Byrd wants to be top paid Safety

[The King]

Chris Brown ‏<s style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(187, 187, 187); ">@</s>ChrisBrownBills (https://twitter.com/ChrisBrownBills)<small class="time" style="font-size: 12px; color: rgb(187, 187, 187); position: relative; float: right; margin-top: 1px; ">39m (https://twitter.com/ChrisBrownBills/status/356805329440350212)</small>
This would put it north of $9.125M per yr. RT <s style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(130, 218, 245); ">@</s>adambenigni (https://twitter.com/AdamBenigni): Source: <s style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(130, 218, 245); ">#</s>Bills (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Bills&src=hash) Byrd demanding to be highest paid safety in NFL. Told Bills...

Oh good, thanks to these demands we probably can get a couple of third round picks for him.

Yay.

Byrd's very good, but he's not Ed Reed or Troy Polamalu (in their prime), he can't single handed change the tide of a game. Bills wanted to make him a top 4 or 5paid safety and that's right where he is.

[Pinkerton Security]

Ugh....soab. I love Byrd, but thats too much.

[Meathead]

agreed

if the bills are offering in the 7 mil and up range, hes crazy to play the season without taking that deal. hes just asking for the same kind of injury that just cost two other big name guys at least half their paycheck last season and who knows if they will ever get paid like that again

[Mr. Miyagi]

That sucks.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Well the Bills have certainly laid the groundwork to deal him for peanuts and get praised for it by this board, that's for sure.

[GingerP]

The spin is starting. Average value is a poor indicator of contract value. It is how much he is receiving in the first few years that matters. He is probably asking for more early on than the Bills want to pay him. He is likely to play on the 1-year deal now, and the question becomes whether the Bills give him a franchise prohibition for next year to get him to show up for camp. Otherwise, I don't see him showing until late August.

I find it questionable the Bills are hesitant to pay Byrd when Mario Williams has a $10.6M roster bonus (guaranteed) and $18.4M cap number coming next year. Why pay one and not the other? Makes no sense.

[TigerJ]

I guess we hope Aaron Williams turns out to be a terrific safety. It's not impossible.

[jimmifli]

Top paid players are only top paid for one season. Then next season other players that aren't as good pass them. By the 3rd or 4th year they are priced fair or even bargains.

Saying Byrd doesn't change games is silly. His interceptions won couple of games last season. He's absolutely worth being made the highest paid free safety in the NFL, which doesn't mean he's the best safety in the NFL. It just means he's the best free agent safety in the NFL this season.

[jimmifli]

I guess we hope Aaron Williams turns out to be a terrific safety. It's not impossible.

Chris Kelsay becoming a good LB wasn't impossible either. It's pretty comparable. 2nd round draft pick struggles at his position, is moved to a new position he's never played in a scheme he's never played and expected to perform better than he did playing his familiar position in a familiar scheme.

So, how long until Aaron Williams get a 6 year $38 million dollar contract?

[OpIv37]

Even if the team wanted to pay him that much, do we have the cap space?

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Even if the team wanted to pay him that much, do we have the cap space?

Yes. One of the positives of constantly dumping vets is that the Bills roster is fairly cheap at a lot of positions.

[GingerP]

Even if the team wanted to pay him that much, do we have the cap space?

Yes. The Bills currently have $18,665,064 in cap space, per the NFLPA. That is the 5th most space in the NFL.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Yes. The Bills currently have $18,665,064 in cap space, per the NFLPA. That is the 5th most space in the NFL.

And if I'm not mistaken, that already accounts for Byrd's franchise tag #.

[GingerP]

And if I'm not mistaken, that already accounts for Byrd's franchise tag #.

Yes, it does.

[Mr. Pink]

Of course he wants to be the top paid safety in the NFL.

This is what happens every SINGLE YEAR when a guy who's near the top of his position finishes a contract year.

And he damn well knows that if he hit the open market, he would have been the top paid safety in the NFL.

[tatersalad]

I rhink they feanchise hime again next year, this is the business side of the NFL, and if he does leave we would poddibly get a 3rd in supplemental draft, as I think we get that from Levitre leaving this yr

[Mr. Pink]

I rhink they feanchise hime again next year, this is the business side of the NFL, and if he does leave we would poddibly get a 3rd in supplemental draft, as I think we get that from Levitre leaving this yr

This is exactly why I think Byrd doesn't report til he has to, week 10, to get his year of service. So the Bills don't franchise him again or if they do, they trade him.

