Good Ole Tim Graham

[DesertFox24]

I am sorry I do not agree with his strategy to try and get a rise out of EJ.

I will say this though I thought EJ handled the situation with class. Graham can say things like obvious sarcasm and what not, but he cannot deny what EJ said.

That being said I think Tim and the rest of the draft a QB in the first round crowd is just plan ignorant.

I have no problem drafting a QB in rounds 4 or later, but why draft another QB to compete with manual and then neither of them have the proper weapons to show what they can do.

We need 2 OL, a TE, and potentially a big tall WR. I would also argue we need a third down back that can convert 3rd and 1 in heavy run packages.

Even if we took EJ in round 2 I would feel the same way, you take a QB in round 1 or 2 you are going to ride with them for 3 years and see if they develop. After year 2 if no success then draft a guy to compete with them see what he does and you either are in a Chargers situations or you let the guy walk like Edwards and Losman.

[DesertFox24]

I know this is not the answer you people are looking for but unless we are drafting first overall and Elway, Manning, Luck, or a sure fire franchise guy is available why draft a guy like Bortles or Manziel, or Bridgewater that have a lot of issues themselves like Manual.

[DraftBoy]

I like Tim Graham and I've spoken to him before. I think at times he lets his trolls and frustrations get the better of him, but he's a good reporter and you can't fault him for being honest in the face of a player.

How many times do you think Skip Bayless has ripped guys on ESPN, just to get in front of them and cow-tow to their celebrity?

[better days]

Tim Graham is a Jerry Sullivan wannabe.

But Jerry does a better job at being Jerry than Tim does.

I think the News should hire a new writer to give Graham some competition because he is not doing a very good job.

[justasportsfan]

I have no problem drafting a QB in rounds 4 or later, but why draft another QB to compete with manual and then neither of them have the proper weapons to show what they can do.


How do we know if we don't have the proper weapons when EJ is A) not willing to throw the ball b) inaccurate

[Albany,n.y.]

Even if we took EJ in round 2 I would feel the same way, you take a QB in round 1 or 2 you are going to ride with them for 3 years and see if they develop. After year 2 if no success then draft a guy to compete with them see what he does and you either are in a Chargers situations or you let the guy walk like Edwards and Losman.

The Carolina Panthers beg to differ. Just think where they'd be if they had your philosophy and rode it out with Jimmy Clausen because he was a 2nd round pick instead of drafting Cam Newton.
It's a good bet Ron Rivera wouldn't be their head coach anymore instead of signing that extension this week.

[better days]

The Carolina Panthers beg to differ. Just think where they'd be if they had your philosophy and rode it out with Jimmy Clausen because he was a 2nd round pick instead of drafting Cam Newton.
It's a good bet Ron Rivera wouldn't be their head coach anymore instead of signing that extension this week.

The Panthers had the first pick in the draft & Cam was highly thought of.

Is any QB in this class as highly thought of as Cam?

I don't think so, but if that is the case, he won't be there at #9.

[Albany,n.y.]

I know this is not the answer you people are looking for but unless we are drafting first overall and Elway, Manning, Luck, or a sure fire franchise guy is available why draft a guy like Bortles or Manziel, or Bridgewater that have a lot of issues themselves like Manual.

Upon further review, you have redeemed yourself with this answer. Carolina did have the #1 pick, so you might have felt differently than your 1st post indicated

[DesertFox24]

I like Tim Graham and I've spoken to him before. I think at times he lets his trolls and frustrations get the better of him, but he's a good reporter and you can't fault him for being honest in the face of a player.

How many times do you think Skip Bayless has ripped guys on ESPN, just to get in front of them and cow-tow to their celebrity?

I agree he is a good honest reporter and I like reading him and Sully because they are honest and not homers. That being said i personally believe the conversation could have gone differently and should have gone differently.

[DesertFox24]

How do we know if we don't have the proper weapons when EJ is A) not willing to throw the ball b) inaccurate


Ok first of all he is more than willing to throw the ball. He is a raw rookie and got confused and held onto the ball to long yes, but he threw some great deep balls, some terrible deep balls, did well and did terrible going through his progressions.

This knock on being trentative is the one that is completly ludricous in my opinion.

I will agree with the accuracy, his accuracy was great at times and utterly terrible at times.

[DesertFox24]

The Carolina Panthers beg to differ. Just think where they'd be if they had your philosophy and rode it out with Jimmy Clausen because he was a 2nd round pick instead of drafting Cam Newton.
It's a good bet Ron Rivera wouldn't be their head coach anymore instead of signing that extension this week.

They had the first pick in the draft and Clausen was previous regime.

If they bills had the first pick in the draft and Luck was coming out or even someone close to Cam good with running arm and size then yes I would agree.

None of these QBs are that good, did not play in same class of competition and in my opinion are not much better if any better than EJ and Geno.

I am sorry Johnny and tgeddy are tiny light weight QBs that will get blown up. Johnny has the better arm but his way of extending plays and throwing up prayers will not work in the pros, he might be ok but he is going to be turnover machine next year.

