Report: Matt Barkley met with Bills, Jets

[YardRat]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/72995/report-matt-barkley-met-with-bills-jets

The quarterback-needy teams in the AFC East both have their eye on USC prospect Matt Barkley (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/29232/matt-barkley). According to Peter King of Sports Illustrated (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130225/nfl-combine-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Lv48MklB), Barkley met with nine teams at the NFL combine -- and the New York Jets (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/nyj/new-york-jets) and Buffalo Bills (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/buf/buffalo-bills) were in that group.

[better days]

Well, after hearing Barkley talk about Cali QBs, I like him a lot more than I did. He said he is not a Surfer dude, Football is his passion. I do like the sound of that, but I still don't think he has a strong enough arm for Buffalo.

[OpIv37]

I just threw up in my mouth a little.

[Night Train]

" We just wanted to wish you luck with the Raiders. "

[Captain Obvious]

I just threw up in my mouth a little.

Can you please get past your blind narrow hate of all things USC Barkley would be good value in the 2nd Round

[OpIv37]

Can you please get past your blind narrow hate of all things USC Barkley would be good value in the 2nd Round

Blind narrow hate? The guy regressed greatly his senior year and is coming off an injury. And he won't be there in the 2nd. If the FO wants him, it's gotta be at 8. And that's terrible value.

[better days]

Blind narrow hate? The guy regressed greatly his senior year and is coming off an injury. And he won't be there in the 2nd. If the FO wants him, it's gotta be at 8. And that's terrible value.

I would love to see the Jets draft him at #9. He would be a good fit on that team with Sanchez.

[Joe Fo Sho]

We all should hope that the Bills interview every QB in this draft.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Blind narrow hate? The guy regressed greatly his senior year and is coming off an injury. And he won't be there in the 2nd. If the FO wants him, it's gotta be at 8. And that's terrible value.
I don't necessarily love him, but the terrible value thing is overrated.

Didn't you buy a huge screen LED LCD tv within a couple of months of it first coming out? Wouldn't it be much better value to wait until the prices drop after a couple years? But no, you wanted it AT THE TIME so you paid premium for it. That's how it works, if you want something, especially if you NEED something desperately, you go get it even though you're paying more than you have to for it.

[mjt328]

Blind narrow hate? The guy regressed greatly his senior year and is coming off an injury. And he won't be there in the 2nd. If the FO wants him, it's gotta be at 8. And that's terrible value.

Just stop with the value crap.

Will Matt Barkley solve our problems at quarterback? Yes or no.

If the answer is yes, you pull the trigger. PERIOD. END OF STORY. CLOSE THE BOOK AND RETURN TO THE LIBRARY.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Just stop with the value crap.

Will Matt Barkley solve our problems at quarterback? Yes or no.

If the answer is yes, you pull the trigger. PERIOD. END OF STORY. CLOSE THE BOOK AND RETURN TO THE LIBRARY.
LOL just what I said only less nice. :rofl:

[better days]

LOL just what I said only less nice. :rofl:

What is funny is I was thinking about my TV TODAY. I did wait a while & bought a refurbished 47" VIZIO on EBAY for $400. I think I could get a better deal today.

[OpIv37]

Just stop with the value crap.

Will Matt Barkley solve our problems at quarterback? Yes or no.

If the answer is yes, you pull the trigger. PERIOD. END OF STORY. CLOSE THE BOOK AND RETURN TO THE LIBRARY.
I don't disagree. In fact i said somwthing similar in a different thread. Here's the problem: we don't know the answer to that. No one does, and no one will until he's been aging for two years or so.

So, who's most likely to give us the most value at 8? Given Barkley's injury and regression, it ain't him.

[Joe Fo Sho]

I don't necessarily love him, but the terrible value thing is overrated.

Didn't you buy a huge screen LED LCD tv within a couple of months of it first coming out? Wouldn't it be much better value to wait until the prices drop after a couple years? But no, you wanted it AT THE TIME so you paid premium for it. That's how it works, if you want something, especially if you NEED something desperately, you go get it even though you're paying more than you have to for it.

Let's just hope that it would work out better than those folks (myself included) that bought into WebOS..or the first people that bought the plasma televisions that got images burned into them...or the people that bought Windows Vista...or anyone who bought mini-disks...or Sega 32X...or HD DVD players...or a Zune.

[Mr. Miyagi]

What is funny is I was thinking about my TV TODAY. I did wait a while & bought a refurbished 47" VIZIO on EBAY for $400. I think I could get a better deal today.
You paid $400 for it? What a terrible value. Should've waited 6 months and got it for $300. In the meantime you should've used the extra $100 to fill some other void in your life, for better value. Of course, that's because we know exactly when the price point is good enough value for us to buy. In fact, I bet making millions on the stock market would be so easy because we know to pass on terrible values when we see them, knowing the future and all.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Just stop with the value crap.

Will Matt Barkley solve our problems at quarterback? Yes or no.

If the answer is yes, you pull the trigger. PERIOD. END OF STORY. CLOSE THE BOOK AND RETURN TO THE LIBRARY.

That's the problem. Maybe I should use all caps to get the point across better. NO ONE KNOWS WHO IS GOING TO BE A STUD QB.

Everything in the draft is a gamble. It's a game of trying to maximize your returns, while minimizing your risk. Draft the best player to do that.

[better days]

That's the problem. Maybe I should use all caps to get the point across better. NO ONE KNOWS WHO IS GOING TO BE A STUD QB.

Everything in the draft is a gamble. It's a game of trying to maximize your returns, while minimizing your risk. Draft the best player to do that.

Well, I would rather they draft the BEST QB myself. I don't care if they don't draft the best WR or LB, I want the BEST QB in this draft.

[OpIv37]

You paid $400 for it? What a terrible value. Should've waited 6 months and got it for $300. In the meantime you should've used the extra $100 to fill some other void in your life, for better value. Of course, that's because we know exactly when the price point is good enough value for us to buy. In fact, I bet making millions on the stock market would be so easy because we know to pass on terrible values when we see them, knowing the future and all.
Yeah cuz buying a TV is so similar to drafting a QB. But if you insist on that analogy, you don't wait on buying a TV to save money. You wait until better technology comes out and get a better one for the same money.

Or, you could let someone talk you into paying full price for a dated unit, then end up paying full price again in 2 years because the one you bought initially no longer works.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Yeah cuz buying a TV is so similar to drafting a QB. But if you insist on that analogy, you don't wait on buying a TV to save money. You wait until better technology comes out and get a better one for the same money.

Or, you could let someone talk you into paying full price for a dated unit, then end up paying full price again in 2 years because the one you bought initially no longer works.
Maybe you make a lot more money than most people, but a lot of people wait for prices to drop before they buy things. Or wait for movies to come out on DVD before they see it, to get "better value". An analogy is just that, an analogy. The two things don't have to be similar. Buying a TV and renting movies and buying houses not similar, but the analogy works just the same.

Using the same analogy, if your basement is flooding because your sump pump is dead, do you wait until next week when Home Depot MAYBE have it on sale to buy it, or do you run out and pay whatever you gotta pay to get a new sump pump? (This actually happened to me last month).

The point you keep choosing to miss is that, if you need something badly, you can't wait for the value to be just right. You pay premium for it and don't look back.

[X-Era]

Barkley is in the mix at 8. Not because he's necessarily worthy but because:



He's in the top 3 of the QB's available (Smith and Wilson are the other 2 IMO)
The top 3 rank between mid to late 1
All three could go way higher due to the need at the position

[OpIv37]

Maybe you make a lot more money than most people, but a lot of people wait for prices to drop before they buy things. Or wait for movies to come out on DVD before they see it, to get "better value". An analogy is just that, an analogy. The two things don't have to be similar. Buying a TV and renting movies and buying houses not similar, but the analogy works just the same.

Using the same analogy, if your basement is flooding because your sump pump is dead, do you wait until next week when Home Depot MAYBE have it on sale to buy it, or do you run out and pay whatever you gotta pay to get a new sump pump? (This actually happened to me last month).

The point you keep choosing to miss is that, if you need something badly, you can't wait for the value to be just right. You pay premium for it and don't look back.

Maybe you don't live in 2013, but in 2013, there are new TV's out all the time and the prices on the stuff that came out previously have already dropped. So, if saving money is your goal, there is no need to wait. The only reason to wait is to get the new stuff.

As far as the sump pump analogy, it's incomplete. Yeah, the sump pump is leaking but so is the roof and you have four broken windows and the toilets don't flush.

You only have $400 and the only sump pump the store has left costs $399 and is the least reliable brand they sell.

Meanwhile, there are plenty of toilets and windows to choose from, and their best brands are on sale.

So, do you use the money to fix the toilets and windows, or risk spending all your money on an unreliable sump pump that is probably going to be broken again by the time you get another $400 to fix the toilets and windows?

The point you are missing is that we have more than one need, and we are not going to fix them all because we don't have the resources. So, you have to prioritize needs and try to get the best value with the resources that you have. Overpaying for one need while neglecting the other needs is much worse than neglecting the needs where you have the worst value.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I give up. Debating with you is neverending. You always have to have the last words. It's exhausting man.

So we'll just have to agree to disagree.

[mjt328]

I don't disagree. In fact i said somwthing similar in a different thread. Here's the problem: we don't know the answer to that. No one does, and no one will until he's been aging for two years or so.

So, who's most likely to give us the most value at 8? Given Barkley's injury and regression, it ain't him.


"Value" drafting gives you an A grade on the ESPN talkshows and in the magazines. But at the end of the day, it's all about drafting the best players and building the best team. And until we fix the quarterback position, the other 21 starting spots don't mean crap.

Most people felt the Bills did great in the 2011 and 2012 drafts. Why? Because they got great "value" for their picks.

But would the Bills have been better off taking Marcel Dareus (great perceived value) or JJ Watt/Aldon Smith (both would have been considered a HUGE reaches at that point)? What if they grabbed Andy Dalton or Colin Kaepernick with the #3 overall pick? Personally, I would trade Dareus in a heartbeat for either of them right now. How about Russell Wilson? Would you trade Seattle Stephon Gilmore for him? I sure would.


I understand the theory behind waiting until the second round. I really like Barkley and there is a small chance he drops that far. Personally, I also really like EJ Manuel and think he may be available in Round 2. But the Bills can no longer afford to sit on their hands waiting for the right QB to just fall in their lap. It will never happen.

[OpIv37]

I give up. Debating with you is neverending. You always have to have the last words. It's exhausting man.

So we'll just have to agree to disagree.

It's exhausting to hear some of you advocate the same strategy that got us JP Losman. It's exhausting to hear you advocate such a risky draft strategy when poor draft choices are a major reason for 12 years of constant disappointment.

[better days]

The point you are missing is that we have more than one need, and we are not going to fix them all because we don't have the resources. So, you have to prioritize needs and try to get the best value with the resources that you have. Overpaying for one need while neglecting the other needs is much worse than neglecting the needs where you have the worst value.

Well, you have the right idea, but you do not know how to prioritize. Having Fitz at QB is the equivalent of having a crater size hole in your roof. That needs to be fixed before the windows & toilet. I can cover the windows with cheap plywood & make a cheap repair on the toilet rather than buy a new one. The roof is the priority as is the QB.

[OpIv37]

Well, you have the right idea, but you do not know how to prioritize. Having Fitz at QB is the equivalent of having a crater size hole in your roof. That needs to be fixed before the windows & toilet. I can cover the windows with cheap plywood & make a cheap repair on the toilet rather than buy a new one. The roof is the priority as is the QB.
And you will be buying a new roof again in two years because you're getting the lowest possible quality of repair.

[mjt328]

It's exhausting to hear some of you advocate the same strategy that got us JP Losman. It's exhausting to hear you advocate such a risky draft strategy when poor draft choices are a major reason for 12 years of constant disappointment.

The problem is not in the strategy. It's as you said... in the poor draft choices.

Losman was a bad pick. But not because of when he was drafted, or because we traded up to get him.
He was a bad pick because he sucked.

It's never a bad idea to address the most important position in the field. Especially with the new rookie salary cap - taking one early no longer costs $10 million per year and sets the team back 3-4 years.
The Panthers rolled the dice with Jimmy Clausen. When he didn't work after a season, they moved on. Now they should have Newton for 10+ years to build the franchise around.

[Jaybird]

NO chance he turns out ot be a good nfk QB... He is Matt Leinhart round 2

[Mr. Miyagi]

It's exhausting to hear some of you advocate the same strategy that got us JP Losman. It's exhausting to hear you advocate such a risky draft strategy when poor draft choices are a major reason for 12 years of constant disappointment.
I have a feeling that youre really good at criticizing what is wrong and never offers anything constructive.

We went with BPA with Spiller and you *****ed and moaned about that too.

Can't ever win with you.

[sdbillsfan2]

I see nothing wrong with stats like this. Better then 2 to 1 td to int. rate in a "down" year ? Yeah that sucks ....not ! This kid plays for the love of the game. He's bright and isn't looking for camera time.
Statistics
<tbody>
Passing

Rushing


Year
Comp
Att
Yards
Pct.
TDs
Int
Rating

Att
Yds
Avg
TD


2009 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_USC_Trojans_football_team)
211
352
2735
59.9
15
14
131.3

45
-38
-0.8
2


2010 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_USC_Trojans_football_team)
236
377
2791
62.6
26
12
141.2

34
-17
-0.5
2


2011 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_USC_Trojans_football_team)
308
446
3528
69.1
39
7
161.2

28
14
0.5
2


2012 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_USC_Trojans_football_team)
246
387
3273
63.6
36

15
157.6


25
-72
-2.9
0

</tbody>

[Joe Fo Sho]

Well, I would rather they draft the BEST QB myself. I don't care if they don't draft the best WR or LB, I want the BEST QB in this draft.

You'd rather have Tim Tebow or Jimmy Clausen than Suh or Spiller or Pierre Paul? Good luck with that strategy.

[JoeMama]

I want nothing to do with Matt Barkley but not because of perceived value.

Ultimately any QB that pans out is worth the risk.

We should know that better than anyone given the dearth of talent at QB for the past 13 years.

[HAMMER]

I have a feeling that youre really good at criticizing what is wrong and never offers anything constructive.

We went with BPA with Spiller and you *****ed and moaned about that too.

Can't ever win with you.

Op is NEVER wrong, he is smarter than everyone else, I thought you would be used to it by now.

[YardRat]

Once upon a time Dick Jauron was convinced that Aaron Maybin was going to be 'the answer' for Buffalo on defense, and despite a minimal resume and lackluster performance at the combine still pulled the trigger on him at #11. If he would have played the smart game, and taken a more likely 'sure thing' (Orakpo) and been patient enough to see if Maybin dropped into the second the team would have been much better off.

If Nix thinks the 'real' GOOD QB's coming into this draft are actually somebody like Matt Scott from Arizona or Brad Sorenson from Southern Utah, would any of you be happy that he pulled the trigger on 'his guy' at #8 instead of waiting at least a round or two?

[Novacane]

Just stop with the value crap.

Will Matt Barkley solve our problems at quarterback? Yes or no.

If the answer is yes, you pull the trigger. PERIOD. END OF STORY. CLOSE THE BOOK AND RETURN TO THE LIBRARY.



Agree! I am so sick of all the experts on this board talking about what is value and what it not! No one knows who got good value with their picks for a couple years

[Jeff1220]

I didn't even own an HD flat panel (LCD) until a little over a year ago. It's never that important for me to have the newest technology now. I wait and if it's something I want, I get it after the initial craze-related price surge goes down. I guess I'm kinda like the Bills in that way.

[X-Era]

"Value" drafting gives you an A grade on the ESPN talkshows and in the magazines. But at the end of the day, it's all about drafting the best players and building the best team. And until we fix the quarterback position, the other 21 starting spots don't mean crap.

Most people felt the Bills did great in the 2011 and 2012 drafts. Why? Because they got great "value" for their picks.

But would the Bills have been better off taking Marcel Dareus (great perceived value) or JJ Watt/Aldon Smith (both would have been considered a HUGE reaches at that point)? What if they grabbed Andy Dalton or Colin Kaepernick with the #3 overall pick? Personally, I would trade Dareus in a heartbeat for either of them right now. How about Russell Wilson? Would you trade Seattle Stephon Gilmore for him? I sure would.


I understand the theory behind waiting until the second round. I really like Barkley and there is a small chance he drops that far. Personally, I also really like EJ Manuel and think he may be available in Round 2. But the Bills can no longer afford to sit on their hands waiting for the right QB to just fall in their lap. It will never happen.I think the top 3 guys are all worth about the same. A mid to late 1 ranking. But I cannot fault the Bills for taking one at 8 due to the need at the position and difficulty in finding one.

Nix himself has already made the statement that you may need to get one a round earlier to get one due to the need by so many teams.

In the end the ranks are great but the final draft positions are determined by the teams, not the experts. And almost every year QB's are drafted higher than their ranking. That's just the reality. And personally, I'm OK with it.

I rationalize it like this... If we draft a QB 20 picks too early and we get a guy who can lead us to the playoffs who the hell cares. The whole point of the draft is to fill needs and get better. And there is no more important position for the Bills to get better at than QB.

All that said, I'm still leery on the whole class but recognize that guys like Dalton, Kaep, Wilson, and Ponder all had issues that kept them from being high 1st round picks and all are playoff QB's. It could simply be that they are over analyzed. That we look too hard for flaws and then overstate perceived issues. A few of these guys could end up being playoff QB's and that's what the Bills really need.

Yes, I'd be fine with waiting and taking another position at 8 but I'm also fine with taking a QB at 8 even if it's a guy ranked in the mid to late 1st.

[Captain Obvious]

Will Matt Barkley solve our problems at quarterback? Yes or no.



As expected OpiV never gave a yes or no answer to your question

[OpIv37]

The problem is not in the strategy. It's as you said... in the poor draft choices.

Losman was a bad pick. But not because of when he was drafted, or because we traded up to get him.
He was a bad pick because he sucked.

It's never a bad idea to address the most important position in the field. Especially with the new rookie salary cap - taking one early no longer costs $10 million per year and sets the team back 3-4 years.
The Panthers rolled the dice with Jimmy Clausen. When he didn't work after a season, they moved on. Now they should have Newton for 10+ years to build the franchise around.
Yet, they still suck. Why? Partially because they have holes that went unfilled when they wasted a pick on Claussen.

[OpIv37]

As expected OpiV never gave a yes or no answer to your question

I've had it with your passive aggressive nonsense. You never address me directly and you never post anything except shots at me. You don't have the balls to offer up your own opinion.

And for the record, I've been more than clear about the fact that I don't think Barkley is the answer.

[OpIv37]

I have a feeling that youre really good at criticizing what is wrong and never offers anything constructive.

We went with BPA with Spiller and you *****ed and moaned about that too.

Can't ever win with you.

When we drafted Spiller, we had two good RB's on the roster and lots of other holes. And Spiller was pretty average for two years. Lynch should have been traded before the draft. That whole situation was botched, but yet you still seem to think its me *****ing just to *****.

For the record, I said, and have long said, that it should be BPA with SOME deference given to need. Need wasn't considered in the Lynch situation.

[Bert102176]

Well, I would rather they draft the BEST QB myself. I don't care if they don't draft the best WR or LB, I want the BEST QB in this draft.

Ryan Leaf was suppose to of been one ofe the best in his draft class how did that turn out. Just cause they maybe ranked high you don't really know till they are on the field on sundays.

[Bert102176]

Every draft pick is a crap shoot in you don't know what your gonna get

[coastal]

Matt Barkley IS an upgrade over Fitz and would stabilize the QB position.

I'd welcome his addition in round 2.

[tampabay25690]

Matt Barkley IS an upgrade over Fitz and would stabilize the QB position.

I'd welcome his addition in round 2.

If we draft Barkely it will be with the #8 pick.

[better days]

Every draft pick is a crap shoot in you don't know what your gonna get

Agreed. But I will trust the judgement of Nix & his scouts over my own or anyone else on this board to pick the QB.

[OpIv37]

Agreed. But I will trust the judgement of Nix & his scouts over my own or anyone else on this board to pick the QB.

Yeah, so far Nix's judgment has gotten us less wins than Jauron and the #8 overall draft pick. Performance dictates confidence, not title. And so far, Nix doesn't have the performance.

And just in case you haven't been paying attention, there have been literally dozens of times when people on this board have been right and the people running this team have been dead wrong.

[better days]

Yeah, so far Nix's judgment has gotten us less wins than Jauron and the #8 overall draft pick. Performance dictates confidence, not title. And so far, Nix doesn't have the performance.

And just in case you haven't been paying attention, there have been literally dozens of times when people on this board have been right and the people running this team have been dead wrong.

Well, it can not be disputed there is MUCH more talent on this team than there was when Nix was hired. That is all he does, get players on the team. He does not coach the players or install the system to be played.

[OpIv37]

Except that the measure isn't more talent than the crappy team he inherited. The measure is enough talent to win, and so far we don't have that.

And don't forget who picked the last coach.....

[Thief]

I know I am supposed to "attack the post" but seriously, this Opiv37 dude sounds stupid in every single one so I don't know where to start, lol.

[better days]

Except that the measure isn't more talent than the crappy team he inherited. The measure is enough talent to win, and so far we don't have that.

And don't forget who picked the last coach.....

The Bills were so terrible when Nix was hired, it required a total rebuild. That takes TIME. The talent is now there to win with the exception of QB, that is the reason the Bills NEED a GOOD QB in this draft.

And yes Nix hired Gailey, but he did not have a big pool to choose from for HC. NOBODY was beating down the door to Coach the Bills when Nix was hired. And I think the failure was not Gailey coaching the offense, the failure was the DCs Gailey hired for defense.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I know I am supposed to "attack the post" but seriously, this Opiv37 dude sounds stupid in every single one so I don't know where to start, lol.
No one is more frustrated about Op that I am, maybe except for his wife Dora, but he's far from stupid. Stubborn and misinformed, yes. Not stupid.

Yes and you should attack the post and not the poster. Considered yourself verbally warned.

:miyagi:

[OpIv37]

The Bills were so terrible when Nix was hired, it required a total rebuild. That takes TIME. The talent is now there to win with the exception of QB, that is the reason the Bills NEED a GOOD QB in this draft.

And yes Nix hired Gailey, but he did not have a big pool to choose from for HC. NOBODY was beating down the door to Coach the Bills when Nix was hired. And I think the failure was not Gailey coaching the offense, the failure was the DCs Gailey hired for defense.
Uh, did you see the way the D played this past season? We need FAR mor than a QB. Nix has concentrated on the D for the last 3 years and the back 7 is still a disaster outside of Byrd (if we can keep him) and maybe Gilmore.

[k-oneputt]

Yeah the D sucked too, but imo, coaching and scheme were the biggest problems.

[better days]

Uh, did you see the way the D played this past season? We need FAR mor than a QB. Nix has concentrated on the D for the last 3 years and the back 7 is still a disaster outside of Byrd (if we can keep him) and maybe Gilmore.

No Question the defense was TERRIBLE last year & that is the reason Gailey was fired. As k-oneput said, I think Coaching & Scheme were much more responsible for that than the players. McKelvin played pretty good last year, he needs to be resigned & Williams may prove to be a good safety.

[coastal]

If we draft Barkely it will be with the #8 pick.
I'm ok with that, and most Bills fans would be once the selection was made.

The other thing that would have to happen here for me to truly be comfortable with selecting him there is for us to trade back up into the first to get either Ertz or Eifert.

[better days]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/72995/report-matt-barkley-met-with-bills-jets

The quarterback-needy teams in the AFC East both have their eye on USC prospect Matt Barkley (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/29232/matt-barkley). According to Peter King of Sports Illustrated (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130225/nfl-combine-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Lv48MklB), Barkley met with nine teams at the NFL combine -- and the New York Jets (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/nyj/new-york-jets) and Buffalo Bills (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/buf/buffalo-bills) were in that group.


I just read, the Bills met with Tyler Wilson TWICE.

[coastal]

I just read, the Bills met with Tyler Wilson TWICE.
Nix is the worst poker player in the world... everyone KNOWS that he's the pick if he's there at 8.

[OpIv37]

Yeah the D sucked too, but imo, coaching and scheme were the biggest problems.

To some degree. But we have no NFL quality LB's with the possible exception of Bradham. And S is a mess after Byrd unless Searcy comes through or Williams can be moved back. And CB is a mess after Gilmore. So there is still apt of work to be done in regards to talent.

[coastal]

To some degree. But we have no NFL quality LB's with the possible exception of Bradham. And S is a mess after Byrd unless Searcy comes through or Williams can be moved back. And CB is a mess after Gilmore. So there is still apt of work to be done in regards to talent.
Buddy Nix has put his stamp on this team!

