What a refreshing change thus far

[Mr. Miyagi]

It's nice to see us moving quickly in hiring a coaching staff for a change. The last few times we were always one of the last teams to hire a HC, interviewing everyone else's leftovers and by the time we got our guy, all the assistant coaches were gone. This time by getting Marrone early, we were able to get Pettine right out of the gate, and already onto filling out the other coaching positions. We can even start evaluating players early, etc.

Look at the other teams that don't have coahces yet, Philly, Cleveland, San Diego, Chicago, and they're all interviewing the same 5 guys round and round and there's really nothing sexy out there. So they'll end up doing what we did in the past, settle on someone else's trash and have nothing for assistants.

Looks like maybe Russ is moving forward with a new culture!

:gobills:

[Bone]

I agree 100%. I am not used to the Bills hiring people that I have actually heard of before.

[NOT THE DUDE...]

i know it's early, but i think russ taking over has a lot to do with real name coaches who other teams want coming here... im still cynical after so many years of losing, but it does feel refreshing and these new coaches seem much more competent and with the times... jmo

[mikemac2001]

Espically Coach's leaving there teams withen the div

i think we have made a hard push to change the image we have...i liked all the hires so far

[BigZ]

I'm a little concerned about a college OC but that's the HC's expertise. Glad we got an up and coming DC who's AGGRESSIVE.

[SquishDaFish]

This is the first time in a long time im really feeling good about the bills and now just blind optimism

[psubills62]

I love the optimism, Miyagi, but I still want to see a lot more (like wins, among many other things) before I get too excited.

I do like getting our coaches on board early before other teams might try to hire them.

[TigerJ]

In once sense, I really like the youth and energy that seems to be the theme of the new Bills coaching staff thus far. However, one of the criticisms I remember having of Gregg Williams and his coaching staff was that he seemed inclined to hire only people that were younger and/or less experienced than he was, as if he felt that too much knowledge and experience was threatening to him. I hope Marrone doesn't make the same mistake. I'd like to see at least a few grizzled veterans in coaching included in the staff. Maybe that's only because I'm grizzled and old.

Also, I really hope there is some color in his coaching staff when all is said and done. So far it's all lily white.

[Night Train]

This board has gone through every stage of a 16 year old girl the last week.

[Joe Fo Sho]

This board has gone through every stage of a 16 year old girl the last week.

Welcome to the internet.

[Bone]

This board has gone through every stage of a 16 year old girl the last week.

this is going to be my "first time" in five years...seeing the bills actually blitz!

[The King]

I want to see a team that has an attitude. Look at Pitt, Bal, NE. These teams all play with a chip on their shoulder and take every loss personally. That's what I want to see.

[BillsWin]

Not only are they two intriguing hires, but I also get the sense that Marrone is "fired up".

It's refreshing to have a head coach come in and immediately want to get to work.

Pettine was a fantastic hire for us. While the jury is still out on Hackett, I've heard he is highly thought of as a rising star in this league and for its future.

About as innovative as they come and let's not forget that Marrone will put his own stamp on the playbook as well. So the 33 year old may be calling the plays, but it's not all on him to develop an NFL playbook.

So I sense that we may be a hybrid of New Orleans Saints and K-GUN hurry up offense.

[YardRat]

Oh, c'mon Miyagi...obviously you're not listening closely enough to those who believe they pulled names out of a hat last Monday and took the first guy Brandon could respond to with 'Hey! I know him!!'.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

It's nice to see us moving quickly in hiring a coaching staff for a change. The last few times we were always one of the last teams to hire a HC, interviewing everyone else's leftovers and by the time we got our guy, all the assistant coaches were gone. This time by getting Marrone early, we were able to get Pettine right out of the gate, and already onto filling out the other coaching positions. We can even start evaluating players early, etc.

Look at the other teams that don't have coahces yet, Philly, Cleveland, San Diego, Chicago, and they're all interviewing the same 5 guys round and round and there's really nothing sexy out there. So they'll end up doing what we did in the past, settle on someone else's trash and have nothing for assistants.

Looks like maybe Russ is moving forward with a new culture!

