too. However, that Jets game was the same one he hurt us with the late penalty. My overall problem with your statement is your basing Stevie's whole career performance on these 6-7 games. You can't do that, that doesn't make sense. Moulds was way better than Johnson in my opinion, i agree. But Evans has never had 2, 1000 yard seasons in a row ever. in fact Evans has never had 2 seasons in a row over 850 yards. In fact Evans only made it above 60 catches twice. My point is don't drag Evans into a discussion about Johnson. Because Johnson is way better than Mr. Fly Route, who also had his fair share of drops. Secondly you asked where he's been this past season. The simple answer is usually jogging back to the huddle after our terrible QB throws it behind, or over the head of him. Yesterday, I assure you sir was an awkward day where you saw Johnson under perform, and Fitz actually hit Stevie on route. Stevie is solid usually and would have had a much better year with a better QB.
Do you honestly think my "negative vibes" have any effect on the team whatsoever? That's just delusional.

And why do Stevie's past mistakes suddenly disappear because it's a different season? I disagree that it's only 6 or 7 games, but even if it is, that's 2+ games a year on average where Stevie hurts us with mental mistakes. Not bad plays or being outplayed by a better player. Inexcusable mental mistakes. It's a pattern with him and I don't know why you or anyone else finds it acceptable.

[OpIv37]

Since you think Stevie is holding them back you must want the Bills FO to cut him?

No, I want the Bills' FO to use him as a #2 and get a #3 who can possibly step up when (not if) Stevie flakes.

But it'll never happen cuz of the contract they gave him.

[Ginger Vitis]

But it'll never happen cuz of the contract they gave him.

So because of Stevies contract they cant sign a FA WR or they can't draft a WR in next years draft in the 1st or 2nd round?

[OpIv37]

So because of Stevies contract they cant sign a FA WR or they can't draft a WR in next years draft in the 1st or 2nd round?

Technically they can. But, remember that lovely concept of opportunity cost? If we get a true #1 in FA, that's cap money that can't be spent on the rest of the team. How much cap are you willing to spend on the WR position?

Same for the draft pick: if we use it on WR then we can't use it on LB or QB.

But realistically, they won't do it anyway because it would mean tacitly admitting that resigning Stevie for so much was a mistake, and they won't publicly admit their mistakes.

[Ginger Vitis]

Technically they can. But, remember that lovely concept of opportunity cost? If we get a true #1 in FA, that's cap money that can't be spent on the rest of the team. How much cap are you willing to spend on the WR position?

Same for the draft pick: if we use it on WR then we can't use it on LB or QB.

But realistically, they won't do it anyway because it would mean tacitly admitting that resigning Stevie for so much was a mistake, and they won't publicly admit their mistakes.

If you think resigning Stevie Johnson to the kind of money he got was a mistake then you must wish they hadnt done that and that he left as a FA..

[OpIv37]

If you think resigning Stevie Johnson to the kind of money he got was a mistake then you must wish they hadnt done that and that he left as a FA..

Yeah well the team ****ed up on that one and put themselves in an impossible position. Despite his limitations, he's still the best WR on the team. So, they either let him walk and be piss-poor at WR, or pay him as a #1 and be mediocre at WR. They chose the latter. If they had known how bad Fitz was gonna be, they probably would have taken the former and saved the money and gotten their compensatory draft pick.

[ParanoidAndroid]

And a 1000 yard season is 62.5 yards a game. Lookout Jerry Rice!



Haha! Yeah.... He's no Jerry Rice! Two straight going on possibly three in a row with a mediocre QB.... It's something Andre Reed never did, with a HOF QB and he's been a HOF candidate how many times? You really want to go there?

[Mouldsie]

OP is idiotic

[OpIv37]

Haha! Yeah.... He's no Jerry Rice! Two straight going on possibly three in a row with a mediocre QB.... It's something Andre Reed never did, with a HOF QB and he's been a HOF candidate how many times? You really want to go there?

Um, Jim Kelly had targets other than Reed. Fitz doesn't have targets beyond Stevie. Nice try, though.

- - - Updated - - -


OP is idiotic

I'm idiotic? I'm not the one defending a player who is consistently hurting the team.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

In a related story, Mr. Christ was asked his opinion about the current state of the Buffalo Bills including Joker and the Bills offense:

16109

[ParanoidAndroid]

Um, Jim Kelly had targets other than Reed. Fitz doesn't have targets beyond Stevie. Nice try, though.

If anything, the lack of other targets makes it MORE difficult to get the numbers, not less. The fact that defenses know he's all we got and he's still putting up solid numbers is even more impressive.
Thanks for improving my position for me.... I'm even more convinced.

[Mr. Pink]

Nobody holds Stevie back...the fact that there is no quality WR opposite of him helps him.

When you're the only legitimate WR option on a team, you're going to get more targets and thus better statistics.

Lee Evans was no different when he was here and no I'm not comparing the two as Stevie is more well rounded WR overall.

[OpIv37]

If anything, the lack of other targets makes it MORE difficult to get the numbers, not less. The fact that defenses know he's all we got and he's still putting up solid numbers is even more impressive.
Thanks for improving my position for me.... I'm even more convinced.

That's pretty twisted logic to defend the same old "it's everybody's fault but the player I like" routine.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Joker could evolve into a number 1 receiver, but he needs coaching that demands excellence and keeps him on a short leash.

[OpIv37]

Joker could evolve into a number 1 receiver, but he needs coaching that demands excellence and keeps him on a short leash.

Unfortunately, we haven't had anything that remotely resembles player development or competent coaching since the Wade Phillips days, arguably the Marv Levy days.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Unfortunately, we haven't had anything that remotely resembles player development or competent coaching since the Wade Phillips days, arguably the Marv Levy days.

Keep in mind, other than for the great bouts of libation and partying during Superbowl week, the Bills teams of the early nineties actually had locker room leaders. Darryl Talley, Jim Kelly, Kent Hull, etc. Bruce acts stupid someone will call him out.

[Historian]

Haha! Yeah.... He's no Jerry Rice! Two straight going on possibly three in a row with a mediocre QB.... It's something Andre Reed never did, with a HOF QB and he's been a HOF candidate how many times? You really want to go there?

Sorry, OP is right.

When I think of Johnson, the image that comes to mind, is that of him dropping the game winning TD against the Steelers a few years ago.

And he's been doing it ever since, on a pretty regular basis.

The guy is a tremendous athlete, with excellent speed, who has concentration problems, IMO.

Just because we plucked him out of the 7th round, and he became a polished gem for us doesn't make him a #1 receiver.

And bringing Andre Reed into it is just silly.

Reed had 48 catches as a rookie with Bruce Mathison and Vince Ferragamo throwing to him.

And as for his antics, it only shows how weak of a coach Gailey (and Jauron) really are. Most would have put the brakes on the silly stuff years ago.

Had they done that, perhaps he might have developed into the HOF player you all seem to think he is.

:idunno:

[Mouldsie]

Excellent Speed and drops a lot of passes. Good scouting report.