This is why I give EJ thru late December

[Yasgur's Farm]

http://www.trendingbuffalo.com/sports/buffalo-bills/through-3-games-ej-manuel-is-trending-upward/
From
Read the whole article... But the quote below is why he get thru late December IMO...
[QUOTE]Manuel isn’t an absolute “one-read” quarterback, but he doesn’t run through 2-4 progressions very often. That’s a very advanced but ultimately necessary quarterbacking trait. Offensive coordinator Nate Hackett has done a great job getting Manuel an open receiver on his first read but the Chargers secondary had a magnificent day in coverage, both in man and zone, and coupled with a poor offensive line showing, many times, Manuel either didn’t have anyone open or was faced with pressure almost immediately or before pass-catchers made their breaks.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

More than anything else, Manuel needs to quickly move off his initial target if it’s not open right away.

This is one thing that Chargers picked on which has carried over from pre-season where more than one observers have said that he tends to stare down the receivers. I noticed in the wed presser he mentioned that he needs to calm down when the play is not there, which echos what Marrone said on Monday.

Of course it is much easier to say stuff in front of a microphone than when DEs are crashing down to you on the field. But this is the kind of improvement I want to see over the course of the season. There are a lot of things for him to fix; if I were the coaches, I'd take one small step at a time and say let's focus on this one now.

[Homegrown]

The Browns like the cut of your jib

[justasportsfan]

Manuel isn’t an absolute “one-read” quarterback, but he doesn’t run through 2-4 progressions very often. That’s a very advanced but ultimately necessary quarterbacking trait. you know who had that very advanced trait and was way more advanced than EJ? Van Pelt and Fitz.

If you can't throw , that advanced trait is useless.

If you have that advanced trait but don't have the BASIC trait that a qb needs which is accuracy, then you should be a coach.

[EDS]

EJ gets the whole season to prove himself since there is no one else on the roster to develop as an alternative.

[malvado78]

Of course it is much easier to say stuff in front of a microphone than when DEs are crashing down to you on the field.

Sounds like we should send some DE's at him while he is at the mic during the presser. Give him more opportunities for experience.

[WagonCircler]

EJ gets the whole season to prove himself since there is no one else on the roster to develop as an alternative.

So you think the Bills gave Orton that huge contract with no possible hope that he can play?

Ridiculous.

[malvado78]

So you think the Bills gave Orton that huge contract with no possible hope that he can play?

Ridiculous.

Who cares what amount of money they gave him. They have plenty left over EVERY year. Hopefully that changes with new ownership...

[ghz in pittsburgh]

Who cares what amount of money they gave him. They have plenty left over EVERY year. Hopefully that changes with new ownership...

If Pegula were the owner two years ago, Fitz might still be here. And tell you what, Fitz might just be the perfect guy to start while Manuel learns in the first year and mentor in the 2nd year.

[Meathead]

exactly how late into december? if we are talking december 20th then maybe, but if its pats december 25 then forget it

[Night Train]

It's not all about Manuel.

If Marrone thinks he's auditioning for employment for Pegula and Co., then he'll insert Orton the second he thinks the season may be in jeopardy. It's all about winning.

I don't think he gives a crap what Whaley and Brandon think now. Once the season starts, the team is his and his voice is primary.

It goes for all positions.

[Bill Cody]

So you think the Bills gave Orton that huge contract with no possible hope that he can play?

Ridiculous.

It's the same deal he had in Dallas. And he played there, when Romo was hurt. But yes he was signed by Dallas with the hope that he would never take a snap. Same idea here except the hope is he never takes a snap because EJ is improving. Orton will play when Marrone has given up on EJ or EJ is hurt, that simple.

[sudzy]

Who cares what amount of money they gave him. They have plenty left over EVERY year. Hopefully that changes with new ownership...

You know what else I hope changes with new ownership? Excepting mediocre play at QB.

[EDS]

So you think the Bills gave Orton that huge contract with no possible hope that he can play?

