2 year / $13 Million Max for Kolb

[Skooby]

If Kolb hits everything, he makes $13 Million over 2 years. I hope he's maxed out on everything.

[black N yellow]

Adam Schefter ‏<s>@</s>AdamSchefter (https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter) <small class="time"> 20m (https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/318170324761993216) </small> Here's how much Bills wanted Kevin Kolb in Buffalo: Staff spent last weekend with him, then hosted Kolb in BUF on Thurs and Fri to visit.

[TacklingDummy]

CHAMPIONSHIP

Not a bad move considering we don't have crap at QB.

Who else were they suppose to get?

[Night Train]

Local radio says multiple incentives met carry him to 13 Mil over 2 years. Sounds like his actual fig is much lower and is very team friendly.

Hope he collects the 13 Mil, which means the Bills are winning. ( I know the odds of that. Save me the sophmoric response )

He does operate well out of the shotgun, so I can see the idea since Marrone/Hackett had Nassib doing that exclusively in college.

[Scumbag College]

I have a strange feeling that this is going to lead the Bills to not pick a QB in this year's draft until later on- if they pick one at all.

I think Geno goes before the Bills pick at 8, and with all of the holes on this team the Bills don't reach for a QB at 8. Second round pick comes and there isn't a QB that Buddy and Marrone feel comfortable with and they go in another direction. I don't think that too many teams are enamored at all with this QB class and the teams that need a "QB of the future" are going to roll the dice and wait until next year.

[DraftBoy]

Gotta think the Bills are going BPA (likely OL or DL) in the first round.

[coastal]

Gotta think the Bills are going BPA (likely OL or DL) in the first round.
One of 3 tackles or Warmack...

but not the Bills... They will blow the pick on Nassib or Patterson

[TacklingDummy]

Gotta think the Bills are going BPA (likely OL or DL) in the first round.

WR

[DraftBoy]

One of 3 tackles or Warmack...

but not the Bills... They will blow the pick on Nassib or Patterson

Won't be Warmack. Could be a pass rusher like Werner, Jordan, or Ansah as well.

- - - Updated - - -


WR

Patterson or Allen would be the only targets that high.

[BillsFever21]

One of 3 tackles or Warmack...

but not the Bills... They will blow the pick on Nassib or Patterson

Well if they plan on rolling with Kolb as their starter they better take two good offensive lineman and a wide receiver between the first three or four rounds and try and build a fort around him. The guy is a sack machine and if he gets breathed on he gets injured.

The Kool-Aid drinkers likes to say it was just because of Arizona but the rest of them didn't get sacked at the rate that he did and he also can't stay healthy. Even with Philadelphia he had trouble making it through a few games without getting injured.

[kingJofNYC]

It's clear they're taking BPA with the first pick, but now with their second they can take a QB, sit him and not throw him into the fire. EJ Manuel may be the guy.

[gonzo1105]

Anyone think that Tavon Austin might be the pick. I mean think about the explosiveness of the offense and Marrone has seen him for 4 years. Spiller, Johnson, Jackson, Austin.

[DraftBoy]

Anyone think that Tavon Austin might be the pick. I mean think about the explosiveness of the offense and Marrone has seen him for 4 years. Spiller, Johnson, Jackson, Austin.

I do not.

[BertSquirtgum]

Cordarrelle Patterson here we come. They should have drafted aj green two years ago.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

If there are any functioning neurons left in the brains at OBD, the first pick is Geno if available and BPA if he isn't followed by Nassib in the second.

[BertSquirtgum]

If there are any functioning neurons left in the brains at OBD, the first pick is Geno if available and BPA if he isn't followed by Nassib in the second.

No thanks to Jamarcus smith.

[fluteflakes]

No thanks to Jamarcus smith.

He's nothing like JaMarcus Russel, as either a player or, more importantly, a person.

To even make the comparison is a joke.

[BertSquirtgum]

He's nothing like JaMarcus Russel, as either a player or, more importantly, a person.

To even make the comparison is a joke.

No thanks to Jamarcus Smith.

[The Jokeman]

Cordarrelle Patterson here we come. They should have drafted aj green two years ago.

No, we should have drafted Dez Bryant three years ago and kept Marshawn Lynch. I don't mind the pick of Patterson but I think LT is a strong possibility as one thing Kolb struggles with is taking sacks and as outlined in a earlier thread LT is the number one position on a team and I'm not 100% sold on Glenn there. Then in Round 2 we might take a QB if have questions on Kolb and in Round 3 could see a WR like Aaron Dobson.

[Skooby]

We need a WR & LB in the worst way, those will be our first few positional picks wherever we land.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Take a WR or LB in the first, then Nassib or Wilson in the second to groom.

Kolb is obviously just a hold-over.

[The Jokeman]

Take a WR or LB in the first, then Nassib or Wilson in the second to groom.

Kolb is obviously just a hold-over.

and what do we do with the LG/LT question mark? As to me we have four question marks, long term QB, LB, WR and LG/LT yet the order in which we take them might be different.

[JediMindPowers]

Let me get this straight...we don't even bother offering Levitre a contract, yet we waste 13 mil on Kevin Kolb and might even end up drafting a guard (Warmack) in the first round anyway?

