The AFC East Is A Giant ? Mark In 2013

[BillsImpossible]

When is the last time you can remember the AFC East being a big giant question mark during the off season?

It's been a very long time.

The Patriots have a serious Tight End problem. Tim Tebow is not an NFL TE...at 6'2 235 lbs, he's too small.

Danny Amendola is Tom Brady's new boyfriend.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1683559-grading-the-new-england-patriots-major-offseason-moves-to-date/page/2

Last Tuesday...you could hear Brady yelling on the field, a hundred yards away from where the media was, and he was saying, "I love it! I love it, Danny! That's the way to do it, Danny!"

Will the new romance cure Tom's loss of Wes Welker?

Will Danny boy be Tom's new fountain of youth? At 36 years of age, maybe Tom wants to finally settle down?

On to the Dolphins...

Lots of off season fish maneuvering. Left tackle is a huge question mark, and they resigned their backup QB for 2 years, $8 million. They may as well have just slapped Ryan Tannehill in the face and said, "It's your job to lose pal, don't get hurt buddy!"

The Fins continue to look for Dan Marino's replacement on the QB carousel in Miami.

Meanwhile...

The Jets are in salary cap jail for the next 5 years or more if they don't unload practically half of their roster. Sanchez is done in New York after making an ass out of himself in more than one way. They drafted a quarterback with thin skin in Gino Smith, and their DC left the team to join...

The Buffalo Bills. In an odd kind of way, the Bills have the most stability in the division.

Compared to the the Pats, Fins, and Jets...the Bills seem ready to pounce on their AFC East rivals.

I understand how The Brady Bill in New England has been the foundation of stability for over the past decade, but now they have Tim Tebow's media circus compounded with murder charges against Hernandez, who according to Wikipedia..."is an American football tight end who is currently a free agent. He most recently played for the New England Patriots."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Hernandez

"Who is currently a free agent."

(not a joke, they actually said that...)

Imagine how many players on the team are being asked questions by investigators right now?

Want to bet that law enforcement officials are trying to find out who knew what by talking to his teammates?

How many players will be involved in the investigation? A lot of people in the franchise are going to be interviewed and asked serious questions.

None of this will be televised or reported on because the NFL can hire the best PR agency in the world so none of us ever hear or see anything about what's actually going on inside of the New England Patriot's fortress. Belichick won't say a word even though he could very well be in a room right now, answering questions he by his own nature does not like to answer to.

Dare I ask this...did any of his teammates know about what AH did and didn't say anything?

If I was a detective working for law enforcement, some of the first people I would want to talk to are his teammates and his coaches.

It's been a very interesting off season. One like no other...35 arrests of NFL players.

The Buffalo Bills have the cleanest slate of all.

Opportunity is knocking hard on One Bills Drive.

[OpIv37]

The Patriots have overcome WR/TE problems before. Granted, this time the scale of the problem is much larger and comes with added distractions, but so far nothing has been able to derail them. They are still the favorites until proven otherwise.

If they do finally fall apart, I think the Fish win the div by default. They are not great but they are on their way up. The Bills are relying on a bunch of rookies (maybe even at QB) and have new systems on both sides of the ball. Plus they still lack talent in a lot of areas. The Jets are just an epic cluster****.

[Meathead]

its wrong to wish that it was brady talking to the wrong people at aarons little party so im not gonna do it

[elltrain22]

The Pats will still dominate the division. They have more question marks this season than in a long time, but they have a hall of fame coach and qb, and in this league, that pretty much guarantees ya 11-12 wins.

The Dolphins, on paper, have gotten alot better, but they too have alot of questions. Having said that, as much as I hate the Phins, I wouldn't be surprised if they won 10+ games this season, but I also would love to see them lose 10+, but don't think thats gonna happen.

The Jets seem like they might be an easy 12 loss team. Controversy all over the place. Big mouth coach, who's is probably a 1-3 start away from getting canned; and not even by the owner, but b/c the fans & media are gonna go crazy if that happens. There QB situation is probably even dicier. Drafting Geno Smith is a PR nightmare for this team, and Mark Sanchez has been totally setup for failure. The whole offense seems like a trainreck already, and with all they have lost on defense, it's not much to be optimistic about, even if your Fireman Ed.

Then there are our Bills. We have the most question marks of any team in the division, IMO. I'm probably gonna said like a very simplistic fan when I say, but in this league, all you have to do is get a good coach or a good qb. If you can get one of those, your probably in the playoffs, but if you can get both, your a superbowl contender. The thing about this team, is we have a new coach, and 2 new qb's. Now, TBH, both (coach & qb) could easily be busts in both categories, but what if they aren't??? What if Marrone can coach, and actually has a good staff behind him?? What if Kolb plays well behind a better O-line?? (Phily & Arizona btw, are probably 31, and 32 in O-line rankings) What if EJ Manuel does get reps this year, and what if he can move the chains?? A couple of things we know. CJ is awesome, our defense has got to be better, and our WR'ing core will be very exciting to watch. IMO, we may be a 3 win team if every question mark is no, but if a few answers are yes, we might be a 9 win team this year.

