Time to can EJ, get Johnny Manziel

[Skooby]

I'm only looking at the Bills drafting a gamer at QB, Johnny football. EJ isn't that bright or realistically able to digest NFL calling, ditch him for a winner that won't give up.

[G Wolly]

This thread is bad and you should feel bad.

[BuffaloRedleg]

This thread is bad and you should feel bad.

16717

[BertSquirtgum]

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/s379/bhurtgam/beastly_zpsbd834723.jpg

[Night Train]

" LOOK AT ME POST ! LOOK AT ME POST ! "

[YardRat]

Manziel is going to be a train wreck at the NFL level.

[DraftBoy]

Are we really going to do this for the next 6 months.

Let me start the canned response.


I'm only looking at the Bills drafting a gamer at QB, Johnny football. EJ isn't that bright or realistically able to digest NFL calling, ditch him for a winner that won't give up.
This post is stupid. Now rinse and repeat.

[kishoph]

You think Manziel is going to come in here and read an NFL defense ? Ain't gonna happen. Manziel's biggest asset is his ability to run and be elusive, reports are he has bad progression work in the pocket, he has terrible footwork, lack of size and strength and his arm would not work in the later months at the Ralph. You enjoy ripping on EJ now, you would have a field day if Manziel gets here.

[Historian]

Jimmy Clausen II

[Ginger Vitis]

The issue here isn't that Skooby wants the Bills to draft Johnny Manziel. The issue is over the next 6 months Skooby will suggest the Bills draft 6 different QBs in the 1st Round and create a separate thread for all 6 QBs

[trapezeus]

Manziel will set a bad team back very fast, IMO. I could be wrong.

he's undersized and seemingly has no love for the fact the game at the NFL level is all elite talent. for a guy who was being paid to help some kids at a manning camp and blew it off and was dismissed shows me that he has no respect for anyone than himself.

If he isn't going to respect the first family of football before he's gotten paid, how is he going to react to a bad team, in a small town after he's gotten paid. When the story isn't about how good he is on day 1, i bet you have a Geno Smith x5. Headcase.

EJ may not be the guy if his accuracy isn't going to be improved, but manziel will be an oft injured. His supporters will always run to his rescue to say, "wait til he gets healthy" and his detractors may work themselves into the anti-tebow crowd like frenzy thoroughly enjoying his failures. for a team as pathetic as ours, i don't think we'll benefit much from having him on our team.

[Pinkerton Security]

Manziel = Tebow with a little more speed. He will never pan out at the pro level IMO

[k-oneputt]

They can also take Bortles, Bridgewater, or Hundley and I will consider it an upgrade.

[SquishDaFish]

First idiots who think we ate going to draft a first round qb this year need to wake the **** up to reality. They believe in ej and a rookie gets more than one year before they stay another.

Second off Johnny football I have a feeling is going to be garbage in the nfl

[k-oneputt]

First idiots who think we ate going to draft a first round qb this year need to wake the **** up to reality. They believe in ej and a rookie gets more than one year before they stay another.

Second off Johnny football I have a feeling is going to be garbage in the nfl

Yeah yeah we get all that. We know what the Bills will do, not what they should do. Get ready for another year of suck and then the "brains" in the front office will realize the guy is a stiff and a NFL backup. Then they will start over again.

[OpIv37]

This thread is stupid. Even of you don't like EJ, Manziel is not the answer.

There are limitations to his game, and he has maturity issues and a huge ego. And I don't mean the Jim Kelly "I got this" confidence/leadership ego. I mean the Donte Whitner/ Aaron "Mayhem Maybin" rap song "look at me I'm so great even though I haven't done jack ****" ego.

[jamze132]

Johnny Football will quickly lose that ego in the NFL, which he's not going to be successful in.

[DraftBoy]

For the record if Bridgewater is there at our pick, you have to at least think long and hard about it.

There is no way he is, but just saying.

[kishoph]

For the record if Bridgewater is there at our pick, you have to at least think long and hard about it.

There is no way he is, but just saying.

I would think about Mettenberger in the 3rd or later rounds, he's a big strong kid with some football smarts. I'm not worried about the injury, because he's not the running type QB, so put him in the pocket and see what he can do. Even if they do draft a QB this draft, I want EJ going in as the starter, no competition, give him the reps that a starting QB needs. If they bring in someone else, take time to develop him, while seeing what EJ can do in his 2nd year, with a full camp and hopefully injury free.

[Bill Cody]

I'm torn on Manziel. He definetely has leadership ability, charisma and he makes plays. And he's fun to watch. That's no small thing in my eyes. Losing is one thing, being bored to death is another. That last game in Tampa was one of the worst football games I've ever seen, just painful to watch.

Yes he's a punk. Yes he's undersized. Yes he's in for a rude awakening in the NFL. But....in a lot of ways Manziel reminds me of Doug Flutie and I remember Flutie fondly. In the end Flutie wasn't quite good enough to win a championship but he did something we haven't seen in these parts in a LOOONNNG time, see the playoffs. But no how no way would I gamble a top ten pick on Manziel. 2nd rounder? Yeah I think I'd be in for that. It would certainly shake things up around here and to me that's a good thing.

