EJ Manuel's Accuracy

[jamze132]

Is it just me or does EJ not possess the natural accuracy gene that elite QBs possess? It seems like the majority of his passes are off the mark which normally leads to (1) INT, (2) incompletion, (3) receiver tipping the ball into the air, (4) receiver getting destroyed by a DB, or (5) receiver making the catch but losing all momentum and/or footing resulting in an immediate tackle.

Or am I off base here? I know I don't have a Masters degree in QB development but I am a die-hard Bills fan so I know exactly what a ****ty QB looks like.

[justasportsfan]

he cant even dink on target.

[Uncle Jesse]

You can't teach accuracy. You can work on the foot work and mechanics, but in the end it's just something you can do. He can't. It was all over his scouting reports too.

[Night Train]

Throws a good slant and post.

When he has to feather a swing pass over the DE/OLB to a RB or arch a deep ball on the sideline fly pattern, he needs practice. Tells me he didn't have to do it at Fla. St. and needs to practice the basics with his position coach.

Not the first guy who showed up a bit raw needing work. They drafted the athlete knowing this.

[OpIv37]

Before this past game, EJ had actually done pretty well in terms of not throwing INT's. Howevwr, he does tend to lead guys into hits and stop guys in their tracks, which is frustrating cuz Fitz had the same problem.

[k-oneputt]

The guy did this his whole career at Fla. St. This is nothing new.

[Thurmal]

Entrusting the Bills to pick out decent QBs is like entrusting a 12-year old girl to pick the music for a cross-country road trip.

[TacklingDummy]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-tPf7Kol_ZDY/TsNjQlE3wuI/AAAAAAAAAM4/cPMnFirfpao/s640/tebow+barn.jpg

[kishoph]

Manuel does seem to have some accuracy problems, to me he seems like he has a harder time with it in the first half of games, but overall his percentage of poor throws per attempt, is not that bad. I used stats in another thread to show this, in fact his percentage of poor throw per all attempts is a fraction lower than Tom Brady's (I am not saying he's better than Brady). He has some bad throws, sometimes horrible (the throws out of bounds), but all his passes are not bad, like some people want to imply.

Blaming Manuel for the hit on Woods is ridiculous IMO, but too many people bought into it because, the color commentator for the game (Steve Beurlein) said so. In the pic below, the ball (circled) has already left Manuel's hands, Woods is coming across the middle (#1), Revis (#2) who made the hit, has just broke off his coverage of Hogan (#3), who was coming back towards the line of scrimmage, because Manuel was scrambling. Is Manuel really suppose to see two receivers at once, when they are half the width of a football field and 10 yards away from each other, and also expect that Revis is going to be able to break off his coverage and and cover the distance to make the hit. If anything at all it was a great play by Revis, although a hit on a defenseless receiver. Also if you watch the replay, you can see Woods reach back for the ball and not running to it and Revis. I'm sorry about being long winded about it, but I'm tired of people (not just on this board) blaming Manuel for the hit on Woods.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v153/kishoph/Image3ss.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/kishoph/media/Image3ss.jpg.html)

[WagonCircler]

It's abundantly clear, especially after last week's debacle, that EJ can throw accurately when he has good protection, but has horrendous accuracy when he has poor protection.

This is why he was considered a project by so many teams.

This is a massive hole in his game that it's hard to imagine being turned into a strength.

Some QBs are NFL ready starters coming out of college. It's clear that EJ is not one of those guys.

[k-oneputt]

I see one quality - he is big, tough to tackle, and can scramble out of pressure.

I also see a qb that - can't throw the ball downfield, is not accurate with his throws, locks on to his #1 option, has poor instincts and feel in the pocket, looks afraid to trust his ability { what he has}, and takes to long to deliver the ball.

But that's just me. I'm sure the Bill's superscouts know better.

[justasportsfan]

It's abundantly clear, especially after last week's debacle, that EJ can throw accurately when he has good protection, but has horrendous accuracy when he has poor protection.

This is why he was considered a project by so many teams.

This is a massive hole in his game that it's hard to imagine being turned into a strength.

Some QBs are NFL ready starters coming out of college. It's clear that EJ is not one of those guys.


EJ's accuracy sucks when he is in a rush or in a panic mode . He reverted back to not trusting his receivers not named Woods or Johnson.

[jamze132]

I think it's ridiculous. How does someone get paid that much to throw the ball that bad?