Hammer away!!

[TigerJ]

Danny Amendola's a good receiver, and Brady will complete a bunch of passes to him if he stays healthy. Of course, staying healthy has been the big if for Amendola. Buffalo plays New England in the season opener, so it's not likely Amendola will be injured at that point. Looking at the Patriots, Brady clearly in not going to have as many proven weapons as he's had in the past, but Brady/Belichick and company have been pretty adaptable inn the past, and there's no reason to think the Patriot offense won't be productive this season. The best hope Buffalo has is that Mike Pettine is going to be able to get the Bills defense cranked up in a hurry and apply the pressure that we know can rattle Brady. Meanwhile, we need to hope that Nate Hackett's offense is different enough to keep the Patriots guessing since the Patriots won't have any regular season film footage of the Bills running it. Belichick will have to rely on preseason footage and guess at what the Bills might do based on what people will have been saying about Buffalo's offensive plans.

[ublinkwescore]

I hope we take our division for the next 5 years.

[better days]

The Pats will still dominate the division. They have more question marks this season than in a long time, but they have a hall of fame coach and qb, and in this league, that pretty much guarantees ya 11-12 wins.

The Dolphins, on paper, have gotten alot better, but they too have alot of questions. Having said that, as much as I hate the Phins, I wouldn't be surprised if they won 10+ games this season, but I also would love to see them lose 10+, but don't think thats gonna happen.

The Jets seem like they might be an easy 12 loss team. Controversy all over the place. Big mouth coach, who's is probably a 1-3 start away from getting canned; and not even by the owner, but b/c the fans & media are gonna go crazy if that happens. There QB situation is probably even dicier. Drafting Geno Smith is a PR nightmare for this team, and Mark Sanchez has been totally setup for failure. The whole offense seems like a trainreck already, and with all they have lost on defense, it's not much to be optimistic about, even if your Fireman Ed.

Then there are our Bills. We have the most question marks of any team in the division, IMO. I'm probably gonna said like a very simplistic fan when I say, but in this league, all you have to do is get a good coach or a good qb. If you can get one of those, your probably in the playoffs, but if you can get both, your a superbowl contender. The thing about this team, is we have a new coach, and 2 new qb's. Now, TBH, both (coach & qb) could easily be busts in both categories, but what if they aren't??? What if Marrone can coach, and actually has a good staff behind him?? What if Kolb plays well behind a better O-line?? (Phily & Arizona btw, are probably 31, and 32 in O-line rankings) What if EJ Manuel does get reps this year, and what if he can move the chains?? A couple of things we know. CJ is awesome, our defense has got to be better, and our WR'ing core will be very exciting to watch. IMO, we may be a 3 win team if every question mark is no, but if a few answers are yes, we might be a 9 win team this year.

Hammer away!!

I know you are right that Belicheck & Brady will go in to the HOF, but it just does not seem right that those two could CHEAT their way in to the HOF especially since they have done NOTHING since the Cheating was stopped & they had the ADVANTAGE ALL THOSE YEARS of playing in a TERRIBLE Division which just about insured a playoff game at home for them, after sitting home the wildcard weekend while other teams knocked each other out of the playoffs.

[justasportsfan]

Pats may have to revert back to their 2007 season offense although they don't have Moss but they do have Jones to take his place. :D .

Talent wise, they definitely got weaker. I don't care what schemes they run but without Gronk or Hernandez , they're are not going to have that much advantage in creating mismatches. They are going to have to run the ball and be successful at it. Brady is Brady but Amendola is not Welker.

[mayotm]

I know you are right that Belicheck & Brady will go in to the HOF, but it just does not seem right that those two could CHEAT their way in to the HOF especially since they have done NOTHING since the Cheating was stopped & they had the ADVANTAGE ALL THOSE YEARS of playing in a TERRIBLE Division which just about insured a playoff game at home for them, after sitting home the wildcard weekend while other teams knocked each other out of the playoffs.They've been to two Super Bowls since they were caught cheating. Brady has continued to put up MVP type numbers. That's "doing nothing" in your book, yet you'll contiune hype the likes of Marcus Easley every year. Interesting. I hate the Pats as much as any Bills fan, but they are still clearly the class of the division.