Teddy is 6'1 and played at 205 pounds this past season no matter what he says everyone says the guy was 200 pounds soaking wet. He is accurate but the majority of his yards are from YAC because his skill position guys are good. He did not throw deep balls that ofter instead throwing a lot curls, outs, and slants and often times on a third and long would throw short of the sticks and his wr would break a tackle or it would be a completly blown coverage.

Bortles and Carr are probably the only two that I think have a legitimate shot and both will probably be gone and to be honest EJ has a better resume than either of them.

Now there are plenty of QBs I would not mind us taking a look at in round 3 or later.

Boyd
Falas
McCarren
Price
Tom Savage
Mizzou QB only as an UDFA terrible arm strength so probably should rule him out
Mettzenberger
Murray (I really like this guy a lot probably my favorite of all and might be able to get him in round 4 due to injury)
Yes Murray is short but he has some Drew Brees to him, would be interested to see Hand Size as Whaley said that is big for him if he has small hands probably not going to be a bill

[DesertFox24]

Add that Grappolo to the list as well forgot about him, for third round or later

[Mr. Miyagi]

I think the News should hire a new writer to give Graham some competition because he is not doing a very good job.
LOL love this!

[justasportsfan]

Ok first of all he is more than willing to throw the ball. He is a raw rookie and got confused and held onto the ball to long yes, but he threw some great deep balls, some terrible deep balls, did well and did terrible going through his progressions.

This knock on being trentative is the one that is completly ludricous in my opinion. You could say that about Thad and Tuel as well. There is a reason why people compared him to Trentative because he was dinking and dunking.


I will agree with the accuracy, his accuracy was great at times and utterly terrible at times. what bothers me is he was utterly terrible even in short passes. So since we agree he was terrible at times, it's hard to gauge our receivers. Some of his completed passes were made by receivers diving for the ball which make him look more accurate than he really is.

[Mindbender]

I agree with Graham. If and only if they think a franchise QB is sitting there. We don't have a franchise QB right now which means we won't win. Might EJ turn out to be the franchise guy? Sure. Right now he's an unknown quantity. He's been inconsistent. Why pass on someone who might be better?

[DesertFox24]

You could say that about Thad and Tuel as well. There is a reason why people compared him to Trentative because he was dinking and dunking.

what bothers me is he was utterly terrible even in short passes. So since we agree he was terrible at times, it's hard to gauge our receivers. Some of his completed passes were made by receivers diving for the ball which make him look more accurate than he really is.


Look I think we have good WRs, but I think we need a bigger target for red zone work. This guy can be a TE or a WR but to get a big WR would be better because they can be matched up against shorter CBs for the most part.

A 6'5 TE will usually have a 6'2 or 6'3 LB on them in red zone, while a 6'5 corner will have a 5'11 to 6'1 corner on them, which is a bigger height descrepancy which allows for better physical matchups on shorter quicker passes like you see in X and goal situations.

Yes I agree about his short passing accuracy which was less accurate than his intermediate and long balls. This is very concerning and is the one reason why I have not said he will be good or not.

The dinking and dunking thing does not bother me anywhere near as much as you guys, all Tom Brady did before Randy Moss was dink and dunk and dink and dunked his way to three super bowls. Since Moss Tom Brady has tried very hard to pass the ball down the field with success but no rings.

The only thing I can hope is that in year two after seeing complex def and speed of the game that he will process things faster and be more deliberate with his throws which will hopefully increase accuracy. That coupled with more time working his WRs this offseason and actually training as a QB of a team with a system opposed to where he was last year not knowing will improve him.

That being said if he is the same next year as this year then draft a qb round 1, even if like the chargers and he becomes Brees and blows up we are in a good trade situation.

[X-Era]

I am sorry I do not agree with his strategy to try and get a rise out of EJ.

I will say this though I thought EJ handled the situation with class. Graham can say things like obvious sarcasm and what not, but he cannot deny what EJ said.

That being said I think Tim and the rest of the draft a QB in the first round crowd is just plan ignorant.

I have no problem drafting a QB in rounds 4 or later, but why draft another QB to compete with manual and then neither of them have the proper weapons to show what they can do.

We need 2 OL, a TE, and potentially a big tall WR. I would also argue we need a third down back that can convert 3rd and 1 in heavy run packages.

Even if we took EJ in round 2 I would feel the same way, you take a QB in round 1 or 2 you are going to ride with them for 3 years and see if they develop. After year 2 if no success then draft a guy to compete with them see what he does and you either are in a Chargers situations or you let the guy walk like Edwards and Losman.To me it's no real surprise.

EJ has confidence that he can be our franchise guy... I'd hope he does considering where we took him

Graham is fickle and wants us to add another QB because Ej isn't the answer right now. Tim has no reason to trust in EJ and has no responsibility to be patient.

[swiper]

I am sorry I do not agree with his strategy to try and get a rise out of EJ.

I will say this though I thought EJ handled the situation with class. Graham can say things like obvious sarcasm and what not, but he cannot deny what EJ said.