[tatersalad]

but at week 10 he gets a prorated portion of 6 millon not a good idea

[Thief]

Franchise him again next year. If he comes back at week 10, let him back up Williams. Lets see who in the NFL wants to make our back safety 10 million a year when he only managed to play spot duty for 12 games over a 2 year span. I F'in hate Eugene Parker. Play hardball. Some day these players are going to learn. These cold weather teams aren't farm teams for the big city glam teams. They are lucky there is even a free agency, let alone the ability to score 10 mil for playing a game you love.

[Goobylal]

Yes. The Bills currently have $18,665,064 in cap space, per the NFLPA. That is the 5th most space in the NFL.
And that includes Byrd's $6.9M tag, meaning they really have $25,565k in cap space

[justasportsfan]

Can't say I blame Byrd. Aim for the stars and you might hit the moon.

[Mike]

And that includes Byrd's $6.9M tag, meaning they really have $25,565k in cap space

And the 'we can't afford' this player argument rages on...

In the future, the CBA should have a rule that any money below salary cap goes to the NFL and is split evenly the same way NFL TV revenues are split evenly.

The Bills are benefiting financially from the Big Market Teams and even had a top 10 profit in the mid 2000's due to low payroll and profit sharing. Thank god, the new CBA has a Salary Cap Floor.

- - - Updated - - -


And that includes Byrd's $6.9M tag, meaning they really have $25,565k in cap space

And the 'we can't afford' this player argument rages on...

In the future, the CBA should have a rule that any money below salary cap goes to the NFL and is split evenly the same way NFL TV revenues are split evenly.

The Bills are benefiting financially from the Big Market Teams and even had a top 10 profit in the mid 2000's due to low payroll and profit sharing. Thank god, the new CBA has a Salary Cap Floor.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

In the future, the CBA should have a rule that any money below salary cap goes to the NFL and is split evenly the same way NFL TV revenues are split evenly.

Interesting idea. I like it.

[GingerP]

And that includes Byrd's $6.9M tag, meaning they really have $25,565k in cap space

If they rescind the tender, yes.

If the Bills franchise Byrd next year he gets a 2-year total of $15,215,200 for the last 2 years, an average salary of $7.607,600. That would make him the NFL's 5th-highest paid S, below Eric Weddle ($8M), DaShon Goldson ($8.25M), Eric Berry ($8.34M) and Troy Polamalu ($9.125M).

[Mike]

Ugh....soab. I love Byrd, but thats too much.

You have to remember that the market sets the price... If he wanted a $100M it would be just as laughable as if the Bills wanted to pay him $500K.

The FS market has a price of around $9M for a premier FS. If the Bills won't pay it, someone else would so why should he take a pay cut to play for a team that hasn't made the playoffs in forever and is trying to low ball him?

If you could change companies right now, get 25-40% more money than your employer is offering, and work for a winner wouldn't you do it?

[Goobylal]

If they rescind the tender, yes.
Yeah, I meant if they sign him to a long term deal, the $6.9M tag essentially gets erased and they'll have $25+M in space until the first year number is known. And that would probably leave them with more cap room than at present, since his first year cap hit will likely be less than $6.9M.

[Meathead]

Can't say I blame Byrd. Aim for the stars and you might hit the moon.

wait, what?

[BillsFever21]

Yes, it does.

That that basically means we have around 25+ million in cap space. Even IF they gave him 9 million a year we would still have 16 million in cap space left which is a good chunk of money. That would be plenty of money to pay Woods if they wanted to next year. I love how people say the Bills are strapped for cap space when they have the 5th most cap space in the NFL.

He also may be asking for 9+ million but all of them guys ask for more then they're willing to take. Just as the team is always willing to pay more then their initial offers. That's all part of a negotiation and eventually if both parties are interested in getting a deal done they meet somewhere around the middle. My guess is he could be had for around 8 million a year like Weddle and Goldston recent received.

