So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/06/12/bills-mailbag-by-vic-caruccilack-of-cap-puts-a-dent-in-spending/

From what I’ve heard from the current Bills coaching staff, Manuel has gotten minimal technical/mechanical guidance since arriving in Buffalo as a first-round draft pick. The opinion of the current coaches is that he pretty much has been on his own the past two years in developing his game. And that has been reflected in his performance through offseason workouts.

Someone lied here. I thought they gave Manuel a QB coach the 2nd year at least. Also, Marrone and Hackett at least developed a QB at Syracuse; I can't believe they would just draft a guy, gave instructions, and then let him rise and fall on his own without watching and correcting closely all the way.

Carucci wasn't here when manuel was drafted so maybe he didn't know first hand what happened here.

[MillsapsBillsFan]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

I thought that the general consensus all along after Marone was fired was that Manuel didn't get coached the way he should have. Manuel never had a dedicated QB coach, it was Hackett the whole time. I'm not saying that EJ is just a good coach away from being our long-term starter, but I do think that our coaching staff may have had some play in stunting his development.

I have no idea how good of a coach Hackett is, but judging by the regression of our offense during his time here I would say that its at least plausible that Manuel didn't get the coaching that a rookie QB stepping into a starting role should get

[Night Train]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

I heard there was a shooter from the grassy knoll.

It's all speculative filler which may/may not carry validity. I do know the kid Hackett playcalling was beyond terrible most games, so I can see Roman quickly IDing any limitations Manuel has and giving him a fighting chance to sink or swim over the next 2-3 months.

QB's can be ruined early on with no direction in their development. See Losman.

I honestly could care less about explanations now. New owner, coach and way of doing business ( I hope ). Put anyone at QB that can give us something and let's get this thing rolling.

[better days]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/06...t-in-spending/

From what I’ve heard from the current Bills coaching staff, Manuel has gotten minimal technical/mechanical guidance since arriving in Buffalo as a first-round draft pick. The opinion of the current coaches is that he pretty much has been on his own the past two years in developing his game. And that has been reflected in his performance through offseason workouts.

Someone lied here. I thought they gave Manuel a QB coach the 2nd year at least. Also, Marrone and Hackett at least developed a QB at Syracuse; I can't believe they would just draft a guy, gave instructions, and then let him rise and fall on his own without watching and correcting closely all the way.

Carucci wasn't here when manuel was drafted so maybe he didn't know first hand what happened here.

So, we are supposed to take your opinion over the Bills Coaching staff?

[jimmifli]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Most QB coaches work almost exclusively on the playbook, reading defenses, progressions etc. Maybe some camp time gets spent on a little footwork but not much.

Isn't that why EJ went to Steve DeBerg's camp?

Anyways, he's learning a new offense, with new plays, progressions, responsibilities and strategies. Despite what this staff says, I doubt they are spending much time on mechanics.

[OpIv37]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Of course they are going to sah he received bad coaching.

They were handed a bad QB situation with no real opportunity to fix it. They need to keep player morale high and fans interested in the game. If they blame EJ's past failures on the previous coaches, it makes it seem as though the struggles were due to people who are no longer here and there is still hope for EJ to develop.

Maybe it's true, maybe they are grasping at straws. But the coaches and FO are going to say it anyway.

[trapezeus]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

i think if:

1. the new offense is as run heavy as expected,
2. any qb play is really required to just get5-10 yard passes out consistently 15-20 time a game,

then one of these guys has to be consistent enough with the intermediary ball to open up the defense to let guys run as wanted.

[Meathead]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

i wish somebody would have asked marrone why no qb coach that first season. seems like a ridiculously obvious question that afaik was never asked

youve got your shiny new highly drafted qb, a brand new offense, an offensive coordinator who is still waiting for his first chest hair ... and you decide to skip the qb coach entirely. so what do you know that all these hundreds of other nfl hcs who never went without a qb coach dont? what brew of magic do you hold where the actual name of the coach includes the position of the player who will define your success/failure at your job - and you dont even hire one!?!

marrone reeks of coaching arrogance and that always looked like exhibit A

[gr8slayer]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Wouldn't surprise me, the Bills have never been much for developing QB's.

[Strongman]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

i wish somebody would have asked marrone why no qb coach that first season. seems like a ridiculously obvious question that afaik was never asked

youve got your shiny new highly drafted qb, a brand new offense, an offensive coordinator who is still waiting for his first chest hair ... and you decide to skip the qb coach entirely. so what do you know that all these hundreds of other nfl hcs who never went without a qb coach dont? what brew of magic do you hold where the actual name of the coach includes the position of the player who will define your success/failure at your job - and you dont even hire one!?!

marrone reeks of coaching arrogance and that always looked like exhibit A

I'd say it was more of a decision Littman made to save an extra buck.

[IlluminatusUIUC]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

There's something to be said that too much coaching can be as bad as too little. An NFL QB already has so much to learn and manage that making him think about his mechanics at the same time can set everything back. That FSU reporter scouting sheet on Manuel said essentially the same thing, that you could see Fisher trying to instill mechanics in Manuel, but when the live bullets were firing Manuel would quickly regress to what felt natural. I don't know if it's even possible to make major changes to one's throwing mechanics at this age, but if it was I would think it would have to happen from the bench.

In the most charitable reading of the 2013 season, Marrone wanted Kolb to start and Manuel to learn from the bench for a year or two while breaking him into the league slowly. But even that required Kolb to stay healthy, something he had a long career proving he could not do, and made cutting Tarvaris Jackson one of the dumbest moves Marrone/Whaley ever made.

[Ed]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Marrone supposedly spent a lot of time working with the OL and our OL was terrible and only got worse. Fred Jackson and CJ Spiller both struggled and had poor seasons. They couldn't figure out how to use Stevie Johnson or Mike Williams effectively either. Why would anyone think that our QB's got good coaching under Marrone and his staff? Our offense did nothing well and no one got better. That's why they switched to Orton so quick. They needed someone with a lot of experience that they didn't have to teach/coach.

[better days]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Of course they are going to sah he received bad coaching.

They were handed a bad QB situation with no real opportunity to fix it. They need to keep player morale high and fans interested in the game. If they blame EJ's past failures on the previous coaches, it makes it seem as though the struggles were due to people who are no longer here and there is still hope for EJ to develop.

Maybe it's true, maybe they are grasping at straws. But the coaches and FO are going to say it anyway.

Not true. Rex & Roman could have said Marrone was right in benching EJ, that EJ is just not a GOOD QB & never will be a GOOD QB.

[WagonCircler]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Well the current Bills Head Coach has a spectacular record of expertise with QBs. Dirty Sanchez. Curious George. The Dog Murderer.

How could we possibly doubt his credibility on the subject?

[better days]

Re: So now the spin is Manuel got no coaching until this year? I don't believe so.

Well the current Bills Head Coach has a spectacular record of expertise with QBs. Dirty Sanchez. Curious George. The Dog Murderer.

How could we possibly doubt his credibility on the subject?

Well, despite those crappy QB's he had to work with, Rex took the Jets to the AFC CHAMPIONSHIP game two years in a row.