When do we start getting worried about Gilmore?

[Crisis]

Other than Tuel and Graham (Moorman I guess too?), he was the only other player I could point to that had an abysmal game. He had his up and downs his rookie year (all the advanced stats pointed to him being exceptional his rookie year but I didn't really see it), and has been a complete liability since coming back this year.

I'm not ready to write him off yet obviously, just some progress would be nice.

[pmoon6]

Hmmm. The Chiefs had 124 yards passing and no touchdowns. How did he have a bad game?

[coastal]

Hmmm. The Chiefs had 124 yards passing and no touchdowns. How did he have a bad game?
Dwayne Bowe caught a few hitch passes.

[Novacane]

The passes they were completing were when the CB were playing 10 yds off the line.

[pmoon6]

Dwayne Bowe caught a few hitch passes.I think some people don't take into account the other team has good players as well. And they're also pros.

[coastal]

Well you can never draft enough DBs.

[Bangarang]

Lol this is funny.

[Skooby]

LOL, the Chiefs passing yardage was terrible.

[Novacane]

Hmmm. The Chiefs had 124 yards passing and no touchdowns. How did he have a bad game?




Justin Rogers had worse quarters than that and not all those 124 yards were on Gilmore.

[Novacane]

LOL, the Chiefs passing yardage was terrible.




Their entire offense was terrible. We could of won this game even with the turnovers if they just weren't returned for touchdowns.

[Mr. Pink]

This just in...

Even though Bowe is having a down year, he's still pretty good.

7 catches for 67 yards today.

[Mahdi]

Gilmore got picked on a bit today its true, no worries though.

[Jaybird]

the guy is still working his way back from injury.. and he had a good game. NO worries on Gilmore

[Crisis]

This just in...

Even though Bowe is having a down year, he's still pretty good.

7 catches for 67 yards today.

And that's a season high for Bowe. Not to mention a pass interference Gilmore had on him.

Bowe hasn't had a down-year, he's been INVISIBLE. The defense wasn't the problem today but Gilmore was not, and has been a liability since he came back.

He's even ranked in the bottom 5 for advanced stats for DBs - http://wp.advancednflstats.com/defenderstats.php?pos=CB

I'm not writing him off but people saying he had a good game is just not true. He was picked on all day and has been picked on every single game since coming back. How much of that is because of the injury remains to be seen.

[Mace]

Other than Tuel and Graham (Moorman I guess too?), he was the only other player I could point to that had an abysmal game. He had his up and downs his rookie year (all the advanced stats pointed to him being exceptional his rookie year but I didn't really see it), and has been a complete liability since coming back this year.

I'm not ready to write him off yet obviously, just some progress would be nice.

Gilmore is probably one of the 5 players I worry about not at all.

[The Jokeman]

Gilmore is probably one of the 5 players I worry about not at all.

Agreed Gilmore, Mario, Kyle, Dareus and CJ/Freddie are the only guys I don't worry about if healthy. I could also say the same about Byrd too but I know people are going to hate on him for a lack of INTs and the whole speculation he wants out of here but truth be told think it's a mistake letting him walk after this season. Also I'm going to start to give Cordy Glenn credit too.

[BertSquirtgum]

I have been worried. He really stinks. I was wondering why people couldn't wait till he gets back.

[Mace]

Agreed Gilmore, Mario, Kyle, Dareus and CJ/Freddie are the only guys I don't worry about if healthy. I could also say the same about Byrd too but I know people are going to hate on him for a lack of INTs and the whole speculation he wants out of here but truth be told think it's a mistake letting him walk after this season. Also I'm going to start to give Cordy Glenn credit too.

I'd replace Kyle with Alonso, Dareus with Johnson. I have big problems with this d-line giving up so many gashing runs when you know a gashing run is coming and I can't really blame Pettine for years of the same before he got here.

There's something wrong with the d-line.

[kingJofNYC]

I'm not, rough game at times but still made a couple of break ups. Played with no safety over the top and couldn't afford to get beat deep, kept Bowe in front of him. The one deep throw to Bowe went nowhere because he controlled and squeezed him into the sideline.

If you think Gilmore stinks Hurkey I can't wait to hear what you think of EJ when he actually gets on the field.

[Crisis]

sure looks good today!

[psubills62]

Good question. Feel like he's been targeted a number of times lately.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Pettine's scheme demands a lot of DBs. With so many blitzes and fake blitzes, he's on an island a lot. Both DBs were getting roasted today.