Wow, this team is awful.

[mikemac2001]

Let me get this straight...we don't even bother offering Levitre a contract, yet we waste 13 mil on Kevin Kolb and might even end up drafting a guard (Warmack) in the first round anyway?

Wow, this team is awful.


Dumb post up to 13 mill for 2 years

So max of 6.5 a year if he wins games

Not the same

[kwharter]

If they are going to run the spread offense with Kolb in Buffalo he will be a great qb for that. I went to the University of Houston and watched him play there. He was very accurate and very consistent. He has the tutalage of Art Briles who was his coach in High School and then his coach in college. Art Briles moved on to Baylor afterwards and was RG3 coach. Before Kolb was the qb at UH the team was 1-11. He is a great QB if given the correct system. Whether we play him in the correct system I don't know but if we do we will win a lot more than we have.

[kingJofNYC]

There's no question that Marrone/Hackett spread it around, not quite Houston/Air Raid, but they love the gun and 3+ WRs.

[Downinfloflo]

This signing came after Buffalo worked out the so called top QB's in this years draft.

No way the Bills take a QB with the #8 pick.I don't think they feel one is worth the #8th pick.So they signed Kolb as a stop gap in case their guy is not there in round's 2 or 3.

[The Jokeman]

If they are going to run the spread offense with Kolb in Buffalo he will be a great qb for that. I went to the University of Houston and watched him play there. He was very accurate and very consistent. He has the tutalage of Art Briles who was his coach in High School and then his coach in college. Art Briles moved on to Baylor afterwards and was RG3 coach. Before Kolb was the qb at UH the team was 1-11. He is a great QB if given the correct system. Whether we play him in the correct system I don't know but if we do we will win a lot more than we have.

All the talk with Hackett jr has been K-Gun/WCO type offense. I don't see a lot of spread in that especially with our holes at WR. Also we've had talks with free agent TE Walker and Davis who are a bit more athletic type TEs. I think our offense will be more traditional this year than it was under Gailey.

[OpIv37]

If Kolb hits everything, he makes $13 Million over 2 years. I hope he's maxed out on everything.

How does this break down exactly? What are the incentives?

At face value, this contract is sickening. This team does nothing in FA, claiming a lack of cap space, then they give this contract to Kolb? That's pathetic.

But, if its incentive-laden and he only gets that much if he succeeds, then it's understandable.

So, how does it break down? What's the max and min cap hits?

[The Jokeman]

How does this break down exactly? What are the incentives?

At face value, this contract is sickening. This team does nothing in FA, claiming a lack of cap space, then they give this contract to Kolb? That's pathetic.

But, if its incentive-laden and he only gets that much if he succeeds, then it's understandable.

So, how does it break down? What's the max and min cap hits?

I'm sure that management wasn't foolish on how they worked out the deal. I mean they worked out the Fitzpatrick deal and were smart enough to know when to cut him that could spread the cap hit across two years versus one. One thing this team does know how to do is make contracts that won't kill them. The only problems is they lack to find the right talent to go with those contracts.

[OpIv37]

You're sure management wasn't foolish? You do know we are talking about the Buffalo Bills, right?

[YardRat]

This signing came after Buffalo worked out the so called top QB's in this years draft.

No way the Bills take a QB with the #8 pick.I don't think they feel one is worth the #8th pick.So they signed Kolb as a stop gap in case their guy is not there in round's 2 or 3.

Great point.

[jamze132]

I think the Zbills did this move just so when they're on the clock at #8 they can take a knee and remember that they don't have to overdraft a QB by 2 rounds.

[swiper]

One of 3 tackles or Warmack...

but not the Bills... They will blow the pick on Nassib or Patterson

MLB???

[swiper]

Dumb post up to 13 mill for 2 years

So max of 6.5 a year if he wins games

Not the same

Not to mention one is a QB and one is a guard. Most improtant vs. least important position.

[swiper]

This signing came after Buffalo worked out the so called top QB's in this years draft.

No way the Bills take a QB with the #8 pick.I don't think they feel one is worth the #8th pick.So they signed Kolb as a stop gap in case their guy is not there in round's 2 or 3.

PFT was saying this is why the Raiders were going after Flynn as well.

[TacklingDummy]

How does this break down exactly? What are the incentives?

At face value, this contract is sickening. This team does nothing in FA, claiming a lack of cap space, then they give this contract to Kolb? That's pathetic.

But, if its incentive-laden and he only gets that much if he succeeds, then it's understandable.

So, how does it break down? What's the max and min cap hits?

I guess you were happy with Jackson and Corp.

[coastal]

Who is this Corp character I keep hearing about?

can we kick him into guard?

[Mr. Miyagi]

You're sure management wasn't foolish? You do know we are talking about the Buffalo Bills, right?
Really? You think all these people in the FO are just complete idiots? And their bosses are so stupid that they don't recognize that either?

[CoolBreeze]

You know this for sure? Without a question of doubt they didn't talk to Levitre or his agent? Haven't spoken a word to him since January? 8 million dollars for a G is insane. Especially for one who never was a Pro Bowl player. Levitre was above average, not great. He's replaceable for more than 1/2 the cost. Glad you don't manage my checkbook.
Let me get this straight...we don't even bother offering Levitre a contract, yet we waste 13 mil on Kevin Kolb and might even end up drafting a guard (Warmack) in the first round anyway?