Unless he just flat out doesn't want to be in Buffalo or Buffalo doesn't want to pay him then there isn't any reason why a deal couldn't have gotten done. If they gave him 8 million a year that would a million dollars he would be losing this season in guaranteed money and then he would need to wait until next year for a long-term deal if he wasn't tagged again. That would also extend the time before he could become a free agent again.

Goldson and Weddle got around 19+ million in guaranteed money over 3 years. If the Bills will already have 6.9 million into a franchise tag for this season and want to keep him then it would be foolish not to dole out 13 million more for a couple more years during the guaranteed money period of the contract.

I'm thinking they probably want to pay him somewhere around 7 million a year like the franchise tag is(average of top 5 safeties) and he is probably asking for 9. It shouldn't have been hard to settle on 8 million a year and get a contract done.

Even though some don't want to admit it because he isn't a long-term Buffalo Bill but them very same people over the past several years were the same ones saying he was a top safety in the league. The guy is a game changer and has made big plays for turnovers for this team which won us a couple more games last season. If we had a better offense to take advantage of the INT's and FF's he has created it would've been even more then that.

If we're not keeping him past this season then we might as well trade him and try to get around a 2nd round pick out of it. There would be a contender who needs a playmaking safety who would give us a 2nd. Especially if it would most likely be a late 2nd round pick. This team isn't going anywhere this season and if he doesn't fit into our long-term plans then try and get something for him. One year of Byrd on this team wouldn't do us any good at all.

As far as holding out until week 10 like some of said there isn't any chance in hell he will do that. Many players threaten to but they're not going to give up over half of their pay for the season whether they are mad about the franchise tag or not. That would be around 4.5 million dollars he would be leaving on the table and that's not going to happen. If he was trying to get an extra 5-10 million over a 5 year contract he sure the hell isn't going to give up 4.5 million by holding out till week 10. That would essentially negate any extra money that he was trying to receive in the first place when it's all said and done.

[BillsFever21]

If they gave him a 5yr-42m dollar contract with around 20 million in the first few years it would be wise to front load the contract this year with 25 million in cap space. Give him 10 million this year and then he would only cost 10 more million over the next couple years of the guaranteed portion of the contract. Why let all the extra cap space go to waste as we would still have 15 million in cap space available even after front loading the contract.

Hell that would still give us plenty of money to extend other younger players already under contract that we want to keep around for a while. If you wanted to keep some average decent starters/depth like Carrington or Hairston you could get them cheap if you offered them an extension and raise while they still have a year or two left on their contract. Even Eric Woods could be had at a cheaper price then after this season if he plays well and happened to stay healthy for once.

Either that or you could get Spiller at a decent price if you wanted to go that route. He only has a couple more years left on his contract and already makes a decent chunk of change anyway. You could give him a 3 or 4 year extension on top of his current contract and get him much cheaper then you would next season or in a couple more years after he lights it up now that he should be the main back without Jackson getting in his way. Turn that 2 years left on his contract into a 5 year deal and it would take him up to around 28 years old when guys like him start losing a step anyway. For the most part RB's are only good up till 30 years old.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

If they gave him a 5yr-42m dollar contract with around 20 million in the first few years it would be wise to front load the contract this year with 25 million in cap space. Give him 10 million this year and then he would only cost 10 more million over the next couple years of the guaranteed portion of the contract. Why let all the extra cap space go to waste as we would still have 15 million in cap space available even after front loading the contract.

Exactly. Intelligent teams stagger their big cap hits so that not every big contract hits at once. There are ways to do this, involving how you apportion a guy's money between signing bonus, guaranteed salary, non-guaranteed salary, and incentives.

[BillsFever21]

I guess none of this matters anymore since the deadline has passed. Good job once again Buffalo. He will cost 6.9 million against the cap anyway and we will still sit there with 18 million left behind in cap space without extending any of our good young players to take advantage of it.

We supposedly couldn't keep Levitre because we needed to save the money for a contract extension for Byrd. Now we don't even get him signed to an extension. Great use of cap space Buffalo. But hey we got a failed 5 year CB for 4 million a year and a career average LB for 7 million in guaranteed money over the next two years. Between bad coaching and a roster of mostly average players that's why we are always below average and win around 6 games every season.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

But hey we got a failed 5 year CB for 4 million a year and a career average LB for 7 million in guaranteed money over the next two years.