[Mace]

He's still acting like he's wearing the club, he's not healed yet, just rest him a game and through the bye, it doesn't matter. He's batting with that one arm still and obviously not on his game, when plays happen to the bad side where he was injured, he has to clutch with the other one or paw with the bad one. He holds that arm different when in coverage from what I am seeing.

My doubts on Byrd's feet are gone too, on that INT he got to a point he just couldn't run, I thought it was obvious. Gilmore's gonna hurt that wrist again because it never healed all the way, and whatever Byrd is capable of we'll see it for someone else.

It just reminds me too much of playing Terrence McGee on one leg for no purpose.

[OpIv37]

Gilmore got roasted today.

I know- a player isn't defined by one game, good or bad. But it's far from Gilmore's first bad game.

He's not a complete bust, but he's looking like yet another Buffalo draft pick who isn't completely useless but will never justify where he was selected in the draft.

[kingJofNYC]

He's been pretty poor the last two games. Cornerbacks are like QBs, you never know with these guys. Look at Claiborne, he's a ****ing bust and was considered a lock. Still think Gilmore will pan out, played a very good second half last season, we'll see.

[trapezeus]

i won't watch the bills next year if this results in us taking a CB in the first round.

[Crisis]

bump again.

[JoeMama]

Stephen Gilmore is crashing and burning.

A modern day Chris Watson.

[YardRat]

IMO yesterday was more about individual responsibilities in the coverage scheme they put in...Atl ran a lot of picks, over-unders etc...for the life of me, even when they are in man, I don't know why the call isn't to 'switch' instead of sticking with the receiver they are lined up against at scrimmage.

[bills_7]

Next year will be a big year for him we will see if he is a number 1 or 2 guy it's really hard to tell this year with this injury

[Thief]

In Gilmore's defense, kinda hard to cover a guy who pushes off all game and gets away with it. Just saying.

[Saratoga Slim]

I'm not worried about him being a good CB. But I don't see any indication yet that he's going to be in the shut-down class.

[OpIv37]

Stephen Gilmore is crashing and burning.

A modern day Chris Watson.

Nah- at least Watson could catch punts.

Gilmore made some nice plays in the fourth but got toasted again for the first 3 quarters. Another wasted pick.

[trapezeus]

DB's are not an issue. we clearly don't have the top ones or most consistent ones, but we have a pass rush and we are getting to the QB. If the offense could play better and more consistently, our defense won't be on the field all day long.

the last thing this team needs is to go fishing for another DB early in the draft. They need to have some focus on the offense and keep building depth in the front 7 of the defense. any qb who can only get 3 seconds or less to make a play will not exploit mid ranged DBs. when you have a pass rush scheme like wanny did where the DB has to run around with the receiver for 4-5 seconds routinely, the best DB's won't make a difference.

[Mahdi]

Gilmore is a "Seahawk" type CB. Don't play him in off-man and expect him to make a play. He has been doing that a lot lately and it gets him burned. He is not a quick twitch CB. He is a physical CB that knows how to re-route and jam.

I think he is PB caliber but please use him correctly.

[Oaf]

McK is miles past him. How?

[GvilleBills]

McK is miles past him. How?He's been in the league for 5 years maybe? Gilmore showed more last half of '12 than Leo had in his first 3yrs. Its time to pump the brakes on the Gilmore hate people. We will be very happy going forward with #24 and #21. They could use some help though. Robey gets out-physicalled off the line, and Ron Brooks has been injured or invisible.

[GvilleBills]

Gilmore is a "Seahawk" type CB. Don't play him in off-man and expect him to make a play. He has been doing that a lot lately and it gets him burned. He is not a quick twitch CB. He is a physical CB that knows how to re-route and jam.

I think he is PB caliber but please use him correctly.

^^^^ 100%

[Oaf]

I'm tired of seeing Gilmore line up on 3rd and 8+, knowing it's going his way, and seeing it go his way for an easy conversion.

I also agree with Mahdi. I just wish he'd didn't have to keep his hands on the WRs to keep up with them after 5 yards.

[BillsFever21]

So much for our version of Revis Island.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Gilmore is a "Seahawk" type CB.

On PEDs?

[Crisis]

On PEDs?

"Adderall"

[kingJofNYC]

He's been ****, slightly worried at this point. Can't believe McKelvin is our most consistent DB, Robey's been good too but he got skunked against Atlanta.