Wow, this team is awful.

[DraftBoy]

Guys this is similar to how Miami (to their credit) handled their QB system last year. You bring in two vets to compete with and mentor whatever young QB you add. Its a truly open competition in camp and the Bills still have the flexibility to take a QB in any round. I don't think they'll take 2, unless they dump Corp early.

It's honestly not a bad way to go because you have two relatively young vets who can push each other and if the rookie we take isn't ready to go you have two guys who at least have starting experience with small cap numbers to secure the spot. There is no rush/pressure to push a rookie into the spotlight and if one of your veterans suddenly finds his game you have trade value to the market while grooming the long term answer.

Win/Win for me.

[X-Era]

Let me get this straight...we don't even bother offering Levitre a contract, yet we waste 13 mil on Kevin Kolb and might even end up drafting a guard (Warmack) in the first round anyway?

Wow, this team is awful.
I think it's very unlikely we take a Guard in the 1st.

I could still see a QB at 8 even with Kolb.

I also could see Patterson, Ogletree, Jones, maybe Mingo or Werner

[SpikedLemonade]

Probably our best option at this point.

We kinda need to look like we are trying.

He won`t be healthy enough by late November and December to get us one or two ugly meaningless wins.

[Figster]

Guys this is similar to how Miami (to their credit) handled their QB system last year. You bring in two vets to compete with and mentor whatever young QB you add. Its a truly open competition in camp and the Bills still have the flexibility to take a QB in any round. I don't think they'll take 2, unless they dump Corp early.

It's honestly not a bad way to go because you have two relatively young vets who can push each other and if the rookie we take isn't ready to go you have two guys who at least have starting experience with small cap numbers to secure the spot. There is no rush/pressure to push a rookie into the spotlight and if one of your veterans suddenly finds his game you have trade value to the market while grooming the long term answer.

Win/Win for me.


Well said, I agree

Kevin Kolb is an upgrade over Fitzpatrick, guys got a good intermediate passing game and is still relatively young when it comes to NFL experience.

Shows a change in approach the new regime intends on using to improve and stabalize the most important position on the football team.

win/win for me

[TacklingDummy]

Well said, I agree

Kevin Kolb is an upgrade over Fitzpatrick, guys got a good intermediate passing game and is still relatively young when it comes to NFL experience.

Shows a change in approach the new regime intends on using to improve and stabalize the most important position on the football team.

win/win for me

Jackson and Corp.

Kolb was a no brainier for me.

Like I said before, if not Kolb then who?

[DetDannyWilliams]

We all know how the Bills feel about the QB's in this draft. just listen to Nix in the taped phone conversation!

[bf1]

They'll draft a few cornerbacks again.

[OpIv37]

I guess you were happy with Jackson and Corp.

Kolb is no better.

[BertSquirtgum]

Kolb is no better.

Disagree

[Bills41]

Disagree

Kolb was pretty good with the Eagles when he was healthy. I remember watching him a lot with the Eagles.

[The Jokeman]

I think it's very unlikely we take a Guard in the 1st.

I could still see a QB at 8 even with Kolb.

I also could see Patterson, Ogletree, Jones, maybe Mingo or Werner

Mingo scares me as LSU guys of late haven't transitioned well in the pros. He's the one that I don't want. Jones' injuries and poor pro days etc are scary too. Yet he might be more a game player than a workout guy. Werner is probably the safest of the picks you mentioned yet doesn't scream out to me as a top 10 talent.

[The Jokeman]

Who is this Corp character I keep hearing about?

can we kick him into guard?

He's the "coulda been" the next great USC QB if not for injuries which caused him to transfer to small school Richmond where he played mediocre at best. Just a guy really who might groom into another Matt Cassel type at best IMHO. Yet more likely some guy no one will remember in two years when he's out of the NFL.

[Don't Panic]

I think the Zbills did this move just so when they're on the clock at #8 they can take a knee and remember that they don't have to overdraft a QB by 2 rounds.

At a minimum we have this. Now they don't ave to fell pressured to make a pick. I still think they can go Geno at 8 and cut whoever of TJax and Kolb don't show well in camp. It was a solid hedge moved by OBD that restores some flexibility on draft day and through camp. Still want to see the breakdown of the incentives, and it certainly won't solve any of our problems long term, but a pretty smart move all in all.

[Michael82]

http://media.knoxnews.com/media/img/photos/2012/10/14/media_f81f30aa9bb6410f8866691cc6832d8c_t607.jpg

[Michael82]

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/sports/photos/2012/10/16/940-kolb-8col.jpg

- - - Updated - - -

And then the positive.... :up:

http://media.reporternews.com/media/img/photos/2012/09/22/43836_t607.JPG

[Cali512]

Any of the top DE/OLB or WR and thats all. There will be 3-4 from those 2 positions that will be worth the 8th pick, so we better stick with them. Aside from OL, these are the 2 positions that dominate this class.

