What traits do you look for in a prospect?

[mjt328]

With all the draft threads, it's hard not to notice that everybody seems to disagree on the best prospects available.

The opinions on Matt Barkley are all over the place. Some think he should be the pick at #8. Others think we should avoid him altogether. Some think we should wait for Ryan Nassib in the second. Other like Tyler Wilson as the best prospect in the draft.

It got me curious... What traits do you personally look for in a draft prospect (quarterback or otherwise)?

Are you that stat guy who can rattle off how many yards, touchdowns and turnovers a guy has? Do you prefer to scan You Tube for bits of game film? Are you that fan glued to the Combine to watch cone drills? If you were to draft a prospect personally, would you go by his upside - or do you look strictly at production in college? How much do you weight attributes like leadership, games won in college, intelligence, character, etc.


Personally, I'm a big believer in drafting the safe prospects with consistent past production. I cringe at words like potential and upside. I can't stand the Combine and think it's a massive waste of time. If a guy hasn't done it on film, I'm extremely skeptical that he can develop in the pros. I'm also not a fan of one-year wonders. If I was an NFL GM, I would have snatched up Brian Orakpo in a second and wouldn't have touched Aaron Maybin until the 3rd round. But I'm also the type of guy who would have passed on someone like Cam Newton.

How about you guys?

[Buckets]

I like players who don't act like it's their first time when they actually do whats expected of them, IE crazy celebrations over making a tackle or catahing a pass. Come-on guys it's what you're f'n paid outrageous money to do.

[Jeff1220]

I don't watch enough college football consistently to have a really strong opinion on anyone, so I take that into account when I start looking into the names and positions that teams (and especially the Bills) will be looking at. I too don't like one year wonders. No matter what my stance is prior to the draft, I can talk myself into wait and see mode with any pick since the whole thing is just a crapshoot anyway.

[YardRat]

Depends on the position.

Generally speaking, though, I think it's possible to spot some of the immeasurables just by watching their stature, body language, how they carry themselves, etc while actually playing the game. Sometimes guys are just flat-out footballers, regardless of what the stats and combine results say.

[TigerJ]

Perfection is the best trait. I find that looking for someone who has it is very frustrating though.

[TigerJ]

For a more serious post, it really varies. What role do you want hime to play, starter or fillin reserve. What's your budget for signing him. Are you drafting, and in what round? Are you looking to sign a veteran free agent, an undrafted rookie free agent? You're going to demand more in the way of credentials if you're drafting in a higher round, paying a higher salary, or looking for a starter instead of a reserve.

Say I'm drafting high in the first round. I want great measurables. I want an attitude that isn't satisfied with anything excellence less than. And I want somone who got the very best production that his college circumstances would allow. If it's a quarterback who had an outstanding offensive line and great skill players around him, he'd better have close to a 70% completion average, 3000+ yards passing and clost to a 3/1 touchdown to interception ratio. Later on in the draft, you're just not going to find all of that in the same package, so you start looking for some of it. Maybe you've got a kid with good measurables, who had to deal with coaching changes or maybe there was an attitude issue that you think for some reason might have been corrected or at least is correctable. You look for a kid who may not have the complete package, but he's got something that sets him apart from the other players who are available.

When it comes to veterans, a lot of it is price and role related. If you're signing depth, you're not going to pay as much and you're not going to get as much. I tend to shy away from 30 year old plus veterans unless its for a short term band aid. If the Bills didn't think Chad Rinehart is good enough to take Andy Levitre's spot, and Buffalo didn't want to use a draft pick on a rookie guard, they could sign Brandon Moore and get at least a couple very good years out of him though he's 32, I could do that. I would very much prefer to find younger guys with the potential to develop for my depth players, though even for that, there are exceptions. If I'm starting a rookie QB, I think it's really good to have a grizzled veteran as a backup, because he can be like an extra coach.

[OLDSRIP]

A nice body, smokin hot eyes, long hair doesn't hurt, etc.

those are some of the traits I look for.