[justasportsfan]

I know you are right that Belicheck & Brady will go in to the HOF, but it just does not seem right that those two could CHEAT their way in to the HOF especially since they have done NOTHING since the Cheating was stopped & they had the ADVANTAGE ALL THOSE YEARS of playing in a TERRIBLE Division which just about insured a playoff game at home for them, after sitting home the wildcard weekend while other teams knocked each other out of the playoffs.
you don't need to win a sb to get to the HOF. Ask Marv and Kelly. But BBs and Brady's superbowls will have *

[better days]

They've been to two Super Bowls since they were caught cheating. Brady has continued to put up MVP type numbers. That's "doing nothing" in your book, yet you'll contiune hype the likes of Marcus Easley every year. Interesting. I hate the Pats as much as any Bills fan, but they are still clearly the class of the division.

Yes the Pats* are the class of a SUCK AZZ division. I already said that. Do you think they would have gone to two more Super Bowls if they played in the AFC North or NFC East for example? I DOUBT they would have myself.

And we will see what kind of numbers Brady puts up this year with FEW weapons. If he puts up MVP numbers this year, I will have to give him more credit.

[Historian]

They are still the favorites until proven otherwise.


Conversely, we're still a joke until we prove otherwise.

[OpIv37]

Yes the Pats* are the class of a SUCK AZZ division. I already said that. Do you think they would have gone to two more Super Bowls if they played in the AFC North or NFC East for example? I DOUBT they would have myself.

And we will see what kind of numbers Brady puts up this year with FEW weapons. If he puts up MVP numbers this year, I will have to give him more credit.

Well the Bills play in the same suck ass div and have horrendous div records, yet you continue to tout Bills players who have accomplished nothing while ****ting on Patriots players who had much better stats and a lot more wins.

Don't ge me wrong- I despise the Patriots. Bu it hurts your credibility when you try to say the Bills have talent while simultaneously dumping on Patriots players who have accomplished a lot more than anyone on the Bills' roster.

[Meathead]

that team has never been more devoid of stars than it is right now

wont matter. as long as youve got arguably the best qb ever still in his prime, you could stock the team from the local retirement home and still win eleven games

[better days]

that team has never been more devoid of stars than it is right now

wont matter. as long as youve got arguably the best qb ever still in his prime, you could stock the team from the local retirement home and still win eleven games

Well, I think this is where people are wrong that think that way. YES having Brady is a HUGE advantage, but he can't do it alone. And even in the past when it has been said he had no stars, those players were BETTER than the likes of Donald Jones.

[OpIv37]

Well, I think this is where people are wrong that think that way. YES having Brady is a HUGE advantage, but he can't do it alone. And even in the past when it has been said he had no stars, those players were BETTER than the likes of Donald Jones.

I'd love to know what you'd be saying about Donald Jones right now if the Bills had retained him

[justasportsfan]

I'd love to know what you'd be saying about Donald Jones right now if the Bills had retained him

I know what you'd be saying :D

[better days]

I'd love to know what you'd be saying about Donald Jones right now if the Bills had retained him

I was NEVER a Donald Jones fan. You can go through my past posts & I doubt you find me say anything positive about him other than I hope he reaches his potential (before the season started) or something like that.

His stats SHOULD improve with Brady throwing him the ball, but as I said if he drops the ball in NE as he did in Buffalo, Brady will not throw to him very often.

[BleedinGreenNC]

When is the last time you can remember the AFC East being a big giant question mark during the off season?

It's been a very long time.

The Patriots have a serious Tight End problem. Tim Tebow is not an NFL TE...at 6'2 235 lbs, he's too small.

Danny Amendola is Tom Brady's new boyfriend.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1683559-grading-the-new-england-patriots-major-offseason-moves-to-date/page/2

Last Tuesday...you could hear Brady yelling on the field, a hundred yards away from where the media was, and he was saying, "I love it! I love it, Danny! That's the way to do it, Danny!"

Will the new romance cure Tom's loss of Wes Welker?

Will Danny boy be Tom's new fountain of youth? At 36 years of age, maybe Tom wants to finally settle down?

On to the Dolphins...

Lots of off season fish maneuvering. Left tackle is a huge question mark, and they resigned their backup QB for 2 years, $8 million. They may as well have just slapped Ryan Tannehill in the face and said, "It's your job to lose pal, don't get hurt buddy!"

The Fins continue to look for Dan Marino's replacement on the QB carousel in Miami.

Meanwhile...

The Jets are in salary cap jail for the next 5 years or more if they don't unload practically half of their roster. Sanchez is done in New York after making an ass out of himself in more than one way. They drafted a quarterback with thin skin in Gino Smith, and their DC left the team to join...

The Buffalo Bills. In an odd kind of way, the Bills have the most stability in the division.

Compared to the the Pats, Fins, and Jets...the Bills seem ready to pounce on their AFC East rivals.