[Mace]

Before this past game, EJ had actually done pretty well in terms of not throwing INT's. Howevwr, he does tend to lead guys into hits and stop guys in their tracks, which is frustrating cuz Fitz had the same problem.

Thing with Fitz though, his arm couldn't get the ball where his eyes and head meant it to go when he finally achieved starter. You'd notice him trying to put more into firing the ball to compensate ineffectively. Manuel has more arm strength, but not the head. Doesn't know what he's seeing, throws trentatively.

Manuel looks awful. But it's just fact they trotted him out on a short preseason drumming lack of mistakes and speed into his head, he went down, came back and they're drumming patience and ballsy into him. It will either ruin him or make him. Atm, just seems like it confused him. But he was a raw project QB.

Suppose I'd think they should have aimed for a consistent approach not reacting to how the season went, because the show is supposed to really start next year, but were pulled into their own illusion of being good enough. They weren't good enough, or Manuel would be the weak link. Against Tampa the whole team stunk. Big diff between being "a" weak link or "The" weak link.

This team is really just not good enough, or well coached enough to brand Manuel an utter failure yet, though I'm as tempted to as anyone else at this point.

[Fletch]

The guy did this his whole career at Fla. St. This is nothing new.

He did, and if the team had bothered to do their homework they would have easily seen that.

But he was their guy.

You cannot argue with incompetence and idiocy.

[BertSquirtgum]

Is it just me or does EJ not possess the natural accuracy gene that elite QBs possess? It seems like the majority of his passes are off the mark which normally leads to (1) INT, (2) incompletion, (3) receiver tipping the ball into the air, (4) receiver getting destroyed by a DB, or (5) receiver making the catch but losing all momentum and/or footing resulting in an immediate tackle.

Or am I off base here? I know I don't have a Masters degree in QB development but I am a die-hard Bills fan so I know exactly what a ****ty QB looks like.

If you're just using the tampa game as a argument then you're way off base. The entire offense was a complete joke. I've never seen an offense play so bad.

[Bangarang]

It's abundantly clear, especially after last week's debacle, that EJ can throw accurately when he has good protection, but has horrendous accuracy when he has poor protection.

This is why he was considered a project by so many teams.

This is a massive hole in his game that it's hard to imagine being turned into a strength.

Some QBs are NFL ready starters coming out of college. It's clear that EJ is not one of those guys.

So he's like every other QB to play football? Pressure in his face and no help from the o-line leads to inaccurate passes? You may be onto something.....

[WagonCircler]

So he's like every other QB to play football? Pressure in his face and no help from the o-line leads to inaccurate passes? You may be onto something.....

Yes, but waaaayyyy worse under pressure than most.

And he's got a Trent Edwards style vaginal infection. Did you see all those attempts downfield on Sunday?

I didn't.

[jills]

You can't be a successful QB in this league with no accuracy, only the Bills draft a QB with the only trait that can't be corrected.

[jdaltroy5]

Look at all the QBs that started in their first years. Most of them have a sub 60% completion rating and sub 7 YPA.

Peyton, Stafford, Dalton, Tannehill, Bradford, Eli, Flacco, Luck, and Alex Smith all fit that criteria.

Brees, Rivers, Brady, Romo, Rodgers, and Kap all sat for a year before playing full time.

I'm not saying that Manuel will ever be good, but I'd like to give him another year and some more protection before writing him off.

Hopefully the game slows down for him and he gains some confidence in his arm and his receivers.

I really wish that we had kept Levitre so that we could add another RT in the draft this year. Possibly even a mid round pick to play RG.

That line would be dominant.

[Meathead]

Blaming Manuel for the hit on Woods is ridiculous IMO

never made sense to me that the qb is responsible for not getting the wrs hit. unless the target is ten feet away (like a screen) theres no way any qb can determine who is open AND where the defenders are that might hit him

its like ppl who think hockey players pick corners when they shoot. theres just too much going on and too many variables to pick spots to shoot. on a breakaway or if you find yourself in front of the net with nobody around then sure you can aim to a side high or low, but 99% of the time you really have no choice but to aim for the heart of the net and hope it finds its own way in

[jdaltroy5]

never made sense to me that the qb is responsible for not getting the wrs hit. unless the target is ten feet away (like a screen) theres no way any qb can determine who is open AND where the defenders are that might hit him

its like ppl who think hockey players pick corners when they shoot. theres just too much going on and too many variables to pick spots to shoot. on a breakaway or if you find yourself in front of the net with nobody around then sure you can aim to a side high or low, but 99% of the time you really have no choice but to aim for the heart of the net and hope it finds its own way inThe QB IS responsible for his guys getting hit. They can't protect them 100% of the time, but they can place the ball in a spot that can allow the WR to go to the ground right away rather than stretching up and getting nailed.