[coastal]

Bring on Johnny Football!!!

[jdaltroy5]

Bring on Johnny Football!!!
http://cdn3.ridiculouslyeffi.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/31220121.jpg

[malvado78]

I would think about Mettenberger in the 3rd or later rounds, he's a big strong kid with some football smarts. I'm not worried about the injury, because he's not the running type QB, so put him in the pocket and see what he can do. Even if they do draft a QB this draft, I want EJ going in as the starter, no competition, give him the reps that a starting QB needs. If they bring in someone else, take time to develop him, while seeing what EJ can do in his 2nd year, with a full camp and hopefully injury free.

I believe this is the right answer. I would also not be upset with Bridgewater in the first. Neither option would I bench EJ next year. Let him be the starter and the other guy back up and learn. Lets fix this QB situation. I am so tired of watching other NFL team with real QB's...

[coastal]

If EJ plays like he did in Tampa in the next 3 games, why wouldn't you look at other options?

we will likely have a top 3 pick in that scenario, so we would have a pretty good prospect sitting there.

[WagonCircler]

Manziel = Tebow with a little more speed. He will never pan out at the pro level IMO

OK, now THIS is stupid.

Manziell may or may not make it as an NFL QB, but he and Tebow have almost nothing in common (other than a Heisman).

Tebow is Billy Graham. Manziell is Charlie Sheen.

Tebow is never more than a few yards from a bible. Manziell studies his playbook by light of a jukebox.

Tebow was a fullback playing QB who couldn't really throw, who was, due to a poor delivery, horribly inaccurate. Manziell is, like Russell Wilson, a baseball player who can deliver the ball accurately from any arm angle like a second baseman.

Tebow was a straight ahead bull rusher. Manziell cuts on a dime like Vick.

Seriously, the two are polar opposites.

[trapezeus]

Johnny Football will quickly lose that ego in the NFL, which he's not going to be successful in.

i dont think he will. i think he'll always make excuses. he doesn't strike me as a peyton type qb where they shoulder the blame because that's the position they are in.

hypothetically, If the Bills know that Manziel wants to be on a particular team and that team is in love with him, it would be shrewd to draft him if we go before them and see how many picks you can take from the team that wants him that badly. I'm sure there will be one team that absolutely loves the guy. he has that hype.

[jdaltroy5]

If EJ plays like he did in Tampa in the next 3 games, why wouldn't you look at other options?

we will likely have a top 3 pick in that scenario, so we would have a pretty good prospect sitting there.He won't though. My guess is that he'll play decent against Jacksonville, play his best game of the season against Miami, and then throw up a dud against New England.

We'll probably end up picking in the 6-9 range at which point any decent QBs will be off the board.

I'd love to make a similar trade as last year and pick up a couple of high picks so we can stock the offensive line.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

I wouldn't complain if we ended up with Manziel, but I wouldn't want him in the Top 10.

[Mr. Pink]

Manziel reminds me of a more athletic JP Losman.

Which while being an upgrade, still wouldn't be good enough.

[SquishDaFish]

I wish we had a good vet ahead of ej so he can sit and learn so you guys would not cry about a Damn rookie in the nfl where nit everyone could make it. He's a rookie learning the nfl qb ways. it takes more that 6 or so starts to become something usually

[coastal]

I know another Bills QB who liked to party...

http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/51f968a7ecad047d38000001-538/johnny-football-at-spring-break.jpg

[TacklingDummy]

OK, now THIS is stupid.

Manziell may or may not make it as an NFL QB, but he and Tebow have almost nothing in common (other than a Heisman).

Both are white.


Tebow is Billy Graham. Manziell is Charlie Sheen.

Tebow is never more than a few yards from a bible. Manziell studies his playbook by light of a jukebox.

Tebow was a fullback playing QB who couldn't really throw, who was, due to a poor delivery, horribly inaccurate. Manziell is, like Russell Wilson, a baseball player who can deliver the ball accurately from any arm angle like a second baseman.

Tebow was a straight ahead bull rusher. Manziell cuts on a dime like Vick.

Seriously, the two are polar opposites.

Im thinking Johnny probably is not a virgin.

Tebow has a rag arm, Johnny throws darts.

[TacklingDummy]

I wish we had a good vet ahead of ej so he can sit and learn so you guys would not cry about a Damn rookie in the nfl where nit everyone could make it. He's a rookie learning the nfl qb ways. it takes more that 6 or so starts to become something usually

Either you have it or you don't.
Somethings cant be teached.
How many years has EJ played QB?
He can't even master the dumpoff pass with accuracy.