[Cali512]

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/sports/photos/2012/10/16/940-kolb-8col.jpg

- - - Updated - - -

And then the positive.... :up:

http://media.reporternews.com/media/img/photos/2012/09/22/43836_t607.JPG



Maybe you should watch those games and how long he had to throw. It was virtually impossible to have any success on AZ. He really really didnt get a fair shot. Fitz actually has always had a good OL in front of him, and the games he didnt he sucked. At least even if our OL plays terrible, Kolb will still play fine.


With Kolb you know hes gona be solid, he doesnt have multiple ints and doesnt start making mistakes just because hes getting hit or hurried. The thing is whether hes going to be great or very good. I think its a low risk high reward

[Mouldsie]

Gotta think the Bills are going BPA (likely OL or DL) in the first round.
Thank God

[better days]

I believe in Kolbs ability to play, I just don't believe in his ability to stay healthy.

[trapezeus]

kolb's head injuries concern me...the time the bills line can get it together concerns me.

i like his numbers are small and can be dumped easily. i like that it allows us to get the BPA in the first round and reach for a nassib or bray in later rounds.

and if everything is gone, keep fortifying the lines and trenches on both sides of the ball. makes 2014 a possible break out year if this one goes ok.

[CleveSteve]

I agree with DB and dog. This is a good move, but shouldn't preclude drafting a QB early. Depending on how the contract is structured, it might not be a significant hit if he's the backup. For example, if he makes half the max of his contract as a backup, he will be making Chase Daniel money. And if you think you'd have been better off with Chase Daniel, you're doing it wrong.

[mjt328]

Here are my thoughts:

I've seen him play quite a bit, and Kevin Kolb is roughly on the same level as Ryan Fitzpatrick. The same category as guys like Matt Cassel, Kyle Orton, Matt Hasselbeck, Chad Henne, Brian Hoyer, David Garrard, and so on.

I've been watching the NFL for roughly 25 years now. These guys are ideal backups, because they can often come in after a "short-term" injury (1-3 weeks) to the starter and play good enough to keep the team in games. Maybe win a couple. But teams that are counting on these guys to start a full season and lead them to the playoffs - well, these are the same teams that end up drafting in the Top 15 when April comes back around. The consistency just isn't there.

So how does this apply to us?

Personally, I think paying Kevin Kolb even the veteran minimum is probably a waste. I don't care if the contract is all incentives.
The front office and coaching staff is trying to win this year, no matter how unrealistic that expectation is. They see Kolb as a guy who can keep us competitive in 2013. And they are probably right. I have few doubts that he will beat out TJax for the job, and look decent at times. But he's not going to take us to the playoffs. He's not going to be the franchise quarterback that we've been looking for since Kelly retired.

All Kolb is going to do is take snaps and in-game experience away from the developmental guy we draft (assuming we are really are smart enough to draft one). Unfortunately, just like Fitz, he's probably good enough to help us scrape out a couple meaningless wins - knocking our draft position down for next year. Worse case scenario, he plays well enough that our front office decides to give him the reigns for another season or two - prompting us to ignore QB in the draft again.

[BertSquirtgum]

Here are my thoughts:

I've seen him play quite a bit, and Kevin Kolb is roughly on the same level as Ryan Fitzpatrick. The same category as guys like Matt Cassel, Kyle Orton, Matt Hasselbeck, Chad Henne, Brian Hoyer, David Garrard, and so on.

I've been watching the NFL for roughly 25 years now. These guys are ideal backups, because they can often come in after a "short-term" injury (1-3 weeks) to the starter and play good enough to keep the team in games. Maybe win a couple. But teams that are counting on these guys to start a full season and lead them to the playoffs - well, these are the same teams that end up drafting in the Top 15 when April comes back around. The consistency just isn't there.

So how does this apply to us?

Personally, I think paying Kevin Kolb even the veteran minimum is probably a waste. I don't care if the contract is all incentives.
The front office and coaching staff is trying to win this year, no matter how unrealistic that expectation is. They see Kolb as a guy who can keep us competitive in 2013. And they are probably right. I have few doubts that he will beat out TJax for the job, and look decent at times. But he's not going to take us to the playoffs. He's not going to be the franchise quarterback that we've been looking for since Kelly retired.

All Kolb is going to do is take snaps and in-game experience away from the developmental guy we draft (assuming we are really are smart enough to draft one). Unfortunately, just like Fitz, he's probably good enough to help us scrape out a couple meaningless wins - knocking our draft position down for next year. Worse case scenario, he plays well enough that our front office decides to give him the reigns for another season or two - prompting us to ignore QB in the draft again.

Anyone the Bills draft will need to sit and learn the NFL system just like Kaepernick did.

[SquishDaFish]

Here are my thoughts:

I've seen him play quite a bit, and Kevin Kolb is roughly on the same level as Ryan Fitzpatrick. The same category as guys like Matt Cassel, Kyle Orton, Matt Hasselbeck, Chad Henne, Brian Hoyer, David Garrard, and so on.

I've been watching the NFL for roughly 25 years now. These guys are ideal backups, because they can often come in after a "short-term" injury (1-3 weeks) to the starter and play good enough to keep the team in games. Maybe win a couple. But teams that are counting on these guys to start a full season and lead them to the playoffs - well, these are the same teams that end up drafting in the Top 15 when April comes back around. The consistency just isn't there.