That being said I think Tim and the rest of the draft a QB in the first round crowd is just plan ignorant.

I have no problem drafting a QB in rounds 4 or later, but why draft another QB to compete with manual and then neither of them have the proper weapons to show what they can do.

We need 2 OL, a TE, and potentially a big tall WR. I would also argue we need a third down back that can convert 3rd and 1 in heavy run packages.

Even if we took EJ in round 2 I would feel the same way, you take a QB in round 1 or 2 you are going to ride with them for 3 years and see if they develop. After year 2 if no success then draft a guy to compete with them see what he does and you either are in a Chargers situations or you let the guy walk like Edwards and Losman.

This site needs a groan button.

[DesertFox24]

To me it's no real surprise.

EJ has confidence that he can be our franchise guy... I'd hope he does considering where we took him

Graham is fickle and wants us to add another QB because Ej isn't the answer right now. Tim has no reason to trust in EJ and has no responsibility to be patient.

This is the trend in the NFL that I find disturbing if any player does not show they are good in year one then they are considered a bust.

Look at McKelvin had we given up on the guy he would have been another in a long line of ex bills that are good players. Now is McKelvin the 11th best player in his draft class, I would say irrevocably NO.

However, his skill and performance are in line with his new contract and I am very glad that he is still on the team and is now a good player for us. Unlike Jabri Greer, Winfield, pat Williams, the list goes on and on and on and on.

I had no problems with Nate Clements leaving for that kind of money just like I have no problem if Byrd leaves and gets 9 mil a year and just like I had no issues with Levitre leaving for 8+ a year.

Clements was not a true lock down corner like Revis he was a cover 2 guy and did not deserve to be highest paid CB in league like San Fran paid him to be.

I personally do not value the guard position over LT, C, and RT those are three critical positions in my opinion. I think we can get solid guards for 2-4 million a year and have a great OL if we have very good players at LT, C, and RT.

FS with Bryd. This is tough one for me to admit because I like the guy he is a bill was drafted by us and would be awesome if he decides to stay. That being said if we sign bryd to 9 mil a year who might that prevent us from signing?

If Whaley and Brandon can say paying Bryd will allow us to do the below then ok:
Resign Gilmore if he becomes as good as we think he can (best bills corner and top 3 in the league)
Resign Dareus
Resign Hughes if he has another good year
Resign Glenn
Resign Spiller
Resign Kiko
Resign Robert Woods
Resign EJ or another franchise QB to BIG deal probably

Yes I know other people like Mario, Kyle, and other big contracts will be off the books or potentially cut for room, but I think you guys understand my point.

Which is this, is a top 3 FS more valuable than a
top 3 DT
top 3 MLB
top 3 CB
top 3 game changer (spiller)
potentially top 5 LT
potentially a franchise QB (if we ever get one)

By this list I mean if we sign Bryd we lose one of these guys. I dont think Hughes or Woods will ever be top 5 of their positions so I would take Bryd over them.

[trapezeus]

i also think taking a first round qb is a cheaper way to go. there are no real journeymen to take the job and asking thad to be there is just short sighted.

if ej is only as good as a back up, we got him. and if the next guy is great, awesome. if it works the other way, where ej is great and the other guy is a back up, he's getting valuable time to get into the roll.

thad isn't a long term answer if ej doesn't pan out. if a top flight guy is there at 9 and you like him....take him. I'd rather spend 14 years being a middling team with occasional playoff appearances than what we've done so far.

[justasportsfan]

Look I think we have good WRs, but I think we need a bigger target for red zone work. This guy can be a TE or a WR but to get a big WR would be better because they can be matched up against shorter CBs for the most part.

A 6'5 TE will usually have a 6'2 or 6'3 LB on them in red zone, while a 6'5 corner will have a 5'11 to 6'1 corner on them, which is a bigger height descrepancy which allows for better physical matchups on shorter quicker passes like you see in X and goal situations.

Yes I agree about his short passing accuracy which was less accurate than his intermediate and long balls. This is very concerning and is the one reason why I have not said he will be good or not.

The dinking and dunking thing does not bother me anywhere near as much as you guys, all Tom Brady did before Randy Moss was dink and dunk and dink and dunked his way to three super bowls. Since Moss Tom Brady has tried very hard to pass the ball down the field with success but no rings.

The only thing I can hope is that in year two after seeing complex def and speed of the game that he will process things faster and be more deliberate with his throws which will hopefully increase accuracy. That coupled with more time working his WRs this offseason and actually training as a QB of a team with a system opposed to where he was last year not knowing will improve him.

That being said if he is the same next year as this year then draft a qb round 1, even if like the chargers and he becomes Brees and blows up we are in a good trade situation.

I am not saying we don't need receivers. I am simply stating it's hard to gauge how good or bad our receivers are when your qb was average at best.

Brady dinked and dunked but he was accurate enough to move the ball. EJ is not even as good as Trent in dinking the ball.

[DesertFox24]

I am not saying we don't need receivers. I am simply stating it's hard to gauge how good or bad our receivers are when your qb was average at best.