[OpIv37]

I wish we had a good vet ahead of ej so he can sit and learn so you guys would not cry about a Damn rookie in the nfl where nit everyone could make it. He's a rookie learning the nfl qb ways. it takes more that 6 or so starts to become something usually

I agree that it takes time, but here's the problem: we don't know for sure, but what if EJ isn't the guy? What if we lose the next 3 and are in a position to take a QB?

We passed on Aaron Rodgers cuz we had JP ****ing Losman.
We passed on Russell Wilson because we had Ryan ****ing Fitzpatrick.

There are probably others, but those two come immediately to mind. If Losman became a legit starter or ifs Fitz kept putting up numbers like he did at the start of 2011, no one would give a damn that we passed on those other guys. But they didn't.

So, here we go again. If we pass on a good QB to stick with EJ, no one will care if EJ pans out. But if he doesn't, we will be the laughingstock of the league yet again.

[feldspar]

I agree that it takes time, but here's the problem: we don't know for sure, but what if EJ isn't the guy? What if we lose the next 3 and are in a position to take a QB?

We passed on Aaron Rodgers cuz we had JP ****ing Losman.
We passed on Russell Wilson because we had Ryan ****ing Fitzpatrick.

There are probably others, but those two come immediately to mind. If Losman became a legit starter or ifs Fitz kept putting up numbers like he did at the start of 2011, no one would give a damn that we passed on those other guys. But they didn't.

So, here we go again. If we pass on a good QB to stick with EJ, no one will care if EJ pans out. But if he doesn't, we will be the laughingstock of the league yet again.

Yep, picking the wrong QB high sets a team back years because there is always the built-in "he needs to develop" reasoning behind sticking with him. While true to a point, it's also dangerous. Add that to the "he got hurt, so his development was impeded" aspect, and you have a recipe for planning on having EJ Manuel be the starter next year. After all, "he's shown flashes" that he can build on...is how they sell it. No real disproving that.

With Fitz, it was the money the Bills gave him, which I thought was a stupid move from the get-go. But a guy like Losman certainly hindered management from going after a QB. Losman got hurt his first year too, and we actually got rid of a better QB so he could play in his second year. Why? Because he was picked high. That was before the rookie wage scale, so now I figure it has to be a little different.

My thoughts are that if the Bills pick high enough and they think there is a better QB than Manuel available to them, they should take him. QB is the most important position in sports, without a question. They don't really owe Manuel anything, and he never even really won the starting role in the first place...Kolb got hurt.

It's a tough call, but there is no way the Bills should rule out going after an upgrade at quarterback. At the very least, they should draft one somewhere. Nix said that they VERY seriously considered taking another QB this year, which I assumed meant around the 4th round when most of them (save 3) were all there.

Personally, I think Manziel is something of a punk. Is he going to even declare?

[WagonCircler]

Is he going to even declare?

He hates his Head Coach. He's going to declare.

Plus, if he has anyone with a lick of sense advising him, they will tell him to cash in before he gets into any more legal trouble and lessens his value.

[kishoph]

Either you have it or you don't.
Somethings cant be teached.
How many years has EJ played QB?
He can't even master the dumpoff pass with accuracy.

If by dumpoff passes, your talking about passes behind the line of scrimmage, you should know he has a higher completion % in that area than both Manning and Brady (and a lot of other QB's) and it's not because they don't throw there, because they have both thrown almost 30 more passes behind the line than Manuel. Manuel has his problems, but it's stupid to just make **** up because you don't like him.

A lot of dumpoffs come because of pressure and you learn to handle the pressure more with experience, but 8 games should be enough experience for anyone I guess and he should have everything "mastered".

You've been posting on this board since 2002, you would think you would have "mastered" it by now, but you still haven't a clue.

[BertSquirtgum]

Manziel is going to be a train wreck at the NFL level.

No he isn't. Everybody was saying the same thing about Cam Newton on here.

[BertSquirtgum]

Let it be known that I want a #1 receiver in the first and I don't believe that Manziel is going to be terrible in the NFL.

[BuffaloRedleg]

It makes me kind of understand why Manziel is going nuts partying and enjoying himself right now. He ought to stay in college and drag it out as long as he can. He'll be a has-been butt of jokes before he's 25 most likely. Although a rich has-been, so that has merit.

[DraftBoy]

OK, now THIS is stupid.

Manziell may or may not make it as an NFL QB, but he and Tebow have almost nothing in common (other than a Heisman).

Tebow is Billy Graham. Manziell is Charlie Sheen.

Tebow is never more than a few yards from a bible. Manziell studies his playbook by light of a jukebox.

Tebow was a fullback playing QB who couldn't really throw, who was, due to a poor delivery, horribly inaccurate. Manziell is, like Russell Wilson, a baseball player who can deliver the ball accurately from any arm angle like a second baseman.

Tebow was a straight ahead bull rusher. Manziell cuts on a dime like Vick.

Seriously, the two are polar opposites.

Well they are both white and you know all those guys look the same.

[DraftBoy]

No he isn't. Everybody was saying the same thing about Cam Newton on here.