So how does this apply to us?

Personally, I think paying Kevin Kolb even the veteran minimum is probably a waste. I don't care if the contract is all incentives.
The front office and coaching staff is trying to win this year, no matter how unrealistic that expectation is. They see Kolb as a guy who can keep us competitive in 2013. And they are probably right. I have few doubts that he will beat out TJax for the job, and look decent at times. But he's not going to take us to the playoffs. He's not going to be the franchise quarterback that we've been looking for since Kelly retired.

All Kolb is going to do is take snaps and in-game experience away from the developmental guy we draft (assuming we are really are smart enough to draft one). Unfortunately, just like Fitz, he's probably good enough to help us scrape out a couple meaningless wins - knocking our draft position down for next year. Worse case scenario, he plays well enough that our front office decides to give him the reigns for another season or two - prompting us to ignore QB in the draft again.

What people are seeming not to understand is We NEEDED another QB ALONG WITH A rookie so we will have a REAL QB Competition. You need 4 or so QBs we only had 1 1/2 with TJAX and that fish Carp or Corp whatever his name is.

[mjt328]

What people are seeming not to understand is We NEEDED another QB ALONG WITH A rookie so we will have a REAL QB Competition. You need 4 or so QBs we only had 1 1/2 with TJAX and that fish Carp or Corp whatever his name is.

Four quarterbacks? I've heard many coaches say it's impossible to give a fair shake to more than 2-3 guys competing for the quarterback job in the same training camp.

And I would have definitely preferred taking 2 prospects in the draft and letting them battle it out, instead of grabbing a mediocre veteran.


No matter what, we are screwed in 2013.
I would prefer to draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd round, then again in the 3rd or 4th. Then use the season to evaluate. If things don't look good, we will probably pick high again in 2014.

Instead, I know exactly how this will play out.
The Bills will now feel confident enough to pass on a QB at #8. By the time it rolls around to our second pick, we will get the 4th or 5th QB on the board.
They will roll with Kolb as the starter all season long. We will win about 5 games.
A year from now, we will be out of the running for the top 2014 quarterbacks (again) and we'll have a mid-round developmental guy that we know nothing about.
The Bills will give him 2-3 years before deciding he's crap. So we will be back to square one in approximately 2017.

[Skooby]

Well hopefully if we have a losing season, it's with only 1 or 2 wins so we can get a good QB next year.

[ServoBillieves]

Four quarterbacks? I've heard many coaches say it's impossible to give a fair shake to more than 2-3 guys competing for the quarterback job in the same training camp.

And I would have definitely preferred taking 2 prospects in the draft and letting them battle it out, instead of grabbing a mediocre veteran.


No matter what, we are screwed in 2013.
I would prefer to draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd round, then again in the 3rd or 4th. Then use the season to evaluate. If things don't look good, we will probably pick high again in 2014.

Instead, I know exactly how this will play out.
The Bills will now feel confident enough to pass on a QB at #8. By the time it rolls around to our second pick, we will get the 4th or 5th QB on the board.
They will roll with Kolb as the starter all season long. We will win about 5 games.
A year from now, we will be out of the running for the top 2014 quarterbacks (again) and we'll have a mid-round developmental guy that we know nothing about.
The Bills will give him 2-3 years before deciding he's crap. So we will be back to square one in approximately 2017.

Can you read my fortune too? You're good at this. I especially like the part where you implied that Aaron Corp was a legit competitor for the starting job. That's what a QB competition is, someone who can start. So a rookie, a guy who didn't dress in 2012, and a guy with a flashy youtube video (nowhere near as good as mine when it comes to Buffalo sports, he adds, snidely) would be ideal? Oh wait, you said TWO rookies. So we'd grab 2 rookies, a "vet" in TJa, and Aaron Corp, and let them fight it out? That's like watching 4 crippled pigs struggle to reach the trough. Whoever was taken highest would immediately know that the job was theirs for the taking and slack off, the other rookie would most likely be cut or PS, and TJacks would be backup or not be dressed.

We've seen how great the Redskins decisions have been in the past so let's make a template and draft 2 QB's and let them "battle it out." OH WAIT, they knew what they had in Griffin and had jack **** behind him so they drafted a QB to be his backup

So with all the other holes we have, all the needs, depth, et cetera, you want to waste 2 of 6 draft picks on a potential starter and his backup?

Overly-long story short, Kolb was a good pick up. He's not going to win a championship this year, but no one else out there in FA or in this draft class is going to this year either. Don't pull the "we might as well have kept Fitz" BS either, he was bleeding the team's money and if he didn't want to take a pay cut then I hope he enjoys his clipboard job in Tennessee. So rather than whine, be happy the Bills didn't go back out and re-sign Gibran Hamdan as a warm body in camp.

[Skooby]

Can you read my fortune too? You're good at this. I especially like the part where you implied that Aaron Corp was a legit competitor for the starting job. That's what a QB competition is, someone who can start. So a rookie, a guy who didn't dress in 2012, and a guy with a flashy youtube video (nowhere near as good as mine when it comes to Buffalo sports, he adds, snidely) would be ideal? Oh wait, you said TWO rookies. So we'd grab 2 rookies, a "vet" in TJa, and Aaron Corp, and let them fight it out? That's like watching 4 crippled pigs struggle to reach the trough. Whoever was taken highest would immediately know that the job was theirs for the taking and slack off, the other rookie would most likely be cut or PS, and TJacks would be backup or not be dressed.