Brady dinked and dunked but he was accurate enough to move the ball. EJ is not even as good as Trent in dinking the ball.

All I am saying is I think it is way to early to tell after 10 games if EJ is accurate or not. Heck we are not even sure if he was playing with knee pain or had to alter his approach to accomodate for pain in the knee.

I have had a knee sprain and they are painful for awhile and it is not like he was siting on a coach or at a cpu typing on message boards he was trying to get ready to play and probably pushed a lot harder.

Yes it is an excuse but until next year the only thing we have to go on from an EJ injury free stand point is the colts preseason game.
The only other thing we know is that he was getting better every week up until the Cleveland game. Then after that he had bad games and got gradually better then got hurt again.

His highs were not enough to remove any concerns and his lows were LOW, but as a first rounder he Whaley and Marrone deserve one more year of EJ as the starter.

[better days]

i also think taking a first round qb is a cheaper way to go. there are no real journeymen to take the job and asking thad to be there is just short sighted.

if ej is only as good as a back up, we got him. and if the next guy is great, awesome. if it works the other way, where ej is great and the other guy is a back up, he's getting valuable time to get into the roll.

thad isn't a long term answer if ej doesn't pan out. if a top flight guy is there at 9 and you like him....take him. I'd rather spend 14 years being a middling team with occasional playoff appearances than what we've done so far.

I don't know if there is even one top flight guy at QB in this entire draft.

I just question if any QB in this draft will be great.

I was at the Drs the other day & read an article in ESPN the magazine about Manziel.

In that article, Johnny football came across as a spoiled RICH kid. Very Ryan Leaf like in his maturity.

If that article is accurate, I doubt Manziel gets drafted in the 1st rnd. I would take a flyer on him in the 3rd, but I would not hold my breath for him to be the Savior at QB.

There are more QB's to choose from in this draft, but every one of them has as many question marks as EJ & Geno did when they were drafted.

Thad has been in the Bills system a year & I think he would be a better back up than any Rookie the Bills could draft.

[Meathead]

so freakin rude to post comments about sometthing in an online article and not provide a link

http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/tim-graham/draft-another-qb-its-business-not-personal-20140130?two-bills-drive

[justasportsfan]

so freakin rude to post comments about sometthing in an online article and not provide a link

http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/tim-graham/draft-another-qb-its-business-not-personal-20140130?two-bills-drive

Ha! I hope the lights the fire under his arse.

[DesertFox24]

so freakin rude to post comments about sometthing in an online article and not provide a link

http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/tim-graham/draft-another-qb-its-business-not-personal-20140130?two-bills-drive

My bad, I thought everyone knew what I was talking about since it was all over twitter.

I live in Nevada so I am three hours behind and made a bad assumption that everyone knew what I was talking about.

I was under the impression WGR was all over this story.

[better days]

All I am saying is I think it is way to early to tell after 10 games if EJ is accurate or not. Heck we are not even sure if he was playing with knee pain or had to alter his approach to accomodate for pain in the knee.

I have had a knee sprain and they are painful for awhile and it is not like he was siting on a coach or at a cpu typing on message boards he was trying to get ready to play and probably pushed a lot harder.

Yes it is an excuse but until next year the only thing we have to go on from an EJ injury free stand point is the colts preseason game.
The only other thing we know is that he was getting better every week up until the Cleveland game. Then after that he had bad games and got gradually better then got hurt again.

His highs were not enough to remove any concerns and his lows were LOW, but as a first rounder he Whaley and Marrone deserve one more year of EJ as the starter.

Well, having had a torn meniscus I do believe that affected EJ's accuracy if he played with that which it looks like he did.

I was carrying groceries out to my car a dozen eggs on top wouldn't you know, with that & my knee just gave out on me.

I found myself on my azz with broken eggs all over the parking lot.

I could see EJ could not step into his throws with that problem.

[justasportsfan]

All I am saying is I think it is way to early to tell after 10 games if EJ is accurate or not. Huh?you were able to tell in your earlier post. What neither you nor I am not sure about is if he can fix it.




Heck we are not even sure if he was playing with knee pain or had to alter his approach to accomodate for pain in the knee.

I have had a knee sprain and they are painful for awhile and it is not like he was siting on a coach or at a cpu typing on message boards he was trying to get ready to play and probably pushed a lot harder.

Yes it is an excuse but until next year the only thing we have to go on from an EJ injury free stand point is the colts preseason game.
The only other thing we know is that he was getting better every week up until the Cleveland game. Then after that he had bad games and got gradually better then got hurt again.

His highs were not enough to remove any concerns and his lows were LOW, but as a first rounder he Whaley and Marrone deserve one more year of EJ as the starter.

IMO, it's got nothing to do with the knee. He was able to throw well against the jets in the 2nd game. IMO, his accuracy stems from his inability to read the entire field (the knock on him coming out of college) and is too gunshy to pull the trigger that when he finally decides to dink it, he's dinking in a hurry and misses his target.