I understand how The Brady Bill in New England has been the foundation of stability for over the past decade, but now they have Tim Tebow's media circus compounded with murder charges against Hernandez, who according to Wikipedia..."is an American football tight end who is currently a free agent. He most recently played for the New England Patriots."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Hernandez

"Who is currently a free agent."

(not a joke, they actually said that...)

Imagine how many players on the team are being asked questions by investigators right now?

Want to bet that law enforcement officials are trying to find out who knew what by talking to his teammates?

How many players will be involved in the investigation? A lot of people in the franchise are going to be interviewed and asked serious questions.

None of this will be televised or reported on because the NFL can hire the best PR agency in the world so none of us ever hear or see anything about what's actually going on inside of the New England Patriot's fortress. Belichick won't say a word even though he could very well be in a room right now, answering questions he by his own nature does not like to answer to.

Dare I ask this...did any of his teammates know about what AH did and didn't say anything?

If I was a detective working for law enforcement, some of the first people I would want to talk to are his teammates and his coaches.

It's been a very interesting off season. One like no other...35 arrests of NFL players.

The Buffalo Bills have the cleanest slate of all.

Opportunity is knocking hard on One Bills Drive.



Salary cap jail for the next 5 years? You should do your research before you type. The Jets will have around $24 million in cap space in 2014, no dead money on the books for 2014.

[BillsFever21]

I know you are right that Belicheck & Brady will go in to the HOF, but it just does not seem right that those two could CHEAT their way in to the HOF especially since they have done NOTHING since the Cheating was stopped & they had the ADVANTAGE ALL THOSE YEARS of playing in a TERRIBLE Division which just about insured a playoff game at home for them, after sitting home the wildcard weekend while other teams knocked each other out of the playoffs.

They haven't done anything since then? Are you kidding? They have been in two SB's and if not for the Giants having their number then they may have won both of them. The first one took an amazing catch by Tyree to beat them and the most recent one would've been a victory if Welker didn't drop an easy catch that would've been a TD then they probably would've won the second time they played them.

They have also been to AFC Championship games during the span along with winning the AFC East all but one of the seasons when Brady was injured. Even then they still won 11 games that year.

If that's considered not doing anything since their SB victories then I wish the Bills wouldn't have done "anything" for the past decade.

[BillsFever21]

Yes the Pats* are the class of a SUCK AZZ division. I already said that. Do you think they would have gone to two more Super Bowls if they played in the AFC North or NFC East for example? I DOUBT they would have myself.

And we will see what kind of numbers Brady puts up this year with FEW weapons. If he puts up MVP numbers this year, I will have to give him more credit.

The division hasn't been very strong but they still had to beat them other teams in the playoffs to make it to the SB or AFC Championship games. They also had to beat their teams outside of the division. The would be a valid excuse if they were winning the division with 8 or 9 wins a year while 6 or 7 of their wins was in the division.

And if the division is that bad then what does that say for the Bills who have finished last in the division for that entire time except for maybe a year or two? Not to mention the horrible division record that we've had and not only against the Patriots.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

The division hasn't been very strong but they still had to beat them other teams in the playoffs to make it to the SB or AFC Championship games. They also had to beat their teams outside of the division. The would be a valid excuse if they were winning the division with 8 or 9 wins a year while 6 or 7 of their wins was in the division.

And if the division is that bad then what does that say for the Bills who have finished last in the division for that entire time except for maybe a year or two? Not to mention the horrible division record that we've had and not only against the Patriots.

7 division wins is quite the feat ;)

[BillsFever21]

7 division wins is quite the feat ;)

Nice catch. I meant 5 or 6 of their wins lol. The Patriots and the NFL are such cheaters they must be stealing an extra divisional win without anybody noticing.

[gebobs]

they have done NOTHING since the Cheating was stopped
Yeah, nothing but 4 division titles and playoff appearances and 60-20 in the regular season since the beginning of '08. Sure they're just 3-4 in playoffs and have only one conference championship. Fortunately for them, the HoF isn't just another rehash of Super Bowl memories. ;-)

I know we're all bitter about the Patriots and want to rationalize their success. IMHO, if they got an edge with Spygate, it was only slight and only added to an already significant edge they had on the rest of the league. By all means, chide them for skirting the rules. Every team does. Even the Bills (Gregg Williams polished his bounty tactics with us).

But give them some credit too. If the Patriots benefited from playing in a weak AFC East, they were a big reason why the other teams were such abysmal failures. Under those two, they average 12.2 wins a year and 443 points scored. You have to go back to 1991 to find the one and only Bills team that even scored that much in one season, let alone a dozen. If they never won a single Super Bowl, they would still be in the HoF. :-)

[better days]

Well the Bills play in the same suck ass div and have horrendous div records, yet you continue to tout Bills players who have accomplished nothing while ****ting on Patriots players who had much better stats and a lot more wins.

Don't ge me wrong- I despise the Patriots. Bu it hurts your credibility when you try to say the Bills have talent while simultaneously dumping on Patriots players who have accomplished a lot more than anyone on the Bills' roster.

Aside from Gronk, the Pats* have NO players at receiver that have accomplished more than the Bills.

We will see at the end of the season about my credibility in regards to this subject.


Bills: Stevie Johnson > Pats*: Danny Amendola Stevie has BETTER stats.

Bills: TJ Graham > Pats*: Donald Jones

Bills: Robert Woods ? Pats*: Aaron Dobson ? Who knows who will be better? And Dobson will have Brady throwing him the ball. Still I like Woods chances to be better than Dobson.

Bills: Da'Rick Rogers, Marquise Goodwin, Chris Hogan ? Pats*: Kamir Aiken, Josh Boyce, Julian Edelman ? .................a bunch of ??????????????? on both teams but I think the Bills will strike GOLD before the Pats* from these players.

Bills: Scott Chandler, ChrisGragg Pats*: Rob Gronkowski, Jake Ballard................no question Gronk if healthy is MUCH greater than Chandler. But what if Gronk only plays 8 games & what if he is not the Gronk of old after back surgery? I think Chandler is at least even with Ballard & I think Gragg will be better than any other TE the Pats* have.

Feel free anyone that disagrees with my assessment. Like I said we will see at the end of the season how my credibility is.

[BillsFever21]

If you predict something long enough it eventually has to come true. It wouldn't be any huge bold prediction.

[better days]

Yeah, nothing but 4 division titles and playoff appearances and 60-20 in the regular season since the beginning of '08. Sure they're just 3-4 in playoffs and have only one conference championship. Fortunately for them, the HoF isn't just another rehash of Super Bowl memories. ;-)

I know we're all bitter about the Patriots and want to rationalize their success. IMHO, if they got an edge with Spygate, it was only slight and only added to an already significant edge they had on the rest of the league. By all means, chide them for skirting the rules. Every team does. Even the Bills (Gregg Williams polished his bounty tactics with us).

But give them some credit too. If the Patriots benefited from playing in a weak AFC East, they were a big reason why the other teams were such abysmal failures. Under those two, they average 12.2 wins a year and 443 points scored. You have to go back to 1991 to find the one and only Bills team that even scored that much in one season, let alone a dozen. If they never won a single Super Bowl, they would still be in the HoF. :-)

The Pats* were the beneficiaries of playing in a WEAK AFC East. The Pats* were no more reason the Bills, Jets & Fins were abysmal failures than any other team that those teams faced outside the division.
And when the Bills were going to the Super Bowl, Miami was ALMOST as GOOD as the Bills & the Jets & Pats* were MUCH better than the 3rd & 4th place teams of the Pats* run so the Bills did not have a WEAK division to beat up on as the Pats* have had.

[better days]

If you predict something long enough it eventually has to come true. It wouldn't be any huge bold prediction.

Well then, JOIN me now in predicting the Pats* downfall.

[BillsFever21]

Actually for being such a horrible division the Bills have done much better outside the division over the past 5 years since the last time they had a winning record inside the division. The Pats also have a good record outside of the division over this span with a record of 36-14. Our division hasn't been great but it's not because of the Pats just beating up on a bad division.

Inside the division since 2008 - 6-24
Outside the division since 2008 - 23-27
Total record since 2008 - 29-51

The Bills have averaged 1.2 wins in the division over the past 5 seasons and 4.6 outside the division during that span. If the division was the only reason why the Pats were any good then how come the Bills are almost .500 outside of the division yet they can't win inside of the division? Even if the Bills would've averaged 4 wins inside the division over that span they would've been 43-37 over the past 5 seasons for an average of almost 9 wins a year.

Probably the worse example was in 2008 when they were 0-6 in the division yet they were 7-3 outside of the division. Even a .500 divisional record that year puts them in the playoffs. The biggest problem for the Bills haven't been outside the division it's been inside the division. Had they played better inside the division over the past 5 years we would've seen at least 1 playoff appearance.

[better days]

The division hasn't been very strong but they still had to beat them other teams in the playoffs to make it to the SB or AFC Championship games. They also had to beat their teams outside of the division. The would be a valid excuse if they were winning the division with 8 or 9 wins a year while 6 or 7 of their wins was in the division.

And if the division is that bad then what does that say for the Bills who have finished last in the division for that entire time except for maybe a year or two? Not to mention the horrible division record that we've had and not only against the Patriots.

The Pats* BENEFITED from being AFC EAST Division Champions. As such, they were granted a first rnd bye & a HOME game. HUGE ADVANTAGE BOTH.

And has been pointed out, your numbers are WAY OFF. Winning the MAXIMUM 6 games in division as the Pats* did last year, they only had to win 6 games outside the Division to reach 12-4 & a HIGH ranking among playoff teams.

The Pats* Won against the Titans (Away) Broncos (Home) Rams (London) Colts (Home)Texans (Home) Jags (Away)

The Pats* LOST against the Cards (Home) Ravens (Away) Seahawks (Away) 49ers (Home)

In other words, the Pats* record outside the AFC East Division was 6-4...........................NOT impressive at all. The Pats* as they have for the entire 21st Century, BENEFITED from playing in the WEAK AFC EAST last year & YES the Bills were among the WEAKEST OF THE WEAK in the division in that time.

[gebobs]

The Pats* were the beneficiaries of playing in a WEAK AFC East. The Pats* were no more reason the Bills, Jets & Fins were abysmal failures than any other team that those teams faced outside the division.

They certainly were beneficiaries of playing in a weak division. I said just that. But those Bills, Jets and Dolphins teams held their own outside the division and have been absolutely owned within. During that time, the rest of the AFC East is a combined 249-271 (0.479). Not great, slightly below average. Pretty good for the bottom three teams in the division actually. Over the same span, they are 15-59 (0.203) against the Patriots. So to be clear, the Patriots did far more damage to those teams than the rest of the league did.

Twelve years of utter domination in a division. Never once have they lost more than 2 games in the division during a season. Has any other team dominated a division for that long? I doubt it. The rest of the division may have sucked, but to be the one that is on top for 12 seasons in a row (yes, Miami edged them out one year though they had the same record) is nothing short of amazing.

Like it or not, BB/TB will go down in NFL history as one of the greatest coach/QB tandems in NFL history. I hate them like hell, but they get my respect. They deserve it.


And when the Bills were going to the Super Bowl, Miami was ALMOST as GOOD as the Bills & the Jets & Pats* were MUCH better than the 3rd & 4th place teams of the Pats* run so the Bills did not have a WEAK division to beat up on as the Pats* have had.
I guess I agree. The Bills never did dominate the division but one year, 1991. However, I'm not clear why you bring the Bills up. The Bills, by your measure, never did anything either.

[better days]

Actually for being such a horrible division the Bills have done much better outside the division over the past 5 years since the last time they had a winning record inside the division. The Pats also have a good record outside of the division over this span with a record of 36-14. Our division hasn't been great but it's not because of the Pats just beating up on a bad division.

Inside the division since 2008 - 6-24
Outside the division since 2008 - 23-27
Total record since 2008 - 29-51

The Bills have averaged 1.2 wins in the division over the past 5 seasons and 4.6 outside the division during that span. If the division was the only reason why the Pats were any good then how come the Bills are almost .500 outside of the division yet they can't win inside of the division? Even if the Bills would've averaged 4 wins inside the division over that span they would've been 43-37 over the past 5 seasons for an average of almost 9 wins a year.

Probably the worse example was in 2008 when they were 0-6 in the division yet they were 7-3 outside of the division. Even a .500 divisional record that year puts them in the playoffs. The biggest problem for the Bills haven't been outside the division it's been inside the division. Had they played better inside the division over the past 5 years we would've seen at least 1 playoff appearance.

I think the reason the Bills have faird better outside the division is those teams do not know the Bills as well as the teams in the division do, especially the Pats*. Hopefully this year will be different because this team will not be known to all.

[better days]

They certainly were beneficiaries of playing in a weak division. I said just that. But those Bills, Jets and Dolphins teams held their own outside the division and have been absolutely owned within. During that time, the rest of the AFC East is a combined 249-271 (0.479). Not great, slightly below average. Pretty good for the bottom three teams in the division actually. Over the same span, they are 15-59 (0.203) against the Patriots. So to be clear, the Patriots did far more damage to those teams than the rest of the league did.

Twelve years of utter domination in a division. Never once have they lost more than 2 games in the division during a season. Has any other team dominated a division for that long? I doubt it. The rest of the division may have sucked, but to be the one that is on top for 12 seasons in a row (yes, Miami edged them out one year though they had the same record) is nothing short of amazing.

Like it or not, BB/TB will go down in NFL history as one of the greatest coach/QB tandems in NFL history. I hate them like hell, but they get my respect. They deserve it.


I guess I agree. The Bills never did dominate the division but one year, 1991. However, I'm not clear why you bring the Bills up. The Bills, by your measure, never did anything either.

I was responding to another poster that brought the Bills up. As I said before, YES the Pats* have DOMINATED the AFC East. Does ANYONE think they would have dominated the AFC North? Or the NFC East in the same manor? I sure don't.

[gebobs]

In other words, the Pats* record outside the AFC East Division was 6-4...........................NOT impressive at all.It sure isn't impressive, but everyone with a working knowledge of the NFL knows the 2012 Pats were probably among the two worst squads under BB/TB.

But just as you focus on the 6-4 mark outside the division and wave off the 6-0 mark within (impressive in any division, any season, for any team), you focus on a season that was by all measures a disappointment and casually disregard the epic dozen years of domination, a run that is not over until another team steps up.




The Pats* as they have for the entire 21st Century, BENEFITED from playing in the WEAK AFC EAST last year & YES the Bills were among the WEAKEST OF THE WEAK in the division in that time.
That's fine and dandy. The 2001-2102 Patriots is still among the greatest dynasties in football and will feature many players in the HoF.

[mayotm]

Aside from Gronk, the Pats* have NO players at receiver that have accomplished more than the Bills.

We will see at the end of the season about my credibility in regards to this subject.


Bills: Stevie Johnson > Pats*: Danny Amendola Stevie has BETTER stats.

Bills: TJ Graham > Pats*: Donald Jones

Bills: Robert Woods ? Pats*: Aaron Dobson ? Who knows who will be better? And Dobson will have Brady throwing him the ball. Still I like Woods chances to be better than Dobson.

Bills: Da'Rick Rogers, Marquise Goodwin, Chris Hogan ? Pats*: Kamir Aiken, Josh Boyce, Julian Edelman ? .................a bunch of ??????????????? on both teams but I think the Bills will strike GOLD before the Pats* from these players.

Bills: Scott Chandler, ChrisGragg Pats*: Rob Gronkowski, Jake Ballard................no question Gronk if healthy is MUCH greater than Chandler. But what if Gronk only plays 8 games & what if he is not the Gronk of old after back surgery? I think Chandler is at least even with Ballard & I think Gragg will be better than any other TE the Pats* have.

Feel free anyone that disagrees with my assessment. Like I said we will see at the end of the season how my credibility is.What about your boy Marcus Easley? Or are you done predicting his greatness?

[IlluminatusUIUC]

I was responding to another poster that brought the Bills up. As I said before, YES the Pats* have DOMINATED the AFC East. Does ANYONE think they would have dominated the AFC North? Or the NFC East in the same manor? I sure don't.

I wouldn't discount it. Since their run started in 2001, they are 6-3 vs. the Steelers, 5-3 vs. the Ravens, 4-1 against the Bengals, and 4-1 against the Browns and one of the Steelers losses came during the Cassel year.

They are 2-3 against the Giants (2 obviously being Super Bowls), 3-0 vs the Cowboys, 4-0 vs. the Eagles (1 Super Bowl), and 2-1 vs. the Redskins.

[gebobs]

I was responding to another poster that brought the Bills up. As I said before, YES the Pats* have DOMINATED the AFC East. Does ANYONE think they would have dominated the AFC North? Or the NFC East in the same manor? I sure don't.Certainly not. I agree on that. Regardless, they would still have been among the top teams. In 2001, only the Steelers had a better record and the Pats beat them fair and square in Pittsburgh. In '03, they beat two of the top three teams other than themselves to get to the show.

Any way you slice it, 12 years of domination has to be reckoned with. How long did Kelly succeed in the division on his way to being canonized in Buffalo? Seven or so. Consider all the great coaching/qb tandems in league history. Six years is epic. Twelve and going is historical.

[BillsFever21]

The Pats* BENEFITED from being AFC EAST Division Champions. As such, they were granted a first rnd bye & a HOME game. HUGE ADVANTAGE BOTH.

And has been pointed out, your numbers are WAY OFF. Winning the MAXIMUM 6 games in division as the Pats* did last year, they only had to win 6 games outside the Division to reach 12-4 & a HIGH ranking among playoff teams.

The Pats* Won against the Titans (Away) Broncos (Home) Rams (London) Colts (Home)Texans (Home) Jags (Away)

The Pats* LOST against the Cards (Home) Ravens (Away) Seahawks (Away) 49ers (Home)

In other words, the Pats* record outside the AFC East Division was 6-4...........................NOT impressive at all. The Pats* as they have for the entire 21st Century, BENEFITED from playing in the WEAK AFC EAST last year & YES the Bills were among the WEAKEST OF THE WEAK in the division in that time.

Their non-divisional record over the past 5 years have been 36-14. They didn't just get to where they're at from beating up on teams inside the division. They still took care of their business outside of playing the Jets, Dolphins and Bills. In their worst years they "only" had a .600 winning percentage outside of the division? Like I stated earlier, I could see if they were winning 5 or 6 games a year inside the division but then only winning a few games a year outside of the division. It's not like they have been winning the division with 8 or 9 wins a year. They have also been good outside of the division.

2012- 6-4
2011- 8-2
2010- 9-1
2009- 6-4
2008- 7-3

Two of the divisional winners in the AFC has a 7-3 record outside of their division in the Texans and Broncos. The Texans were also 5-1 in their division and the Broncos were 6-0 in their division. The majority of good teams have good records because they can beat their teams inside and outside the division. It doesn't matter if you go 6-0 in your division if you can only win a few games outside of your division. To get a first round bye you need at least 12 wins and that involves at least having a .600 winning percentage outside of your division.

You have been predicting the Patriots downfall for years now and each year after that you try and downplay the season they had by making up excuses why they still had a good record. They still need to take care of their business outside of the division or they would be making the playoffs with 9-10 wins a year and playing the first week of every playoff season. Over the past 5 years they have a .720 winning percentage outside of the division. They have been good both in and outside of the division.

[mayotm]

Their non-divisional record over the past 5 years have been 36-14. They didn't just get to where they're at from beating up on teams inside the division. They still took care of their business outside of playing the Jets, Dolphins and Bills. In their worst years they "only" had a .600 winning percentage outside of the division? Like I stated earlier, I could see if they were winning 5 or 6 games a year inside the division but then only winning a few games a year outside of the division. It's not like they have been winning the division with 8 or 9 wins a year. They have also been good outside of the division.

2012- 6-4
2011- 8-2
2010- 9-1
2009- 6-4
2008- 7-3

Two of the divisional winners in the AFC has a 7-3 record outside of their division in the Texans and Broncos. The Texans were also 5-1 in their division and the Broncos were 6-0 in their division. The majority of good teams have good records because they can beat their teams inside and outside the division. It doesn't matter if you go 6-0 in your division if you can only win a few games outside of your division. To get a first round bye you need at least 12 wins and that involves at least having a .600 winning percentage outside of your division.

You have been predicting the Patriots downfall for years now and each year after that you try and downplay the season they had by making up excuses why they still had a good record. They still need to take care of their business outside of the division or they would be making the playoffs with 9-10 wins a year and playing the first week of every playoff season. Over the past 5 years they have a .720 winning percentage outside of the division. They have been good both in and outside of the division.Don't let the facts get in the way. Better Days has his subjective arguments and CAPITALIZED words to refute the facts.

[gebobs]

Don't let the facts get in the way. Better Days has his subjective arguments and CAPITALIZED words to refute the facts.

I get his point. The Pats certainly have benefited from weak intradivisional opponents. He overstated his case saying that they haven't done anything since 2007. That's my main contention.

[mayotm]

I get his point. The Pats certainly have benefited from weak intradivisional opponents. He overstated his case saying that they haven't done anything since 2007. That's my main contention.it's not a major revelation that the division has been weak, especially the past two seasons. As Bills fans, we all hate the Patriots. Some people just choose to ignore the facts. They've been a damn good team for many years.

[better days]

It sure isn't impressive, but everyone with a working knowledge of the NFL knows the 2012 Pats were probably among the two worst squads under BB/TB.

But just as you focus on the 6-4 mark outside the division and wave off the 6-0 mark within (impressive in any division, any season, for any team), you focus on a season that was by all measures a disappointment and casually disregard the epic dozen years of domination, a run that is not over until another team steps up.




That's fine and dandy. The 2001-2102 Patriots is still among the greatest dynasties in football and will feature many players in the HoF.

The reason I disregard the years of domination is because of the CHEATING the Pats* did during that time. And anyone that thinks it was not a HUGE advantage to CHEAT, answer this question.

WHY, when Goodell told them to STOP CHEATING the Pats* did not? If they had, the CHEATING would all have been blown under the rug & would not have been an issue.

I will tell you why the Pats* did not stop the CHEATING even when the Commissioner told them to do so...................it was a HUGE ADVANTAGE!

And if the 2012 Pats* were among the two worst squads under BB/TB after this year the 2012 Pats* will be among the three worst squads under BB/TB because this years team will be worse than last years.

The Pats* are on the DECLINE.

And yes, they were a dynasty with a number of players going to the HOF, but like Roger Marris who had an asterisk placed behind his name in the HOF because he beat Babe Ruths record in more games played, the Pats* & all associated with that team should have an asterisk* as well because of the CHEATING they did.

[better days]

Certainly not. I agree on that. Regardless, they would still have been among the top teams. In 2001, only the Steelers had a better record and the Pats beat them fair and square in Pittsburgh. In '03, they beat two of the top three teams other than themselves to get to the show.

Any way you slice it, 12 years of domination has to be reckoned with. How long did Kelly succeed in the division on his way to being canonized in Buffalo? Seven or so. Consider all the great coaching/qb tandems in league history. Six years is epic. Twelve and going is historical.

CHEATING & WEAK division.

That is how I view it.

[better days]

Don't let the facts get in the way. Better Days has his subjective arguments and CAPITALIZED words to refute the facts.

You should have capitalized FACTS.

I use caps as I have said before in the same way I would use pronunciation if we were talking.