We've seen how great the Redskins decisions have been in the past so let's make a template and draft 2 QB's and let them "battle it out." OH WAIT, they knew what they had in Griffin and had jack **** behind him so they drafted a QB to be his backup

So with all the other holes we have, all the needs, depth, et cetera, you want to waste 2 of 6 draft picks on a potential starter and his backup?

Overly-long story short, Kolb was a good pick up. He's not going to win a championship this year, but no one else out there in FA or in this draft class is going to this year either. Don't pull the "we might as well have kept Fitz" BS either, he was bleeding the team's money and if he didn't want to take a pay cut then I hope he enjoys his clipboard job in Tennessee. So rather than whine, be happy the Bills didn't go back out and re-sign Gibran Hamdan as a warm body in camp.

There will be somebody that's a great QB from this draft, we just won't be the team that gets him.

[Buffalo Billy Bison]

Here are my thoughts:

I've seen him play quite a bit, and Kevin Kolb is roughly on the same level as Ryan Fitzpatrick. The same category as guys like Matt Cassel, Kyle Orton, Matt Hasselbeck, Chad Henne, Brian Hoyer, David Garrard, and so on.

I've been watching the NFL for roughly 25 years now. These guys are ideal backups, because they can often come in after a "short-term" injury (1-3 weeks) to the starter and play good enough to keep the team in games. Maybe win a couple. But teams that are counting on these guys to start a full season and lead them to the playoffs - well, these are the same teams that end up drafting in the Top 15 when April comes back around. The consistency just isn't there.

So how does this apply to us?

Personally, I think paying Kevin Kolb even the veteran minimum is probably a waste. I don't care if the contract is all incentives.
The front office and coaching staff is trying to win this year, no matter how unrealistic that expectation is. They see Kolb as a guy who can keep us competitive in 2013. And they are probably right. I have few doubts that he will beat out TJax for the job, and look decent at times. But he's not going to take us to the playoffs. He's not going to be the franchise quarterback that we've been looking for since Kelly retired.

All Kolb is going to do is take snaps and in-game experience away from the developmental guy we draft (assuming we are really are smart enough to draft one). Unfortunately, just like Fitz, he's probably good enough to help us scrape out a couple meaningless wins - knocking our draft position down for next year. Worse case scenario, he plays well enough that our front office decides to give him the reigns for another season or two - prompting us to ignore QB in the draft again.

As you say, Kolb just wasn't consistent. My answer to that is, you have to be up right to be consistent!

[ServoBillieves]

There will be somebody that's a great QB from this draft, we just won't be the team that gets him.

I won't argue that fact, but unless we're omniscient we might as well throw darts at the board. There is no Luck/RGIII/Stafford/Ryan/Bradford/whoever in this draft at all. The game is evolving, so Geno looks like the #1, but he's no sure fire. I actually think he's going to tank personally but that's a gut feeling. I'd rather have Kolb here and know he's seen the speed of the NFL than 2 rookies who see Freeney and Spikes flying at them.

[psubills62]

Four quarterbacks? I've heard many coaches say it's impossible to give a fair shake to more than 2-3 guys competing for the quarterback job in the same training camp.

And I would have definitely preferred taking 2 prospects in the draft and letting them battle it out, instead of grabbing a mediocre veteran.


No matter what, we are screwed in 2013.
I would prefer to draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd round, then again in the 3rd or 4th. Then use the season to evaluate. If things don't look good, we will probably pick high again in 2014.

Instead, I know exactly how this will play out.
The Bills will now feel confident enough to pass on a QB at #8. By the time it rolls around to our second pick, we will get the 4th or 5th QB on the board.
They will roll with Kolb as the starter all season long. We will win about 5 games.
A year from now, we will be out of the running for the top 2014 quarterbacks (again) and we'll have a mid-round developmental guy that we know nothing about.
The Bills will give him 2-3 years before deciding he's crap. So we will be back to square one in approximately 2017.
Confidence? Since when does 6.5m maximum per year for a QB equal confidence? That probably equates to something like 5m/year actual at best, which is backup money nowadays. If they pass on QB at 8, it will be due to uncertainty, not confidence. Uncertainty that the QB they take at 8 (which might be the 2nd best QB, after all) will be any better than the QB they take at 41.

I'm fine with the Kolb signing. He's not the answer and it shouldn't be expected that he is. Fine as a seat-warmer.

[imbondz]

makes no sense to me why we got rid of Fitz, to get a Fitz-lite QB. I guess we wanted to save money on a back up QB and groom the next qb we draft? So the rookie QB is going to be groomed by Kolb? Or we're just going to hope the rookie QB develops into a franchise QB. just don't get the Kolb pickup

[mjt328]

Can you read my fortune too? You're good at this. I especially like the part where you implied that Aaron Corp was a legit competitor for the starting job. That's what a QB competition is, someone who can start. So a rookie, a guy who didn't dress in 2012, and a guy with a flashy youtube video (nowhere near as good as mine when it comes to Buffalo sports, he adds, snidely) would be ideal? Oh wait, you said TWO rookies. So we'd grab 2 rookies, a "vet" in TJa, and Aaron Corp, and let them fight it out? That's like watching 4 crippled pigs struggle to reach the trough. Whoever was taken highest would immediately know that the job was theirs for the taking and slack off, the other rookie would most likely be cut or PS, and TJacks would be backup or not be dressed.