And what do you mean, you can't pick a corner in hockey? It's not even that hard to do that.

[kishoph]

The QB IS responsible for his guys getting hit. They can't protect them 100% of the time, but they can place the ball in a spot that can allow the WR to go to the ground right away rather than stretching up and getting nailed.

And what do you mean, you can't pick a corner in hockey? It's not even that hard to do that.

Sure there are times when a QB does hang a receiver out to dry, but the players are so fast and can cover so much ground that you can't blame the QB for most hits receivers take, especially coming through the middle.

As far as picking corners in hockey, sure if you're under no pressure and not going full speed, it's not very difficult to do, still not easy. But when you're in a game, especially at higher levels, it's very hard, why do you think so many shots go wide, hit the glass or end up right in the crest of the goalies jersey ? Unless guys are aiming at those spots.

The speed of major league sports is so fast, that things that seem simple to do, aren't so simple, in fact they are pretty hard, if not everyone would be a pro athlete. A good example is a receiver that drops a ball, it's real hard to be running full speed then turn around find the ball and the cradle it in, especially if someone is trying to prevent you from doing it. This is the reason I very rarely (if not ever) dog players, I know how hard the games are, I'll ***** about coaching or management sometimes (still very hard jobs) but players are gonna have drops, fumbles, missed tackles, etc, etc., every player does.

[jdaltroy5]

Sure there are times when a QB does hang a receiver out to dry, but the players are so fast and can cover so much ground that you can't blame the QB for most hits receivers take, especially coming through the middle.I'm not saying that it's easy. It's very difficult, that's why only a select few in the league can consistently do it. And even then, you're going to have an instance of a player getting hurt. Welker got concussed just last week after catching a ball.


As far as picking corners in hockey, sure if you're under no pressure and not going full speed, it's not very difficult to do, still not easy. But when you're in a game, especially at higher levels, it's very hard, why do you think so many shots go wide, hit the glass or end up right in the crest of the goalies jersey ? Unless guys are aiming at those spots.Pucks get tipped, goalies close gaps, take good angles, or they are shooting at the goalie looking for a rebound. Those players must be pretty good if they can consistently score while just throwing it at the net and hoping for the best.


The speed of major league sports is so fast, that things that seem simple to do, aren't so simple, in fact they are pretty hard, if not everyone would be a pro athlete. A good example is a receiver that drops a ball, it's real hard to be running full speed then turn around find the ball and the cradle it in, especially if someone is trying to prevent you from doing it. This is the reason I very rarely (if not ever) dog players, I know how hard the games are, I'll ***** about coaching or management sometimes (still very hard jobs) but players are gonna have drops, fumbles, missed tackles, etc, etc., every player does.Of course pro sports are hard. I've never claimed that I could play pro sports (or anything close to it). But picking a corner in hockey is not difficult. I've been doing it since I was a kid with the foam targets or the fake plastic goalie.

[The last buffalo fan]

Look at all the QBs that started in their first years. Most of them have a sub 60% completion rating and sub 7 YPA.

Peyton, Stafford, Dalton, Tannehill, Bradford, Eli, Flacco, Luck, and Alex Smith all fit that criteria.

Brees, Rivers, Brady, Romo, Rodgers, and Kap all sat for a year before playing full time.

I'm not saying that Manuel will ever be good, but I'd like to give him another year and some more protection before writing him off.

Hopefully the game slows down for him and he gains some confidence in his arm and his receivers.

I really wish that we had kept Levitre so that we could add another RT in the draft this year. Possibly even a mid round pick to play RG.

That line would be dominant.

This and I would grab a QB on any of the first three rounds on next year's draft.

[kishoph]

I'm not saying that it's easy. It's very difficult, that's why only a select few in the league can consistently do it. And even then, you're going to have an instance of a player getting hurt. Welker got concussed just last week after catching a ball.

Pucks get tipped, goalies close gaps, take good angles, or they are shooting at the goalie looking for a rebound. Those players must be pretty good if they can consistently score while just throwing it at the net and hoping for the best.