[Mahdi]

He's been ****, slightly worried at this point. Can't believe McKelvin is our most consistent DB, Robey's been good too but he got skunked against Atlanta.

A lot of playing CB is groove and confidence. Right now two things are going against Gilmore.

One, he is coming back from an injury that affected his biggest asset, his hands, which he uses actively in his style of defense. He's not going to get back to his form from last year right away.

Two, if you remember last year, he was being used to cover every team's best receiver anywhere on the field. I remember him following Larry Fitzgerald all over the field last season and shutting him down. Same with others. That for a CB can elevate his game to another level. Right now he is not being used that way and I don't see him playing with any kind of swagger. When the Bills get back to using him to press every #1 WR he will be back to looking like a PB CB.

[DraftBoy]

A lot of playing CB is groove and confidence. Right now two things are going against Gilmore.

One, he is coming back from an injury that affected his biggest asset, his hands, which he uses actively in his style of defense. He's not going to get back to his form from last year right away.

Two, if you remember last year, he was being used to cover every team's best receiver anywhere on the field. I remember him following Larry Fitzgerald all over the field last season and shutting him down. Same with others. That for a CB can elevate his game to another level. Right now he is not being used that way and I don't see him playing with any kind of swagger. When the Bills get back to using him to press every #1 WR he will be back to looking like a PB CB.

He has to earn the right to cover the other teams #1 and right now he's not playing well enough to do it.

[swiper]

Again, he's still learning. Why are so many people sooooo quick to worry about Gilmore, want to cut Steve Johnson and to replace Hackett - yet want to give Manuel a pass? Manuel is terrible. Footwork is terrible. Vision of the field of play is terrible. Throws under, behind people constantly. You can't teach what he is lacking. QB in the 1st round of 2014 please.

[gr8slayer]

I still don't think that he's completely healthy, and I'm not sure that he has his swagger/confidence back yet. The guy is a hell of a player that's just having a rough kind of year, but he'll rebound. It could be worse, you could have given up a load of draft picks to move up and draft Morris Claiborne. On his worst day, Gilmore is a better CB than Claiborne on his best day.

[Mahdi]

He has to earn the right to cover the other teams #1 and right now he's not playing well enough to do it.

Of course but as I said in my first point. He probably is not where he needs to be after missing 8 weeks and playing with a club his first two weeks back.

If I'm Pettine, I force him to play against everyone's #1 and let him sink or swim. Chances are with his competitiveness and style he will rise to the challenge and regain his confidence.

The only thing that would stop me is the play of Leodis. Since he is playing so well it would be frustrating for him not to get that same opportunity.

[TigerJ]

Lots of fans are worried already. I'm hoping that with an offseason of conditioning and a good training camp next summer Gilmore will have a strong season and turn into the shutdown corner we were hoping for, but the Bills may need to hedge any bet they make on him by drafting a potential starter at cornerback in the 2014 draft.

[better days]

Lots of fans are worried already. I'm hoping that with an offseason of conditioning and a good training camp next summer Gilmore will have a strong season and turn into the shutdown corner we were hoping for, but the Bills may need to hedge any bet they make on him by drafting a potential starter at cornerback in the 2014 draft.

I think CB like WR is way down the list of needs for the Bills.

I would put OL & LB at the top of the list myself.

[DraftBoy]

Again, he's still learning. Why are so many people sooooo quick to worry about Gilmore, want to cut Steve Johnson and to replace Hackett - yet want to give Manuel a pass? Manuel is terrible. Footwork is terrible. Vision of the field of play is terrible. Throws under, behind people constantly. You can't teach what he is lacking. QB in the 1st round of 2014 please.

Because the other side wants to give some players more time and yet rid themselves of others?

I think both sides are nuts. Gilmore, Manuel, Johnson, and Hackett aren't getting cut this offseason nor am I too worried about any of them. Next year is about put up or shut up. This year is simply about getting the new schemes down and showing something on the field.

[DraftBoy]

I still don't think that he's completely healthy, and I'm not sure that he has his swagger/confidence back yet. The guy is a hell of a player that's just having a rough kind of year, but he'll rebound. It could be worse, you could have given up a load of draft picks to move up and draft Morris Claiborne. On his worst day, Gilmore is a better CB than Claiborne on his best day.

