No more football for you, Russ Brandon!

[WagonCircler]

Jason La Canfora is reporting that Kim Pegula will be the Bills' CEO and that Doug Whaley will no longer report to Russ Brandon, instead reporting directly to the Pegulas.

They also mentioned that the new owners aim to separate the football side from the operations side.

This is AWESOME news.

Russ can do his weasely PR stuff. As long as he has zero input into football ops, he can't do any damage.

Also reporting that Pegs' are looking to bring in a football consultant, mentioning Ernie Accorsi, Ron Wolf and Mike Holmgren.

Nothing but good news here.

"Team president/CEO Russ Brandon has forged a strong relationship with Terry Pegula, sources said, through the process of them purchasing the team, and given his deep ties to the Western New York business community and unique knowledge of the franchise having acted as de-facto owner as the late Ralph Wilson began to struggle with his health, he is likely to remain in a role overseeing the business operations of the team. Under the new structure Kim Pegula will serve as the team's CEO, sources said, with Brandon serving as team president but with general manager Doug Whaley expected to be no longer reporting to Brandon but instead directly to the Pegulas, thus drawing more delineation between football operations and the business operation."

More...

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24749471/pegula-family-expected-to-bring-outside-consultants-to-help-with-bills-transition

[X-Era]

Russ moving strictly back to the business side is no shocker. Personally I won't be surprised if Whaley stays.

I think Marrone is very much in jeopardy.

I think Pegula will want to add a significant name as a HC... Shanny, Cowher, or Gruden wouldn't shock me. And unlike before Pegula being an all new owner may be able to convince one of them that it's a whole new ball game in Buffalo.

All conjecture on my part.

[justasportsfan]

If Pegula wants the support of the fans, Shanny is not the way to go.

Marrone is not in jeopardy unless he blows the season. If the bills make playoffs, fans will get on the Marrone wagon.

[coastal]

Russ Brandon can crawl back into the woodwork from whence he came.

Incompetent little rat.

[WagonCircler]

Russ moving strictly back to the business side is no shocker. Personally I won't be surprised if Whaley stays.

I think Marrone is very much in jeopardy.

I think Pegula will want to add a significant name as a HC... Shanny, Cowher, or Gruden wouldn't shock me. And unlike before Pegula being an all new owner may be able to convince one of them that it's a whole new ball game in Buffalo.

All conjecture on my part.

I think Marrone has a better chance to stay than Whaley.

Marrone has a shot at saving his job by making the playoffs with a scrap heap QB, whereas Whaley totally shat the bed with the EJ situation, which will have huge repercussions next year's draft.

[black N yellow]

Thank God.

[DraftBoy]

No shock here and I'm very happy that Brandon is staying on board and focusing on the business end.

[YardRat]

Unless the team ****s the bed, I don't see Marrone or Whaley being in jeopardy of losing their jobs.

Terry, please...stay as far away from Holmgren as a football consultant...and Shanny, Cowher and Gruden as HC's...as possible.

[OpIv37]

Littman's out and Russ is away from football. It's a good start.

But I still want a scorched earth policy. Everyone with blood on their hands for any portion of the last 15 years needs to be ****-canned, which means everyone above Whaley.

I'll give Whaley and Marrone another year, barring a Fitz/Gailey collapse over the rest of this season.

[YardRat]

No shock here and I'm very happy that Brandon is staying on board and focusing on the business end.

I still don't believe he'll be around much longer, and will move on of his own accord.

- - - Updated - - -



Incompetent little Lecter.

Fixed it, and don't ever make the same mistake again.

[justasportsfan]

No shock here and I'm very happy that Brandon is staying on board and focusing on the business end.
While it means nothing really, Russ brought the bills camp to Pittsford which is pretty much Kim's backyard growing up.

[notacon]

Jason La Canfora is reporting that Kim Pegula will be the Bills' CEO and that Doug Whaley will no longer report to Russ Brandon, instead reporting directly to the Pegulas.

They also mentioned that the new owners aim to separate the football side from the operations side.

This is AWESOME news.

Russ can do his weasely PR stuff. As long as he has zero input into football ops, he can't do any damage.

Also reporting that Pegs' are looking to bring in a football consultant, mentioning Ernie Accorsi, Ron Wolf and Mike Holmgren.

Nothing but good news here.

"Team president/CEO Russ Brandon has forged a strong relationship with Terry Pegula, sources said, through the process of them purchasing the team, and given his deep ties to the Western New York business community and unique knowledge of the franchise having acted as de-facto owner as the late Ralph Wilson began to struggle with his health, he is likely to remain in a role overseeing the business operations of the team. Under the new structure Kim Pegula will serve as the team's CEO, sources said, with Brandon serving as team president but with general manager Doug Whaley expected to be no longer reporting to Brandon but instead directly to the Pegulas, thus drawing more delineation between football operations and the business operation."

More...

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/jason-la-canfora/24749471/pegula-family-expected-to-bring-outside-consultants-to-help-with-bills-transition

The structure that Ralph Wilson relied on for the Bills is THE reason they never succeeded on a consistent basis.

This team needs FOOTBALL people to run the FOOTBALL part of the team.....not loyalists to the owner like Mr. Wilson liked.

[El Guapo]

Littman's out and Russ is away from football. It's a good start.

But I still want a scorched earth policy. Everyone with blood on their hands for any portion of the last 15 years needs to be ****-canned, which means everyone above Whaley.

I'll give Whaley and Marrone another year, barring a Fitz/Gailey collapse over the rest of this season.


i completely agree. The verdict is still out on Marrone.

[GreedoII]

Shanny and Cowher are outdated..Gruden might work tho...

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Its a start, hopefully he brings in a competent OC. Also, I am not against canning Whaley.

[Don't Panic]

Brandon was just a placeholder anyway... he was simply the highest ranked guy standing when Ralph's health got to the point where he couldn't make ANy decisions (as opposed to few of them). Brandon knew he'd slide right back into his marketing gig once new owners were on board.

As for HC and GM, I think the next change you will see, at the earliest, is 2016. I see Pegula giving the Dougs at least another season to get things straight. If we don't make the playoffs this year or next? Peace out, boys...

[Mace]

I'd be great with Accorsi or Wolf as consultants. Holmgren would be catastrophic.

Cowher's time is past, but regardless, he and Gruden will not step away from their happy place to go anywhere without a perfect QB situation and just as well.

Shanahan would be catastrophic.

Accorsi or Wolf though...would be really really good.

[Mike]

I think Marrone has a better chance to stay than Whaley.

Marrone has a shot at saving his job by making the playoffs with a scrap heap QB, whereas Whaley totally shat the bed with the EJ situation, which will have huge repercussions next year's draft.

Whaley's EJ pick really cost the Bills 3 first rounders. First in selecting him then 2 more in trying to cover up that selection by drafting Sammy.

[DynaPaul]

Back to shilling hot dogs and jerseys for you Russ!

[BertSquirtgum]

Best news to come out of this so far.

[Historian]

Amen!

[Fletch]

Russ moving strictly back to the business side is no shocker. Personally I won't be surprised if Whaley stays.

I think Marrone is very much in jeopardy.

I think Pegula will want to add a significant name as a HC... Shanny, Cowher, or Gruden wouldn't shock me. And unlike before Pegula being an all new owner may be able to convince one of them that it's a whole new ball game in Buffalo.

All conjecture on my part.

I don't think that Gruden would come here if Whaley was still the GM. I wouldn't if I were him.

[Fletch]

Whaley's EJ pick really cost the Bills 3 first rounders. First in selecting him then 2 more in trying to cover up that selection by drafting Sammy.

Thanks for properly understanding that. So many don't.

A little bit of a wash with the picks though, don't forget we traded down to get another 2nd that we used to grab Alonso with. Alonso was worth Manuel's slot.

Still, you're right, Whaley had no business drafting Manuel in the 1st at all, and he was forced to try to cover his ass by consuming two 1st's and a 4th on Watkins who hasn't even proven that he's the best WR in this draft class much less that special WR that so many insist that he is. There's enough evidence out there to suggest that all he's ever going to be is a Moulds type of WR, good to very good but hardly great like he has to be to make that pick look intelligent.

Here's my biggest issue, watch the video in my signature, Whaley himself implies that if Manuel doesn't work out then he should be looking for a new job because he doesn't know what he's doing. Well?

I see no circumstances under which Doug should be kept, particularly if it's to "prove himself for one more season." He's already destroyed this year's draft, what's he going to do, trade out 2nd, 3rd, and 5th picks for a late 1st rounder to take another flyer on some QB?

I don't want Whaley anywhere near our draft HQ come draft day.

[Fletch]

Littman's out and Russ is away from football. It's a good start.

But I still want a scorched earth policy. Everyone with blood on their hands for any portion of the last 15 years needs to be ****-canned, which means everyone above Whaley.

I'll give Whaley and Marrone another year, barring a Fitz/Gailey collapse over the rest of this season.

While unpopular, I'm going to suggest that such a collapse is coming. I don't see us finishing out the year any better than 4-6 for a 7-9 finish. I'm thinking that or 6-10 again.

Our "elite D" was exposed yesterday and will continue to look not so elite down the road as we start facing teams that don't feature RBs like Damian Williams, George Winn, Donald Brown and 2nd rate receivers. Even yesterday it was 2nd rate receivers like LaFell and Tyms that looked like Moss and Welker. Tyms beat Gilmore for a TD and LaFell burned McKelvin badly for one of his 2 TDs.

Teams that most people here assume automatic wins against like Cleveland and Miami are both playing much better than anyone thought. Cleveland's playing better than we are. We might say that we should take two from the Jets but we haven't done that in years. In fact, our record against the Jets since 2007 is only marginally better than it is against the Pats. Coming into this season we were 1-11 vs. the Pats and 3-9 against the Jets.

Orton is better than EJ and isn't a complete embarrassmet at QB, but it's already clear that he's not anything more than a stop-gap for the season. He's responsible for 17 points off of his own TOs over the last two weeks, 7 of which came off of a pick-6 last week. The team isn't scoring any more points than we were under EJ and while Detroit has a good defense, the Pats do not and we still couldn't muster more than three scores and 22 points against the Pats, in Buffalo with a season-opening type atmosphere.

Remember, Fitzpatrick threw 23, 24, and 24 TDs in 2010, 2011, and 2012 and we were still only 4-12, 6-10, and 6-10. I think that too many people are expecting more from Orton's presence than they should be. I don't see Orton playing much better than Fitzpatrick at this point, maybe slightly, but not significantly.

Spiller has more TOs than TDs. Jackson's also clearly starting to run out of steam in his career. Neither RB should have had the troubles we had yesterday with Orton and our passing game.

Watkins also clearly isn't having the impact that Whaley said he would.

I view the games @ Denver, @ NE, Green Bay, and KC as losses. Despite any records all four of those teams are playing better football than we are. Cleveland and @ Miami are going to be tougher than anyone thought heading into this season. Odds are that we split with the Jets despite how poorly everyone thinks they're playing. We should beat Minnesota and Oakland, but for now those are the only two games left that should be automatic.

We'd better win next week at home vs. Minnesota or it's going to be an epic loss this season.

[Fletch]

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by DraftBoy http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=4005928#post4005928)

No shock here and I'm very happy that Brandon is staying on board and focusing on the business end.



I still don't believe he'll be around much longer, and will move on of his own accord.

Where's he going to go? Walmart?

He's grown up in the region and went to college at Fisher if I'm not mistaken. Which team would hire him? Would you? I think that his value in this case is directly tied to his familiarity and ties to the region. That's not going to help him anywhere else.

I suppose he can go back to baseball.

[DraftBoy]

Where's he going to go? Walmart?

He's grown up in the region and went to college at Fisher if I'm not mistaken. Which team would hire him? Would you? I think that his value in this case is directly tied to his familiarity and ties to the region. That's not going to help him anywhere else.

I suppose he can go back to baseball.

If I had a football team and business ops opening? In an absolute minute.

[JohnnyGold]

While unpopular, I'm going to suggest that such a collapse is coming. I don't see us finishing out the year any better than 4-6 for a 7-9 finish. I'm thinking that or 6-10 again.

Our "elite D" was exposed yesterday and will continue to look not so elite down the road as we start facing teams that don't feature RBs like Damian Williams, George Winn, Donald Brown and 2nd rate receivers. Even yesterday it was 2nd rate receivers like LaFell and Tyms that looked like Moss and Welker. Tyms beat Gilmore for a TD and LaFell burned McKelvin badly for one of his 2 TDs.

Teams that most people here assume automatic wins against like Cleveland and Miami are both playing much better than anyone thought. Cleveland's playing better than we are. We might say that we should take two from the Jets but we haven't done that in years. In fact, our record against the Jets since 2007 is only marginally better than it is against the Pats. Coming into this season we were 1-11 vs. the Pats and 3-9 against the Jets.

Orton is better than EJ and isn't a complete embarrassmet at QB, but it's already clear that he's not anything more than a stop-gap for the season. He's responsible for 17 points off of his own TOs over the last two weeks, 7 of which came off of a pick-6 last week. The team isn't scoring any more points than we were under EJ and while Detroit has a good defense, the Pats do not and we still couldn't muster more than three scores and 22 points against the Pats, in Buffalo with a season-opening type atmosphere.

Remember, Fitzpatrick threw 23, 24, and 24 TDs in 2010, 2011, and 2012 and we were still only 4-12, 6-10, and 6-10. I think that too many people are expecting more from Orton's presence than they should be. I don't see Orton playing much better than Fitzpatrick at this point, maybe slightly, but not significantly.

Spiller has more TOs than TDs. Jackson's also clearly starting to run out of steam in his career. Neither RB should have had the troubles we had yesterday with Orton and our passing game.

Watkins also clearly isn't having the impact that Whaley said he would.

I view the games @ Denver, @ NE, Green Bay, and KC as losses. Despite any records all four of those teams are playing better football than we are. Cleveland and @ Miami are going to be tougher than anyone thought heading into this season. Odds are that we split with the Jets despite how poorly everyone thinks they're playing. We should beat Minnesota and Oakland, but for now those are the only two games left that should be automatic.

We'd better win next week at home vs. Minnesota or it's going to be an epic loss this season.

This is the best post I've read on here in awhile.

And I think we're going 10-6. But it'll be a battle to get there, for sure.

[Fletch]

And I think we're going 10-6. But it'll be a battle to get there, for sure.

All I know is that if the playoffs started today then we wouldn't be in them.

[Topas]

Like it.
No to Holmgren and Shanny. I am torn about Cowher and Gruden.
And I agree with Wagon. Marrone is less on the hot seat than Whaley.
Usually he has them play hard and keeps them in games. But if it continues as last Sunday ... good riddance

[trapezeus]

russ shouldn't be with the bills period. you guys sell yourselves short if you think russ has helped make the bills a popular ticket. i would argue that he's made the bills less popular by not getting a winner out on the field. regionally, we support hte billls. outside of football, no one even thinks about the bills. they rarely even pick bills players in fantasy pools. if you want to get a bigger fan base, you win games. the bills could be a much bigger deal if they were a football team that people wanted to root for.

that *****eating grin he has in all the publicity pics with the pegulas says it all. he'll kiss anyone's ass to keep his protected status. he is the curse. get rid of russ, and you revive the bills instanteously.

[GreedoII]

russ shouldn't be with the bills period. you guys sell yourselves short if you think russ has helped make the bills a popular ticket. i would argue that he's made the bills less popular by not getting a winner out on the field. regionally, we support hte billls. outside of football, no one even thinks about the bills. they rarely even pick bills players in fantasy pools. if you want to get a bigger fan base, you win games. the bills could be a much bigger deal if they were a football team that people wanted to root for.

that *****eating grin he has in all the publicity pics with the pegulas says it all. he'll kiss anyone's ass to keep his protected status. he is the curse. get rid of russ, and you revive the bills instanteously.

Leaving Fredonia and the Toronto series thing is something that always irked me about this Turd....

[Night Train]

I still don't believe Brandon will be around much longer, and will move on of his own accord.


Reportedly being courted by Mark Davis to be President of the Raiders...with a move to LA coming.


Frank Reich...hmmm..he does know the Marchibroda playbook and has put a lot of it into the current Chargers O.

No to Holmgren. Acorsi & Wolf make complete sense.

[Novacane]

Thanks for properly understanding that. So many don't.

A little bit of a wash with the picks though, don't forget we traded down to get another 2nd that we used to grab Alonso with. Alonso was worth Manuel's slot.

Still, you're right, Whaley had no business drafting Manuel in the 1st at all, and he was forced to try to cover his ass by consuming two 1st's and a 4th on Watkins who hasn't even proven that he's the best WR in this draft class much less that special WR that so many insist that he is. There's enough evidence out there to suggest that all he's ever going to be is a Moulds type of WR, good to very good but hardly great like he has to be to make that pick look intelligent.

Here's my biggest issue, watch the video in my signature, Whaley himself implies that if Manuel doesn't work out then he should be looking for a new job because he doesn't know what he's doing. Well?

I see no circumstances under which Doug should be kept, particularly if it's to "prove himself for one more season." He's already destroyed this year's draft, what's he going to do, trade out 2nd, 3rd, and 5th picks for a late 1st rounder to take another flyer on some QB?

I don't want Whaley anywhere near our draft HQ come draft day.


What evidence? You very well may turn out to be right but there's no evidence to suggest any such thing!

[HHURRICANE]

Don't completely understand the Whaley hate here. Uhhh the talent pool has marketedly improved since he got here. Anybody notice the 7th rounder starting at Tackle? Or the 5th rounder at guard?

Marrone has also done a very good job on challenges, clock management, etc. We need an OC and hopefully that comes in the off season.

[better days]

If everyone working now for the Bills above secretary is fired I would be fine with it.

But I would also be fine with Brandon & Whaley remaining & Marrone as well as long as he gets rid of Hackett.

[coastal]

If everyone working now for the Bills above secretary is fired I would be fine with it.

But I would also be fine with Brandon & Whaley remaining & Marrone as well as long as he gets rid of Hackett.
Translation: you're a hot mess with a habit of butt-talkin'!

[Buffalogic]

Don't completely understand the Whaley hate here. Uhhh the talent pool has marketedly improved since he got here. Anybody notice the 7th rounder starting at Tackle? Or the 5th rounder at guard?

Marrone has also done a very good job on challenges, clock management, etc. We need an OC and hopefully that comes in the off season.People that hate Whaley are flat out ******ed.

I mean the only criticism is that he could have waited until the second round to pick a qb. He reached on EJ, yes, but if he took a second round QB, then we have no Kiko or no Robert Woods. Two players that were definitely good selections. And Whaley gets no credit for passing on bust Tavon Austin and picking up an extra 2nd rounder that turned into Kiko?

There is no guarantee EJ or any other prospect they hoped to groom would be available to them in the third or fourth round. Kolb was supposed to be our starter while we groomed EJ. We needed to draft a prospect QB because Kolb wasn't the answer and he was very injury prone. That plan shattered when Kolb did and now the hindsight is 20/20.

Aside from QB the talent on the team is better than it has been in a very long time. And complaining about Watkins is stupid because we haven't had a receiver this talented since Moulds or Reed. That doesn't come for free. I want the GM to be aggressive when it comes to upgrading the talent on this team. We have had enough middling level players for over a decade now and that hasn't cut it.

[BertSquirtgum]

I would love to know who Whaley wanted to hire as head coach.

[WagonCircler]

And complaining about Watkins is stupid because we haven't had a receiver this talented since Moulds or Reed. That doesn't come for free. I want the GM to be aggressive when it comes to upgrading the talent on this team. We have had enough middling level players for over a decade now and that hasn't cut it.

Yesterday's game is the PERFECT illustration of how wrongheaded Whaley was to make the deal for Sammy.

Is Sammy a good WR with huge upside? No doubt.

But the fact is, he was largely erased by one DB.

No WR, not Jerry Rice, not Andre Reed, not Larry Fitzgerald, is worth TWO number one picks and a number 4 pick.

And when you make that move, putting all your chips on a QB who turns out to be a total flop, you have to go.

He made a sucker's bet. He busted.

[Buffalogic]

Julio cost more and was worth it.

Sammy is worth it, I don't care who the QB is. Drafting an elite player doesn't mean he's putting all his chips in EJ's basket because EJ is gone and Sammy is still here. Sammy isn't eternally linked to EJ.

Watkins was open a lot vs Revis it just looked like Orton was shying away from throwing it over there. Erased is oversimplifying.

[WagonCircler]

Julio cost more and was worth it.

Sammy is worth it, I don't care who the QB is. Drafting an elite player doesn't mean he's putting all his chips in EJ's basket because EJ is gone and Sammy is still here. Sammy isn't eternally linked to EJ.

Watkins was open a lot vs Revis it just looked like Orton was shying away from throwing it over there. Erased is oversimplifying.

Sammy had what, two catches yesterday? Chandler had huge catches for first downs all day. What did we spend to get him?

Sorry, but QB is far and away the most important position on any team in any sport, and the Bills wasted next year's first rounder, which needed to be spent on a QB, on a player who is not playing better than other WRs who cost only one first rounder.

It was a sucker's move by Whaley.

[Buffalogic]

There's no first round QB to take man. If we finish 8-8 or 7-9 or if we make the playoffs at 11-5, there is no QB to take in the first round that is not another EJ. Overdrafted.

We will draft a second round QB in 2015 and that could have been the plan even if we still had a first round pick. Point being there is no guarantee we would pick a first round QB if we didn't take Watkins. Also, look at the last first round QB we drafted. He was awful. Watkins talent is guaranteed. The NFL talent of a mid first round QB in 2015 is not.

Whatever QB we do get will be improved by having an elite talent to throw to, so EJ and Watkins aren't linked. You act like selecting Watkins threw away a sure fire starting NFL qb for us in the 2015 draft and that is just not the case.

[WagonCircler]

There's no first round QB to take man. If we finish 8-8 or 7-9 or if we make the playoffs at 11-5, there is no QB to take in the first round that is not another EJ. Overdrafted.

We will draft a second round QB in 2015 and that could have been the plan even if we still had a first round pick. Point being there is no guarantee we would pick a first round QB if we didn't take Watkins. Also, look at the last first round QB we drafted. He was awful. Watkins talent is guaranteed. The NFL talent of a mid first round QB in 2015 is not.

Whatever QB we do get will be improved by having an elite talent to throw to, so EJ and Watkins aren't linked. You act like selecting Watkins threw away a sure fire starting NFL qb for us in the 2015 draft and that is just not the case.

First of all, you don't know that there's not a first round QB in this draft.

Second, this team has weaknesses on the OL and in the secondary that could have been addressed. We pissed away a 1st and a 4th, at a time when we should be building and shoring up weaknesses.

Watkins talent is guaranteed and is well worth a first round draft choice. But it's not worth two of them and a fourth, especially when you are betting your chips on a flop of a QB who will be a career clipboard holder.

Both are a reflection on Whaley. He took ownership of the EJ pick this year.

[Mace]

Julio cost more and was worth it.

They needed those picks to beef themselves up. Julio was the crowning jewel for an SB.

Last time someone argued with me about him, well he was hurt while Atlanta rode the bus last year ! He's not hurt this year, Atlanta is 2-4, -6 net points, he's doing great and they have their QB.

Bad trades for crowning jewels that aren't.

[Buffalogic]

It's not Julio's fault the entire oline died and they didn't replenish any defensive starters. The year he came on to the scene they were one play away from the superbowl. No position outside qb will save the team but the goal is to get the players who are better than the players on the other teams.

[YardRat]

lol...Some of you should spend a little time in the archives...the number of people slobbering over the knobs of Barkley, Nassib and Geno at #8 is hilarious.

[trapezeus]

People that hate Whaley are flat out ******ed.

I mean the only criticism is that he could have waited until the second round to pick a qb. He reached on EJ, yes, but if he took a second round QB, then we have no Kiko or no Robert Woods. Two players that were definitely good selections. And Whaley gets no credit for passing on bust Tavon Austin and picking up an extra 2nd rounder that turned into Kiko?

There is no guarantee EJ or any other prospect they hoped to groom would be available to them in the third or fourth round. Kolb was supposed to be our starter while we groomed EJ. We needed to draft a prospect QB because Kolb wasn't the answer and he was very injury prone. That plan shattered when Kolb did and now the hindsight is 20/20.

Aside from QB the talent on the team is better than it has been in a very long time. And complaining about Watkins is stupid because we haven't had a receiver this talented since Moulds or Reed. That doesn't come for free. I want the GM to be aggressive when it comes to upgrading the talent on this team. We have had enough middling level players for over a decade now and that hasn't cut it.

wouldn't you want your GM to be acknowledge the same thing that every draft guide said, "this is a weak class". Would having another strong LB in round 1 or another strong Lineman on the OL made it easier for a journeyman like orton to operate one year while a different qb developed on the bench? Was last year so dramatically different running with thad lewis than it was with EJ?

Whaley drafted a position because he simply wanted that filled. they could have gotten stronger on the line to make the transition for a new qb much easier. but he passed on that and gambled to fill the qb position. the watkins trade was bad. watkins is very talented and very exciting, but the give was too much. especially considering the bust rate at that position. nonetheless, the expense was justified to make ej better, and it didnt. so now we look at next year with orton, manuel and a need for another qb.

frankly i'd rather have a terrible gm with an eye for QB because that can mask a lot than having a fm that kind find everything but.

[better days]

First of all, you don't know that there's not a first round QB in this draft.

Second, this team has weaknesses on the OL and in the secondary that could have been addressed. We pissed away a 1st and a 4th, at a time when we should be building and shoring up weaknesses.

Watkins talent is guaranteed and is well worth a first round draft choice. But it's not worth two of them and a fourth, especially when you are betting your chips on a flop of a QB who will be a career clipboard holder.

Both are a reflection on Whaley. He took ownership of the EJ pick this year.

Whaley no doubt overpaid for Watkins.

But he is on the team & is a weapon.

I blame the Coaching staff for not making better use of him just as they don't use CJ Spiller properly or Mike Williams.

I am really frustrated with Marrone & especially Hackett.

[Fletch]

Whaley no doubt overpaid for Watkins.

But he is on the team & is a weapon.

I blame the Coaching staff for not making better use of him just as they don't use CJ Spiller properly or Mike Williams.

I am really frustrated with Marrone & especially Hackett.

You know it's funny, whenever promises that are made about players not performing, like Spiller, Watkins, Preston Brown, Spikes, etc., it's never that maybe the players were overrated, it's always that our coaches aren't using them effectively.

Here's a clue, Spiller's a role playing RB, not a starter and is a below average rusher. Watkins isn't as good as everyone thought or thinks he may be and his skills are not translating to the NFL, quite predictably too, as many thought they would. It's not the coaches. If Watkins were really all that with the ball in his hands then he's had more than his share of opportunities to prove that.

Yeah yeah, he needs "in space" meaning that he needs to catch the ball with no one within 10 yards in any direction, yeah yeah we get that, but any player will put up huge numbers like that, but unfortunately that's just not something that happens except by accident and defensive mistake in the NFL. So if Watkins, like Spiller, is waiting for all this "space" to operate in, good luck with that.

You'd think that as Bills fans most of us would have learned that by now after watching three and a half seasons of Spiller's futility.

[better days]

You know it's funny, whenever promises that are made about players not performing, like Spiller, Watkins, Preston Brown, Spikes, etc., it's never that maybe the players were overrated, it's always that our coaches aren't using them effectively.

Here's a clue, Spiller's a role playing RB, not a starter and is a below average rusher. Watkins isn't as good as everyone thought or thinks he may be and his skills are not translating to the NFL, quite predictably too, as many thought they would. It's not the coaches. If Watkins were really all that with the ball in his hands then he's had more than his share of opportunities to prove that.

Yeah yeah, he needs "in space" meaning that he needs to catch the ball with no one within 10 yards in any direction, yeah yeah we get that, but any player will put up huge numbers like that, but unfortunately that's just not something that happens except by accident and defensive mistake in the NFL. So if Watkins, like Spiller, is waiting for all this "space" to operate in, good luck with that.

You'd think that as Bills fans most of us would have learned that by now after watching three and a half seasons of Spiller's futility.

Spiller was very effective when Chan Gailey used him properly.

He is not a power back which is how Hackett is using him.

And Watkins caught 2 out of the 3 balls thrown to him Sunday.

If he were targeted more, he no doubt would have had more catches & probably had a penalty or two in his favor as well.

It is the Coaching, not the players IMO.

[YardRat]

wouldn't you want your GM to be acknowledge the same thing that every draft guide said, "this is a weak class". Would having another strong LB in round 1 or another strong Lineman on the OL made it easier for a journeyman like orton to operate one year while a different qb developed on the bench? Was last year so dramatically different running with thad lewis than it was with EJ?

Whaley drafted a position because he simply wanted that filled. they could have gotten stronger on the line to make the transition for a new qb much easier. but he passed on that and gambled to fill the qb position. the watkins trade was bad. watkins is very talented and very exciting, but the give was too much. especially considering the bust rate at that position. nonetheless, the expense was justified to make ej better, and it didnt. so now we look at next year with orton, manuel and a need for another qb.

frankly i'd rather have a terrible gm with an eye for QB because that can mask a lot than having a fm that kind find everything but.

He gave the majority of the fan base what they were clamoring for...a first-round QB. If Whaley hadn't drafted a QB last year, he wasn't going to take one this year (IMO), and he would have been skewered for not addressing the QB position.

Since Whaley has been GM, the team has brought in how many QB's in the last season and a half? Eight? Nine? He's used all avenues possible, also...draft, free agency, trade, UDFA...rookies, back-up vets, vets with experience starting. It certainly isn't a matter of not understanding the need for upgrades and lack of effort trying to achieve it.

[WagonCircler]

Since Whaley has been GM, the team has brought in how many QB's in the last season and a half? Eight? Nine? He's used all avenues possible, also...draft, free agency, trade, UDFA...rookies, back-up vets, vets with experience starting. It certainly isn't a matter of not understanding the need for upgrades and lack of effort trying to achieve it.

Everyone with eyes understands that there's a need for upgrades. The difference is that we're not being paid to find solutions. Whaley has not only failed with his solutions, he has excersized terminably poor judgement in the draft, emptying next years arsenal based on the assumption that EJ was the answer, drafting bombs like Cyrus Kouhanjo, and doling out a $39 MIL contract with $5 MIL in guaranteed money to Mike Williams.

He hasn't been a total disaster, but for every good move, me makes multiple terrible moves. His attaboy to aw***** ratio is WAY out of whack.

We dot need excuses. We need someone better.

[trapezeus]

He gave the majority of the fan base what they were clamoring for...a first-round QB. If Whaley hadn't drafted a QB last year, he wasn't going to take one this year (IMO), and he would have been skewered for not addressing the QB position.

Since Whaley has been GM, the team has brought in how many QB's in the last season and a half? Eight? Nine? He's used all avenues possible, also...draft, free agency, trade, UDFA...rookies, back-up vets, vets with experience starting. It certainly isn't a matter of not understanding the need for upgrades and lack of effort trying to achieve it.

if you have a long term vision on building a team, and management supports that, no level of fan discontent will disrupt that. if the bills oline became quite good and our running game was solid while we struggled with a weak qb and our d was getting better, most fans would say, "they've built a team and they need a qb." whaley would get credit for long term vision.

as far as i can tell, whaley builds a team the way some of my friends build their fantasy teams. they forget about the draft date, then scramble to make sense of it, pick a couple positions because they think that's what they should take and then pray it all works out.

if they didn't do the watkins trades, i would have more patience with him. to get more players into the fold on a team that's trying to improve, i understand. But they drafted a bunch of OL this year, none seem to have much promise locking down positions, we got two RB's in, but still use the same old two RB, we've rotated our WR corp out to have an OC who doesn't like to utilize them.

it makes no sense. it's movements for movement sake. and the fact it has zero vision of building a team over the last two years and leaving us shorthanded next year with a team whose ceiling is the playoffs...it's a disaster.

and even if he acheives his goal of playoffs this year, they still don't have a qb of the future to have a ceiling that can be any higher.

[Buffalogic]

Kiko based on talent would have been a top10 pick if they redrafted. Yes they blew it on Manuel, but we had the same amount of picks and hit on both our second rounders. I mean it could have been a lot worse if they didn't recognize the talent of Kiko and Woods. That should be commended.

The strength of the class doesn't mean anything if they are enamored with one prospect. They were hoping EJ could be groomed and take over but that plan failed and then EJ failed. I don't fault them for trying to get a QB prospect, they just chose the wrong one.

[YardRat]

Everyone with eyes understands that there's a need for upgrades. The difference is that we're not being paid to find solutions. Whaley has not only failed with his solutions, he has excersized terminably poor judgement in the draft, emptying next years arsenal based on the assumption that EJ was the answer, drafting bombs like Cyrus Kouhanjo, and doling out a $39 MIL contract with $5 MIL in guaranteed money to Mike Williams.

He hasn't been a total disaster, but for every good move, me makes multiple terrible moves. His attaboy to aw***** ratio is WAY out of whack.

We dot need excuses. We need someone better.

IMO it's the other way around, his hits outweigh his misses. Too many focus on the 'bling' (QB and WR) and ignore the rest of the team.

To dismiss either KuJo or MW after only 6 games is shortsighted.

[YardRat]

if you have a long term vision on building a team, and management supports that, no level of fan discontent will disrupt that. if the bills oline became quite good and our running game was solid while we struggled with a weak qb and our d was getting better, most fans would say, "they've built a team and they need a qb." whaley would get credit for long term vision.

If the comments around here are indicative at all of the entire fan base, I'll respectfully have to disagree. Everything else being the same, save plugging another player in for EJ, and there would still be a large faction clamoring for Whaley's head because he hadn't properly addressed the QB position. Hell go back through some of the pre-EJ threads, Nix, et al, were getting roasted because they hadn't spent a high draft pick on a QB in years, and 'gawddammit I want one now!'. Go back through some threads from just early this season, and you'll see a ton of comments similar to exactly what you posted..."they've built a team and they need a qb."

In less than two short seasons, Whaley is on the way to building a team. They still have holes, and the job isn't complete, but there definitely has been forward progress and it's obvious the fan base is not going to have the patience that you claim. Jesus...we're six games in, we're 3-3, they've beaten two good teams on the road (something they struggled with mightily last season, and two games that most, not just the whiners, had chalked up as sure losses) and have a long season left to prove something.

[WagonCircler]

IMO it's the other way around, his hits outweigh his misses. Too many focus on the 'bling' (QB and WR) and ignore the rest of the team.

To dismiss either KuJo or MW after only 6 games is shortsighted.

The focus is on "bling" as you call it, because those are the costliest/highest picks. He has made glaring, expensive errors (not just money-wise, but value-wise) with the highest picks.

Mike Williams is actively asking to be traded. Cyrus' own coach called him a statue with no arms. These are serious blunders.

[YardRat]

The focus is on "bling" as you call it, because those are the costliest/highest picks. He has made glaring, expensive errors (not just money-wise, but value-wise) with the highest picks.

Mike Williams is actively asking to be traded. Cyrus' own coach called him a statue with no arms. These are serious blunders.

I'd prefer to wait a full season, even two on a rookie, before passing too much judgement. But that's just me.

[trapezeus]

was thinking about anotherreason brandon shouldn't be involved at all with this team. under his model of helping the team make money, they knowingly put out crappy teams with very low probability of being ok. the proof is that they try to front load the home games because they know they won't be any good in the back end to ensure sellouts.

is that a great marketer? a good football team sells out tickets no matter when it is. Thanks to this, we have a hard schedule predominantly on the road. 3 of 4 games to finish out december.

thanks for absolutely nothing, russ.

I will now await his defenders to say, "but he wasn't the guy making the decision at the time, please show me proof"

[Fletch]

is that a great marketer? a good football team sells out tickets no matter when it is.

He's only indirectly responsible for putting a bad product on the field. Besides, what happened to all this talk about an elite D, best RBs in the league, top OL, best WRs in the league, best DL, etc.?

Brandon hired Whaley and Whaley hired the rest of the crap staff. They all need to go. Pegula's clearly not new to watching this team so there should be absolutely no "need to assess things first" BS. It's fully known by everyone, or most anyway, what the problems are. Get the scalpel and cut it out.