We've seen how great the Redskins decisions have been in the past so let's make a template and draft 2 QB's and let them "battle it out." OH WAIT, they knew what they had in Griffin and had jack **** behind him so they drafted a QB to be his backup

So with all the other holes we have, all the needs, depth, et cetera, you want to waste 2 of 6 draft picks on a potential starter and his backup?

Overly-long story short, Kolb was a good pick up. He's not going to win a championship this year, but no one else out there in FA or in this draft class is going to this year either. Don't pull the "we might as well have kept Fitz" BS either, he was bleeding the team's money and if he didn't want to take a pay cut then I hope he enjoys his clipboard job in Tennessee. So rather than whine, be happy the Bills didn't go back out and re-sign Gibran Hamdan as a warm body in camp.

For the record, I didn't say anything about Aaron Corp. And I never said we would have been better off keeping Fitzpatrick.

All I said was that Kolb was a wasted signing.

Back in 2010, what Bills fan would have predicted that our coaching staff would take THREE FULL SEASONS to evaluate whether Ryan Fitzpatrick was a legitimate NFL starter? If you would have run a poll back then, most of us were smart enough to know he was nothing more than a backup. There was plenty of tape from his days on the Rams and Bengals, not to mention the last few games of 2009.

It's guys like Fitz, Kolb, Cassel and Orton that keep teams like us out of the playoffs for a decade. If you go back 10 years, it was guys like Jay Fiedler, Jon Kitna, Chris Redman, Jim Miller, Rodney Peete, Patrick Ramsey, Shaun King, Trent Green, etc. They have a knack for looking great at times and fooling stupid teams into giving them a shot as the starter. But the consistency is never enough to topple good defenses on a regular basis, or win shootouts with the other top QBs.

I would rather completely crash and burn in 2013 with nothing but rookie QBs, as opposed to playing around with average-below average veterans.

Maybe I'll prove wrong. Maybe our coaching staff will be smart enough to still draft a QB high and Kolb will be nothing more than a backup.
But I have a bad feeling that Kolb is our starter for at least this season. If he looks decent, the next few years could be really ugly.

[Mike13]

Maybe you should watch those games and how long he had to throw. It was virtually impossible to have any success on AZ. He really really didnt get a fair shot. Fitz actually has always had a good OL in front of him, and the games he didnt he sucked. At least even if our OL plays terrible, Kolb will still play fine.


With Kolb you know hes gona be solid, he doesnt have multiple ints and doesnt start making mistakes just because hes getting hit or hurried. The thing is whether hes going to be great or very good. I think its a low risk high reward

As opposed to vast amount of success he is going to have in Buffalo?

[ServoBillieves]

makes no sense to me why we got rid of Fitz, to get a Fitz-lite QB. I guess we wanted to save money on a back up QB and groom the next qb we draft? So the rookie QB is going to be groomed by Kolb? Or we're just going to hope the rookie QB develops into a franchise QB. just don't get the Kolb pickup

You must have skimmed the thread or didn't think of the rationality of this...

Did you want Tavaris Jackson and Aaron Corp to be the only threat to a highly drafted QB? Or did you want to keep Fitz's unbelievable contract to be a backup? I mean, that seems so logical, but we should've kept the game killer.

[ServoBillieves]

For the record, I didn't say anything about Aaron Corp. And I never said we would have been better off keeping Fitzpatrick.

All I said was that Kolb was a wasted signing.

Back in 2010, what Bills fan would have predicted that our coaching staff would take THREE FULL SEASONS to evaluate whether Ryan Fitzpatrick was a legitimate NFL starter? If you would have run a poll back then, most of us were smart enough to know he was nothing more than a backup. There was plenty of tape from his days on the Rams and Bengals, not to mention the last few games of 2009.

It's guys like Fitz, Kolb, Cassel and Orton that keep teams like us out of the playoffs for a decade. If you go back 10 years, it was guys like Jay Fiedler, Jon Kitna, Chris Redman, Jim Miller, Rodney Peete, Patrick Ramsey, Shaun King, Trent Green, etc. They have a knack for looking great at times and fooling stupid teams into giving them a shot as the starter. But the consistency is never enough to topple good defenses on a regular basis, or win shootouts with the other top QBs.

I would rather completely crash and burn in 2013 with nothing but rookie QBs, as opposed to playing around with average-below average veterans.

Maybe I'll prove wrong. Maybe our coaching staff will be smart enough to still draft a QB high and Kolb will be nothing more than a backup.
But I have a bad feeling that Kolb is our starter for at least this season. If he looks decent, the next few years could be really ugly.