Clairborne's issue (imo) is that he's soft. He's not Patrick Peterson and he's not going to jam you at the line of scrimmage. He actually jams with the wrong hand and jams across his body which makes it difficult to turn when the WR breaks free. Haven't watched much Dallas to say if its a scheme issue or a player issue. Amukamara (who I was very high on) seems to have a similar issue in NY.

[GingerP]

Clairborne's issue (imo) is that he's soft. He's not Patrick Peterson and he's not going to jam you at the line of scrimmage. He actually jams with the wrong hand and jams across his body which makes it difficult to turn when the WR breaks free. Haven't watched much Dallas to say if its a scheme issue or a player issue. Amukamara (who I was very high on) seems to have a similar issue in NY.

Amukamara is playing really well this year, he has really developed in his 3rd year. He is more physical than he has been and does a nice job both in coverage and against the run. He has 66 tackles, an Int, 9 passes defensed and 2 forced fumbles. He has blossomed into a good all-around CB. I watched him when they played Green Bay and thought he was playing really well. He got beat once in that game by James Jones for a long completion when he missed a jam, but played physical in both the run and pass game. Good player.

[Mahdi]

I think CB like WR is way down the list of needs for the Bills.

I would put OL & LB at the top of the list myself.

DL, LG and WR are the main needs IMO. We need to stop the run and establish the run first and foremost. Run D is terrible and we need an anchor on the DL. Two, we need to impose our will in the run game and that's not happening with our struggles at LG.

After those two we need a big receiver that is a threat in the redzone. Those needs align well in the draft because you can get a WR #1, a good run stuffing DT in the second and generally you can find a good G prospect in the 3rd round.

[DraftBoy]

Amukamara is playing really well this year, he has really developed in his 3rd year. He is more physical than he has been and does a nice job both in coverage and against the run. He has 66 tackles, an Int, 9 passes defensed and 2 forced fumbles. He has blossomed into a good all-around CB. I watched him when they played Green Bay and thought he was playing really well. He got beat once in that game by James Jones for a long completion when he missed a jam, but played physical in both the run and pass game. Good player.

If he playing outside yet? Last time I saw the Giants he was playing almost exclusively in the slot.

[DesertFox24]

I am not worried about Gilmore, I just hope he does not hurt his wrist again.

All of the fans want to find scape goats and blame people that is why they want to get ride of everyone so fast.

All of these Manual detractors are only repeating what draft experts said prior to the draft and never watched the kid play in college.

Manual was not a finished product entering the draft he was a project and it is up to Marrone and Hackett to polish him up and make him a player that is what they will be judged on.

To that point I am quite confident they will do well as they took an undrafted QB and molded him into a fourth round QB. Nassib was not highly recruited at all was not invited to elite 11 or any of those functions so please dont tell me he was an elite prospect.

Like draftboy said this year was never really about making playoffs it was getting team acclimated to new schemes and getting rookies valuable playing time. Hopefully next year we make the push for the division.

I still think bills are second best team in division even now.

[GingerP]

I still think bills are second best team in division even now.

That depends how you measure relative best-ness.

If you go by how many games they have won, they are 4th in the division. I'm not sure what measure puts them 2nd.

[Meathead]

Gilmore played too well as a rook to be worried just bc he entered a sophomore slump. hes gonna be a star here a loong time

[Crisis]

That depends how you measure relative best-ness.

If you go by how many games they have won, they are 4th in the division. I'm not sure what measure puts them 2nd.

Blind homerism.

[Mace]

I'm still really not worried about Gilmore. I think hurrying him back with the club didn't help him any and this year is still on the job training for system. Healthy and acclimated, I think you see lockdown Gilmore again next year when it all starts to come together. I'd have cut McKelvin before this year 75 times or so, and he's looking good, so Gilmore in a learning, injury year doesn't bother me much You can see he's not using that hand well, still, and a wrist is a huge part of the game for a corner.

He's not been riddled with unrelated ailments that make you worry about him being injury prone, and was too good his first healthy year to make you think he's lost. Doesn't seem to say much, just works harder. Reminds me of early Revis.

[DesertFox24]

Blind homerism.
Well considering that we bet the phins and jets and lost to pats on last second field goal I would say we are second best team in division. This means nothing as teams 2, 3, & 4 will be drafting top 12 this year.

It is called the eye ball test and anyone who says jets are better is smoking. I can sort see the phins argument but we beat them down there and if we sweep them then I cannot see how you can say they are better.

The pats are the pats.

[BertSquirtgum]

Gilmore sucks people. He is targeted every week.

[Crisis]

Bump.