Don't forget a #6-7 wideout and kick returner making $4 million per year. But in an emergency, he can do handoffs!

[BillsFever21]

Don't forget a #6-7 wideout and kick returner making $4 million per year. But in an emergency, he can do handoffs!

Well we obviously need to have that emergency QB on the roster for 4 million a season that can hand the ball off in case 2-3 QB's are injured during the game lol. If it got to that point anyway we're screwed so it doesn't matter. It's not like he can pass and lead us to a victory. Hell I think almost every pass he has thrown for us has been intercepted.

[Beebe's Kid]

Losing a player like Byrd is bad business. You need to retain some guys pass their rookie contracts, and if you have one of the best players at their position...those are the guys you keep. Of course Byrd wants a lot of money...he is going to get it, and Buffalo hasn't given him a lot past a coaching carousel and little real fanfare. His boy Whitner did okay...got through hearing what a piece of **** he was...got to move to the Bay Area, and got paid. Why they hell would he feel compelled to stay for anything less than a **** load of money? He wouldn't.

The price Buffalo pays for being Buffalo is that they either pay, or lose players. I say that they should pay Byrd.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Well it was fun seeing him on sundays in Buffalo, oh well like all good things this must come to an end.

[HAMMER]

Bye Bye Byrdie. He better play and have a stellar year or he will not get top money next year. As we have seen, there are many players that have lost utilizing this strategy. I think he wants out of Buffalo.

[tampabay25690]

Bye bye..,. From what I know the Bills are willing to pay him 7 mill per to a long term deal.....

[tampabay25690]

Losing a player like Byrd is bad business. You need to retain some guys pass their rookie contracts, and if you have one of the best players at their position...those are the guys you keep. Of course Byrd wants a lot of money...he is going to get it, and Buffalo hasn't given him a lot past a coaching carousel and little real fanfare. His boy Whitner did okay...got through hearing what a piece of **** he was...got to move to the Bay Area, and got paid. Why they hell would he feel compelled to stay for anything less than a **** load of money? He wouldn't.

The price Buffalo pays for being Buffalo is that they either pay, or lose players. I say that they should pay Byrd.

Come on wake up...
We won't and shouldn't pay Byrd 9 mill per season......
Come on

[tampabay25690]

Some of u don't realize who is repping Byrd!!!!!!!
He doesnt have a great rep with the Bills and is very $$$$$$$ hungry...
I'm sorry I like Byrd but not for 9 mill plus.......

If I told u that we had the chance to keep Byrd or Spiller who would u choose??????

Yea exactly!!!

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Some of u don't realize who is repping Byrd!!!!!!!
He doesnt have a great rep with the Bills and is very $$$$$$$ hungry...
I'm sorry I like Byrd but not for 9 mill plus.......

If I told u that we had the chance to keep Byrd or Spiller who would u choose??????

Yea exactly!!!

If I told you that was a dumb question because we could easily afford both what would u say????

Exactly.

[SpikedLemonade]

And that includes Byrd's $6.9M tag, meaning they really have $25,565k in cap space

Sounds like the Bills are operating under their own internal salary cap.

I can't wait until the Bills have a new owner.

[tampabay25690]

If I told you that was a dumb question because we could easily afford both what would u say????

Exactly.

U don't think me and every other fan knows that??

[TigerJ]

Chris Kelsay becoming a good LB wasn't impossible either. It's pretty comparable. 2nd round draft pick struggles at his position, is moved to a new position he's never played in a scheme he's never played and expected to perform better than he did playing his familiar position in a familiar scheme.

So, how long until Aaron Williams get a 6 year $38 million dollar contract?Of course, Jairus Byrd was drafted in the second round, played CB in college, and was asked to make a position switch because he didn't have a great skill set for CB. The comparison with Byrd seems more apt because Aaron Williams is still pretty young, was projected to be the best safety in the draft if he made that switch, and we're talking the same positions. Kelsay was asked to change positions because he didn't fit a 3-4 scheme as a DE. No one ever projected him to be a more effective outside linebacker. Aaron Williams was projected to safety before he was drafted because that position fit his skill set better, namely, he didn't have great flexibility in his hips to flip and turn, something that is critical for CBs, not so much for safeties. I'm not predicting Williams is going to be a great safety. That's kind of like hoping lighting will strike in the same place twice. I do think the chances of Williams being at least a solid safety are better than the odds ever were that Chris Kelsay was ever going to be a good linebacker

[sukie]

I have a question. Since we sucked ball sack on D last year and gave up over 430 points. Did Byrd make THAT much of an impact in a shatty team?