No they weren't.

[Skooby]

For the record if Bridgewater is there at our pick, you have to at least think long and hard about it.

There is no way he is, but just saying.

Oh so now it's a good idea to change QB's, let's all make up our minds.

[colin]

i'd take jonny football in the 1st. i'd also take him late in the first if we trade down or in the 2nd if he slips.

either way, with ej as our only game ready qb (our back ups suck) we absolutely need a qb, even if ej turns out to be good (i think he won't, and that he sucks), and in the first 3 rounds i recon.

[TacklingDummy]

If by dumpoff passes, your talking about passes behind the line of scrimmage, you should know he has a higher completion % in that area than both Manning and Brady (and a lot of other QB's) and it's not because they don't throw there, because they have both thrown almost 30 more passes behind the line than Manuel. Manuel has his problems, but it's stupid to just make **** up because you don't like him.

A lot of dumpoffs come because of pressure and you learn to handle the pressure more with experience, but 8 games should be enough experience for anyone I guess and he should have everything "mastered".

You've been posting on this board since 2002, you would think you would have "mastered" it by now, but you still haven't a clue.

Im talking the dumpoff pass where he hits the receiver between the numbers in stride. Not the dumpoff pass where the receiver has to catch the ball at his feet, over his head, or behind him.

[BertSquirtgum]

No they weren't.

Ok. 90% of the posters were.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Worst thread ever. Jesus Christ.

[sudzy]

16718I start threads because I like to hear myself type.

[BertSquirtgum]

Worst thread ever. Jesus Christ.

No, Skooby

[TacklingDummy]

In 12 months Mitch can bring this thread up when the Bills pass on Johnny Football and he becomes a star.

[ckg927]

Manziel is going to be a train wreck at the NFL level.

Just like Tim Tebow.

[alohabillsfan]

EJ does suck, but no way this ******ed front office sees it so they will draft more supporting casts only to get to maybe 8-8 over the next year or two then will reach for a QB in a draft class devoid of QB talent.

[Mace]

Manziel will declare, become the Miley Cyrus of the NFL for 2 years, shake his addictions off, head to the Canadian league to rehab his rep, have the time of his life and never look back, and revitalize the Canadian game while tearing up their record books. In 10 years if any of us live so long, there will be a Yahoo Sports headline, "Manziel, at peace with himself ignores NFL return rumors".....

He'll be the Favre of the CFL, and everyone will always wonder.....except Manziel, because by then the US dollar will be worth a nickel in Canadian Money and he'll own a US state or three, more concerned with electing his Manziel Party reps to maintain favorable tax offsets.

[The Popcorn]

I'm only looking at the Bills drafting a gamer at QB, Johnny football. EJ isn't that bright or realistically able to digest NFL calling, ditch him for a winner that won't give up.


Manziel is a Dome-type QB for the NFL. Buffalo doesn't play in a Dome. Giving up on a 1st round QB, after his first year,"isn't that bright" either.

[Skooby]

Everyone still love EJ?

[WagonCircler]

Manziel is a Dome-type QB for the NFL. Buffalo doesn't play in a Dome. Giving up on a 1st round QB, after his first year,"isn't that bright" either.

Asinine. Absolutely asinine.

Are you watching the game today? Have you watched all year?

If you have, you'd notice that the Bills have played in poor weather ZERO times this season, and there are two games left.

Weather is the most overrated factor in choosing a QB, by far.

[stuckincincy]

Asinine. Absolutely asinine.

Are you watching the game today? Have you watched all year?

If you have, you'd notice that the Bills have played in poor weather ZERO times this season, and there are two games left.

I went through the BUF December stats a while back, in response to a poster here who was insistent about getting a "cold weather quarterback."

It's bunk.

Weather is the most overrated factor in choosing a QB, by far.

[colin]

If olb and wr/te of merit aren't there at our first pick, we might have to pick up a qb. Of course I'm assuming the best ol are gone as they tend to be. I really want ej to shape up, and hes got 2 tough games to show what he's got, but no matter what our overall qb talent is too low.

[Mace]

If olb and wr/te of merit aren't there at our first pick, we might have to pick up a qb. Of course I'm assuming the best ol are gone as they tend to be. I really want ej to shape up, and hes got 2 tough games to show what he's got, but no matter what our overall qb talent is too low.

There isn't a better project QB than the one we have who now has NFL experience. People always want to grab the great QB who isn't there. Getting the best QB last draft would have meant Geno Smith. Woo.

I still think they dorked up not taking Kaepernick and waited to grab their franchise guy in a feeble QB year, but this year with the teams who need QB's is just not glorious, no matter how many teams take one. Looking back, people wanted Gabbert, Ponder, even Clausen, just to take one.

No one really says what QB sure thing to take, because there isn't one sitting there, and certainly not Manziel with his head not on straight, short for the pro game (Russell Wilson regardless), and awful full of himself before meeting pro defenders after racking up how many National Championships ?