[X-Era]

With all the draft threads, it's hard not to notice that everybody seems to disagree on the best prospects available.

The opinions on Matt Barkley are all over the place. Some think he should be the pick at #8. Others think we should avoid him altogether. Some think we should wait for Ryan Nassib in the second. Other like Tyler Wilson as the best prospect in the draft.

It got me curious... What traits do you personally look for in a draft prospect (quarterback or otherwise)?

Are you that stat guy who can rattle off how many yards, touchdowns and turnovers a guy has? Do you prefer to scan You Tube for bits of game film? Are you that fan glued to the Combine to watch cone drills? If you were to draft a prospect personally, would you go by his upside - or do you look strictly at production in college? How much do you weight attributes like leadership, games won in college, intelligence, character, etc.


Personally, I'm a big believer in drafting the safe prospects with consistent past production. I cringe at words like potential and upside. I can't stand the Combine and think it's a massive waste of time. If a guy hasn't done it on film, I'm extremely skeptical that he can develop in the pros. I'm also not a fan of one-year wonders. If I was an NFL GM, I would have snatched up Brian Orakpo in a second and wouldn't have touched Aaron Maybin until the 3rd round. But I'm also the type of guy who would have passed on someone like Cam Newton.

How about you guys?All. I think everything should be considered.

However, I weight things based on what will most influence a players ability to become successful.

But there is no rule.

Many players who can play never do and many who aren't as athletically gifted end up being great players.

I value:

Character. Good people will be good people. And more often than not, trouble makers will be trouble makers.
Attitude. Is the player a whiner and complainer or someone who is driven to do the best job possible for the team.
Work Ethic. Laziness drives me crazy.
Humility but with a driven mentality. It's the opposite of the "I'm more important than the team" ego driven mentality.

and then:

Position specific attributes which may include:
Size
Speed
Intelligence
Toughness
Strength
Stamina
Quickness
Fluidity
Dexterity
Leaping Ability
Vision

I feel different attributes are important to different positions. Speed isn't as important as strength for an OG. Just one example.

I really can't pinpoint one specific attribute but I do feel that the character piece may be a bigger factor in success ultimately than the athleticism and physical abilities.

You always look at all of it.

But I do think we need to be careful to look more closely at what we may find on the internet as far as character goes. Te'o is a great example. His story could be anything from a manipulator and liar to a great kid who just was a victim.

On the field you can tell a lot about a player. You can learn about what type of person they are from how they play.

That's my 2 cents.

- - - Updated - - -


Depends on the position.

Generally speaking, though, I think it's possible to spot some of the immeasurables just by watching their stature, body language, how they carry themselves, etc while actually playing the game. Sometimes guys are just flat-out footballers, regardless of what the stats and combine results say.:clap:

And some guys are loafers and you can see that too.

[YardRat]

A nice body, smokin hot eyes, long hair doesn't hurt, etc.

those are some of the traits I look for.

Stephon Gilmore just called...he's very flattered.

[The Jokeman]

With all the draft threads, it's hard not to notice that everybody seems to disagree on the best prospects available.

The opinions on Matt Barkley are all over the place. Some think he should be the pick at #8. Others think we should avoid him altogether. Some think we should wait for Ryan Nassib in the second. Other like Tyler Wilson as the best prospect in the draft.

It got me curious... What traits do you personally look for in a draft prospect (quarterback or otherwise)?

Are you that stat guy who can rattle off how many yards, touchdowns and turnovers a guy has? Do you prefer to scan You Tube for bits of game film? Are you that fan glued to the Combine to watch cone drills? If you were to draft a prospect personally, would you go by his upside - or do you look strictly at production in college? How much do you weight attributes like leadership, games won in college, intelligence, character, etc.


Personally, I'm a big believer in drafting the safe prospects with consistent past production. I cringe at words like potential and upside. I can't stand the Combine and think it's a massive waste of time. If a guy hasn't done it on film, I'm extremely skeptical that he can develop in the pros. I'm also not a fan of one-year wonders. If I was an NFL GM, I would have snatched up Brian Orakpo in a second and wouldn't have touched Aaron Maybin until the 3rd round. But I'm also the type of guy who would have passed on someone like Cam Newton.

