If a high school can change it's mascot, why can't an NFL team do the same?

[DetDannyWilliams]

LANCASTER, N.Y. - The Lancaster School Board unanimously approved a new nickname -- the "Legends" -- at a meeting on Monday night, marking another step forward for the district following the retirement of the old "Redskins" http://www.wgrz.com/story/news/education/2015/06/08/the-lancaster-legends/28719953/

[Novacane]

Cause the owner doesn't want to.

[Zoneblitser]

More of the politically correct bull****.

[OpIv37]

More of the politically correct bull****.

Just answer this:

Why are native Americans the only group allowed to be identified by their skin color? People would be furious if there were teams called the Atlanta Darkies, the Miami Brownskins, the Vancouver Yellowskins or the Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

But for some reason, no one seems to mind calling native Americans "Redskins."

I ask this question every single time this issue comes up and I have yet to get an answer.

[WagonCircler]

Just answer this:

Why are native Americans the only group allowed to be identified by their skin color? People would be furious if there were teams called the Atlanta Darkies, the Miami Brownskins, the Vancouver Yellowskins or the Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

But for some reason, no one seems to mind calling native Americans "Redskins."

I ask this question every single time this issue comes up and I have yet to get an answer.

Redskins refers to the red warpaint applied to the skin by a specific tribe.

But why let the facts ruin a good whine?

[Pinkerton Security]

...they can! They choose not to because it will come at a large cost to them - re-branding a megamillion dollar franchise isnt cheap

[Joe Fo Sho]

Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

This team would instantly become my 2nd favorite team.

[Pinkerton Security]

Redskins refers to the red warpaint applied to the skin by a specific tribe.

But why let the facts ruin a good whine?

Heres a fact - its still used (no matter the origin) as a racial term that most natives would probably not be in favor of being called.

[OpIv37]

Redskins refers to the red warpaint applied to the skin by a specific tribe.

But why let the facts ruin a good whine?

Yeah but it also refers to the scalps of native Americans that were taken as war trophies and it's been used as a disparaging name as well. But let's not let that get in the way of a good whine about someone else's perceived whine.

[WagonCircler]

Heres a fact - its still used (no matter the origin) as a racial term that most natives would probably not be in favor of being called.

It's a misconception by ignorant people. And the truth is, survey after survey shows that most natives don't give a ****. In fact many are proud of the Redskins mascot.

[WagonCircler]

Yeah but it also refers to the scalps of native Americans that were taken as war trophies and it's been used as a disparaging name as well. But let's not let that get in the way of a good whine about someone else's perceived whine.

That NOT what the team was named after. So this is another case of stupid people looking to act like victims, which is especially ironic in that it's mostly white, liberal bereavement enthusiasts who cry so hard about this.

At the end of the day, this is about privately owned property, whose private owner refuses to change the name of HIS property, over a misconception by ignorant people like you, regarding the origin on HIS PROPERTY'S name.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Redskins refers to the red warpaint applied to the skin by a specific tribe.

But why let the facts ruin a good whine?


Seriously? You're fine with jokes about that day when 3,000 innocent people were incinerated? That makes you an *******.

Wait, let me guess...you think they deserved it.

Got any Holocaust jokes? Maybe a funny plane crash anecdote? A humorous ditty about a dead soldier's funeral?

Wow.

Just..

...wow.

I feel like you shouldn't be able to have these two thoughts.

[OpIv37]

That NOT what the team was named after. So this is another case of stupid people looking to act like victims, which is especially ironic in that it's mostly white, liberal bereavement enthusiasts who cry so hard about this.

At the end of the day, this is about privately owned property, whose private owner refuses to change the name of HIS property, over a misconception by ignorant people like you, regarding the origin on HIS PROPERTY'S name.

It may not be what the team was named after, but it's what people think of when they hear the name now.

[WagonCircler]

I feel like you shouldn't be able to have these two thoughts.

Really? Please elaborate.

If anything, this is a clear illustration of the difference between what is truly offensive and what is an imagined slight, created by people who have an agenda.

[WagonCircler]

It may not be what the team was named after, but it's what people think of when they hear the name now.

Private ****ING property.

Just because people are stupid and misunderstand something doesn't mean the government should be able to step in, as they are trying to do, and force a man to change the name of his business.

[OpIv37]

Really? Please elaborate.

If anything, this is a clear illustration of the difference between what is truly offensive and what is an imagined slight, created by people who have an agenda.

Nothing is "truly offensive"' because what's offensive is subjective.

[OpIv37]

Private ****ING property.

Just because people are stupid and misunderstand something doesn't mean the government should be able to step in, as they are trying to do, and force a man to change the name of his business.


Ok you just completely changed the topic. I'm simply discussing whether or not the name is offensive. I never said anything about what the government should or shouldn't do.

[gebobs]

Redskins refers to the red warpaint applied to the skin by a specific tribe.

Facts? That story is apocryphal at best and likely a hoax. In any case, the common understanding of the term is pejorative now.


But why let the facts ruin a good whine?
Here are some facts for you... George Preston Marshall, the original owner, was considered by his contemporaries, in an age of institutionalized racism, as an inveterate bigot and would not sign blacks so as not to offend his de facto market, the deep South. He held out until 1962 when RFK threatened to revoke the stadium lease. Marshall then drafted Ernie Davis who refused to play for Marshall.

[Bill Cody]

We covered this subject at length. Don't expect any of the usual suspects to be changing their minds about it.