I don't know another QB to take early without him being the same reach as Manuel.

[Skooby]

There isn't a better project QB than the one we have who now has NFL experience. People always want to grab the great QB who isn't there. Getting the best QB last draft would have meant Geno Smith. Woo.

I still think they dorked up not taking Kaepernick and waited to grab their franchise guy in a feeble QB year, but this year with the teams who need QB's is just not glorious, no matter how many teams take one. Looking back, people wanted Gabbert, Ponder, even Clausen, just to take one.

No one really says what QB sure thing to take, because there isn't one sitting there, and certainly not Manziel with his head not on straight, short for the pro game (Russell Wilson regardless), and awful full of himself before meeting pro defenders after racking up how many National Championships ?

I don't know another QB to take early without him being the same reach as Manuel.

We have little talent at QB, so I'd start with a new one.

[Mace]

We have little talent at QB, so I'd start with a new one.

Same question though, which one ? Brett Hundley, Derek Carr, Aj McCarron, Tajh Boyd, Kevin Hogan, one of the torn ACL guys, Murray or Mettenberger ? You're basically drafting another Manuel too high and hoping you get another project QB when you already have one with NFL experience without going through another year of project QB.

They need live and die another year with Manuel, who posted a 3 TD (2 pass 1 rush) 105 ranking. Why exactly is this the day to be upset at him ? It isn't.

Let's see if he stays healthy and improves last 2 games. Plenty of time to argue about it after.

[WagonCircler]

Let's see if he stays healthy and improves last 2 games. Plenty of time to argue about it after.

The problem is, what we're going to see the next two games is what we've seen all season. Long stretches of horrendousness with short periods of competence.

And I do mean just that--competence. The "good" passes EJ throws are just run-of-the-mill NFL passes. They just look good because our standards have become so low.

This is a cycle of insanity. This is the continuation of the bad Bills QB saga.

[Skooby]

b
The problem is, what we're going to see the next two games is what we've seen all season. Long stretches of horrendousness with short periods of competence.

And I do mean just that--competence. The "good" passes EJ throws are just run-of-the-mill NFL passes. They just look good because our standards have become so low.

This is a cycle of insanity. This is the continuation of the bad Bills QB saga.

We also had to limit the play book because EJ isn't smart enough to handle it, we have ourselves a slow kid at QB. That's completely unacceptable & makes him a back-up at best. If my only job was learning how the plays work & throw a ball, I'd say knowing how the plays work is half the battle. We don't want to confuse the man now would we ?

[PromoTheRobot]

We all talk about drafting and developing a franchise QB but what we really want is to drop a quarter in a slot machine and hit the jackpot.

PTR

[better days]

The problem is, what we're going to see the next two games is what we've seen all season. Long stretches of horrendousness with short periods of competence.

And I do mean just that--competence. The "good" passes EJ throws are just run-of-the-mill NFL passes. They just look good because our standards have become so low.

This is a cycle of insanity. This is the continuation of the bad Bills QB saga.

That rushing TD by EJ was FAR MORE than just competence.

There are few QB's in the NFL that can do the things that EJ can do from a physical standpoint.

EJ has the physical tools, he needs to get some experience & develop as an NFL QB.

But ANY QB in the draft will need that as well.

[WagonCircler]

That rushing TD by EJ was FAR MORE than just competence.

There are few QB's in the NFL that can do the things that EJ can do from a physical standpoint.

EJ has the physical tools, he needs to get some experience & develop as an NFL QB.

But ANY QB in the draft will need that as well.

Following a block and running into the end zone on a draw? Are you serious?

Wow.

Secondly, the passes he threw in the first quarter would get any other QB in the NFL benched, and far outweigh whatever perceived "physical skills" you're talking about. But that TD? 100% of the QBs in the NFL could pull that off.

[better days]

Following a block and running into the end zone on a draw? Are you serious?

Wow.

Secondly, the passes he threw in the first quarter would get any other QB in the NFL benched, and far outweigh whatever perceived "physical skills" you're talking about. But that TD? 100% of the QBs in the NFL could pull that off.

Yeah? I would love to see Manziel try that. If any defensive player tackled him, he would be crushed just like RG III was. And while Tom Brady can plow ahead for a yd, I have never seen him run a draw like that. It is BS to say any NFL QB can run that play. And NO Coach is going to bench a Rookie QB in the same situation the Bills are in.

[swiper]

The problem is, what we're going to see the next two games is what we've seen all season. Long stretches of horrendousness with short periods of competence.

And I do mean just that--competence. The "good" passes EJ throws are just run-of-the-mill NFL passes. They just look good because our standards have become so low.

This is a cycle of insanity. This is the continuation of the bad Bills QB saga.

Thank you for having the cajones to stand up to the stupid teenagers that post here and tell them the facts. EJ Manuel just sucks. He throws behind, below, over more than either Edwards or Losman did. He has horrid footwork. He has horrid vision of the field. He makes a mundane completion and everyone thinks he's awesome. He's not. He sucks.