How about you guys?

I read scouting reports and determine if a prospect fits what the Bills need. As all too often I think people see the Bills a LB and immediately bring up OLB rankings and say this guy is the best OLB we should take him. Yet sometimes that OLB prospect is a better in a 4-3 vs a 3-4. Being the Bills are talking about running more hybrid fronts etc then I focus more on guys that can play OLB and/or DE. More and more draft sites are now seperating prospects where in years past they didn't so you really needed to do reading.

I also admit I prefer bigger guys and/or more athletic. Case in point I like EJ Manuel more than Ryan Nassib although as stated in a previous post the more I think of it the less I think I should as in the history of the NFL it seems that drop back passers have more success than athletic guys. Also I rarely look at character to determine if I should take a guy or not. Sure there's risk in taking a guy Alec Ogletree compared to Manti Te'o but I take the rate the better athletic prospect almost every time. Unless the guy has serious red flags like being expelled from his team or chronic drug use etc. I'm also more than willing to reach at key positions like left OT which to me is the most important positon on the field following by pass rush and a strong CB. I also believe franchise QBs are made not born. In that they usually have great talent around them which leads to their success early and as they age they become great ones. I posted a thread last year entitled, What comes first the Franchise QB or the Egg that a lot of people enjoyed and stand by it.

Case in point, if I were Buddy Nix right now I wouldn't be hell bent on signing Leodis McKelvin. As to me the guy has some serious liabilities as a CB which makes him a depth guy and to me depth guys are just guys they don't have to be above average just mearly average. I know he's a great return man but as posted endless times this offseason I think a guy like Cordalle Patterson can me drafted at pick 8 and immediatly replace McKelvin as our return specialist and also help fill some of our concerns at WR as right now we have Stevie Johnson (a #1), TJ Graham (a #3) and Brad Smith (a #4 or #5). I don't think he'd be a great #2 as a rookie and why also propose we sign a free agent like Brandon Gibson to fill that role over the next two years and let Patterson refine his skills and be a breakout WR in his third year like most WRs do. That said I could also see the Bills take a guy like Dion Jordan with pick 8 as he gives us a LB/DE that could do some serious damage as a Will LB and/or right DE and allow Mario Williams play on his favored left side. That all said if Geno Smith does fall to us I would make him the pick as everyone comments he's no Andrew Luck or RGIII so what? Everyone marvels that he doesn't make dumb decision, he's shown that he can be pin point accurate in college and grades well in pocket prescense etc. All of which is what I deem is needed to excel as an NFL QB and he is an athlete as evident by his combine performance. That said think it's vital that we land a true #2 WR in free agency and shore up at least one of LB spots too otherwise think any QB, reguardless where we draft him, will be a failure as again to me surrounding cast is important.

[ServoBillieves]

Smile.

It's all in the smile.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

All my opinion, obviously.

For quarterbacks I look primarily at three things: Starts, completion %, and yards per attempt. IMO accuracy is the most important part of a quarterback's game and cannot really be taught. Completion % is a good stat in that it quickly separates the players who are accomplishing their primary goal - completing passes consistently. Arm strength is overrated, in the sense that people overlook way too many flaws in a QBs game if he has a cannon. Yds/Attempt further differentiates players who are just running constant dumpoffs ala the Trent Edwards' of the world. For a contemporary example, I would be much more interested in drafting someone like Barkley (47 starts, 64% passing) then Mike Glennon (26 starts, 60% passing)

For all other positions, it obviously depends, but I like to see some respectable college production first and foremost. I especially hate the "athletic freaks" who somehow never accomplished anything meaningful. If they couldn't do it against college opponents, why would we assume they could vs. pros? Dontari Poe and Ansah are the types I would avoid high in the draft.