A lot of this of course will eventually come down to money as most things do in America. If/when Dan Snyder loses his appeal of the patent case and therefore loses his exclusive right to profit from the racist logo he will relent and change the name. I mean, business is business, right? And after a few days of hub bub about how terrible it is that the racist name had to be changed the right wing will move on to the next reason why they need to stock the bunker with AK47's to protect themselves from the bad old tyrannical government. Dan Snyder will make a bundle on new sales of gear and the rest of us will yawn and move on with our lives. The Washington Hogs will survive.

[WagonCircler]

Ok you just completely changed the topic. I'm simply discussing whether or not the name is offensive. I never said anything about what the government should or shouldn't do.

Did you actually read the topic?

Pretty cut and dry.

If a high school can change it's mascot, why can't an NFL team do the same?

The man doesn't want to change the name of his team because the name was not and is not about the skin color of anyone. Therefore, the man should not have to change the name of his team.

If school boards, which are in large part synonymous with idiocy, lots to change the name of a high school team, that's different. The Washington Redskins are private property.

I didn't change the topic at all.

[gebobs]

Private ****ING property.

Ir-fecking-relevant.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Really? Please elaborate.

If anything, this is a clear illustration of the difference between what is truly offensive and what is an imagined slight, created by people who have an agenda.

Well you get all up in arms over someone who cracks a joke about 9/11...then you say that naming a football team after a racial slur for a group of people that the white man basically destroyed is OK.

Just to be clear on my stance on these two topics...I don't care about either of them.

[OpIv37]

First of all, no one said he HAS to change it. The original poster just asked "why can't he?" You insist on replying to things that no one actually said.

Second, the man doesn't want to change the name of his team because it will cost him money. Changing all those logos isn't cheap, plus he will be losing brand recognition on a brand that's been established since long before he owned it. Believe me, if Snyder thought he would make more money by changing the name than by keeping it, he would have done it years ago. Don't kid yourself into believing that Snyder is taking some moral stand against political correctness and big government. He's acting in what he thinks is his own best financial interest and nothing more.

[Zoneblitser]

Did you actually read the topic?

Pretty cut and dry.

If a high school can change it's mascot, why can't an NFL team do the same?

The man doesn't want to change the name of his team because the name was not and is not about the skin color of anyone. Therefore, the man should not have to change the name of his team.

If school boards, which are in large part synonymous with idiocy, lots to change the name of a high school team, that's different. The Washington Redskins are private property.

I didn't change the topic at all.

Wagon it appears a couple of students that heard the mad at the world sociology professor, you know, the one who thinks freedom has to be legislated to those who oppose their views, are just regurgitating a class lecture.

[gebobs]

Wagon it appears a couple of students that heard the mad at the world sociology professor, you know, the one who thinks freedom has to be legislated to those who oppose their views, are just regurgitating a class lecture.

No one has said anything about legislation.

[feldspar]

People suck in general

[Zoneblitser]

No one has said anything about legislation.

Not yet but you know that the liberal agenda depends on legislation to make itself relevant in todays sociaty.

[Bill Cody]

First of all, no one said he HAS to change it. The original poster just asked "why can't he?" You insist on replying to things that no one actually said.



The question before the court is should the patent for the logo be renewed. The case against is that it's about profiting from a racist image which would not qualify for a patent. If Snyder loses the case and holds firm on not changing the name, which he most certainly can do, then I'll take notice of his principled stand. I'm thinking those principles will end when the revenue stream slows down. As you say, he doesn't have to change the name, that's a red herring. Ultimately the courts not the government will decide the matter of the patent.

[Jimkelly12203]

Never thought i'd ever be on Dan Snyder's side in anything. But in this.. i'm with him. I wouldn't change that name if it was my team. It's a historic franchise. This is just like changing the Washington bullets to the wizards (dumb).

[MillsapsBillsFan]

The real solution to this is to change the mascot and logo to a potato. Then they can be the washington redskin potatoes and everyone can still call them the redskins. Everyone wins!


17411

[WagonCircler]

No one has said anything about legislation.

Except, umm, Harry Reid. You know, the legislator?

[WagonCircler]

The question before the court is should the patent for the logo be renewed. The case against is that it's about profiting from a racist image.

Not racist. Just perceived as such by some who crave being faux offended by imagined slights.

[Bill Cody]

Except, umm, Harry Reid. You know, the legislator?

He thinks they should change the name. Has he brought a bill to do so? No. Will he be? No. But carry on.

[Bill Cody]

Not racist. Just perceived as such by some who crave being faux offended by imagined slights.

Right. Because Indians have been treated so well by the whites in this country over centuries. They don't need to be faux anything.

[gebobs]

Except, umm, Harry Reid. You know, the legislator?

I am not familiar with any legislation but to be clear I meant anyone here in this thread.

[gebobs]

Never thought i'd ever be on Dan Snyder's side in anything. But in this.. i'm with him. I wouldn't change that name if it was my team. It's a historic franchise. This is just like changing the Washington bullets to the wizards (dumb).

How about just changing it to the Skins? Fans call them the Skins now anyway.

[gr8slayer]

We should just tell all those Native Americans to go back to their own country.

[gebobs]

We should just tell all those Native Americans to go back to their own country.

Are we going with the Bering Land Bridge theory or the Mormon "lost tribes of Israel" story?