[swiper]

Are we really going to do this for the next 6 months.

Let me start the canned response.


This post is stupid. Now rinse and repeat.

Really? Who died and made you a draft expert? Because you come off as a stupid 14-year old with nothing better to do. You're nothing but a dumb chump.

[TedMock]

b

We also had to limit the play book because EJ isn't smart enough to handle it, we have ourselves a slow kid at QB. That's completely unacceptable & makes him a back-up at best. If my only job was learning how the plays work & throw a ball, I'd say knowing how the plays work is half the battle. We don't want to confuse the man now would we ?

The 49ers scaled down the playbook in 2011 and it helped Alex Smith's confidence. The Panthers scaled down the playbook this season to get Cam Newton back on track and it's worked. I'm sure there are other examples. It's not that they have learning disabilities. Sometimes it is best to scale back and master in steps. I think they should have started this way to begin with.

[swiper]

That rushing TD by EJ was FAR MORE than just competence.

There are few QB's in the NFL that can do the things that EJ can do from a physical standpoint.

EJ has the physical tools, he needs to get some experience & develop as an NFL QB.

But ANY QB in the draft will need that as well.

Are you 13 or 14 years old, because it's really hard to tell. The stupidity just runs thick from each of your posts.

- - - Updated - - -


The 49ers scaled down the playbook in 2011 and it helped Alex Smith's confidence. The Panthers scaled down the playbook this season to get Cam Newton back on track and it's worked. I'm sure there are other examples. It's not that they have learning disabilities. Sometimes it is best to scale back and master in steps. I think they should have started this way to begin with.

You left out the Mark Sanchez colored arm bands there Einstein.

[TedMock]

Are you 13 or 14 years old, because it's really hard to tell. The stupidity just runs thick from each of your posts.

- - - Updated - - -



You left out the Mark Sanchez colored arm bands there Einstein.

It didn't work for Sanchez. It worked for some, but not for others. I never said it was fool proof. You somehow grossly missed my point. Read, think, respond rationally...Einstein.

[Skooby]

Are you 13 or 14 years old, because it's really hard to tell. The stupidity just runs thick from each of your posts.

- - - Updated - - -



You left out the Mark Sanchez colored arm bands there Einstein.

Look at Sanchez now, LOL.

[starrymessenger]

He's big.
That's it.

[WagonCircler]

Yeah? I would love to see Manziel try that. If any defensive player tackled him, he would be crushed just like RG III was. And while Tom Brady can plow ahead for a yd, I have never seen him run a draw like that. It is BS to say any NFL QB can run that play. And NO Coach is going to bench a Rookie QB in the same situation the Bills are in.

Like they crush Drew Brees? Or Russell Wilson? Because those guys are behemoths.

This just in...it's still a passer's league. Always will be.

By the way, EJ has the knees of a 90 year old woman. If he's another one of these guys who has to run to make up for his passing deficiencies, we won't be talking about him for very long.

[Skooby]

Like they crush Drew Brees? Or Russell Wilson? Because those guys are behemoths.

This just in...it's still a passer's league. Always will be.

By the way, EJ has the knees of a 90 year old woman. If he's another one of these guys who has to run to make up for his passing deficiencies, we won't be talking about him for very long.

Glass knees.

[better days]

Like they crush Drew Brees? Or Russell Wilson? Because those guys are behemoths.

This just in...it's still a passer's league. Always will be.

By the way, EJ has the knees of a 90 year old woman. If he's another one of these guys who has to run to make up for his passing deficiencies, we won't be talking about him for very long.

Hey, I wanted the Bills to draft Wilson. He not only can throw the ball, he is SMART enough to avoid tackles.

Brees does not run at all.

As for EJ I have to admit, his knees are a concern.

[swiper]

It didn't work for Sanchez. It worked for some, but not for others. I never said it was fool proof. You somehow grossly missed my point. Read, think, respond rationally...Einstein.


Dear Einstein,

I got your point more than you did. Thanks for playing though.

[swiper]

Like they crush Drew Brees? Or Russell Wilson? Because those guys are behemoths.

This just in...it's still a passer's league. Always will be.

By the way, EJ has the knees of a 90 year old woman. If he's another one of these guys who has to run to make up for his passing deficiencies, we won't be talking about him for very long.

The problem with Manuel is that his absolute ceiling is that of Randall Cunningham. If that's what the little kids want, then keep cheering for his development. I want another Jim Kelly personally. And EJ Manuel will never get close to that level.

[gr8slayer]

Exactly what has Manziel won?
I'm only looking at the Bills drafting a gamer at QB, Johnny football. EJ isn't that bright or realistically able to digest NFL calling, ditch him for a winner that won't give up.

[Dr. Lecter]

b

We also had to limit the play book because EJ isn't smart enough to handle it, we have ourselves a slow kid at QB. That's completely unacceptable & makes him a back-up at best. If my only job was learning how the plays work & throw a ball, I'd say knowing how the plays work is half the battle. We don't want to confuse the man now would we ?


Slow kid?

I know he is black, but the fact is he graduated early (3.5 years) from FSU and has been working on his master's

He might not make it as a QB, but to call him "slow" is incredibly based on nothing. Even for you.

And that is saying something

[gr8slayer]

That escalated quickly, haha.

Slow kid?

I know he is black, but the fact is he graduated early (3.5 years) from FSU and has been working on his master's

He might not make it as a QB, but to call him "slow" is incredibly based on nothing. Even for you.

And that is saying something

[stuckincincy]

:popcorn:

[starrymessenger]

Slow kid?

I know he is black, but the fact is he graduated early (3.5 years) from FSU and has been working on his master's

He might not make it as a QB, but to call him "slow" is incredibly based on nothing. Even for you.

And that is saying something

Football IQ probably has little to do with being a good scholar.
i doubt EJ has difficulty understanding concepts.
Its really more about the ability to execute.

[Skooby]

Football IQ probably has little to do with being a good scholar.
i doubt EJ has difficulty understanding concepts.
Its really more about the ability to execute.

Very little to do with it, see Fitzpatrick.

[WagonCircler]

Football IQ probably has little to do with being a good scholar.
i doubt EJ has difficulty understanding concepts.
Its really more about the ability to execute.

To me, football IQ consists of a few things (QB-wise). The first of which is similar to what fighter pilots need--the ability to quickly analyze a situation, make snap decisions and execute accordingly.

Next, you have to consistently play using proper mechanics, i.e. muscle memory. The mechanics can be learned, but they have to become second nature. Footwork and delivery are all highly complex and precise disciplines at this level.

And then there are non-muscle memory football fundamentals, like remembering to protect the ball when you run with it.

The great QBs also have an internal clock. They sense pressure and they have a knack for knowing, down to the millisecond, when they need to get rid of the ball.

These are prerequisites. You cannot succeed at the position if you are deficient in any of these areas.

But even if you are, you need to consistently deliver the ball accurately. You can have perfect mechanics, and it will help you most of the time. But with some QBs, and it sure looks like EJ may be one of them, there's just a disconnect between the hand and the eyes. It may be physical, it may be psychological, but some guys just can't make the throws. Especially under pressure.

It's hard to say what causes EJs problems, and certainly footwork is a big part of it, but this is not the sort of thing that a starting NFL QB needs to be working on. He needs to have mastered these mechanics long ago.

EJ is raw. His football smarts are far from ready to be a star in this league.

It has nothing to do with the kind of intelligence that Ryan Fitzpatrick has or even Thad has (Duke doesn't pass football players just because they're football players. Basketball? Maybe). But Thad exhibits the same lack of football smarts as EJ. Carrying the football like a loaf of bread is inexcusable for a Pop Warner QB, and yet, you see both EJ and Thad do it repeatedly.

I just don't know if you can acquire discipline at this level if it's not already there. This is fundamental stuff. If you can't master your mechanics, how are you going to execute flawlessly AND learn to read Defenses expertly, WHILE playing with perfect mechanics?

And on top of it, EJs showing the sacklesness of Trent Edwards. These are all very bad signs.

[Mace]

The problem is, what we're going to see the next two games is what we've seen all season. Long stretches of horrendousness with short periods of competence.

And I do mean just that--competence. The "good" passes EJ throws are just run-of-the-mill NFL passes. They just look good because our standards have become so low.

This is a cycle of insanity. This is the continuation of the bad Bills QB saga.

Man up, sissy boy, we've butched through it before.

Or Manuel up.

There's really not much else to do except hope otherwise though.

[Skooby]

It's on other people's mind as well.


Bills (28): Do they draft a quarterback early again next spring?

http://nypost.com/2013/12/17/nfl-power-rankings-dolphins-refuse-to-be-sunk/

[better days]

It's on other people's mind as well.



http://nypost.com/2013/12/17/nfl-power-rankings-dolphins-refuse-to-be-sunk/

I see no problem with drafting a QB. But unlike last year, it is not a necessity this year.

[swiper]

I see no problem with drafting a QB. But unlike last year, it is not a necessity this year.

Well the degree of need is that of opinion. No matter what people think of Manuel, there are few that disagree the 2nd/3rd string needs to be upgraded.

[WagonCircler]

Man up, sissy boy, we've butched through it before.

Or Manuel up.

There's really not much else to do except hope otherwise though.

And I wrote that before the Jacksonville game.

What did we see?

Long stretches of horrendousness followed by short periods of competence.

You could apply that description to pretty much every Bills QB since Jim Kelly.

It's like Groundhog Day.

[Mace]

And I wrote that before the Jacksonville game.

What did we see?

Long stretches of horrendousness followed by short periods of competence.

You could apply that description to pretty much every Bills QB since Jim Kelly.

It's like Groundhog Day.

Sure it is. But Groundhog day ended up better eventually.

Butch up Mister Man, we have a couple weeks left and the Bills could end up with a winning division record ! Probably won't but if they do !

I still think they ruined Losman before Losman could be Losman in a wicked run and shoot deal. Miami and New England. Next year might be a better version of Groundhog Day until we get it right. Might not be too, but it's good to hope for something around this terrible freaking festive holiday freaking season because we are freaking hopeful about something freaking good.

Same as always, maybe next year, Wagon.

[Skooby]

I don't expect EJ to be consistenly good on every series but there was some basic footwork skills pointed out specifically during the game that really scares me. Poor footwork is a trait that almost all of our recent failures at QB share, it drives me crazy. You can forget about touch passing or accurate passes with this being the case, long ball is out as well. They're going to have to shorten the playbook to accommodate EJ soon, handoffs only.

You want to watch great footwork & balance ? Watch Johnny Football drop back, he's already ready for the next move. Here's footwork for you:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kewl4qxkkWI&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dkewl4qxkkWI

[WagonCircler]

Same as always, maybe next year, Wagon.

I spent 7 years in Chicago. I was a part time Bleacher Bum in the Andre Dawson/Ryne Sandberg days.

It occurs to me that the Bills have become the Cubs of the NFL. The lovable losers.

People go to the games because they're such a great party. Sound familiar?

And they keep going. And if the team wins...BONUS! If the team loses? Well, we pretty much expected that, right? But it was a great party!

So, why field a contender when the fans keep coming, win or lose?

Right up until the end of the season, when the weather's not so nice anymore. Then there's the Hot Stove league.

We'll get 'em next year!

[Mace]

I spent 7 years in Chicago. I was a part time Bleacher Bum in the Andre Dawson/Ryne Sandberg days.

It occurs to me that the Bills have become the Cubs of the NFL. The lovable losers.

People go to the games because they're such a great party. Sound familiar?

And they keep going. And if the team wins...BONUS! If the team loses? Well, we pretty much expected that, right? But it was a great party!

So, why field a contender when the fans keep coming, win or lose?

Right up until the end of the season, when the weather's not so nice anymore. Then there's the Hot Stove league.

We'll get 'em next year!

Mark Grace, Amazing Grace. Yes, it sounds familiar. Next year or nothing, until the year after. Chicago still has Cubs. Is good Buffalo still has Bills.

Have to get them next year, won't be this one.

Crap shame what happened to Grace. Very Bills.

If we don't have a next year, what do we have ?

[Skooby]

Mark Grace, Amazing Grace. Yes, it sounds familiar. Next year or nothing, until the year after. Chicago still has Cubs. Is good Buffalo still has Bills.

Have to get them next year, won't be this one.

Crap shame what happened to Grace. Very Bills.

If we don't have a next year, what do we have ?

Next week to rob Miami of their dreams of the playoffs, then the following week game to rob the Pats of a bye-week.

[WagonCircler]

If we don't have a next year, what do we have?

Bacon?

[Mace]

Bacon?

And bacon is always enough. With bacon on the side, an order of bacon, and some bacon to go.

[starrymessenger]

I spent 7 years in Chicago. I was a part time Bleacher Bum in the Andre Dawson/Ryne Sandberg days.

It occurs to me that the Bills have become the Cubs of the NFL. The lovable losers.

People go to the games because they're such a great party. Sound familiar?

And they keep going. And if the team wins...BONUS! If the team loses? Well, we pretty much expected that, right? But it was a great party!

So, why field a contender when the fans keep coming, win or lose?

Right up until the end of the season, when the weather's not so nice anymore. Then there's the Hot Stove league.

We'll get 'em next year!

Off topic and not Bills related but I well remember Andre's days with the Expos with fondness. What a great player.
glad he went where he could play on grass. That turf in Montreal was killing his knees.

[Skooby]

Off topic and not Bills related but I well remember Andre's days with the Expos with fondness. What a great player.
glad he went where he could play on grass. That turf in Montreal was killing his knees.

What was Andre's jersey colors?

[starrymessenger]

What was Andre's jersey colors?

White and pale blue, home and away - Go Spos.

[WagonCircler]

...

[WagonCircler]

With royal blue pinstripes!

And for the aways, for most of Andre's time there, they were wearing these:

16724

EDIT:

Oops! I thought you meant the Cubs colors.

Incidentally, Royal Blue, Red and White (Bills colors). Coincidence? Haha.

[starrymessenger]

EDIT:

Oops! I thought you meant the Cubs colors.

Incidentally, Royal Blue, Red and White (Bills colors). Coincidence? Haha.

Thanks for the pic.
Nice to see Hawk again after so many years

[Skooby]

Incidentally, Royal Blue, Red and White (Bills colors). Coincidence? Haha.

Pegged !!

[Skooby]

Glass knees. Here we go again, he's out this Sunday.

[Skooby]

I expect Thad to throw some bombs in the rain.