[Mike]

I have a question. Since we sucked ball sack on D last year and gave up over 430 points. Did Byrd make THAT much of an impact in a shatty team?

In fact he made a huge difference. According to advanced stats, his play won us 50% of our games. In another 5 games he had game changing plays that gave the Bills a lead!

If the rest of the team was better, instead of him help us win an extra 3 games, the number might be 5!

He is also the highest rated safety in ability to influence the results of a game WPG (i think that's the acronym) was 1.9 compared to Palamalou (sp) who as at .94 (rough estimates) All done on a very poor team!

Lastly, this isn't your fathers NFL. FS are becoming very important in today's pass happy nfl.

[BertSquirtgum]

Eugene parker is scum. Trade Byrd before he gets hurt.

[Historian]

I thought he had a phenomenal rookie season, then went to sleep for the last couple years. Yes, the team was terrible, but if you're a true superstar you stand out anyways.

A bit of an uptick last year, but he knew he was about to go into negotiations.

I hope they pay him, not because of his ability, (and he is good, I admit) but to show the rest of the league we are serious in trying to contend, and taking care of our own.

If he walks, the entire organization looks bad, IMO.

[Goobylal]

Sounds like the Bills are operating under their own internal salary cap.

I can't wait until the Bills have a new owner.
A new owner like Pegula (who I love), who will spend good money after bad? Actually I'm ecstatic that they're not paying Byrd $9M/year to play FS. That's insane.

[kishoph]

In fact he made a huge difference. According to advanced stats, his play won us 50% of our games. In another 5 games he had game changing plays that gave the Bills a lead!

If the rest of the team was better, instead of him help us win an extra 3 games, the number might be 5!



Lastly, this isn't your fathers NFL. FS are becoming very important in today's pass happy nfl.

That's just ridiculous, how did our free safety win us 50% of our games ? Even if you take one of Byrds best plays (if not the best) the late int in the Thursday night game, it doesn't mean he won us the game, it could of been Scotts int after that, or McKelvins punt return for a TD or Lindells 4 FG's, it's a team effort. I don't care what stats you go by, you can't say 1 player is responsible for winning us a game. Sure he added to getting us victories, but you keep posting this like if Byrd wasn't on the team, we would of lost those games, which is nonsense.

[jdaltroy5]

A new owner like Pegula (who I love), who will spend good money after bad? Actually I'm ecstatic that they're not paying Byrd $9M/year to play FS. That's insane.
You're ecstatic that they're not paying Byrd 9/m a year?

So what are you going to spend your cut of the 25 mil on?

[Mike]

That's just ridiculous, how did our free safety win us 50% of our games ? Even if you take one of Byrds best plays (if not the best) the late int in the Thursday night game, it doesn't mean he won us the game, it could of been Scotts int after that, or McKelvins punt return for a TD or Lindells 4 FG's, it's a team effort. I don't care what stats you go by, you can't say 1 player is responsible for winning us a game. Sure he added to getting us victories, but you keep posting this like if Byrd wasn't on the team, we would of lost those games, which is nonsense.

There are a couple of sites that keep advanced stats on players impact on the final score of a game and their personal impact on a win/loss.

For example, a player's number would go up if he were to return an interception for a TD in overtime and win the game. Sure, he didn't win it alone however his play was the difference. In 3 of our wins last year, Byrd was the difference and in another 5 games his play either 1) put us up -late in the game- or 2) helped us tie an opponent or 3) gave the offense great field position to go for a tie.

[kishoph]

In 3 of our wins last year, Byrd was the difference and in another 5 games his play either 1) put us up -late in the game- or 2) helped us tie an opponent or 3) gave the offense great field position to go for a tie.

If that's how you look at it, he was the difference in a couple of losses also, I remember him giving up a last minute TD and he looked like complete garbage against the Titans.

[Goobylal]

You're ecstatic that they're not paying Byrd 9/m a year?