That said, after the 4th round all bets are off. The chances of anyone from those rounds becoming a meaningful player are pretty low so swing for the fences. Guys like Michael Jasper are my ideal late round pick -That's the appropriate amount of risk vs. upside.

[OLDSRIP]

Stephon Gilmore just called...he's very flattered.

Ha, not quite who I had in mind. lol
I was thinking more along the lines of players from the LFL (lingerie football league)
but each to his own.

[X-Era]

All my opinion, obviously.

For quarterbacks I look primarily at three things: Starts, completion %, and yards per attempt. IMO accuracy is the most important part of a quarterback's game and cannot really be taught. Completion % is a good stat in that it quickly separates the players who are accomplishing their primary goal - completing passes consistently. Arm strength is overrated, in the sense that people overlook way too many flaws in a QBs game if he has a cannon. Yds/Attempt further differentiates players who are just running constant dumpoffs ala the Trent Edwards' of the world. For a contemporary example, I would be much more interested in drafting someone like Barkley (47 starts, 64% passing) then Mike Glennon (26 starts, 60% passing)

For all other positions, it obviously depends, but I like to see some respectable college production first and foremost. I especially hate the "athletic freaks" who somehow never accomplished anything meaningful. If they couldn't do it against college opponents, why would we assume they could vs. pros? Dontari Poe and Ansah are the types I would avoid high in the draft.

That said, after the 4th round all bets are off. The chances of anyone from those rounds becoming a meaningful player are pretty low so swing for the fences. Guys like Michael Jasper are my ideal late round pick -That's the appropriate amount of risk vs. upside.
So, a QB who runs a simple spread in the MAAC, has 4 full years of starts, a high comp. percentage, and enough long throws to give you a decent yards per attempt is all you need? Even if the guy is dumb as a rock and has serious issues with his throwing mechanics?

Better yet, Tim Tebow would fit your version.


<tbody>


Career
<spacer type="block" height="1" width="1"></spacer>
Passing
<spacer type="block" height="1" width="1"></spacer>
Rushing
<spacer type="block" height="1" width="1"></spacer>
Sacked
<spacer type="block" height="1" width="1"></spacer>


Year
Team
G


QBRat
Comp
Att
Pct
Yds
Y/A
Yds/G
TD
Int


Rush
Yds
Yds/G
Avg
TD


S




2006
Florida (13-1)
14


201.7
22
33
66.7
358
10.8
25.6
5
1


89
469
33.5
5.3
8


0




2007
Florida (9-4)
13


172.5
234
350
66.9
3286
9.4
252.8
32
6


210
895
68.8
4.3
23


13




2008
Florida (13-1)
14


172.4
192
298
64.4
2746
9.2
196.1
30
4


176
673
48.1
3.8
12


15




2009
Florida (13-1)
14


164.2
213
314
67.8
2895
9.2
206.8
21
5


217
910
65.0
4.2
14


27




Career


55


177.8
661
995
66.4
9285
9.7
168.8
88
16


692
2947
53.6
4.4
57


55


</tbody>

Only trying to make the point that with QB's especially you really should look at everything.

[better days]

At the top of the draft, the first two rounds, I want a guy that has produced at a high level against good competition. Not some small school wonder or a guy that played only one year of division I football.

I like guys from the SEC because that is the best College has to offer. The time to take chances is in rnds 3 or later except at QB. It is worth the risk to gamble on a QB because the reward is so great if you hit.

[BidsJr]

1. Release. Can he get the ball out fast.
2. In pocket mobility. Can he slide around the pocket, feel pressure.
3. If 1 and 2 are bad move on to the next guy.
4. Everything else.

[better days]

So, a QB who runs a simple spread in the MAAC, has 4 full years of starts, a high comp. percentage, and enough long throws to give you a decent yards per attempt is all you need? Even if the guy is dumb as a rock and has serious issues with his throwing mechanics?

Better yet, Tim Tebow would fit your version.