[mjt328]

Well, it can not be disputed there is MUCH more talent on this team than there was when Nix was hired. That is all he does, get players on the team. He does not coach the players or install the system to be played.

Actually, that can be disputed.

Most of the Bills best players: Fred Jackson, Stevie Johnson, Eric Wood, Andy Levitre, Kyle Williams and Jairus Byrd were already on the team when he got here.

Sure he added CJ Spiller, but in the process he got rid of Marshawn Lynch.
Marcel Dareus was supposed to be a slam dunk star, but he was average last year and is quickly becoming a big disappointment.
Our 2010 and 2011 drafts are quickly becoming total busts (Levy-Jauron level). And even though it's early, nobody really stood out from the 2012 draft class.

Three years and our QB sitution is just as bad as the day he came. Same for our wide receivers.
Our offensive line is significantly better, but our linebacker and cornerback situation is worse.


This perfectly proves the point I was making earlier in this thread. People think Buddy has done a good job, because ESPN experts tell us that he gets "good value" from his drafts.
But at the end of the day, the players he is selecting are NOT performing and he's leaving better players on the board.

[Bill Cody]

Matt Barkley IS an upgrade over Fitz and would stabilize the QB position.

I'd welcome his addition in round 2.


I think Barkley goes in the 1st round, maybe to the Jets. How funny would that be? 2 overhyped, over rated USC QB's on the same roster, replace one drama with another lol

[Mr. Miyagi]

I think at the end, Barkley will turn out to be a decent QB.

[Bill Cody]

I think at the end, Barkley will turn out to be a decent QB.

Do decent QB's win Super Bowls anymore?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Do decent QB's win Super Bowls anymore?
It's just a general statement. I wouldn't be super angry if we took him, because I think he could be pretty decent.

Not a direct comparison, but Eli Manning isn't that take-charge huge arm super elite QB either. I think Barkley is going down that path instead.

[OpIv37]

Do decent QB's win Super Bowls anymore?

And here we have the root of the problem. I will be surprised if any of the QB's in this draft ever win a SB. We are talking about using the #8 pick on a guy who may be jus barely good enough to be a "franchise QB." Buffalo's need for a franchise QB doesn't automatically put one in this draft.

[better days]

Actually, that can be disputed.

Most of the Bills best players: Fred Jackson, Stevie Johnson, Eric Wood, Andy Levitre, Kyle Williams and Jairus Byrd were already on the team when he got here.

Sure he added CJ Spiller, but in the process he got rid of Marshawn Lynch.
Marcel Dareus was supposed to be a slam dunk star, but he was average last year and is quickly becoming a big disappointment.
Our 2010 and 2011 drafts are quickly becoming total busts (Levy-Jauron level). And even though it's early, nobody really stood out from the 2012 draft class.

Three years and our QB sitution is just as bad as the day he came. Same for our wide receivers.
Our offensive line is significantly better, but our linebacker and cornerback situation is worse.


This perfectly proves the point I was making earlier in this thread. People think Buddy has done a good job, because ESPN experts tell us that he gets "good value" from his drafts.
But at the end of the day, the players he is selecting are NOT performing and he's leaving better players on the board.

NO, it can not be disputed there is much more talent now than when Nix was hired. Nix added talent to the players you named, hence MORE talent.

[Bill Cody]

It's just a general statement. I wouldn't be super angry if we took him, because I think he could be pretty decent.

Not a direct comparison, but Eli Manning isn't that take-charge huge arm super elite QB either. I think Barkley is going down that path instead.

Hmmm...maybe but I'm skeptical. Even Barkley admits he's not been as good a leader as he should be. That's Eli's biggest strength. Eli can look very average at times but he has the heart of a lion when it matters. Not so sure that applies to Barkley. They had a fight in the locker after the bowl game with GTech- guys felt Barkley should have been playing. Should he have? Don't know.

[mjt328]

NO, it can not be disputed there is much more talent now than when Nix was hired. Nix added talent to the players you named, hence MORE talent.

Your exact quote was MUCH more talent.
It's marginal at best. Let's compare.

Fitz and FJax were already here. CJ Spiller and Lynch are a wash. Lee Evans and TO were better than any of the crap receivers Nix has brought in.
We are better at tight end and offensive tackle, but it's very likely that we lose Levitre this year. So the interior of our line will be worse.
Schobel was at least as good as Mario played last year. KW and Kelsay were here already. So far, Dareus has not been much better than Stroud.
Poz, Mitchell and Ellison are much better than the crap we currently have at linebacker.
McKelvin and Byrd were already here. Gilmore has the potential to be our best corner, but AWilliams is terrible - much worse than Terrence McGee or Drayton Florence. We don't have a starting free safety now.

To summarize:
Better with Nix - TE, OT, DL
Worse with Nix - WR, LB, S, soon to be OG

[better days]

Your exact quote was MUCH more talent.
It's marginal at best. Let's compare.

Fitz and FJax were already here. CJ Spiller and Lynch are a wash. Lee Evans and TO were better than any of the crap receivers Nix has brought in.
We are better at tight end and offensive tackle, but it's very likely that we lose Levitre this year. So the interior of our line will be worse.
Schobel was at least as good as Mario played last year. KW and Kelsay were here already. So far, Dareus has not been much better than Stroud.
Poz, Mitchell and Ellison are much better than the crap we currently have at linebacker.
McKelvin and Byrd were already here. Gilmore has the potential to be our best corner, but AWilliams is terrible - much worse than Terrence McGee or Drayton Florence. We don't have a starting free safety now.

To summarize:
Better with Nix - TE, OT, DL
Worse with Nix - WR, LB, S, soon to be OG


You can't judge players, especially YOUNG players based on one year with bad Coaching at that.

Williams may well prove to be a GOOD safety. Byrd will be a Bill next year one way or another.

If McKelvin is a Bill next year which I think he will be, Nix will be responsible for that. Just as he will be responsible for Byrd being a Bill next year. Just as he is responsible for Stevie still being a Bill.

You have no idea if Levitre will be a Bill or not next year. If not, I expect Nix to fill that void.

Schobel in his prime may be as good as Mario was last year, lets see how he plays under Pettine.

[OpIv37]

You can't judge players, especially YOUNG players based on one year with bad Coaching at that.

Williams may well prove to be a GOOD safety. Byrd will be a Bill next year one way or another.

If McKelvin is a Bill next year which I think he will be, Nix will be responsible for that. Just as he will be responsible for Byrd being a Bill next year. Just as he is responsible for Stevie still being a Bill.

You have no idea if Levitre will be a Bill or not next year. If not, I expect Nix to fill that void.

Schobel in his prime may be as good as Mario was last year, lets see how he plays under Pettine.

There is nothing here but conjecture. Conjecture that the rookies will improve, that Mario will be better under Pettine, that Williams will be better at S, that Byrd will stay, that Levitre will be kept or replaced, that McKelvin will stay.

Try evaluating Nix on what he's actually done instead of what you expect to happen. Maybe then you'll see that he's not all that great.

Maybe not, though. You've already blamed the problems on a fired coach, and when it was pointed out that Nix hired that coach, you blamed it on a lack of available options.

So, it's pretty hard to evaluate Nix objectively when nothing is ever his fault and you give him credit for doing things that haven't happened.

[better days]

There is nothing here but conjecture. Conjecture that the rookies will improve, that Mario will be better under Pettine, that Williams will be better at S, that Byrd will stay, that Levitre will be kept or replaced, that McKelvin will stay.

Try evaluating Nix on what he's actually done instead of what you expect to happen. Maybe then you'll see that he's not all that great.

Maybe not, though. You've already blamed the problems on a fired coach, and when it was pointed out that Nix hired that coach, you blamed it on a lack of available options.

So, it's pretty hard to evaluate Nix objectively when nothing is ever his fault and you give him credit for doing things that haven't happened.

Well, I just heard Rich Gannon on Sirius today say the same thing about evaluating young players.

I am not blaming ALL the problems on Chan. I blame most of them on Jauron, he left the cupboard bare. Nix had a lot of shopping to do to fill it back up.

The Bills needed a complete overall when Nix was hired. That takes time as Nix said it would when he was hired. If the Bills were a car, Nix put in a new motor & transmission, did all the mechanical work. He fixed the body as well. Now it just needs a new paint job, new upholstery, & new tires.

[X-Era]

There is nothing here but conjecture. Conjecture that the rookies will improve, that Mario will be better under Pettine, that Williams will be better at S, that Byrd will stay, that Levitre will be kept or replaced, that McKelvin will stay.

Try evaluating Nix on what he's actually done instead of what you expect to happen. Maybe then you'll see that he's not all that great.

Maybe not, though. You've already blamed the problems on a fired coach, and when it was pointed out that Nix hired that coach, you blamed it on a lack of available options.

So, it's pretty hard to evaluate Nix objectively when nothing is ever his fault and you give him credit for doing things that haven't happened.
Personally, I'm happy with Nix overall.

But the Fitz re-signing was a bad move and that's on Nix. There was no way he proved enough that first year starting to deserve that money. For me to still back him he must release Fitz. If we see Fitz starting a single game next year I will want Nix gone.

[better days]

Personally, I'm happy with Nix overall.

But the Fitz re-signing was a bad move and that's on Nix. There was no way he proved enough that first year starting to deserve that money. For me to still back him he must release Fitz. If we see Fitz starting a single game next year I will want Nix gone.

I agree, I want Fitz gone. I think it is clear, Nix is on his way out. I just hope Whaley does as well as Nix did.

[mjt328]

There is nothing here but conjecture. Conjecture that the rookies will improve, that Mario will be better under Pettine, that Williams will be better at S, that Byrd will stay, that Levitre will be kept or replaced, that McKelvin will stay.

Try evaluating Nix on what he's actually done instead of what you expect to happen. Maybe then you'll see that he's not all that great.

Maybe not, though. You've already blamed the problems on a fired coach, and when it was pointed out that Nix hired that coach, you blamed it on a lack of available options.

So, it's pretty hard to evaluate Nix objectively when nothing is ever his fault and you give him credit for doing things that haven't happened.

I was disagreeing with you earlier in this thread, but this is spot on.

If you can't evaluate a young player as a bust, then you certainly can't just assume he's going to be good either.

The book hasn't closed on the Nix drafts by any means, but the early returns aren't very promising. I've got high hopes that Dareus flips the switch on next season, but it's hard not to notice several guys drafted after him already becoming NFL superstars - Green, Watt and Smith for instance.

[better days]

I was disagreeing with you earlier in this thread, but this is spot on.

If you can't evaluate a young player as a bust, then you certainly can't just assume he's going to be good either.

The book hasn't closed on the Nix drafts by any means, but the early returns aren't very promising. I've got high hopes that Dareus flips the switch on next season, but it's hard not to notice several guys drafted after him already becoming NFL superstars - Green, Watt and Smith for instance.

Well, after a great Rookie year, Cam Newton regressed last year as well. It happens. I don't think a draft should be judged until about 4 years down the road.

[X-Era]

I was disagreeing with you earlier in this thread, but this is spot on.

If you can't evaluate a young player as a bust, then you certainly can't just assume he's going to be good either.

The book hasn't closed on the Nix drafts by any means, but the early returns aren't very promising. I've got high hopes that Dareus flips the switch on next season, but it's hard not to notice several guys drafted after him already becoming NFL superstars - Green, Watt and Smith for instance.
No it isn't.

Claiming the rookies will not improve or will get worse is also conjecture.

And saying that our drafts aren't promising is ridiculous. Spiller is one of the most dynamic backs in the league. Dareus is far from a flop and Gilmore played very well down the stretch. Add in players like Hairston, Glenn, Bradham, Rogers, Brooks, Carrington who is finally coming on, and UFA's like David Nelson... He's done a nice job.

He's re-signed our own, had decent drafts, made the biggest signing in Bills history, signed guys who started for us and were at least solid like Pears, Barnett, Florence, and Chandler.

Really his big mistake is Fitz. He has a chance to fix that. Let's see if he does.

The bigger question is what does this have to do with the title of this thread at this point?

[better days]

No it isn't.

Claiming the rookies will not improve or will get worse is also conjecture.

And saying that our drafts aren't promising is ridiculous. Spiller is one of the most dynamic backs in the league. Dareus is far from a flop and Gilmore played very well down the stretch. Add in players like Hairston, Glenn, Bradham, Rogers, Brooks, Carrington who is finally coming on, and UFA's like David Nelson... He's done a nice job.

He's re-signed our own, had decent drafts, made the biggest signing in Bills history, signed guys who started for us and were at least solid like Pears, Barnett, Florence, and Chandler.

Really his big mistake is Fitz. He has a chance to fix that. Let's see if he does.

The bigger question is what does this have to do with the title of this thread at this point?

It looks like MANY on this board do not want Nix to fix the QB position this year. They would rather draft a scrub in rnd 2 or lower & hope to get a QB next year when they think the class will be better.

IMO, NOBODY knows how good the next class will be next year or if the Bills will have as good a chance next year to draft a GOOD QB as they do this year. This QB class may suck, but if the Bills can draft the one GOOD QB in it, that is all that is needed. And Nix has said he thinks 2 or 3 QBs have that potential...................out of 6 to 8 that will be drafted in this draft.

If no QB is drafted before #8 the Bills will have their pick of every QB in the draft. I would bet that won't be the case next year.

[TacklingDummy]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/72995/report-matt-barkley-met-with-bills-jets

The quarterback-needy teams in the AFC East both have their eye on USC prospect Matt Barkley (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/29232/matt-barkley). According to Peter King of Sports Illustrated (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130225/nfl-combine-peter-king-monday-morning-quarterback/#ixzz2Lv48MklB), Barkley met with nine teams at the NFL combine -- and the New York Jets (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/nyj/new-york-jets) and Buffalo Bills (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/buf/buffalo-bills) were in that group.


It's real simple.
If the Bills draft Matt Barkley and he turns out to be like Mark Sanchez drafting him at 8 would turn out to just like most any other Bills high draft pick.
If Barkley turns out the a franchise QB than the Bills fortunes will change for the better.

No one knows.

[The Jokeman]

It's just a general statement. I wouldn't be super angry if we took him, because I think he could be pretty decent.

Not a direct comparison, but Eli Manning isn't that take-charge huge arm super elite QB either. I think Barkley is going down that path instead.

What Eli is clutch in the 4th quarter, he's the classic game manager type QB but better than average and can lead the team to a drive when needed when the game on the line. Brady is like that, when his D was better, and so was Montana yet what do they all have in common? They had great talent around them and right now the only great talent I look at on the Bills roster is Spiller and Dareus. Although I did like what I saw of Gilmore and feel that guys like Wood, Levitre, Stevie Johnson, Byrd and Kyle Williams are above average. Freddie might be included in that if he can learn to stop fumbling again.