[trapezeus]

I don't know if there is even one top flight guy at QB in this entire draft.

I just question if any QB in this draft will be great.

I was at the Drs the other day & read an article in ESPN the magazine about Manziel.

In that article, Johnny football came across as a spoiled RICH kid. Very Ryan Leaf like in his maturity.

If that article is accurate, I doubt Manziel gets drafted in the 1st rnd. I would take a flyer on him in the 3rd, but I would not hold my breath for him to be the Savior at QB.

There are more QB's to choose from in this draft, but every one of them has as many question marks as EJ & Geno did when they were drafted.

Thad has been in the Bills system a year & I think he would be a better back up than any Rookie the Bills could draft.

The issue isn't is thad a good back up. he is. but the way EJ played, he is too. so let's get a guy who has starting qualities. it can only drive EJ to play better. and if he can't, he wasn't our guy. and if the new guy plays better, thad's there to be the back up at a cheaper cost.

with the new rookie scale, you should be trying to hit the homerun on a great QB every draft until you have a top 5 qb. especially when your current one was injured 3 times.

It's crazy to say "let's just see if EJ can get it without a better back up plan."

I think the bills would be fine if a qualified journeyman could come in and take over if EJ isn't getting it.

Because as much as no one wants to say it...the rest of the bills team might be ready to be a playoff team now. not wait for EJ to stay healthy and learn some more. D was good, the WR are new and the backs have 1 year left. spiller has a year on his contract and fred will hit the wall sooner or later.

[trapezeus]

Huh?you were able to tell in your earlier post. What neither you nor I am not sure about is if he can fix it.




IMO, it's got nothing to do with the knee. He was able to throw well against the jets in the 2nd game. IMO, his accuracy stems from his inability to read the entire field (the knock on him coming out of college) and is too gunshy to pull the trigger that when he finally decides to dink it, he's dinking in a hurry and misses his target.


agreed, EJ is a streaky guy. he's rick james. if he's on...he's on. and if he's not, its awful. and the nice thing is he doesn't seem to be affected by either. he's not a sulker, like losman

[DesertFox24]

agreed, EJ is a streaky guy. he's rick james. if he's on...he's on. and if he's not, its awful. and the nice thing is he doesn't seem to be affected by either. he's not a sulker, like losman

There is a lot to like about EJ and his game from a physical and mental standpoint.

He is very streaky and inconsistent that is not to be debated.

He has an NFL history of injury issues not to be debated.

He can throw and can really spin it so he can play in BLO winters.

Like we all have said he needs to get faster at reading def and trust his prep and let it rip.

I read an article and he compared EJ to Flacco saying neither is elite but is good enough to win and when they are on they are on, but they are not Peyton, Brady or Brees and cannot carry a team all by themselves.

I completely agree with this, and is why he was not a top 3 pick. Plain and simple, and is another reason why I say why draft another QB that is that exact same guy.

[X-Era]

There is a lot to like about EJ and his game from a physical and mental standpoint.

He is very streaky and inconsistent that is not to be debated.

He has an NFL history of injury issues not to be debated.

He can throw and can really spin it so he can play in BLO winters.

Like we all have said he needs to get faster at reading def and trust his prep and let it rip.

I read an article and he compared EJ to Flacco saying neither is elite but is good enough to win and when they are on they are on, but they are not Peyton, Brady or Brees and cannot carry a team all by themselves.

I completely agree with this, and is why he was not a top 3 pick. Plain and simple, and is another reason why I say why draft another QB that is that exact same guy.I don't agree on Manuel.

I really can't blame much on him long term. I throw much, if not all, on his inexperience in the pro game. If he doesn't progress upward from here I will agree. I just want him to have a full off season with a throwing camp to the WR's. A full and healthy TC as the starter, and then see how he progresses in the real games.

I really think the stop and start choppy messed up season due to injury prevented him from gaining real traction and properly developing.

Yes, I think he can get a great deal better and the his mental markup is something I really like and a real reason I think he can get way better still.

I just don't think it's over yet.

[sudzy]

The Panthers had the first pick in the draft & Cam was highly thought of.

Is any QB in this class as highly thought of as Cam?

I don't think so, but if that is the case, he won't be there at #9.


I beg to differ. I don't remember Cam being the clear #1, by any means. A lot of people in the media thought he was a huge reach over all the talent at other positions (Von Miller, AJ Green, Dareus). I also remember Spike getting slammed when he turned into Cam's cheerleader on another board. This is were teams with good scouting staffs pay off.

[swiper]

Look I think we have good WRs, but I think we need a bigger target for red zone work. This guy can be a TE or a WR but to get a big WR would be better because they can be matched up against shorter CBs for the most part.


Suggestion: Go to GOOGLE and look up Ramses Barden in the news.

[DesertFox24]

I don't agree on Manuel.

I really can't blame much on him long term. I throw much, if not all, on his inexperience in the pro game. If he doesn't progress upward from here I will agree. I just want him to have a full off season with a throwing camp to the WR's. A full and healthy TC as the starter, and then see how he progresses in the real games.

I really think the stop and start choppy messed up season due to injury prevented him from gaining real traction and properly developing.

Yes, I think he can get a great deal better and the his mental markup is something I really like and a real reason I think he can get way better still.

I just don't think it's over yet.

I hope your are right I am routing for him. After we drafted him I really liked all the stuff I read so hoping he becomes the guy

[DesertFox24]

Suggestion: Go to GOOGLE and look up Ramses Barden in the news.

Lol if was legit he would not have been a futures free agent signing. I am not going to say he will not be any good but I will be surprised if he makes team and even sees the field

[BillsFever21]

so freakin rude to post comments about sometthing in an online article and not provide a link

http://www.buffalonews.com/columns/tim-graham/draft-another-qb-its-business-not-personal-20140130?two-bills-drive

I was thinking the same thing as I was reading through the thread. I was thinking where the hell are the quotes or article he is referring to.

[Meathead]

just bc local ppl might know a reference doesnt mean one shouldnt be provided. what if an alien taps into our internet and the first thing they see is your post? wouldnt you want the little green man to not have to look up what you already had open? and what if he never heard of google, did you think of that? the ease of following your post might have persuaded him to not invade earth, and i wouldnt want to have to live with that on my conscience. besides, providing a link is intergalactic law so why risk it

[BuffaloRedleg]

All I am saying is I think it is way to early to tell after 10 games if EJ is accurate or not. Heck we are not even sure if he was playing with knee pain or had to alter his approach to accomodate for pain in the knee.

I have had a knee sprain and they are painful for awhile and it is not like he was siting on a coach or at a cpu typing on message boards he was trying to get ready to play and probably pushed a lot harder.

Yes it is an excuse but until next year the only thing we have to go on from an EJ injury free stand point is the colts preseason game.
The only other thing we know is that he was getting better every week up until the Cleveland game. Then after that he had bad games and got gradually better then got hurt again.

His highs were not enough to remove any concerns and his lows were LOW, but as a first rounder he Whaley and Marrone deserve one more year of EJ as the starter.

Of course you don't know for sure whether he is accurate or will be a hall of famer.

I think it's certainly safe to say that he hasn't shown that he is accurate, and that there is a <50% chance that he will become a franchise QB.

That is why you hedge your bets. That's what good owners do.

Why are we one of the only teams who rely on "hope" instead of reasonable concepts of risk mitigation?

[X-Era]

just bc local ppl might know a reference doesnt mean one shouldnt be provided. what if an alien taps into our internet and the first thing they see is your post? wouldnt you want the little green man to not have to look up what you already had open? and what if he never heard of google, did you think of that? the ease of following your post might have persuaded him to not invade earth, and i wouldnt want to have to live with that on my conscience. besides, providing a link is intergalactic law so why risk itSeriously. Why would you want an alien to attack earth? So selfish. Do you not realize what your actions can cause?

Don't let an alien attack earth; get rid of cable, get DirecTv.

[Patti120]

Can't say that I have a prob with the article. I hope ej stays healthy and becomes the QB we need though!

[better days]

The issue isn't is thad a good back up. he is. but the way EJ played, he is too. so let's get a guy who has starting qualities. it can only drive EJ to play better. and if he can't, he wasn't our guy. and if the new guy plays better, thad's there to be the back up at a cheaper cost.

with the new rookie scale, you should be trying to hit the homerun on a great QB every draft until you have a top 5 qb. especially when your current one was injured 3 times.

It's crazy to say "let's just see if EJ can get it without a better back up plan."

I think the bills would be fine if a qualified journeyman could come in and take over if EJ isn't getting it.

Because as much as no one wants to say it...the rest of the bills team might be ready to be a playoff team now. not wait for EJ to stay healthy and learn some more. D was good, the WR are new and the backs have 1 year left. spiller has a year on his contract and fred will hit the wall sooner or later.

So who is the QB with starting qualities you propose the Bills draft?

And in what rnd? Like I said, they all have question marks.

If EJ does stay healthy, the Bills will start him every game of the season as they should.

I expect peaks & valleys in EJ's play as we all should. My hope is the rest of the team helps from letting the valleys become to low.

[Night Train]

So you draft another QB to have 2 undeveloped, unproven QB's.

Yeah...that's some sharp thinking..:down:


The idea is to replace Kolb with a Vet who can step in this coming year and keep the season from sinking.

If Manuel fails, THEN you draft another QB in 2015.

[better days]

I beg to differ. I don't remember Cam being the clear #1, by any means. A lot of people in the media thought he was a huge reach over all the talent at other positions (Von Miller, AJ Green, Dareus). I also remember Spike getting slammed when he turned into Cam's cheerleader on another board. This is were teams with good scouting staffs pay off.

Go GOOGLE Cam Newton. He was THE #1 pick by most experts in that draft.

And he was declared the best QB well before the draft happened.

Yes Cam had some red flags, like the fact he was kicked out of Fla & only played one year of D1 football, but that is NOTHING like the red flags the QB's in this class have.

And there was no other QB in that class that came close to him unlike this year where there is no consensus #1 QB in the draft.

And QB trumps EVERY other position in the draft, just ask Tim Graham.

[better days]

I agree with Graham. If and only if they think a franchise QB is sitting there. We don't have a franchise QB right now which means we won't win. Might EJ turn out to be the franchise guy? Sure. Right now he's an unknown quantity. He's been inconsistent. Why pass on someone who might be better?

My problem with Graham is the article he wrote. Not his thought that the Bills should draft a QB.

A valid argument could be made for drafting a QB because of EJ's injuries last year if nothing else.

BUT Tim tried to write a column in the style of Jerry Sullivan & it was a hacked attempt at the type of humor Jerry Sullivan is so good at.

I don't often agree with Jerry, but I have to say I do get a laugh more often than not reading him.

There was NOTHING funny in this column even if Tim thinks there was. It was pitiful IMO.

[BuffaloRedleg]

So you draft another QB to have 2 undeveloped, unproven QB's.

Yeah...that's some sharp thinking..:down:


The idea is to replace Kolb with a Vet who can step in this coming year and keep the season from sinking.

If Manuel fails, THEN you draft another QB in 2015.

Why is it bad to have a backup plan?

It's the most important position in all of sports.

You absolutely have to hedge your bets. Nothing even remotely matters compared to getting a QB.

Seahawks seem to be doing well and are reaping the benefits of hedging their bets at the QB position. They threw everything at the board until something stuck. That's great management.

[better days]

Why is it bad to have a backup plan?

It's the most important position in all of sports.

You absolutely have to hedge your bets. Nothing even remotely matters compared to getting a QB.

Seahawks seem to be doing well and are reaping the benefits of hedging their bets at the QB position. They threw everything at the board until something stuck. That's great management.

Well, like I asked trap, what QB would you like to see the Bills draft as a back up plan?

There is nothing wrong with a back up plan, but unless the QB you draft to compete with EJ has at least as much potential, that is a wasted pick that could have been better used.

[BuffaloRedleg]

And I'll add that the Bills refusing to hedge their bets at the QB position is the whole reason we are in this mess in the first place. Passing on Kaepernick and Wilson was a perfect example of that. This is easily a playoff team with one of them 2 at QB.

Excuse me while I go get hammered to forget that.

[BuffaloRedleg]

Well, like I asked trap, what QB would you like to see the Bills draft as a back up plan?

There is nothing wrong with a back up plan, but unless the QB you draft to compete with EJ has at least as much potential, that is a wasted pick that could have been better used.

If none of the marquee guys are there at 9, then there are plenty who can be obtained in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds.

I hate when people use your argument. It's virtually impossible to tell how a QB will turn out. Even RGIII looks like he could turn out to be a bust with all these injuries. I could throw a bunch of names out there and of course there are reasons not to draft them. That's missing the point.

The only way to ensure that you almost never get a good QB is to draft one every 3 years when your average draft position is around 7-14. Like the Bills have. The only way to do it, unless you magically bottom out in the right year like the Colts, is to go for quantity and keep trying to see what works. Everything falls into place once you have a good QB. You don't even really know how good your team is until you have one, as he makes everyone from the O-Line to WRs to the Defense better. It's that important. And that's why you hedge your bets.

[better days]

If none of the marquee guys are there at 9, then there are plenty who can be obtained in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds.

I hate when people use your argument. It's virtually impossible to tell how a QB will turn out. Even RGIII looks like he could turn out to be a bust with all these injuries. I could throw a bunch of names out there and of course there are reasons not to draft them. That's missing the point.

The only way to ensure that you almost never get a good QB is to draft one every 3 years when your average draft position is around 7-14. Like the Bills have. The only way to do it, unless you magically bottom out in the right year like the Colts, is to go for quantity and keep trying to see what works. Everything falls into place once you have a good QB. You don't even really know how good your team is until you have one, as he makes everyone from the O-Line to WRs to the Defense better. It's that important. And that's why you hedge your bets.

Well, Mike just accused me of being wrong all the time.

And I am from time to time, but that is because I am not afraid to put my neck out & take a position.

I said I wanted the Bills to draft Russell Wilson. Looks like I was right about him.

I said I would like the Bills to draft Mike Glennon or EJ Manuel & they are the two best QB's in that class.

And Russell Wilson was drafted with the #12 pick.....................in the THIRD rnd.

Joe Flacco was drafted #18

Aaron Rodgers was drafted #24

Brady was drafted in the 6th rnd

Tony Romo like Jeff Tuel, was not drafted at all

And there have been MANY QB's drafted HIGH that were a BUST like Ryan Leaf.

[X-Era]

Why is it bad to have a backup plan?

It's the most important position in all of sports.

You absolutely have to hedge your bets. Nothing even remotely matters compared to getting a QB.

Seahawks seem to be doing well and are reaping the benefits of hedging their bets at the QB position. They threw everything at the board until something stuck. That's great management.I'd be OK with taking another QB. However, the Bills seem to want to land 3 starters out of the draft each year. Without a trade down you're looking at the 4th round or beyond... If they go after potential day one starters with picks 1, 2, and 3.

So in the 4th or beyond I'm fine taking a guy. He'd be competing with Tuel for the 3rd QB spot most likely since Lewis has probably shown enough to be inked in as the backup.

I don't mind the move in the later rounds.

[X-Era]

And I'll add that the Bills refusing to hedge their bets at the QB position is the whole reason we are in this mess in the first place. Passing on Kaepernick and Wilson was a perfect example of that. This is easily a playoff team with one of them 2 at QB.

Excuse me while I go get hammered to forget that.EJ played 9 games. If he played another 7 do you think we could have won 2 or 3 more than we did? I think that's possible personally. I think the Browns and Bengals games could have been wins. Just me.

[sudzy]

If Manuel fails, THEN you draft another QB in 2015.


Then you get people that claim it takes at least 3 years to develop a rookie QB and they should give him another year. I told everyone when they said we have to draft a QB last year whether there were any first round ranked ones or not, if you draft the wrong one it will set them back 5 years. Get ready people because it's going to set us back 5 years.

[better days]

Then you get people that claim it takes at least 3 years to develop a rookie QB and they should give him another year. I told everyone when they said we have to draft a QB last year whether there were any first round ranked ones or not, if you draft the wrong one it will set them back 5 years. Get ready people because it's going to set us back 5 years.

Well, if it set the Bills back 5 years drafting EJ, how many years would it be to not draft anybody last year?

I think if it is 5 years with EJ, it would be 6 or 7 years without him.

[cookie G]

I'd be OK with taking another QB. However, the Bills seem to want to land 3 starters out of the draft each year. Without a trade down you're looking at the 4th round or beyond... If they go after potential day one starters with picks 1, 2, and 3.

So in the 4th or beyond I'm fine taking a guy. He'd be competing with Tuel for the 3rd QB spot most likely since Lewis has probably shown enough to be inked in as the backup.

I don't mind the move in the later rounds.

I don't think that is what he means by a "back up plan". He's talking about drafting another QB if Manuel fails/doesn't progress. He's not talking about bringing in a back up QB.

[DynaPaul]

How is EJ going to grow if he isn't challenged? In this case it's a reporter telling him he needs real competition because he wasn't that impressive as a rookie drafted that high.

[stuckincincy]

I like Tim Graham and I've spoken to him before. I think at times he lets his trolls and frustrations get the better of him, but he's a good reporter and you can't fault him for being honest in the face of a player.

How many times do you think Skip Bayless has ripped guys on ESPN, just to get in front of them and cow-tow to their celebrity?

I'm fine with him, but he is a bit thin-skinned.

[JoeMama]

I think Tim Graham has the right of it.

This isn't a weight loss retreat for rich women, it's a professional football team. We shouldn't be so concerned with hurting EJ's feelings. We should be concerned with becoming a better, more competitive football team.

14 years and counting.

And that streak ain't coming to an end until we have a stud at the helm.

[better days]

I think Tim Graham has the right of it.

This isn't a weight loss retreat for rich women, it's a professional football team. We shouldn't be so concerned with hurting EJ's feelings. We should be concerned with becoming a better, more competitive football team.

14 years and counting.

And that streak ain't coming to an end until we have a stud at the helm.

IMO, it isn't about Tim Graham being right or wrong in his opinion.

The point is he is worse at his job than EJ is at his.

Graham was trying to copy Jerry Sullivan's style in that article & he did a terrible job.

The News should hire someone to give Tim some competition.

[JCBills]

The Carolina Panthers beg to differ. Just think where they'd be if they had your philosophy and rode it out with Jimmy Clausen because he was a 2nd round pick instead of drafting Cam Newton.
It's a good bet Ron Rivera wouldn't be their head coach anymore instead of signing that extension this week.

Since when are we picking #1 overall?

[Mace]

Doesn't make the least sense to me to add an unknown QB with a learning curve, from what looks to me like a weak QB class, when we already have three of them that now have more experience in the offense and the pros.

The Bills dorked up in not having a QB coach, and not having a steady handed vet available to hold the fort and mentor an offense on the same learning curve.

I don't know how Manuel, Lewis, Tuel turn out, I don't think this QB coach is any good either, but we know the drill. Suffer a few years and start over.

Or, you finish building a team a future QB can walk into if these don't work out, with the picks we have so the available young QB's live and die on merit, and you know for sure.

I like Tim Graham, he's sort of the best reporter they have, usually doesn't add editorial, just gives you facts. Reports, adds interesting thoughts from his extensive league contacts.

This article seemed peculiar, like he was trying too hard to add spice.

I give Manuel credit though. He handled it professionally. I'm not real sure why a sports reporter thinks a pro player would stand there and wait, fascinated to hear the reporters thoughtful explanation in any case.

"Oooh, really Tim, why yes, you're right come to think ! Say, tell me your thoughts on my throwing motion, because it's important to me to learn this kind of important stuff from a reporter."