Of course pro sports are hard. I've never claimed that I could play pro sports (or anything close to it). But picking a corner in hockey is not difficult. I've been doing it since I was a kid with the foam targets or the fake plastic goalie.

I never implied or meant it to seem that you said you could play pro sports, I was basically saying if it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

With picking corners it's different in a full speed hockey game. In a game with 30 shots on net, there's gonna be at least 15 that are not close to the net, there's too many circumstances where you're not going to be able to just come at a goalie pristine and pick a corner, even in shootouts players completely miss the net, or hit the goalie dead in his chest. There's no doubt, if you're just standing in the slot with no pressure, it's not that difficult to pick a spot on the net, but in a game, you'll seldom if ever get that chance

[jdaltroy5]

This and I would grab a QB on any of the first three rounds on next year's draft.I would grab one at any point where there is value, whether it be the first round or the fifth round. However, if that's not the case, I would try to use the first couple of rounds to get protection and weapons for Manuel. If Mettenberger is sitting there in the 4th or Murray in the 5th, I would definitely take them.

[Meathead]

its not just pro level hockey its any level, too many things going on to be able to stop, take a look, and aim for a spot unless youre on a breakaway or a puck just happens to bounce to you when youre all alone in front of the goalie

ask any player not named gretzky and if theyre honest theyll tell you they almost never aim for a spot, they just try to get it on net with as much speed as possible and hope its gets through. the best you can do it maybe try to go high on a goalie that you know goes down or to try for the five hole on a screen, otherwise you just try to shoot hard and to the center of the net. most likely you will be off target anyway and the puck will just find its way in if youre lucky

[jdaltroy5]

I never implied or meant it to seem that you said you could play pro sports, I was basically saying if it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

With picking corners it's different in a full speed hockey game. In a game with 30 shots on net, there's gonna be at least 15 that are not close to the net, there's too many circumstances where you're not going to be able to just come at a goalie pristine and pick a corner, even in shootouts players completely miss the net, or hit the goalie dead in his chest. There's no doubt, if you're just standing in the slot with no pressure, it's not that difficult to pick a spot on the net, but in a game, you'll seldom if ever get that chanceI know it's different in a full speed hockey game. I've been playing hockey for 25 years. He made it seem like NHL players can't aim the puck and they just shoot at the net and hope for the best. That does happen a lot from the point, but those guys aren't even trying to aim the puck.

Just because something gets in the way (goalie or player) doesn't mean that the puck wouldn't have reached its intended target.

[jdaltroy5]

its not just pro level hockey its any level, too many things going on to be able to stop, take a look, and aim for a spot unless youre on a breakaway or a puck just happens to bounce to you when youre all alone in front of the goalie

ask any player not named gretzky and if theyre honest theyll tell you they almost never aim for a spot, they just try to get it on net with as much speed as possible and hope its gets through. the best you can do it maybe try to go high on a goalie that you know goes down or to try for the five hole on a screen, otherwise you just try to shoot hard and to the center of the net. most likely you will be off target anyway and the puck will just find its way in if youre luckyI've played hockey for 25 years. I've played with guys that have made the OHL and even the NHL.

When you're in on a goalie, you are never, ever told to just shoot in the middle and hope for the best.

I remember I specific drill when I was 8, where we would work on aiming for the inside of the post.

If you're talking about shooting it from the point, that's different. It's next to impossible to aim anything from there. The goal is to get it low and hope for a rebound off the pads.

But if you have a legitimate scoring chance, you absolutely can aim the puck and it's not that hard. I'm not saying it's easy to score, because obviously the goalie can block where you're aiming though.

[Buffalogic]

Ej has no accuracy. His long balls are let it loose and pray it doesn't end up out of bounds. He's not presice. At all. I want him to do well, I just don't think it will ever happen.

[WagonCircler]

Ej has no accuracy. His long balls are let it loose and pray it doesn't end up out of bounds. He's not presice. At all. I want him to do well, I just don't think it will ever happen.

I agree. The thing that's maddening to me though, is that he has shown flashes of accuracy on deep routes to Goodwin.

With a guy like Goodwin, those passes are relatively low risk. EJ has plenty of arm. Put it up and let the Olympic sprinter run under it. We've seen it work.

But they didn't even try one deep ball last week. I'd love to know if EJ is just checking out of it.

I know the protection sucked, but he was sacked 7 times anyway. Why not at least take one shot?