Ridiculous.

From a fans perspective, I think Orton is a very good back-up QB and a solid stopgap starter. I don't view him as the long-term answer and I think it would take a perfect alignment of the stars for the Bills to contend in a meaningful way with Orton at QB. As such, I rather just play Manuel in the perhaps futile hope he "gets it" or confirm he is not the answer so the team does not need to waste time with him next season.

[starrymessenger]

This is one thing that Chargers picked on which has carried over from pre-season where more than one observers have said that he tends to stare down the receivers. I noticed in the wed presser he mentioned that he needs to calm down when the play is not there, which echos what Marrone said on Monday.

Of course it is much easier to say stuff in front of a microphone than when DEs are crashing down to you on the field. But this is the kind of improvement I want to see over the course of the season. There are a lot of things for him to fix; if I were the coaches, I'd take one small step at a time and say let's focus on this one now.

So you're in Pittsburgh Ghz?
Then you should remember that when EJ faced the Steelers last year the Steeler DBS were looking at each other in amazement all saying in perfect unison "but he just stares at the guy his throwing to".
And y'know what? That was what he did at FSU too.
Nothing has nor is it likely ever to change.
Take away his first read and he's done like dinner.

[The Jokeman]

So you're in Pittsburgh Ghz?
Then you should remember that when EJ faced the Steelers last year the Steeler DBS were looking at each other in amazement all saying in perfect unison "but he just stares at the guy his throwing to".
And y'know what? That was what he did at FSU too.
Nothing has nor is it likely ever to change.
Take away his first read and he's done like dinner.

EJ Manuel leaves a complicated legacy behind him at Florida State.

As a transitional player it's hard to argue Manuel wasn't excellent for FSU. He entered the program with plenty of clout and left it better off than he found it.

Remember where Florida State was when EJ Manuel got there. The Bowden era was coming to an unceremonious end, the talent on the team had declined and a once proud program was slowly sinking into the quicksand of college football parity.

Heck, EJ had to practically win out -- allowing for an obvious loss to Tim Tebow's Gators -- after replacing an injured Christian Ponder during his redshirt freshman year just to send Bowden out a winner in his final season. Manuel's Gator Bowl performance (in which he went 17/24 for 189 yards and lead FSU to a 33-21 victory over West Virginia) is still amongst his best moments at FSU.

Three years later Manuel was selected 16th overall in the NFL draft after going 12-2 and winning an Orange Bowl in his senior season. Along the way FSU had moved back up from ACC also-rans (which they were for about seven years) and reclaimed their place atop the conference.

That's not too shabby.


All EJ did in his last year was win 12 games in a season for the third time ever at FSU, win a conference title and earn just the second BCS victory in Florida State history.

Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/florida-state/2013/10/jameis-winston-on-pace-to-rewrite-fsus-record-books.html#storylink=cpy

[feldspar]

I'll give EJ until it's a little too late.

Then again, why replace him when it's a little too late?

I think Orton gives us a better chance to win right now. I'm hoping Manuel starts turning into an entirely different player because I'm a Bills fan and I have no choice. I don't exactly unequivocally dislike him as a player YET, but if this crap doesn't improve, I will. There are some pretty bad fundamental aspects of his game that I'm not sure he can overcome at this point, no matter how hard I cross my fingers.

It's the QB situation that is holding this team back, and I don't think that's really a secret from anybody that knows his ass from a hole in the ground.

[The Jokeman]

I'll give EJ until it's a little too late.

Then again, why replace him when it's a little too late?

I think Orton gives us a better chance to win right now. I'm hoping Manuel starts turning into an entirely different player because I'm a Bills fan and I have no choice. I don't exactly unequivocally dislike him as a player YET, but if this crap doesn't improve, I will. There are some pretty bad fundamental aspects of his game that I'm not sure he can overcome at this point, no matter how hard I cross my fingers.

It's the QB situation that is holding this team back, and I don't think that's really a secret from anybody that knows his ass from a hole in the ground.

Is one year worth sacrificing a potential of a decade of winning if not more? I had this argument back in the Flutie/RJ debates 16 years ago. Personally EJ may be a worse QB than Orton right now but is he bad enough that it's worth to not letting him develop on the field/and or truly demonstrate he really shouldn't be playing. If winning 2 of the first 3 games this season with our sole loss against a team that made the playoffs the season before and was coming off a victory against the defending Super Bowl champs is holding us back then we agree to disagree what that term means. This kid has played 13 games and the team's won 6 of them, Not a bad start to a career at all.

[The Beef]

So you think the Bills gave Orton that huge contract with no possible hope that he can play?

Ridiculous.

Bingo.

Orton should have been put in during the 4th when the defense kept getting stops.

There was one play in the 2nd half where EJ stepped up in the pocket, displayed the worst footwork I have ever seen and had his feet equidistant from each other, body completely squared with facing the LOS and manger to leave his feet and throw a terrible ball to Sammy I believe.

He isnt Trent JR because Trent was scared to throw INT's. EJ looks terrified to take a hit. His scrambling is AWFUL. The 4 yard OB scramble on 3rd and long is the most infuriating play I've ever seen. At least a check down to Fred will result in a DB getting ***** slapped.

The 2nd half of the Chargers game was Losman-esque. Just a minor league performance at QB. You could see old receivers being completely ignored or balls being 5 yards off target the entire time.

[Mace]

you know who had that very advanced trait and was way more advanced than EJ? Van Pelt and Fitz.

If you can't throw , that advanced trait is useless.

If you have that advanced trait but don't have the BASIC trait that a qb needs which is accuracy, then you should be a coach.

I'm still not so convinced Manuel isn't accurate so much as befuddled by the pro game and not confidently committing to his throws. Have mentioned this before and have to again, was a huge mistake not having a bridge vet or QB coach and tossing him into a west coast principle fast decision offense, then hiring a bad QB coach and a vet to sweat him.

Doesn't mean he's not under pressure to start producing, he just doesn't look capable of a 300 yard game atm, but I think he's doing what they tell him and still befuddled if his read isn't immediate and obvious. May as well roll with him though, I have a feeling the D is going to have more problematic games and we aren't as close as we think.

[CoolBreeze]

Giving up on Manuel was never an option this year. As already said in this thread, his play in his first 13 games has not been terrible, IMO not even close. If Manuel is benched this season, I'd be shocked.

As I've said before, if he gets benched the FO should call a press conference. To announce how big of failures they are. Not just for giving up on Manuel too early, but for trading away next years 1st to move up and take Watkins this year. Watkins will be good either way, but it seems obvious the move was based upon the coaches and the FO confidence that Manuel was the guy for years to come.

Either way we're still 2-1 not 0-3, so now is not the time to even talk about giving up on Manuel. Yes, he played bad last week, but that was last week. The Chargers are a very good football team, and had some tricks we weren't ready for. But I believe and hope Manuel comes out strong this week and fixes his mistakes.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

So you're in Pittsburgh Ghz?
Then you should remember that when EJ faced the Steelers last year the Steeler DBS were looking at each other in amazement all saying in perfect unison "but he just stares at the guy his throwing to".
And y'know what? That was what he did at FSU too.
Nothing has nor is it likely ever to change.
Take away his first read and he's done like dinner.

Yes I'm in Pittsburgh. And I was in Heinz field when the Bills played Steelers.

A couple of wise men told me that staring down your receivers in NFL most often happens to entry QBs and is a habit that can be fixed relatively easily. Most college QB do not have many read options, as you see on Saturdays. It is part of a transition. When protection breaks down, this is especially true that your instinct, other than run, is to go for your comfort zone - the first option, where you practice the most.

[RedEyE]

I give EJ the season and if he hasn't shown any sign of upward progression then the Bills need to hit the off season market balls to the wall.