So what are you going to spend your cut of the 25 mil on?
How about Spiller and Wood?

[jdaltroy5]

How about Spiller and Wood?

Spiller still has three years left on his contract.

And unless we plan on giving Wood 20 mil a year, there's no reason he can't be extended as well.

[kishoph]

Spiller still has three years left on his contract.

And unless we plan on giving Wood 20 mil a year, there's no reason he can't be extended as well.

Isn't there also a $7 Million hit next year from Fitz ?

[Mike]

If that's how you look at it, he was the difference in a couple of losses also, I remember him giving up a last minute TD and he looked like complete garbage against the Titans.

When all of this is taken into account -both plays that help you win or lose- a stat is established.

Out of all Safties Byrd had the highest impact on win. His effect was around a 1.9 compared to Ed Reed at .9...

In other stats, like effecting the Score he was ranked 3rd among all Safeties.

As a fan, I was fully behind the Bills when they didn't resign Poz, Whitner, etc...

Levitre and Byrd are a different story. Levitre was a standout Guard and Byrd is elite, no question about it, his play changes the outcome of games.

Regarding Wood: to me he is middle of the road Center, perhaps slightly above average. He misses so much time due to injury I would have strongly preferred the Bills keep Levitre instead. But it's these type of decisions that separate the top FO from the mediocre ones.

$25M under the cap, Bills could have all 4 players long term (Spiller, Levitre, Wood, & Byrd) and still have plenty of cap room for other top FAs!

[jdaltroy5]

Isn't there also a $7 Million hit next year from Fitz ?
Yeah, but he's a 3 million dollar hit this year. There's no reason that they can't afford that as well.

Even if they wanted to make up for that, there are definitely guys they could cut to make up the difference.

Cutting Mark Anderson and Brad Smith alone would save 6 mil against the cap. Not that I'm advocating that they do that, but if they get into cap trouble, there are definitely ways to get out of it.

[Typ0]

cash and team into the crapper.

[Fixxxer]

I understand not getting silly overpaying mediocre talent but until we get the franchise QB we can overpaid a little for great or elite talent, and Byrd falls in those two categories, no matter how positive or negative you're about the Bills.

[BertSquirtgum]

F U Byrd.

[psubills62]

My thoughts, FWIW, after skimming this thread:

1) Very few players seem to sit out games anymore. I'd be surprised if Byrd didn't show up before Week 1.

2) Honestly, Byrd is worth the money. Maybe it's the Bills fan rationalizer in me, but I hate paying top dollar. It's rare to find guys actually worth that money. However, statistically, one of the best things any defensive player can do is create turnovers. Byrd does that. Safeties really aren't worth much money, but from what I've heard about Pettine's system, Byrd could be a very valuable player.

3) Moving Aaron Williams to safety is quite different from moving Kelsay to LB. Moving Kelsay to LB means he has entirely different responsibilities, playing in space and more often a 2-point stance, etc. While Williams' responsibilities would also be different, they would be much more subtle differences. Williams' natural position was also assumed to be safety coming out of college, while Kelsay was a 4-3 DE the entire way.

4) Sometimes when these kinds of situations happen, they end up being resolved somewhat surprisingly before the player hits FA the next year. I think it's still possible that Byrd will be re-signed.

If Byrd is not re-signed, I won't agree with the decision. However, as always in football, it's not necessarily about the players who got away, it's who you get. If you get poor players to replace good ones, then that's a problem. If you get good players to replace good ones, then it's fine. I'm not going to worry about players who leave Buffalo, I'll worry about the players they replace them with.

[jdaltroy5]

My thoughts, FWIW, after skimming this thread:

1) Very few players seem to sit out games anymore. I'd be surprised if Byrd didn't show up before Week 1.

2) Honestly, Byrd is worth the money. Maybe it's the Bills fan rationalizer in me, but I hate paying top dollar. It's rare to find guys actually worth that money. However, statistically, one of the best things any defensive player can do is create turnovers. Byrd does that. Safeties really aren't worth much money, but from what I've heard about Pettine's system, Byrd could be a very valuable player.

