Count on a loss against the Jets, and a 7-9 season.

[HHURRICANE]

Take the coaches, talent etc. out of this for a moment and just focus on our remaining schedule.

Oct 26 BUF @ NYJ LOSS
Bye
Nov 09 KC @ BUF LOSS
Nov 13 BUF @ MIA LOSS
Nov 23 NYJ @ BUF WIN
Nov 30 CLE @ BUF WIN
Dec 07 BUF @ DEN LOSS
Dec 14 GB @ BUF LOSS
Dec 21 BUF @ OAK WIN
Dec 28 BUF @ NE LOSS

The Jets have enough pride not to go 1-7. I'm sure they view this as a winnable game and certainly have ample time to prepare.

Being realistic I don't see a best case scenario better than 9-7, which would be a big accomplishement at this point.

[casdhf]

No way do we go into Denver and win, but other than that we could win, or lose, every game on the schedule.

[bdutton]

http://www.xtinedanielle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/keep-calm-and-stay-positive-106.png

[Fletch]

No way do we go into Denver and win, but other than that we could win, or lose, every game on the schedule.

He's got Denver as a loss.

I see us losing to Cleveland.

[HHURRICANE]

http://www.xtinedanielle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/keep-calm-and-stay-positive-106.png

I'm calm...just realistic.

We needed to dominate the Vikings yesterday. When your head coach is acknowleding your short comings it's not a good sign for the rest of us.

This team should be 9-7 or 10-6. If Orton had started (no blame anywhere) and we had a decent OC (not even great, just decent) I think 9-7 or 10-6 is very reasonable for this team.

[Historian]

I think we lose to the Raiders and beat the Pack.

Hell, nobody gave us a snowballs chance against Baltimore last year.

[justasportsfan]

I still think we sweep the fins.

[BuffaloRedleg]

I don't see how you can be so confident. It's not like Jets fans are sitting on the other side saying the same thing about us. I bet they are chalking us up as a loss because they are even more pissed and depressed about their team. I bet we'll be vegas favorites as well.

They are both pretty weak teams dude, it could go either way.

Here you go, baby.

17154

[ublinkwescore]

if we can beat the jets, we should sniff playoffs. I think we will sweep the fins, and if we beat the jets sunday, them too. 4-2 in our division will be big for us, we also have the raiders, and cleveland. I don't think the Browns will beat us again.

[ublinkwescore]

I have a feeling we will sweep the NFC north this year.

I also think Bryce Brown is going to make CJ a former bill by season's end.

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm calm...just realistic.

We needed to dominate the Vikings yesterday. When your head coach is acknowleding your short comings it's not a good sign for the rest of us.

This team should be 9-7 or 10-6. If Orton had started (no blame anywhere) and we had a decent OC (not even great, just decent) I think 9-7 or 10-6 is very reasonable for this team.


I don't think it is quite that easy.

The Seahawks should have dominated the Rams yesterday. The Patriots should have dominated Miami earlier this year. The Browns should have stomped Jacksonville yesterday.

The league is pretty damn close. Really, the only sure thing game I see on the rest of the schedule is Denver. (and the Raiders are probably close to one as well)

Other than that? All games can reasonably go either way

[The King]

I can't look ahead with this team. I give us a 40% chance against the Jets.

[THATHURMANATOR]

He's got Denver as a loss.

I see us losing to Cleveland.

The team that just lost to Jacksonville right?

[trapezeus]

I still think we sweep the fins.

thursday night road teams typically fair poorly.

[MikeInRoch]

I don't think it is quite that easy.

The Seahawks should have dominated the Rams yesterday. The Patriots should have dominated Miami earlier this year. The Browns should have stomped Jacksonville yesterday.

The league is pretty damn close. Really, the only sure thing game I see on the rest of the schedule is Denver. (and the Raiders are probably close to one as well)

Other than that? All games can reasonably go either way

I don't think there's any way we beat the Pats at home either. I'll agree about all the other games.

[SpikedLemonade]

I don't see how you can be so confident. It's not like Jets fans are sitting on the other side saying the same thing about us. I bet they are chalking us up as a loss because they are even more pissed and depressed about their team. I bet we'll be vegas favorites as well.


The Jets are a 2 to 3 point favourite right now.

It is a coin flip.

- - - Updated - - -


I don't see how you can be so confident. It's not like Jets fans are sitting on the other side saying the same thing about us. I bet they are chalking us up as a loss because they are even more pissed and depressed about their team. I bet we'll be vegas favorites as well.


The Jets are a 2 to 3 point favourite right now.

It is a coin flip.

[better days]

The Jets are a 2 to 3 point favourite right now.

It is a coin flip.

- - - Updated - - -



The Jets are a 2 to 3 point favourite right now.

It is a coin flip.

Home teams are given 3 points off the bat.

If a home team is not favored by at least 3 points, they are the underdog.

[imbondz]

I don't know how Vegas or betting works, but are they basically saying the 1-7 Jets are better than us?

[Dr. Lecter]

No. They are saying the two teams are even on a neutral field

[Mr. Pink]

There's three games on the schedule they don't have a snowballs chance in hell at winning. Green Bay, New England and Denver.

The rest of them are all winnable games.

[better days]

I don't know how Vegas or betting works, but are they basically saying the 1-7 Jets are better than us?

Vegas is saying that betters think the Jets at home are better than the Bills by 3 points.

[imbondz]

So outside of us Bills fan, the country views us no better than a 1-7 team. Worse than actually. lol.

[JohnnyGold]

I don't think it is quite that easy.

The Seahawks should have dominated the Rams yesterday. The Patriots should have dominated Miami earlier this year. The Browns should have stomped Jacksonville yesterday.

The league is pretty damn close. Really, the only sure thing game I see on the rest of the schedule is Denver. (and the Raiders are probably close to one as well)

Other than that? All games can reasonably go either way

Exactly.
All the hand-wringing. The prognosticating. The whining, the grumbling.
And yet: we're almost halfway through the season, a game back from a first round bye.

Face it: teams lose games. And when they lose, they won't look good. Teams win games, and not every win is going to look amazing. The Giants won the Super Bowl at 9-7.

The time to b!tch is over--that season runs from the day we lose our 8th game to eliminate us from the playoffs, til opening week 2015. But right now? Just enjoy the ride man... just enjoy the ride.

[BuffaloRedleg]

The Jets play decent against the Pats, which they always seem to do, and all of a sudden everyone is blowing their load over them.

I'm taking Buffalo this week especially +3 are you kidding me. They aren't great but they are certainly a better team. The only place the Jets are better basically is coaching.

[better days]

So outside of us Bills fan, the country views us no better than a 1-7 team. Worse than actually. lol.

Well, the Jets have a lot of fans, the Jets losses were to good teams & the Jets have had extra time off before this game having played on Thursday last week.

[Dr. Lecter]

There's three games on the schedule they don't have a snowballs chance in hell at winning. Green Bay, New England and Denver.

The rest of them are all winnable games.


How is Green Bay not winnable?

[JohnnyGold]

I don't know how Vegas or betting works, but are they basically saying the 1-7 Jets are better than us?

First and foremost, remember: Vegas is not in the business of making predictions, they are in the business of making money.

Here's how it works: Picture the scales that lady justice holds, weighed down on either side. Vegas wants those scales to be as equal as possible--the "line" is the needle in the middle that balances the money between the JETS plate, and the BILLS plate. The higher the line in favor of one team, the more people are going to bet for the other team.

As those bets come in for one team vs the other, the line moves. So if there's a dollar on the Jets to win, and a dollar on the Bills to win, and the Bills win, then someone who bet on the Bills might make 1.75 cents (the payout depends on the moneyline, an entirely different conversation). But the 25 cents that doesn't go to the winning bettor is kept by Vegas.

So, as you can see, Vegas is PRIMARILY interested in having money go equally to both sides. The betting public determines the line. The opening lines are what Vegas is predicting, but that could move as early as tonight. And it will, probably closer to even by the time the week is over.

GO BILLS!

[better days]

First and foremost, remember: Vegas is not in the business of making predictions, they are in the business of making money.

Here's how it works: Picture the scales that lady justice holds, weighed down on either side. Vegas wants those scales to be as equal as possible--the "line" is the needle in the middle that balances the money between the JETS plate, and the BILLS plate. The higher the line in favor of one team, the more people are going to bet for the other team.

As those bets come in for one team vs the other, the line moves. So if there's a dollar on the Jets to win, and a dollar on the Bills to win, and the Bills win, then someone who bet on the Bills might make 1.75 cents (the payout depends on the moneyline, an entirely different conversation). But the 25 cents that doesn't go to the winning bettor is kept by Vegas.

So, as you can see, Vegas is PRIMARILY interested in having money go equally to both sides. The betting public determines the line. The opening lines are what Vegas is predicting, but that could move as early as tonight. And it will, probably closer to even by the time the week is over.

GO BILLS!

Great explanation on the betting line from Vegas.

[Mr. Pink]

How is Green Bay not winnable?

Aaron Rodgers vs Buffalo Bills pass defense.

Have you seen what he's been doing this year? He'll have 200 yards and 3 TDs at half.

The end.

[Mr. Pink]

First and foremost, remember: Vegas is not in the business of making predictions, they are in the business of making money.

Here's how it works: Picture the scales that lady justice holds, weighed down on either side. Vegas wants those scales to be as equal as possible--the "line" is the needle in the middle that balances the money between the JETS plate, and the BILLS plate. The higher the line in favor of one team, the more people are going to bet for the other team.

As those bets come in for one team vs the other, the line moves. So if there's a dollar on the Jets to win, and a dollar on the Bills to win, and the Bills win, then someone who bet on the Bills might make 1.75 cents (the payout depends on the moneyline, an entirely different conversation). But the 25 cents that doesn't go to the winning bettor is kept by Vegas.

So, as you can see, Vegas is PRIMARILY interested in having money go equally to both sides. The betting public determines the line. The opening lines are what Vegas is predicting, but that could move as early as tonight. And it will, probably closer to even by the time the week is over.

GO BILLS!

I can see the line on this game being even by game time.

[Dr. Lecter]

Aaron Rodgers vs Buffalo Bills pass defense.

Have you seen what he's been doing this year? He'll have 200 yards and 3 TDs at half.

The end.


Green Bay is 5-2 and lost to Detroit.
they are not unbeatable.


They also are 20th in the NFL in passing offense.

The Bills are 19th.

Maybe they are not as dominant as you think they are
The end

[YardRat]

The Jets play decent against the Pats, which they always seem to do, and all of a sudden everyone is blowing their load over them.

I'm taking Buffalo this week especially +3 are you kidding me. They aren't great but they are certainly a better team. The only place the Jets are better basically is coaching.

They also play decent against us. I'm not liking going into their house when they've lost 6 in a row, the current W-L records be damned.

[Mr. Pink]

Green Bay is 5-2 and lost to Detroit.
they are not unbeatable.


They also are 20th in the NFL in passing offense.

The Bills are 19th.

Maybe they are not as dominant as you think they are
The end

2 of the past 3 games Green Bay has basically been done passing the football at halftime.

Rodgers has 1700 yards 18 TDs and 1 INT on the year.

He will shred this secondary.

Detroit is also 5-2 in case you were unaware.

[BuffaloRedleg]

They also play decent against us. I'm not liking going into their house when they've lost 6 in a row, the current W-L records be damned.

Oh no doubt. Like I said, they are better than us at coaching which tends to equalize things. They are a really bad team though, so I mean whatever we'll see.

I just get annoyed with all of this pseudo-wisdom about "we can't play like x and expect to y against z". It's just plain false.

Fans are completely irrational, even the negative "truth telling" ones. I guarantee Jets fans think they are going to lose this week, for example. I was listening to Bill Burr's podcast after the Pats game against us and he was pissed about how bad the Patriots looked and that they didn't deserve to win. That's just the way it is, and we sure as hell have a lot of that around here.

[Mace]

So outside of us Bills fan, the country views us no better than a 1-7 team. Worse than actually. lol.

The Jets are not really so terrible, Geno Smith amazed me last week with his game. Ryan's 4-6 hybrid, the Bills o-line is lost, I have a feeling they do the standard run-a-lot and short pass us mercilessly in their house, blitz madly, they have a vengeance game against life coming and we are not so inevitable atm. They are going to pick on McKelvin, your guess is as good as mine if he will be good McKelvin or bad McKelvin, and I think they thump us in their house because Marrone has no motivational handle on his team.

[Mace]

That's just the way it is, and we sure as hell have a lot of that around here.

The thing is though, they never break us of the habit, bud. They have a tendency to dork around when you expect effort. It can't be false until they make it so, and by now I think we all want them to desperately.

[Forward_Lateral]

Pressure Geno relentlessly, and it won't even be close.

[coastal]

8-8

at least we won't hand over a top 5 pick

[Dr. Lecter]

2 of the past 3 games Green Bay has basically been done passing the football at halftime.

Rodgers has 1700 yards 18 TDs and 1 INT on the year.

He will shred this secondary.

Detroit is also 5-2 in case you were unaware.

I'm perfectly aware Detriot is 5-2

Who did one of those 2 come against? (in case you were unaware)

[better days]

I'm perfectly aware Detriot is 5-2

Who did one of those 2 come against? (in case you were unaware)

Having beaten the Bears in Chicago, the Lions in Detroit & DOMINATING the Dolphins, the Bills appear capable of beating any team any given Sunday as long as they play mistake free football.

[Fletch]

I think we lose to the Raiders and beat the Pack.

Hell, nobody gave us a snowballs chance against Baltimore last year.

Every season, like most other teams, aka we're not special, we win one that we shouldn't have, sometimes two, but rarely more. Tampa beat Pittsburgh, St. Louis beat Seattle. This year we beat Chicago for one. I can't count Detroit because when we played them they had no capable offensive players on the field besides Tate so it was nothing at all like Detroit at full strength, otherwise they would count. That Detroit team when we played them is a 4-12 team on the season without Bell, Bush, and megatron. Not like they're a 12-4 team with them either.

I can maybe see one more such win and maybe GB is it. But at the same time to sit here and say that we will beat all the teams that appear to be about equal or worse than us, Raiders, Miami, Jets, Cleveland is also not smart. We will lose some of those as well.

Also, everyone crows about losing so many games by 3 points or less, well this season we're on the top end of that so far with three of four wins by 3 or less. I doubt that that continues, if anything we're in for a loss or two or three by 3 or less. This is just how things play out for most teams.

I don't see how we beat teams like @ Denver, @ NE, GB (I see Rodgers lighting up our secondary), KC.

I can see us splitting with the Jets but not taking two, perhaps even losing two. If Harvin does anything for them I definitely see that happening. They're a better team right now with a significantly better coach.

Miami's playing more consistently as is Cleveland. Oakland sucks but we know that game is in Oakland where we're jinxed. I still have to think that we finally break that jinx.

But going 3-6 vs. that schedule seems likely to me. 4-5 I have a lot of difficulty envisioning. We're just not that good. If anything I see 2-7 there if not 3-6. But for every win over a team like GB I suspect at least one loss to Miami, Jets, Cleveland, or Oakland.

If Bryce Brown isn't what everyone here has been crowing about we're screwed. We'll have no running game whatsoever. Orton is not the kind of QB that's going to win us those games like that.

But here's the thing, we can't score. Even with Orton in there we're averaging 18.7 ppg. To give us an idea of how bad that is, if it continues it would end up ranking 6th from worst ahead of only Tennessee, Jets, Minnesota, Oakland, and Jax. And the Jets seem to be improving where as we seem to be regressing.

Regression, that's how it works in Buffalo. Other teams with good coaching tweak things and improve, playoff caliber teams that is. But here in Buffalo it seems like an annual exercise to regress once our changes have become known to opponents. Obviously Orton's not drawing the respect of opposing DCs. Now Spiller and Jackson are out, although not as a Jackson injury should come as a surprise to anyone given that he's 33 and the oldest RB in the league. I harped on that all preseason. Team should have made better alternate plans instead of just running down the hallways at OBD talking about how "low mileage" Jackson is.

Spiller sucks, BUT, we've all been assured right here that Bryce Brown is the next Jackson reincarnate. I sure as hell hope so although I don't see it. Again, if not, we're screwed.

Same with our run D although no one wants to hear it. Stopping Lamar Miller and Damien Williams is not a feat. Neither is stopping George Winn or Donald Brown. Meanwhile RBs like Forte run just fine against us at 4.8 ypc and we just got lit up by an unknown named McKinnon, but that doesn't seem to alter anyone's opinion that our rushing D is among the best ever. I see that stat dropping like a brick here soon.

The game winning drive by Orton on Sunday was encouraging, but like when Bledsoe was here, what business did we even have against a team like Minnesota putting up only 10 points through 59 minutes thereby causing the need for a comeback drive like that? One misstep and we lose that game. The point is that if we were that good then why couldn't we put the game away by the half or at least by the end of the 3rd quarter? Maybe that's one of our "fortunate wins" despite the fact that it's against a poor team.

The bottom line right now is that we're not playing the kind of football that's going to win us many games, on either side. We stopped Bridgewater and had bookoo sacks. HURRAY! Big deal. Meanwhile everyone seems to overlook the fact that the Vikes "powered by" McKinnon's rushing managed 5.4 ypc and 158 yards against us, which is horrible from a defensive perspective. I mean seriously, is that insignificant?

Offensively we couldn't put up more than 17 points and took every second of the game, literally, to do it.

We don't play a QB that's worse than Bridgewater the rest of the season, we don't face a RB that's worse than McKinnon either, and we don't face too many defenses if any that are much worse than Minnesota's.

I have no idea how that translates to wins. We're going to have to start scoring more, and with FredEx and Spiller out. I think that Spiller being out may be a plus as we quit trying to force a big run while having 30 heinous runs while trying to generate that good one. Losing Fred will hurt but the clock was winding down on him anyway and we should have made post-Jackson plans, ... but didn't in Whaley's wisdom.

We'll see. I'm not expecting it but it wouldn't surprise me to see us go 1-8.

[Dr. Lecter]

Having beaten the Bears in Chicago, the Lions in Detroit & DOMINATING the Dolphins, the Bills appear capable of beating any team any given Sunday as long as they play mistake free football.

Well, they aren't beating Denver in Denver.

I am pretty sure on that one

[Fletch]

I don't think it is quite that easy.

The Seahawks should have dominated the Rams yesterday. The Patriots should have dominated Miami earlier this year. The Browns should have stomped Jacksonville yesterday.

The league is pretty damn close. Really, the only sure thing game I see on the rest of the schedule is Denver. (and the Raiders are probably close to one as well)

Other than that? All games can reasonably go either way

If we don't find a way to start scoring more than 17 - 20 points we're not going to win too many more games. That's going to be difficult without a good RB. We'll see how good BB is, but it'll be amazing if he can fill starting shoes on this offense. He struggled in Philly. Sure, you can cite three games and ignore the other 40, but that's not wise. Like Spiller he's got a few good runs making him look good but as a steady consistent option it's simply not there.

He's fresh, that's the good thing. That'll last two games though.

On the other side, the defense is going to have to tighten up against good RBs too. The Jets rushing game is better than anything we've faced this season except for maybe Chicago where Forte logged 4.8 ypc against us. If the Jets do that then the game won't be close.

[Fletch]

I don't know how Vegas or betting works, but are they basically saying the 1-7 Jets are better than us?

Vegas works on how people wager. Their goal is 50% of people voting either side. That way they win with the vig.

The lines adjust to accommodate that. For example, if the Jets open at -4 and 70% of the money takes the Jets, then the points go up to persuade betting on the Bills. It keeps adjusting looking for that perfect balance.

If smaller houses are overwhelmed with bets one way, they'll often go to the bigger ones to put money down on the opposite to avoid the potential of that big payout.

It has absolutely nothing to do with football analysis. That's why say when the Pats play San Fran, and the national line is Pats -3, if you bet local in San Fran you may have to take SF even, or contrarily if you wager in the New England states you may have to lay 5 or 6, because they know that their betting base is laden with homers that don't bet reality, they bet their desires. That's why being a book makes money, people bet their hearts, not their brains.

[Fletch]

The Jets play decent against the Pats, which they always seem to do, and all of a sudden everyone is blowing their load over them.

I'm taking Buffalo this week especially +3 are you kidding me. They aren't great but they are certainly a better team. The only place the Jets are better basically is coaching.

We haven't contained any good RB this season. Our "#1 Run D" has been built on smoke-n-mirrors of having played Donald Brown, George Winn, Lamar Miller, and injured Foster who came out, and sub-par Ridley and Vereen. Forte ran well against us and we just let McKinnon and the Vikes have a heyday.

Last season the Jets averaged the same 158 rushing yards that McKinnon just put up against our "#1 rushing D." Which is now 5th by the way. What is the reason why that won't happen again? If it does, will we win? Just asking the tough questions.

I can see us pressuring Geno like we did Bridgewater, but Bridgewater had his best day as a pro against us. It wasn't good, just sayin', he's sucked worse before playing us.

This is anything but a gimme game. The Jets should be favored.

[Fletch]

Aaron Rodgers vs Buffalo Bills pass defense.

Have you seen what he's been doing this year? He'll have 200 yards and 3 TDs at half.

The end.

I also don't expect Lacy and Starks to finish the game with fewer than 100 yards rushing either.

[better days]

Well, they aren't beating Denver in Denver.

I am pretty sure on that one

You never know.

Injuries happen.

If Peyton gets injured, the Bills could win that game.

[Fletch]

Pressure Geno relentlessly, and it won't even be close.

Who's going to stop Ivory, Johnson, and Powell if he plays?

Powell had his best career game against us last season. Ivory posted a top-10 game against us. Chris Johnson has averaged 180 rushing yards against us in three career games.

I wouldn't worry about Smith, I'd worry about a running game that lit up the Pats for 218 yards last week, lit us up for 316 last season, and which currently ranks 2nd in rushing.

Second thing I'd worry about is what Ryan's plans for Orton are. I doubt he's over there sweating because of Bryce Brown.

If Smith plays like he did last week then this game won't be close.

[Dr. Lecter]

I also don't expect Lacy and Starks to finish the game with fewer than 100 yards rushing either.Individually?Are you really saying 2 100 yard rushers and a 300+ yard passer?

[Historian]

FYI...we're 1-3 in Denver since the merger, (most of the games were in OP) last win in 2008.

[better days]

If we don't find a way to start scoring more than 17 - 20 points we're not going to win too many more games. That's going to be difficult without a good RB. We'll see how good BB is, but it'll be amazing if he can fill starting shoes on this offense. He struggled in Philly. Sure, you can cite three games and ignore the other 40, but that's not wise. Like Spiller he's got a few good runs making him look good but as a steady consistent option it's simply not there.

He's fresh, that's the good thing. That'll last two games though.

On the other side, the defense is going to have to tighten up against good RBs too. The Jets rushing game is better than anything we've faced this season except for maybe Chicago where Forte logged 4.8 ypc against us. If the Jets do that then the game won't be close.


I agree the Bills need to score more points.

But I don't care how many yards the Jets put up, through the air or on the ground.

If the Bills can hold them to 16 points like they did the Vikings, I like the Bills chances to win the game.

[BuffaloRedleg]

We haven't contained any good RB this season. Our "#1 Run D" has been built on smoke-n-mirrors of having played Donald Brown, George Winn, Lamar Miller, and injured Foster who came out, and sub-par Ridley and Vereen. Forte ran well against us and we just let McKinnon and the Vikes have a heyday.

Last season the Jets averaged the same 158 rushing yards that McKinnon just put up against our "#1 rushing D." Which is now 5th by the way. What is the reason why that won't happen again? If it does, will we win? Just asking the tough questions.

I can see us pressuring Geno like we did Bridgewater, but Bridgewater had his best day as a pro against us. It wasn't good, just sayin', he's sucked worse before playing us.

This is anything but a gimme game. The Jets should be favored.

I'm not saying it is a gimme, but it has nothing to do with the Jet talent. Their QB is absolutely terrible, their running game is okay, their wide receivers are mostly laughable, their defense is decent but nothing to write home about.

The real indictment here is that our coaching has been so sorry that we're even having this conversation. If we had better coaching this wouldn't even be a game (other than the fact that generally the Jets play us well) we'd discuss in length like Minnesota. We are a much better team but we have people running the team who have not yet learned how to utilize all the talent properly.

The bottom line is that if you really think that we will lose, then what does a win prove? If the Jets are better than we are giving them credit for, then we deserve credit if we beat them. You absolutely will not give them credit if we do end up winning, and I take issue with that. It is a double standard, you only give credit in a loss but never a win.

[Dr. Who]

And he suffers from hypergraphia.

[Jry44]

The Jets play decent against the Pats, which they always seem to do, and all of a sudden everyone is blowing their load over them.

I'm taking Buffalo this week especially +3 are you kidding me. They aren't great but they are certainly a better team. The only place the Jets are better basically is coaching.

Richardson and Wilkerson against our guards is a severe mismatch. Look at what JJ Watt alone did to us?

If our run defense shows up half asleep against this week like they did against Minn. it could be another long afternoon in Jersey.

I feel our ability to protect Orton is the key to this game. The Jets have the leagues worst secondary, and if we can get some time to throw the ball, I think we win a close one. If not it could be another frustrating afternoon.

[Jry44]

We haven't contained any good RB this season. Our "#1 Run D" has been built on smoke-n-mirrors of having played Donald Brown, George Winn, Lamar Miller, and injured Foster who came out, and sub-par Ridley and Vereen. Forte ran well against us and we just let McKinnon and the Vikes have a heyday.

Last season the Jets averaged the same 158 rushing yards that McKinnon just put up against our "#1 rushing D." Which is now 5th by the way. What is the reason why that won't happen again? If it does, will we win? Just asking the tough questions.

I can see us pressuring Geno like we did Bridgewater, but Bridgewater had his best day as a pro against us. It wasn't good, just sayin', he's sucked worse before playing us.

This is anything but a gimme game. The Jets should be favored.

Stopping another teams running game isn't just about containing a great back. Sunday aside, our front 7 has done a remarkable job at winning at the point of attack and filling the running lanes all season long. The only place we have been vulnerable with any consistency against the run this season is on the right, where Jerry Hughes isn't very good at holding the edge. Aside from that our dline had been doing a great job at dominating one on one battles up front. Miami as a team has had a pretty good run game. The Miami (4), Houston (8), and Minnesota (10) are all top ten teams in the league at running the ball. We've completely shut down two of those three!

[better days]

I think the key to beating the Jets is to get an early lead.

That will quiet the crowd, maybe even turn them against their own team & they start booing the Jets.

Hackett will be able to call any play in his limited playbook & the Bills Defense can tee off on Geno.

[BuffaloRedleg]

Richardson and Wilkerson against our guards is a severe mismatch. Look at what JJ Watt alone did to us?

If our run defense shows up half asleep against this week like they did against Minn. it could be another long afternoon in Jersey.

I feel our ability to protect Orton is the key to this game. The Jets have the leagues worst secondary, and if we can get some time to throw the ball, I think we win a close one. If not it could be another frustrating afternoon.

I can play that game. It is easy to cherry pick things and say "that is the reason we will lose" but it goes both ways. The Jets have the worst QB in the league and it isn't even close.

It is dishonest to not look at the big picture and just pick specific things that fit the storyline you want to convey.

Nobody seems to be talking about coaching, but I see that as the biggest issue we are going to face. We are getting lost in these matchups that while yes they matter, they happen every week. Every team pairs up poorly against JJ Watt and Richardson/Wilkerson. That's just football.

[notacon]

I'm not saying it is a gimme, but it has nothing to do with the Jet talent. Their QB is absolutely terrible, their running game is okay, their wide receivers are mostly laughable, their defense is decent but nothing to write home about.

The real indictment here is that our coaching has been so sorry that we're even having this conversation. If we had better coaching this wouldn't even be a game (other than the fact that generally the Jets play us well) we'd discuss in length like Minnesota. We are a much better team but we have people running the team who have not yet learned how to utilize all the talent properly.

The bottom line is that if you really think that we will lose, then what does a win prove? If the Jets are better than we are giving them credit for, then we deserve credit if we beat them. You absolutely will not give them credit if we do end up winning, and I take issue with that. It is a double standard, you only give credit in a loss but never a win.

No, he's not. Watch him outplay Orton by a mile.

[Jry44]

I can play that game. It is easy to cherry pick things and say "that is the reason we will lose" but it goes both ways. The Jets have the worst QB in the league and it isn't even close.

It is dishonest to not look at the big picture and just pick specific things that fit the storyline you want to convey.

Nobody seems to be talking about coaching, but I see that as the biggest issue we are going to face. We are getting lost in these matchups that while yes they matter, they happen every week. Every team pairs up poorly against JJ Watt and Richardson/Wilkerson. That's just football.

Man, you all are such a hostile bunch on this board!

First... where did I ever say that we were going to lose? I said that Richardson and Wilkerson are severe mismatches for us because of the way our guards are playing, and yes, I get that they give everyone problems, now imagine how much of a problem they are going to be for the worst starting pair in the league? Get my point on the concern there? Unless Marrone decides to work Craig Urbik back in there somewhere, this COULD very well be enough of a mismatch that the game could be decided much like the Texans game. You would have to be very naive to think otherwise...

Secondly... I didn't look at the bigger picture? I said that we match up very well against the Jets secondary and that Orton getting time would be the key to moving the ball. We simply are not a good rushing team anymore, not with Richardson and Pears as our guards. If they get blown up as badly as the Vikings mediocre defensive line blew them up, there's no way we will be able to do anything. I also mentioned our run defense. Because Geno Smith is so bad, the Jets will, and always have loved to pound the rock. We struggled with this last week. It is a cause for concern and we could see another game similar to the Vikings game that we just eeked out.

And third, Percy Harvin is a factor. We have no idea as to how the Jets plan on using the guy.

Again, not making a prediction either way, I am simply stating that this game is no gimmee simply because Geno Smith is a terrible Qb and because the Jets have a bad secondary. Which ever team wins in the trenches is going to win this game.

[better days]

I can play that game. It is easy to cherry pick things and say "that is the reason we will lose" but it goes both ways. The Jets have the worst QB in the league and it isn't even close.

It is dishonest to not look at the big picture and just pick specific things that fit the storyline you want to convey.

Nobody seems to be talking about coaching, but I see that as the biggest issue we are going to face. We are getting lost in these matchups that while yes they matter, they happen every week. Every team pairs up poorly against JJ Watt and Richardson/Wilkerson. That's just football.

Speaking of JJ Watt, I called him a dirty player because he went after EJ's lower legs.

Well, he did the same thing last night to Big Ben.

He was not flagged for it, but the announcers commented on it & they showed a replay.

JJ Watt is a DIRTY player.

[jamze132]

There's three games on the schedule they don't have a snowballs chance in hell at winning. Green Bay, New England and Denver.

The rest of them are all winnable games.
And for us to make the playoffs, those are the only 3 losses we can have. I'm not holding my breath.

[Jry44]

No, he's not. Watch him outplay Orton by a mile.

I don't by any means think that Orton is a great player, but are we talking about the same two guys??

[ServoBillieves]

13-3.

[bdutton]

13-3.

Is that going to be the patriots record?

[RedEyE]

Speaking of JJ Watt, I called him a dirty player because he went after EJ's lower legs.

Well, he did the same thing last night to Big Ben.

He was not flagged for it, but the announcers commented on it & they showed a replay.

JJ Watt is a DIRTY player.

100% agree. I think it will eventually come out that he is juicing. I don't mind emotional players but he has to be one of the angriest guys to play since Romanowski and Alzado.

[BuffaloRedleg]

Man, you all are such a hostile bunch on this board!

First... where did I ever say that we were going to lose? I said that Richardson and Wilkerson are severe mismatches for us because of the way our guards are playing, and yes, I get that they give everyone problems, now imagine how much of a problem they are going to be for the worst starting pair in the league? Get my point on the concern there? Unless Marrone decides to work Craig Urbik back in there somewhere, this COULD very well be enough of a mismatch that the game could be decided much like the Texans game. You would have to be very naive to think otherwise...

Secondly... I didn't look at the bigger picture? I said that we match up very well against the Jets secondary and that Orton getting time would be the key to moving the ball. We simply are not a good rushing team anymore, not with Richardson and Pears as our guards. If they get blown up as badly as the Vikings mediocre defensive line blew them up, there's no way we will be able to do anything. I also mentioned our run defense. Because Geno Smith is so bad, the Jets will, and always have loved to pound the rock. We struggled with this last week. It is a cause for concern and we could see another game similar to the Vikings game that we just eeked out.

And third, Percy Harvin is a factor. We have no idea as to how the Jets plan on using the guy.

Again, not making a prediction either way, I am simply stating that this game is no gimmee simply because Geno Smith is a terrible Qb and because the Jets have a bad secondary. Which ever team wins in the trenches is going to win this game.

My bad man! I misread you. Some of the other guys around here do what I said but you clearly don't.

[BuffaloRedleg]

Speaking of JJ Watt, I called him a dirty player because he went after EJ's lower legs.

Well, he did the same thing last night to Big Ben.

He was not flagged for it, but the announcers commented on it & they showed a replay.

JJ Watt is a DIRTY player.

I don't think he is dirty I think he is just a maniac out there and things happen. He seems like a pretty awesome dude every time I see him interviewed. Some guys just play so hard they can't stop themselves.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

Yeah, this team doesn't have a chance of winning Sunday. I say they just cancel the charter flight and go hide in the locker room until the league just awards the game to the Jets. Not a chance no how, no way that a 4-3 team could beat a 1-6 team. Not in this league. Of course, if the Bills do beat the Jets then Fletch and co come back on here and spew well obviously the Bills can only beat bad teams like the Jets.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

There's three games on the schedule they don't have a snowballs chance in hell at winning. Green Bay, New England and Denver.

The rest of them are all winnable games.

I'm in the distinct minority here, but I think we can beat Green Bay. I did not say we WILL beat Green Bay, but I think --at least right now -- think we CAN beat Green Bay. Denver and New England, on the other hand.

[Jry44]

I'm in the distinct minority here, but I think we can beat Green Bay. I did not say we WILL beat Green Bay, but I think --at least right now -- think we CAN beat Green Bay. Denver and New England, on the other hand.

I'm also in that minority. The game being at home is good for us. And if we can stay healthy along the dline I feel like we will have a chance if we can generate some pressure. Hell, Miami damn near beat them.

[better days]

I don't think he is dirty I think he is just a maniac out there and things happen. He seems like a pretty awesome dude every time I see him interviewed. Some guys just play so hard they can't stop themselves.

Things only happen when you want them to happen.

Watt knew what he was doing when he went after EJ's legs & he did the same exact thing to Big Ben.

It is the way Watt plays the game. Watt is a DIRTY player.

[Historian]

Actually, we usually play well in NY, although sometimes its a comedy of errors.

Its here where we lay an egg against them.

If they're a contender they should beat the Jets.

[starrymessenger]

Who's going to stop Ivory, Johnson, and Powell if he plays?

Powell had his best career game against us last season. Ivory posted a top-10 game against us. Chris Johnson has averaged 180 rushing yards against us in three career games.

I wouldn't worry about Smith, I'd worry about a running game that lit up the Pats for 218 yards last week, lit us up for 316 last season, and which currently ranks 2nd in rushing.

Second thing I'd worry about is what Ryan's plans for Orton are. I doubt he's over there sweating because of Bryce Brown.

If Smith plays like he did last week then this game won't be close.

ivory is a load and their O-line is a lot better than ours.
They will test our run D.
Geno has had to do it the hard way but he is learning and looks to be getting better.
Unless our O-line steps up Wilkerson and Richardson will be like a couple of bears with Orton dressed in a hamburger uniform.
On O idk that our run game will be able to make much of a dent in their front.
Kyle will prolly throw quick slants and shallow crossing patterns. No long developing routes. Sammy and Chandler should be featured.
i expect a close game. Maybe Kyle makes good in the fourth quarter again.
Or maybe Harvin punches Geno in the mouth before the half is over.

[starrymessenger]

I'm in the distinct minority here, but I think we can beat Green Bay. I did not say we WILL beat Green Bay, but I think --at least right now -- think we CAN beat Green Bay. Denver and New England, on the other hand.

Fix the O-line and we can beat NE.

[Woodman]

I'll leave all the so called experts with these 3 words::

ANY GIVEN SUNDAY

[YardRat]

Our run defense used to be so bad, including last season, back-ups and no-names made their mark running all over us. And people *****ed, me included.

Now we are stopping the run for the most part, putting a hurting on the 'good' backs and stuffing the back-ups. And some still *****.

Would you rather go back to getting gashed for 200 yards on a regular basis regardless of who is carrying the rock? Not me.

Also, as far as I know, nobody has exactly anointed Brown as anything other than better depth and on paper a better back-up option than Ronnie Wingo or Tashard Choice.

[Historian]

Actually, we usually play well in NY, although sometimes its a comedy of errors.

Its here where we lay an egg against them.

If they're a contender they should beat the Jets.

Did the Historian call that one or what????

lol

[Night Train]

Did the Historian call that one or what????

lol
But I was instructed to count on a loss by the constipated Twitter Gods

I'm so confused..

[Dr. Lecter]

No, he's not. Watch him outplay Orton by a mile.

*cough* *cough* *cough*

[justasportsfan]

Funny how Fletch and co. pretend to be magicians when they're wrong. They disappear for a while.

[alohabillsfan]

Lmao, yes so many experts, yes geno outplayed Orton, yes their run game dominated! Yes we were out coached, this list goes on.... Experts, SMFH

[notacon]

*cough* *cough* *cough*

Holy crap, was I ever wrong, wrong, wrong! (http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php/226338-Count-on-a-loss-against-the-Jets-and-a-7-9-season?p=4010637&viewfull=1#post4010637)

So happy that I was wrong. Geno Smith put on one of the worst QB performances I have ever seen.

Unfortunately, I am still not very confident that the Bills will do much better than that 7-9 record. They only get to play the Jets one more time this year. They don't get to play terrible Minny anymore....or Chicago. These are teams having very bad years.

The Bills did not play that well against the Jets. This is a very good honest recap (http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/14717/buffallo-bills-prove-a-mystery-at-midway-mark) of just how terrible their offense was...



The Bills possessed the ball 15 times against the Jets, failing to gain a first down or touchdown on nine of those drives. Only three teams this season have finished games with a higher percentage of stagnant drives than the Bills' 60-percent rate against the Jets.

Consider that the Bills had by far the best starting field position (an average of 51.3 yards to the goal) of any team this season -- along with a plus-29.6 yard field position margin, the NFL's sixth-best since 2001 -- and some of the lost opportunities come to light.

That was the most striking observation from Sunday's game: The Bills scored 43 points yet at times managed to look just as inept offensively as the Jets, who committed six turnovers. And this comes one week after Buffalo's mistake-filled, 17-16 win over the Minnesota Vikings.

It's not the mark of a playoff team. It has the stench of a weakness that better teams can expose when the season is on the line this winter.


The Bills offense sucks as much as it always has. Everyone knows I think Orton sucks, and as we meet tougher teams, his weaknesses will be glaring.

As I look at the rest of the schedule, I can easily see them winning only two more games, against the Jets and Cleveland. The next game will be a bell weather...and we're lucky that we're meeting KC in Buffalo instead of Kansas.

As a long time Bills fan of over 50 years, I have been disappointed time after time after time. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised than bitterly disappointed.

Only the Bills can win these games. They have to prove they can on the field. I am cautiously pessimistic because I have to be honest.

[Dr. Lecter]

As I look at the rest of the schedule, I can easily see them winning only two more games, against the Jets and Cleveland. The next game will be a bell weather...and we're lucky that we're meeting KC in Buffalo instead of Kansas.



You don't think they beat Oakland?

[trapezeus]

i hope oakland wins before we play them. because then the bills will be less likely to overlook them.

i thought the inability to move the ball consistently and how conservative the team was should have people worried about how the team can go 5-3 for the next 8. it will have to be that or better.

Frankly, if the bills want to be in the playoffs, they have to be better than the NFC North. that means beating cleveland for a start. and then there are 3 other teams that might make the playoffs because they are 4-2-1 and 5-3 as well. they are playing more complete ball.

[notacon]

You don't think they beat Oakland?

Nope. If it was in Buffalo, yes. In Oakland, I think it's 80% chance of losing that game. If I'm wrong (hopefully) it still puts us at 8-8 (the most one can expect with Orton at the helm) and we're still out of the playoffs.

[better days]

Holy crap, was I ever wrong, wrong, wrong! (http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php/226338-Count-on-a-loss-against-the-Jets-and-a-7-9-season?p=4010637&viewfull=1#post4010637)

So happy that I was wrong. Geno Smith put on one of the worst QB performances I have ever seen.

Unfortunately, I am still not very confident that the Bills will do much better than that 7-9 record. They only get to play the Jets one more time this year. They don't get to play terrible Minny anymore....or Chicago. These are teams having very bad years.

The Bills did not play that well against the Jets. This is a very good honest recap (http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/14717/buffallo-bills-prove-a-mystery-at-midway-mark) of just how terrible their offense was...



The Bills offense sucks as much as it always has. Everyone knows I think Orton sucks, and as we meet tougher teams, his weaknesses will be glaring.

As I look at the rest of the schedule, I can easily see them winning only two more games, against the Jets and Cleveland. The next game will be a bell weather...and we're lucky that we're meeting KC in Buffalo instead of Kansas.

As a long time Bills fan of over 50 years, I have been disappointed time after time after time. I'd rather be pleasantly surprised than bitterly disappointed.

Only the Bills can win these games. They have to prove they can on the field. I am cautiously pessimistic because I have to be honest.

The Bills have to win against the Chiefs. That would be 6 wins.

Then win against the Fins AGAIN. That would be 7 wins.

Beat the Jets AGAIN. 8 wins.

Beat the Browns. 9 Wins

Beat the Raiders. 10 wins & hopefully playoffs.

[Forward_Lateral]

Nope. If it was in Buffalo, yes. In Oakland, I think it's 80% chance of losing that game. If I'm wrong (hopefully) it still puts us at 8-8 (the most one can expect with Orton at the helm) and we're still out of the playoffs.

I think there's a 100% chance your brain is defective. See if you can return it.

[notacon]

I think there's a 100% chance your brain is defective. See if you can return it.

What a jerk.

I make a reasonable assessment, and just because you don't agree with reality, I am mentally defective?!?!

Jesus. Ass hats like you make the world a worse place. Grow the **** up!

[Historian]

I think we beat KC, NY Cleveland and the Pack.

We beat the Raiders and we're in.

We lose and we're outside looking in with an above .500 record.

[better days]

I think we beat KC, NY Cleveland and the Pack.

We beat the Raiders and we're in.

We lose and we're outside looking in with an above .500 record.

I hope you didn't bet the mortgage payment the Jets would put up 33 points on the Bills.

[Dr. Lecter]

Nope. If it was in Buffalo, yes. In Oakland, I think it's 80% chance of losing that game. If I'm wrong (hopefully) it still puts us at 8-8 (the most one can expect with Orton at the helm) and we're still out of the playoffs.

How so?

Oakland is the worst team in the NFL right now.

Of course they can win that game, but putting it a 80% loss is way off base.

[feldspar]

What a jerk.

I make a reasonable assessment, and just because you don't agree with reality, I am mentally defective?!?!

Jesus. Ass hats like you make the world a worse place. Grow the **** up!

The Bills have an 80% chance of beating the Raiders in Oakland? This is your definition of reality?

You have a pretty strange idea of what reality is.

I'd call that an opinion...one that not many people would agree with, at that.

Just curious, but how did you come up with the 80% number? Break out the calculator with pure infallible math?

You should grow up a little yourself. Start by understanding the difference between fact and opinion.

[Forward_Lateral]

What a jerk.

I make a reasonable assessment, and just because you don't agree with reality, I am mentally defective?!?!

Jesus. Ass hats like you make the world a worse place. Grow the **** up!

Your assessment was far from reasonable.

[DesertFox24]

Can we talk about our matchup against the Chiefs. My lord we are 5-3 and already planning how we will not make the playoffs.

The Chiefs are a good team if we can beat them and the phins on a short week I think we will get in.

I will concede Denver and pats as a L but I am not sure the pack will roll in here in December with us in the playoff hunt and beat us for sure.

[justasportsfan]

The Bills offense sucks as much as it always has. Everyone knows I think Orton sucks, and as we meet tougher teams, his weaknesses will be glaring.



I hasn't been because of Orton. It's mostly because our OL and we can't run.

[notacon]

I hope you didn't bet the mortgage payment the Jets would put up 33 points on the Bills.

I do not bet on NFL games.


How so?

Oakland is the worst team in the NFL right now.

Of course they can win that game, but putting it a 80% loss is way off base.

Easy. The Bills have a very bad record on the West coats, and in particular, Oakland. Every team wins some at home that they are not expected to. The Bills will be coming off two very tough weeks by traveling to Denver and then back home to meet Green Bay and then back to the West coast. I think they will come out flat.

I think they lose in a close game.


The Bills have an 80% chance of beating the Raiders in Oakland? This is your definition of reality?

You have a pretty strange idea of what reality is.

I'd call that an opinion...one that not many people would agree with, at that.

Just curious, but how did you come up with the 80% number? Break out the calculator with pure infallible math?

You should grow up a little yourself. Start by understanding the difference between fact and opinion.

No, I said the Bills have a 80% chance of LOSING in Oakland.

Yes, an "assessment" is the same as an "opinion". Whine and jump up and down like a baby all you want. I never said what wrote was a "fact". Jesus. Get a ****ing grip and grow the **** up!


Your assessment was far from reasonable.

I think it is. Have you been paying attention to the last decade of the Bills?? Sorry, but, they have not shown very much improvement in offense. The last two games, against two of the worst teams in the league prove that they are not anywhere close to prime time. Orton sucks generally, and all the overestimation of what kind of QB he is on this board does nothing to show he is any different than his 9 years in the league have proven.

Genrally, if you guys don't agree, then disagree. We'll see when the season is over who is so smart. I hope like hell I am wrong. I doubt it. No need to go ape **** over it. It's football and has little bearing on life. If it does have such an overbearing affect on your life....you need to get one.

[Dr. Lecter]

Easy. The Bills have a very bad record on the West coats, and in particular, Oakland. Every team wins some at home that they are not expected to. The Bills will be coming off two very tough weeks by traveling to Denver and then back home to meet Green Bay and then back to the West coast. I think they will come out flat.

I think they lose in a close game.




What is the current Bills team recprd on the west coast and in Oakland?

[justasportsfan]

Nope. If it was in Buffalo, yes. In Oakland, I think it's 80% chance of losing that game. If I'm wrong (hopefully) it still puts us at 8-8 (the most one can expect with Orton at the helm) and we're still out of the playoffs.

you want us to take you seriously but you post this?

The bills beat the bears at chicago and the bears are better than the raiders.

[trapezeus]

How so?

Oakland is the worst team in the NFL right now.

Of course they can win that game, but putting it a 80% loss is way off base.

bills haven't won in oakland since the 70's. is that the stat? also, oakland has played good teams tough. only 2 teams in 75 years have gone winless? we just had one. so if oakland is winless into the second last game of the season, there is a lot working against us.

that being said, it's a ways away. perhaps the raiders start gelling together. maybe the bills start gelling together.

it's as hard to predict as any of the games, including the one 2 weeks away. let's worry about oakland when it's next up.

[justasportsfan]

bills haven't won in oakland since the 70's. is that the stat? also, oakland has played good teams tough. only 2 teams in 75 years have gone winless? we just had one. so if oakland is winless into the second last game of the season, there is a lot working against us.

.we never won at chicago too and we beat and they're better than the raiders.

[Dr. Lecter]

The Bills record in Oakland in the 70's, 80's, 90's, and 00's is meaningless.

[feldspar]

No, I said the Bills have a 80% chance of LOSING in Oakland.

Yes, of course. What I meant.


Yes, an "assessment" is the same as an "opinion". Whine and jump up and down like a baby all you want. I never said what wrote was a "fact". Jesus. Get a ****ing grip and grow the **** up!


LOL, you were trying to tell people that disagreeing with you is the same with disagreeing with reality. This is what you said. And reality is that the Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland?

I'm "whining and jumping up and down like a baby?" You're too funny.

[notacon]

you want us to take you seriously but you post this?

The bills beat the bears at chicago and the bears are better than the raiders.

I don't care one whit if I'm "taken seriously". Time will tell.

The '...one team beat one who beat the other...' is for college ball. Meaningless in the NFL. I gave my reasons. Even if I'm wrong on the Raiders, that still leaves the Bills with a 8-8 record and woefully out of the playoffs.

What exactly is the point?


bills haven't won in oakland since the 70's. is that the stat? also, oakland has played good teams tough. only 2 teams in 75 years have gone winless? we just had one. so if oakland is winless into the second last game of the season, there is a lot working against us.

that being said, it's a ways away. perhaps the raiders start gelling together. maybe the bills start gelling together.

it's as hard to predict as any of the games, including the one 2 weeks away. let's worry about oakland when it's next up.

I never said my opinion and prediction was based on any "stat". i stated why I think they will lose in Oakland, and even if they win, it's irrelevant as far as making the playoffs. Time will tell.


we never won at chicago too and we beat and they're better than the raiders.

See my college explanation above. Irrelevant in the NFL.


The Bills record in Oakland in the 70's, 80's, 90's, and 00's is meaningless.

I gave several other reasons why in addition to that.


Yes, of course. What I meant.



LOL, you were trying to tell people that disagreeing with you is the same with disagreeing with reality. This is what you said. And reality is that the Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland?

I'm "whining and jumping up and down like a baby?" You're too funny.

Yeah. The "reality" that this Bills have a long history of not making the playoffs. This team has shown very little sign of improving enough to get there this year. The last two games, their offense was terrible. They struggled for 59 min. against Minny...not a very good team...at home.

The "reality" is even if they win in Oakland, they will still not come close to making the playoffs with a 8-8 record.

And, yes, you are acting like a baby.

[feldspar]

Yeah. The "reality" that this Bills have a long history of not making the playoffs. This team has shown very little sign of improving enough to get there this year. The last two games, their offense was terrible. They struggled for 59 min. against Minny...not a very good team...at home.

The "reality" is even if they win in Oakland, they will still not come close to making the playoffs with a 8-8 record.

And, yes, you are acting like a baby.

This is entertaining, just how how unreasonable you are being.

Keep it up, extremely successful sales guy.

The Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland, and that's reality.

Reality is also that you have a 99.9% chance of being a total hump.

If I'm a baby, what do grown men do? Suck your dick?

[HHURRICANE]

I cracked up when I saw this thread at the top.

I love the win but if you listened to NY radio, like I did (was on a plane yesterday) I have to say that the Bills did everything in their power to lose this game. The NY annoucers were like "how are the Bills not running away with this game?"

I'm sorry but our offense (blame it on the OC) is a nightmare.

I'm sticking with 7-9. I think the games that we've squeeked out wins in, this game included, will be balanced out by the ones down the road that we won't.

[Dr. Lecter]

Can we discuss this like adults and not make dumb, insulting comments?

[feldspar]

Can we discuss this like adults and not make dumb, insulting comments?

Probably not.

[Historian]

The Bills record in Oakland in the 70's, 80's, 90's, and 00's is meaningless.

Not necessarily.

There has to be some sort of reason why they haven't won there since 1965...or why we couldn't beat the Fish in the 70's, never won in Chicago, nor why we have a losing record in Tampa.

It tells me they're tough places to play in, and no matter how good or bad the team is, you have to acknowledge the streak.

The Bills have done a good job exercising demons this year. I hope they keep it up, but a west coast game is no gimme.

[Novacane]

Can we discuss this like adults and not make dumb, insulting comments?


notacon is involved so not likely

[stuckincincy]

notacon is involved so not likely

You are right. I'd like to see him/her tossed into one of his socialist paradises. He'd be a scullery maid, and if cute enough, would be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session.

[justasportsfan]

I cracked up when I saw this thread at the top.

I love the win but if you listened to NY radio, like I did (was on a plane yesterday) I have to say that the Bills did everything in their power to lose this game. The NY annoucers were like "how are the Bills not running away with this game?"

I'm sorry but our offense (blame it on the OC) is a nightmare.

I'm sticking with 7-9. I think the games that we've squeeked out wins in, this game included, will be balanced out by the ones down the road that we won't. funny, you are sticking with what you heard on the radio because in your head, you wanted to be right about the bills losing to the jets.

The bills may have not ran away with the game in the first half but they made the right adjustments in the 2nd half.

[justasportsfan]

Can we discuss this like adults and not make dumb, insulting comments?
where's the fun in that?

[notacon]

This is entertaining, just how how unreasonable you are being.

Keep it up, extremely successful sales guy.

The Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland, and that's reality.

Reality is also that you have a 99.9% chance of being a total hump.

If I'm a baby, what do grown men do? Suck your dick?

Looking at your posts this morning, and you are calling me "unreasonable"?!?! Really?? Jesus. My prediction is not only "reasonable" it's more probable than not.

Maybe you should look up these big words before you use them.

You are a "baby" in the sense that you are acting monumentally immature.


Can we discuss this like adults and not make dumb, insulting comments?

I have not insulted one poster here. I have been attacked relentlessly.


Probably not.

Obviously.


Not necessarily.

There has to be some sort of reason why they haven't won there since 1965...or why we couldn't beat the Fish in the 70's, never won in Chicago, nor why we have a losing record in Tampa.

It tells me they're tough places to play in, and no matter how good or bad the team is, you have to acknowledge the streak.

The Bills have done a good job exercising demons this year. I hope they keep it up, but a west coast game is no gimme.

A beacon of "reason". What I think is an important factor is the schedule. Traveling virtually across the country twice over a little over two weeks, and playing two very, very good football teams. The Oakland game smells like a let down from a mile away.


notacon is involved so not likely

I have not insulted one poster here. All I have gotten, in this and other threads on the football side of this forum, is relentless attacks, insults and vilification. Yes, I defend myself from time to time...but...mostly I take them with a grain of salt.


You are right. I'd like to see him/her tossed into one of his socialist paradises. He'd be a scullery maid, and if cute enough, would be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session.

Do you any idea what "socialist" means?!?! I have never, and I mean, NEVER supported any kind of "socialism". Period.

It is the ignorant that jump to conclusions on something they know nothing about...and based on that ignorance, make silly and inappropriate labels.

[better days]

I cracked up when I saw this thread at the top.

I love the win but if you listened to NY radio, like I did (was on a plane yesterday) I have to say that the Bills did everything in their power to lose this game. The NY annoucers were like "how are the Bills not running away with this game?"

I'm sorry but our offense (blame it on the OC) is a nightmare.

I'm sticking with 7-9. I think the games that we've squeeked out wins in, this game included, will be balanced out by the ones down the road that we won't.

As Justa said, you just want to be right when you were obviously wrong. And if you had actually seen the game you would have seen the Jets DOMINATED by the Bills.

I do agree Hackett called a terrible game, but the players overcame that.

You go ahead & stick to 7-9........just gives me one more person I can make fun of at the end of the season.

[Dr. Lecter]

I
have not insulted one poster here. I have been attacked relentlessly.



I know that.

Hence why I asked people to tone it down. I don't have time to send out that many PM's right now

[feldspar]

My prediction is not only "reasonable" it's more probable than not.

Of course your prediction is more probable than not...it's set at 80%. There is an 80% chance that the Raiders beat the Bills.

There can be no arguing with that. The math is in. The scientists have spoken.



I have not insulted one poster here.

Stop whining and jumping up and down like a baby. Get a grip and grow the **** up!!!!!!!!!!!!

Of course, these are not insults, right successful sales guy?

If I respected you, perhaps I would be offended.

[PromoTheRobot]

Take the coaches, talent etc. out of this for a moment and just focus on our remaining schedule.

Oct 26 BUF @ NYJ LOSS
Bye
Nov 09 KC @ BUF LOSS
Nov 13 BUF @ MIA LOSS
Nov 23 NYJ @ BUF WIN
Nov 30 CLE @ BUF WIN
Dec 07 BUF @ DEN LOSS
Dec 14 GB @ BUF LOSS
Dec 21 BUF @ OAK WIN
Dec 28 BUF @ NE LOSS

The Jets have enough pride not to go 1-7. I'm sure they view this as a winnable game and certainly have ample time to prepare.

Being realistic I don't see a best case scenario better than 9-7, which would be a big accomplishement at this point.

:poop:

[bdutton]

I'm just going to put this here...

http://imgur.com/2NVascI.gif

No... it goes there!

[swiper]

Can we discuss this like adults and not make dumb, insulting comments?

You'd have to start by having mature, reasonable people.

[pmoon6]

I would put in my two cents, but Feldspar is doing incredibly well.

Just a little tidbit, I didn't nickname Notacon, "Nutty" for nothin".

[swiper]

I guarantee I he's not a good salesman. Sales manager = career salesman. Which is a dead end job that nobody wants. I did it for 15 years. Worked triple hard to get out and do something dignified.

[better days]

You'd have to start by having mature, reasonable people.

A board like that would have VERY FEW people on it.

[Oaf]

I think we can beat Den.

[TacklingDummy]

I think we can beat Den.

It's puff, puff, PASS.

The bills will lose that game by 20.

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

It's puff, puff, PASS.

The bills will lose that game by 20.

and i'll be at that game. woohoo. i'll probably leave at halftime right after manning 6th touchdown pass of the game

[BertSquirtgum]

I hope HH had some crow for dinner tonight.

[notacon]

we never won at chicago too and we beat and they're better than the raiders.

Well...well...well...

Did you watch the game last night. I guess by your logic, my prediction that the Raiders will beat the Bills is not so far fetched.

KC beats the Bills, Oakland beats KC...


This is entertaining, just how how unreasonable you are being.

Keep it up, extremely successful sales guy.

The Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland, and that's reality.

Reality is also that you have a 99.9% chance of being a total hump.

If I'm a baby, what do grown men do? Suck your dick?

My predictions have been better than most so far. Bills offense sucks the big one, Orton gets worse as every game goes by, and the Bills drop two in a row.


I guarantee I he's not a good salesman. Sales manager = career salesman. Which is a dead end job that nobody wants. I did it for 15 years. Worked triple hard to get out and do something dignified.

Gee, I missed this little immature piece of blatant insult before.

You "guarantee" that I'm "not a good salesman"??? Exactly how in the world do you know...so much so that you "guarantee" it?? Jesus. Now you are talking like a 12 year old. What's next, you going to say that your dad can beat up mine???

And, it is amusing that people like you think that being a salesman is a "dead end job". Just how does one define "dead end"?? I would suspect that you are trying to say that sales is not a rewarding profession...and the phrase "dead end" means that one cannot not make good living being in sales.

Of course, the uninformed hear the word "sales" and they think about some one in retail sales....the guy behind the counter or helping someone with a pair of shoes.

This just shows how totally ignorant you are of the sales profession. Some of the highest earners in the world are in "sales", with "Sales managers" being on top of those earnings.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics "sales managers" earn a median salary of $105, 206 in 2012 (http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/sales-manager). The best paid made more than $187,199.

Now, whenever I talk about earnings, it upsets everyone of this board, so I will not get into such details. Suffice it to say, that you have NO idea what you are talking about. I haven't earned as little as $187K for years.

Now, I am sure that you did toil in "sales" for 15 years, and you worked extra, extra hard for something "more dignified". I suspect that you were in a "dead end" job because you are not very good at sales.

Stock brokers are in "sales". Real estate agents are in "sales". Manufacturer's reps are in "sales". Medical industry employs huge numbers of people in "sales". Millions of people in "sales" earn millions of dollars a year....and have a very rewarding lifestyle and career satisfaction.

So...stop talking about things you have no idea about. Especially when you try and magically determine exactly how "successful" I am through a internet forum.

[notacon]

Oh, and Swiper....I do not know where you live. I have a home in Western New York.

But, I'm not worried about all that wonderful snow that has been piling up there because I'm in my second home in the Southwest United States.

Warm and sunny here!!

[pmoon6]

Oh, and Swiper....I do not know where you live. I have a home in Western New York.

But, I'm not worried about all that wonderful snow that has been piling up there because I'm in my second home in the Southwest United States.

Warm and sunny here!!Well, defrauding old ladies out of their life savings is one way to live the American Dream.

What sales pitch did you use to go along with your trustworthy face?

[notacon]

Well, defrauding old ladies out of their life savings is one way to live the American Dream.

What sales pitch did you use to go along with your trustworthy face?

Seriously?? You have fallen to a new low, even for you moonie.

[Night Train]

Oh, and Swiper....I do not know where you live. I have a home in Western New York.

But, I'm not worried about all that wonderful snow that has been piling up there because I'm in my second home in the Southwest United States.

Warm and sunny here!!


I live here too and own a second place in Coral Springs, FL. That doesn't mean anything.

I also predicted 7-9.

But I'm not worried about being "right" with faceless people on the internet and embracing the A-hole poster moniker ad nauseam.

Welcome to the Ignore feature.

Bye-bye.

[pmoon6]

Seriously?? You have fallen to a new low, even for you moonie.:rofl:. Sorry, I couldn't resist. Call it a character flaw.

[HHURRICANE]

Eeeks, I guess my thread was more realistic than I even thought.

That's depressing.

[HHURRICANE]

As Justa said, you just want to be right when you were obviously wrong. And if you had actually seen the game you would have seen the Jets DOMINATED by the Bills.

I do agree Hackett called a terrible game, but the players overcame that.

You go ahead & stick to 7-9........just gives me one more person I can make fun of at the end of the season.

Do I get to make fun of you. I'm a Bills fan just not dillusional.

[better days]

Do I get to make fun of you. I'm a Bills fan just not dillusional.

OK make fun of me.

I admit I did not think Marrone was as bad a HC as he has proven to be.

[trapezeus]

5-11 still a possibility as well. which i felt like at the beginning of the year only because we went 7-9 for 3 years, 6-10 for 3 years and now it would only make sense that russ and company have improved the team by making it measurably worse.

the fact that we are debating whether the team needs to be stripped from the top down after 15 years is why we suck for so long.

[better days]

5-11 still a possibility as well. which i felt like at the beginning of the year only because we went 7-9 for 3 years, 6-10 for 3 years and now it would only make sense that russ and company have improved the team by making it measurably worse.

the fact that we are debating whether the team needs to be stripped from the top down after 15 years is why we suck for so long.

Well, the talent has IMPROVED on this team from what it was a few years ago.

Coaching is the main thing holding this team back IMO.

[trapezeus]

Well, the talent has IMPROVED on this team from what it was a few years ago.

Coaching is the main thing holding this team back IMO.

agreed, but the offensive side of the ball isn't amazing. the GM didn't have to reshuffle the WR corp, especially now that he won't vouch for manuel. at trade date, watkins and trading stevie was supposed to be to help manuel. then they gave up on manuel and say he's a buddy pick now and that he was always suppose to be sitting. So then why change the top receivers?

again, it points to how reactionary the FO is and how non-visionary they are.

[better days]

agreed, but the offensive side of the ball isn't amazing. the GM didn't have to reshuffle the WR corp, especially now that he won't vouch for manuel. at trade date, watkins and trading stevie was supposed to be to help manuel. then they gave up on manuel and say he's a buddy pick now and that he was always suppose to be sitting. So then why change the top receivers?

again, it points to how reactionary the FO is and how non-visionary they are.

I think it points more to Marrone's lack of making proper use of the weapons Whaley provided him.

And when he was hired, Marrone said he was going to bring innovation to the team, run an uptempo offense. LMAO at that. Some uptempo offense Marrones team has.

ONE TD in the last 8 Qtrs.

[trapezeus]

like i've said repeatedly, the OL issues seem to be coaching related. guys have no idea who to block. coaches aren't making it clear for them. i find it hard to believe they are all stupid. it's almost impossible to pick a new line in draft class and whiff on every single one of them.

the playcalling isn't god awful on it's own. there are plays out there (moreso when manuel played) where guys are wide open and the throws weren't happening. Orton is reverting to that level as well. that also points to players being coached to not make a mistake. and you see that again with not having the stones to go for it on 4th and short in a game you need to win.

it's a bad mentality and marrone is starting to fall into jauron land where he'll do the same thing over and over again.

at 5-5, they can control their destiny, but i don't think marrone is the guy who can step up and get 6 big games out of his team. he'll need to win 5 at a minimum to think he has a chance at the playoffs.

[notacon]

I live here too and own a second place in Coral Springs, FL. That doesn't mean anything.

I also predicted 7-9.

But I'm not worried about being "right" with faceless people on the internet and embracing the A-hole poster moniker ad nauseam.

Welcome to the Ignore feature.

Bye-bye.

Good.

I defend my self from unwarranted attacks. And all I have been attacked relentlessly. Does not matter to me, but, I will defend myself. if you don't like it, then I welcome your "ignore". I guess you are too sensitive to hear the truth.

[notacon]

After the second Jets game, I made a reasonable observation and prediction....


Nope. If it was in Buffalo, yes. In Oakland, I think it's 80% chance of losing that game. If I'm wrong (hopefully) it still puts us at 8-8 (the most one can expect with Orton at the helm) and we're still out of the playoffs.

The outrage and insults were flying...here are some of the more ridiculous reactions...


I think there's a 100% chance your brain is defective. See if you can return it.


How so?

Oakland is the worst team in the NFL right now.

Of course they can win that game, but putting it a 80% loss is way off base.


The Bills have an 80% chance of beating the Raiders in Oakland? This is your definition of reality?

You have a pretty strange idea of what reality is.

I'd call that an opinion...one that not many people would agree with, at that.

Just curious, but how did you come up with the 80% number? Break out the calculator with pure infallible math?

You should grow up a little yourself. Start by understanding the difference between fact and opinion.


Your assessment was far from reasonable.


you want us to take you seriously but you post this?

The bills beat the bears at chicago and the bears are better than the raiders.




LOL, you were trying to tell people that disagreeing with you is the same with disagreeing with reality. This is what you said. And reality is that the Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland?

I'm "whining and jumping up and down like a baby?" You're too funny.


This is entertaining, just how how unreasonable you are being.

Keep it up, extremely successful sales guy.

The Bills have an 80% chance of losing in Oakland, and that's reality.

Reality is also that you have a 99.9% chance of being a total hump.

If I'm a baby, what do grown men do? Suck your dick?


You are right. I'd like to see him/her tossed into one of his socialist paradises. He'd be a scullery maid, and if cute enough, would be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session.


Of course your prediction is more probable than not...it's set at 80%. There is an 80% chance that the Raiders beat the Bills.

There can be no arguing with that. The math is in. The scientists have spoken.




Stop whining and jumping up and down like a baby. Get a grip and grow the **** up!!!!!!!!!!!!

Of course, these are not insults, right successful sales guy?

If I respected you, perhaps I would be offended.


I would put in my two cents, but Feldspar is doing incredibly well.

Just a little tidbit, I didn't nickname Notacon, "Nutty" for nothin".

Raiders 26, Bills 24


So...I guess my brain is NOT "defective" and I should "return it"....that I am NOT "off base"....that my idea of "reality" is NOT very "strange"....that my assessment was NOT "far from reasonable"...that YES, I should be "taken seriously"...that I have a very GOOD idea of what "reality" is...that I am NOT "being unreasonable"...I am NOT a "total hump"...that I do NOT deserve to "be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session" The most particularly perverted idea I have ever seen)...that I definitely DID "have a grip"...and that I am NOT "nutty".

Maybe next time the little boys on this site will hold their ignorant little tongues and not make such fools of themselves.

Oh...is anyone going to say that my prediction for a 8-8 season is "nutty" now???

[feldspar]

I am NOT a "total hump"...

Sure you are.

Don't kid yourself. This post does nothing but reenforce it.

[kscdogbillsfan1221]

After the second Jets game, I made a reasonable observation and prediction....



The outrage and insults were flying...here are some of the more ridiculous reactions...





















Raiders 26, Bills 24


So...I guess my brain is NOT "defective" and I should "return it"....that I am NOT "off base"....that my idea of "reality" is NOT very "strange"....that my assessment was NOT "far from reasonable"...that YES, I should be "taken seriously"...that I have a very GOOD idea of what "reality" is...that I am NOT "being unreasonable"...I am NOT a "total hump"...that I do NOT deserve to "be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session" The most particularly perverted idea I have ever seen)...that I definitely DID "have a grip"...and that I am NOT "nutty".

Maybe next time the little boys on this site will hold their ignorant little tongues and not make such fools of themselves.

Oh...is anyone going to say that my prediction for a 8-8 season is "nutty" now???

we're glad that you're happy you were right. congratulations

[wolfpack]

Wow that is a lot of copy and paste, good job buddy, we are all proud of you little man!


After the second Jets game, I made a reasonable observation and prediction....



The outrage and insults were flying...here are some of the more ridiculous reactions...





















Raiders 26, Bills 24


So...I guess my brain is NOT "defective" and I should "return it"....that I am NOT "off base"....that my idea of "reality" is NOT very "strange"....that my assessment was NOT "far from reasonable"...that YES, I should be "taken seriously"...that I have a very GOOD idea of what "reality" is...that I am NOT "being unreasonable"...I am NOT a "total hump"...that I do NOT deserve to "be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session" The most particularly perverted idea I have ever seen)...that I definitely DID "have a grip"...and that I am NOT "nutty".

Maybe next time the little boys on this site will hold their ignorant little tongues and not make such fools of themselves.

Oh...is anyone going to say that my prediction for a 8-8 season is "nutty" now???

[Joe Fo Sho]

I think we lose to the Raiders and beat the Pack.

Hell, nobody gave us a snowballs chance against Baltimore last year.

I'm more impressed with this.

[Novacane]

I hate I told you so posts :rolleyes:

[notacon]

I hate I told you so posts :rolleyes:

I hate unreasonable insults instead of actual discussion about a subject.

No insults, would have produced no "I told you so" post.

You (in general) reap what you sow.

[HHURRICANE]

Well whoever pulled this thread back up at least can say 8-8.

I would rather be in the playoffs.

[HHURRICANE]

Ps...historian nice job!!!!

[pmoon6]

After the second Jets game, I made a reasonable observation and prediction....



The outrage and insults were flying...here are some of the more ridiculous reactions...





















Raiders 26, Bills 24


So...I guess my brain is NOT "defective" and I should "return it"....that I am NOT "off base"....that my idea of "reality" is NOT very "strange"....that my assessment was NOT "far from reasonable"...that YES, I should be "taken seriously"...that I have a very GOOD idea of what "reality" is...that I am NOT "being unreasonable"...I am NOT a "total hump"...that I do NOT deserve to "be dragged upstairs to the local Commissar for a buggery session" The most particularly perverted idea I have ever seen)...that I definitely DID "have a grip"...and that I am NOT "nutty".

Maybe next time the little boys on this site will hold their ignorant little tongues and not make such fools of themselves.

Oh...is anyone going to say that my prediction for a 8-8 season is "nutty" now???Now you can beat off because we lost by two points.

What a sage, what a prophet......still an ass hole.