<TBODY>


Career

<SPACER width="1" height="1" type="block"></SPACER>

Passing

<SPACER width="1" height="1" type="block"></SPACER>

Rushing

<SPACER width="1" height="1" type="block"></SPACER>

Sacked

<SPACER width="1" height="1" type="block"></SPACER>



Year

Team

G




QBRat

Comp

Att

Pct

Yds

Y/A

Yds/G

TD

Int




Rush

Yds

Yds/G

Avg

TD




S






2006

Florida (13-1)

14




201.7

22

33

66.7

358

10.8

25.6

5

1




89

469

33.5

5.3

8




0






2007

Florida (9-4)

13




172.5

234

350

66.9

3286

9.4

252.8

32

6




210

895

68.8

4.3

23




13






2008

Florida (13-1)

14




172.4

192

298

64.4

2746

9.2

196.1

30

4




176

673

48.1

3.8

12




15






2009

Florida (13-1)

14




164.2

213

314

67.8

2895

9.2

206.8

21

5




217

910

65.0

4.2

14




27






Career




55




177.8

661

995

66.4

9285

9.7

168.8

88

16




692

2947

53.6

4.4

57




55



</TBODY>

Only trying to make the point that with QB's especially you really should look at everything.

Well, except Tebow did not put up those numbers in the MAAC. He put up those numbers in the SEC against the best defenses in College. Many of the defensive players Tebow played against are now in the NFL making plays.

And look at Tebows numbers. QB rating of 177.8 for his career. Y/A 9.7 57 TDs rushing 88 TDs passing with only 16 INTs in his career. Hell, Fitz threw that many INTs last year alone. And again, he did that against the best defenses in the Country.

Some team will give Tebow a chance to resurrect his career & he will take advantage of his chance when he gets it.

[X-Era]

Well, except Tebow did not put up those numbers in the MAAC. He put up those numbers in the SEC against the best defenses in College. Many of the defensive players Tebow played against are now in the NFL making plays.

And look at Tebows numbers. QB rating of 177.8 for his career. Y/A 9.7 57 TDs rushing 88 TDs passing with only 16 INTs in his career. Hell, Fitz threw that many INTs last year alone. And again, he did that against the best defenses in the Country.

Some team will give Tebow a chance to resurrect his career & he will take advantage of his chance when he gets it.
So you're helping me make my argument that you can't go just by that?

I know he didn't play in the MAAC.

Some very successful college players don't translate to the NFL. Mechanics can be just one reason why.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

So, a QB who runs a simple spread in the MAAC, has 4 full years of starts, a high comp. percentage, and enough long throws to give you a decent yards per attempt is all you need?

Did I claim it was? No, those are just the primary three factors. If the guy comes in and does a rail of coke during his combine interview, I wouldn't draft him just because he has a 75% completion or whatever. But a guy like Jake Locker, who couldn't even crack a 55% rate in college comes to the NFL and people expect him to be an efficient passer? They got obsessed with watching him throw deep balls at the underwear olympics and forget how wild he looked on game day.


Even if the guy is dumb as a rock and has serious issues with his throwing mechanics?

If he's dumb as a rock and has a horrible throwing motion, how is he completing so many passes?

Do you want a guy who throws ugly completions or pretty passes that float out of bounds? Those are my basic concerns - can he get the job done, and has he been doing it for a long time?


Better yet, Tim Tebow would fit your version.

Only trying to make the point that with QB's especially you really should look at everything.

Tebow would have actually, and I wonder how his career would have turned out if he had been on a team that was actually interested in developing him rather than actively throwing him under the bus. Still, Tebow has a division title and a playoff win under his belt, which is more than this franchise and the boy in your avatar can say for the last 13 years.

The QB I wanted out of that class most was Colt McCoy (that we had a chance at, I mean). A 4 year starter who never dipped below 65%? In the third round? I think Gailey's offense would have suited him well.

In any event, if I had a flawless method of evaluating QBs I wouldn't share for free with you dopes. Sometimes it hits (I was SCREAMING for the Bills to take Wilson) and sometimes it misses.