I want to know why Kolb as a starter is immediate doom. I know your long term plan but you aren't in the FO so we don't know their agenda. For the past however-long what QB has looked good? Who has led us to the promised land? The answer is no one. So, with all of the FA quarterbacks and the draft class available, what was your answer? Who was the savior? 80% of the board is so hell-bent on a proven QB, but I'm pretty sure proven QB's on the Patriots, Broncos, Packers, et cetera, aren't going to be on the Bills roster day 1.

Until on day 1 someone takes a snap we don't know what is going on. We aren't talent evaluators, we aren't scouts, we aren't team owners, so we can always give our opinion but it's the people who become vehemently protective of their opinion that pushes good/intelligent people away from the board.

Signing a veteran quarterback who was talented in college is a problem.
Signing a veteran quarterback who had 0 talent in front of him other than Larry Fitzgerald and was physically destroyed and yet still beat "elite teams" is a problem.
Signing a veteran with an arm is a problem.
Signing a veteran with some form of mobility is a problem.
Signing a veteran who Bills fans wanted to trade for a few years ago is a problem.
Signing a veteran who is now a Bill is a problem.

"Drr, we won't make the playoffs?!" No ****, and no one available would lead us there.

People need to shut up, deal with the situation, and realize that having some form of a veteran QB is better than nothing, which is what we had before.

[ServoBillieves]

As opposed to vast amount of success he is going to have in Buffalo?

The Flounder O-Line looks real good as well to the sophomore, so you're right. There's no way the fish can fail!

[mjt328]

I want to know why Kolb as a starter is immediate doom. I know your long term plan but you aren't in the FO so we don't know their agenda. For the past however-long what QB has looked good? Who has led us to the promised land? The answer is no one. So, with all of the FA quarterbacks and the draft class available, what was your answer? Who was the savior? 80% of the board is so hell-bent on a proven QB, but I'm pretty sure proven QB's on the Patriots, Broncos, Packers, et cetera, aren't going to be on the Bills roster day 1.

Until on day 1 someone takes a snap we don't know what is going on. We aren't talent evaluators, we aren't scouts, we aren't team owners, so we can always give our opinion but it's the people who become vehemently protective of their opinion that pushes good/intelligent people away from the board.

Signing a veteran quarterback who was talented in college is a problem.
Signing a veteran quarterback who had 0 talent in front of him other than Larry Fitzgerald and was physically destroyed and yet still beat "elite teams" is a problem.
Signing a veteran with an arm is a problem.
Signing a veteran with some form of mobility is a problem.
Signing a veteran who Bills fans wanted to trade for a few years ago is a problem.
Signing a veteran who is now a Bill is a problem.

"Drr, we won't make the playoffs?!" No ****, and no one available would lead us there.

People need to shut up, deal with the situation, and realize that having some form of a veteran QB is better than nothing, which is what we had before.


There is no reason to get personal, or tell people to shut up. I have an opinion that is different from you.


I've never cried for us to sign a proven veteran/franchise QB in free agency, because they pretty much don't exist. The only guys available every season are castoffs, re-treads, old men and major injury risks. Peyton Manning was the rare exception and he came out with a list of 4-5 teams he would be willing to sign with, and we were not one of those teams.

The only proven way to land a franchise quarterback (our savior, in your words) is through the draft.

Everybody knows this class doesn't have a Luck/RGIII prospect available. That leaves us with a couple options:
1) Do our homework and take the best QB we deem available
2) Go BPA early and take one of the leftover QBs in later rounds
3) Completely ignore the position until next year


Personally, I think the best option for the future success of our franchise is #1. I know many on this board feel the same.
Signing Kolb tells me they are probably leaning towards #2 or possibly even #3. And I think it's a mistake.

[justasportsfan]

I would think that deal is set up that if he ends up a back up at camp, he get's back up money. I can live with that.

[ServoBillieves]

There is no reason to get personal, or tell people to shut up. I have an opinion that is different from you.


I've never cried for us to sign a proven veteran/franchise QB in free agency, because they pretty much don't exist. The only guys available every season are castoffs, re-treads, old men and major injury risks. Peyton Manning was the rare exception and he came out with a list of 4-5 teams he would be willing to sign with, and we were not one of those teams.

The only proven way to land a franchise quarterback (our savior, in your words) is through the draft.

Everybody knows this class doesn't have a Luck/RGIII prospect available. That leaves us with a couple options:
1) Do our homework and take the best QB we deem available
2) Go BPA early and take one of the leftover QBs in later rounds
3) Completely ignore the position until next year


Personally, I think the best option for the future success of our franchise is #1. I know many on this board feel the same.
Signing Kolb tells me they are probably leaning towards #2 or possibly even #3. And I think it's a mistake.

Then don't complain about a signing. He's not the franchise QB. We all know that. There is no need for a referral. You can come up with thousands of "might happen"'s, but all that will happen here is a "good for you!" Congrats on being right on something we all already know. Call your mom, she'd be proud. We have a new QB in a new system who might be able to train a newer QB.

Did you want an immediate answer? The answer being yes or no, with how you worded it "yes" would be the answer and you need to close your mouth when you breathe.

[SABURZFAN]

Gotta think the Bills are going BPA (likely OL or DL) in the first round.


that'll be Warmack.

[justasportsfan]

I'm surprised that it's still not officially reported at the Bills' website. No interviews. :idunno: