Potential Bills buyer thinks team may need a dome in Buffalo

[Fletch]

Haven't seen this posted yet.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/06/06/potential-bills-buyer-thinks-team-may-need-a-dome-in-buffalo/

The Bills may remain in Western New York but move indoors.


Billionaire Tom Golisano, a former owner of the NHL’s Buffalo Sabres, has confirmed that he is interested in buying the Bills from the estate of the late owner Ralph Wilson, and that he would keep the team in town. But Golisano indicated that a new stadium may need to be built.


“My guess, and it’s strictly a guess, is the stadium will be covered (http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/sports/football/nfl/bills/2014/06/05/golisano-interested-keep-bills-wny/10022633/),” he said, via the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle. “I don’t know if it’ll have a sliding roof or just a permanent roof, but my guess is it will be covered. And the state government, our governor and some of our U.S. senators are very much in favor of this happening.”


Golisano has been linked to developer Scott Congel (http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/developers-700-million-plan-for-west-seneca-plaza-could-include-new-stadium-20140528), who owns land about 10 miles from Ralph Wilson Stadium that could be the site of a new stadium. Such a deal is a long way off, but Golisano made clear that he hopes an arrangement for the Bills to stay in the Buffalo area can be worked out.


“The important thing is someone buys [the team] and keeps it in western New York,” he said. “Do I feel it has to be me? No, I’m not possessed about owning the Buffalo Bills, just as I wasn’t possessed about owning the Buffalo Sabres. They were in danger of leaving, too. In fact they were a lot closer to leaving than the Bills are. I got involved then because I wanted to keep that entity in western New York, and I want to keep the Buffalo Bills in western New York.”


Snow in Buffalo in December is a longtime NFL tradition, and it would be sad to see it go. But if the alternative is the Bills leaving the area entirely, Buffalo fans would embrace a dome.


Personally, taking it out of the snow in the late fall would reduce the experience for me. It would obviously also diminish the homefield advantage. I guess if it means keeping the team ...

[BuffaloWingEater]

Retractable dome downtown is the best case scenario

[Turf]

The open air stadium keeps upper clientele away especially late in the year. That's where the money is. As much as I love the Bills, if its 5 degrees out, I'm not going to the game. I've spent enough games freezing my ass off in those metal seats. A $50 ticket vs a $200 ticket doesn't matter to me, there's only 8 games. I want a good experience. I can still get drunk if I want, which I don't. A few beers is good for me. But I and other like me will spend the money. It will also increase season tickets and the price of season tickets.
Its where the money is. People can still tailgate. It doesn't have to be an all or nothing proposition.

[trapezeus]

pretty solid comments by T Golly. the dome would be something to get used to, but would clearly make attending the late season games where we are out of it much more palatable.

golly's bid seems to be contingent on his guy getting the stadium deal. so i doubt the downtown stadium would be possible. but who knows.

the best part is that he says the state government is in support of helping.

[OpIv37]

Retractable dome downtown is the best case scenario

Retractable dome in Buffalo is useless. We will be lucky to have it open two games a year. If they are dead-set in a dome, save the money and the maintenance and make it fixed roof.

[DraftBoy]

I get the appeal of the retractable roof but why bother with the extra expense? As Op said it won't be open very often.

[Fletch]

People can still tailgate.

Well, we hope so. Seems like the No Fun League keeps cracking down on tailgating. Some others have pointed out how in other stadiums, some major cities like D.C., tailgating isn't what it is in Buffalo currently.

They took some of the fun out of it when they stopped letting people park where they want to. Probably to try to squeeze an extra 80 cars in a lot of thousands just to give a multi-millinaire owner a few hundred more dollars.

[Fletch]

Retractable dome in Buffalo is useless. We will be lucky to have it open two games a year. If they are dead-set in a dome, save the money and the maintenance and make it fixed roof.

They're not going to close it if it's drizzing and 50 out.

I would think that it would be closed to keep snow out of the seats and if the weather clears up then reopened. Who knows. But as long as it's above 40 I'd expect it to be open. Maybe I'm way off. I can see it being closed for 2-3 games. Sept. and Oct. are great in Buffalo. Early November can be nice too. Heck, even December has its nice days.

I have to think that the cost, both construction as well as maintenance, is much greater for a moveable dome. It may not be possible and may simply have to be a hard dome.

[OpIv37]

They're not going to close it if it's drizzing and 50 out.

I would think that it would be closed to keep snow out of the seats and if the weather clears up then reopened. Who knows. But as long as it's above 40 I'd expect it to be open. Maybe I'm way off. I can see it being closed for 2-3 games. Sept. and Oct. are great in Buffalo. Early November can be nice too. Heck, even December has its nice days.

I have to think that the cost, both construction as well as maintenance, is much greater for a moveable dome. It may not be possible and may simply have to be a hard dome.

Problem is, you're thinking like someone from Buffalo. If we get a dome, it's going to be league rules, not Buffalo rules. No way in hell it's open if there's any type of precipitation whatsoever, and no way it's open if it's 40 degrees out.

[DraftBoy]

They're not going to close it if it's drizzing and 50 out.

I think they absolutely would close it for that. Why subject your team to the rain when you don't have to?

[THATHURMANATOR]

Retractable dome downtown is the best case scenario

Why would it need to be retractable? That is what I never get? Why waste the money? We would NEVER open it for a cold weather game.

Also those whining and complaining about a dome obviously haven't missed a home game in 14 years (such as myself) and haven't sat through double digit December games that were 33 degrees and raining while the team was already out of the playoff hunt. STFU ALREADY!!!!

Cold weather is ZERO advantage for the Bils. 90% of our own players are from warm weather locations.

[Bill Cody]

I hate domes but I understand the logic. Whatever it takes

[THATHURMANATOR]

I think they absolutely would close it for that. Why subject your team to the rain when you don't have to?

Without question!!!

[trapezeus]

aren't there specific rules the nfl has for when it closes? i don't think it's too onerous.

retracable keeps the allure of some nice weather for september.

i also think the difference in cost between the two is negligiblie. it's not like $1BN permanently closed and $2.5BN retractable. i would think it's a $200-300MM extra.

[Novacane]

I'd like a dome. I'd go to more late season games if we had a dome.

[Dr. Lecter]

aren't there specific rules the nfl has for when it closes? i don't think it's too onerous.

retracable keeps the allure of some nice weather for september.

i also think the difference in cost between the two is negligiblie. it's not like $1BN permanently closed and $2.5BN retractable. i would think it's a $200-300MM extra.


****. Chump Change. I have that in my cup holder of my car right now......

[better days]

Why would it need to be retractable? That is what I never get? Why waste the money? We would NEVER open it for a cold weather game.

Also those whining and complaining about a dome obviously haven't missed a home game in 14 years (such as myself) and haven't sat through double digit December games that were 33 degrees and raining while the team was already out of the playoff hunt. STFU ALREADY!!!!

Cold weather is ZERO advantage for the Bils. 90% of our own players are from warm weather locations.

I already posted that the Vikings dome should be the model for the new Bills stadium.

Fixed translucent roof.

[trapezeus]

****. Chump Change. I have that in my cup holder of my car right now......

i'm just saying, look at the renovations to the ralph. it started at $60MM and went to $200MM in like 10 weeks when this was being discussed. These are fairly managable and expected overages on such projects..

So wouldn't it suck to get a permadome at $1.3BN, when you could have just slotted a $1.3BN dome that was retractable? Of course, it's convenient that i'm cherry picking the overage on the low one and not applying to the high end. but one thing is that if we are pushing stadium design concepts, the expenses will be fairly close to what you think they may be. it's the cookie cutter following ones that have overages because people just add pork after the fact.

disclaimer: i've never built a stadium, so i can be entirely wrong. that was a guess above.

[Meathead]

never minded the cold or snow when i went to games, it was more the wind depending on how hard it was blowin and where you were sitting. or of course if it rained very much, and combined with wind/cold those days could really suck. but cold and tons of snow without wind/rain is awesome imo. ive always had more snow clothes than i could possibly wear so yeah let it freakin snow

those days are prolly over im afraid to say. i cant imagine they will spend all that money on a modern money sucking entertainment complex only to force their sheep err i mean fans to sit in late season often times miserable conditions and wade through six layers to get to their wallets. and tailgating doesnt do the league hardly any good, its like a big free hippie party except its football

ive gone to games in domes a bunch of times and it always feels antiseptic to me. i suppose you get used to it but its too bad the local tradition is probably going to be a shell of its former self cuz those were some of the best times of my life

[The Jokeman]

Retractable dome in Buffalo is useless. We will be lucky to have it open two games a year. If they are dead-set in a dome, save the money and the maintenance and make it fixed roof.

If it's stadium that could be used for other sports (see baseball) then count me in the retractable crowd. Otherwise yes fixed room makes sense.

[OpIv37]

aren't there specific rules the nfl has for when it closes? i don't think it's too onerous.

retracable keeps the allure of some nice weather for september.

i also think the difference in cost between the two is negligiblie. it's not like $1BN permanently closed and $2.5BN retractable. i would think it's a $200-300MM extra.

That's $200-300MM that WNYers will pay for, either through taxes or ticket prices/PSL's or both.

[OpIv37]

If it's stadium that could be used for other sports (see baseball) then count me in the retractable crowd. Otherwise yes fixed room makes sense.

The problem is that Buffalo doesn't have an MLB team, and won't anytime in the foreseeable future. The new stadium will probably hold 60k or so. The Bisons only draw a fraction of that. And that's not a knock on the Bisons- it's the nature of AAA ball. Hell, most major league stadiums seat 40k, give or take 5k. I would think the energy costs alone would be prohibitive for the Bisons. The additional trouble of designing the stadium to accommodate baseball isn't worth it for the amount of baseball that would be played there.

If Buffalo did have an MLB team that could share a retractable dome, I'd be all for it.

[stuckincincy]

I already posted that the Vikings dome should be the model for the new Bills stadium.

Fixed translucent roof.

I don't know about the MIN stadium, but I do know about the Syracuse Carrier Dome with a translucent roof. It's like watching a game with a never-ending overcast sky.

[OpIv37]

I don't know about the MIN stadium, but I do know about the Syracuse Carrier Dome with a translucent roof. It's like watching a game with a never-ending overcast sky.

The existing open-air stadium in Orchard Park is like that too.

[HAMMER]

Retractable dome in Buffalo is useless. We will be lucky to have it open two games a year. If they are dead-set in a dome, save the money and the maintenance and make it fixed roof.

I don't agree, it is certainly more than two games a year that it would be open. We have had a lot of very nice weather games the last few years into November.

That being said I have attended games in Glendale AZ at the Cards facility when the roof was both open and closed, and the difference is negligible, I love that stadium and it really changed my views on closed roof stadiums. There is no doubt that to be a viable option financially, Buffalo needs a stadium that can be closed.

[stuckincincy]

I don't agree, it is certainly more than two games a year that it would be open. We have had a lot of very nice weather games the last few years into November.

That being said I have attended games in Glendale AZ at the Cards facility when the roof was both open and closed, and the difference is negligible, I love that stadium and it really changed my views on closed roof stadiums. There is no doubt that to be a viable option financially, Buffalo needs a stadium that can be closed.

Buffalo needs a 50% increase in ticket prices and $2,000 and up PSLs for a new stadium. Let those who want to attend pay for their yucks themselves and not try to stick it to folks who don't give a rats' fanny about the NFL.

[trapezeus]

i'm fine paying the difference in PSL's. a new stadium isn't going to put us at the height of PSLs around the league.

I also think a real multi-purpose structure with draws other than just football would make the funding from the state somewhat beneficial. if we are getting major conferences, and hotels start going up and restaurants around that structure, the money spent will be recovered.

if this is just for football, it's going ot be an expense to save our team. i'm fine with that. so little of the pork in bills ever effects me positively. so why not get one break.

[stuckincincy]

i'm fine paying the difference in PSL's. a new stadium isn't going to put us at the height of PSLs around the league.

I also think a real multi-purpose structure with draws other than just football would make the funding from the state somewhat beneficial. if we are getting major conferences, and hotels start going up and restaurants around that structure, the money spent will be recovered.

if this is just for football, it's going ot be an expense to save our team. i'm fine with that. so little of the pork in bills ever effects me positively. so why not get one break.

You can book other events into an arena sized for basketball and hockey, but it's harder to get attractions to fill a 60 -70K stadium. And heating, cooling, lighting a big stadium, all that air space in the dome, all that frigid concrete, is a substantial cost. The overhead is significant. The staffing expense is large.

[Forward_Lateral]

Give them a dome, who cares. Like the article says, if it keeps the Bills in Buffalo, do it. It would probably help bring free agents to Buffalo, knowing they wouldn't have to play in garbage weather half of the home games. Is it a home field advantage? Sure, but so is having 60,000 rabid fans in a dome. Imagine how loud it would get.

Also, this would give Buffalo a chance to get a superbowl, and other bigger sporting events.

Ford Field in Detroit has no problems filling concerts, btw. That's a non-issue.

[better days]

The problem is that Buffalo doesn't have an MLB team, and won't anytime in the foreseeable future. The new stadium will probably hold 60k or so. The Bisons only draw a fraction of that. And that's not a knock on the Bisons- it's the nature of AAA ball. Hell, most major league stadiums seat 40k, give or take 5k. I would think the energy costs alone would be prohibitive for the Bisons. The additional trouble of designing the stadium to accommodate baseball isn't worth it for the amount of baseball that would be played there.

If Buffalo did have an MLB team that could share a retractable dome, I'd be all for it.

IMO, stadiums used for both baseball & football are TERRIBLE.

The sight lines are the worst. I think a dome in Buffalo could be used for things other than football in the offseason such as conventions & trade shows.

[better days]

I don't know about the MIN stadium, but I do know about the Syracuse Carrier Dome with a translucent roof. It's like watching a game with a never-ending overcast sky.

Well, I have been to games at the old dome in Pontiac Mich & Tropicana Field in Tampa.

I would take the look of an overcast sky to a solid roof any day.

[Don't Panic]

Great thread here. A couple thoughts...

I don't see the Carrier Dome as a good reference point to this dome. The roof of the Vikings Dome will be almost transparent from the images I've seen of it. That will have a much different feel than the Carrier Dome.

I'm not seeing the point in a retractable dome if the cost is $250 million higher, especially if there's public dollars involved. The Bisons will not play in this stadium. There's really no major sporting events in the summer. The weather in Buffalo is less than desirable most of the year. Put in a fixed dome and call it a day.

I could see Buffalo getting an NCAA Regional Final with this dome (sweet 16 and elite 8 games). We are an ideal city for it both proximity-wise and it terms of the fact that we don't have a top college program in town.

I really think this thing needs to be built somewhere along the Buffalo River, whether out on the harbor or in a mile or so. That's the best location IMO.

[BLeonard]

Just scrolled through this and figured I'd chime in with a few notes:

1: IMO, the whole cold weather being a "home-field advantage" might have been true in the 90's, but is not nearly the advantage it once was.

2: According to NFL rules, the home team decides whether or not the roof is open or closed in stadiums that have the option. More on that here: http://www.footballzebras.com/2013/05/01/7343/


One and one-half hours prior to kickoff, the home team will have the authority to determine if the roof should be open or closed for the game. The home club may choose to open the roof for some games and not for others. In the event a game is started with the roof in the open position and it is closed pursuant to the procedures set forth below, or if the game starts with the roof in the closed position, the roof must thereafter remain in the closed position for the duration of the game.

So, with the Bills being the "Home Team" for the games played in Toronto, they could have elected to have the roof open, if they so chose to. The fact that they never did furthers my point of the cold weather not being the "home field advantage" it once was. Especially in the cases of the games against Miami and (especially) Atlanta (who plays their home games in a dome)... Why wouldn't you elect to have the dome open...?

3: Interesting note: There is (and has been in the past) a clause in the Bills lease that prohibits pro baseball from being played at RWS... No idea why, but the clause is in there.

-Bill

[OpIv37]

Actually the Bills couldn't open the roof in Toronto. It gets "winterized" after baseball season and can't be opened until it's un-winterized in the spring.

[OpIv37]

I don't agree, it is certainly more than two games a year that it would be open. We have had a lot of very nice weather games the last few years into November.

That being said I have attended games in Glendale AZ at the Cards facility when the roof was both open and closed, and the difference is negligible, I love that stadium and it really changed my views on closed roof stadiums. There is no doubt that to be a viable option financially, Buffalo needs a stadium that can be closed.

According to this, teams with domes tend to keep them closed:

Yet, the NFL teams with retractable roofs — the Houston Texans, Arizona Cardinals, Indianapolis Colts and Dallas Cowboys — have played 66 percent of their games in their current stadiums with the roofs closed, according to figures obtained from the teams by The Atlanta Journal-Constitution. Out of 225 regular-season and playoff games in the four stadiums, 149 have been played with the roof closed and 76 with it open.
The Texans have played 31 games with the roof open and 59 with it closed; the Cardinals 19 with it open and 40 with it closed; the Colts 13 open and 30 closed; and the Cowboys 13 open and 20 closed. The stadiums range in age from 11 years (the Texans’) to four years (the Cowboys’).
http://www.ajc.com/news/sports/football/nfl-teams-tend-keep-retractable-roofs-closed/nWcNT/

The article is from 2/13 so it doesn't include the 2013 season.

All those cities have better weather than Buffalo, with the possible exception of Indy.

If we go with the league average of 66% of games with the roof closed, we are talking 3 games a year with the dome open.

The home team does decide whether or not to keep it open, and people in Buffalo are definitely less adverse to bad weather than people in Texas or Arizona, so maybe the team would decide to open it more than the cities that currently have retractable roofs.

I guess it comes down to cost: how much more should be spent on a retractable dome vice a fixed roof?

[TigerJ]

While I would like a retractable roof stadium versus a fixed dome, I can appreciate the cost issue. Going to a fixed dome is not a deal breaker in my book.

[Northern Stampede]

Football in Buffalo should be played outdoors IN THE ELEMENTS!!!!!!!

[Turf]

Has anyone considered the cost of real heated seats in contrast to a dome?

[OpIv37]

Football in Buffalo should be played outdoors IN THE ELEMENTS!!!!!!!

agreed but that's just not reality. The people like you and me (and most others on this board) who think football should be played in the elements- and don't mind being outside in the elements to watch it- are diehard football fans and the NFL already knows they are going to get our money.

They are going after corporate fans who buy luxury boxes and lower level seats, or more casual fans who will check out a game here and there but won't sit outside for a meaningless December game in a blizzard.

Personally, I'd like to keep it outdoors, but in terms of the long-term viability of the team (ie, attracting as many fans as possible) and building a facility that can host events beyond just football games and bring more people to Buffalo, a downtown dome is the way to go.

[BuffaloWingEater]

Retractable dome in Buffalo is useless. We will be lucky to have it open two games a year. If they are dead-set in a dome, save the money and the maintenance and make it fixed roof.

????????????? September, October, November, plus you can use it as a multiplex with a retractable dome. not useless, practical for all sports and events.

[better days]

????????????? September, October, November, plus you can use it as a multiplex with a retractable dome. not useless, practical for all sports and events.

A retractable dome would be great.

Cost is the only issue IMO.

A fixed translucent roof would cost about half the price of a retractable roof.

[OpIv37]

????????????? September, October, November, plus you can use it as a multiplex with a retractable dome. not useless, practical for all sports and events.
Did you see the article I posted? Existing retractable roofs are closed 66% of the time, and 3 of the 4 are in cities with much better weather than Buffalo.

Also, what sport or event would be hosted in a retractable roof stadium that couldn't also be hosted in a fixed roof stadium? That point doesn't make any sense.

[trapezeus]

buffalo is stilll light years away from a superbowl. i won't say never, but down town and places around the current stadium are not corporate friendly. We don't have the hotels at hte high end to support this. i realize we are building the marriot, etc, but it's got to be growing a lot faster than that.

Have you ever gone to FNC and looked for a restaurant before the game? Pearl street pub is packed and mid level. you need to have a variety of high end and low end stuff with some vibrancy in the town. buffalo currently doesn't provide that and a new stadium alone won't change it.

so the idea of this being a ticket into a superbowl is a non-starter. the growth and improvement over the last 3-5 years is noted, but it has to keep up and it really needs better results. i'm a buffalo kid. i'd love to see it happen, but compared to other towns that have done it and could support it, we don't have a comparable bid.

[BuffaloWingEater]

Did you see the article I posted? Existing retractable roofs are closed 66% of the time, and 3 of the 4 are in cities with much better weather than Buffalo.

Also, what sport or event would be hosted in a retractable roof stadium that couldn't also be hosted in a fixed roof stadium? That point doesn't make any sense.

if you want a state of the art stadium to attract all sorts of events, especially utilizing the canadian market, the stadium has to be multipurpose. while a dome would be more cost effective, i say don't sell the stadium short, especially considering all the positive buzz surrounding buffalo and the economy. even putting the stadium downtown would most likely force the issue of eliminating the skyway and finally spur the joint creation of a signature peace bridge. now, i want the bills to stay in buffalo, and if a dome is the only option then so be it. but reach for the moon on the stadium and settle at the best spot you can.

[Woodman]

Put me down for a football only fixed dome stadium.

We need a poll for this question.

[BuffaloWingEater]

buffalo is stilll light years away from a superbowl. i won't say never, but down town and places around the current stadium are not corporate friendly. We don't have the hotels at hte high end to support this. i realize we are building the marriot, etc, but it's got to be growing a lot faster than that.

Have you ever gone to FNC and looked for a restaurant before the game? Pearl street pub is packed and mid level. you need to have a variety of high end and low end stuff with some vibrancy in the town. buffalo currently doesn't provide that and a new stadium alone won't change it.

so the idea of this being a ticket into a superbowl is a non-starter. the growth and improvement over the last 3-5 years is noted, but it has to keep up and it really needs better results. i'm a buffalo kid. i'd love to see it happen, but compared to other towns that have done it and could support it, we don't have a comparable bid.

like jacksonville, or indianapolis, or the hole that is new orleans? or how new jersey had to accommodate the ny super bowl? the infrastructure will grow in the next few years and a retractable roof/dome is a ticket to landing an eventual super bowl. plus, canada can also help accommodate

[Woodman]

16915

[better days]

16915

I like the pictures of the new Minnesota dome much better than this.

[Historian]

I've wanted a dome here since opening day, 1971.

[stuckincincy]

like jacksonville, or indianapolis, or the hole that is new orleans? or how new jersey had to accommodate the ny super bowl? the infrastructure will grow in the next few years and a retractable roof/dome is a ticket to landing an eventual super bowl. plus, canada can also help accommodate

It would be a tremendous long shot.

First, you need that new stadium - folks have wised up to having their counties go into big debt, watch services drop, just to satisfy the yucks of a relatively few. And a new stadium comes with PSLs and tix increases - at which point, some of the crowd that wants others to pay for their fun bails out.

If you stuck it anywhere around downtown Bflo, the costs to make it reasonably accessible to a full house is considerable. And tailgating as it is known today is in for a rude awakening. Lots of folks attend Bills' games in fair part because of the tailgating bonhomie...curtail that, the numbers of folks won't bother to show up and attend the game mount.

Add in the corruption of a seemingly life-long one-party political machine that will shave millions off, fueled by a carefully constructed minority population that returns same to office in return for other people's money - and it adds up to a big no-go.

The City of Bflo will be fortunate to stave off what is happening to Detroit and other cities. They've no business pimping for a private enterprise organization that would walk away if there was another buck to be made elsewhere.

Refurbish RWS, keep the tailgating alive.

[trapezeus]

like jacksonville, or indianapolis, or the hole that is new orleans? or how new jersey had to accommodate the ny super bowl? the infrastructure will grow in the next few years and a retractable roof/dome is a ticket to landing an eventual super bowl. plus, canada can also help accommodate

jacksonville alone closed the book on small market teams hosting superbowls. they at least had nice weather.

Indy is bigger than buffalo and a little more vibrant. New Orleans is a party town and can accomodate large crowds (plus the PR of supporting NO after katrina was worth it for the nfl)

i don't think multi-millionaires are going to be excited to go to west seneca and have a hotel in downtown. if the stadium comes down town, then it's a matter of continued growth in hotels, restaurants and other things to do. Currently downtown is non-existant. there are only 2-3 top hotels. there is nothing to do downtown. there are no other ways to get around than by car.

it can be done, but it's not close. it's not a 5 year project. it would be 10-20 and at that point, the new stadium may not be shiny enough to the NFL's standards.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Why do we even want a superbowl anyways?

So we can listen to every douche radio outlet from around the country rip on Buffalo and complain about why the game is being held there?

[The King]

It makes sense you need to keep the team profitable year round. You can also have concerts and other events year round.

[PromoTheRobot]

Retractable dome in Buffalo is useless. We will be lucky to have it open two games a year. If they are dead-set in a dome, save the money and the maintenance and make it fixed roof.

It's a friggin' miracle! Opi says something I agree with 100%.

[Don't Panic]

Couldn't there be an open air element to a fixed dome? It may be an undoable stretch, but seeing that you're never going to need A/C being in Buffalo and all, it would be pretty cool to have that cool October air rolling through while playing "indoors". I think some stadium did this... there are openings on the end zone sides that can also be closed. Or does that just half eliminate the purpose of a dome all along?

[Dr. Lecter]

Couldn't there be an open air element to a fixed dome? It may be an undoable stretch, but seeing that you're never going to need A/C being in Buffalo and all, it would be pretty cool to have that cool October air rolling through while playing "indoors". I think some stadium did this... there are openings on the end zone sides that can also be closed. Or does that just half eliminate the purpose of a dome all along?

They will need AC. It is not like it is always 15 and snowing here. I have been to more than one opener when it has been 80+. Fill a domed stadium with 65,000+ people and have no AC in those conditions and people will fry. Not to mention what it is like in August during preseason

[Historian]

I remember two really steaming hot games: The Pittsburgh game in 1991, and The Jets opener in 2002. Both were around 88 degrees.

[pmoon6]

Football was meant to be played outside in the elements. I could give a **** if the upper class elitists and pussies stay away 'cause it's too cowld. Stay at home wrapped in your binkie and watch on TV.

Further proof that the roots of the game have all but shriveled up and died.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Let me say that the first 4 games or so are usually nice weather honestly.

Some years we get 5 or 6 that aren't bad at all.

It is the December games that usually blow.