[sudzy]

Just answer this:

Why are native Americans the only group allowed to be identified by their skin color? People would be furious if there were teams called the Atlanta Darkies, the Miami Brownskins, the Vancouver Yellowskins or the Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

But for some reason, no one seems to mind calling native Americans "Redskins."

I ask this question every single time this issue comes up and I have yet to get an answer.

I don't know of any white people that get offended by the term "Whites".

[Zoneblitser]

Just answer this:

Why are native Americans the only group allowed to be identified by their skin color? People would be furious if there were teams called the Atlanta Darkies, the Miami Brownskins, the Vancouver Yellowskins or the Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

But for some reason, no one seems to mind calling native Americans "Redskins."

I ask this question every single time this issue comes up and I have yet to get an answer.

I went to a high school that our nickname was the Braves. I can't think of a greater honor than being recognized as strong and courageous. Yet there were those not of native American decent that pushed the issue of racism. I find some people aren't happy unless they are trying to force their useless opinions on everyone else and that for the sake of enjoying the turmoil it causes.

[cookie G]

yes!! I am now a legend!

[OpIv37]

I went to a high school that our nickname was the Braves. I can't think of a greater honor than being recognized as strong and courageous. Yet there were those not of native American decent that pushed the issue of racism. I find some people aren't happy unless they are trying to force their useless opinions on everyone else and that for the sake of enjoying the turmoil it causes.

I don't have a problem with most usage of Native American imagery in sports, but sometimes it goes too far. For example, Chief Wahoo.

[OpIv37]

I don't know of any white people that get offended by the term "Whites".

No, but minorities and liberal whites would probably find it racist and some black players may not want to play for a team glorifying white people.

[BertSquirtgum]

Move this ****ty bull**** thread the **** out of the Billszone. If I wanted to read about political correctness I wouldn't be on this site. ****ing pussy liberals.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

How about just changing it to the Skins? Fans call them the Skins now anyway.

Or just call them the Pigskins. They already have a hog theme going on with their fans and it plays on Washington DC.

[BillsImpossible]

Or just call them the Pigskins. They already have a hog theme going on with their fans and it plays on Washington DC.

Ha! That was too fitting.

[jimmifli]

Move this ****ty bull**** thread the **** out of the Billszone. If I wanted to read about political correctness I wouldn't be on this site. ****ing pussy liberals.

Nothing says manliness like crying to refs!

[YardRat]

Why doesn't Canada have the same issue with 'Eskimos' ?

[BillsImpossible]

Why doesn't Canada have the same issue with 'Eskimos' ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo#Origin_of_the_name_Eskimo

While the term "Eskimo" is sometimes considered offensive,[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo#cite_note-4)[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo#cite_note-n580-5) in its linguistic origins[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo#cite_note-anlc-1) it is not a fundamentally offensive word.[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo#cite_note-6)

sounds familiar.

[OpIv37]

Why doesn't Canada have the same issue with 'Eskimos' ?

For the same reason most people don't have an issue with names like 'Seminoles' or 'Braves'. It's not an offensive term like Redskins.

[BillsImpossible]

Give them an inch and they will take more than a mile.

"Never let an opportunity go to waste."

They won't. Next thing coming is PETA.

Calling football teams, "Eagles," "Bears," "Falcons," "Dolphins," "Bengals," "Colts," "Seahawks," "Lions," or any other animal will be considered, "Harmful," to those species due to the violent nature of the NFL, and that is not a stretch either.

Reclaim your balls or they will take them, America.

[BillsImpossible]

For the same reason most people don't have an issue with names like 'Seminoles' or 'Braves'. It's not an offensive term like Redskins.

That's bologna. Most people and football fans all over the world didn't even know, "Redskin," was once used as a derogatory term until the PC police told them.

[YardRat]

For the same reason most people don't have an issue with names like 'Seminoles' or 'Braves'. It's not an offensive term like Redskins.

https://www.google.com/#q=is+eskimo+a+derogatory+term

Although the name "Eskimo" is commonly used in Alaska to refer to all Inuit and Yupik people of the world, this name is considered derogatory in many other places because it was given by non-Inuit people and was said to mean "eater of raw meat."

[YardRat]

http://english.stackexchange.com/questions/9022/is-eskimo-a-universally-offensive-term

"According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo#General), the term is offensive in Canada and Greenland and not elsewhere."

"Having been born and raised in various parts of Alaska I can say, yes, the word is considered offensive there."

[sudzy]

Give them an inch and they will take more than a mile.

"Never let an opportunity go to waste."

They won't. Next thing coming is PETA.

Calling football teams, "Eagles," "Bears," "Falcons," "Dolphins," "Bengals," "Colts," "Seahawks," "Lions," or any other animal will be considered, "Harmful," to those species due to the violent nature of the NFL, and that is not a stretch either.

Reclaim your balls or they will take them, America.

Next thing you know the teams will be named the "New York New Yorkers", the "Buffalo Buffalonians", the "Washington DCers".

[Novacane]

For the same reason most people don't have an issue with names like 'Seminoles' or 'Braves'. It's not an offensive term like Redskins.


Says who? What % of Eskimos have to be offended to make it offensive?

[BillsImpossible]

Next thing you know the teams will be named the "New York New Yorkers", the "Buffalo Buffalonians", the "Washington DCers".

The Miami Sunshine
The New England Ships
The New York Melting Pots
The Buffalo Snow

The Baltimore Riot
The Cincinnati Spaghetti
The Cleveland Steamers
The Pittsburgh Stelars

The Houston GOP
The Indianapolis Speed
The Jacksonville Swamp
The Tennessee Whiskey

The Denver Stoners
The Kansas City BBQ
The Oakland Earthquake
The San Diego Border Patrol

[BillsImpossible]

The Dallas Crips
The New York Bloods
The Philadelphia Thugs
The Washington Mugshots

The Chicago Beef
The Detroit Motor
The Green Bay Cheese
The Minnesota Freeze

The Atlanta Transplants
The Carolina Flight
The New Orleans Voodoo
The Tampa Bay Thunder

The Arizona Desert
The St. Louis Exodus
The San Francisco Express
The Seattle Weed

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Next thing you know the teams will be named the "New York New Yorkers", the "Buffalo Buffalonians", the "Washington DCers".

http://americanfootballfilms.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/houstontexans.jpg

[BillsImpossible]

Let me guess, The Los Angeles Californians is next?

[OpIv37]

That's bologna. Most people and football fans all over the world didn't even know, "Redskin," was once used as a derogatory term until the PC police told them.

Where the hell are you getting that from? Unless you have a source, you are doing nothing but assuming your personal ignorance pertains to all of society.

[OpIv37]

Says who? What % of Eskimos have to be offended to make it offensive?

Yeah, that's a tough call because it's subjective. But are any Inuit or First Nations groups complaining about the Eskimos team? I honestly don't know.

[jimmifli]

Yeah, that's a tough call because it's subjective. But are any Inuit or First Nations groups complaining about the Eskimos team? I honestly don't know.

I think the Cree were more offended since Edmonton is in their ancestral lands and there aren't any Inuit for a VERY long way.

[Jimkelly12203]

Move this ****ty bull**** thread the **** out of the Billszone. If I wanted to read about political correctness I wouldn't be on this site. ****ing pussy liberals.

Don't be too fast to judge... You're talking to an unabashed "liberal" (socially at least) who happens to think it is OUTRAGEOUS that the Skins should be forced to change their name and/or logo.

Some day i'll give my rant about how the terms liberal and conservative are utterly meaningless in this day and age. But i'm not in the mood today.

[BertSquirtgum]

I'm middle of the road in my political views but this thread has no place being in the bills discussion area. I hate the off-season.

[gebobs]

Give them an inch and they will take more than a mile.

"Never let an opportunity go to waste."

They won't. Next thing coming is PETA.

Calling football teams, "Eagles," "Bears," "Falcons," "Dolphins," "Bengals," "Colts," "Seahawks," "Lions," or any other animal will be considered, "Harmful," to those species due to the violent nature of the NFL, and that is not a stretch either.

Reclaim your balls or they will take them, America.

Ahhhh...the old slippery slope argument. And this one is about as stupid as claiming gay marriage will lead to sheep marriage.

[Bill Cody]

I'm middle of the road in my political views but this thread has no place being in the bills discussion area. I hate the off-season.

then don't read it or post on it repeatedly dumbass

[robles]

has been bookmark, this seems like a very interesting thread

http://wigunpics.science/13/g.png

[chernobylwraiths]

Move this ****ty bull**** thread the **** out of the Billszone. If I wanted to read about political correctness I wouldn't be on this site. ****ing pussy liberals.


I'm middle of the road in my political views but this thread has no place being in the bills discussion area. I hate the off-season.

Riiiiiiiight.

literally

[gebobs]

Riiiiiiiight.

literally

Stylishly?

[WagonCircler]

Ahhhh...the old slippery slope argument. And this one is about as stupid as claiming gay marriage will lead to sheep marriage.

Actually, in a thread right here in this forum, the lefties absolutely scoffed at the possibility that someone could be fined or even arrested for declining to take part in a gay marriage ceremony, based on religious objections. Now people who even dare utter support for the caterer/baker risk being accused of hate crimes.

Slippery slopes are very real.

[gebobs]

Actually, in a thread right here in this forum, the lefties absolutely scoffed at the possibility that someone could be fined or even arrested for declining to take part in a gay marriage ceremony, based on religious objections. Now people who even dare utter support for the caterer/baker risk being accused of hate crimes.

Slippery slopes are very real.

...when you make crap up out of whole cloth.

[OpIv37]

Actually, in a thread right here in this forum, the lefties absolutely scoffed at the possibility that someone could be fined or even arrested for declining to take part in a gay marriage ceremony, based on religious objections. Now people who even dare utter support for the caterer/baker risk being accused of hate crimes.

Slippery slopes are very real.
First, show me where people are being accused of "hate crimes" for supporting the baker.

Second, even if it's true, you made a false equivalency. Being accused of hate crimes by some anonymous internet poster is not even close to being "fined or arrested."

Gotta love it how right wing white Christian American males have a persecution complex and can't wait to whine and play the victim. "If you don't defend my right to bigotry, you're a bigot!"

[feldspar]

Here is the irony: the people that have a problem with this are generally calling other people derogatory things.

[Cntrygal]

For the same reason most people don't have an issue with names like 'Seminoles' or 'Braves'. It's not an offensive term like Redskins.

When I was first assigned to Alaska, one of the very first things that they told us when in-processing was to NOT use the term "Eskimo's"... it is considered VERY offensive by the natives up there.

[Novacane]

Good thing no one cares about the CFL then!

[gebobs]

Good thing no one cares about the CFL then!

Yeah, the gays will be protesting in Regina!

[BertSquirtgum]

then don't read it or post on it repeatedly dumbass

I wouldn't have to if it was put in the correct forum to begin with. Dumbass.

[swiper]

Yeah, the gays will be protesting in Regina!


Nothing sadder than a man in Regina looking for vagina.

[swiper]

I wouldn't have to if it was put in the correct forum to begin with. Dumbass.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Iubog28_KBI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[gr8slayer]

I've got to admit, I'm very annoyed by the current trend in our society of being insulted by everything. It's getting really old...

[gebobs]

I've got to admit, I'm very annoyed by the current trend in our society of being insulted by everything. It's getting really old...

Yeah, it sucks. But it's the price of inclusion. In fifty years, it won't be so much of an issue.

[feldspar]

I've got to admit, I'm very annoyed by the current trend in our society of being insulted by everything. It's getting really old...

Seems like a lot of people go out of their way to sustain a sense of outrage all the time...even if it's about something they don't even give a rat's ass about, really.

So the cops told these 7 and 8 year old girls that they need a permit to run their lemonade stand in Texas. The poor things were trying to raise money for their father's day gift to a man who, in all probability, is a saint. How horrible, and I'm just about immobilized with anger after hearing this news.

HELP!

Does anybody really think that the quality of their lives will be better if the Redskins changes their name?

Remember, the Redskins are calling THEMSELVES this. Is there a single person that thinks they are putting themselves down by their very identity? Although, I once knew a guy that called HIMSELF c-u-n-t-licker. Pride comes from strange places sometimes, I suppose. "Redskins" sounds pretty cool to me. Gotta ring to it, ask me. It never occurred to me to be offended by it until somebody suggested I should, at which point I disagree.

I guess that anybody that has a problem with it has a problem...I don't.

[feldspar]

Yeah, it sucks. But it's the price of inclusion. In fifty years, it won't be so much of an issue.

What is going to happen in 50 years, or even 500 years? The "problem" of human nature will be resolved? I don't think so.

People are NOT all the same...never have been and never will be. Trying to force people to pretend that is the case will not only not work, but it will have negative effects. I think that is a form of suppression in the first place.

I'm all for being nice to people as a general principle, not that there isn't exceptions. But honesty is taking a major hit these days. Seems like society at large is chasing a ridiculous ideal that is unworkable. Causing a whole new set of problems.

[gebobs]

It never occurred to me to be offended by it until somebody suggested I should, at which point I disagree.
It never occurred many folk. Is that the bar?

As a teenage jagoff with little empathy, we would call them redskins or worse during lax games. They taught us a lesson in that regard, believe me.

I would never ever call any one of them a redskin now. Would you?

[gebobs]

What is going to happen in 50 years, or even 500 years? The "problem" of human nature will be resolved? I don't think so.
Certainly not. But the tide of progressivism, though it ebb and flow, is ever forward. History will be on my side. Eventually, the Redskin name will be relegated to ash bin of history and not a tear will be shed. Fight it all you want. It's a heinous term from a sordid past. This country is better than that.

[feldspar]

Certainly not. But the tide of progressivism, though it ebb and flow, is ever forward. History will be on my side. Eventually, the Redskin name will be relegated to ash bin of history and not a tear will be shed. Fight it all you want. It's a heinous term from a sordid past. This country is better than that.

I see society becoming more and more superficial.

[Zoneblitser]

Stop calling it progressive when it's really fascist.

[chernobylwraiths]

Not too long ago they used to string black people up for all sorts of minor offenses, or just because they were black.

Even less time ago, gays were bullied, beaten and humiliated because of something that they can't control.

It's called evolution in a way. Our thinking has to evolve.

There certainly is a fine line with some things, especially humor. I have made off color jokes (sometimes literally) at times that some feel cross the line, and some know where the humor is coming from. I won't apologize unless I feel that they are truely offensive. But it all comes down to how we feel about these things. Many don't feel redskin is derogetory, but 99% of them are not of that culture. Most know the N word IS derogetory, but have issues because blacks use it themselves to each other but are offended when whites use it. It also doesn't matter what the word originally was used for, at a point in American history, it was used derogetorily, and that was most prominent. It can be broken down in a simple question that gebob already asked. If given the opportunity, would you call a native American a redskin to his/her face and feel absolutely no discomfort? I'm betting that most would not.

Lastly, we need to get educated. One person pointed out that they wouldn't know it wasn't a bad word unless someone had pointed it out. Well, educate yourself. Ignorance isn't an excuse as some would say. That is how you learn and keep learning. Just because you are an adult you don't stop learning these things. As Cntrygal pointed out, she was TOLD when she was stationed in Alaska to NOT use the term Eskimo as it was offensive to many there. I did not know that. Still learning at my middle/old age.

[BertSquirtgum]

Riiiiiiiight.

literally

Are you going to deny the bleeding heart liberals don't make you sick? or are you one of them?

[gebobs]

If given the opportunity, would you call a native American a redskin to his/her face and feel absolutely no discomfort? I'm betting that most would not.
No I would not, but I reserve the right to do so if I feel like it you fecking fascist.

[Bill Cody]

I wouldn't have to if it was put in the correct forum to begin with. Dumbass.

Wrong DA. You have free will to skip over any thread you're not interested in. But here you are back again. So you ARE interested. Just not interesting.

[gebobs]

Will some mod kindly move the thread?

[chernobylwraiths]

Are you going to deny the bleeding heart liberals don't make you sick? or are you one of them?

Oh, I certainly am one of them Mr. middle of the aisle.

[swiper]

Oh, I certainly am one of them Mr. middle of the aisle.


LOL. He's about as far-right wing idiot as they make. Don't taunt him with normalcy please.

[swiper]

Will some mod kindly move the thread?

Trying to get the mods here to do that is like getting Ville Leino to score a goal.

[gebobs]

Trying to get the mods here to do that is like getting Ville Leino to score a goal.

Jesus, be nice! That was uncalled for! ;-)

Cripes...you ruined my day.

[feldspar]

Just answer this:

Why are native Americans the only group allowed to be identified by their skin color? People would be furious if there were teams called the Atlanta Darkies, the Miami Brownskins, the Vancouver Yellowskins or the Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

But for some reason, no one seems to mind calling native Americans "Redskins."

I ask this question every single time this issue comes up and I have yet to get an answer.

What exactly are you looking for in an answer?

Native Americans have named their teams "Redskins" and still do to this day.

Google "Red Mesa Redskins" for example. This is a high school Navajo Indian football team, and yes, they call themselves the Redskins. Why are they "allowed" to do this? I guess because they want to. I bet you can find some other examples very quickly of Indian teams that call themselves "the Redskins." Then again, is it acceptable to call them Indians now, or is it strictly "Native Americans?"

[gebobs]

Native Americans have named their teams "Redskins" and still do to this day.

Google "Red Mesa Redskins" for example.

In debate over Redskins name, is the ‘R-word’ for racism or respect? (http://cronkitenewsonline.com/2013/05/in-debate-over-redskins-name-is-the-r-word-for-racism-or-respect/)


Suzan Harjo has been fighting the Washington team for two decades over its use of the “R-word,” which she calls the worst slur toward American Indians. Harjo, a member of the Cheyenne tribe in Oklahoma, remembers regularly being called names because of her skin color while growing up in the 1950s. “We were called a lot of names, including the name of the Washington football team, and that’s the worst thing you could be called,” Harjo said. “Out of nowhere, interrupting your daydreams, would come this word being thrown at you. I just grew up hating it.”

Erny Zah, spokesman for Navajo Nation President Ben Shelly, said that not everyone has had a negative experience with the word, and if a Navajo person wants to use the word or root for the NFL team, they should. “We’ve always been proud of a lot of individuality,” Zah said. “If they want to assert themselves as Redskins and the community is fine with that, they are going to continue.” He agreed that use of the word outside American Indian communities should be avoided because it could perpetuate “the legacy of negativity that the term has created.”

“A lot of people do have a relationship with that word. For them, it’s not a positive relationship,” Zah said.

Lawrence said tension over the word on the East Coast – where students at a New York school voted in February to drop the name – does not translate to the Southwest, where tribes enjoy a high level of “isolation and freedom.”

There have been 90 high school teams in the US, mostly around the Great Lakes for some reason, that have had the Redskin mascot. With Lancaster, that number is now down to 57. Six others will probably change soon.

[sudzy]

The Miami Sunshine
The New England Cheaters
The New York Melting Pots
The Buffalo Snow


fixed it for you

[feldspar]

In debate over Redskins name, is the ‘R-word’ for racism or respect? (http://cronkitenewsonline.com/2013/05/in-debate-over-redskins-name-is-the-r-word-for-racism-or-respect/)



There have been 90 high school teams in the US, mostly around the Great Lakes for some reason, that have had the Redskin mascot. With Lancaster, that number is now down to 57. Six others will probably change soon.

What's the conclusion then, boss?

[Joe Fo Sho]

A lot of people don't think it be like it is, but it do.

[JohnnyGold]

This team would instantly become my 2nd favorite team.

Seriously.

Being white is awesome.

I wish I was able to take pride in my race and heritage as much as every other countryman in the world can, without being labeled a bigoted racist.

[chernobylwraiths]

Seriously.

Being white is awesome.

I wish I was able to take pride in my race and heritage as much as every other countryman in the world can, without being labeled a bigoted racist.

Yeah, because that isn't asinine at all. Because you can't take pride in the place where your ancestors came from? You can't take pride in being from some European country? Really? That is just so stupid I weep for your parents.

[BertSquirtgum]

Oh, I certainly am one of them Mr. middle of the aisle.

God is great.

[swiper]

God is great.

Let me get this right...

You're against the first amendment, but would die to keep the second.

You don't want women, minorities or homosexuals to have any rights.

Given your choice, you'd repeal their rights to vote and drive.

Your knuckles bleeding from dragging on the ground?

[JoeMama]

Seriously.

Being white is awesome.

I wish I was able to take pride in my race and heritage as much as every other countryman in the world can, without being labeled a bigoted racist.

Being white IS awesome.

I get to do white guy stuff like listen to Weezer (90s Weezer), watch the Simpsons (90s Simpsons), and eat gourmet cheeses without a shred of guilt.

And all those things are awesome.

I love whiteness.

[swiper]

Being white IS awesome.

I get to do white guy stuff like listen to Weezer (90s Weezer), watch the Simpsons (90s Simpsons), and eat gourmet cheeses without a shred of guilt.

And all those thing are awesome.

I love whiteness.

ROFL. Some things one should just keep to themselves Joe.

[JoeMama]

ROFL. Some things one should just keep to themselves Joe.

I can't keep anything to myself that involves the 90s and being white.

Those are the only two things I know well enough to talk about.

[swiper]

http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2013/303/3/1/fredflintstone2_by_achillesheelart-d6sfjfo.gif

[JoeMama]

White + Nerdy + Brilliance = <iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/XFkzRNyygfk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Generalissimus Gibby]

I am sorry, but I did not feel like reading through six pages. However, I think there is a compromise that can be obtained and it would be to change the name of the Washington NFL club to what it was when the team was located in Boston, namely the Braves. Yeah, long ago in a nation far away, Boston had two baseball clubs, the Red Sox and the Braves, and the NFL club that started in Boston in the 1930s took on the name of the baseball team because they both played at Braves field. In fact according to Wikipedia, one of the first headcoaches of the Braves was part Sioux.


The team originated as the Boston Braves, based in Boston, Massachusetts, in 1932, under the ownership of George Preston Marshall (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Preston_Marshall). At the time the team played in Braves Field (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braves_Field), home of the Boston Braves (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Braves_%28baseball%29) baseball team. The following year the club moved to Fenway Park (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fenway_Park), home of the Boston Red Sox (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Red_Sox), whereupon owners changed the team's name to the Boston Redskins to suggest a kinship with the Red Sox and to continue utilizing the Braves uniforms. To round out the change, Marshall hired William "Lone Star" Dietz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Henry_Dietz), a part-blood Sioux (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sioux), as the team's head coach.[12] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_Redskins#cite_note-12) However, Boston wasn't much of a football town at the time and the team had difficulty drawing fans.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_Redskins

The name Braves allows you to honor that franchises rich on the field tradition, keep the burgundy and gold color scheme, and it also allows you to keep the current logo. However, if the current logo offends, we could always go back to two of the most -IMVHO - badass uniforms in NFL history.

This one:

http://www.gridiron-uniforms.com/images/1969_Washington.png

that they wore in the late 1960s, or this one that they wore in the early 1960s

http://www.gridiron-uniforms.com/images/1959_Washington.png

I don't like the name "warriors" because its too generic, but Braves would be acceptable and in our current -and in this case perhaps for the better - PC climate they could donate some of their proceeds to the more impoverished First Peoples' Reservations.

My. 02

[BertSquirtgum]

Let me get this right...

You're against the first amendment, but would die to keep the second.

You don't want women, minorities or homosexuals to have any rights.

Given your choice, you'd repeal their rights to vote and drive.

Your knuckles bleeding from dragging on the ground?

I'm against the first amendment? and where the **** did you get the idea I don't want women or **** or minorities to have rights? You must be ******ed.

and this is why I said to get this bull**** thread out of the Billszone. I'm here to read about the Bills and make snarky comments about idiots like swiper.

[YardRat]

White + Nerdy + Brilliance = <iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/XFkzRNyygfk" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="420"></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/N9qYF9DZPdw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[JoeMama]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/N9qYF9DZPdw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

See, I love white people stuff.

Especially Weird Al.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/zq7Eki5EZ8o" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[YardRat]

lol...that's awesome

[IlluminatusUIUC]

http://www.gridiron-uniforms.com/images/1959_Washington.png

I don't like the name "warriors" because its too generic, but Braves would be acceptable and in our current -and in this case perhaps for the better - PC climate they could donate some of their proceeds to the more impoverished First Peoples' Reservations.

My. 02

Perhaps if it was the term for "warriors" in the local native language.

[Discotrish]

Just answer this:

Why are native Americans the only group allowed to be identified by their skin color? People would be furious if there were teams called the Atlanta Darkies, the Miami Brownskins, the Vancouver Yellowskins or the Minnesota Fightin' Whities.

But for some reason, no one seems to mind calling native Americans "Redskins."

I ask this question every single time this issue comes up and I have yet to get an answer.

Because "redskins" refers to their war paint, not their skin color.

Patti

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Because "redskins" refers to their war paint, not their skin color.

Patti

The team is supposedly named for the war painted native American but their logo hasn't had anything even resembling war paint on it for over half a century.

http://colorado.aiga.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/redskins.jpg

Whether it was ever intended to invoke red war paint in 1937 (I am skeptical), the team has distanced itself from that image for decades.

[feldspar]

http://sportsmockery.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Chicago-Blackhawks-logo-1956.gif

[IlluminatusUIUC]

http://sportsmockery.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Chicago-Blackhawks-logo-1956.gif

Congrats to them on their new rings.

What's the point of posting this?

[BertSquirtgum]

It's racist. Better change it asap. #dumb

[Discotrish]

It shows the war paint.




I don't like the name "warriors" because its too generic, but Braves would be acceptable and in our current -and in this case perhaps for the better - PC climate they could donate some of their proceeds to the more impoverished First Peoples' Reservations.

My. 02

It's so much easier to visualize a "Legend."

http://media.giphy.com/media/jYwxmPa8Xz8yc/giphy.gif

Patti

[IlluminatusUIUC]

It shows the war paint.

What does? The Blackhawks logo?

[chernobylwraiths]

History lesson, does everyone know that Blackhawk was an individual and not a tribe?

[WagonCircler]

History lesson, does everyone know that Blackhawk was an individual and not a tribe?

That adds another team to the old trivia question about the pro sports teams named after an actual person. I don't remember the rest, but the Buffalo Bills and the Cleveland Browns (after Paul Brown) were two.

[BillsImpossible]

Buffalo Bill is next on the hit list. "Buffalo Wings," is inevitable.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/35/Cody-Buffalo-Bill-LOC.jpg/220px-Cody-Buffalo-Bill-LOC.jpg
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Bill

William Frederick Cody

Later he served as a civilian scout to the US Army (https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Army) during the Indian Wars (https://simple.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Indian_Wars&action=edit&redlink=1), receiving the Medal of Honor (https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medal_of_Honor) in 1872.

[Mouldsie]

I just don't understand the fight to KEEP the name. Who gives a **** if a team mascot changes? **** me.

BTW I could also argue for why it' the decent and right thing to do but I'm sure that's been covered. WWJD?

[IlluminatusUIUC]

That adds another team to the old trivia question about the pro sports teams named after an actual person. I don't remember the rest, but the Buffalo Bills and the Cleveland Browns (after Paul Brown) were two.

I read somewhere that it was named after an Army unit the owner had served in, but that of course the unit was named for the man.

[Generalissimus Gibby]

History lesson, does everyone know that Blackhawk was an individual and not a tribe?

Yes, Chief Blackhawk.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hawk_%28Sauk_leader%29

However, the problem with him --although he was brilliant on many levels -- is that he typifies the "vanishing indian" ideology that swept our culture in the 19th and early 20th centuries.

[YardRat]

Is 'Canuck' an offensive term?

[feldspar]

Is 'Canuck' an offensive term?

Not to me.

But if somebody called me Yard Rat, I might have a bone to pick, as they say.

[Buffalogic]

Minnesota Fightin' Whities for life

[WagonCircler]

I read somewhere that it was named after an Army unit the owner had served in, but that of course the unit was named for the man.

Nope. There was a fan contest to name the Buffalo AAFC team.

Following the 1946 season, in an effort to generate more fan interest and distinguish the football team from the city's minor league baseball and hockey teams, which also bore the name "Bisons," the team ran a contest to select a new name. Over 4,500 entries were submitted, and "the Bills" won over "Bullets," "Nickels" and "Blue Devils." Several contestants suggested the winning name, but James F. Dyson was named the winner of the $500 prize based on his essay comparing the team to a band of "Buffalo Bills." He wrote that, while the legendary Indian Scout William "Buffalo Bill" Cody helped trailblaze the American Frontier, the football team (owned by the president of Frontier Oil) was opening a new frontier in Buffalo sports.

http://www.answers.com/Q/Where_did_the_Buffalo_Bills_football_team_get_their_name

[feldspar]

Nope. There was a fan contest to name the Buffalo AAFC team.

Following the 1946 season, in an effort to generate more fan interest and distinguish the football team from the city's minor league baseball and hockey teams, which also bore the name "Bisons," the team ran a contest to select a new name. Over 4,500 entries were submitted, and "the Bills" won over "Bullets," "Nickels" and "Blue Devils." Several contestants suggested the winning name, but James F. Dyson was named the winner of the $500 prize based on his essay comparing the team to a band of "Buffalo Bills." He wrote that, while the legendary Indian Scout William "Buffalo Bill" Cody helped trailblaze the American Frontier, the football team (owned by the president of Frontier Oil) was opening a new frontier in Buffalo sports.

http://www.answers.com/Q/Where_did_the_Buffalo_Bills_football_team_get_their_name

It's a little more tough to name your team when the name of your city itself is a the name of an animal.

For example, if you think about a Buffalo Sabre, what exactly IS that? Is that a sword used to kill Buffaloes, or is it that the Buffaloes are actually wielding the sword?

See what I mean? Most anything you name your team would suggest a buffalo doing something or a Buffalo being in a certain state. Can't escape the animal. Buffalo Bisons is just redundant.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Nope. There was a fan contest to name the Buffalo AAFC team.

I see my post was confusing, I meant the Blackhawks.


Founding On May 1, 1926, the NHL awarded an expansion franchise for Chicago to a syndicate headed by former football star Huntington Hardwick (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huntington_Hardwick) of Boston. At the same meeting, Hardwick arranged the purchase of the players of the Portland Rosebuds (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portland_Rosebuds_%28ice_hockey%29) of the Western Hockey League (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Canada_Hockey_League) for $100,000 from WHL President Frank Patrick (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Patrick_%28ice_hockey%29) in a deal brokered by Boston Bruins (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Bruins)' owner Charles Adams (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Adams_%28ice_hockey%29).[2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Blackhawks#cite_note-FOOTNOTEJenish201346.E2.80.9347-2) However, only one month later, Huntwick's group sold out to Chicago coffee tycoon Frederic McLaughlin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederic_McLaughlin).[3]
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Blackhawks#cite_note-FOOTNOTEJenish201352-3)McLaughlin had been a commander with the 333rd Machine Gun Battalion of the 86th Infantry Division (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/86th_Infantry_Division_%28United_States%29) during World War I (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I).[4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Blackhawks#cite_note-McLaughlin_Years-4) This Division was nicknamed the "Blackhawk Division" after a Native American of the Sauk (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sauk_people) nation, Black Hawk (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hawk_%28Sauk_leader%29), who was a prominent figure in the history of Illinois.[4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Blackhawks#cite_note-McLaughlin_Years-4) McLaughlin named the new hockey team in honor of the military unit, making it one of many sports team names using Native Americans (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_peoples_of_the_Americas) as icons.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Blackhawks#Founding

[THATHURMANATOR]

More adults being hurt by words... So lame.