:gobills:

I won't lie, when I first read that Marrone was our HC I was angry because I wanted Lovie Smith or Andy Reid, but I have to say that while I am still not sure about his OC, his DC selection shows me he wants to win and he is going to do so at the expense of a division rival. Also, the alacrity and speed with which he has made his coordinator hires suggests to me that he has a vision about what he wants. I don't know how well he is going to do this fall but I think he should at least be able to equal Chan's 6-10s and the future all of a sudden looks bright.

[OpIv37]

Oh, c'mon Miyagi...obviously you're not listening closely enough to those who believe they pulled names out of a hat last Monday and took the first guy Brandon could respond to with 'Hey! I know him!!'.

Yeah, we really should give Nix and Brandon the benefit of the doubt when they make hires that just defy common sense. After all, with their excellent track record, they've earned it....

[YardRat]

Yeah, we really should give Nix and Brandon the benefit of the doubt when they make hires that just defy common sense. After all, with their excellent track record, they've earned it....

Please explain how hiring Marrone, Hackett and Pettine defies common sense.

What hires wouldn't defy common sense?

[The last buffalo fan]

Oh Christ, let's have fun for a change! :drunks:

[RedEyE]

Cautiously optimistic.
But gang, you really need to be patient this season. Just don't be shocked and pissed if the Bills come out and lose their first three out of four games (hypothetically speaking, of course). You need to give this coaching staff a chance to make corrections and inject the right components. There is more than likely going to be huge shake up on offense to include a new QB that may or may not last the season.

[The Toe Show]

I'm in.

Marrone - I like his style. Aggressive, blitzing, discipline, no-bull**** policy.

Hackett, young, solid pedigree, agressive, McDaniels style - looks like he can still play. I'm optimistic.

Pettine, perfect background, blitz, flexible schemes.

These guys make sense together - I sense chemistry.

Our coaching staff is going to look YOUNG! and HUNGRY!

The free agent QB market is ****.

Not sure how we plan to navigate that.

I say trade for Rivers, draft QB. Play the vet, groom the rook.

We also need to make moves at LB.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I hate Rivers.

[The Toe Show]

I hate Rivers.
That's why he's good.

[OpIv37]

Please explain how hiring Marrone, Hackett and Pettine defies common sense.

What hires wouldn't defy common sense?

No NFL HC experience for Marrone. No previous OC experience at any level for Hackett, plus he was a QC coach in Buffalo before. Hiring ANYONE who had their hands on this train wreck the last 12 years defies common sense, with the possible exception of Bobby April. And that's not even mentioning the lack of experience.

I can live with Pettine.

[MikeInRoch]

So what HC with NFL experience would have made "common sense"?

[OpIv37]

So what HC with NFL experience would have made "common sense"?

Reid. Cowher. Billick. Gruden.

Lovie Smith and Whisenhunt both underachieved recently, but both got NFL teams to the SB and would have made more sense than Marrone. It wreaks of a PR move to get/keep fans from the Syracuse area.

[psubills62]

I wouldn't say that hiring someone with no NFL HC experience "defies common sense." How do you think people get NFL HC experience?

Defying common sense would be hiring a HC who had no HC experience on any level.

Not sure I agree about getting/keeping Syracuse fans. You just pissed them off by hiring away the head coach that was rebuilding their program. Not exactly the best PR move to make.

[OpIv37]

I'm saying that after 13 years of losing, the Bills are not in a position to take chances on HC's with no prior NFL experience.

And Hackett has no previous OC experience at any level, so that definitely defies common sense even by your standard.

[mysticsoto]

I'm saying that after 13 years of losing, the Bills are not in a position to take chances on HC's with no prior NFL experience.

And Hackett has no previous OC experience at any level, so that definitely defies common sense even by your standard.

On the other hand, the Bills have been hiring the rejects HC of other teams for the last few years and it has yielded nothing. Perhaps it is time for a different approach and instead look to someone who knows about resurrecting a bad franchise.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Reid. Cowher. Billick. Gruden.

Lovie Smith and Whisenhunt both underachieved recently, but both got NFL teams to the SB and would have made more sense than Marrone. It wreaks of a PR move to get/keep fans from the Syracuse area.
Reid - not available, already hired by KC
Cowher - not interested in any NFL job right now
Billick - :puke:
Gruden - not interested in us
Lovie - :puke:
Whisenhunt - :puke:

Any other suggestions?

- - - Updated - - -




And Hackett has no previous OC experience at any level, so that definitely defies common sense even by your standard.
He was the OC at Syracuse.

[psubills62]

I'm saying that after 13 years of losing, the Bills are not in a position to take chances on HC's with no prior NFL experience.

And Hackett has no previous OC experience at any level, so that definitely defies common sense even by your standard.
Hackett was the OC at Syracuse. Like I've said, I understand people's qualms about him, so not necessarily going to defend Hackett. I'm personally going to wait and see how he does in the NFL.

As for the Bills taking chances, I can see your point. At the same time, I personally think it's best for the Bills to take chances. Guys who are established are most likely going to be looking for a better situation than Buffalo, and they're going to demand things (like control of personnel) that really hasn't worked out in the past for other coaches. I actually think Buffalo taking a risk on an up-and-comer is better than hiring a retread (whether he's a good or a bad one). The key is being able to recognize someone who would be a good/great HC. I haven't seen anything to indicate the Buffalo Bills would recognize a good/great up-and-comer, but I'm not going to blame Marrone for Buffalo hiring him, so I'm willing to wait and see what he does.

But that's just my opinion. I think either way can work (there's arguments for both sides), and I mentioned my preference. You obviously have your preference. Just don't think that going a different direction than what you prefer equates to defying common sense.

[justasportsfan]

No NFL HC experience for Marrone. No previous OC experience at any level for Hackett, plus he was a QC coach in Buffalo before. Hiring ANYONE who had their hands on this train wreck the last 12 years defies common sense, with the possible exception of Bobby April. And that's not even mentioning the lack of experience.

I can live with Pettine.

well we made common sense hires in both Chan and Jauron. Didn't turn out well.

Marrone is a high risk hire but it's time that we took some risks instead of the conventional/conservative hire in Dick and Chan.

[justasportsfan]

Reid. Cowher. Billick. Gruden.

Lovie Smith and Whisenhunt both underachieved recently, but both got NFL teams to the SB and would have made more sense than Marrone. It wreaks of a PR move to get/keep fans from the Syracuse area.

You cant use Reid. He wanted full control.

Don't you wonder why NO ONE has called Billick for an interview just like no one other than the bills called Jauron and Chan? You want to repeat the same common sense?

Maybe we should have made WANNY our HC beased on the list you gave us. I mean he has experience, has a SB ring as a DC.

[BidsJr]

I don't care if Mickey Mouse is our head coach, we have the best DC we have had since Wade Phillips. That all by itself is a massive upgrade to what we have had in a long long time. I am willing to give Hackett a chance considering Marrone's experience with the Saints.

[ServoBillieves]

I don't care if Mickey Mouse is our head coach, we have the best DC we have had since Wade Phillips. That all by itself is a massive upgrade to what we have had in a long long time. I am willing to give Hackett a chance considering Marrone's experience with the Saints.

I would care if Mickey Mouse was our head coach... I heard he's an ******* and doesn't have much football knowledge.

Anywho, I can understand the confusion with Hackett being OC. It's kind of a weird sense of extremes. The low being Hackett, the middle being Marrone, and the top being Pettine. It's out of whack but, whatever. If we want to stay fans then this is what we have to deal with, and I'm on board... again :/.

[OpIv37]

You cant use Reid. He wanted full control.

Don't you wonder why NO ONE has called Billick for an interview just like no one other than the bills called Jauron and Chan? You want to repeat the same common sense?

Maybe we should have made WANNY our HC beased on the list you gave us. I mean he has experience, has a SB ring as a DC.
In case you didn't notice, the guys I mentioned had success as an NFL HC. That's the big difference between them and Wanny, Jauron or Gailey.

Marrone has neither experience nor success as an NFL HC.

[justasportsfan]

In case you didn't notice, the guys I mentioned had success as an NFL HC. That's the big difference between them and Wanny, Jauron or Gailey.

Marrone has neither experience nor success as an NFL HC.
You also mentioned Billick. Why didn't he get a sniff from any team?

to a degree Gailey, Wanny and Jauron had their success as headcoaches.

Whisenthunt went to the sb but one can argue that it was because of Kurt Warner. Take Warner away one can argue, he's Wanny and Jauron.


The bills have hired retreads. I can't blast them for doing something different this time. I can't blast them for not bringing in OLD school mentality.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Marrone has neither experience nor success as an NFL HC.
Neither did Jim Harbaugh last year.
Neither did John Harbaugh in 2008.
Neither did Mike Smith in 2008.
Neither did Mike McCarthy in 2006.
Neither did Sean Payton in 2006.
Neither did Gary Kubiak in 2005.

What a bunch of failures these guys must be.

I feel like I could go on but I won't.

[MTBillsFan]

I want to see a team that has an attitude. Look at Pitt, Bal, NE. These teams all play with a chip on their shoulder and take every loss personally. That's what I want to see.

That will be awesome to see! I watched the end of the games that we've lost only to see guys laughing and joking around with the same guy that just beat them. I know you need to be a good sport and all but take pride in your job and if someone does it better than you, you should be made as hell for a little while and get back on the field and kick some a$$.

[justasportsfan]

One thing OP is neglecting when it comes to common sense is that the bills hired someone other teams wanted . Does that mean those teams don't have common sense either?

[better days]

I won't lie, when I first read that Marrone was our HC I was angry because I wanted Lovie Smith or Andy Reid, but I have to say that while I am still not sure about his OC, his DC selection shows me he wants to win and he is going to do so at the expense of a division rival. Also, the alacrity and speed with which he has made his coordinator hires suggests to me that he has a vision about what he wants. I don't know how well he is going to do this fall but I think he should at least be able to equal Chan's 6-10s and the future all of a sudden looks bright.

I would have prefered Lovie Smith myself, but now the Pettine is the DC, I'm glad it worked out this way.

[OpIv37]

Neither did Jim Harbaugh last year.
Neither did John Harbaugh in 2008.
Neither did Mike Smith in 2008.
Neither did Mike McCarthy in 2006.
Neither did Sean Payton in 2006.
Neither did Gary Kubiak in 2005.

What a bunch of failures these guys must be.

I feel like I could go on but I won't.

Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Pete Carroll with the Jets, Romeo Crennel, Gregg Williams, Josh McDaniels, Jason Garrett.... I could go on but I won't.

[OpIv37]

One thing OP is neglecting when it comes to common sense is that the bills hired someone other teams wanted . Does that mean those teams don't have common sense either?

What other teams? The Browns and KC? Sorry but our standards should be higher than that.

[madness]

What other teams? The Browns and KC? Sorry but our standards should be higher than that.
SYRACUSE, N.Y. - The list of NFL teams interested in Orange head coach Doug Marrone is growing by the day. In addition to the Bills and Browns showing interest, the Chiefs, Bears and Eagles are now in the mix.

The San Diego Chargers had a strong interest in Doug Marrone and might have tried to sign him if their coaching search was in position to act, league sources told The Buffalo News over the weekend.

"The Eagles have interviews set up with Falcons coordinators Mike Nolan (defense), Dirk Koetter (offense) and Keith Armstrong (special teams). They also have Oregon's Chip Kelly, Penn State's Bill O'Brien and Syracuse's Doug Marrone high on their list of candidates to replace Andy Reid."

Bill Polian noted he wasn't involved in the Bills' coaching search. He certainly approved of the Bills' choice, though. "I gave his name to any owner who asked about a potential head coach," Bill Polian said. "Clearly, I wasn't the only one."

[Mr. Miyagi]

Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Pete Carroll with the Jets, Romeo Crennel, Gregg Williams, Josh McDaniels, Jason Garrett.... I could go on but I won't.
Right. So what we're saying is that there are winners and losers from coaches without NFL HC experience. That pretty much negates your point.

I'm not saying Marrone is the next great coach from God. None of us knows that. But to say he's going to be a total bust just because he has no NFL HC expereice is jumping to conclusion in the worst way. And it's not a realist thing to say, it's a pessimist sky-is-falling thing to say.

[justasportsfan]

What other teams? The Browns and KC? Sorry but our standards should be higher than that.

it doesn't matter OP> They went for someone that other teams wanted and instead of getting some credit for that, obviously you find something negative in that. If you look who the eagles and bears are interviewing, they are interviewing a bunch of guys who didn't even get a sniff from other teams.

[justasportsfan]

What other teams? The Browns and KC? Sorry but our standards should be higher than that.


SYRACUSE, N.Y. - The list of NFL teams interested in Orange head coach Doug Marrone is growing by the day. In addition to the Bills and Browns showing interest, the Chiefs, Bears and Eagles are now in the mix.

The San Diego Chargers had a strong interest in Doug Marrone and might have tried to sign him if their coaching search was in position to act, league sources told The Buffalo News over the weekend.

"The Eagles have interviews set up with Falcons coordinators Mike Nolan (defense), Dirk Koetter (offense) and Keith Armstrong (special teams). They also have Oregon's Chip Kelly, Penn State's Bill O'Brien and Syracuse's Doug Marrone high on their list of candidates to replace Andy Reid."

Bill Polian noted he wasn't involved in the Bills' coaching search. He certainly approved of the Bills' choice, though. "I gave his name to any owner who asked about a potential head coach," Bill Polian said. "Clearly, I wasn't the only one."

what now? what now?

[Mr. Miyagi]

what now? what now?
16179

[trapezeus]

i got the ESPN update that the browns hired someone after flirting with bigger names earlier last week. How 2010 of them.

I'm a little skeptical on who did the hire. if the bills seriously wanted culture change, they'd have gotten rid of russ brandon, a proven 13 yr loser as he keeps climbing the ranks with each worse season presented.

i really don't think ralph passed on a torch...but at this point, you can't do anything but hope this works out. but watching the jags and browns stuble makes me comfortable that we are ahead of at least 2 teams next year.

i'll really chime in on this hire by week 8 next year when we see how the 7-8 teams with vacancies compare to one another.

i've been somewhat anti-nix of late because of the useless rounds 2-7 drafts. but he did improve the lines, and that seems to hvae mattered to marrone, a coach who was sought out by other teams. This abysmal 6-10 team wasn't because of a lack of talent, which means hopefully the chance of a turnaround is greater for next year.

[OpIv37]

Right. So what we're saying is that there are winners and losers from coaches without NFL HC experience. That pretty much negates your point.

I'm not saying Marrone is the next great coach from God. None of us knows that. But to say he's going to be a total bust just because he has no NFL HC expereice is jumping to conclusion in the worst way. And it's not a realist thing to say, it's a pessimist sky-is-falling thing to say.
No, it's not.

He's never proven that he can coach at the NFL level. At any given moment, there are only 32 NFL head coaches, and usually anywhere from 4-6 get fired at the end of the year. Being able to doing successfully is a very rare skill, and I don't believe Marrone or anyone else can do it until they prove it. There is nothing unrealistic or pessimistic about that whatsoever. It's just the simple reality of the NFL.

[Dude]

What other teams? The Browns and KC? Sorry but our standards should be higher than that.The Bills can't control what other teams have vacancies. Would you make the same statement if the Patriots and 49ers were looking for a head coach and the Bills hired a guy who was high on their list?

[OpIv37]

The Bills can't control what other teams have vacancies. Would you make the same statement if the Patriots and 49ers were looking for a head coach and the Bills hired a guy who was high on their list?
I'm not really sure what you are getting at here. People are trying to justify the Marrone hire by pointing out that other teams wanted him. My point is that what other teams want has no bearings on his abilities or experience (or lack thereof), especially when the other teams that want him are just as mistake-prone as Buffalo.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

I will give Marrone the benefit of the doubt, but tbh I'm not confident about a guy successfully jumping straight from the Big East to the AFC East. Though it is nice to have someone young and vibrant, hopefully he will coach with a pair unlike our previous hires.

[justasportsfan]

No, it's not.

He's never proven that he can coach at the NFL level. At any given moment, there are only 32 NFL head coaches, and usually anywhere from 4-6 get fired at the end of the year. Being able to doing successfully is a very rare skill, and I don't believe Marrone or anyone else can do it until they prove it. There is nothing unrealistic or pessimistic about that whatsoever. It's just the simple reality of the NFL.

Miyagi posted successful coaches who didn't have any NFL experience, then you posted coaches who failed. You both have points . In other words, it's neither here nor there yet you insist on whining. Typical.

[OpIv37]

Miyagi posted successful coaches who didn't have any NFL experience, then you posted coaches who failed. You both have points . In other words, it's neither here nor there yet you insist on whining. Typical.
Once again..... Shoot the messenger and make it about me.

I don't want to think that this team made yet another very questionable choice. I don't want to think that we are going to suck for another 3 or 4 years. But when the team makes moves like this, it sure as hell seems like its business as usual and the same results as usual.

You and Miyagi can try to avoid that reality by clinging to guys who are exceptions to the rule. You can try to avoid that reality by making it seem like it's me *****ing just to *****. But, reality will kick you in the nuts again, as it always does.

I hope Marrone does well. I really do. I just don't see any real reason to expect that he will.

[justasportsfan]

Once again..... Shoot the messenger and make it about me.

I don't want to think that this team made yet another very questionable choice. I don't want to think that we are going to suck for another 3 or 4 years. But when the team makes moves like this, it sure as hell seems like its business as usual and the same results as usual.l.Lol. Business as usual is picking a retread coach that nobody wants. It's so hard for you to see that because you're just looking for something to whine about.



You and Miyagi can try to avoid that reality by clinging to guys who are exceptions to the rule. You can try to avoid that reality by making it seem like it's me *****ing just to *****. But, reality will kick you in the nuts again, as it always does.

I hope Marrone does well. I really do. I just don't see any real reason to expect that he will. You are *****ing just to *****. No one here is saying we're going to the superbowl. No one here is even predicting playoffs yet. We're just happy that the bills are doing something going with a different direction. They are finally taking a risk instead of the safe/conservative route like we did with the last 2 coaches.

Lets face it. Wherther we got Lovie or Whiz there's are pro's and cons. You'd still find something to whine about.

Billick? Give me a break. So many teams needs a coach and no one even bothered calling him.

[OpIv37]

There are a lot of other options besides a college guy with a mediocre record and retreads that no one else wants. It's business as usual in the sense that they still aren't willing to do what it takes to get the right guy for the job.

And please..... Whether other teams wanted Billick or Marrone is completely irrelevant. Remember, like us, they aren't in the hunt for new coaches because they've been making good decisions lately.

[Mr. Miyagi]

You and Miyagi can try to avoid that reality by clinging to guys who are exceptions to the rule.
Why are the failed coaches you listed are the rules and mine are the exceptions? Maybe the Steve Spurrier and Nick Sabans of the world are the exceptions. And how do you count Jason Garrett as a failed coach already?

[OpIv37]

Why are the failed coaches you listed are the rules and mine are the exceptions? Maybe the Steve Spurrier and Nick Sabans of the world are the exceptions. And how do you count Jason Garrett as a failed coach already?

There are far more Spurrier types than Harbaugh types. The list I gave was just off the top of my head. I didn't have time to look up all the forgettable coordinators and college HC's who failed as NFL HC's.

As far as Garrett, well the Cowboys have underachieved for two straight seasons under him. I suppose he could turn it around, but if I were a Cowboys fan, I definitely wouldn't bee too confident about the future with Garrett and Turnover Tony.

[justasportsfan]

There are a lot of other options besides a college guy with a mediocre record and retreads that no one else wants. It's business as usual in the sense that they still aren't willing to do what it takes to get the right guy for the job.

And please..... Whether other teams wanted Billick or Marrone is completely irrelevant. Remember, like us, they aren't in the hunt for new coaches because they've been making good decisions lately.

you brought Billick up. Not me.


Reid. Cowher. Billick. Gruden.

Lovie Smith and Whisenhunt both underachieved recently, but both got NFL teams to the SB and would have made more sense than Marrone. It wreaks of a PR move to get/keep fans from the Syracuse area.

Cowher. Not no one has interviewed him. No need to argue him.

Billick. no one interviewed him. Offensive coach who won with defense. Unless he can assemble the very same staff he had at ravens, whats he gonna do here or any team that didn't bother with him.

Gruden- has he interviewed anywhere ? Negative- after inheriting Dungies team and winning the sb what did he do after that? Gruden on MArrone "“This is a guy I have been studying for a long time.

Whisenhunt- what did he do without Warner? As crappy as we were, we beat his team.

Lovie Smith- Good coach but offensively confused.


there's always something to whine about no matter who we brought in.

[trapezeus]

i agree with OP though that marrone will be damned trying to get more production out of this team in just one year. Especially if the QB isn't one of the "hot from the get go" guys. IF we get an aaron rodgers (who presumably benefited greatly from sitting, though we'll never know), the guy is going to take his lumps.

Mitigating that is that CJ spiller should get the ball, Marrone should know how to keep an OL coached up and playing well, we get one more difference making WR and we may have a very good WR corp, and we have a seasoned DC who has been pretty good with very good talent with the jets (ranked #1 a couple times), and still pretty good when the good talent got injured or old as they did this year in NY.

But i still think a guy who plans to deviate from the old regime can't help but have a lost season out the gate. but i guess that's why we give them 3 years to get the job done.

My biggest issue is that brandon was involved in the selection which means the whole thing is suspect.

[OpIv37]

you brought Billick up. Not me.



Cowher. Not no one has interviewed him. No need to argue him.

Billick. no one interviewed him. Offensive coach who won with defense. Unless he can assemble the very same staff he had at ravens, whats he gonna do here or any team that didn't bother with him.

Gruden- has he interviewed anywhere ? Negative- after inheriting Dungies team and winning the sb what did he do after that?

Whisenhunt- what did he do without Warner? As crappy as we were, we beat his team.

Lovie Smith- Good coach but offensively confused.


there's always something to whine about no matter who we brought in.

I never said any of those guys were perfect. I never said I wouldn't have *****ed if we had taken one of those guys. Here's the thing, though: if we had taken any one of those guys and someone said "it could have been worse. We could have taken that guy from Syracuse," I would have whole-heartedly agreed.

But once again, we are losing focus. It's about which pick is the right pick for the team, not which pick is gonna make Op STFU. It's not about me- its about the team.

[justasportsfan]

I never said any of those guys were perfect. I never said I wouldn't have *****ed if we had taken one of those guys. Here's the thing, though: if we had taken any one of those guys and someone said "it could have been worse. We could have taken that guy from Syracuse," I would have whole-heartedly agreed.

But once again, we are losing focus. It's about which pick is the right pick for the team, not which pick is gonna make Op STFU. It's not about me- its about the team.

we will be going round and round here. So you could have been wrong about the Harbaughs and the others in Miyagi's list by saying "it could've been worse" ,then you'd bring up Spurrier and co.

We shall see how things go. Like I said, to me it's neither here nor there.

To get back to the topic, Your argument about the bills not using common sense on this pick is way off. They grabbed a coach who was wanted by other teams. Ignore that so you can ***** just to *****.

[OpIv37]

Your premise is faulty. Other teams are perfectly capable of defying common sense as well, especially the Browns and Chiefs. So, once again, what other teams wanted has nothing to do with whether or not the pick makes sense.

[trapezeus]

we will be going round and round here. So you could have been wrong about the Harbaughs and the others in Miyagi's list by saying "it could've been worse" ,then you'd bring up Spurrier and co.

We shall see how things go. Like I said, to me it's neither here nor there.

To get back to the topic, Your argument about the bills not using common sense on this pick is way off. They grabbed a coach who was wanted by other teams. Ignore that so you can ***** just to *****.


but with the same leaders make the selections as last time, i don't know that we have enough to say that this will be successful or not successful.

Marrone could be belichick but with the browns on the bills if management continues to suck. How many drafts since 2000 do we need to have so many holes?

That isn't really a coach's problem, but i don't buy that ralph wilson all of a sudden gave russ a lot of control he never had and that they allowed dick jauron to run the draft unchallenged.

The organization still seems to be highly disfunctional without any major sweeping changes to the parts who made it dysfunctional.

[Mr. Miyagi]

There are far more Spurrier types than Harbaugh types.
There are? Because you said so? I thought you were a stats guy. Surprised that you're not ready to back up your statement with facts.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I think we're just offended by how you can jump straight to "this guy is gonna suck because he has no NFL HC experience", when none of us really knows, and it's been proven that plenty of such first time coaches succeeded, as well as failed. There just isn't any way to say definitively one way or another. And it's just so ****** annoying that you find a way to ***** all the time about everything, however it happens. You said it yourself, had we hired a guy with HC experience, you probably would *****ed about something else all the same. So yes, at the end it's about you, not being wrong, but about your nonstop constant *****ing about everything. Dude sometimes you just need to STFU.

[THATHURMANATOR]

OH DAMN OP JUST GOT BLOWN THE **** UP BY MIYAGI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

- - - Updated - - -

I am fine with Marrone for sure.

I have liked what I have heard out of him.

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

Both of you have valid points. I absolutely do think we have moved a different direction and there is something to the fact that other teams (besides just the browns and chiefs) were looking at Marone. We have a young, energetic staff that seems to be a different mentality than what we've had in recent years.

But to OPs point, after 13 years of misery, it's hard to be anything but pessimistic when everything they have done has turned out so wrong for so damn long.

[OpIv37]

I think we're just offended by how you can jump straight to "this guy is gonna suck because he has no NFL HC experience", when none of us really knows, and it's been proven that plenty of such first time coaches succeeded, as well as failed. There just isn't any way to say definitively one way or another. And it's just so ****** annoying that you find a way to ***** all the time about everything, however it happens. You said it yourself, had we hired a guy with HC experience, you probably would *****ed about something else all the same. So yes, at the end it's about you, not being wrong, but about your nonstop constant *****ing about everything. Dude sometimes you just need to STFU.

A few have succeeded, many haven't.

And once again- this isn't about me. The team keeps doing things that are worthy of *****ing, hence, I keep *****ing.

This is what I find ****ing annoying: when people like you jump up and down about how "refreshing" it is because the Bills did something slightly different without stopping for two ****ing seconds to think about whether or not it makes sense. You're so desperate for some shred of evidence that things may finally be different that you don't think about it objectively. Then, when someone like me points out that this move may not be very wise, you jump down my throat for "*****ing" like I'm the bad guy.

Well, guess what? The overwhelming majority of my "*****ing" has turned out to be pretty damn accurate, meanwhile this team ****s up time and time again while people like you continue to give them the benefit of the doubt for some absurd reason. But the problem is ME? Give me a ****ing break.

Believe me, I really want things to be different this time around. I really hope this is a "refreshing change" like you claim. But, at face value, it seems like the Bills going cheap and getting guys with a local following so they can put asses in seats without having to win or pay a top coach. There is absolutely no logical reason whatsoever to believe that this time is different until we see some actual results.

[Skooby]

Refreshing is a word I rarely use.

[justasportsfan]

A few have succeeded, many haven't.

And once again- this isn't about me.
This is what I find ****ing annoying: when people like you jump up and down about how "refreshing" it is because the .

lol. Not about you but it's about Miyagi?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Sorry Op I didn't mean to be a dick. Just vented for a second there, I think might've spoken the truth about this particular subject though.

Basically, some of us are glass-half-full guys, some of us are glass-half-empty guys, and you're a glass-is-practically-dry-and-we're-all going-to-die-of-thirst-and-the-human-species-is-going-to be extinct-soon-and-why-doesn't-anyone-else-seem-to-care-about-this-but-my-life-sucks-anyway-hey-why-the-hell-is-the-damn-floor-so-dirty-by-the-way-and-who-the-hell-picked-this-ugly-color-for-the-walls-oh-****-it-the-world-might-as-well-end-this-sucks kind of guy.

So we have our differences.

[OpIv37]

Sorry Op I didn't mean to be a dick. Just vented for a second there, I think might've spoken the truth about this particular subject though.

Basically, some of us are glass-half-full guys, some of us are glass-half-empty guys, and you're a glass-is-practically-dry-and-we're-all going-to-die-of-thirst-and-the-human-species-is-going-to be extinct-soon-and-why-doesn't-anyone-else-seem-to-care-about-this-but-my-life-sucks-anyway-hey-why-the-hell-is-the-damn-floor-so-dirty-by-the-way-and-who-the-hell-picked-this-ugly-color-for-the-walls-oh-****-it-the-world-might-as-well-end-this-sucks kind of guy.

So we have our differences.
Yeah, the difference is that you have a glass half full of spoiled milk and you're calling it Dom Perignon and then getting mad at me for pointing out that you're drinking spoiled milk.

Maybe, eventually, you people will start listening to me instead of insisting that I'm just a pessimist and your milk isn't really spoiled. Every time, you guys accuse me of being a "pessimist" or a "whiner" but every time, the team sucks. I don't know why you people are so insistent on your moment of false hope before reality kicks you in the nuts instead of just accepting reality from the beginning.