3) Moving Aaron Williams to safety is quite different from moving Kelsay to LB. Moving Kelsay to LB means he has entirely different responsibilities, playing in space and more often a 2-point stance, etc. While Williams' responsibilities would also be different, they would be much more subtle differences. Williams' natural position was also assumed to be safety coming out of college, while Kelsay was a 4-3 DE the entire way.

4) Sometimes when these kinds of situations happen, they end up being resolved somewhat surprisingly before the player hits FA the next year. I think it's still possible that Byrd will be re-signed.

If Byrd is not re-signed, I won't agree with the decision. However, as always in football, it's not necessarily about the players who got away, it's who you get. If you get poor players to replace good ones, then that's a problem. If you get good players to replace good ones, then it's fine. I'm not going to worry about players who leave Buffalo, I'll worry about the players they replace them with.
I agree with what you said, but I also wanted to add on that it isn't always about getting good players to replace good players.

If it takes you a first round draft pick to replace a good player with a good player, then in reality, that is a negative move because that draft pick could've been used to shore up another position.

[psubills62]

I agree with what you said, but I also wanted to add on that it isn't always about getting good players to replace good players.

If it takes you a first round draft pick to replace a good player with a good player, then in reality, that is a negative move because that draft pick could've been used to shore up another position.
True, but at the same time you'll almost certainly save money on the first round pick which can be spent elsewhere. So there's a cost for each move.

It's really up to the team to determine who the core players are, re-sign them and build around them with good draft picks and veterans who play their role very well. I personally would say Byrd is a core player.

[JCBills]

Oh good, thanks to these demands we probably can get a couple of third round picks for him.

Yay.

Byrd's very good, but he's not Ed Reed or Troy Polamalu (in their prime), he can't single handed change the tide of a game. Bills wanted to make him a top 4 or 5paid safety and that's right where he is.

I say pay the man. He is one of the few in the league that can and has had a massive impact from the safety position. There isn't much he doesn't do as good as anyone if not better. In 4 seasons he has developed from a ball hawk into a complete safety. 18 Ints and 10 FFs screams impact player. He can light up backs and close down lanes in run support. He can flat out ball.

[stuckincincy]

I say pay the man. He is one of the few in the league that can and has had a massive impact from the safety position. There isn't much he doesn't do as good as anyone if not better. In 4 seasons he has developed from a ball hawk into a complete safety. 18 Ints and 10 FFs screams impact player. He can light up backs and close down lanes in run support. He can flat out ball.

I'd rather have my massive impacts coming from somebody on the defensive front seven. :shake:

[JCBills]

I'd rather have my massive impacts coming from somebody on the defensive front seven. :shake:

Other than what we know we have in the front seven, do you see anyone on the roster that is suddenly going to become that? No, but we do know what Byrd brings on the back end. Pay the man.

[stuckincincy]

Other than what we know we have in the front seven, do you see anyone on the roster that is suddenly going to become that? No, but we do know what Byrd brings on the back end. Pay the man.

I understand your point. And he's not one of them. He's a defensive back. And few teams allow themselves to be held up at gunpoint by a defensive back, even though it hurts. See previous Bills' management - Winfield and Clements come to mind. See recently, Jonathan Joseph here in CIN. A tough loss, but that's life.

I'm having trouble with him not signing the tender. The offered cash - top 5 - is a significant increase for him, to say the least. Locally, DE M. Johnson signed his, thanked the B'gals for the big $ increase and the opportunity given to him, and repeatedly said he will play to his utmost this coming season. There's no reason to doubt his words, and CIN knows he's moving on - hence re-signing DE Carlos Dunlap and drafting DE Margus Hunt in the 2nd.

And here's J. Byrd. Mum.

Doesn't that give you pause?

I don't think he's laboring under some sort of mind control by his agent. Either he has a brain filled with pus and can't see reason in a top 5 salary, the Bills' offer has nasty hooks in it, he just flat out doesn't want to ply his trade with BUF anymore, he's betting that fan moaning will fatten his larder, or that there are some kind of cosmic waves acting in unknown fashion. Add your own ideas.


You certainly can throw rocks at the Bills for not getting him re-signed before his contract year.

Whatever is up, this is a team game, and though we all know that the $ is tops in the minds of the players, there are tons of them who know what team spirit is - lived it much of their lives - it matters - and this guy is not showing much there.

I'm done caring what happens.